tv Andrea Mitchell Reports MSNBC July 2, 2013 10:00am-11:01am PDT
if i can, i'm hitting you. correct? that's what the defendant is claiming, i'm suffocating you. i'm not going to put my hand on your mouth. >> that's fine. >> would you have your hands like that, just like this? or would you be fighting me? >> i'd be fighting you. right now on "andrea mitchell reports" -- the latest from the george zimmerman trial. the lead detective in this case continuing his testimony today, shedding new light on zimmerman's physical struggle with trayvon martin. our legal team is standing by. we'll have them, as well as the trial. when it gets under way we'll take you there live. honoring 19 heroes. the town of prescott, arizona is reeling today from the loss of the fearless firefighters. hotshots who died fighting the fast moving fire 85 miles outside phoenix. this morning the wife of andrew ashcraft, one of those firefighters who died monday, paid tribute to her husband and his fallen comrades on "today."
>> in our time of mourning we want people to know that they were heroes, that they were heroes in our homes, they are heroes in our community, they are rehose for the community that they helped. our kids will remember them as heroes as well. to cairo. more anti-government demonstrations fill tahrir square today as the clock ticks down for president mohamed morsi. he has until tomorrow to address the protesters' demands or the military steps in. and nowhere to run. still hold up at the moscow airport. nsa leaker edward snowden getting turned down left and right as he requests asylum from nearly two dozen countries. also today -- watch out, jagger. guy moves like obama. the president gets his groove on in africa dancing to the beat yesterday as he arrived in tanzania. then today he was caught kicking it demonstrating a new u.s. invention. the socket ball. kicking it around pore 30
minutes can provide hours of power. you can see it is just another day in the presidential juggling act. mr. obama's got some moofs. good day, i'm peter alexander live in washington. again in today for my friend, andrea mitchell. the george zimmerman trial will resume this hour. you aren't missing any testimony right now. we've already seen some important developments today, including judge nelson telling the jury to disregard some key testimony from the former lead investigat investigat investigator, chris serino who continued to answer questions in court this morning. msnbc analyst, lisa bloom and nbc's craig melvin is live for us if sanford, florida. craig, we've learned now about a new motion that has been filed by the prosecution in this case. it deals specifically with a photo that was put up on instagram. this photo was put out several days ago. as you see it there, ice cream cones in hand, by don west, one of the defense attorneys on the
right, daughter, molly. she's, we're told, 23 years old, where it said among other things, we beat stumdty celebration cones -- #dadkilledit. so what's the motion the prosecution is filing? >> it is called a motion for inquiry. as you mention, it stems from that picture that was posted on instagram last week by molly west. that motion was actually filed yesterday and it was filed by the state and essentially not to get into all the legal verbiage, but the state claims that they filed this motion, "to ensure court proceedings are treated with respect and not as occasions for inappropriate jokes." so the state right now basically asking the judge to just look in to the posting of this picture. the motion not calling necessarily for any sort of action, any sort of punishment, but the state does want judge nelson to look into this picture. mark osterman was the witness that was testifying, the last
witness that testified before the lunch break. the jury should be back by 1: 30. we're told the jury should be back then. mark osterman was the 26th witness to testify for the state. he is the self-described sort of best friend. in fact he said at one point that george zimmerman was the best friend that he's ever had. they've known each other for five years. he and his wife wrote a book together called "defending our friend. "his wife during an interview with dr. phil last year actually said, george zimmerman, "had every right to kill trayvon martin." we heard a number of things from mark osterman when he took the stand. among the most interesting was recounting what zimmerman told him about the gun and what zimmerman told -- what zimmerman has said to police about the gun. you'll remember zimmerman has essentially claimed that trayvon martin was going for the gun. osterman today in court said zimmerman told him that trayvon
martin actually grabbed the gog for the gun, grabbed the gun. there was some confusion over there. so again, once court resumes here at 1:30 there could be a number of different witnesses that take the stand. we still haven't heard from the medical examiner or from the paramedic that we expect to hear from who arrived on the scene. we also at some point expect to hear from one or more than likely both of trayvon martin's parents. peter. >> craig, thanks so much. lisa, i want to bring you in. i'll have you put your prosecutor's hat on for a second. give us a sense of what the prosecution's strategy is going into this afternoon as we continue to hear from this best friend of george zimmerman. he's recounting his story as it was communicated to him by george zimmerman. what does the prosecution hope to do with this sghns. >> it is all about establishing inconsistencies with george zimmerman's story. we have george zimmerman locked in from his videotaped and handwritten and audiotaped stories a number of them that he gave law enforcement right after the incident.
