tv The Ed Show MSNBC October 29, 2013 2:00pm-3:01pm PDT
thanks so much for joining us this afternoon. coming up right now, my friend and colleague, "the ed show" with my friend, ed schultz. good evening, americans, and welcome to "the ed show" live from new york. let's get to work. ♪ one of the traditional methods of imposing statism or socialism on a people has been by way of -- >> reagan changed the ideological trajectory of a country. >> we've got great unfinished business in this country. we are behind every country, pretty nearly, in europe. and this matter of medical care for our citizens. >> but that fight is worth fighting for! >> obama care is the test of this new liberalism. >> insurance is real important. >> and today it hangs in the
balance of a website or a promise here and there. >> it doesn't mean any government takeover. >> what the president said and everybody said all along, there are going to be changes brought about by the affordable care act. >> if the president knew that these letters were coming, that raises some serious questions about the sales job of obama care. >> these folks need to stop scaring everybody. >> why are you cutting these people from their insurance? >> well, dave, we're not cutting people. we're actually transitioning people. >> create minimum standards of coverage. minimum services that every insurance plan has to provide. >> if he does not succeed with obama care, expansive liberalism, i think it will be set back a full generation. >> i refuse to see this country in all of us shrink from these struggles, which are our responsibility and our time. because what we are now talking about in our children's day will seem to be the ordinary business of government.
>> wow. jfk versus ronald reagan. talking about medicare and health care back in the day. two political icons in american history. and, of course, it was realized under lbj. and i think that we're going through a little bit of this right now. big-time. 30 years from now, we're going to be thinking about, gosh, obama had a lot of negativity on him. you know, there is so much negativity right now taking place in the media, i find it absolutely amazing. it's almost as if we're afraid to say a positive statement about health care for millions of americans. let's start with the numbers tonight, if we can. obama care by the gallup poll was at 41% with the american people back in august. in october, it was at 45%. it's gaining in popularity. the more we hear about it, the more people realize it. but i know we're fixated on websites right now.
you know what, i think that network reporters throughout the entire industry may be caught in a dilemma that obama care is so positive and going to have such a tremendous impact on american life and american society in setting the foundation for better changes in the future, i think that network reporters and people on tv are having a hard time saying something nice about it, or positive about it, because they might be viewed as journalistically compromised. they're not really showing a great deal of integrity if they say something positive about obama care. here's the point. there are absolutes. and if you go to a free health care clinic, and if you run into someone who hasn't seen a doctor for seven years and that person has stage four breast cancer, believe me, it will change you. all of that's going to be changed under obama care. but in the meantime, there's an
awful lot of misinformation floating around television about obama care these days. so let me just take a few minutes to set the record straight tonight. let's start with perception, about what america is going through. when i was in london last week, i tweeted out, man on the street conversation in u.k. why does your media want health care to fail? now, where in the world would they ever get that idea? take a look at some of the reporting over the last few days. >> millions of people right now can't eat -- are holding their hands up in distress, number one, because they're losing their insurance policies. >> more than 2 million americans have been told they cannot renew their current health insurance policies. >> and that is more than triple the number of people said to be buying insurance under the affordable care act. >> you discovered the white house officials were aware that between 40 to 67% of individuals will not be able to keep their policies. >> the real problem is that people weren't told the truth.
