tv All In With Chris Hayes MSNBC March 2, 2015 5:00pm-6:01pm PST
a walk out by the right? or a takeover not seen since gold water days? that is "hardball" for now. thank you for being with us "all in" with chris hayes starts now. tonight on "all in." shocking new footage of another office involved shooting. and the white house puts out a plan to curb police violence. >> the moment is now for us to make these changes. we'll talk about all of it with ben crump. then the netanyahu campaign comes to america. fact checking his predictions on iran. plus the latest on vladimir putin and the murder of his top political foe. and as balm care returns to the supreme court, why republicans may stand to lose even if they
win. all in starts right now. >> good evening from new york. shock, outrage, and a lot of questions tonight. at about noon yesterday, police were called to 5:45 south san pedro street on a reported robbery. after officers responded to the location they say they attempted to detain the suspect. here is part of the altercation that ensued.
>> oh my god! [ bleep ]. >> we pause the video at the sound of the first shot but multiple shots were fired. prior to the shooting you can hear people saying drop the gun numerous times. andrew smith described the altercation. >> during the attempt to detain him, had did not cooperate, they tried to taz him, and then there was a struggle over one of the officer's weapons. three officers were involved a supervisor and two police officers. the suspect was struck and he was pronounced dead at the scene by the fire department. >> security camera footage is available. there was multiple eyewitnesss
that reacted realtime and after at the shock happening before their eyes. >> they just killed that man. >> one of those witnesses seems to corroborate part but not the most crucial part of the account. he describes the actions of the man on the street known as africa. >> they tased him a couple times. the officer was saying give me like my baton, like i need back up, why are now not helping me. >> did you see him -- >> not at all. >> the central question is culpability of an unarmed suspect. the kinds of questions that have come front and center following a string of cases in which unarmed black men are shot and killed by police with various claims of justification. the most recent being the
shooting of a 12-year-old. now the city of cleveland, in a legal filing in it's capacity as a department in a wrongful death lawsuit made an assertion that sounded shocking. plaintiffs' decedent's injuries losses and damages complained of were directly and caused by the plaintiff's failure to exercise due care. in other words the boy was responsible for his own death. the mayor of cleveland himself today, frank jackson, felt a need to apologize. >> to protect all of our defenses we use words and phrased things in a way that was insensitive. we are apologizing today as a
city to the family of tamire rice and the citizens of the city of cleveland. >> joining me now is benjamin crump. your response to the filing by the city of cleveland? >> it was shocking chris. to say this 12-year-old kid who has now become the face of police excessive force in america is responsible for his own death, especially after you watch what you see on that surveillance video, chris. that is very important. it is 1.7 seconds that they come and shoot this child that is on a playground. and it is riveting because you see the gazebo there. when the car comes up as reckless as it does if there was any other children on that playground they would have been
in harm's way. it is just troubling on so many levels that you're now going to blame a 12-year-old child, based on what we see on this video. >> mr. crump, this is a legal filing in a city where they're dchts in a claim of wrongful death by the family you represent. is it not the case that were you, the attorney for the city of cleveland, you would be essentially duty bound as an advocate to make precisely the kinds of arguments that the city of cleveland is making here. >> or you can say we made a mistake. you can be honest with people and say this is a terrible thing. this is not what we want our police officers to do. you can come out and, you know i mayor offered an apology that i know we will talk about later, but what you want a city and responsible leadership to do is when you make a mistake, when you have failed your citizens to be honest.
go and say that this officer, this shooter, we made a mistake hiring him. you know he had been force to resign three months prior to the city of cleveland hiring him as a police department. and his employment records, chris. they say he was untrainable. he was not fit to be a police officer. this is the person that shot this child in 1.7 seconds. even more troubling than that chris, is what happens when his 14-year-old sister runs out of the community center screaming they killed my baby brother. they don't show her any compassion. they don't show her any care as you would think a compassionate person would. they tackle her. she tries to get pup they put her in handcuffs and drag her in the snow in the back of the police car and she is handcuffed in the back seat of a police car the way you see on the surveillance video, and she
watches her 12-year-old brother kicking as he lays dieing in the snow. >> given that set of facts, i have to ask if the rice family accepts the mayor's apology. >> what they want instead of apologizing for word choices and grammar, they want a sincere apology saying we failed. we have an epidemic going on across america as you show with los angeles. and then i have a representation of the family in pasco, washington where a medical examiner kal-- mexican national name he is running from the police he puts his hands up and they continue to shoot. so people like other noted
lawyers have to fight to make a record of this stuff. but before we didn't have video, so it is rifting that we have video now and so hopefully more people than just the victims in our communities are saying this is wrang what the police is doing. >> should cleveland forfeit their case come forward and settle the case. saying this is a wrongful death. we're sorry, and settle civilly with you and the family? >> i think what they were really apologetic and sincere, they would want to do a quick resolution and say actions speak so loud we don't need to say anything. we know it was wrong what happened. we know that the officers should have tried to deescalate the situation. look how recklessly the driver drove on the scene. what protocol was he following.
