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tv   Outnumbered Overtime With Harris Faulkner  FOX News  July 13, 2018 10:00am-11:00am PDT

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>> all right, thank you so much to charlie hurt, what a great day to be on the couch. we will back here at noon on monday, here is harris. >> harris: stunning news breaking here in the special counsel's investigation as president trump continues his european tour. he is now in the united kingdom, we've been watching it, holding a news conference with the prime minister and meeting with queen elizabeth the second half and just moments ago. president trump just leaving windsor castle, where he and first lady melania trump had tea with queen elizabeth. next stop for them, scotland. ahead of the president tsai with vladimir putin, do to happen on monday. deputy attorney general rod rosenstein announced a major
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indictment of 12 russian intelligence officers in the investigation into russian meddling in the 2016 presidential election. watch. all right, apparently we do not have sound. i know where we can get some, though. john roberts' life for us in london with the latest. john? >> harris, we are on a bus heading back to our hotel in london rush hour rush-hour tra. the president just held a bilateral meeting in press conference with theresa may. the indictment of these russian intelligence officers in connection with the mueller investigation is going to add another wrinkle to the president's upcoming summit with vladimir putin on monday in helsinki, finland. he remember, putin was not happy at all of the initial 11
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indictments of russian officials and so he certainly cannot be happy about this one. president trump gave us a glimpse into what he is going to talk about in that monday summit, he said he would talk about syria, crimea, and russia's meddling in the 2016 election, with the president now firmly seems to acknowledge. listen here. >> it will be a tremendous achievement, we will be talking about other things. i know you will be asking, what would be talking about meddling, i will absolutely bring that up. i don't think you'll have any "i did it, i did it, you got me" but you never know what happens. i will absolutely, firmly asked the question. hopefully we will have a very good relationship with russia. >> in that bilateral meeting and the ensuing press conference, the president looking for a little bit of a reset after comments he made in an interview with the u.k. at sun newspaper.
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the president exploded on the scene when he said he didn't like the direction theresa may it was going in and that it will likely mean the united states couldn't cut any trade deals with the u.k. that looked on the surface like a serious political undercutting just as they were getting together for this bilateral meeting. for the press conference today, the president heaped praise on the british prime minister, listen here. >> i have a lot of respect for the prime minister and unfortunately there was a story that was done which was generally fine, it didn't put in what i said about the prime minister. i want to apologize, i said such good things about you. she said "don't worry, it's only the press." i thought that was very professional. i might add -- they've been
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doing it to me and i had been doing it to them. >> the body language of the leaders look like there was no hard feelings, when the president and prime minister came down the steps to the podiums where they were giving the press conference, the president held the prime minister's hand to take her down the steps. the president right now, harris now at windsor castle with the queen to have tea to have tea with her majesty. i want to point out before we g go, the president called out one of my colleagues of nbc as dishonest and said nbc news was dishonest. he also called out cnn is not a real network, fake news. let me just add that i know kristin walker, she set up a friend of mine, she is as honest as the day is long and to call her dishonest is unfair. i used to work at cnn and they have fine journalists who risk
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their lives to cover news around the world and to say they are not a real network or fake news is also unfair. i just want to add that in ther there. >> harris: john roberts, you always have people's back. it's impressive, thank you. joining us now, lee selden serves on the house foreign affairs committee. this was a big meeting today, we will get more on the president's visit. i want to start with the indictment. intelligence officers working against the cause of american democracy. >> this is the appropriate supervised investigation with regards to the election. russia metals, they do it in syria, they will meddle with their own elections in the past, they will do it again if we don't have transparency and accountability. this is the appropriate supervised scope. we should be concerned about
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cybersecurity, or if it's a republican network, it's not just russia, north korea, cybersecurity is a big issue. this is great work on the part of our justice department and to send a message, do not do it again. >> harris: we saw rod rosenstein go where you're going, this is not a political thing, i want to hear now from the deputy ag and get more, watch. >> there is no indication in this indictment that any american citizen committed a crime. there is no allegation that the conspiracy affected any election. >> harris: that's important, why? >> that's consistent with what i've been told as well and i am not aware of any crime whatsoever committed by our president or anyone on his