you can remember, they were told they would be able to keep their policies if they liked them. >> oh, lots of accusations floating around. who is lying. lots of numbers being thrown out there. whether they're correct or not, well, let's get to the chase. let's start tonight by giving you the paul harvey rest of the story. 14 million people in this country purchase insurance on the individual marketplace. if you purchase health insurance from an individual marketplace, there are no changes made to your plan. you can keep it. amazing, isn't it? you're grandfathered in. however, if your insurer, meaning the insurance company, makes changes to your plan like changing a premium or deductible, or your plan is no -- and your plan is no longer valid -- okay. you would get a cancellation notice and that's what is going on right now. and be forced to upgrade to a
plan with standards under the affordable care act. folks, this is all about standards. these 14 million people that buy insurance on the individual marketplace, some of them are going to get these notices, because they have -- i can't use the "s" word. they have crappy insurance. raising the standards of health care in america and making sure insurance companies live up and actually deliver what they're supposed to is what obama care is all about. now, i would assume if a network anchor were to say something like that they might get called on the carpet for saying something positive. all plans created after 2014 will have to meet the standards, which is good for consumers. oh, that's positive. we can't say that. the whole point is that we're going to be getting rid of junk insurance plans that really haven't delivered anything for the american people in a positive way. for example, "consumer reports"
analyzed a number of low-quality plans. they found in some cases junk plans are worse than no insurance at all. for example, if you were on a fixed benefit indemnity plan, it could look something like this. the cost of your plan is still going to be $450 a month. you can get $100 a piece for five doctors' visits. $50 a year for screenings and tests. and $1,000 a day for up to 30 days in the hospital. and you might think when you sign on to this, oh, that's really good. really? let me put that in perspective. the average hospital stay costs over $1700 a day. if you get really sick, this plan is going to hang you out to dry financially. and on top of it, you still pay $450 a month for health insurance which is junk. the whole point of health reform is to do away with plans like this. they are essential health
benefits offered with obama care. this is what we call new standards that must be provided to consumers. why doesn't that get reported by all the people who think that, well, 40 to 60% of the people are going to be losing their insurance. over 2 million. 2 million people in this country, charlie, have got lousy insurance and obama is trying to do something about it. that's your headline on cbs, dude. first, ambulatory patient services are going to be included. doggone it, they're going to give you a ride to the freakin' hospital. you could get covered without being admitted to the hospital. this, of course, is another good thing. emergency services are going to be covered. hospitalization is covered. this includes even surgery? oh, yeah. maternity and newborn care is on the list. mental health and substance use disorder services are also
covered. prescription drug costs, they are required on this plan, as well. rehabilitative services are covered. this includes things like physical therapy. laboratory services must be covered. preventative and wellness visits are going to be covered and the pediatric services must be covered. the two biggest kickers in all of this, and it's just a quick bullet point out there, no lifetime limits on coverage, and preexisting conditions are covered. these are the standards that obama care is bringing to the marketplace. this is an upgrade. we're upgrading, honey. what do you think about that? you know those people that i saw at these free health care clinics would have given anything for an upgrade. number one, they couldn't afford it. and number two, they didn't know how to get it. in many cases. and they hadn't seen doctors for years. this is a key element. if you are a low-income earner on a junk plan, you can qualify
for subsidies to help purchase a quality plan with those damn standards that i'm talking about. and in the long run, health care reform is going to be great for america, and republicans know it. what do you think krauthammer was talking about? people are going to be healthier, and in the long run, health care costs, what are they going to do? they're going to go down. but, of course, the liberal congressional budget office was the people that put that report together. we don't want to pay attention to them. they're really not nonpartisan, according to the conservatives. this has republicans scared out of their minds. they don't know what to do. krauthammer laid down the battle lines this morning. he said if obama care fails, liberalism will be set back a generation. >> the irony is that his signature achievement, obama care, is the test of this new liberalism, and today it hangs in the balance of a website or a promise here and there, so
there's kind of a practical reality check on his ambitions. if he does not succeed with obama care, the cause of the kind of expansive liberalism, the kind of entitlement state he has been looking for, i think will be set back a full generation. >> this is not about entitlements. this is about excess. this is about people being denied. and this new liberalism that's out there. heck, i thought kennedy had a pretty good dose of how he wanted to take this country in the right direction. and now president obama, i guess you could say, generationally speaking is taking us to round two. what are they afraid of? they are afraid that this is going to be so popular, and that they are on the wrong side of history, that they won't be able to recover for generations. because the democrats and president obama will be accredited with doing something really, really big for american families.