we want officers trained properly so we don't continue to see these things happen over and over again at such an alarming rate. >> we also have news tonight in what is arguably the most polarizing closely follows police shooting in recent memory. death of michael browne at the hands of officer darren wilson. a local jury declined to indict wilson. they hoped that they might bring a civil right's case against wilson. the justice department did not find grounds for a civil right's violation, but they are finishing a report into the broader practices of ferguson police. the teenager of course michael brown.
today president obama's task force on police shootings said that such shootings should be investigated by independent prosecutors and that was just one of many recommendations. >> there was recommendations around racial profiling. that is a step we have taken at the federal level. if you talk to the fbi, if you talk to our federal law enforcement, it may be challenging for them to change old practices, but they are confident that they're able to continue to do their job effectively. >> joining me now is barry scheck. great to have you here. >> great to be here. >> let's start with a task force and work our way back through that news. you work intimately on the other side of police investigations and prosecutors for years. different jurisdictions and quality of prosecutions, different procedures, right? different levels of corruption.
what can the government do when you talk about the crazy spectrum on policing. >> they have 18,000 different policing agencies. people get money from the federal government, these agencies. the hope is that you will be able to incentiveize them to change practices in return for getting the money. and also that the justice department, and it is already beginning to do this will set out certain training programs that will really bring some closure to some of the worst problems. take the cleveland shooting. everybody that has been part of what they call tactical policing, really invented by this great genius who was a new york city police officer, got a ph.d. the first thing that you teach police officers when they arrive upon a scene of a report of man with a gun, in this instance teenager with a gun.
when you pull up your police officer, you get to a position of cover, behind the police car. you yell clear and loud commands. police, freeze. don't move. but not drop your gun. i can't think of any explanation for what they could give for what happened in cleveland. what ben crump said is this is what i they should do. they should say we admit this was wrong, we will pay money damages. we will try to cooperate with those that came in in the department of justice in december. the justice department issued a 14141. a notification of practices that they did not have adequate training, they were using excessive force. it was recent but the most important thing that this 21st
century policing report of the obama administration points out is remedy. how can we get these remedies to work? we had a lot of consent decrees across the country. in jails. in new york in new orleans, louisiana where you have decent decrees and nothing happens. what the 21st century report is trying to point out is that we need to get everybody involved. the reviews to see if they can come up with new remedies that work. >> so the question becomes at what level does the problem lie? there is one analysis that says it is in insufficient and spotty training. the other says the problem lies deep ner aer in a overpolicing of the nation. and practices and policies that created the largest prison population in the western world. you can train if you want but
that will not get to the root here. >> that is true we all know there is mass incarceration -- >> not everybody. >> not everybody, but when you try to talk about remedy this is not simple. we had the ruling on stop and frisk in new york. now we have another judge looking at how to enforce it. it may sound crazy to you, but we have to get the police unions involvemented involvement involved. we have to get to the street narrative in the head of officers that it is training protecting the community and themselves. >> and that gets down to the nub. watching that video in the los angeles shooting right? i don't know i can't read the minds of anyone involved in that but i can plausibly think that officers thought their life was in danger even if from an objective third party standpoint they weren't.
it seems like a gap between those two things where this happens. >> people point out there was a special group there that takes care of homeless people that tries to deal with mentally ill people. so i know what these are like. usually they're procedures with nets and -- they tried to tase him twice. apparently the officer involved was on probation, he was new. also in cleveland, the officer that never should have been hired in the first place. >> and that points to big flaws in the practices and training. >> we'll see you on thursday. we're godoing a special on the innocence project. >> thank you, chris. if you bring the cameras there, i'm not sure -- >> there was a stay of execution, he will not be we'll will running our original reporting on that and we'll see
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>> the concern is not only does it look like it politicizes the relationship but what is also a problem is when the topic of the prime minister's speech is an area where the executive branch the u.s. president and his team have a disagreement with the other side. i don't think it is permanently destructive. i think it is a distraction from what should be our focus. and that should be how do we stop iran from getting a nuclear weapon. >> the president eluding to a tale of two diplomatic missions. john kerry in switzerland
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are expressing anger at netanyahu. and more than 40 members of congress, now planning to skip it all together. in a warm up address today at the conference of the israel public affairs committee, netanyahu insisted he did not mean to step on president obama's toes. >> i am not intending to show any disrespect for president obama or the office he holds. my speech is also not intended to inject israel into the american partisan debate. >> he maintains that iran poses a threat to israel. and is widely known to be the only middle eastern country with a nuclear weapon. he argued that the whole diplomatic flap and the damage it has caused is worth it to try and block a deal.