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behalf. the president did not commit a crime to win and election and that's where this whole investigation, the branding of it, the people cheering for it, hoping robert mueller will show up at the white house, it's become so partisan and it got away from the focus of why it's been created and why it was legitimized in the first place. i think it's important for the deputy ag to make that announcement absolutely clear. where a foreign adversary may look to test a system, look to a state board of elections to try to get into a computer, it doesn't mean she actually did change vote count. they will test out systems but it doesn't mean they actually attacked it to change results. that part of the investigation, it shows even though there was bad activity going on, it doesn't mean they changed any vote counts and that's
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consistent with the briefings are received. >> harris: no indication that americans would have known with whom they were corresponding online. this came into play because he was starting to list some of the charges and among them were the phony internet identifications. he called it charges of aggravated identity theft, were people corresponding with them and a third party company they were running timed information through, a pass-through company with information online. no indication americans knew with whom they were corresponding. that's important, why? >> very important. this information is coming up because members of congress would receive classified briefings and we can't come up to the cameras tell everybody what we been briefed on but this is a complex network. it's not a russian intelligence official directly with the the,
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it's a complex tree. not just the law enforcement community but also the intelligence community and working with the intelligence community of other nations. what's also important to note is they could have been a lot more cooperative throughout this process. they were not very forthcoming in providing their information. we could've had a lot more answers and conclusions a lot earlier in this process. >> harris: not just information there but you had the clinton campaign as well being asked for their servers. and they ran it through a third party, we talked about this on "outnumbered," they ran it through a third-party to be be able to look at information on the former secretary of state's servers. >> they were not cooperative whatsoever and there are important conclusions to be drawn. what's also important as donald trump was elected president in november of 2016 by the american people, who were listening to him talking about the need to better control our borders, enter into better trade
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deals, move in a better direction as far as health care goes, the list goes on and on. from one issue to the next, that's why donald trump was elected. it doesn't mean by any stretch of the imagination that we should not and can't come together as americans to bring accountability whenever a foreign adversary tries to breach our systems. >> harris: thank you very much. let's get the other side of the political aisle, brad sherman sits on the house foreign affairs committee, great to see you today. you've got these 12 russian intel officers indicted for u.s. election meddling. this is forward movement. >> it tells us what we already know, russia hacked, russia spread false news, russia was trying to help trump win the presidency. but it provides the additional details that make it even more
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difficult for putin to deny it. the real question is what sanctions are we going to impose on russia because of what they've done? indicting people in the u.s. court system who will never visit the united states is just telling 12 people they can't come to disneyland. we've got to do more than that. we have sanctioned russia for what they've done to other countries, it's time to sanction russia for what they've done to us and to make it plain what will happen if they interfere in the 2018 election. >> harris: that's really interesting, what should we do, what should the sanctions look like? the president is getting ready to meet with the russian president on monday. we are told he was briefed about all of this, the president was briefed earlier this week, he knew what will be happening today as well. what does a sanction look like against russia? that's appropriate with meddling in a u.s. presidential election.
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>> i am most concerned in preventing future meddling. russia has sputnik radio, bbc broadcast in one category, if they want to editorialize openly that's one thing but if they are going to be tampering with vote tabulation, stealing files, which was the very crime committed in watergate and again in 2016, we have to cut russia off from our banking system. we have to draw a line in the sand. if they start using criminal activity to interfere with our vote tabulation or steel files, we've got to impose on them the kinds of sanctions we've imposed on iran. it will be a bigger deal because russia is a bigger economy but those sanctions brought iran to the negotiating table and that's where i would start if they met all in our election. >> harris: we got a little taste of that, what do we do
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about protecting our elections moving forward? we clearly have not been doing enough, russia is not the only country that would attempt to, probably already has, cyber warfare is a common weapon now among some people around the world, like china. >> second, we need you know you will never educate every american, i get some great recipes on the internet and my relatives are telling me that's not all that goes in that pie. it's almost impossible to do. what if there is something the federal government can do? you are mentioning paper trails, that sort of thing, what else? >> finally, all of the political organizations need to have good