the jurors have now heard those, have had an opportunity to read those. so the prosecution wants to show any inconsistencies so that the jury can conclude he was either lying or he was mistaken or some combination of those two. >> lisa, quickly, does it matter if you are talking to this third party witness? this is a witness who was told the story by george zimmerman. he said he didn't even keep notes. so does what he says real dloi them that much good. >> i thought this was an extremely weak witness for the prosecution. i don't think they got much out of him and i think on balance it was much better for the defense because this is george zimmerman's best friend. he obviously like him a lot. everything he said he said in a way that was helpful to zimmerman. he is a law enforcement officer himself. he talk about recommending that george zimmerman get a gun, that zimmerman did so legally, had he had a concealed carry permit, how upset zimmerman's wife was after the shooting, how upset zimmerman was after the shooting. he just went on and on in favor of the defendant in this case. on balance, i don't really see
the strategy of why the prosecution called him. >> we'll continue that conversation in a bit. the trials continues in about 20 minutes. we'll take you there live. we move on to another headline making news overseas. this is pressure on the egyptian president, mohammed morrissey, continues to mount today following the military's 48-hour ultimatum as well as a string of high-level detections from morsi's islamist government as those massive protests continue to sweep through that country. ayman, it is another day but the same story as we look around you and we hear it, just a remarkable scene there in tahrir square. >> reporter: well, yeah, absolutely incredible. you can probably hear behind me, it is a deafening sound. i can tell you that with every passing hour, more and more people are coming in to this square chanting, many of the same slogans they did two years ago. the arabic word for "leave." they are anticipating some sort
of announcement. that may be premature but it is clear in the minds of the people here, the clock is ticking on the president of mohammed morrissey. president morsi has been in the palace today holding emergency meetings with the minister of defense, as well as the prime minister, perhaps in some attempt to try to salvage his presidency, try to come up with some type of framework that will allow him to stay in power. but for the time being, the ultimatum stands. that that was issued by the military saying that president morsi must address the grievances of the people within 48 hours. we have about 12 to 13 hours left on that deadline. right now security across this country is extremely heightened. you can anticipate a great sense of anxiety among people. that is because on one side of the divide here in tahrir, people are celebrating. but on the other side of the political divide, those that are supporting president morsi, they have seen the decision by the military as a coup on the legitimacy of the democratic process. they, too, have gone to the streets.
they, too, are organizing rallies and this is the showdown that's going to unfold here in egypt over the next several hours an certainly one that has a lot of people on edge, not only in the country but across the region. peter? >> ayman, i'm reading from notes about the read h-out from president's call to president morsi where he he conveyed concerns over recent developments in violence, specifically the violence directed to women. he stressed that democracy is "about more than elections. it is also about ensuring that the voices of all egyptians are heard and represented." from an american perspective, if you can break this down into plain english for us, what should americans be looking to have happen when this time expires? what are the possible outcomes in terms of who does take power in that country? >> well, right now we don't have a clear answer on that yet. the military has issued the ultimatum saying that president morsi must address the demands of the people.
the demands have been two simple demands. one, either president morsi leaves or he calls for early elections. the united states has increasingly stood by president morsi over the past year. it's not yet clear what position they will take as this ultimatum winds down. what's important for people in the u.s. to understand is that egypt is currently divided. the overwhelming majority of the people over the past several days have been increasingly calling for president morsi to step down. they say that over the past year he has mismanaged the country and attempted to take more an more power for him an his islamist supporters. they feel that the country has not made a genuine transition to democracy. this is what they have been calling for for the past two careers. not only under the leadership of president morsi but also under the leadership of the military which could very well be back in power in the next 24 hours. so it is extremely concerning for some to see that the military has once again re-asserted itself into the
politics of egypt. that certainly is going to be something of great concern for washington and for other players across the world to see that the egyptian military has injected itself back into the country's politics. but at the same time, people say that this is really the last chance for egypt to try and get to a genuine democracy. not only under the control of the military, or that of the islamist leader, mohamed morsi, but one that genuine lynn reflects the will of people like those behind me here in tahrir square. >> the countdown is on. we are watching the clock and we'll continue to visit with you. we appreciate that report. the president is touring africa. that was political but it was also personal. it was packed with some really emotional moments especially during a visit that took place at robin island where nelson mandela spent much of the 27 years behind those very bars. look at some of these striking photographs. it was obviously a powerful experience for a president who considers the ailing leader a major source of inspiration. as you can see the president holding his daughter sasha in