>> the purpose of my address to congress tomorrow is to speak up about a potential deal with iran that could threaten the survival of israel. iran envelops the entire world with it's tentacles of terror. this is what iran is doing now without nuclear weapons. imagine what they will do with nuclear weapons. and the same iran vows to annihilate israel if they develop nuclear weapons, it would have the means to achieve that goal. >> one official saying we feel that members of congress are not fully aware of the details of the emerging deal with iran. but benjamin netanyahu is not the most reliable source of information. back in 1992 netanyahu advised that iran was three to five
years away from reaching nooukuclear weapons capability. that was 20 years ago. they still have not gotten it. in the intervening decades, he has continued to warn they're on the verge of making a bomb most notably in 2012 when he used this highly technical graphic. they concluded that iran was not performing the activity necessary to produce weapons. joining me now my next guest, susan rice says a bad deal is better than no deal. what are the contours of the deal and how does anyone from the iran side american side score it as good or bad.
i think the obama administration made it clear what a good deal is as far as the u.s. is concerned. that is a one-year break out time. one year from when they decide to build a bomb. they need at least a year to do so. and that would give the u.s. enough time to impose sanctions, or attack iran or whatever. whatever they need to do to stop iran from doing it. >> just to be clear, what the u.s. is saying is a situation in which iran has some domestic nuclear capabilities that is monitored in such a way, were they declared out, we're no longer doing this it could take them a year to get to -- >> at least a year yeah. the assumption would have to be that right now they have daily inspections on the iranian nuclear sides. you would have to kick out those before we attacked them. then you would assume what they're kicking out, and you're
withdrawing from the npt, that you would have a bomb. >> the izy don't necessarily trust the u.n. monitoring -- >> it's the iaea. >> yes, and the iranians to stick to a deal. >> the history has shown they have stuck to a deal. they have stuck to the joint plan of action that was signed in 2013. november of 2013. they have abided by that treaty. it's not a treaty, sorry, by that agreement to scale back the nuclear program to stop enriching at 20%. so they have abided by that. so what -- why believe they're not going to abide by a deal. and if they don't, we'll know. how will we not know? it will be very clear. this is the number of sentrycentrifuge centrifuges you have.
this is the stockpile you can maintain, what is there not to know? you can argue if they're doing something in secret that no one has done no intelligence agency in the world has been able to discover and they're not a hermit kingdom, no one has discovered their secretly building a bomb if they're doing it anyway what does it matter if we can't discover it. >> it seems to me the argument that susan rice makes before aipac is that a deal is the only way to stop them from pursuing a bomb. >> absolutely it incentivizes them not to build a bomb. >> why? >> a deal makes -- if sanctions are lifted as iran demands, because the things we demand from iran they demand in return. lifting of sanctions, back into the international community, banks, oil sanctions, it would
make them economically viable. right now they're having problems. it would bring it out of isolation. when that happens, iran can progress in many ways that it can't right now. it can't even fly it's planes right now because of sanctions, for example. >> if you're benjamin netanyahu, or anyone high up in the israeli government, a deal means this country that is declared an enemy of yours, they want to destroy you -- they will get stronger broadening the national community, their arch of influence that is growing through iraq and other places is stronger, why do you want that? >> i can see that and of course that is why he doesn't want a nuclear deal. the problem is if iran is an existential threat with a nuclear deal, this particular deal as far as he knows the
contours of the deal will be an exten existential threat. if there is not, their nuclear program will accelerate. they will abide because they said they will but that doesn't mean they can enrich uranium all the way to 80%. >> they can do the north korea two step which is be in the treaty, within the contours of the treaty and then say peace, we're out of the treaty we have a weapon. >> if you're saying we don't want a deal what you're saying is the only way to stop them is to go to war. >> a military -- they're not going to stop by themselves. >> military action like targeted strikes will not work. that will also not stop a bomb. then you're talking about an invasion. half a million troops. i think obama is correct in seeing if you're against a deal any deal that doesn't
completely stop them -- >> you're essentially figging a bomb or a military -- >> you're either okay with them having a bomb but one or the other. hooman majd. do you think there are more male or female ceos. how about this more women ceos or ceos named dave? who errs who spends himself in a worthy cause and who, if he fails at least fails, while daring greatly sfx: background city noise ♪
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>> i want to show you a picture of a crime scene. that is the body of former deputy prime minister boris boris nebstoff. he had given a radio interview hours before he was gunned down. he called putin a pathological liar. he said i'm afraid putin will kill me. he was reportedly shot multiple times in the back as he walked across a bridge with his girlfriend. he was slain in the heart of moscow steps from red square, and just 200 yards 600 feet from the walls of the kremlin itself. that is an area that is exceedingly well monitored. no reporters are being told that the cameras on the bridge where he was shot were not working.