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cybersecurity. it's -- in the heat of a campaign you tend to be what are we going to do in today's press conference and a little bit less on how do we make sure a variety of nefarious actors are not hacking into our computer syste system? >> harris: you mention political organizations, we now have, a distance with this latest round of indictment charges. i want to know your point of view on it, are we in a place where we can put these politics and partisan points of view aside and look at this for what it is? a problem for our total democracy no matter which party you're in. >> it's a problem for our democracy and the democracies of other countries we work closely with around the world. we need european cooperation to sanction russia if it meddles in our election or germany's election, britain's election,
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et cetera. i want to say, if it's free speech, if it's an editorial, that's one thing. the other extreme, interfering in vote tabulation systems, something like that isn't something we cannot forgive in the future. >> harris: we have a quick white house statement on rod rosenstein. one, there is no allegation of this indictment that americans knew they were corresponding with russia, i've been talking about that this hour. there is no allegation that any american citizen committed a crime, no allegation that the conspiracy changed the vote counter affected any election results. no allegations of knowing involvement by anybody in the campaign and no allegations that the alleged hacking affected the election results. this is consistent with what we have been saying all along. quick response from you, congressman sherman? >> there is no proof it affected tabulation, there is definite proof that it affected how some
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people voted because the trim campaign made a very big deal about the emails, the dnc emails, it was embarrassing for the democratic party and in a number of ways cost us some votes. we know donald trump jr. wanted russia to help with "dirt on hillary," he just didn't get it. we know that meeting was an attempt to get a legal help. whether there was ever a meeting that was successful in getting illegal help, we will have to see. that is why mueller is doing his investigation. >> harris: on the flip side of that, a democratic pay for an anti-trump dossier, we could go back and forth all day but i have to let you go. >> everybody does opposition research, that is a completely different issue. >> harris: president trump speaking out today ahead of his high-stakes meeting with russian president vladimir putin on monday. what we can expect when they sit
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down together especially after the justice department just indicted another 12 russian intelligence officers. we are awaiting lisa page at a closed-door house hearing -- we have live pictures of her, let's go to it. is she arriving? we will bring it to you after the break. stay close. there she is. now. since my stroke, he hasn't left my side.
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>> harris: a fox news alert, lisa page, the woman -- the other half of that duo, if you will, sending those anti-trump text messages, just arrived to meet with house lawmakers behind closed doors. she's want back and forth on whether she wanted to do this. now she has kept the meeting. this just one day after peter strzok faced off against republicans over the text messages they were changing and whether their personal opinions influenced decision-making at the fbi. catherine herridge live on capitol hill with the latest. this is day two of that couple. >> that's right, harris, it's been pretty frantic in the last few minutes because lisa page has just arrived here. we were able to throw her a few
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questions, i asked her if she watched agent strzok's testimony yesterday, i asked her whether she had any way coordinated her testimony with strzok or his legal team and i asked if she had any regrets, she didn't answer any of those questions and basically plowed right through the reporters to one of the back entrances. this comes after the ten hours of testimony yesterday from agent strzok, her former colleague and lover. one of the highlights from last night was when strzok discussed his termination by the russian special counsel. he said robert mueller asked very few questions, let's liste listen. >> did robert mueller ever ask you if you were biased against donald trump? >> he did not. >> was it clear that he was aware of these incendiary text messages? >> yes. >> he knew of the text messages but never asked you whether you are biased or not? >> that's correct. >> one of the big highlights from yesterday which was agent
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strzok's explanation of the text where he and paige discussed stopping then candidate trump. he testified first that he couldn't remember the text and then later said it was driven by anger and what he described as statements from candidate trump that were targeted at a military family. that event was in late july and strzok did not write this text until eight days later, let's listen. >> you were speaking on the behalf of the american people, is that correct? >> i don't recall writing that text. but i can tell you is that that text in no way suggested that i or the fbi would take any action to influence the candidates. >> that's a fantastic answer to a question nobody asked. >> another text they had to