his arms. the final stop on president obama's trip was in tanzania where nbc news chief white house correspondent chuck todd filed this report before hopping on the flight back home. >> it was a busy final day for the president, a half-way on the last of this six-day trip, had his longest for the president to africa. two presidents, presidents obama and bush stood side by side at the u.s. embassy, laying a wreath paying tribute to the victim of one of the first big terrorist attacks plotd by osama bin laden. there were attacks here on the embassy in tanzania and north here in kenya. the more interesting event though of a bush and obama turned out to be a meeting of the two first ladies. first lady laura bush here is hosting a two-day summit for african first ladies. she invited michelle obama to come and michelle obama and laura bush had a pretty
interesting candid panel discussion about life in the white house where you heard laura bush describe it, sometimes it is confining a little bit like a prison. then of course laura bush joked, well, it is a priz been a pretty good chef. but they both talked about the struggles sometimes of being in the fish bowl and the stress of obviously the weight of the world on their two husbands. president obama's final event turned out to be a tour of a power factory where he demonstrated the socket ball. what it is, it is a soccer ball that when you kick it around it builds up enough kinetic energy that you can then use it to plug in a light or for other supplies. it is all part after legacy president obama hopes to lead here, that he is the american president that provides the resources that brings power and electricity to rural africa. he's now off back to washington, d.c. he'll host a fourth of july event at the white house. then it is camp david for a long weekend. traveling with the president here, peter, i will see you back next week. i'm in tanzania now. hopefully we'll be back in washington in a couple of days.
>> chuck, thanks a lot. safe travels, of course. yesterday during the president's trip to africa, this really unique an rare glimpse into the life of first families. first lady michelle obama joined there by laura bush at the african first ladies summit. mrs. obama said, "nothing prepares you for the role of first lady." as both women dished about making the quick transition to living in the white house. >> i remember walking into that house and i didn't even know where the bathrooms were. but i had to get ready for a ball. it was and i've got to look nice? what door is this? you're opening all these doors? you can't find your toothpaste. you don't know where your kids are. that's day one. (announcer) at scottrade, our clients trade and invest
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back now live on "andrea mitchell reports." president bush's preference since he left nofs 2009 has been to stay out of the political conversation, but there he was in africa, the former commander in chief, giving an honest assessment of edward snowden's actions before today's wreath laying ceremony with president obama. take a listen. >> i know he damaged the country and the obama administration will deal with it. >> do you think it is possible for one man to really damage the security of the nation? >> i think he damaged the security of the country. i put the program in place to protect the country and one of the certainties is civil liberties were guaranteed. >> joining me now for our daily fix, nbc's senior political editor, mark murray. chris cillizza, msnbc contributor and managing et toward of post politics.com. mark, start with this remarkable image of seeing the two
presidents, 43 and 44, together specifically as they were talking about this issue of surveillance. they are both on the same side of this issue which with so notable given the fact that obama, as then senator an candidate obama, just pounded the president, former president, on the topic back then. >> peter, it is part of being president and holding the office. i would imagine whoever is president in 2016 or 2020 will probably also agree on that nsa program, that once you're in office your duty is to protect the people. there will be the debate on how do you weigh security versus civil liberties. you're seeing more after warmth between the two men, one republican, one democrat. we started seeing this during the bush 43 library dedication where president obama said some very nice things particularly when it came to immigration reform. now that obama no longer is going to run for election again, can you kind of see how they join this fraternity of presidents where they share more than they disagree. >> i want to bring it back
closer to home, the showdown now officially brewing in the great state of kentucky. allison grimes, the secretary of the blue grass state, secretary of state there, announced that she's going to challenge mitch mcconnell for his seat. grimes had had just 38% of the vote barely eight months ago. >> look, it is not easy. what she has going for her is this, peter. mitch mcconnell has really never gotten above about 54%, 55% of the vote with the exception of one year in 2002. so he's not someone who really gets 60%, 70% in terms of his re-election races. he is someone who's divisive both in the state and nationally so there is a built-in anti-mitch mcconnell vote that's probably higher than what barack obama got. the problem though is that she's never run this kind of campaign before. she is the secretary of state. her father, is a well known former state party chairman. he's a friend of bill clinton's.
