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tv   KTVU Fox 2 News at 4pm  FOX  September 14, 2015 4:00pm-5:01pm PDT

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and blocks destroyed. >> today the wind kicked back up. 1200 firefighters try to knock down this deadly wildfire. the four on 2 live from middleton starts now. >> good afternoon everyone. live from middleton. welcome to the four on 2. i am mike mibach. >> i am keba arnold. we are standing where an apartment complex used to be. we came in through highway 29. blocks and blocks of scorched land. homes destroyed. one thing that stood out to me is the story of survival. you have the devastation but the next block a home will be standing. had this used to -- >> this used to by an apartment building. water still coming out of the pipe. you can see the wall coming down. >> the air condition unit.
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had the violence -- >> the violence attitude the fire had to bring down the buildings. how violent the wildfire was. home, cars, burned. beyond it, you still see a couple homes right there. the winds and the flying embers. >> so unpredictable. and the weather out here, cooler, we have sprinkles flying around. the wind, i talked to cal fire, yes, it is good news as far as fighting the fire in these conditions but with the colder temperatures came the winds. ashes are flying around. >> before we get to the numbers. one of the first things i wanted to do, head up towards the village of cobb. that is where the fire started. as soon as i got onioning 75 --
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got on 175, i am not speechless, but we did not say word for about 7 minutes. the devastation was unbelievable into cobb. and driving back down, i pictured that is the way the fire came. ane canyon and -- in a canyon and started flying down. that destruction all over the place. this was a thriving community. people livered here. worked here. and now for the most part it is a ghost town. pg&e, they are everywhere. spread out here, working -- [ talking at the same time ] >> trying -- fix the power poles. they don't even know when they will allow residents back in at this point. >> the latest numbers regarding the valley fire. one thing that is sny
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containment number. 5% con-- that is containment number. 5 containment. one death. and four firefighters were injured during the fire over the weekend. >> i know it is hard to get an exact count but 400 homes destroyed. 400 families without a place to live. you had to count the vehicles, we have seen countless vehicles destroyed. one of the homes burned belonged to the cal fire chief. 7 other firefighters lost their homes. they went and fought the fire and now we have 8 firefighters who lost their homes. >> it is -- it is heart breaking. the fire started on saturday. over to john sasaki who has more on just when the fire started and bring us up to date on the fire fight as of now. >> i can tell you just like you, you are a mile from where
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we are. we are in middle town as well. this is 4 houses in a row. just like where you are, all burned to the ground. cars, buildings, everything just burned down. it is utter sense orphdestruction out here. if there is one bit of good news, the wert has been -- weather has been cold and rainy today giverring the firefighters -- giving firefighters help. we saw no major flames. hard to think in term of good news when there is devastation everywhere you look. we saw thousands of people, 61,000 acres burned, and 1,000 buildings lost. those numbers are still coming in. the area was a peaceful area before the flames raced through. this is a hotal loss.
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-- total loss. 100 homes burned to the ground. cal fire officials are moved by what they have seen. >> personally it touches on the people that live here. people that lost everything. lived for years up here. you know, lost their homes. their valuables. people that lived here 30, 40 years. these things can be replaced but they evacuated, their lives rin tact but the property is gone -- are in tact, but the property is gone. >> reporter: here is something that hopefully will be rebuilt. one house on the right is fine. next to it, burned down. on the other side, fire damage but sur5ed okay. it is remarkable that we ever scene after scene like this. destruction on one side of the
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street and the other side of the street homes have winsocked. -- have been saved. 8 hours it burned 40,000 acres. that is a fast moving fire. windy, hot, dry. and firefighters tell me it was burning in those sippuations gothousand degrees, enough to dash situations 2,000 degrees, enough to -- situations, 2,000 degrees, enough to melt metal. nightmare scenarios here. back to you. >> i can smell that. reported in northern california for two decades now, have you ever come across this in your professional career? >> reporter: the one fire this reminds me of is the fire in lake tahoe, burninged 200 -- burninged 250 -- burninged 2hung 50 -- burned 2hung 50,000
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homes. the other -- 250,000 homes. the other thing, i went to japan effected by the tsunami in 2011. every time you see it it movers you. -- it moves you. i have a friend who i talked to a lilt while ago -- little while ago, lives up here, her home survived. all the homes around it were burned to the ground. it really is one of those things, if you live in the bay area you probably know someone who lives up here, something, and know someone who has been affected by this. >> it is amazing. even coming in on 29, you would see patches of land coaches but the house in the -- scorched, but the house in the middle gone. amazing to see.