krauthammer knows this is armageddon for conservatives. if they don't stop it now, ooh, that tidal wave is coming in and they're not going to have a big enough wall to stop the wave of positive -- positive things happening with obama care. you know, it's easy to get on tv and throw out one number after another number after another number. i had an interesting conversation today with the governor of kentucky. i was so moved by what he was saying and the impact that the rollout of obama care, the affordable care act in kentucky had been like. i'm going to go to kentucky. i have to go to kentucky. and i want to see this in action. how can kentucky get it so right, and a number of other states who are rejecting obama care get it so wrong? get your cell phones out. i want to know what you think. tonight's question. is the media doing enough to combat the lies about obama care? text a for yes, b for no to
67622. and you can always go to our blog at ed.msnbc.com and leave a comment there. we love that. we'll bring the results later on in the show. for more, let's bring in the former vice president of corporate communications for cigna health insurance, wendell potter. mr. potter, good to have you with us tonight. i'll take the liberty to say that you know obama care, you know the affordable care act better than anybody. and i appreciate your time here tonight. i want to know about these people that are getting the phone calls. i'll go to you, the expert. who are the people getting the phone calls that their insurance isn't going to be any good anymore. he is plain that to our viewers tonight. >> well, frankly, they're people like my daughter, who got a notice that her plan will be discontinued. and here's why. it's because her plan was among those that are inadequate. the commonwealth fund recently did a survey or study showing up to 30 million americans are in plans that are inadequate. as soon as they sign up for these plans, they're in the ranks of the underinsured. meaning, as you said, if they
get really sick, they're going to be on the hook for a lot of money. >> your daughter had junk insurance, mr. potter. >> she did. >> okay. but that's the bottom line. and so everybody in america, and there's 2 million people of the 14 million that are in the free market right now, have lousy plans. so this is about standards. president obama -- obama care has brought standards to the industry that must be met for consumers, correct? >> that's exactly right, ed. and this is welcome news. it is one of the reasons why we had to have health care reform in the first place, because a lot of companies, including those that i used to work for, have made a lot of money selling junk insurance. selling coverage to people that doesn't protect them. and the reason is because those plans are very, very profitable. insurance companies do not have to pay very much on claims. people in those plans often think they've got protection. and they find out when it's too late they don't. >> mr. potter, how is the media
misrepresented this story? >> they've misrepresented it, because they just have not done their homework. and i tell you, we can't give the white house a pass on this. because this is something we knew would happen. we knew that insurance companies would be sending out these notices, because they have been selling junk coverage. and so the white house should have been on top of this a long time ago. i would give them a failing grade on crisis communications or damage control right now. but the mainstream media has an obligation to tell the truth about what's really going on, and to put this into appropriate context. these 14 million people who are in the individual market, that's less than 5% of the total u.s. population. of those, more than half of them, probably well more than half, will get subsidies to help them buy coverage. so they not only will get better coverage, they'll pay less for it than they're paying now for crappy coverage. >> so this is a key point. this is the other side of the
story. this is the rest of the story. these 2 million folks out there who are getting these notices are going to be going -- being able to go into these state exchanges and they're going to be able to go through the federal system, and they're going to be able to get insurance, in many cases at a cheaper rate with standards and better coverage, correct? >> right. >> how in the world could reporters leave that out? how in the world could reporters leave that out? >> because they're being completely irresponsible. or are just wanting to make sure they get a headline or the lead story on the 6:00 news or whatever. it is just completely irresponsible reporting or shoddy reporting. >> mr. potter, thank you for joining us tonight on "the ed show." i appreciate it so much. and i do think -- >> thank you, ed. >> that if you go to a health care clinic and you run into somebody who hasn't had insurance or seen a doctor for years, and has got stage three or four breast cancer, and is i've met these americans, this is a game-changer for them. and it will change you. it will change how you view all of this.
