tv Hardball With Chris Matthews MSNBC July 17, 2013 2:00pm-3:01pm PDT
call to arms? let's play "hardball." good evening, i'm chris matthews out in san francisco. let me start tonight with this. stand your ground. what's this law all about? is it a statement that you don't have to avoid trouble? is it a call to arms? and what part did it play in george zimmerman's behavior that tragic night? did it encourage him to pursue trayvon martin? was it because he had a gun and thought he had the law on his side? isn't it a fair question that none of this would have happened if this person had been unarmed? was there something in his thinking, zimmerman's about the law, something about the way he behaved that resulted pr this law that says stand your ground?
let's get to the next round in this debate. this public verdict on the trayvon martin tragedy. the battle over stand your ground. perry bacon is an msnbc contributor and political editor with the grio.com and radica jones is the assistant managing time editor for "time" magazine. tell me about what you think is the reason why the attorney general, eric holder who is in a somewhat political position but also primarily in a public service position, why he would be speaking as he has come out of talking about the trial of george zimmerman, begin to talk about stand your ground, the law in florida? >> well, i think eric holder is in a unique position to talk about this. he comes from a person perspective, he comes to it as the first african-american attorney general and he will also obviously brings a legal perspective to it. when we started recording on the stand your ground loss in the background of this case last year when the case came to
prominence, we discovered even some state attorneys in florida have who are employed to uphold this law have issues with it. and it seems to me that will from that point forward, you know, from the point when it became clear there would be a trial, people have been paying attention to stand your ground laws, they've been becoming more informed about them and it makes a lot of sense he would direct his attention there. >> i guess the question is, did the stand your ground law play a role in the jury room? even though it was not mentioned much in the trial, one of the zimmerman jurors known as b-37 says it played a role in the jury deliberations. in a statement to cnn the juror says "my prayers are with all those who have the influence and power to modify the laws that left me with no verdict option other than not guilty in offered to remain within the instructions." this juror also said the group had been split on a verdict in some of their discussions with three jurors for acquittal, two for manslaughter, and one
leaning toward second degree murder. other jurors have distanced themselves since then from juror b-37 four of them put out a statement in response saying we ask you to remember that we are not public officials and did not invite this type of attention into our lives. we also wish to point out that the opinions of juror b-37 expressed on the anderson cooper show were not, were, her own and not in any way representative of the jurors listed below and it list the four of them. perry bacon, we'll go back and forth on this. the influence of that law because it seems to me you've got to separate two things here. focus on whether you believe the testimony of george zimmerman which was introduced through the police questioning of him and that was taped of that. or you don't. if you do, was there an option here to leave the situation that he was involved in that he was pinned down, did he have the option to walk away? in other words, i'm not sure you can get clarity here from this
jury yet. were they thinking he was telling the truth but he still had the option even if telling the truth to get away and avoid this situation or were they not believing him and if they weren't believing him, why did they acquit him? this is what's inconsistent in the jury decision. if what do you call it, stand your ground legislation really was influential here? i don't think it was because if it was, we'd have some clarity here, my fought thought. >> the i think you're right. my understanding is that the defense itself was did not invoke stad your ground and i know that jeb bush and some other republicans even at the time of the killing initially said the stand your ground really didn't apply here. i think when you talk about the politics of this though, one reason eric holder is talking about stand your ground laws is the administration would love to push some kind of broader he proposals on getting rid of guns at a federal level because we know having zimmerman having a gun was important here and maybe you shouldn't have had a gun. but they have had no success
passing any gun control loss federally. so part of the administration's view is there are 22 states that have stand your ground laws including florida, new hampshire and two other states where obama won in 2012. there's probably some room to get those laws repealed in those states. i think that's where you're hearing eric holder talk about them. >> again i want to get clarity. what do you think was the relevance in your understanding of what happened in that jury room to the issue of stand your ground? >> my understanding from listening to that juror's testimony is that they really tried to isolate the moment of the struggle and the killing and if stand your ground played a role at all, again my understanding is that it may have been sort of the em boldening backdrop to this struggle. but they seem to want to isolate that moment of violence away from what motivated george zimmerman to get out of his car