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>> reporter: one thing i was doing was covering the two other fires, what was one of the command centers, middleton high school, yeah, and so, you know, just across the street, you may have seen that the flower shop across the street was damaged. but the high school seems like it survived okay. maybe it will serve, helping out people again. the kids who were in school there will have issues because their high school may be standing but they probably live in these homes too. it will knee a long time -- be a long time for the community to recover. >> john sasaki live this afternoon, thank you for that report. >> the map of the area. >> pull opmap right now -- up a map right now. the burn area.
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cobb, whispering pines, cobb, middle town. lake county. hidden valley lake. 61,000 acres burned. i like to hear updated numbers. i wonder if they will come out this evening to see if they made progress today because of the weather. you have the cooler temperatures -- [ talking at the same time ] >> one thing i noticed on 121, kept wanting to see the smoke, but the marine layer was in, which is a great thing, the weather is helping but when you got here, it was breezy. speaking of the wind, ktvu's meteorologist rosemary orozco with the latest conditions. >> looking at your live shot, looks like it is calm where you are at. that is good news. the winds will be a factor into the evening hours. between the hills we have wind. 10-15. even 20 miles per hour. as we get into the forecast here. through the next hour or so, i
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expect the winds will continue. coming in from a southwest direction, the smoke will be pushed in this direction, away from napa county and the clear lake area. that is good news. temperatures on the cool side. damp out there. a little drizzle throughout the afternoon. that will continue into the evening hours. we are looking at 6:00 p.m. and the winds are 5-15 miles per hour. and into the latter half of the evening the winds will continue to die down and the temperatures will die down as well. that is good news there. good to look at again. calm conditions. paying attention to the background. that is good news. and the damp weather continues and the winds continue to die down into the evening hours. back to you in the field. >> thank you. a few drops right now.
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feeling them. >> one person up here yesterday was ktvu's noelle walker. you were live here, you are east of highway 29, talking to the residents. this is an emotional time. i met one man who had to call a woman who is on vacation in spain and send her pictures saying her house is gone. >> reporter: i know. it kill use to look around and -- kills you to look around and see some of these things. maybe seeing this for the first time, the homeowners may be saying their home is gone for the first time. today when we stopped on jefferson street, i saw a man wiping away tears. i went up to him and i said do you need a hug. he opened his cars and gave me -- arms and gave me a hug. he didn't even lose a home.
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let's show you what we are looking at. this is jefferson street. i wish i could tell you what street this is but the sign is burned out. lincoln is one block that way. there was a home owner who owned this home and the one next to it and the one across the block. three homes. one he livers in and one he rents out and one he was building and they are all gone. he worked 30 years to built this. he has three sons. he wanted to leave a home for each son and now he has to startover. when you fall down you just have to get back up again. and that is what he will do. but it will take time. take a look over here. this is something we see in many places. the fire place is standing and everything else is wiped out. there are still burning embers. firefighters putting out the
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spot fire. we have wind here today. that is not great for the fire fight, even though there are sprinkles falling. what we have seen firefighters doing today is going from house to house. they were just here a half hour ago. poking through the rubble with pitch forks and rakes, lifting things up. they have dark task of sifting through to make sure there are no unaccounted victims beneath the rubble. the crews i asked said no they haven't found anything or anybody. that is good news. let's hear from the man we talked to earlier today. when i asked him why he was emotional, this is what he said. >> reporter: how many people in your family lost homes? >> my brother in law, my niece,
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my brother, so many friends. so many close friends. >> reporter: all those people he said have lost homes. his home was still standing. he stayed with people and fended off the flames. he said they should have left. he said if any of those people had been lost in the fire he didn't know what he would have done. he says he wished he left. he should have left but now so meningy people are -- many people are wondering what do you do next, you can't give them a blanket, there is nowhere to put it. >> yes, we talk about rebuilding. what does that mean? where do you start? what do you do? noelle walker, thank you, live. >> a a lot of pg&e crews, i
