tv The Fox News Specialists FOX News June 14, 2017 2:00pm-3:01pm PDT
situation again that -- this is me talking -- that we ought to take a look at our security on those that are there in big groups like that. that might be important. we've been playing this game. i've been in it now for six years, i guess. we practice every morning at 6:00 to 8:00. every i thought the story that jeff duncan told was very interestin interesting. jeff was leaving early. he said, are those republicans or democrats? jeff that republicans, and he began shooting. but i do think that should be addressed by von enforcement. if we are going to have a big group of elected officials, how are we going to handle it from a security standpoint? thank you very much, and
god bless you. >> congressman roger williams. he and an aide were injured in today's shooting. my goodness. the start of the day, i was getting text messages starting shortly after everything happened with so many questions. and here we are several hours later with so many unanswered questions. >> eric: this day developed at 7:00. throughout the day, you heard what was going on. this event was a metaphor for america. think about this for a second. a baseball diamond, what is more american than baseball? nothing. representatives representing america on the baseball diamond, a bipartisan charity event. softball game. this is all americana in every respect, and then this one, a chilling email to a congressman recently within the last hour and half or so saying, one down, 216 to go.
meaning g.o.p. republican congress people. a scary and sad day in america. they say they're going to play that game tomorrow. >> eboni: we saw the joint press conference from the coaches from the democrat and republican side. people speculating this bipartisan meant of unity can be short-lived. >> kat: it can be short-lived but something like this, you can't have any thoughts but bipartisan thoughts. paul ryan said an attack on one of us is an attack on all of us. scary if you would've thought what would've happened if you hadn't had the police there? and the other group, they wouldn't have been there. >> eric: arm to police. note that. >> eboni: let's go to a fox news correspondent live in alexandria, virginia. thanks for being with us. >> nice to be with you. investigation continues, it is painstaking to recreate events
like these. you can see the evidence collection teams by the third-base dugout, and that's where eyewitnesses say james hopkinson hodgkinson emerged. you see men they're laying out the markers of bullet casings and other evidence. trying to run down to weapons, the unmistakable rifle that so many people talked about that they saw hodgkinson emerge with. and then a handgun. take a listen to the shoot-out. [gunfire] do we know where he's at? 's to go behind.
>> stayed down! stay down! speaker that was the exchange of fire between hodgkinson and the third base dugout, where you see the agents walking across by the third base line. steve scalise was playing second base, just there where the evidence team is. mr. wallace to the left, that is the dog park where the video you just saw was being taken. the shoot-out, three to 5 minutes long. 60 or so bullets. it was very clearly targeted. take a listen to a witness. >> based on what you can see, was it clear this gentleman, the gunman, who the gunman was focused on shooting. he wasn't randomly shooting at civilians or other people in the neighborhood?
>> who is was not randomly shooting at civilians from what i saw. he seemed to be focused on shooting on the assumed capital police officers who were behind a black suv, exchanging fire. >> house majority whip airlifted off the field in critical conditions after surgery. one member of his security detail shop that will be okay. another heard but currently out of the hospital. the captain, chief of police for capital police saying their heroic actions certainly saved a lot of lives out here. we are learning a little bit more about the gunman. from his facebook page, that he called president trump a traitor. from belleville, illinois, just outside of st. louis. the local paper reports lots of letters to the editor, clearly angry with republican policies. it also learning from capitol hill that at one point he volunteered for then
presidential candidate bernie sanders. take a listen to senator sanders. >> second by -- second by this despicable act. violence of any kind is unacceptable in our society, and i condemn this action in the strongest possible terms. speak a word from the fbi, now leading the investigation, that development are coming quickly. we expect a press conference from them at approximately 5:30. with what they have learned since this began. we are about ten hours into the investigation. >> eboni: thank you for the updates. senator rand paul, an eyewitness to today's shooting, will be joining us in a little bit here on the show. let's meet today's specialists. she is the author of "the self you vote" but she specializes in
everything politics and polling. kristen soltis anderson. he is won five awards from the national press club and society of professional journalists and the editor-in-chief of "the kill" newspaper. specializes in interviewing the big news and politics. thank you for being with us on a troublesome and high-profile newsday. bob, you have interviewed the whip. i went to law school in new orleans. a lot of my friends know him well. what was going through your min mind? we didn't know his condition. >> bob: it affects you. he's a very down to earth guy. we interviewed him on getting the votes for obamacare, repeal and replace, and he's -- not all i -- lawmakers are down to eart. he's a regular guy.
it's a scary situation. >> eboni: eric, to bob's point, one of my good friends is congressman richmond, a democrat, and a colleague in the house with scalise. when he came out with his support of scalise, he got a lot of backlash. i think that is systematic of where we are in this country, a lack of compassion people have for one another as people. the humanities being lost. >> eric: we are becoming more divisive and divided as a country but the political rhetoric is getting ratcheted up on both sides. let's be fair and balanced about it. on both sides it's happening. there is a wake up, america monologue where i address that. is this america, or is it?