bill clinton was involved in getting allison grimes to run. but this is a different kind of race. not just because it is a senate race but because it is mitch mcconnell. this is somebody who makes no bones about the kind of campaigns he he runs an given his numbers he has to make it about allison grimes, president obama, not mitch mcconnell. that's the way he wins. i wouldn't expect a whole lot of happy talk from mitch mcconnell. i think you will see a lot of ads from mitch mcconnell. >> what does this end up looking like? we saw what mcconnell did to ashley judd and she never even got into the race? >> it is going to be nasty, it is going to be divisive. one thing allison grimes doesn't have, she isn't that lightning rod coming out of the gate. mcconnell campaign will try to do everything they can. >> biggest obstacle to mitch mcconnell? >> mitch mcconnell. he is someone who has great advocates and great detractors.
they'll all come out. grimes is someone who's credible an they can rally around. >> thanks, guys. former representative william gray died monday at the age of 71. the democrat was elected to congress for philadelphia in 1978. gray was the first after can american to serve as chairman of the budget committee and house majority whip. in a statement today, president obama called him a trail blazer whose leadership made our communities, our country and our world a more just place. also, on this day 50 years ago, the civil rights act was signed into law by president lyndon b. johnson. landmark piece of legislation ended jim crow laws making racial discrimination against minorities and as well as women illegal. it banned segregation at school and public facilities. >> as long as any american is denied the chance to fully
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fancy feast. the best ingredient is love. once again you are watching "andrea mitchell reports." i'm peter alexander sitting in today for andrea. we will take you back to the george zimmerman trial when it resumes. that should be happening within the next five to ten minutes. we'll bring you back down to florida so you don't miss a minute of that. no country for young men. that sounds like a hollywood phlegm these days. at times, edward snowden's story seems to play that way as with well. the former nsa contractor is facing new hurdles in his quest for asylum. russia, as you likely saw, insisted snowden would have to stop leaking information before they would consider his asylum request so snowden pulled the request. now according to wikileaks, snowden has requested asylum in 20 countries, but many of them have already said no, thanks. nbc's jim maceda is joining me now from moscow. jim, give us a better understanding of where this stands right now for edward
snowden. he's been in there for approaching ten days inside the terminal behind you. what happens now? >> well, those 20 countries, ten of them are european, scandinavian nations. which at first glance doesn't make a lot of sense because those of these are nato countries, they have extradition treaties with the u.s. unless -- unless snowden is thinking -- don't want to assume that i understand that -- that even u.s. allies, like germany an france and italy might be willing to give him asylum after that bombshell leak regarding the u.s. bugging of eu officials and buildings and the anger -- genuine anger that that has triggered. now the countries that have refused or are in the process of refusing, interestingly enough, are the brics -- israel, brazil, china. and now russia, probably because
of the economic damage that in harboring a wanted meamerican fugitive. nine of the countries can't process the application because snowden, the applicant, need to be on national soil or at an embassy. he's stuck here in moscow. he has no u.s. pat port, and he has no russian visa. if you remove all of the "nos" and "not probables" from that list of 20, you end up with venezuela, bolivia and iceland as front-runners so take your pick. >> just very briefly, jim, we know ironically the venezuela president was in moscow today. did he make any reference to snowden's allege asylum request? >> yes, he did. we approached him on it. he visited the russian parliament today. his first comments were that venezuela hadn't yet received the application but whether it did, it would respond to it. but then he went on to sound like the typical leftist
anti-american. like a stump speech, haranguing american imperialism, praising snowden for minutes and the praise just flowed. when we did ask him if he was going to fly back to caracas with snowden on board his presidential plane, he laughed as he said, "all i'm bringing back from here is the oil and gas agreements which i've just signed." laughed again and got in his car. pete, back to you. >> i know you'll watch it closely from there, jim maceda in moscow, jim, nice to visit with you, thank you. as residents of arizona come to grips with this painful loss of some of the state's bravest young men, many people are flocking to the home of the firestation that lost 19 of its 20 elite firefighters on sunday in pros coescott. single deadliest day for american firefighters since 9/11. moments ago there was a press conference and city officials recognize as they mourn there is still massive fire they need to focus on putting out.
