tv Charlie Rose PBS February 21, 2017 12:00pm-1:01pm PST
>> well, you know, you have parents and you have people that adore you and you have people that for 15 years nothing went wrong then all of a sudden the world seems to come to an end. it was incredible. >> charlie: did you have to go through your father and say bail me out. help me through the crisis. >> my father won't have been in a position but he supported me morally. i have a sister who's a federal judge and she's very strong. she's a fantastic woman. i never knew to loyalty whether she'd be there and she was there in spades. other people were there. the other incredible thing is you can't tell who's going to be there and who's not. i would have bet my life on certain people. i would have said politically speaking that somebody you know, andrew stein would have been
there and he wasn't. >> charlie: there for what? >> for 15 years i supported him andrew stein. i never asked him for a thing. when i needed a vote at the end when everybody else was on board he was not there and i was surprised. now ultimately he was there but i shouldn't have been difficult. >> charlie: here comes one of the things they say about you is that ticks within you a vindictiveness about you and you won't forget and part of the trump style is at some point you'll try to get stein back. >> well, i don't think i'm going do that. i'm disappointed in him and not in others. there were people a man like allen greenberg who would call me every day -- >> charlie: what would he say. >> just keep fighting. he's a phenomenal guy and why
they've done tremendously well but allen has been a loyal friend and i've had a lot of other loyal friends and i guess i'll go into this book in the third book and if i do a book it's a best-seller. i think this will be the best book because i believe i know more now than i did for the other two. -- >> charlie: did you think you were invincible. >> i didn't because i'd seen too much but i had a 15 year run that was virtually unpress --
unprecedented run and there was an article that said welcome to the '90s, donald and everything was crashing and i learned a lot about myself. >> charlie: you keep say you learned. what did you learn? >> i think i learned for real i'm a pretty tough guy. it take a tough guy -- hey, it takes the brains and this and a toughness. because to go through a period of turmoil where everything seems to be going in the wrong direction and survive it and end up as they say in my new magazine covers are coming back. >> charlie: greenberg said trump went from owning 100% of nothing to 50% of something that's making money. fair? >> i think that's what he said
and he said making a lot of money. >> charlie: that the right. he did say that. >> the casinos turned out to be tremendous and some people criticized them and new york is coming back on a slow basis. i don't know how long it's going to take but the casinos in particular have been fantastic. it's just worked out for me. it hasn't worked out for a lot of other people. i think part of that is about an inner strength and that's what i'll be talking about and i'll talk about the loyalty of other people and how you treat other people so maybe they are loyal. >> charlie: did it split the family or cause division between you and your brother? >> it didn't cause division. i was a little disappointed in my brother. i thought he would have fought harder than he did. i was the oppose of my sister. i have a sister who's a phenomenal lady -- >> charlie: this is the judge? >> the judge. my other sister likewise was
tremendous. my parents have always been and i'd expect them to be. one of my attorneys said always count on my mother. i maybe took advantage of my mother and maybe never appreciated her as much but she's fantastic. >> charlie: it was said you came out of defense of mike tyson and your mother said enough, donald. >> that's the first time my mother got angry at me. my mother was so crazy when i came out in defense of mike tyson. and part of the reason -- >> charlie: she's 80? >> 80 years old. >> charlie: tough? >> more than tough she's quality. >> charlie: she said what? >> he didn't exactly like the fact i was defending iron mike but i watched what happened to him and how badly he was represented by an attorney in washington charging him $300 million from an attorney and i
watched the way he did it and i heard about a girl that late in the evening knocked on his door was taken in. i don't know. i think he with you badly represented but i did see that number one she knocks late in the night and two she's dancing at a beauty contest at 8:00 in the morning and i saw the tape and she's dancing happily in the morning and now mike tyson is in jail three and four years. i had a real problem with don king and the lawyer. >> charlie: but it was determined he raped her regardless of why she came there. >> i don't know that it happened and i think as they said, if he didn't testify he would have been exonerated. he was arrogant.