this is why i get infuriated. because i know these people haven't been there. i know they haven't gone face-to-face with the american people. it's easy to sit there and just throw out a number. well, 2 million people are going to get screwed. they're getting notices. and obama should have known this. why don't some of these network reporters get off their ass and go down to some of these clinics and meet the real people who are going to see the benefits of obama care. is there a moral component to that? whoa, that's too heavy a question for a network story. remember to answer tonight's question there at the bottom of the screen. share your thoughts with us on twitter at ed show and on facebook. want to know what you think. tell me if i'm wrong. coming up, the shock jock game. >> shock of all shocks. >> quote, sticker shock. >> sticker shock. >> shock me, shock me, shock me, with that deviant behavior. >> i am shocked. shocked. >> shocked! republican senators who voted
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for headlining a gala fund-raiser on the eve of the anniversary of hurricane sandy. >> and republican name-calling continues. >> the senator didn't lash out at his critics. least not most of them. he says there's no comedy with harry reid, i think he's an absolute [ bleep ]. [ bleep ]. >> pardon my french, but you're an [ bleep ]. >> the number-two trender. statue limitations. >> the statue of liberty has probably the most identifying symbol of america. >> phyllis shafly, the grandma of conservative gods, loses the meaning of lady liberty. >> the statue of liberty memorializes the unique liberty we enjoy in america. has nothing whatever to do with immigration. it is the statue of liberty, not the statue of immigration. >> we don't fall for that stuff here. >> and today's top trender. shocker. >> i'm shocked. >> shocked. >> the republican two-word culture returns. >> the reports of sticker shock for those who are young and
healthy are widespread. >> sticker shock. >> sticker shock. >> sticker shock. >> you would be shocked to know what it costs. ♪ joining me now is dr. kory a bare, ceo, and professor at lsu health science center. great to have you with us, doctor. appreciate your time tonight. is it disingenuous in a mislabel by the media and by the conservatives to use the term "sticker shock?" >> yeah, it is. because guess what? you're getting a better product. i mean, it's not sticker shock when you want to buy a rolls-royce and you get the rolls-royce. i mean, obviously, the subsidies are going to help pay for the insurance of the people. and that's why we have got to get the website fixed, and, you know, i'm not excusing obama care -- obama for this website debacle. but at the same time, the more we enroll people in the insurance, the price will go
down. so it's not sticker shock. and we've got to get the website fixed so we can enroll more people. >> now, the affordable care act has standards that we haven't seen before. it's going to weed out the junk insurance. i want to know, what's your reaction as a doctor to that? what does that mean to you, the provider? >> well, i'm really upset about it. because the issue is 90% of americans never read their insurance policy. so they don't really know they don't have maternity care or they don't have prescription drug coverage until they get pregnant, and need some medicine, okay? so the issue is -- think about it like car insurance. if you have a rolls-royce, you can't have honda coverage. you have to have rolls-royce coverage. same thing with insurance for your body. you cannot just walk around with no insurance, because if you do, and you get sick, then everybody else has to pay for it. sounds very republican, right? nobody wants to pay for people that they don't actually have to deal with. so the reality for me is that the republicans really should embrace this. because this is what they actually came up with. >> well, the republicans,
obviously, use the term "government takeover." now they've got sticker shock. when they were talking about government takeover, they were talking about the standards that are going to be put in the industry that must be met by the insurance industry for consumers. and so this is a law it telling people how they're going to have to operate. this is -- they called that the government takeover. you as a doctor, what do you call it? >> i don't call it anything, except throwing away garbage people were being sold for many years and not knowing they don't have a standard. everything needs to have a standard, especially when it comes to dealing with your health. you can't have people that think they have good insurance and they don't. there's always a standard. and that's what we're doing. >> the first show that i did on msnbc in april of 2009, i pulled out my health care bill and i showed the numbers on there and i asked the audience if you thought this was fair. and oh, by the way, this was our rate back in 2007, 2008 and now
in 2009. that was sticker shock. >> exactly. >> and i just want to say, nobody is going to be getting those kinds of increases 18 to 20% increases, which we saw in many cases on the individual insurance market. factor in the bush years. and i think that has to be said. that's not being talked about enough by the democrats out there. you want sticker shock? let's go back and take a review of exactly what the insurance rates were from 2000 to 2008, and then when we started talking about obama care, they started to come down a little bit, because the insurance industry was nervous about what was going to happen. and then the standards came in, and now the report is, well, there's 2 million people out there getting a nasty notice. they're getting the notice, because they've got junk insurance. now -- go ahead. >> think about this. i mean, i bring the facts, ed. think about this. the kaiser family foundation did a study in 2008 that showed, a family of four actually had insurance that doubled to $13,000 in 2008, and an
individual had insurance that doubled to almost $6,000. now, if you do the math right, bush was president from 2001 to 2009, so unless it dropped in the last month of his presidency, that didn't happen. >> but i didn't hear any of these conservatives talking about sticker shock back then. >> exactly. >> that was just the free market at work. >> that's what it is. exactly. >> dr. kory a bare, thanks for joining us. coming up, the decades long fight over the redskins team name. and later, the fox news medical e-team gets an f in tonight's pretenders. but next, "ask ed live" just ahead on msnbc. stay with us. twins. i didn't see them coming.