-- is it raqqa? he was a bernie sanders campaign worker who was a devout socialist, walked up to the baseball field and asked a representative, are these republicans or democrats. he decided to open fire. >> kristen: politics has become so triable. i don't think bernie sanders has any responsibility for this whatsoever. i don't view him as being someone who's rhetoric is being over over-the-top in a way that would encourage someone to violence but we have in america with increased tribalism and politics. my specialization is polling but right before the election, pew asked who are you voting for and could you respect someone who voted for the other candidates?
we can't respect each other's votes. >> eboni: my mother faced backlash for her support of president trump. i was covering the inauguration. she wanted a "make america great again" t-shirt and i refused to get a four because i was literally afraid as to what the reception would be in her community. >> kat: we don't see enough of people blaming the shooter for shooting people. i think it's okay to examine the climate surrounding it but this is this guys fault. a66-year-old adult man shoots a bunch of people, it's his fault. i think this goes beyond trump if we are going to talk about the rhetoric. if you support small government solutions, then you are taking someone's food away to starve their kids in your pushing their grandma off the cliff with the other hand. that certainly does make
republicans look like evil people. i think it's a problem and i think it's disingenuous because having a different approach to solving problems isn't the same as wanting people to die. i think it takes a special kind of evil, disgusting person to shoot a bunch of people. >> eric: used an important word. let's talk about the republican health care plan. these are democrats who have said this. bill de blasio said it's not not an overstatement saying some children will die because of this. this is heightened rhetoric. cory booker says it will cost americans lives. nancy pelosi, "this is deadly. this is deadly." bernie sanders says thousands of americans would die. the democrats aren't afraid to use that word when talking about republican policy. you're going to tell me that crazy people aren't going to hear this and go oh, my god, they really are going to kill us. what do we do? >> kristen: if you are somebody who supports strict gun
control, and we've had a lot of arguments today about could they have been better protected with their own firearms? you can see someone saying if you don't give some of the right to protect themselves, you are putting them at risk for dying. there are ways you can talk about issues of life and death. that doesn't excuse him on going out and killing someone. >> kat: you can be upset and mad and people don't grab guns and shoot people. >> eboni: accept that people do. >> kat: evil does that. >> eboni: evil people, evil individuals. i talked about this earlier. i do think we have to look at the fact that the rhetoric is starting to merge with the reality. to blindly think they are always meant to be distinct is naive at this point. that's my personal opinion on it. i've seen the correlation firsthand. >> kat: would you agree it exists on both sides? >> eboni: 100%.
there are people who felt because the a disagreed with president obama's foreign policy, that we were going to die because of that. it's horrible and egregious. up next, senator rand paul will join us with his harrowing experience. stay with us. are upgrading their watere filter to zerowater. start with water that has a lot of dissolved solids...
