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tv   Washington Week With Gwen Ifill  PBS  April 16, 2016 1:30am-2:01am PDT

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>> sharp elbows in the empire state as hillary clinton and bernie sanders jostle to make it there. while donald trump says republican party rules aren't on the level. williams in for gwen ifill tonight on "washington week." of people are lot very surprised to learn that you supported raising the minimum $15 an hour! >> you know, wait a minute. wait a minute. not accurate! >> clinton and sanders clash as vote.rk prepares to >> does secretary clinton have the experience and intelligence president? of course she does. but i do question -- [cheering] do question her judgment. >> this is a phony attack that is designed to raise questions no evidence or support to undergird the
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insinuation that he is putting forward in these attacks. >> while on the republican side, says ted cruz and the republican establishment aren't playing fair. >> this is a rigged system, folks. the republican national committee, they should be themselves for allowing this kind of crap to happen! yelling ands been screaming. a lot of whining. the house speaker of says this time he really means it. >> let me be clear. not want, nor will i accept, the nomination for our party. >> our coverage of the presidential come naiting nominating march continues with ed o'keefe, political reporter for the washington post, jonathan martin, national political correspondent for the new york times, michael scherer, bureau for time magazine, and alexis simendinger, white house correspondent for real clear politics. >> award-winning reporting and analysis, covering history as it
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happens, live from our nation's capital, this is "washington week" with gwen ifill. this is "washington week" with ifill. corporate funding for "washington week" is provided by... >> we're committed to strong. we're committed to sure. we're committed to smart and and bold.ure in a world of enduring needs, the men and women of boeing are proud to build and deliver critical capabilities for those protect our nation and its allies. and that's an enduring commitment. >> thousands of people came out today to run the race for retirement. them, are you completely prepared for retirement? okay. prepared? you save 1% more of your
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income? it doesn't sound like much, but 1% nowan additional could make a big difference over time. >> i'm going to be even better about saving. it.ou can do >> prudential. >> additional corporate funding for "washington week" is by genentech. additional funding is provided foundation.own donating all profits from food products to charity and nourishing the common good. the ford foundation. the ethics and excellence in journalism foundation. the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. you! >> once again, live from washington, sitting in for gwen ifill this week, pete williams of nbc news. >> good evening. song ever broadcast by radio was performed on board a the brooklyn navy
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yard. it was called "i love you truly." last night, there was anything air in brooklyn, as hillary clinton and bernie sanders met in that spot for their first debate in five weeks. she was hoping to end his recent string of seven straight victories. the tone with his first answer about whether she's qualified to be president. >> oh, i question her judgment. super p.a.c.'s, which are collecting tens of special of dollars from interests, including $15 million from wall street. believe that that is the kind of judgment we need to be of president we need. >> well, the people of new york voted for me twice to be their senator from new york -- [cheering] and president obama trusted my judgment enough to ask me to be secretary of state to the united states. >> there were candidates talking amid all that applause from the
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crowd. it seem so much more ak moaacrimonious last night? stakes areway, the higher. obviously bernie sanders is thinking that tuesday's primary forew york could be the end him, definitely the end by the end of this month. the clinton campaign is talking how he'll run out of real estate by the end of this month in terms of the number of designates he would need to catch up for her. the other element for secretary they're just sick of each other. this has gone longer than her team anticipated. out-raced her, dogged her. he is not going to quit. that,t her argument is you know, mathematically he just can't get the nomination, even the momentum. and you can see also from the democratic perspective, it this, supposed to be like because it's supposed to be a contrast with the republicans. too much of a reminder of what the republicans are doing, as far as some democrats, in new york but for some. >> it's almost like there are two races.
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delegates, race for which bernie sanders is losing and hillary is winning and almost certainly will win. but there's this other race them, about how far left he could push her. every time she moved a little seemed to celebrate and get the crowd going and say, look, see, i did that, she said $15 an hour instead of $12 that she used to say before. when asked about the living wills, she said, yes, you should break up the bank. these are positions that i don't when shelary clinton, started this race, expected to be taking. it's not that she wouldn't be came true.ey but she's created a very modulated campaign so far. ask you about this minimum wage thing, because, you know, he said he wants it 15. 12, a step at go is a time. does that illustrate the difference between his idealism her prag pa tism -- pragmatism? >> absolutely. she's looking at the art of the possible, and he is sort of totally consumed by what the world should be.