he was a horrible witness and i would say generally speaking you don't put him on aa witness. he was horrible witness and to get four or five or six years there were too many circumstances. she was in a beauty contest and dancing with a big smile on her face at 8:00 in the morning. >> charlie: but the jury listened to her too and test her credibility as they heard it and it's the same man that represented john hinckley and had an extraordinary reputation in a very good washington firm. >> i've soon mike and people really take advantage of this man. i think this is one of those examples. i know we have a system of jury and if you're found guilty you're guilty but i think hey, mike tyson in my opinion should be given another break. they put him in jail before he was even guilty.
>> charlie: do you feel he'll ever fight again and be a heavyweight champ. >> i think he'll fight again. in the prison he's in they don't allow fighting. ali was a unique man. maybe mike will come back. i think mike probably will be the champion again but you have some young heavyweight fighters like lennox lewis is who is phenomenal. >> charlie: do you think holyfield is going to lose? >> i think the next champion is going to be lennox lewis. >> charlie: he did a number -- first round. >> he knocked him out and he went 18 or 20 rounds. >> charlie: that's the claim to fame. >> lennox lewis is probably the real thing and the first real thing since mike and he's younger and this and that. >> charlie: what is your fascination -- are you an athlete?
scratch golfer? >> scratch golf. >> charlie: par 72, 73 on good courses up against good players. >> up against good players. >> charlie: for money or not so much. >> i like for money because it gives you an interest. there's a point at which you can't push you have to wait and see how the chips are falling. >> in the adversity period. >> i'd go on the golf course and sometimes i'd go with friends who are good golfers and you don't think with the problems of the world and again i like to blame myself but frankly i was doing so well and so easy i took it easy and i started relying on other people and said listen you, went to the warton school of finance and you take care of this and i stopped and then i got rid of people and did it myself and since then things have been fantastic. >> charlie: is 1992 the best year of your life?
>> it came together financially speaking and in so many other ways. >> charlie: i reel all these numbers and this is not investigative journalism and we are interested in what makes you tick and we don't have the resources but do you owe $5 billion? >> at one point i owed close to $5 billion and had assets close in excess of that and the tax load was stupidity by the politicians. >> charlie: a lot of people supported that. the tax reform act of all time and jack kemp too did he not? >> i like a lot of the people you mentioned and they didn't support. he destroyed this home-building industry in the united states and destroyed the savings and loans. >> charlie: with the reform act? >> what happened is incentive was taken out of the real estate
industry and the industry such as savings and loans and the values plummeted. so the savings loans had billion in real estate that is now half. >> charlie: you know better than i do the savings and loan crisis came about because they lent a lot of money to developers that were bad loans and shouldn't have been made. >> that's true. i have to say it's 100% true but a lot of that was exacerbated and loans that could have been good were made bad because of the change because of the 1996 tax law change. all of a sudden you had changes. >> charlie: and some people came along and made a ton. >> some made a ton. >> charlie: one person made $1 million. >> he's a good man i hope he did but it's the government's fault.
they have fought -- have to put the incentive back into real estate. >> charlie: people with great entrepreneurial gifts like you get yourself extended too far and then what happens in america as the a business cycle and when the economy go up and down if you get your stuff extended too far and have a huge debt service push comes to shove and you find yourself in a very very between a rock and a hard place and it's extending yourself too far that causes so many people to come to that. >> i'm not going to not take blame for that. i think everybody takes blame because the only people that don't get in tloubrouble are th people that don't do anything. people said how can you build a $1 billion.