>> it is an incredible tragedy that's happened out here and yet we need to get focused back on the task at hand and that's to make sure in honor of these firefighters that we attack this fire safely and with swiftness. >> nbc's gabe gutierrez joins me now from prescott. you just see that memorial that just continues to swell there behind you, gabe. share some of the personal stories you've heard about these individuals, these men who lost their lives. so many of them so young. most of them in their 20s. >> reporter: that's right, peter. just simply heartbreaking. victims range in age from 21 to 42 years old. most of them in their 20s, most of them with young children at home. and the widow of one of those firefighters, andrew ashcraft's widow, spoke out to the "today" show this morning and talked about how it was -- she was simply devastated and that her husband died doing something that he loved, that he was trying to save lives and that she had had exchanged text
messages with him just a few hours, even minutes, before she last heard from him. one of those text messages he expressed he was proud of his son had gave a talk at church that morning. she asked if he would not be able to sleep in his own bed and she never got a response. it is truly heartbreaking, some of these stories that we are hearing from some these victims' families. most of them in their 20s with young children. behind me this memorial is growing. this town of 40,000 people is just coming together and remembering these 19 firefighters. as you mentioned though, peter, this huge fire continues to burn out of control. the last estimate we have is about 8,400 acres but chances are it has grown much bigger than that. conditions today aren't helping. it is still hot and windy. they do expect just a little bit more humidity later on today but really, it is unclear how much of a difference that will make. there will still be these whipping winds that will continue to fuel this fire.
but here in prescott, there was a memorial last night. more than 1,000 people showed up to remember these firefighters and we do -- the firefighters do expect to get some help from the federal government. four c-130 aircraft have been requested by the you u.s. forest service. two of them were in colorado, two in california and they are expected to get here in the next day or so. so that may help fighting these fires. but the investigation continues into how exactly these 19 firefighters died. we don't expect autopsy results for another 24 to 48 hours so we are still waiting on that. >> gape gutierrez is in arizona for us today. your heart is not just with the family mechanical bers but also the 20th member of the granite mountain hotshots, the one survivor who was not in the fire with them at that time. gabe, thanks for that report. lift-off, but not for long. check it out. come back to your screen. for a russian rocket caught on tape, this thing exploded over kazakhstan. the engines unexpectedly shut down just second after takeoff.
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keep your car healthy with the works. $29.95 or less after $10 mail-in rebate at your participating ford dealer. so you gotta take care of yourself? yes you do. you gotta take care of your baby? oh yeah! once again you are watching the george zimmerman trial here on msnbc. court, as you can see now, back in session after a brief lunch recess. we want to get right to "usa today's" allison door and jalani is a contributing writer for "the new yorker." to sort of tee up with a we should expect to see this afternoon. so much of what's been taking place over the course of the last two days is to try to build that list of inconsistencies, those small little details. some of them smaller than others
that might undermine the credibility of george zimmerman. where have they made ground on that of effort? >> i think they've made ground this afternoon when they called one of george zimmerman's best friends to the stand and asked him about details in his book. the friend said george zimmerman said trayvon actually grabbed the gun, had his hand on the gun and this george zimmerman took his hand off. that's something he had never told to police. i think prosecutors can trying to do that. they didn't make much ground with the actual police officer. police officer said zimmerman's statements were inconsistent. so it is still hard to say where they are with all of with but they've made some ground. >> you can see on the left side of the screen, we should tell our audience, we're watching video that's being played to the jurors in the courtroom. this is from an interview that took place with both george zimmerman and his attorney, mark o'mara, in july last year. are you struck by the difference in appearance of george zimmerman, the stress of the trial obviously taking a toll on
his physical appearance. but this is just another effort to use george zimmerman in his own words even if he himself refuses to take the stand. isn't it? >> yeah. i think that's absolutely true. iffer's not there on the stand personally, they've been trying to kind of paint a web of his words. i agree, this is why had they had his best friend on the stand, that's why they've kind of gone back through the police interviews. they've tried to paint as the prosecution would expect, try to paint george zimmerman into a corner using his own words. >> can i ask you a brit about george zimmerman's demeanor in the courtroom? he's been described by so many observers, to use their language, detached. not just as we witness had him in the courtroom but detached more specifically in the moments, in the hours, even the days that followed this shooting, this fight as he describes it, that led to the death of trayvon martin.