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tonight, our first question comes from carmen. and it is, why is the gop targeting the big three. because they want to privatize absolutely everything they can get their hands on. you see, privatization means instead of this money in social security going into a government fund that's going to be dished out later on benefits, it would go to like wall street and they could play with that money and if the market goes up, you'll be better off. if it goes down, you want to take that risk, then you wouldn't have any social security. they believe in profit. that's what they're all about. they're not so concerned about security. our next question from mike bogger from virginia. apparently he says the virginia governor's race is being watched by the country. who do you think will win the election and why? well, the recent polling has terry mccaulive, a good democrat and believer and business and people and education and all of the things the republicans have been going after is what he has
been standing up for. and kuch necessarily -- i mean, come on. this guy has taken us to ground zero on the war on women in virginia. and some of the radical things that he has said and done and advocated for has turned off a lot of voting blocks. but the bottom line is, you've got to get out and vote. you can't talk your way to the championship. so those folks in virginia, if they really want change, this is the time to get out there and get it done. i think terry mccaulive will win. i want to him to win. stick around. i'm kayla tausche with your cnbc market wrap. the dow surged 111 points, the s&p hit a new high, gaining 9. the nasdaq added. 12 single family home prices saw their biggest annual gain in august since 2006. prices jumped 12.8% from a year ago. meanwhile, retail sales edged down .1% in september. that's thanks to a drop in auto sales. and blackberry shares are up after the "wall street journal"
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with our auto policies. so call liberty mutual today. and if you switch, you could save up to $423. liberty mutual insurance. responsibility. what's your policy? welcome back to "the ed show." thanks for watching tonight. this is a special group of folks in america. nfl owners. a group of people who just cannot be offended. they run the world, in their world. you can't hit an nfl owner -- you can hit him as hard as you want. completely out of their character to be told what to do. there is a level of arrogance afforded by power and money. and washington redskins owner, daniel schneider, is no exception. schneider is world an estimated $1.2 billion. good for him. he's not used to being told what to do. this nfl owner is more interested in money than political correctness and satisfying a crowd out there that thinks his team's name is
wrong. but recent criticism of the redskins name has put schneider on the hot seat. the nfl is scheduled to meet with the oneida indian nation on wednesday regarding the team's name. now prior to that meeting, in fact commissioner roger goodell met with schneider and according to the "washington post" schneider said he has no plans to change the name. in the past he has made it very clear, he has no intention of changing the team's name. earlier this month, he published an open letter to "the washington post" and asked those offended by the name, to, quote, try and have respect for what the name means, not only for all of us in the extended washington redskins family, but among native americans too. now, if you look up the word redskin in the dictionary, the term is widely identified as offensive slang. joining me now is dave zi ron, sports editor of "the nation" magazine and you can find his work at edgeofsports.com.
dave, good to have you with us tonight. i remember doing sports 25 years ago. there were protests outside the metrodome in minneapolis, northern minnesota, native americans came up saying they didn't like the name washington redskins. this has been going on for a long time. why all of a sudden, and i say it over the last year or so, after 20, some, 25 years of this conversation, why is it such a heated conversation right now? >> it's a great question, ed. because the story has exploded over the last year. and there are really three reasons for why this is the case. the first is the active intervention of native american tribes. the oneida indian nation, the choctaw indians of oklahoma and midwest. they have stepped forward and they have said, you know, what this is not okay with us. the oneida nation has bought commercials and dc radio, sports radio air time and they have actually also organized demonstrations in places like green bay and one coming up november 7th. but there are two other reasons, as well. the first is that the team is relevant for the first time in 20 years. i mean, back when george h.w.