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and perhaps not is. and that's always been the sort of knock on her, the clinton brand. they're for incrementalism. unapologizapologetic about that. to now try to remake herself into something different, that is a contrast of clinton brand. it can be perceived as a bit of a stretch. today's a reflection of democrat party that that's what she has to get to. she doesn't have a choice in the matter. got to accommodate a party that is very different today than it was when bill in '92.ran, you know, >> ed, is there any sign that bernie sanders is expanding his he basically the same place he's been all along? >> no. it seems to be sticking to where it's been. i think they had some hope in new york, given that two years and there was a primary governor's race there and a liberal opponent challenged the sitting governor, andrew cuomo and there was a belief that he
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could at least hit the 35% or so that she got. but if you look at poll after poll, he hasn't really moved the she's likely to get this race with at least 60% support. >> he also addressed during the debate -- he had this interesting retort about the conservative showt, which was -- stunning to was some democrats, who believed that he was just absolutely walking away from the idea of wooing african-american voters, in new york or anywhere else, by theissing this massacre in south as, you know, this problem of conservatism when that's not necessarily true among democrats. odd thing to say. >> a problem for bernie from the beginning -- this is a guy who marched, who fought for civil rights as a college kid in who came to washington, marched with dr. king. and yet every step of the way, this whole campaign, when he has had to reach out to not the vermont people he's used to rest of the, the democratic party, he stumbles like this. he just hasn't been able to make transition. >> one of the surprising moments
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came on the subject of the middle east, of israel, a state that issue is probably more important than anywhere else. bernie sanders said that hillary enough tosn't done support the palestinians. >> i read secretary clinton's apac.ent speech before i heard virtually no discussion at all about the needs of the people, almost none in that speech. >> i'm the person who held the meetings between the president of the palestinian minister and the prime of israel. three long meetings. on i was absolutely focused what was fair and right for the palestinians. foro is that a risky thing bernie sanders to do in new york? >> speaking of how politics have party, imaginer dropping ed koch and pat debaten back into that last night. they would be shocked about what's happened to the politics state.r party and their the fact is that what bernie did
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last night wasn't that risky. not going to do that well with jewish voters who are most passionate about israel. either, a, republicans or b, voting for hillary clinton. what he is doing is speaking to of progressives i guessmuch more -- even handed is the phrase -- when it comes to looking at israel. speak to how politics have changed. is it risky for him? really, given where the party is now. >> remember when she ran for the senate? for having metd with -- and i think embraced the wife of yasser arafat when she visiting the united states. >> six years ago. >> right. >> and she had to sort of from theherself palestinians. to now be told she's not doing it must have been such a circle of life moment for someone who began a career in new york and is hoping to solidify her career by going to new york. left to rome.ers what was the political thinking
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there? >> of course if there's a gomary on tuesday, you would to rome too. actually, senator sanders got an justation he said he couldn't pass up, which was to participate in a conference in issues.t dealt with looks like a think tank kind of discussion, about the issues he cares so much about, the morality of our economy and what we should do as a society, as a world, a globe. took his entire family, his grandchildren, and he went there. where secretary clinton went? she went to california. why? she's raising money and spending likewith hollywood types george collin and his wife -- clooney and his wife. contesting ahead to the in june, in california. they'll return to new york but each of them took a break. >> well, ten months into his campaign for president, donald preoccupiedcome with the republican parties's rules for choosing its delegates buthe national convention he's getting no sympathy from ted cruz or the party's national
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chairman. millions of votes more! but i also have hundreds of delegates more. that's not the same thing to me. i think the vote is the thing that you count. right? [cheering] >> the vote! >> i know the rules very well. but i know that it's stacked against me by the establishment. >> anyone who knows anything about washington knows that the establishment is not rooting for me. but the rules are simple. the way you get elected is that a majority of the delegates in election. empoweredegates are by the voters. but the delegates on the floor choose the nominee of the party, after being empowered by the voters. this is a very normal system using for many years. >> so, ed, two questions. first of all, does donald trump have a point? and secondly, why the public it?laining about >> well, i think, you know, he's making a political point in keep his base motivated in the few states that remain. and to keep his supporters motivated in the states that
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already voted, urging them to turn out to their delegate processes, if they're allowed to show up. you know, he -- i had a senior todayican party official describe it this way, and i think it's a very good way to frame it. as if he is the owner of an nfl expansion team who is complaining about, you know, how field goals are kicked. >> ha ha! of and accusing the league conspiring against his team to lose. no. you just learn the rules of the game, you'll understand they're not actually there to conspire against you. it's just the way it is. the colorado situation he's been complaining about is democratice most process -- >> very quickly, what is that? what happened? >> they use a convention, last that is the culmination of four, five months meetings, district wheregs, county meetings, thousands of republicans came the 34 peopleck
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who will represent them in cleveland at the convention. messiestrobably the and somewhat romantic version of in thisy you can find country. it's just that it's not a primary caucus where someone us whot there and tell won. >> and they had made the change last year that colorado had. a actually became quite story, that they had gone from a caucus to a convention. well-known. i think trump, pete, is also playing a psychological game here. starting to set up what is effectively going to be a the groupampaign on of unbound delegates, the folks coron's conventions convention basically political free agents. this is a start of a campaign for them, for trump to say i'm most delegateshe and votes. i might be short hoff a majority but -- of a majority but you me this.y i think he is setting that up by what he's doing right now.