and that is where you have a real gray area with this law. >> well, let me ask you about, but the self defense part would have come in when he was believed, according to the jury's decision, he was in danger of losing his life or serious bodily image. that wasn't when the he left the car. his decision about using the gun came when, if you believe his testimony, when he was pinned down and being slammed into the sidewalk. if you believe his testimony. that's why i don't understand why this jury keeps saying there's an issue of law here when by that definition, regular self-defense would have worked. again, let me go back to perry on that. i think we've got a real problem with consistency in this verdict. >> the jurors have not been -- they can decide -- they have not been very clear about their rationale. i think we'll probably never get a full picture of what all six of them thought. we're getting sort of one at a time speaking. i guess we'll later on in a few weeks know how much of a role stand your ground played versus
versus their interpretation of what happened there versus what other people have talked to us about. i don't think we have a clear sense what they exactly think happened yet. >> let's go to attorney general eric holder. he has gone public now with a forceful denunciation of stand your ground laws. this is holder, the attorney general speaking about the law at the naacp's annual convention just yesterday. >> it's time to quell laws that senselessly expand the concept of self-defense and so dangerous conflict in our neighborhoods. >> these laws try to fix something that was never broken. there has always been a legal defense for using deadly force if and the if is important. if no safe retreat is available. it it is our collective obligation. we must stand our ground. >> let me go to perry and then radhika both answer the same
question. it's a tough one. is it is this a smart political focus for the attorney general? because it does allow him to give deliberation to the question of bringing a civil rights case against zimmerman but in the meantime, be active on this front while leaving the other question aside for a bit and maybe relinquishing the feed for him to act on the other front if he acts aggressively enough on this stand your ground issue. perry? >> my understanding from legal experts it be pretty hard to problem the civil rights violation in this case. it is unlikely the doj will move forward on that issue. in that sense, hold ser taking the issue where he can. holder doesn't have any power on state laws. let's be clear. he can't get a florida stand your ground lawrie peeled. it is a good way for him and i heard the white house today at the press briefing talked about the stand your ground idea, as well and to make a broader push to get rid of these laws. that's something they can do. my suspicion is we'll see the main legal recourse is through
the martin family filing a civil suit, not doj. >> radhika your thoughts on these three issues, cliding the civil rights potential and the stand your ground politicking if you will. >> i think perry makes a good point. there's a bigger picture which is that the stand your ground policies like stop and frisk policies in new york, for example, and various other laws and policies end up having a disproportionate effect on the african-american community. holder is in a good position to talk about that and whether he can directly announce those laws and he can't as perry says, he can make people moral attuned to them and their consequences. i think that's a valuable move. >> just to be careful here, i know we have to be nuanced here. i grew up in philadelphia and i keep track of how they do things out there. michael nutter won the democratic primary for mayor by advocating stop and frisk and gaining his greatest support in the african-american community on that issue. so the idea that the african-american community as a
group is against stop and frisk wasn't held up, didn't seem to be the case in philly. >> i think that's true but it's a community issue and something we're seeing as we report on the story this week is that churches and black communities and other you know nonpolitical leaders are starting to think about the broader implications of this verdict and of attention to the stand your ground law and think, how can we will move forward from here to make our communities safer and lose fewer young black men to violence. it's a much broader. >> there are other reasons to stop and frisk besides ethnicity. i hope there is. it has to do with the behavior, situations after a gang killing, all kinds of things that a good police officer can handle effectively. thank you perry, thank you radhika. a reminder watch reverend al sharpton's interview with rachel jeantel on "politics nation" at 6:00 p.m. eastern. coming up, more evidence that
not only did republicans push voter id laws to keep down democratic turnout but it may have worked a bit. in washington today, by the way, hearing why we still need enforceable voting rights law. also, leave it to liz cheney to say the problem with senate republicans these days, wow, is they're too willing to go along with democrats. did you notice? her run for the senate could put wyoming on the political warpath. and lindsey graham wants tonight consider a boycott of the russianen olympics next year if putin grants edward snowden asylum. finally why so many people are angry with this cover on the rolling stone. i think i'm angry. this is "hardball," the place for politics. i love my contractor, and i am so thankful to angie's list for bringing us together. find out why more than two million members count on angie's list. angie's list -- reviews you can trust.
martin family. and with every people in loves someone who is lost to violence. no mother, no father, should ever have to fear for their child walking down a street in the united states of america. >> looking strong. hillary clinton there. we'll be right back after this. . . and we've made a big commitment to america. bp supports nearly 250,000 jobs here. through all of our energy operations, we invest more in the u.s. than any other place in the world. in fact, we've invested over $55 billion here in the last five years - making bp america's largest energy investor. our commitment has never been stronger. these are sandra's "homemade" yummy, scrumptious bars. hmm?