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address was this text where agent strzok had very disparaging comments for trump supporters in southern virginia. let's listen to that exchange. >> what does trump support smell like? >> that's an expression of speech, that clearly was not smiling one thing or the other. what i meant by that was living in northern virginia, having traveled 150 miles south within the same state, i was struck by the extraordinary difference in the expression of political opinion and belief amongst the community there. >> you described that as smell in capital letters. >> that was her choice. >> democrats ran a lot of interference throughout the ten hour hearing and made the very legitimate point that if agent strzok was so filled with anti-trump biased, if he wanted judy to derail the campaign, he could have sent that information to
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the media which didn't happen. >> if you had wanted to harm and interfere with the election of president trump, you could have leaked information that the investigation was ongoing, but none of that came out. >> character assassination, connecting dots that are meant to be connected, generalizing from an isolated incident, cherry picking facts, sometimes fabricating facts, it's astounding, a new low in the united states congress. what a shame. >> one of the reasons lisa page is on capitol hill today for the closed-door deposition, the transcribed interview is that she was threatened with contempt. she either had to show up for the public testimony yesterday or come today for a deposition or they would initiate contempt proceedings. we anticipate she will be inside
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several hours today and back again monday for a second session. >> harris: do we know what the differences will be between today and monday or is it just a matter of having more time? >> my sense from my discussions is that it's really down to logistics and timing. if you look at agent strzok's deposition, that went for 11 hours, 90 minutes within the classified session, so it may just be a matter of timing. >> harris: let's take it in deeper, steve brussel of the house oversight committee, great to have you today. on the heels of all of this coming together, is there some cross-section you see today where you would want to see lisa page specifically asked about something based on something you saw yesterday with her lover peter strzok? >> for many of us we would like to know the other half of the story and we'd like to know what her views are, what those things
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she didn't work directly for us for strzok but she certainly worked in a senior position as counsel, she certainly has information that i am certain in the closed-door session they will be getting two. >> harris: democrats are pressing the point, one in particular from rhode island was saying he wants to see all the transcripts. i want to watch and listen and get your response. >> having open transcripts and oversight and government is precisely one of the reasons why we called mr. strzok to be in the hearing, so people could hear those words for themselves. if they were demanding that so much, why weren't they demanding it earlier when those transcripts were there? >> harris: no doubt, here's how testy it got. >> there seems to be no good reason other than a personal preference of some, apparently, that this transcript not be released. >> we are investigating irregularities conducted in
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investigations by the fbi, the gentleman wants to perpetuate that by creating irregularities here and releasing questions so other potential future witnesses can read the question before their asked. >> harris: i want to get your response to that because you are right, you have to want it for all if you want it for some. >> you don't want those things to be released before the actual testimony from both the strzok and page are given, you want to get it on its surface, i think the american people deserve that but it think one of the most interesting things in the hearing yesterday was this portrayal that there was no bias, it didn't affect decisions and reese are repeatedly accusations that inspector general horwitz said there was no bias and that is not the case. he said they had no confidence that his decision on the laptop
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was about bias and they said he had a biased mind-set. what they were saying was that the prosecutors had no bias, but not mr. strzok and this is a point that has been repeatedly missed as it's been shouted over in the greater picture. >> harris: congressman russell, some of this comes down, if you put bias aside to just judgment, this is a man who had a lot of power in a couple of different investigations. the question becomes, was that lack of adjustment judgment? you talk about the anthony weiner laptop, and just the poor judgment of walking in and downloading all that material off the server onto that laptop. you talk about those things in the investigation, i want to just ask now, what does accountability look like for him? are you still going after bias or is the most tremendous amount of judgment, bad judgment
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enough? >> inspector general horwitz recommended several of the agents, strzok and page are included, that they be referred to the penalty and offense code for adjudication, he believed they were implicated in provisions of that and they would turn that portion over to the fbi. i don't think he will survive that well, there's nothing i've read in those guides that makes me believe he did not violate several of those measures, i pointed those out in my questioning to him yesterday. these are things, obviously we have concern. the biggest concerns, the fbi wields tremendous power and our law enforcement wields tremendous power, they get that from the consent of the government that it comes with trust and if we can't trust our own law enforcers we are in serious trouble. >> harris: congressman russell, we will let you put that button on it, that touches us all.