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this, of the ironies of though, for those inside the republican party is that the woo, he needs to win, to to win over, they're part of the party. they're part of the -- they are the party. they're the infrastructure. so by doing what ed is saying, which is the art of the deal of base,ating with your isn't going to help you in the same way that it would if you stiff-arming the r.n.c. is not the way to go. >> i think it's becoming clear that trump may just have one this, on the first ballot. >> he only has one shot. >> there's two delegate fights going on right now. what happened in colorado, which is actually choosing delegates who they willose support at the convention. then there's a separate fight of choosing delegates to support donald trump on probably just the first ballot, and cruz has been incredibly effective and other party establishments have incredibly effective of seeding that pro-trump pool with anti-trump people. so if trump is not able to lock them up on the first ballot,
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very eager tore run away from him. >> it was just stunning this week to see his new senior advisory tell me, look, it's irrelevant -- >> who is the new -- >> trump's new senior advisory. the fact that ted cruz is packing these delegate spots supporters who would switch on a later ballot is irrelevant, we do get to a later round, he sort of surmised, we're screwed. ha!a i want to ask you about the piece you wrote about ted cruz. is ted cruz becoming more mainstream? hillary clinton is moving more to the left. to thecruz moving more center? >> he's certainly singing a different song. whether it will be successful is much an open question. he's not a very talented or tested politician in appealing middle. this is a guy whose entire brand is always going to the right on every question. and, you know, if you compare, though, what he was doing in iowa, which was talking every who aret churches pressed by gay people coming and whatg to get married, to
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he's saying now, every time he's interviewed, he talked about raising wages, getting people back to work, manufacturing he's-- he's speaking as if a democrat now. >> why? >> because he's trying to convince his party in the short-term that he can actually carry this in the general election. part, at, for the most least the elected part of his party, doesn't like him at all, is --e he >> ha ha! >> because his career has been based on basically stepping on to pushof his own party himself ahead. and so he has to convince them and he has to convince the rank file that he's not just far right ted, that he can actual challenge for hillary clinton. >> speaking of votes, tell me arithmetic.ump how does winning new york change the future path for donald trump? >> so there are 95 delegates up for grabs tuesday night in new york. you win --hanning if a chunk if you win statewide and in eacha chunk
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congressional district. state does it one of a few ways. in new york, it's essentially if than 50%, you get them all. it probably don't, goes to a 2-1 split between trump and somebody else. a few districts that are unlikely to be 50% plus for donald trump. and some of the ones right in the city. they might go to john kasich most likely. 95 if that's the case, he needs to wininue to do well and overwhelmingly or, you know, super majorities, in pennsylvania later in the month, maryland, rhode island, connecticut. him, don'tk good for they? good his brand of republican those places.l in ted cruz is a -- he's a to >> and the challenge for trump counts every delegate
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now, so you take pennsylvania, for example, there are a handful statewidees available but most of them are unbound. rhode island, it's more proportionally done. all inside baseball, pete. but what it adds up to is every structureits unique of delegates and for the ones where trump looks to be the strongest, very few of them are winner take all, meaning even in states where he wins, he's not get every single delegate. >> that's the irony of cruz's sort of anti-establishment message. he may rail against the washington establishment but what this process is beginning he has wooedthat and won over the political establishment in places like springs, topeka, kansas, augusta, georgia. file were going to stuff those delegate spots with vote for him.ld >> alexis, is it looking like donald trump will win the ballot?on on the first >> oh, i think it's not possible to even exactly say that right
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now. know that right now? so many of these important big states to go. now? is he a little over 700, you know. >> yeah. toand he's got a long way go. >> the other thing to take into account, because of these getsnd delegates, if he within 20, 30, 40, he doesn't have to hit that number exactly, point he's going to be threatening the whole party, if you don't put me in this position, i'm walking and take all my people and you will lose the general election. compelling. pretty >> paul ryan invoked the words of civil war general tecumseh sherman, who famously said, "i will not accept if nominated and will not serve if elected." that he absolutely, positively does not want to presidentandidate for at a contested convention. >> i simply believe that if you the nominee for our party, to be the president, you it.ld actually run for i chose not to do this. therefore, i should not be