bush was president and that is was the last time washington was in the super bowl, there are protests and sit-ins at the super bowl. you can go back and look this up. no one has cared about them in 20 years. fast forward to today, robert griffin iii is their star quarterback, and people are asking why this name. and the last reason why is about the man you just talked about, tan schneider. i mean, he is like teaching a master class in anti public relations. every time the guy opens his mouth he's almost like a caricature of the kind of arrogant 1 percenter who puts everybody's teeth on edge. >> dave, can the nfl force him to change a team's name? it's not like them to pick on people in their own fraternity. and this report now says that he is simply not going to change the name. what authority does the league have, if any? >> the league, unfortunately, has no authority to actually push him to change his name. here's who has authority. the federal courts have authority if they dome that the
name is, in fact, a slur. you're not actually allowed to name a product after a slur. that's a law. and so if that court case goes through and it's termed to be a slur then he would have to change the name. something else that we would have to change the name. if he wants to move the team out of the maryland suburbs, where they currently are and into washington, d.c., the d.c. city council has said already, we will not allow you back into the city unless you change the name. >> all right. dave ziran, thanks for your time tonight. now d.c. delegate house of representatives congresswoman eleanor holmes norton and james peterson, director of africana studies and associate professor of english at lehigh university and msnbc contributor. dr. peterson, let me ask you first. to the point, is the term redskins as bad as the "n" word? >> uh, yes. if they were called the washington black skins and had a menstrual on their helmet or the washington white skins and had some colonial white person on
their helmet i think black and white people in america would see it for what it is. it is a racial slur. we should have zero tolerance for this. we would hope the nfl, mr. schneider and the redskins' organization could take a leadership role on this. we want them to get out and lead on this issue. they shouldn't be pressured by different nations by different american indian nations. they shouldn't have to be pressured by the federal government. it's the 21st century. there is a way in this language, the i am image, as well as the name does as much violence as the name washington bullets did. you saw the basketball franchise had to change. there is a recovery time for brands, though. we should be sympathetic in some ways for. but at the end of the day, what's right is what's right and their name is very wrong. >> and government reaction coming in. nancy pelosi recently told the hill, it would probably be a good idea if they changed the name. president obama said he would think changing the name, if he were the owner. congresswoman, do these teens of voices make a difference? >> well, not only do our voices
make a difference and some of us have even filed a bill, but i think increasingly, the voices of the people make difference. and i hope that dan snyder doesn't put himself in the same category as george preston marshal, who was forced to integrate the team the last of the teams to be inlt grated. because he wasp playing on federal land. and said that he would integrate the team with the harlem globetrotte globetrotters. integrated with whites. i mean, he was an avowed racist. i don't think that's what dan snyder is. but he's good to go the same route that george preston marshal did. because the patent and trademark office on four different occasions, when he tried to patent the name anew, since 1999, has turned down such request. and the trademark appeals board
has already found the name to be disparaging. it was overturned by a court only on a procedural technicality. technicality. if they follow their own precedents, and a new case was just argued in march -- >> yeah. >> this name is going, going, gone. step up before you're compelled. >> well, it seems like he's not going to do that. he has told the nfl commissioner, he's not going to change the name. the only way to hit him is in his pocketbook. i mean, and do you think that sponsors would start putting pressure on him? >> after a while. but let me talk about his pocketbook for a moment. imagine if, in fact, those of us who love the redskins and count me among them v to get rid of all of those hats and shirts and other paraphernalia and he's got to make them anew. he's going to make immense. so far from losing money, this is a good business decision, as well. >> but the arrogance of nfl
owners is nobody is going to tell them what to do. i mean, look, james peterson, look how they were in denial for a long time about head injuries. and really didn't want to do anything about that. >> yeah, but the -- >> the federal government can tell you what to do. >> a federal statute can tell you what to do. >> okay, so congresswoman, you think that the redskins are going to be forced to change their name. >> i do. based on all the precedents out there. there are recent precedents. i don't see how the trademark appeal board can do anything else and the statute itself, which has been found to be constitutional. >> okay. >> says that you cannot profit from a derogatory name. >> all right. mr. peterson, what's ahead for the redskins here? >> well, i think -- my sense is that what nfl owners have got to come to terms with in their sort of 1% bubbles is that these franchises really exist as public/private partnerships. i mean, they're privately owned, but they don't really exist without the public.