it takes time. >> charlie: one arguments about riverside flat is that you faced opposition on the part of the planning commission. a lot of people who did not want to see a huge development over there you turned it around and most people give you the credit for turning it around. it was a 12-0 vote and did you make so many concessions it's no longer an economically viable project. >> today you can have the best piece of land in new york and nothing's viable. when i did the hotel the market was in shambles and everybody said you're crazy and by the time it opened it was tremendous. >> charlie: but would it have been as successful without the
zoning and abasement. >> no, but i got concessions and now we're asking for certain things and every civic association virtually in new york is supporting it. >> charlie: but because of the concessions you made with the subway and the park and so the question remains can you deliver? >> the market comes back and you deliver. if the market doesn't come back you don't deliver. maybe clinton will come up with a housing program with subsidized housing. we have an area that's rat-infested and if i get the zoning if the city turns around and the incentives are put back in real estate -- >> charlie: those are ifs. >> there's always ifs. when i did trump tower everybody said it was too big and
expensive and turned out to be the most successful condominium development in the country. >> charlie: but is it profitable? >> yes and the most successful condominium complex. people thought i was crazy to do it and it worked out to be fantastic. you can say the taj mahal and trump law -- plaza. >> charlie: who makes the decision when to go? is that made by you or the bankers? >> the city is lucky to have the bankers i have on my job because they've invested a lot of and have confidence in me and in the city and frankly they're very lucky because otherwise it could be a were a this or that and that would be bad for everybody. i have great banks on this particular site and they've gone with me and believe in me and i'll tell you what, ultimately
the decision's going to be good. >> charlie: they say when you owe as much as you did they become your partners. >> some are in deep trouble. >> charlie: are they in bankruptcy? >> they're in deep trouble. the banks -- my banks have had a great confidence in me. they know i'm good and do it the best and i'm honest. >> charlie: do they have a choice? i'm not there to get the loan back. >> i'm not saying it was easy but they had a choice and they could have gone a different route. >> charlie: what's the route they could have gone? >> a contentious route rather than working with me it could have been contentious and it would have been bad for me and them. >> charlie: they could have put you up against a wall and said
you owe us this money. >> it would have been bad for me including them and they understood that. i found out a couple things about banks. first i find the banks to be very underrated in terms of the intelligence level. the whole thing. i've worked with the banks closely for years and they've done a fantastic job at least as far as my stuff is concerned. they've done great for me and i've done great for them. i think in 12 months i may be stronger than two or three years ago. i think i will be stronger. i'd like to see an uptick in the market. >> charlie: why do you think you'll be stronger? you've given up equity? >> the story is i've given up equity. i sold the shuttle -- >> charlie: you made more than you sold more than what you paid
for. >> i reduced my debt by hundred of millions of dollars by the sale of the shuttle. if i sit down win a pencil and paper we can maybe figure it out in five years it's a long-term deal and i got rid of a lot of debt and personal guarantees. >> charlie: unsecured loans from friend friends. >> if you take the casino properties i have 80% of the taj mahal. >> charlie: is it making a fortune or generate fortune in revenue but has a fortune plus in expenses. >> it has a big fortune in expenses. it's a four-star. >> charlie: how much in the end
is net-net cash? i hear a lot of is flowing in but there's a lot of money going the other way. >> we'll have probably $80 million in interest. i think it could have a cash flow of $40 million to $50 million. the taj mahal has turned out successful and i own 100% of trump plaza. i sold very little. >> charlie: why would your friend from bear stearns say you used to own 100% of assets that were worth nothing and now he owns 50% of things that are making a lot of money. what's the difference? >> i own 50% of the castle. i am also paying less interest because i sold 50% to bond holder and in return i got a reduction in debt and interest so it's making more money. in atlantic city i owe 100% and
that's turning out to be fantastic. because of the fact -- >> charlie: if you're a winner they're a winner. >> they don't want to seem like a winner. >> charlie: let me stay with that image. was it embarrassed for you they say about you they took his toys away. his yacht away. >> i sold it. >> charlie: did the banks put you on an allowance or not. help us understand how bad it got for you and whether you said wow. >> i didn't love waking up in the morning. >> charlie: you were the big winner and then suddenly the papers started saying trump in trouble. golden boy no longer has the midas touch. >> the hardest thing about life
to understand in baseball if you get 15 runs in the first inning and you don't get any more runs you still have 15 runs at the end of the game. generally speaking you'll win that game. as sad as it is to say. >> charlie: a la the atlanta braves. >> in life i was 15-0 and then had one very bad year. maybe my fault because there were a lot of people's fault and there was the government's fault. i have to tell you, eight of smart trouble are in real big trouble and i'm not and a lot of smart people are dead, they're gone, they're buried. >> charlie: and why are they bur buried, gone, history and you are alive and well? >> you have 15 great years and
one bad year and you're only as good as your last article or what you've done. you take a guy like harry humphrey. he had 50 great years and unfortunately he married leona. poor guy. harry, get rid of her leave her alone, find a new woman if you can. and he marries leona and now has a couple bad years to put it mildly and now the score's 50- 2. he has a fall year and it should be 50-2 that's a good record. i had one bad year and one and a half real bad years. it was a struggle. it was surviving at the top. i wrote the book "surviving at the top." it wasn't pleasant. >> charlie: did you of lose confidence and say i may not get out of this? > no.