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thank you. >> thank you, harris, appreciate it. >> harris: new fox polling shows approval about the russia investigation into into meddlin meddling. our power panel next. don't take entresto with an ace inhibitor or aliskiren, or if you've had angioedema with an ace or arb. the most serious side effects are angioedema, low blood pressure, kidney problems, or high blood potassium. entresto, for heart failure. with who we are as people and making everybody feel welcome. ordering custom ink t-shirts has been a really smart decision for our business. i love the custom ink design lab because it's really easy to use. they have customer service that you can reach anytime. t-shirts help us immediately get a sense of who we are as a group. from the moment clients walk in,
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>> harris: we will see the president heading to helsinki, finland, back home in washington, d.c., rod rosenstein announced new indictments about an hour ago against russia for election meddling. the president said he plans to ask the russian leader about syria, ukraine, and interference in the u.s. election. new fox news polling shows this, 59% of the public thinks president trump should meet with putin. a former trump state department senior advisor and senior fellow at the center for national interest. people have a certain way they feel about our president meeting
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with putin, yes, it ought to happen. >> this should've happened a lot earlier, typically american presidents dieterle with russian leaders, russia is an important country. because of the insinuated impact on the election, it's been put off but it's finally happening on monday. >> harris: we've heard that indictment, it was very specific in the ways that they tried and if, in fact, they were to be successful in the future, i guess a big question is are we doing enough to stop them and how do we do that? brad sherman was on earlier, he said we need to thwart their ability to do business in certain banks and put sanctions on russia, what do you think? >> i heard brad say that. to say we should fence russia from the banking system, would crank up the price of oil even more, and russia interviews inn
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our political system -- >> harris: do we let them get away with that? >> we can offer our own political warfare. i'm not saying we shouldn't do that but we should do what we are doing, law enforcement measures. russia has always engaged in political warfare efforts, they are nowhere near as successful as for example the chinese. you do recognize and realize they have no impact. the money they put into our politics couldn't sway the election for the mayor of wichita, it doesn't have -- >> harris: i don't think that's the point, the point is they are trying in one day they could be successful. with china, are we doing enough to keep them from doing it to our elections, too? >> china recently after finding a significant part of bill clinton's reelection in 1996 are focused more on stealing our ip
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but very focused on countries of australia, countries in africa, really around the world. australia big inbound recipient of thinly disguised chinese money. they're the effort is exposing around the world what china is up to. especially its initiative that is an attempt to buy influence around the world. >> harris: sit tight just a second as we watch this breaking news together. the president of the united states and the first lady exiting marine one, they met with queen elizabeth the second at windsor castle for an afternoon tea. would love to have gotten the tea on that meeting. maybe we will one day. they are going to head to scotland, the president continuing his european tour. tough on nato about defense spending and then doing their part for all of our allies and paying certain percentages of the gdp that would bring them in line with the expectations we must meet. and then you have a meeting with
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the queen, the queen generally publicly does not discuss politics with leaders around the world. we love to have known exactly what they talked about but for right now the president, the center of attention there as he boards air force one in europe. on his way to scotland with the first lady of the united states. it's been a history making visit. christian, your thoughts? >> it's a good wrap up to a trip with europe, we've offered them a very significant trade deal. no tariffs. theresa may, the prime minister is not really in a position to accept that but our alliance with britain is strong. going to do real diplomacy, we have real interests with russia and things with which we can cooperate. thwarting china, getting north korea to come in from
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economic engagements. these are the things we should have been talking to the russians about four months and months and we haven't because of partisan politics here. >> harris: now that you've put it in the context of all those high-stakes things we have to talk with russia about, does it help today to have the deputy ag continue on? we don't see any americans who committed any crimes but we are looking at this and studying it. >> i think it's good to say that, i think at some point mueller shouldn't say, if that's true, that's fine, turn over this investigation for the regular u.s. attorney who deals with counterintelligence. today's timing is a little suspicious, they could've come up with this indictment at any time, the investigation has been going on for months. >> harris: i'm just giving you what he said. christian, we will have you back.
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have a fabulous weekend. new concerns about antitrust bias inside the fbi following peter strzok's marathon hearing on capitol hill yesterday. my president trump's attorney says a trump-mueller interview is now farther away than ever. next. they could never hold you down. when i built my family tree and found you, i found my sense of adventure. i set off on a new life, a million miles away. i'm heidi choiniere, and this is my ancestry story. now with over 10 billion historical records, discover your story. get started for free at ancestry.com
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>> harris: the president's attorney really meg rudy giuliani now says the potential interview between president trump and robert muels further away following peter strzok's capitol hill testimony. >> you are of a lawyer, would you walk your client into a kangaroo court with guys who donated $36,000 to his opponent? if you had an objective group of people you can persuade, of course. but if you have people like him, they've never unraveled the tape he created.
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>> harris: peggy lee is , kayleh mcenany. i want to jump on this point, 48% of people approve of the investigation, that number is getting smaller. maybe it more surprising, a seven-point drop comes entirely from a decline among democrats. why do you think that is. >> these are interesting snapshots and that's all they are at this moment in time. there's been a lot of confusion about what the facts are. this investigation has drawn out for quite a while. it's an interesting snapshot but we have yet to see the end and i think the real pole will be taken when the last of the either indictment or the last of the reports is issued.