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talked to one crew and they said they are trying to restore power by tonight but they are going pole by pole assessing the situation. still to come, a story about pg&e that doesn't have to do with restoring power. about helping horses that were stranded in the area because of the fire. our live coverage returns national restaurant association bit. dash returns in a bit. ♪ ♪
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welcome back to the four on 2. covering the valley fire. you can't turn a corner without seeing pg&e crews out here, hard at work trying to repair the power lines and as they are doing their jobs they found themselve said in another situation -- themselves in another situation. >> this is in regards to horses. i have seen a lot of trailers, especially empty trailers, they know horses are standed, they want to get them out. -- stranded, they want to get them out. pg&e workers found horses in middletown. taking a break. they checked in on the animals. said they need water. got them water and then they were trying to do the right thing. >> we are out here working trying to do our jobs and do the right thing and we have down time, we realized they
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were out here by themselves and we want to make sure they have food and water. here we are. >> here we are. talk about going the extra mile. appreciate that from pg&e. had they are going to extra mile. the pg&e workers helping the horses and so many at home are donating items, water and clothing. let's bring in red cross now, we have virginia with the red cross. we want to talk about the needs now as we are fighting the valley fire. thank you for being with us. >> thank you for having me. >> right now virginia you are okay on supplies? you need more supplies or is it monetary donations? >> it is the monetary donations we are -- donations we are looking for. we have a lot of donations, materials and supplies. and it is much more efficient if people donate financially
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because we have a specific need we can run out and get it. so -- [ talking at the same time ] >> can you give an example what the specific needs are. >> some of the things the red cross takes care of, food and shelter and we replace medications and eye glasses, those are things that are specific to someone that can't be donated other than as a financial donation. [ talking at the same time ] >> i am sorry? >> virginia, that was my next question. when we have these tragedies so many people try to take advantage, what is the best way, the safest way to donate to the red cross but also to
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make sure the money goes for this valley fire here? >> if you go to,thereisplaceto esignation-- there is a place to designate and there is a -- [ talking at the same time ] >> i know we areoon delay so we have -- are on a delay so we have that cross talk. in regards to the evacuation centers, kelseyville, as well as the napa count fairgrounds -- county fairgrounds. had yes, i am in kelseyville right now. >> do you've count on how many residents, hoy many -- how many people the red cross is now serving? >> the situation in napa county
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is fluid because people are coming and going. and it is a large area of the fairgrounds, we think that ballpark is between 800 and 1200. we know we served 800 meals last night. kelseyville 300. . >> virginia, we thank you for what the red cross is doing. >> thank you so much. >> thank you. they need the monetary donations. something i didn't think about. i spoke to a woman who ran out of her house and her house is destroyed -- [ talking at the same time ] >> eye glasses. >> prescriptions, medications. donate if you can. a number for the red cross, give them a call. let them know how much you can donate. $5, $10, fantastic.
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a thousand dollars, better, do what you can. 1(800)red cross and if you text them automatic $10. if you go to their website you can specifically designate where you want your money to go. >> i like that. [ talking at the same time ] >> you want to know. [ talking at the same time ] all right. we mentioned we had drizzle earlier. >> coming and going. [ talking at the same time ] >> let's bring in meteorologist rosemary orozco with the weather here and in the bay area. >> a little soggy this afternoon. cool conditions. and we are going to continue with this pattern for the next couple days. the cloud cover. a live look there where the clouds have been stuck with us the entire day. a nice change. feels like fall. temperatures dropped off quite a bit.
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if we look at live storm tracker 2 we have green on the screen. we have scattered showers that continue to fall over the north bay. and as we ever been hearing where the fire is, sprinkles from time to time. that is excellent news. helps to put a damp thorn flames. into -- damper on the flames. drizzle here. not being picked up on the screen. we have a lilt along the east bay -- little along the east bay shorelines. winds shifts long highway 101. rain around morgan hill and gilroy. we ever a front that is moving through the area. in addition to this disturbance that moved through the area, they came together to bring us cloudy, cool weather and the sprinkles that will continue into the evening hours. that will continue to push through and for tomorrow we will remain partly cloudy.