>> charlie: not once? >> the reason i didn't say it is because i had to do it myself. i built what i did myself by working long hours and working hard and smart. more importantly than anything else using my own brain. there was a point where i was making so much so fast and it was so easy i almost got bored and now i'm writing about this. >> charlie: i should believe you hear saying in a way this was good because it gave me a chance to test myself and made me hungrier and leaner and therefore i pay attention. >> i think when i look to the future it was good and i had to do it myself. i had riverside south for five years and went through a succession of executives in charge. a year and a half ago i took it over myself and i got a 12-0 vote and you were told i did it
myself. >> charlie: i read. >> guest: you can't believe everything you read but i did do it largely myself with a gruoup of people. i spearheaded something i think would turn out to be a great thing. i went back to work and why i survived and who knows. you lost during this period three key executives who died in a helicopter crash and went through executives and put your lawyer in charge. you had a divorce. fair to say people were laughing at you about the adivorce. i was living in new york and we were amused and some people said enough of this. >> i couldn't help it. you were feeding the columnists too. >> it wasn't a feed. it was a frenzy.
i called up a person at a new york tabloid and i said don't put it in and he said i have to we're selling papers like crazy. i think for 28 days in a row and this swamped everything it was big and crazy and out of control and had all the elements of a soap opera. >> charlie: did it bring satisfaction to you you got out of the marriage then you would have at another time. >> some people say i dit purpose. >> some say you used the adversity that you better make your deal now. i was happy to pay ivana because
if i would have ended up with nothing she and the children would have been taken care of and that was important. at one point i was being sued by $2 billion from her and that would have been nasty and -- >> charlie: if you hadn't bottomed out and put pressure on her. >> it wasn't a question of pressure. there was a point where she probably thought i wasn't going to make it. she just had to read the "new york times" and they were making predictions about me and the bad is when you're doing bad they go the other way and did it the other way times ten. had i not been involved in a
glitch i don't think we'd be here i'd be studying for a trial. it got so bad and the stories began getting so bad she said i better take what i'm entitled to according to our contact and got the $10 billion plus this and that and probably a package of $25 million. i think her lawyers were horrendous. she could have gotten more with better lawyers. >> charlie: more amenable in a settlement. >> ivana decided to hire these characters that were just looking for fame and fortune for themselves and they did a bad job for her. my folks did a great job for me
and i had a wonderful lawyer but in the end i'm saddened by it because i would have preferred the initial deal. she was poorly represented in this divorce. >> charlie: you must have some sensitivity for a woman and you seem all powerful and she doesn't know and has to lean on to the advice she gets. >> she was leaning "the wall street journal" i'm not even saying the stories were wrong. i've done things but i'm not saying they were wrong at the time. the economy was atrocious and the business was bad and the real estate business was horrendous and the casino business was bad and we're opening up the taj mahal in the middle of the world and everyone's at home. >> charlie: and reading about you and another woman. >> guest: i never left for
another woman. i left because i got tired of the ballroom gowns and the nonsense. >> charlie: what's that mean? >> guest: i don't necessarily believe -- the so-called charity events but the people that have them are probably the least charitable people i've ever met and have them for their own villiv villiv villive -- i look at the table settings at the plaza hotel and the other places and in the end i don't think they make a hell of a lot for charity and i look at united way where the man gets paid millions to run it and i look at charities. i've started charities and there's few well-run charities. >> you got tired of the balls?