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>> harris: just to get on point here, it's pretty generic. a new fox poll revealed that approval of the russia investigation has dropped. >> the american public has realized that the left has deceived them. here we are, two years after the opening of the fbi investigation, one year plus after the beginning of the mueller investigation and there is no collusion. i believe i was on your show back in february when the first set of indictments came out, against the russians and the social media scheme, very interesting. rod rosenstein said there, there is no evidence that americans had knowledge. today he said there is no allegation that americans made it a crime. there is no evidence. the american public is it seeing it. >> harris: he said there was no indication or evidence that americans even new online with whom they were dealing.
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it goes beyond whether or not there was a crime. peggy, as you look at the scope and see the dwindling of from democrats, is this something democrats want to lean on going into the midterm election? >> today to say there wasn't crimes committed against americans is just wrong, you had 12 russians being indicted today because of the fact that they tried to influence our election. why we aren't screaming from the rooftops for more sanctions to be able to go after these russians were trying to influence our elections is beyond me. why the president knowing this information over in england called it a witch can't, continues to call it a witch hunt, instead of the condemnation of these acts is beyond me.
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>> harris: we will talk about it, stay close. sugar spikes you can really feel it. glucerna. everyday progress.
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>> hi, everyone, i'm dana perino, 12 russians indicted by the special counsel for interfering with our election. now democrats calling for president trump to cancel his one-on-one meeting with
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vladimir putin. jody? major protests still happening in london after the president meets with prime minister theresa may and the queen. all that and more on "the daily briefing" ." >> harris: just days away from the president's high-stakes summit with vladimir putin on monday and at top member democrat on the senate intel committee had this to say about canceling it, watch. >> he should not meet with vladimir putin one-on-one, there needs to be other americans in the room to make sure we know what really happens. if he and his team are not willing to make the facts of this indictment a top priority, they need to cancel the helsinki summit. >> harris: that was about 9 minutes ago, we captured it as it was happening. let's bring back the power panel. penny, i will start with you, democrats and saying call the whole thing off.
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we just talked about americans wanting to see it happen, though they may think the president has not been tough enough on vladimir putin, why call it off? >> i agree with senator warren, he was saying it should go on with other people in the room. what we have seen from president trump, for example on the recent interview is he denies things that were set on the record. it is important to have other people in the room to make sure we understand what was being communicated, what putin said as well. i do think we should have -- it should still continue. >> harris: if it's going to be a one-on-one, and it looks like the white house is not going to change because of what mark warner says, why now? you got an indictment against russia for meddling, you've got forward movement in this case. it would give the president even more ground to talk about what
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happened. >> president trump is already said he intends to bring this up and here's one thing i can assure you of, president obama knew about the meddling, he did nothing about it, nothing. i can guarantee you that president trump will exhibit the kind of toughness president obama never showed. these are democrats playing politics. i also find it interesting that democrats who claim to care so much about collusion, -- not collusion, but meddling, why didn't you care when it was happening in the last election? peter strzok confirmed to us yesterday, russia has been doing this for a very long time, democrats just didn't care then, they care now because their candidate lost. >> we always have cared, that's why you saw president obama implement strong sanctions against russia, once the trump administration tried to walk back and pull away from. >> when you tell vladimir putin,
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more flexibility to give you what you want after the election, not really being toug tough. >> harris: that was a moment caught on camera. thank you very much, have a wonderful weekend as we head into the commercial break, you can read the entire deputy ag rosenstein's indictment. stay close. i needed legal advice for my shop. that's when i remembered that my ex-ex- ex-boyfriend actually went to law school, so i called him. he didn't call me back! if your ex-ex- ex-boyfriend isn't a lawyer, call legalzoom and we'll connect you with an attorney. legalzoom. where life meets legal.
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i'm harris. here's dana. >> dana: a fox news alert on the russia investigation. rod rosenstein just unveiling new charges for russian intelligence officers accused of hacking the dnc and the clinton campaign. i'm dana perino. this is "the daily briefing." rosenstein announcing the charges at a news conference earlier today. mr. trump saying he will bring up russian meddling. >> i will absolutely bring that up. i don't think you'll have any gee, i didn't, you got me. there won't be a perry mason here. you never know what happens.

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