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>> eric: senator rand paul was at the scene of today shooting. he joins us from washington. senator, you are on tv this morning on your phone and you were very compelling. can you take us through what you experienced this morning? >> i had just been up to bat and they told us to take five cuts. you know how it is, you sometimes think maybe my five cuts will be eight or ten. today i said i'm going five. because i chose to do what i was supposed to do, i was walking away as the shooter was preparing. i walked over to the dugout and senator jeff flake from arizona said, can i have a ride back to capitol hill? i said sure. i said i'm going to go another
cut at the batting cages which was farther away. i walked a little further out than i was putting on my helmet and we hear a loud shot. i live in kentucky, so people hunt in my neighborhood, even in the bottomland around my neighborhood. it's not uncommon to hear a shotgun. i heard a loud shot and it sounded close. like anything else, you think well, i don't know what that was. just about to say let's get started but then we heard five to ten shots quickly in a row and we knew something was wrong, and then we heard ten, 20 more shots. maybe a total of 50 or 60 shots. at this point, everyone is ducking for cover, scrambling. two staffers in left field and the shooter is along the third-base line hiding behind the dugout, a concrete cinderblock dugout. two of the staffers raised the
whole perimeter of the outfield so they are where i am. there is an oak tree right next to the batting cage. i am behind that tree. there are two staffers on the other side of the fence. we see that the shooter shoots representative scalise, and he's down. people are yelling "i'm hit." two guys on the other side of the fence, one of them has to make a decision. it's a tough decision. do i lay still and hope they think i'm dead or they don't come close or do i decide this is not a good place to be? while they are laying there, the bullets are landing all around them in the dirt of the warning track. one of them decides he's coming over the fence. it is about a 20-foot tall fence, chain-link fence. i think he was over in two seconds. i'm not sure i could've done that if i had to. he joins me and we are behind
the tree. at this point, we hear he's changing magazines, firing again. it's sort of like a killing field. the whole wide open field, no one can get to scalise. he is crawling as much as he can into the outfield. he has a significant injury but he crawls 15 yards, still no one can get to him because there is bullets spraying across the entire field. the people in the first base dugout, a submerged dugout where you go down about two feet to get in. they are below the lip of it. the bullets are going into the dirt in front of the dugout and bouncing up into the back. we hear that the shooter seems to be moving. seems like he is going towards home plate which means he's coming to the right half of the field where we are where most of the players are.
fortunately where the capital polices. the staffer and i behind the tree, we make a decision, run across an open field but in the opposite direction of the shooter or stay and see what happens. we made the choice we were unarmed and there was nothing we could do against someone with a semiautomatic rifle. we decide to run. we start hearing the capitol hill police, who are just amazing heroes, begin firing back. i found out later they were both shocked in the process. we lost our signal. we lost our signal. >> eric: we still have you. can you hear us? we lost the senator. you mentioned had it happen for for the capitol hill police.
>> eboni: they would've just have baseball bats. i wish we could've asked him, my question was congressman roger williams said they'd do the 6:00 to 8:00 a.m. practice. i wonder if people know that and they know where they are located because i'm wondering how this crazy madman. >> kat: think about how horrifying it is, you have no idea what's going on. you see it in the movie. it doesn't happen to you. i don't know how i react. it's terrifying. >> eric: you both live in d.c.? >> bob: outside d.c. >> eric: a lot of people know about the game and the practice. >> bob: absolutely. you can find out this information. it is so fortunate that scalise, and we pray that he recovers, that he was there because otherwise you have no security. this brings up the question of lawmaker security.
rank-and-file don't have security. >> eric: i think it was estimated that betsy devos, cabinet secretary, her security cost somewhere around a million dollars per month. one person. you are talking 535 members of congress. times a million times 12 months. we have a $4 trillion budget but 6 billion is a lot of money. >> kristen: what's tragic is that any and -- in any of these situations, living in a free society, there's always danger. >> eric: allow me to break in for a second. we have senator rand paul back. we have a minute or so. can you summarize, your final thoughts? >> at this point, the capitol hill police returning fire and you talk about the real heroes. both of them wounded in returning fire but had they not been there, i think it would have been a massacre. we had people hunkered down around the field with no defense. we were lucky capitol hill
police was there and i want to say thank you to them. >> eric: thank you for joining us. i know you have been sought after today. thank you for coming on our show. coming up, one return, it's time to wake up, america about the escalating climate of violence. be right back. because i get a safe driving bonus check every six months i'm accident free. because i don't use my cellphone when i'm driving. even though my family does, and leaves me all alone. here's something else... i don't share it with mom. i don't. right, mom? i have a brand new putter you don't even know about! it's awesome. safe driving bonus checks, only from allstate. sometimes i leave the seat up on purpose. switching to allstate is worth it.