>> i got tired of the scene and some i like and some i don't. they're a vicious breed. >> charlie: some would say this is a guy on top of the world and he wanted to have his cake and eat it too and date young attractive woman who viewed him as a giant catch and an interesting man to be with. >> guest: i think it's great. i've never had a better time -- >> charlie: what's great about it. >> i can do what i want. i can be with who i want to be with. i really like it and i would tell you if i didn't and by the way i think at a certain point i won't like it and get tired of it. >> charlie: and settle down? >> i think i'll settle down strongly but at this point i do like it. i had a fabulous life in many respects. >> charlie: great kids. >> fantastic children. great children and i love them and that was so worthwhile.
i have another friend who was also fantastic for a fairly long period of time and i just didn't want to settle down. i didn't want to get married. i didn't want to marry marla and i didn't want to settle down. i'm just not ready for it. it's not me. it's not right now. >> charlie: is that what killed that relationship? >> a lot of things perhaps killed it but probably that's the predominant thing. i was very antsy and didn't want to settle and don't forget i'm busy. i'm doing different things and i'm so happy now. i enjoy getting up and going out to the wars and the wars are now becoming battles and it's just worked out well. you can't devote lots of time to a relationship when you go through this. >> charlie: there's also a piece that you love the limelight and - public's adulation something. the mirror of something is
somehow important, confirming -- true? >> i don't think so. i think i got used to it and do well in it. it's great for my business. the fact is my casinos are up more than any casinos in the united states. we're number one, two and three in increases in atlantic city every month. >> charlie: at the same time the most profitable. it's one thing to be up in revenue. you're not saying necessarily they're the most profitable. >> the taj mahal has the largest gross profit by any casino by far. >> charlie: and the most gross. >> the biggest gross and largest gross in profit in atlantic city. now, i'll say this, when people thought i was going down they sort of deserted me. >> charlie: who deserted you? >> i'm talking about customers
not local friends or this, that the. when the taj mahal customers even the condominium customers thought i was going down for the count they really deserted me. i have to say. now that they see me doing well again and that i'm back and have crazy magazine covers one of the reasons my casinos are up so much more is -- >> charlie: are you saying it makes sense to promote this. look at this picture. you like this being don't you? you promote that because it says donald is back and it's good for business so you want people to believe you're back. >> it's late in the evening and you're a fantastic guy and we did this in new orleans but -- here we are doing an interview.