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we will have a less possibility of seeing scattered showers. temperatures remind mild. fairfield 22 miles per hour. 15 concord. oakland 29. the north bay, napa 20 miles per hour. and we don't like to see the wind in the area but breezy at times through the evening hours in the middletown area where the fire continues to burn. 61 degrees right now san francisco. 70 oakland. low 70s walnut creek. 76 livermore. 76 as the afternoon high. moisture continues to push out of the way. tomorrow morning we may wake up with partly cloudy skies. cloud cover there along the coast line. temperature wise, mild. 74 for livermore tomorrow. 69 oakland. 54 san francisco. upper 60s along the peninsula and north bay 73 for santa rosa. 72 napa. extended forecast, temperatures continue to be on the mild
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side. wednesday we may get scattered showers. we will put a chance in there. wednesday night and thursday morning. on the back half of the week, temperatures warm back into the 80s, perhaps low 90s inland. back to you. >> thank you. sadly this is not the only fire that is burning right now. had especially in northern california -- >> especially in northern california. the fire in amador and calaveras county. the latest number on the butte fire when we return.
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welcome back to middletown on the four on 2. middle of september, this is wildfire season in northern california. mid-september. rolls into october. hopefully we get precipitation and it ends there. this past weekend, the valley fire kicked up and we had devastation here -- devastation here. and the butte fire in amador and calaveras counties. an update on that fire burning out there. firefighters are saying it is 30% contained. 71,000 acres have burned. mandatory evacuations still in effect for residents in the area. had between the two -- >> between the 2, 23,000 people displaced. bean the butte fire and the
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vale fire combined. 200 miles away from here. >> 200 structures burned. 135 of those have been homes. >> people brought in extra cell service -- [ talking at the same time ] >> you can imagine this is playing out on social media. back to the studio with heather holmes. how is this happening, what are you seeing? >> throughout this, since the fire started on saturday we have seen very gripping photos and videos. they take you to the moment when the fire started. and the frantic attempts by people to evacuate and seeing what the evacuation was like. and then now the after math. i want to begin with this photograph. a woman hugging a firefighter. the woman says this is a picture of her mom and dad and uncle. they lost their house and their
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business. hugging a firefighter, thanking the thousand firefighters who are working 36 hours plus trying to get the fire under control. so next we have this one. you can see. nothing but a long line of break lights here. this is in the moments that folks were hold to get out and get out immediately. look, as far as the eye can see. a line, vehicle after vehicle after vehicle. he says he learned a new word today, evacuation. this was heading up to clear lake saturday night. once the fire broke out. we talked about this area, a lot of ranches in the area, a lot of live stock. this shows you the dedication to the animals. more than pets. more like family members to some people in the area. there is no trailer. just a truck with two horses in the back. the person said this makes my eyes well up with tears,
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represents what middletown stands for. good horse people who come together for their neighbors and will do whatever it takes in times of need. implying they didn't even belong to the men in the truck but they found the horses, put them in the truck and get out of town. a video now. take a look. i was talking about the moment people were told to get out. what it was like being surrounded by the flames. so much smoke and ash and flames. this says this is happening right now. fire all around us for miles. inside look at what the fire is doing to otherwise the in the small communities -- doing to those in the small communities. we have seen seeing these throughout the last couple days. each is more telling about the situation, the desperate situation. as you saw, the grateful
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situation that has arisen here. >> yeah. unless you are in those shoes it is hard to imagine picking up your life, what you can, and get out of your house. thank you for sharing. >> a live picture now. in lake county. live picture in napa county, calistoga. a lot of the evacuees made their way there. when we come back we will get an update in calistoga and maybe if they will be there tomorrow and the days to come when the four on 2 returns.
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here in middletown covering the valley fire. we are in the location, what used to by an apartment complex. you see air condition units, you see what is left behind. >> this is off of 29. along 175. i will walk you over. we showed this at the top of the newscast. this gives you an idea how vishhouse wildfire was -- vicious the wildfire was. you can see the trucks and the cars, all gone. . [ talking at the same time ]
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>> this is an example of how the wind played role on saturday afternoon. stormed down the canyon into middletown and the fire was flicking embers left and right. >> the people that used to live in that home, in this apartment complex, they had to evacuate. a lot of people are still evacuated. and carm -- ktvu's tom vacar joins us live from calistoga. hey tom. >> reporter: yes, we had confuse here. situation here is -- we had confusion here. situation here has been over cast. the people are waiting to know when they can go back. many know the fate of their houses but they want to know.