what does that say to you as we witness a guy who seems to be pretty calm given the fact that everybody else who witnessed this, people who called in to 911, were in hysterics at the time. >> you i think his friend said that george zimmerman was shocked, he was stunned. police officer serino said that when you shoot somebody that you're going to go kind of into shock because it is a big trauma. so zimmerman by some would consider calm, but many people have said that zimmerman wasn't cavalier, that he didn't just say i shot this kid, then walked around. he was really more quiet and more thoughtful and almost taking it all in. i think he's kind of like that in the courtroom that he hasn't shown a complete disdain for what's going on but he has been kind of blank when you look at his face. >> had help me back up a little bit. give me a sense of just from an american perspective, this is more than just a trial between two men that only about a year ago nobody knew the names of,
george zimmerman and trayvon martin. it says a lot about america, about race and about class. what are we witnessing here as we watch this trial take place? because it seems to be a lot bigger than just this individual case -- at least being viewed that way. >> it is. if i can add one quick point. the video that shows that initial interview with officer chris serino, it could also appear callus because he he does appear very calm, very composed. whether he is in shock or just very composed, i think that will be something for the jury to determine. when he kind of relays that this person has been shot and he's dead, and he still refers to him as a punk, then officer s eflt serino says, well, he's not a punk. maybe he just has a placid demeanor. on the bigger significance of this case, everything about this unspoken question between the prosecution and the defense is whether or not this jury is
capable of seeing trayvon martin as an innocent victim. i think that's what this boils down to. in a broad are sense, whether or not people can see an african-american male as an innocent victim. >> we want our audience to see what the jurors are seeing right now. we'll give you the live audio and video that's going on in the courtroom, a conversation that took place with fox news from last year. >> -- we also had learned trayvon was speaking with his girlfriend supposedly at the time. maybe he he was afraid. if he didn't know who you were? >> no. >> you don't think that -- why do you think that he was running then? >> maybe i said running but he was more -- >> you said he was running. >> yes. he was like skipping, going away quickly. but he wasn't running out of fear. >> you could tell the difference? >> he wasn't running. >> he wasn't actually running. >> no, sir. >> that's what you said to the dispatcher. you thought he was running.
let me ask you this. at that point you can hear the unbuckling of the seatbelt, hear you opening the car door. and the dispatch asks you at this point -- and this became a very key moment that everyone in the media focused on. dispatcher asked you, are you following him? and you said yes. explain that. >> i meant that i was going in the same direction as him to keep an eye on him so that i could tell the police where he was going. i didn't mean that i was actually per suing him. >> so this moment where some had suggested you were out of breath on that tape, you yourself were not runing? >> no, sir. >> and you i think made a statement to the police that it was the wind as you were getting out of the car moving, that was the sound we hear, not you out of breath? >> yes, sir. >> welcome back to hannity. we continue now with more of my exclusive interview with with george zimmerman an his attorney, mark o'mara. >> what did you do from that
moment forward? this is where we get into this minute gap in this case. you know, what did you do from that minute forward when dispatch said we don't need you to follow him? what did you do next? >> i walked across the sidewalk on to my street where i thought i would meet a police officer that i had called. >> so you did not continue to follow him. >> no, sir. no, sir. >> all right. so you you continue from there. you sounded at that moment on the tape though a little bit distracted. what was the distraction? were you looking for him? or. >> i wanted to make sure that when he asked me for my address, i didn't want to make sure nobody was lingering and could hear my address an then come back. i was making sure that there wasn't anybody that was going to surprise me and just try and give them an accurate location.
>> because they said, can we meet you here at a certain location. you said have them call me. >> yes. >> why did you want them at that point to call you? >> i had hadn't given them correct address. i gave them a -- the clubhouse vicinity. however, i was walking through to my street, and i was going to give them the actual street, number and name. >> how was it long, george, after that that you saw trayvon again? because you said you stopped, you did not continue pursuing him bhp d him. when did you next see trayvon martin? >> 30 seconds. >> where exactly were you at that point and how far away were you from your car at that moment? >> i guess about 100 feet or more. >> so you never went further than how far approximately from your car are? >> i'd estimate it to be approximately 100 feet.
>> you you never went further than that from the car? >> no, sir. >> and so at that point, trayvon is -- all of a sudden you turn around and there he was. >> yes, sir. >> what happened next? >> he asked me what my problem was. >> "explettive" problem. >> yes. i had put my cell phone in my pocket instead of my jeans pocket. i went to grab my phone and this time call 911 instead of non-emergency and when i reached into my pants pocket because that's where i keep it out of habit, it wasn't there and i was shocked. i looked up and he punched me and broke my nose. >> yes. >> sew said to you, you have "expletive" problem. those were the exact words he used.