i think we'll have a good time and hope you get good ratings too. >> charlie: exactly. >> it happens to be great for business. it was nice if it's the other way if you have problems -- >> charlie: but apart from all that, ego. >> i have an ego. i've never met a successful person. >> charlie: neither have i. nevertheless, you love the limelight and beyond the business and what it does and the trump image. like it. you like the fact there's security guys ahead of you and behind you and adulation and women want to be with you and wherever you go there's flash bulbs and this kind of thing. you like it. >> i don't mind it. >> charlie: you don't mind it? >> i use to like it more. i probably would miss it if it
weren't here. i probably would. >> charlie: it's part of your -- >> it's been wild but i also think it's great for business. it's great for the casino business and condominium business. they just came out with a report that trump apartments sell more on a square foot basis than any apartment in new york by far. it's not even close. a lot of that is all the nonsense. >> charlie: let me talk about people you ought to say sorry to. one -- i'll raise this person first. the guy in philadelphia. you know who they say you got fired. remember the guy who did the analysis? >> he did great. he did well and now i'm his champion. >> charlie: you have to look back -- [overlapping speaking] >> charlie: one man may have lost a job because you leaned on him. >> he's a tough go and savvy guy
and now my biggest champion. in fact he used the world brilliant. >> charlie: what's his name? >> marvin. he was a great critic of me and now saying i'm brilliant. >> charlie: you did him a favor by getting him fired? >> in the long run i think he's doing better. >> charlie: so you did him a favor? dont you regret that? >> that the life. you can't look back. if you look back there are things you would have done differently. >> charlie: what would have you done differently. >> guest: i probably would have sold some other things. i think i would have treated people differently. i think some of the people that were most loyal to me -- i think i would have treated them differently and different groups
differently. i would have wiped the floor with the guys that were not loyal which is great because i love getting even with people. >> charlie: you love getting even with people. >> absolutely. >> charlie: you are going to get even with some people? >> given the opportunity. if given the opportunity i'll get even with people that were disloyal. >> charlie: how do you define disloyal? they turned their back on you. give me one example. >> i had one man who frankly was on the board of a company that i was selling and it was a tremendous sale for me. it was a great sale. would have been a very helpful sale and end up going through but -- >> charlie: the shuttle. >> no, it doesn't matter which company and it was a great thing
for me and i only put him on the board because i thought i was doing him a favor and got some money and contributed nothing. i had five board members. when it came to time everybody said i'm leaving. everyone left except this one particular person said i don't want to leave. when i heard about it i went nuts and blasted him and all of a sudden he left. i consider that a great act of disloyalty. i put him on the board. now, he did leave like andrew. andrew end up in favor of riverside but i never asked him for anything. it's a great job. he had to do a -- >> charlie: how can you get even with andy stein. >> it's not a question of getting even. you can be disappointed in people. >> charlie: you said an eye for an eye. how would you hit him back?
>> time will tell. >> charlie: but looking for the opportunity? >> i'm disappointed with him and i'm disappointed with another man who wouldn't get off the board. he got off after being hit over the head with the cannon. >> charlie: what was the cannon. >> that was me. >> charlie: what was the threat? going to the papers. >> the threat was a strong threat. he would have gone through a lot of hell if he didn't and then gets off and acts like he's doing me a favor. like a great joke of the century but he got off and the deal went through but it doesn't mean i have to love this particular guy. i want somebody loyal from the beginning not loyal because they're afraid or because this or that. i think again i think the new book and i don't know why i'm promoting a book that's not
coming out for three to four month but the most interesting aspect -- we'll do that for the national. forget the local stuff. i think the most interesting aspect is the loyalty area and chapter. >> charlie: you measure loyalty in termed of your own relationship with roy kuhn. ? i'm so loyal to people when someone's slightly disloyal i look at it as a great act of horror. david denkins has had one hell of a comeback in the last six months and you saw what happened. people like the man. i've been with him and watched him and he's become a popular guy. i think he's going to be hard to
beat in a lot of ways. a year and a half no one wanted to run against george bush and it took a man who wanted to run because he was unbeatable. there was no way to beat this guy. >> charlie: he looked like he could win re-election. you support him over juliani. >> i'm not anowsing i'm not announce who will i'm supporting. >> charlie: did he help you planning commission? >> he was tough and strong and community-orient and for the people. and he said he would support the job. >> charlie: there was a guy on the political scene ross perot. were i a billionaire?
did you actually have -- what were you up to? >> maybe what i have now. nobody knows what i'm worth. what's the taj mahal worth or the center. i have no idea. >> charlie: you said the plaza was a trophy. a different place. it's a trophy. it's unique and they'll pay a premium for the best. did you pay too much for the trophy? >> when i bought the plaza i was offered a huge profit and i didn't take it. it was a son sort yum of people. -- con consortium and i love my purchase of the plaza and diversity's a funny thing. it's a question of how many bad shots do you hit.