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every day for the last two days officials have been holding these press conferences that are more information meetings for the silt one of the -- citizens of the area that come come down from lake county to calistoga. we heard some of the remarks today and here is what happened a little while ago. >> it is still spreading in different directions. there is not just one area that is very active. we have multiple areas. the fire is picking up. it is nothing like it was before and we have a lot of resources in the area. and resources are continuing to come in hourly to help. >> i know everybody wants to know when do we get to go home. not an easy question. when it is safe. horrible inconvenience. it would be more inconvenient to put you back in and have to
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evacuate you again. we have to make sure the fire is defeated. >> how important have the daily updates have been? >> it will be really important when we can see how our houses are. i know mine is go. as far as school goes, they need to know about that kind of stuff. had they are very important. we -- >> they are very important. we rely on them. we don't know what is going on. >> reporter: do you feel you are getting enough detail or do you think it is too early to know? >> i don't think we will ever know the extent of the damage till we get in. >> reporter: 24 hours goy the mood was so much -- ago the
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mood was so much jovial and they were having fun despite what happened. but now it is more somber as people begin to understand what happened to them and as they understand what happened to them, one man said a guy who was jovial yesterday was snapping at him today and we are likely to see more of that because they have no idea when they can go home. they have no idea what they are going home to because even once they get back, if they don't have a home they will have to have shelter and that remains unsettled. the situation is wait and see. unfortunately in this area there isn't a lot to do. their property is here and that is where they want to be. tom vacar, ktvu fox 2 news. >> all right. thank you. we headed to middletown around 11:00 a.m. this morning. you went closer to where the
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fire started. >> yeah. as soon as we pulled in, i said lets get on 175, head towards cobb, where the fire started. as we started driving up, the first thing i just -- silence. you could see the devastation. the moon scape. as you make your way up the road, everything is destroyed. this isn't like what we see here, everything is gone. no one was out there with the exception of pg&e and sheriff's deputies. at this one house that wasn't burned i ran into a family who was there. we parked, pulled over. struck up a conversation. started talking. asked to come on to their property. 15 acres or so. sisters live there. one sisters liversane house -- lives in a house that wasn't burned. my conversation with the lady.
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>> reporter: take me back to saturday. describe the scene. >> i was at home and my sister said there is a fire. check it out. weird. i didn't hear planes. we decided we should get things ready to go just in case. >> reporter: what was the point that you knew it was time to go. >> we were looking at the ridge. it was on fire. you can see the flames jumping like crazy all across. we knew it was -- it was time -- we needed to get out of here. that is what we did. >> reporter: how fast was the fire moving at the time? >> i would say -- you know, if it was going a mile a minute. that is probably 60 miles per hour -- who knows. my home is gone. yeah.
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front door was on this side. >> reporter: here? >> yeah. where these blocks are. this was the steps. door goes in that way. living room. kitchen. dining room. bath room. two bedrooms. >> reporter: you were in there two days ago, living there. >> yeah. yes. p now that you see -- >> reporter: now that you see it? it stings. i had to keep telling meself, it is things. -- telling myself, it is things. >> reporter: very strong. >> i have a firm belief in god. that is what keeps my going. >> reporter: one or two things that you wish you did have that you don't? >> this -- my sewing machine. i had a box of paragraphs of my
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children, grandparents, wedding pictures. crazy when you look at it. going around. look, look, there is that. interesting. >> reporter: you will rebuild? >> yeah. maybe not right here. somewhere. for sure. we will see what happens. >> reporter: i hate seeing it but i love seeing you and your family alive. >> picking things up. that is what we will be doing now. >> love hearing that she will rebuild. it takes time. i asked if she had insurance she said no. she will be hoping for contributions. strong family. coming up, we talk live to cal fire and get anuch date on the -- an update on the valley
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fire. four on 2 will be right back.