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period, end of story. >> but his effort to end the story was complicated by this video, released by the speaker's office, challenging america to come together. >> let's have a battle of ideas. let's have a contest of whose ideas are better and why our are better. >> so, jonathan, ryan also had a news conference to talk about east.ip to the middle and this sort of reminds me of the groucho marx line, "who are you going to believe, me or your lying eyes?" [laughter] >> there are similarities there. hewas striking to me that once again said he is not running, not via a press release of paper but instead, in front of the cameras with four flags behind him. not want to run. what he does want to do, pete, is establish himself as a sort to trump. he wabs to be -- wants to be somebody carrying a different banner of conservatism than grievance style
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politics. one thing that struck me was the fact that he denounced the general concept of a white knight coming in to save the day, who hadn't run before. just the fact that it wouldn't be him. he said nobody should even try and do that. douses the blanket further on that possibility. >> and reflect polling data that party agrees the with him. i'll say one thing. this idea that this glossy video signals something. you know the same guy who produced that video for paul producing those same kind for john boehner back in the day. is nothing new. we all -- >> so there was a little push pushback on this, for people that said it is not for you to this decision. the same sort of thing came up. americans don't have the right say categorically that they will not perform any duty that their country might demand. the republicans saying this about paul ryan? >> look, there was only other
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ever one scenario in which paul ryan would get the everyonen, that is if else fails to get the nomination. that still exists as a possibility. >> we dream about that, i'm sure. >> we can dream. not going to happen. but if everyone fails -- i think paul ryan's calculation is, a veryhis has been difficult year for republicans, probably going to be a very difficult general election for republicans. he's got a longer view. he's a young guy. he can run in 2020, 2024. he's got lots of years ahead of him. more importantly, he right now oflly is the face republicanism that is not in this race. i think he's preparing himself piecesble to pick up the no matter what happens. >> very briefly, let me ask you for a quick answer. chairman ofo be the the convention. does that give him any power or does he just say hello and goodbye? >> most years that would be the case, if it wasn't a contested convention. this year he's going to sit with the gavel and have to sort things out. there may be motions from the
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floor. there may be disputes to settle and he'll have to do that. >> but he doesn't have any behind-the-scenes -- >> he won't be the king maker onessarily but he is the who might tell the campaigns get your acts together. >> one of the interesting conventionmally the is designed by the candidate in waiting, right? goinggoing to probably be into the convention without a candidate in waiting. priebus will be figuring out what's on the program. ryan will be sitting next to reince. chairman of the republican party is going to have an enormous amount of power. friends. they know each other very well. ryan will definitely have a say. audition then?is >> i would say. >> okay. it up forwrap tonight. but be sure to check out the week" webcast extra where michael scherer will tell us the impact that the broadway having on the is u.s. treasury decision to remake the $10 bill. that's at
1:55 am later tonight and all weekend long, be sure to keep up with the pbsvelopments on newshour and look for us around the table again next week on "washington week." i'm pete williams. good night! >> corporate funding for "washington week" is provided by... >> today people are coming out to the nation's capital to support an important cause that could change the way you live for years to come. you help? by giving a little more. to yourself. >> i'm running for my future. sometimes forget to help themselves. >> the cause is retirement. today, thousands of people came
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the race for retirement and pledged to save an additional 1% of their income. if we all do that, we can all win! >> prudential. >> additional corporate funding for "washington week" is provided by... boeing. genentech. additional funding is provided by newman's own foundation. donating all profits from newman's own food products to charity and nourishing the common good. the ford foundation. the ethics and excellence in journalism foundation. the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you!
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