not so many good shots but bad shots. >> charlie: minimize the bad sho shot. >> it's a question of how do you stay out of trouble. it's already turning out to be a good deal. >> charlie: in golf you were playing you have to go over the water and sometime don't make it and you get to bogie land. are you back to par? >> i think in six months i'll be stronger than three and four years ago. i restructured things in the early '90s and now it's turning out to be good. who knows, we'll see what happens. let's see what happens with the economy. >> ross perot is willing to
spend and got 18% to 19% of the vote. there was a time you were teasing america you were going run for president. >> people said that. i never did. >> charlie: you didn't think it was an interesting idea. >> i wanted to go to new hampshire. >> charlie: you knew what you're appearance would do. >> i have no idea how much talk would be generate and had no intention for running for president. i will say this, ross perot he made monumental mistakes. had he not dropped out of the election and made the gaffs or had three or four bad days and they were bad days he could conceivably have won the look. >> charlie: some others have
said the same thing. at the same time whatever made him to do as well in part he was effective in the debate and at the same time maybe you have to take with the good of the bad and part of the personality makeup of making him $2 billion create med paranoia. >> the problem with politics and politicians you can't have done very much wrong and that means you can't have done anything. and i do a lot of things and most turn out good but some were bad and if at the hit you with bad it makes it more difficult. >> charlie: and i think f.d.r. said i'm proud of all my enemies. i've earned them. what enemies are you proud of? >> he did a lousy job as mayor. he's a promoter.
he's very much of a promoter. he did not do a good job as a mayor because i was able to build it in four months and built it for a tenth what they did and i got tired of people sitting down and not working and not doing it right and having no planning or leadership. instead of saying donald, you did a great job he went around saying i think we could have done it if we'd done this and that. >> charlie: what other enemy are you proud of? >> i'm not proud of enemies. i'd like to have good friends but i'm not proud of enemies. >> charlie: is your father the seminol seminole influence in your life? >> i'd say my mother and father.
>> charlie: together? >> yes. >> >> charlie: what way did they influence you differently? >> they're different people. my dad is a business-oriented guy but a good man and if somebody said i need $100, $200 my father has the softest touch for people in trouble. he's a great humanitarian in that sense but he's a strong man. you would think of him as cold but he's not cold and my mother is openly warm. >> charlie: except for when it comes to mike tyson. >> it took 40 years. >> charlie: she made you like yourself growing up. >> she did. she's some woman. >> charlie: greenberg in the new york magazine article said if donald gives you his word it's good as gold however -- >> he said sometimes i have a bad memory. >> charlie: it leaves you wide
open to the fact. it raises the question can you trust what donald says. >> he's a great friend and i think he meant that jokingly. i don't know. >> charlie: what brings you the greatest satisfaction now? >> i used to think continued success but i got bored by it and enough is enough. i think right now i'm proud with the way i've handled things. i think i've handled things well from a business standpoint. >> charlie: somebody who steps forward second said this is donald's hype. he's a giant promoter. >> you just have to look at the numbers in the casino journals and it's been a tremendous comeback.
i'm not saying i'm as far back as i will be in six months. i'm back and not in any trouble and doing well and making money. the money is not as important as people would be to a guy like me but it is a scorecard. >> charlie: so what is the most important thing for a guy like you? >> the way i've survived and the image during the survival period. people haven't seen me going to a corner and putting my thumb in my mouth and say i give up. this kid doesn't give up and some people give up. you won't be doing interviews with them but some people did give up and many tough, smart killers gave up. they just gave up and said i can't do it anymore. i think the way in which i survived was important to me. >> charlie: out of the comeback. you're writing this alone? >> i'm doing this one alone because i want my flavor. i've had two wonderful writers.
. >> announcer: a kqed television production. >> it's like sort of old fisherman's wharf. it reminds me of old san francisco. >> and you'd be a little bit like jean valjean, with the teeth, whatever. >> worth the calories, the cholesterol, and the heart attack you might have. >> it's like an adventure, you know? you got to put on your miner's helmet. >> it reminds me of oatmeal with a touch of wet dog.