putin spokesman says a russian leader is overseeing the investigation. they say they will do everything to make sure that the organizers and perpetrators get their justice. tens of thousands of people took to the streets to honor and mourn him. many believe that putin is directly or indirectly responsible for the killing which is the latest in a series of high profile murders of russian leaders. one was a woman who was highly critical of policies and alexander litvineoko. right now the primary witness is the ukrainian girlfriend who is
banned from leaving russia. the english language version of the newspaper saying that his demise have all of the aeroearmarks of a cia set up. a whodunit. the most extreme interpretation of events would be that vladimir putin or someone would go kill this guy and do it in such a way that is so obvious that everyone will be terrified, and kill him right near the kremlin. >> i think the scenario is likely but it is exactly, we'll kill him so very close to the kremlin to send a message and all of our enemies will shiver.
but we know exactly what they want. >> this gets to this area of say for a moment that it is unlikely that vladimir putin ordered this hit, and say there is theories this might have been personal ex-girlfriend -- anything like that. let's put those aside and say most likely it seems a nebulus force. who are the people that act as kremlin enforcers in connection too, with a wink and a nod, to the kremlin. >> remember when they were killing thomas beckett, the knights did not need an order from the king. they knew kpasktexactly what to do. so he explained how it would be. we don't need to know.
in the formula, you know what he wants. so the way it operates is that it itself is anti-kremlin. in this nationalist environment created in russia putin created which is why he is responsible for this murder whether he ordered it or not. in this nationalist environment for those who are not with us are against us it becomes a very legitimate reason to enemy to be killed. it could be anybody. it could be a nationalist thug. it could be a mid-level security forces. they're thinking their ridding the country of the enemy who is not patriotic. >> there is a big difference between a leader of a country saying do something, and that because there is a national environment creating leek that -- >> there is a league and moral difference. >> the moral, maybe, but the thing, the way it has been
working especially in the last year those who are anti-putin become anti-russian. those who are anti-russian have a necessity to be eliminated. so if you're going anti-communist that means you're anti-soviet and you need to go. basically it is the same kind of formula. so yes, in legal terms, there is a difference but in russian terms, where legality is an iffy subject. >> so then what happens next? >> i am finally with that -- that killed so i became one of those that had a doomsday scenario. i think the reason they have not found a culprit yet, which is very bizarre because it is the most watched area -- >> it would like a republican senator being murdered on pennsylvania avenue half have block from the white house.
>> we have seen that happen. the white house has been stormed by various people. it's basically -- however when those people stormed the white house, they were apprehended very quickly. here it has been three days and nobody knows what is going on. so i think they're figuring out how to spin it to their advantage. they want to blacken putin and it is a provocation. that is where we're at right now. >> thank you very much. thank you. how four little words could turn the politics of obama care totally upside down. that is ahead. here in san diego, we're building the first one ever to run on natural gas. ships this big running this clean will be much better for the environment. we're proud to be a part of that.
agreed. if you missed out on the chat this time check it out on facebook.com/ facebook.com/all in chris. rub all this stuff off. huh, what? nobody thought of this before? what's wrong with people? dish issues? not with improved cascade platinum. it powers through... your toughest, starchy messes... better than finish's best... the first time. as if your dishes were non-stick. cascade. now that's clean. ♪ at mfs, we believe in the power of active management. every day, our teams collaborate around the world to actively uncover, discuss and debate investment opportunities. which leads to better decisions for our clients. it's a uniquely collaborative approach you won't find anywhere else. put our global active management expertise to work for you. mfs. there is no expertise without collaboration.