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on the second day, by the way, of a trial over the constitutionality of pennsylvania's votingively d. law an expert testified that photo i.d. requirements disproportionately hurt democrats and minorities. this is the expert for the courts. democrats are three times as likely as republicans and minorities about twice as likely as whites to lack a valid i.d. in other words, people who don't drive cars live in the city, don't have cars or driver's licenses, bingo if you're a republican. this is hard by confined to pennsylvania. in the 201 election cycle, there were at least 1 0 voter
suppression bills is introduced in catch this, 41 states practically the whole map all which were introduced all of which were introduced by republicans under reince priebus's sterling leadership. according to the advancement project which i trust that's what's going on. meanwhile the supreme court effectively nullified the best bulwark of suppression in the voting rights acts. >> lawmakers argued the law is not necessary. judith disagrees director of the advancement progress. judith, let's go to the blatant stuff here. aren't you the, i know you're nonpartisan. aren't you stunned that a politician a chairman of a party in a major state like pennsylvania openly giggles the fact that he's got a law that looked like it was on the books till the courts set it aside that discouraged democrats generally obviously minorities in big cities from voting and he
was thrilled that it shaved half of obama's fleur reality off the ledger? >> the problem chris with that question is you asked if i was stunned. no, i'm not stunned. they are playing our song again, chris. we've been talking about this for the past two years. the gop efforts to make sure that certain groups cannot vote. making it harder for them to vote. we saw this admission right before the election and now we have it again that someone has admitted that's what this scheme was about, to target particular voters so they can't vote. advancement project is in court right now taking care of this case. you know, here we have our expert saying over 680,000 already registered voters wouldn't meet the i.d. requirements. they knew what they were doing when they passed that bill. >> i no he that the african-american community is justified in the anger over the verdict down there in sanford over the weekend. i'm just learning from it. i'm in a learning position on the african-american experience from friends of mine who never
told me before how they've been stopped unjustifiably, have been humiliated for no reason at all except skin color and ethnicity. but i have to say since this is my job that politics matters too, not just the courts. if you want to the affect laws like in harrisburg, no the just laws about voter d. i.d. but about stand your ground, you got to get control of the state legislatures and get involved politically or the other side does what it feels like doing. a.b. stoddard, are you amazed watching these people flag respectly admit what they're doing to protect against cheating or voter corruption, they're doing it with the attempt to help their party screw the democrats and minorities to boot? >> i really think if you look at their comments and if you look at the demographic changes in many states throughout the nation but particularly in the south wit remains the last sort
of republican strong hold where state legislatures because of the premium court are now free mostly republican controlled to do what they want to further restrict voting, i think this is long-term a very difficult issue for republicans and a good issue for the democrats. democrats are already making this an issue as a voter turnout mechanism. they will in 2014 and 2016. they're telling people they want to suppress your vote. get an i.d., get in line. make sure you get there. i think that republicans if they do act with this new sort of liberation from the court decision last month to further restrict voting in particularly in states in the south with the demographics changing because of african-americans and hispanic populations there are going to pay in the long-term by not being able to bring those voters into the tent. it is in my opinion much harder to get the day off on election day, to get there if you're sick, pregnant, old, the weather's bad to transport yourself there and wait in line than it is to get an i.d.