they can't really function without the kind of municipal and statewide support they give for their stadiums and other things. so in the spirit of that, i would hope that mr. schneider would not have to be forced to do this but take the opportunity to transition the team now. the team is not doing so great right now so it's a good year to do it anyway. at least change the mascot and image on the helmet. that would be a good gesture moving in the right direction. so hopefully he'll do what's right here and the nfl will not be begin to continue to beshirt much its brand. >> well nfl owners demand stadiums or public financing or they're going to move their team. they're not used to being told what to do. congresswoman eleanor holmes, she believes that they're going to change the name. this is interesting. let's see where it all goes down. i think the guy is so arrogant, i think would rather sell the team than change the name and be known -- and be known as the owner that changed the name of the team. congresswoman eleanor holmes norton and james peterson, thank you for joining us tonight. coming up, giving up the
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this is the story for the folks who take a shower after work. the next capitol hill induced fiscal crisis is just around the corner. i just know you love to hear that. expectations i would say are very low for the bipartisan group in congress given the task of presenting a new path forward. republican house budget chairman paul ryan and democratic senate majority leader harry reid are both ditching the grand bargain talk. >> i hope that we can do some stuff to get rid of sequestration and go on to do some sensible budgets. budgeteteering. i've got a wonderful leader from this budget committee, patty murray if the state of washington and think she'll do a great job nor us, but i don't see a grand bargain happening. >> still talking about a balance plan. requiring new revenue as part of a long-term budget blueprint to
replace the sequester but no one expects that to happen. the 29-member group, their first meeting is tomorrow and don't have anything planned after that. joining us tonight david stockman. author of the best selling book "the great deformation: the corruption of capitalism in america." honor to have you here, mr. stockman. you've been through eight shutdowns. >> i've been through eight of them. there is not going to a grand bargain. there is going to be a bipartisan dance of the ostriches with their head in the sand stumbling forward until the next crisis. >> so we get the instant replay machine. >> i think we do. and they're out there saying raise the fence. reverse this tiny pinprick in the sequester.
but what are they thinking? we would still have the defense budget after the sequester which is 50% higher than it was in 2000 in real dollars, before the whole bush war machine got cranked up, et cetera. they didn't get the memo the cold war is over. the american people said stop it, syria. we don't need this war machine. they can cut substantially, but instead the republicans will fight to raise it. democrats want revenue. they blew it in the fiscal cliff bill when they extended permanently $4 trillion of tax cuts for the upper part of the households in america. low income people weren't going to be impacted anyway, we never should have extended those taxes. you can't get them back now. it's permanent. and so there's no revenue except trivial loophole closing which will never happen because the lobbies dominate the process. and then finally, if i could just say, president obama stuck
his toe in the water on entitlement reform, but it was the wrong toe. he said, you know, chain cpi. well, that means the person on minimum benefits is going to get hit if they had no other income. $9,000 a year, they're going to get hit. whereas a retired in florida living on a golf course getting $50,000 a year on social security and medicare is going to barely feel the nick. there should be means testing where you take the savings out of the top. so what we have is a total stalemate. we're going to do nothing on entitlements. they're going to try to raise -- >> so your forecast from your answer is you think we're going to be doing a number of these cycles all the way to 2014 to see if one party gets absolute party in the legislative branch. >> i think we'll do them through to '16. my argument is if we wait until 2017 to address this festering
problem and the debt deniers are wrong, we have a huge long-term deficit problem. if you wait until 2017, it means you're going to hope nothing bad happens, no recessions. seven years of recovery, a lot of jobs created, everything built into the cbo forecast which i think is a rosy scenario. so i think we're drifting into danger. and yet, unless they do something now, how can anything be done? >> how would you fix it? if there's no new revenue, how do you fix it? >> you have to have a massive demobilization of this war machine. we don't need it any longer. >> even keeping the country safe in this environment? >> of course we can keep the country safe on $400 billion a year. we don't need $600 billion. bill clinton was keeping the country safe on $400 billion. second, we have to means test the entitlements. there is nothing in the trust funds. that's confetti. we have to means test and go for the affluent recipient, reduce his benefits under medicare and
social security and then finally we need to have some more revenue, but it's going to be hard to find. >> well, there's a lot of money sitting offshore that's not taxed. that's for another discussion. i want you to come back. i enjoy visiting with you. we will do it again. mr. stockman, thank you very much. that's "the ed show." "politicsnation" with reverend al sharpton starts now. good evening, al. >> good evening, ed. and thanks to you for tuning in. tonight's lead, the truth about the gop effort to kill obama care. it's not really about the health care website. it's about the entire law. today republican leaders made that clear. >> you know, the problem with obama care isn't just the website. it's the whole law. >> and the bottom line is the problems with obama care run deeper than just the website. >> hear that? this isn't about the website