>> eric: let's chat. you heard rand paul's account of the events this morning. where are we want to guy like steve scalise is gunned down on second base? mo brooks described the terror he felt being shot at with "just a baseball bat" for defense. don't lose the poetic irony on the fact that this happened on a
baseball field. is this america or is it raqqa or young men a shooter -- the shooter was a bernie sanders volunteer. this was a targeted attack on republicans, no doubt. american politics has been called a bloodsport. both sides are using strong words. it's been that wafer 240 years but there has been a seachange recently. liberal politicians and celebrities are willing to use words. they've been playing fast and loose with the way they disagree with the right. cory booker, a democrat from new jersey said "this will mean death, pain, and suffering." the governor of virginia said people are going to die. let's call it the home field for today's shooting. listen to loretta lynch go too
far. >> i know at the time of concern for people who see our rights being assailed, being trampled on, and even being rolled back. individuals have banded together, ordinary people who simply saw what needed to be done. they marched, they bled. yes, some of them have died. >> eric: really, ma'am? snoop dogg, kathy griffin, goes on and on. how many innocent people have to die before we realize words matter? crazy people act on the crazy things they hear from politicians and celebrities. there are crazy people taking your metaphors literally. before you blow a gasket saying i am being partisan, i would be delivering the same monologue if
it was a democrat practice. i promise you. kat, you yelled at me saying it goes both ways. it does. if there were democrats being targeted, and then they get sho shot, it would be an equal amount of outrage. >> kat: it does go both ways and there's no question people have reached a level of disgusted nests in their rhetoric. my question is what do we do about it? we can tell everybody to be nice. i'm not okay with banning speec speech. can't look at this and say second amendment, first amendment. how do we solve it? >> eric: you implore politicians not to use these metaphors like dying, killing, death, spilled blood. these are just metaphors and normal people's minds putting crazy people's minds, they take them literally. >> eboni: i agree. i hate it.
i started this morning with a tweet that was met with a lot of mixed reviews that begged people in this moment of praying for the family of representative scalise that we not politicize the moment. at that time we didn't know the politics of the shooter. the point is words do matter, i agree. when there are metaphors detecting president trump, i have a problem. just like i have problems with people saying president obama should have eaten a gun. the images they conjure up are so problematic. if they are on a slippery slope to crazy, it goes an extra step. >> kristen: a lot has been reported about the man i had started with op-ed's about tax cuts. how do you get someone who cares
a lot about policy? >> eric: allow me to break-in. >> of the fbi washington field office. i'm here to provide an investigative update on the shooting that occurred this morning. i would like to thank the alexandria police department, u.s. capitol police and medical response teams who responded to the scene this morning for their quick and decisive actions, saving lives. i remind you that this is an active investigation, and details continue to unfold. i stressed this earlier and i'm going to underscore it now. the fbi is not going to talk about the character or nature in which we are investigating this case other than to say we continue to work. this is an active investigation and an ongoing matter. there has been some confusion
about the injuries involved. our statement from earlier today, this afternoon, identify the number of victims and their injuries. let me review that quickly. five individuals were shot, a congressman, a united states capitol police officer, a congressional staffer, a lobbyist, and the subject. an additional two individuals, a congressman and a capitol police officer obtained secondary injuries at the scene and were transported to local hospitals and treated. as for the subject, and this is the only time i will be referring to him by his name, this afternoon we released a statement noting that the subject's name was james
hodgkinson. 66 years of age of belleville, illinois, . he succumbed to his injuries at the hospital and the d.c. medical examiner has issued the cause of death as multiple gunshot wounds to the torso. the fbi has issued a "seeking information" poster identifying the shooter and it can be found at fbi.gov. while the subject is deceased, we continue to actively investigate the shooter's motives, acquaintances, and whereabouts that led to today's incident. we will continue to have presence as we process a scene here in alexandria and fbi agents are searching the shooter's home, his residence is belleville, illinois, . the subject vehicle was located
on scene and has been swept by alexandria pd and the atf, and we will be processing with our fbi evidence recovery team as well. obviously we are looking to glean what we can from the contents regarding his electrical devices that he owns. law enforcement has reason to believe the shooter has been in alexandria, virginia, area since march of this year. the fbi has issued a "seek information" poster located on our website asking the public to come forward with information on the shooter. to the local alexandria community, we believe the shooter has been living out of his vehicle. asking you to report any interactions you may have had with him.