this is not something that you have to show i.d. to get into a lot of buildings. you have to show i.d. sometimes to use your credit club at sam's club, at costco. it's much harder to get there on election day and get your vote cast than it is to get a voter i.d. >> do you buy that or not? >> i don't buy that. we have plaintiffs in our case in pennsylvania and in wisconsin and in texas all whom have had a difficult time trying to get i.d. yeah, if you live in a big city, maybe you do have to use i.d. when you go into officeables. not everyone's gone into big office buildings and getting on airplanes. a lot of elderly people have a hard time getting their birth certificate in order to get the i.d. this is a plan. and i agree that this is about race. this is about demographic shifts. this is about trying to have their last stand to control and have power. and so at the end of the day, yes, politics does matter. but it's who you try to target
and that's what's making it illegal. you know at the end of the day, election day is supposed to be equal. we're all supposed to have the same amount of power when we go into the booth. >> you know what, a.b., i think you have a point there because i think eventually we'll have to have i.d. cards down the road. this is the direction this is all going in. look how republicans in places like pennsylvania have tried to change the electoral college to go congressional district by congressional district rather than state by state. clearly intended to nullify the effect of the urban minority vote because if you go by cd, in pennsylvania you've got 23 cds, i mean 13-5. so clearly they did that even though obama carried the state as a whole you could argue because of minorities having a role to play. they know what they're doing. the same people pushing the i.d. laws are pushing the change in the electoral college so that only the suburbans and rural voters seem to have the clout. >> well, chris, it comes as no surprise to you that political
parties in 2013 with trying to hold and consolidate their power with whatever tools they have. look at the house of representatives where mitt romney won more congressional districts than president obama. but congressional democrats won more votes than those districts. those districts are very finely drawn to advantage the republican party. they have a virtual electoral lock on the house right now. there are not enough swing seats for democrats to compete because of the they were written. they're not representative of the speier country and the way the election turned out last november but they're a very different republican party than what we see countrywide. it's not going to be a surprise that each party is going to use whatever tool they have available. i think long-term it is going to become more difficult for republicans particularly in the south to ignore changing demographics. i think it is also hard to argue that you go to the ballot box and you're forced to show an i.d. when you're not forced to run a check for buying an
assault weapon at a gun show. at the same time there are drivers, i mean at motor motor vehicle departments that offer nondriver's i.d.s. they are required for a lot of. >> you have to get on the subway, go to the department of transportation. >> if you live in texas you have to drive for miles. >> it's harder to get on the voting booth on election night. >> ask people in texas who have to travel for miles and hils to go to a dmv office to get an i.d. not true. >> i do think the republicans are trying to diminish the vote of the african-american as a citizen take away their effective citizenship and i hold reince bre bus the chairman of the party personally responsible for this. he has not lifted a finger to stop this effort in the 41 states. thank you for all the information. up next, from impeachment to immortality, bill clinton gets the ultimate washington honor. he gets to become a building. and be sure to catch our fim edition of the chris mooth
matthews show this weekend. join me as we address the big question, race in america's future. and also celebrate 11 great years on the air with a champagne toast, if you will. plus watch as my guests turn the tables and ask me all the questions this sunday. i'll have last thoughts as we close out what i think has been a great run. this is "hardball," the place for politics. my mantra? trust your instincts to make the call. to treat my low testosterone, my doctor and i went with axiron, the only underarm low t treatment.
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make and it will continue to. just take a look at the side by side of tsarnaev with the other two rolling stone covers. the big question is why is the magazine elevating him to rock star status? a good question. the great mayor of boston called the cover a disgrace and several news stands and pharmacies have decided not to sell it. cvs explaining music and terrorism don't mix. got to happened it to cvs on that one. on a more positive note, nelson mandela turns 95 tomorrow, the great man. the milestone will be celebrated tomorrow night in times square with an encore presentation of "the power of words," a video installation that will simultaneously appear on the many big screen billboards that make the busy thoroughfare so famous. the attention-grabbing exhibit which was first displays in april features animations of mandela's own words. here's his grandson explaining the intention of the project.
>> the peace represents my grand dad's words throughout his life and we've kind of correlated and created a really unique speech which will play out over a number of screens and will hopefully transform some of the values that i think my grand dad tried to carry throughout his life an. >> what a great opportunity to call nelson mandela your grand dad. the add space was donated by the times square advertising coalition. the video was produced in part by robert deanywhere low's tribeca film institute. up next, should kids be required to go to school? one utah lawmaker doesn't seem to think so. republican state senator aaron osmond has come out against compulsory education in the state claiming that mandatory education causes some to shirk prarntal responsibility. he explained his thinking in an op-ed. "some parents completely
disinengage themselves to ensure the education of their children. some parents act as if the responsibility to educate and even care for chair child. dr. brian boles disagreed. quote, i don't think that parents wake up in the morning and send their kids to school because they are worried about getting a i citation. they feel like that is the best for their kids. utah's public school system happens to be the lowest funded in the entire country. finally, from the impeachment to immortality. the epa's washington headquarters right down there on pennsylvania avenue has been renamed for former president bill clinton in a ceremony just today. the name change means that the environmental friendly 42nd president will join the ranks of ronald reagan, dwight eisenhower and teddy roosevelt who also have federal buildings named after them. the dream of every politician to wake up some morning and found
yourself as a building. what happened to the 11th commandment of ronald reagan? we now know how starting wars is something that runs in the cheney family. that's ahead. you're watching "hardball." the place for politics. mmmm, nice car. there's no doubt, that's definitely gonna throw him off. she's seen it too. oh this could be trouble. [ sentra lock noise ] oh man. gotta think fast, herbie. back pedal, back pedal. [ crowd cheering ] oh, he's down in flames and now the ice-cold shoulder. one last play... no, game over! gps take him to the dog house. [ male announcer ] make a powerful first impression. the all-new nissan sentra. ♪ the all-new nissan sentra. "stubborn love" by the lumineers did you i did. email? so what did you think of the house? did you see the school ratings? oh, you're right. hey babe, i got to go. bye daddy! have a good day at school, ok? ...but what about when my parents visit? ok. i just love this one... and it's next to a park.