on wednesday, the u.s. supreme court is scheduled to hear the biggest challenge to obama care since the last momentum obama care challenge that threatened to undermine or destroy the president's signature treatment. last year at this time they upheld the mandate, and there was a sense that the watchers at the last battle had fought and won. now here we are beginning. king versus burwell. it focuses on how part of the statute are worded. they can buy private insurance there an exchange.
if they don't, the feds will open one for them. one big advantage is most people that buy insurance from these exchanges can get help from the federal government. in the provision of the statute that describes this process, it reads the government can help with costs through an exchange established by the state. those seven words, that should allow obama care to help pay for insurance premiums only in those states that have their own exchanges. now, having subsidies available in every state is key and fundamental to the law and being able to function. it was a point so mindfundamental that it was never really covered. as sarah cliff at vox.com puts it there is lots of obama care fights ending subsidies was not one of them. we will continue to cover some of the arguments here and the
stunning bad faith of the plaintiffs. at it's center is the question. what if conservative opponents of obama care finally win. will it be like the perverbial dog that caught the car. nine million people would lose their subsidies. the robert wood foundation thought that two million of them would be unensured. assuming the plaintiffs win, in every state that doesn't have it's own exchange can start campaigning to set one up. give people their health insurance, subsidies, and premiums. and instantly democrats will be handed a huge political weapon. so what is the republican plan if that happens? someone that helped craft the law will join me next.
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helped craft the law, and also michael steele. let's put aside issues of statutory interpretation and plaintiffs that we will table for a moment. what if they rule in favor and they say yeah this is wrong. and you see those people their subsidies get jacked up, some are knocked off, what is the republican plan? >> i think that is still developing. but that is -- after six years, it is still developing. i think what we have seen today, there was an op-ed in the huffington post they started to lay out a plan. it would hold in place and certainly hold those currently on the exchange system so they would keep those subsidies in place for a period of time. that has not been made certain yet, so their situations would
not change. this would not see the immediate extingishing of people's access to health care. >> but they would have to pass that faster than anyone has passed anything in washington in a long time right? >> yeah i mean i think people who are really confident in the congress's ability, the house and senate ability to pass legislation so take a step and look at what happened on a friday night where a very basic piece of legislation could not pass the house of representatives. >> a piece of legislation that was just three weeks of funding. >> let me just say when you have member after member of the house republican caucus spending five years saying obama care is socialism it seems hard for me to fathom how they will magically pass the expansion of subsidies when you have some republican senators arguing this but many more saying this
will be chaos. this will be like -- are we even going to be able to do this why bother. >> i think that is all true. i think at the end of the day, the reality like the shut down reality will force some type of action to hold harmless those individuals currently in the exchange system. you have to do that because otherwise you're right. come june whatever day the decision is made the day after that you will have a situation where everybody is out of the exchange and they don't have health care. >> right. >> so there will have to be -- if the plaintiff in this case wins, the congress had better have in place a seriously within 12 hours legislation to run with. because oregon health care does not stop because congress decides not to act. >> unfortunately it does and i think that's why people are very anxious about nine justices literally threatening the health care of nine million people.
because they looked at this congress that has been unable to do these things and asked themselves why are we in this situation? why is health care threatened like this? and i think it is conservatives that really had a full attempt to not pass -- they can't get this through congress so they're returning to the courts. >> the other thing is -- look you could pass a four-word amendment that said established by the states or the federal government. or the federal government four words, right? if found in the plaintiff's favor, you could just -- >> that ain't happening. >> why not just do that? here is the thing, michael. if that is not happening, the simple technical fix, you create a space in which ted cruz and others will walk and say now we have the leverage burn the whole thing to the ground. >> that is part of the political calculation that the party will have to make. i think at the end of the day, i
don't think we're going to get there. i think the supreme court laid down the predicate to uphold this law, and they go through their analysis of the intent of congress, of the pure language of the law, i think it will be more in favor of the defendant here. >> i have to agree, i think many justices and conservatives recognized they will do profound harm to their party if they gut this law. i think you find republican governors, senators and legislatures saying hold on we can't let the conservative activist destroy. >> michael, you said something interesting to me. people that watched this case
it feels like the momentum and winds are shifting for precisely the reasons that you articulated. that is "all in." good evening rachel. >> thank you at home as well for staying with us for the next hour. there is a lot going on tonight, a, chris hayes is back. b. the controversial address to congress by benjamin netanyahu. that is tomorrow. washington is in full scale tissy over that right now. we'll have more of that ahead. congress through themselves a week long lifeline and we're back again where the homeland security department may run out funding at the end of the week. 2016 politics just got slightly scrambled with foreign policy proving very