likewise, the subject traveled from his residence in illinois, and we are asking and speaking with individuals who know him personally or who may have encountered him on his travels. if you have information, please call the fbi 24-hour tip line at 1-800-call fbi and select option one. the 24-hour tip line 1-800-call-fbi and select option one or visit tips dot fbi.gov. all tips will remain confidential. no amount of information is too small to report. law enforcement will remain
unseen until processing of the scene has been completed. we ask that the local community for your patience and cooperation as we can complete the task. further updates will be shared via written statements unless law enforcement collectively advises otherwise. i will open it up for a few questions in a second but i want to turn it over to alexandria pd for a couple of comments. >> thank you. mike brown. of the alexandria police department. i wanted to give the status as to what we are doing in the community to try and reassure the community in terms of the safety and security of our residents. right now, we are canvassing the immediate area, doing door-to-door with our colleagues from the sheriffs department and the fire department so that we can reassure people in the community that we believe this incident today is over, although the investigation will continue in the area for a while. we are working with some other departments in the city, the department of community and health services to make services
generally available for these kinds of situations available to our community over the next couple days. we care very much about our residents and the people who come to visit us and we are doing everything we can to reassure them that this is a safe community and that your government and your public safety personnel care deeply about it. you will see a lot of law enforcement and fire personnel working the area, trying to reassure them. i thank you for that and as part of the department, we will continue to work with the fbi as they move forward on their investigation very thank you very much. >> reporter: did he have a vendetta against republicans? >> i have no comment on that. >> reporter: do you know who's shot brought him down? >> multiple local law enforcement response. i do not know at this time. >> reporter: was a capitol police and alexandria? >> i'm not going to comment on exactly who it was.
>> reporter: can you give us an idea what you're trying to run down on the weapon? >> one handgun and one rifle. >> reporter: what are you trying to learn about them? >> where they came from, who they thought them, how he acquired them. >> reporter: officers interacted with him in march in illinois. was it after that that he came here? >> we believe he has been here since march, i'm not going to comment on the specifics. >> reporter: was the capitol police officer shot and the original round of gunfire? >> i'm not exactly sure. >> reporter: for people who may have seen him, is there anything you can say, jog people's recollections. to >> that is what we are asking the people to help us with. we are not sure.
>> reporter: was he on the radar? [indistinct] >> we are exploring all angles and were not going to be limited. we will let the facts take us where they go. >> reporter: was he still conscious when he was taken away? to go i can't comment, i am not sure. >> reporter: do we know if he was working in the area? pico it appears he was not working. i'm not going to comment on the victims. what i have is what i have already provided. >> reporter: can you describe the vehicle? isn't from illinois?
>> the only comment i will make is it's a white cargo van. >> reporter: can the capitol police talk to us about their officers? those who were injured and return fire? >> fred rogers, u.s. capitol police. we put out a statement today and the chief wants to commend special agent crystal griner and others. grateful for special agent griner, who is in good condition in the hospital. special agent bailey was treated and released, having sustained a minor injury. united states capitol police is dedicated to the mission of protecting the united states capital, members of congress and staff in the visiting public. today we saw how our officers training was put into action paired we would also like to thank our partner agencies, the fbi, atf, u.s. park police,
virginia state police, and especially the alexandria police for their work and helping us respond and mitigate this incident. we continue to provide a robust and visible presence at the capitol complex and to monitor national and world events to provide a level of security that's appropriate. >> reporter: can you describe officer griner's response? >> as part of the investigation and i won't comment. >> reporter: agents who were with congressman scalise, is it a protective detail? what is their mission? >> their assignment today was to protect the congressman. >> reporter: was he the only one who had protective detail? >> we had capitol police officers assigned to monitor the event. >> reporter: there is video and audio recordings of the gun battle. it would appear to have been
ferocious. by a layman's count, dozens and dozens of shots fired and people screaming. can you describe what your officers and the capital officers were facing when they came and clucked back >> i won't go into the specifics of the investigation but i've heard the video and i've talked to my officers at least and some of them, quite frankly it was not only chaotic but it was a combat situation. that is something law enforcement is trained to do and our officers are trained to do. i am proud of the officers at apd and the capitol police. more will come out when the facts are known in the investigation is complete but i couldn't be more proud of the alexandria police officers. >> reporter: they were up against someone with a semiautomatic weapon. >> they did engage in a firefight. i won't do it into the details. it's part of the investigation.
we rely on doing an investigation any time we have a discharge of weapons and we are doing that right now and to get ahead of it would be not fair for the officers or the agency. we will deal with the facts when they become apparent. our officers are doing fine. we are concerned about them. i am personally concerned about them but they did a great job today and i am of them. >> reporter: responding to 911 calls. >> we received a call of shots fired this morning at 7:09. within 3 minutes, we had three units here. some of the units were here earlier and they were engaged. i won't go into greater detail than that. >> reporter: did your officers have any encounters with mr. hodgkinson in the months he's been here? >> i can't speak to it. as part of the investigation.