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. i'm hamp top pearson with your cnbc market wrap. the dow up 18 points, the s&p adding 4, the nasdaq gaining 11 points. construction on new homes fell to the lowest level in ten months. new construction dropped nearly 10% in june. du pont shares surging 5% on word that investor nelson peltz amassed a large stake in the company. he has neither confirmed nor denied. ebay shares down after reporting second quarter revenue in line
with expectations but warning of challenges in the second half of the year. that's it from cnbc first in business worldwide. now back to "hardball." >> i am running for the united states senate because i believe deeply in the values that have made our state and our nation great. i am running because i believe it is necessary for a new generation of leaders to step up to the plate. i'm running because i know as a mother and a patriot we can no longer afford simply to go along to get along. we can't continue business as usual in washington. i'm running because i know we are taxed more than enough already. i am running because i know wyoming needs a strong voice in washington. someone who knows how to get things done and isn't afraid to fight for what's right. i will never compromise when our freedom is at stake.
>> brilliant opportunityism. welcome back to "hardball." that was the daughter of former vice president dick cheney liz cheney violating reagan's 11th commandment, that shall not speak ill of any fellow republican hitting mark enzi for being part of the old guard. that refers to the deal enzi helped broker on health care in 2009. enzi who has a 92% lifetime rating from the american conservative union said he thought he and liz were friends and had this to say to nbc's kelly o'donnell yesterday. >> she said that if i ran, she wasn't going to run but obviously that wasn't correct. >> did she call you, sir? >> no, well, he called me a long time ago and said she was considering it. >> what's your relationship with her. >> i thought we were friends. >> cheney's trying to turn enzi into the newest version of robert bennett. remember him telling richard lugar of indiana, senators who were primaried and beaten from the right. alan simpson, the outspoken
former wyoming senator a personal friend of both the cheney family and senator enzi had this to say in the "new york times." it's a disaster a divisive ugly situation. all it does is open the door for the democrats for 20 years. yesterday simply release a statement saying he cares deeply for both liz and mike enzi and has nothing more to say about this. and the state's lone member of the house of representatives cynthia loomis who has senate ambitions of her own called cheney the shiny new pony and slammed her for what she called poor form. >> i don't think she's going about it the right way. in the instance where you have a three-term sitting u.s. senator who has done nothing to merit a primary challenge and you challenge that person without the courtesy of calling them
just before you make an announcement, it's just not the best way to start a campaign. there's a great history of intraparty decorum in wyoming, especially when it comes to these higher profile offices. and certainly that decorum has been broken here. yeah, i think it's problematic. i think it's bad form. >> joining me now to discuss all this is howard fineman and david. let me ask you a simple question. what is her connection to wyoming. >> she went to college in colorado, spent all of her life back here in washington. usually you know a person where they went to high school. that's where you're from. no connection to the state except her father's last name. what's dick cheney up to here? is this some effort to create a satellite of his own political
career? what's he up to? >> well there are a couple things there. first of all the connection is a family connection that goes back to the mid-19th century. that's true. liz cheney chose to live in jackson hole wyoming which is a little bit like saying i'm going to go live in the hamptons and understand the heart beat of new york state. i mean, jackson hole is not exactly casper. it's not even laramie. so there's that. and i think the cheney family is busy trying to resurrect itself to reclaim its reputation. as indeed on a parallel track, george w. bush has been. these are people who are determined. these are fish constantly swimming upstream. it's in their nature. and the cheneys are trying to establish a new generation. and i think these days, people mix the prominence of politics with the prominence of the media. i think liz cheney's desire is to get back here to washington
as a united states senator and she's willing to violate all the rules of life in wyoming to do it. >> you know, you've got spitzer and weaner running after their embarrassments but they didn't have a war with all the casualties of that war on their conscience. cheney never apologized for iraq and nonsense that led to the argument the brilliant propaganda campaign he marshalled to get us in that war and to stay in that war. i mean, they don't apologize for that. they don't say they made a mistake. they don't say anything. they just want more it seems to me. your thoughts, david. give me more. >> well, this is the opposite of an apology. and as you know, because you read it in the book that i did with mike isikoff hubris, there's a scene in which dick cheney sits around with all these sort of neo-con academics and friends and they say, don't worry, dick. history will prove that you were right about iraq and everything else.