>> do you have a problem? what's your problem. >> what's your problem. you said to him -- i don't have a problem. >> yes, sir. >> you reach for your phone. >> i reach for it as i was saying, no, i don't have a problem. >> and at that point you just got had hit? >> he was already within arm's length from me. >> and was that the punch in the nose that broke your nose? >> yes, sir. >> right there. you went immediately down to the ground? >> i don't rememberfy went immediately to the ground or if he push me to the ground. but i ended up on the ground. >> what do you remember happened from there? because there were police reports and descriptions that you gave and you were little bit dazed obviously and at one point you said that you wanted him -- you wanted to stop him from hitting your head on the cement. >> yes, sir. >> is that what you told the police? >> yes, sir. >> so after that first hit, what happened next? >> he started bashing my head into the concrete sidewalk. i was -- as soon as he broke my
nose i started yelling for help. i was disoriented and he started slamming my head into the concrete. >> which is where the lacerations came from? >> yes, sir. >> you said it was like your head was going to explode was a comment you had had given to the police. >> yes, sir. he continued to punch me in the head. >> how many times would you estimate that he punched you? >> several. more than a dozen. >> and hitting you hard. at what moment did you -- you said you feared for your life. at what moment do you remember when you literally remember when you thought, i may die. is that -- because you said you feared for your life. do you remember the exact moment when you felt that? >> in hindsight, i would say when he was slamming my head
into the concrete and i thought i'd lose consciousness and i didn't know what would happen at that point. >> how close was the concrete to the grass? because the big issue is also the grass stains that you had on your clothes and you made a statement to the police that you wanted to get to the grass. was that to protect your head from getting -- banging into the cement again? >> yes, sir. >> how close was that in proximity? >> it butts up to the concrete. >> were you able to get to the grass? >> yes, sir. >> how did you do that? >> i guess you could say shimmied. he was straddled on me with his full weight and i would try and sit up and push myself down. whenever i would sit up, that's when he would take the opportunity to slam my head back down and bunch me in the head and continue to hit my nose. >> was he talking to you a lot during this fight, during this when he was beating you? because you said he is beating you and pounding your head into
the cement. was he talking to you during that time? >> yes. >> he was saying -- >> cursing. telling me to shut up. and then finally telling me he was going to kill me. >> and he said those words. and he said -- when did he first see your gun? >> after we were on the ground, i shimmied with him on top of me and it made me jacket rise up and he being on top of me saw it on my right side. >> what happened after that? >> i felt him take -- he had -- after he couldn't hit my head on the concrete anymore, he started to try to suffocate me and i continued to take -- push his hands off of my mouth an my nose, particularly because it was excruciating having a broken nose and him putting his weight on it. and that's the point in time when he started telling me to shut up, shut up, shut you up. >> why did he tell you to shut up? >> i don't know.
>> didn't -- we heard the screams on the one recording from the neighbor that was calling the police and there's been some dispute whose voice that is. was your voice screaming or was that trayvon martin's voice? >> that was my voice, absolutely. >> police said at one time they heard 14 screams. you were screaming that loud? >> yes, sir. >> you said to the police at one point he put his hand over your mouth. do you think that was to silence you from screaming? >> yes, sir. i believe he, from what the investigators told me, he knew that i was talking to the police, and i was yelling so that -- i believe that the police officer was there, and they just couldn't find me. so i was yelling in the hopes that they were in the vicinity and they would come when they heard me yelling. >> do you remember when you,
yourself, reached for your weapon? do you remember that moment? >> yes, sir. >> tell us about that. >> at that point i realized that it wasn't my gun, it wasn't his gun, it was the gun. >> did he say anything? you said he was talking a lot about the gun. did he say he noticed the gun? >> he said you're going to die tonight [ bleep ] and took one hand off of my mouth, and i felt it going down my chest towards my belt and my holster. that's when i -- i didn't have anymore time. >> do you think you acted more out of a conscious thought? i know these events happen very quickly. do you remember consciously thinking, i've got to grab my gun, or did you just do it? was there a conscious thought that went through your head that you thought you were going to
die and you had to get your weapon and fire? >> i'd love to give you an answer -- >> you don't know? >> it just happened so quickly. >> there was an eyewitness that was out from the very beginning that, in fact, did tell the police the night of the shooting that he saw trayvon on top of you and did see the beating. there is no witness to the actual shooting itself. right? >> correct, besides myself. >> besides yourself. >> yes, sir. >> when you think back -- there was one report, a police report, that actually said you didn't know after you fired -- you thought you missed. >> i didn't think i hit him, yes. >> yeah, so what happened immediately after the shooting then, george? i understand one guy came out, he said he had a flashlight, that he spoke to you, and you said to call your wife, tell her what happened, that i shot somebody. do you remember that conversation? >> the conversation i had with