the fbi has a lead and we are working with the fbi. we will give you that information when it's available. thank you. [indistinct question] not sure of that. we will have to get back to you. >> reporter: any indication he discussed this with anyone else? >> that is part of the investigation. >> reporter: do you have anybody else in custody? >> we have no one else in custody. >> reporter: did he have multiple guns on him? >> i'm not going to comment about the guns other than one handgun and one rifle. >> reporter: did he have the hand gun on him or was it in the car? >> i am not going to comment. >> reporter: how this could be prevented. congressman being protected.
do you expect the investigation will give us any answers? >> i ask that you let us run the investigation. >> reporter: what can we expect out of the investigation? we know you concluded he was the shooter. what else will the final report provide? what do you hope to answer? >> we hope to answer motive and why he was here and why he did what he did. >> reporter: [indistinct question] >> i have no information about that. i have no comment. >> reporter: why do you think he chose this game? why did he choose today? >> no indication of why today at all.
>> reporter: will security be at national park tomorrow? >> i can't speak to the security about tomorrow. >> reporter: he was essentially living on this street and the politicians came to him essentially. is it possible this was just an opportunity? >> we will figure it out. >> one more question. >> reporter: any indication he knew this practice was going on? >> we have no indication that he knew this was going on. >> reporter: you are not actively seeking any other suspects? >> no, we are asking the community's help. >> reporter: you are not asking the community, be on the lookout for anybody else. you are not looking for anybody else. >> not at the moment. >> eric: listening to a press conference offered by the fbi,
alexandria police department and the capitol hill police department. the reason why there was capitol hill police there at all was because steve scalise is the whip, part of the leadership group. they get 24-hour secret service and capitol hill police, one or the other. the reason why this wasn't a rand paul massacre, as he points out, is because they were there. one of the things that was most important, a tidbit of information we got is that they are looking for potentially a larger group here. is he a lone wolf or part of a larger group and what is the motive? >> eboni: is this orchestrated? were people helping him? there tracking down the status of the weapons. he wouldn't comment too much. we know it's one rifle, one pistol. did he buy them himself? those things are going to be
looked at closely. >> eric: when we have a full screen appear, talking about a larger group. we saw he had a couple facebook pages, social media pages. one of them was liking this pag page. earlier in the day. it is called "terminate" the republican party. there was some pushback, people saying things like that shouldn't be allowed on social media. >> kat: i think that is taking a little too far. it could mean disband, when you go down that route, you start to get in trouble. there are plenty of people in that group i'm sure who aren't going to hurt anyone, don't think of it that way. could being that strict nguyen on social media prevent crime? it would but we will be getting rid of all of our freedom. >> eric: you don't think it would fall under hate speech?
a lot of social media accounts, they pull it down, maybe not even that provocative. >> kat: terminate the republican party could mean anything. not that it is nice rhetoric but if you're going to start talking about getting criminally involved, i don't know. >> eric: kristin, what do you think of the investigation? >> kristen: i am interested to find out how he went from being someone who writes off beds about tax brackets. the picture that's been going around talks about taxing the rich. we need 20 tax brackets but it's not advocating violence. someone who is passionate about politics and we want to encourage that. what led him down this path? to be someone who takes it just such an extreme. what does the path look like and how can you stop it? >> eboni: i think many of us
like to think of the path that is a long stretch but i think it's getting shorter and shorter with every passing election and i'm troubled when i see this type of thing. >> eric: the shorter and shorter. machen seems to be that the left starts -- the gun-control argument comes to the forefront. >> bob: we have already heard some of it today. i think the politics. i've been covering politics for 20 years. it's never been worse. the temperature is too hot. the 2000 election, contested. any violence? no. if the 2016 election had been contested, where there have been violence? i think so. the politicians have to watch their rhetoric. they have to curb their own speech in order to not set off people. >> eric: motive seems to be the most important issue. what is it? is he simply a socialist was lost his mind?
or is there something bigger? >> kristen: app might be harder to know with certainty. the things he's posted on social media. he may have left something behind. but take the issue when the man shot gabby giffords. he did not die. we were able to find out afterwards he is genuinely a crazy person but he wasn't radicalized by the right-wing come as many folks on the left said. he was still alive and we had that. he >> kat: his friends saying that they were terrified of him. >> kristen: because the shooter has died, it will make it a little harder to find out. >> eric: we have a lot of, we have his rap sheet, fairly extensive. domestic violence. not extensive? >> eboni: not from what i've seen.