and i think this is sort of a short cut to get to that point. to get the cheney name associated with victory, not with tragedy in iraq and liz cheney, i mean, she is more cheney than cheney. i mean, in terms of what she's said during the iraq years and what she's been doing ever since. i think while a lot of neo-cons and a lot of conservatives have actually adopted somewhat more moderate or more measured positions, she is out there still playing the birther card against the preds. she he had this tweet a few months ago saying the president's more interested in disarming americans than disarming al qaeda. this is the guy who bumped osama bin laden. she's still like back in 2003. but completely unrepenttant. >> you know cheneys remind me of lynn and dick, they remind me of superman in a movie as played by marlon brando and eva marie saint. packing their kid in a little
missile to send him off to america or somewhere. they're like they packed her into this little missile and sending her off to wyoming to continue the life form. >> i think, chris, i think while i do think this has to do with the family and don't forget, that liz cheney was always and has always been since the iraq war became such a deep and wound and controversy in american life, she's always been her dad's strongest public defender. she helped him on his book. she is loyal, fiercely loyal and that's part of the equation. but i think she wants to be a figure in her own right. she probably will look -- >> can she be a terry partier. >> she's not she's not. that's the thing here. it's not quite like dig lugar who was an establishment figure. he was. it's not like bob bennett who liked the idea of making deals. mike enzi is pretty much with a
couple of exceptions pretty much a down the line tough wyoming conservative and he's well liked there. and i know cynthia loomis well and i can tell, by the way, she would like to run for that senate seat eventually but had the good grace not to run over mike enzi to do it. there are less than 600,000 people in wyoming. i've spent a fair amount of time there. i don't think they're going to like it. i don't think the tea party is going to like it. as a matter of fact, rand paul one of the leaders of the movement immediately backed enzi, immediately denounced liz cheney because don't forget, it was cheney and the whole neo-con establishment who tried to prevent rapid paul from getting that seat in kentucky and backed the establishment figure there. >> howard, you're so smart as you always are in small states like south dakota or wyoming, personal civility, the way you behave, your treatment of other people people is the key to politics. i use as an example sxwraun
thune who didn't complain about losing a questionable can be election to tim johnson. because he handled it like a gentleman, he was elected heavily against daschle. i think you're right. it's about form. it's about being a good person, close-up where people are watching you. she hasn't passed that test. >> if i thought the tea party was going to back her, it would be a different equation. she doesn't fit the tea party mold and enzi doesn't fit the victim of the tea party. >> more time for you next time, david corn. thanks, howard. up next, lindsey graham says the united states should consider boycotting the olympics in russia last year if put tine grants asylum to edward snowden. it's yet another example how much the republicans, i don't know what they miss. anyway, this is "hardball," the place for politics. tomorrow. which is why he's investing in his heart health by eating kellogg's raisin bran®. mom make you eat that? i happen to like raisins. [ male announcer ] invest in your heart health. now that's what i'm talkin' about.
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skin reactions like blisters, peeling rash, hives, or mouth sores to address possible life-threatening conditions. talk about your alcohol use, liver disease and before you reduce or stop cymbalta. dizziness or fainting may occur upon standing. take the next step. talk to your doctor. cymbalta can help. herself noticenous as we can see as she talks about the trayvon martin case and the voting rights act again yesterday. her poll numbers are looking good too in states that matter in 2016. let's look the at the scoreboard. in the key swing state of virginia where hillary clinton has a five-point lead over new jersey governor christie covereding to a new poll. that's five points for millry. clinton 45, christie 45. against rand paul the republican with the hot hand right now on the right certainly, not even a contest. clinton kills the guy. 14-51. i'm sorry. 581-37. we'll be right back.