the gentleman or -- >> yeah. >> yes, sir. >> you do remember that conversation. and he did talk about it. his suggestion was -- is that you were very matter of fact about it. do you remember what you said to him? do you think you were in a state of shock? did you know that trayvon -- when did you know that trayvon had died? >> probably about an hour after i got to the police station. >> after the shooting, did you -- and you saw that he was laying there and obviously injured, there was a moment where you realized he was shot. >> like i said, he sat up and said something to the effect of you got it or you got me. i assumed he meant, okay, you got the gun, i didn't get it. i'm not going to fight anymore. at which point i got out from under him. >> is there anything you regret? do you regret getting out of the car to follow trayvon that night? >> no, sir. >> do you regret that you had a
gun that night? >> no, sir. >> do you feel you wouldn't be here for this interview if you didn't have that gun? >> no, sir. >> you feel you would not be here? >> i would that it was all god's plan and for me to second-guess it or judge it -- >> is there anything you might do differently in retrospect now that time has passed a little bit? >> no, sir. >> you know, the detective said, you know, that you had -- detective singleton quoted you as saying the bad guy's always get away. did you -- you also said that on the 911 tape. did you have a feeling that there were a lot of people that do get away with crimes? in other words, were you sort of predisposed in your mind to think that criminals get away too often? >> not in general. i think in our neighborhood there's geographic advantages for burglaries. >> do you have any idea -- why
do you think trayvon would have confronted you the way he did? i made a comment on the air one day, and i got beaten up pretty bad for saying this all could have just been a terrible misunderstanding or mistake. do you think maybe -- is there any possibility he thought you were after him and you thought he was after you and there was some misunderstanding in any way? >> i've wrestled with that for a long time. i can't -- one of my biggest issues through this ordeal has been the media conjecture, and i can't assume or make believe. >> the one witness you first met, the guy with the cell phone i mentioned, asked about your demeanor right after the shooting. he was the first person on the scene. >> yes, sir. >> first person you saw. he said that you looked like you had been, quote, butt whooped, like you had had a fight and you were asking, call my wife, just
tell my wife. but, you know, he was acting like it was nothing. is that how you were feeling at the time? because you didn't find out until later that trayvon had passed away. >> no, i knew that i had discharged my firearm, and i was scared, nervous. i also thought the police were going to come and see me with a firearm and shoot me. i mean, i was terrified. >> did you look over at trayvon -- you obviously at some point recognized he had been shot. you didn't know it in the beginning. did you look over at him and any time and realize he was in really bad shape? >> no, sir. >> and how long it was between the time you shot him to the time the police got to the scene? >> it felt like forever. i'd say 15 to 30 seconds. >> it was that quick? >> yes, sir. >> immediate. so in other words, they had already been on their way, and they were there within 15, 30 seconds.
what do you make of all the national media attention in this case? there are crimes that happen every day. the nation is focused on your case. why do you think that is, and what do you make of it and what does it mean to you? >> it's surreal. i don't like that they've rushed to judgment the way they have. i feel that any time they have a story that's remotely positive, they interpret it negatively. >> you had called police at least four prior occasions and mentioned black male suspects. i wanted to give you a chance to respond why you called. what were those instances about? >> i never volunteered that information. it was always at their request that i describe them.
even when i described them, i didn't volunteer their race until they asked me. and there's also hispanic kids and white kids that were in the neighborhood. >> that you made calls about? >> yes, sir. >> let me ask you this. i want to the go back to one specific in the case, if i can. it's the issue of you following him. we heard -- i asked you earlier about the dispatch call. you said you stopped, you didn't follow him. there's one moment that you were apparently -- as you look at the grounds of where this took place, there's the apartment and there's the overhangs and then there's another street on the other side. you had gone to the other street. >> yes, sir. >> so how do you get to it the other street if you're not following him? where were you going at that point? >> i was walking from where i had parked my car towards my street. he went right, down in between
the houses. i went straight across. >> in that sense, were you following him? >> no, sir. >> you weren't following him? >> no, sir. >> and this is after the 911 call? >> during. >> during the call. >> they stated we need you to do that. >> why were you walking back to your street and not to the car at that point? i'm trying to get the chronology. >> certainly. where i parked my car was the back of townhouses. there wasn't a way to know what the street number was. i knew if i walked straight through, it's a circle, retreat view circle. i knew if i walked straight through to there, that would be retreat view circle and i could tell them exactly one, two, three, four retreat view circle and not just a general area of where my car was like i had done previously.
>> i'm tamron hall. the news nation is following key testimony in the second-degree murder trial of george zimmerman. we were just watching an interview george zimmerman did with sean hannity of fox news. i have lisa bloom standing by as well as john burress. lisa, let me start off with you. it's interesting. you hear george zimmerman in that interview discuss the media's role. yet, he was giving a very high-profile interview with his attorney seated next to him in an attempt at that time to describe what he says happened that night. >> that's right. well, he chose an interview with a relatively friendly interviewer with his attorney by his side. he gave that one interview answering all of the questions that were posed to him. what the prosecution is doing by in