this goes back to the legal question around, did he own the gun legally or illegally? i am wondering because oftentimes the other issue we have with gun controls is mental health. bipartisan support around furthering mental health valuations when it comes to who should have a gun. i am asking. traditional mental health, schizophrenia, bipolar, but what about politics and the trumpeter arrangement and all of this, hyper- partisan crazy. i think it's becoming a real thing. that's my fear. >> eric: kat, is it going to a pro-gun control argument? or will it end up being an antigun control argument, saying if there are more people armed maybe this wouldn't have happened. god forbid scalise isn't there today and there is no capitol hill police.
it's 10 minutes may move before they alexandria police department gets there. how many people are data? >> kat: the same people making the same argument again. it's human thing to see a tragedy and want to change policy, to want to restrict policy which is exactly why we have the bill of rights and exactly why it's so hard to amend the constitution. it's for a reason, so that we don't act based on emotion. i thought it was a great point you brought up. if he had not been there, this would have been a different story. >> eboni: it is a well-intentioned thing you just articulated. it's different than people who look at a tragedy like today or congresswoman giffords and put it into a political narrative that suits their conveniences. >> bob: you see that all the time and politics. you talk about gabby giffords, that have been years ago.wasn't. did it change policy?
not at all. is this going to change policy? i am pessimistic. i hope so. eric, you were mentioning the rhetoric of political war rooms. >> eric: the media -- we do the same thing but the problem is when crazy people listen to it and look up to celebrities or politicians or media personalities, they take it literally and they take things into their own hands. which i would say is a better argument for the second amendment than any of this. >> kat: there is no argument for the second amendment. the second amendment is the argument itself. people don't take it seriously and they should. changing the second amendment is not going to happen. >> eric: if you can get gunned down on second base and softball practice, you can get gunned down anywhere. >> eboni: you can, and that's the thing.
my cost on the radio show has been shot five times. he's been shot on the streets of new york city. a lot of people feel like today is a little bit of a wake-up call for washington, d.c., and not in a "this is what they deserve" way but maybe this is the type of firsthand experience something need to realize how dangerous the world really is. >> eric: my wife wants a gun permit. she sees this going on. americans are saying i have a right to bear arms and i'm going to do it. >> kristen: i do focus groups and folks across the political spectrum feel unsettled, unsafe. they feel like things aren't going their way and they are angry in washington but they are also angry at the anger in
washington. they would like the temperature turned down a little bit. i think across america, even though we have the change in administrations, people are feeling unsettled. they are not dealing particularly safe and i think when people are nervous and scared, that's one more scary things happen. >> eboni: i am someone who is thinking, and we live in new york city. of course i am thinking about i don't want to be a lame duck. to >> eric: you are 100% accurate. it's one of them most difficult cities in the country to get a gun permit. it's easier to get one in d.c. >> eboni: i will get trained and i will know how to operate it well and correctly. >> eric: i posed this to kristen. is it worth what could be several billion dollars to make sure these congresspeople are protected? >> bob: a lot of members say they don't want that protection but i think one of the things
about the humanity of the day, senator flake called scalise's wife. can you imagine getting that phone call? it is so frightening. i think a lot of members say no, i'm a member of congress and i know the risks. we have been at events and we do feel scared sometimes. >> eric: flake was calling scalise's wife saying, he's okay. could have been very different. >> kat: gives me chills to think about it. i haven't heard any congressperson saying they want that, that they want to have everybody have their own -- >> eric: give it a few days. >> eboni: i want to say thank you, thank you, thank you to the capital city police. special agent crystal griner and officer bailey. >> eric: we are going to say thank you to our fox news specialist. christian soul to sanderson and bob cusack and we want to
thank you for watching. follow us at specialistsfnc on twitter and facebook. 5:00 will never be the same. "special report" will be all over this. [gunfire] >> members of congress practicing for a charity baseball game, a heavily armed man with a history of angry politics and run-ins with the law. a shooting that could have turned into a massacre. this is "special report," i am chris wallace and for bret baier. several people are in the hospital tonight but they are lucky to be alive. a gunman opened fire this morning at a baseball practice for members of congress in alexandria, virginia. among the wounded, the number three republican in t