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we invest more in the u.s. than any other place in the world. in fact, we've invested over $55 billion here in the last five years - making bp america's largest energy investor. our commitment has never been stronger. we're back. nsa leaker edward snowden applied for a temporary asylum in russia. today russian president vladimir putin tried to strike a diplomatic tone. for weeks he said he would never turn snowden other to us. but today he said bilateral relations in my opinion are more important than squabbles over the secret services. we warned mr. snowden any action by him that could cause damage to russian/american relations is unacceptable for us. the tone was much harsher from
lindsay graham who said america should consider boycotting the "locku olympic games that will be held in russia. >> i love the olympics, but i hate what the russian government is doing throughout the world. if they give asylum to a person i believe committed treason against the united states, that's taking it to a new level. >> that such as was rebuked by many people including the u.s. olympic committee tweeting quote, boycotts didn't work in the 1980s. boycotts only hurt athletes. a veteran correspondent over in russia, simon, i worked for jimmy carter as a speech writer. i don't think i liked it but once you start skipping olympics, you ruin the olympic games principle which is we don't get involved in politics. >> there's truth to that. nobody thinks the united states will boycott the olympics over
this. but the mere threat to do it, the mere suggestion it might become a debating point in the united states does hit vladimir putin in a place where it hurts. he has poured millions of dollars into that city in southern russia to get things ready for the olympic games. it was a city that needed millions of dollars in development. many of those business contracts have gone to people close to vladimir putin. so the idea that there might be some scrutiny over u.s. participation in the games may give vladimir putin -- may give him some pause for thought. >> one thing's clear is snowden still has many supporters in the united states. former new hampshire senator gordon humphries lobbying to give him asylum. grand snowden asylum. he would do the people of the united states a great favor to resist their government in this matter and at this moment. mean whooim, a quinnipi pea pol
last week says snowden was more of a whistle blower prp only 34% believe he was a traitor. and those numbers are pretty consistent across party lines. simon, it's so fascinating to look at the numbers. this is one of those rare moments just like whether you like a sports team or not. it has nothing to do with ideology. republicans and democrats are about the same proportionate in support of him as a whistle blower as a traitor. >> it is fascinating. it's also fascinating to look at the way he's perceived internationally. there's no question those numbers would just be reflected in international public opinion as well. what an extraordinary thing to see the president of the united states barack obama traveling to south africa just a couple of weeks ago and facing protests there in part because of this international perception that he has enlarged the security apparatus in the country. that perception boosted by the
documents that edward snowden has revealed. there's no doubt those revelations have made life harder on the president. >> what do you make of more to come? that snowden has a lot more in his quiver that he could shoot off. >> the obama administration has said they're very concerned about what else he has in his quiver that he could as the president put it, dribble out over the course of the next few weeks or maybe months. even when he's granted -- should he be granted temporary asylum by the russians. one of the questions that i think is fascinating at the moment is how much do the russians know about what he's got? he's spent the best part of three weeks at that airport in moscow. it beggars belief that the russian fsb hasn't at least been inquisitive what is on those four laptops he's purportedly transporting with.
and in russia they would be eager to get their hands on that material. >> it reminds me of the guy flying the piper landing there in red square after all the security in the old soviet union. and the guy that flew his plane into the white house that time. everyone talks about how impregnable they are. this guy can scare the world. thank you for that reporting. we'll be right back after this.
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this they show how republicans view voter suppression as they ticket to success. here you have a party chairman saying that merely the attention given to a voter i.d. requirement cut in half president obama's margin of victory in this state. 41 states had voter suppression bills introduced by republicans last year. do you think people are going to forget which party wanted them to be shutout from their democratic rights? do you think parents might be telling their teenage children right now perhaps on the verge of voting for the first time next year to remember who wants them to vote and who doesn't? this effort by the republican party across the country counts by reince priebus is an assault on black america that is historic, deliberate, unforgettable and you could say unforgivable. keep your eye on this one. and that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "politicsnation" with al sharpton starts right now.
thanks, chris. and thanks to you for tuning in. tonight's lead, a divided jury. four days after george zimmerman was set free, cracks are appearing in the jury that brought back a unanimous verdict of not guilty. last night in an interview on cnn, the woman known as juror b-37 said she'd thought trayvon martin was partially responsible for his own death. >> i believe he played a huge role in his death.