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it is one of california's oldest hot springs. harben hot brings ing middletown. 5,000 -- hot springs. middletown. 5,000 acres. it is gone. some say this dates back to
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1870, harben hot springs in 1972. a well known hot springs location. destroyed by the valley fire. next to me is cal fire chief to give us the latest on the attack. one thing i noticed, with the clouds, how did that play a role in the air attack? >> slows things down. anytime they can't see their targets it makes it difficult to fly appropriately. it did clear up. the winds pushed the smoke and the clouds out of the way. and we did have several air tankers and helicopters flying for good a good part of the -- for a good part of the afternoon. >> did the weather help or hurt this afternoon? >> a catch-22. the cooler temperatures make it easier for the firefighters to work on the line but along with the cooler temperatures comes the higher winds. so that is going to push the containment lines and the fire further to the east and south
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which is where the wind was blowing. that is a problem. >> i didn't see active fire. folks want to know when they can come home. if they have a home. what can you tell us? despite the fact we don't see a lot of active fire, there is a lot of work to do. the infrastructure has to be replaced. there were so many power lines destroyed. working on replacing power poles and wires. we have to make sure that is safe for people to return to before we let them back in. >> all right. thank you varmuch. -- very much. >> thank you. coming up after the break, we were surprised when we pulled in to town, we saw a chevron, a save mart open merchandise we talked to the -- open. we talked to the owner. we will explain coming up after this.
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all right. welcome back to the four on 2. the valley fire. i told a story about my experience when i rolled in, you also have ang experience as you -- an experience as you drove into town. >> we wanted to talk to the people. we saw chevron which was open. >> gas station and a -- [ talking at the same time ] >> and a mart ends. we went inside and the owner was the owner for 12 years. livered in petaluma. got word middletown was on fire -- [ talking at the same time ] >> he was in petaluma. came here to see his store. >> reporter: most of the town
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is shut down. >> we have a special generator from the pg&e. >> reporter: what has it been like for you? >> they all in the shelters. all employees in the shelters. couple of employees that are not allowed to come in because police don't allow them to come in. we are stuck. we don't know whether we will be open today. >> reporter: i noticed customers and people getting gas. >> we had -- the problem is that the -- our pos system is not connecting so we are not able to sell gas. my manager is trying to get it going. >> reporter: you liver in middletown -- >> i live in petaluma.
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very, very sad. i had to have my neighbor, my neighbor is in spain, vacations in spain, her home is in rubbles. she is really bad. >> reporter: how was that like for you to deliver that news? >> very hard. really difficult. yeah. very difficult. >> reporter: did you see this coming? once the fire started how quick it moved -- [ talking at the same time ] >> i was out in sacramento. i had to get -- i had to get messages from my employees who wereane panic. we -- we were in a panic. . >> reporter: you are allowing people to -- [ talking at the same time ] >> they can use restrooms. i don't know whether they can buy gas because the system is down. we are trying to get it up. >> reporter: what do you sty the firefighters trying to get this under control? >> thank you very much.
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they have really been helpful. and the police and the emts. everybody. beautiful job. without them this place would have been really hurting. >> you think, other residents feel that same way, thankful for the firefighters, pg&e. can you imagine having to call your friend on vacation and tell them your house is gone. here is a picture. >> nightmare. [ talking at the same time ] observe we leave on the four -- before we leave on the four on 2. four firefighters injured. you see him here in the hospital. you can see the injuries to his face. he is on the phone with the governor. >> with the governor.
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[ talking at the same time ] >> four firefighter ons a helicopter -- firefighters on a helicopter saturday when they were injured -- [ talking at the same time ] >> arms as well as their face. [ talking at the same time ] >> i am sure the governor was thanking him -- >> not only to him, pass along to all the firefighters thanks for doing what you do. 1200 fire personnel fighting this on the ground and in the air and thank you to pg&e. every corner they are out here working. >> let's head off to break. next is frank and heather and the ktvu fox 2 news at 5:00 p.m.
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ktvu fox 2 news at 5:00 p.m. starts now. >> extreme devastation and now authorities confirm this fire turned deadly. >> scary stuff. takes a lot of courage. the fires will take lives. >> thousands evacuated. hungs losing their homes -- hundreds losing their home. >> brother in law. my niece. my brother. >> picking up the the pieces as thousands remain out of their homes. >> i am frank somerville. >> i am heather holmes.
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the massive valley fire, we learned today it is still spreading. the fire started saturday afternoon. and took off. leaving a devastating path of destruction. >> here is the latest. the valley fire burned 61,000 acres. over 1200 firefighters are battling the flames. today it was confirmed one person has died. firefighters receiverred a call about a woman who -- received a caul about a woman who wasn't able to -- call about a woman who wasn't able to evacuate by herself. 9,000 structures are threatened and at this point the fire is only 5% contained. ktvu's mike mibach and keba arnold are seeing the devastation. seeing it for themselves. >> there is one thing to look at this through the lens of the camera but to be there. what is it like in that community


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