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tv   The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell  MSNBC  March 12, 2015 10:00pm-11:01pm PDT

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turn but the tv station in akron, ohio will not be distracted by them. they are heros. in all honestly, their viewers good luck, ohio. that does it for us tonight. we'll see you again tomorrow. now time for "the last word with lawrence o'donnell." good evening, lawrence. >> rachel, i'm officially speechless. >> local reporters are heroes. that's your assignment. go cover the guy who is pooping on the cars. yes, sir, got it. >> i get to stay safely in the studios. >> thanks, lawrence. we're going live to ferguson, missouri tonight, where a candle light vigil has ended peacefully. and two secret service drunk driving suspects are still on the job and the secret service director has not said a word about it. and dramatic new video was introduced today in boston showing the man whose car was hijacked by the boston marathon bombers and how he managed to
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escape and then help police close in on the bombers. >> we're lucky, by god's grace, we didn't lose two officers last night. >> reporter: at least three shots shattered the calm eaving. >> one officer was shot in the shoulder, the other in the face. >> this was not someone trying to bring healing to ferguson. this was a damn punk. >> nor fallout from that controversial letter written to iran by 47 republican senators. >> i think it's very, very damaging to us. >> iran's supreme leader called it the ultimate degree of political collapse. >> we have located the wreckage of the black hawk. >> the black hawk went down tuesday night. >> the conditions out there were very dense. >> at this point, we are not hopeful for survivors. >> it's day six of testimony in the boston marathon bombing trial.
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>> we're hearing more about the ambush killing of a police officer. >> all units respond. >> surveillance video captures the two suspects running from the scene. >> the shine of the secret service has been rubbed off. >> two high level agents crashed a government car into a secure area at the white house. >> another embarrassing incident. >> we cannot keep having this discussion. >> the white house is once again left looking vulnerable. >> she was in the headlines for all the wrong reasons this week. >> i wouldn't give hillary's troubles to a monkey on a rock. >> but do democrats have any other choice? >> that inevitable front-runner is inevitable. tonight, people have once again gathered in ferguson. this time for a candle light vigil that has just ended. last night in ferguson, two police officers were shot.
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[ car honking ] [ gunfire ] [ screams ] >> neither of the wounded police officers were with the ferguson police department. officials have withheld their names. one police officer is a 32-year-old member of the webster grove's police department. the other is a 41-year-old member of st. louis county police department. is shot right here at the high point of your cheek under the right eye and the bullet lodges right behind his ear. and that bullet is still with him. he's going to have to have further evaluation to figure out what they're going to do with that round. the st. louis county officer was struck right here on the shoulder and the bullet came out the middle of his right back, between the scapula and his spine. >> both officers were released from the hospital this morning. an intense manhunt is under way
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for last night's shooter. this morning, a house in ferguson was raided by police who took into custody three people who were in that house. they were questioned for approximately six hours and released no. arrests have been made. this morning, president obama tweeted this -- >> u.s. attorney general eric holder strongly condemned the attacks this afternoon. >> what happened last night was a pure ambush. this was not someone trying to bring healing to ferguson. this was a damn punk. a punk who was trying to sow discord in an area that is trying to get its act together and trying to bring together a community that has been fractured for too long. >> st. louis police chief john belmar said this -- >> my officers tell me that when
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this happened, when they heard the shots, and when they heard the bullets zinging past, that they saw muzzle flashes about 125 yards away. many officers drew their weapons but no officers fired. i'm going to be honest with you, this is beginning at times to be very difficult for any law enforcement agency anywhere to wrap their arms around. i want everybody here to understand how difficult this is to do it the exact perfect way. >> michael brown's family condemned last night's shooting saying, we reject any violence directed towards members of law enforcement. it cannot and will not be tolerated. joining me from ferguson, missouri are msnbc's trymaine lee and a ferguson activist who was at the scene when two officers were shot last night. also joining us by phone is missouri congressman emanuel cleaver.
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quickly to you, tremaine, what is the situation there now >> moments ago, a vigil of about 100 people ended and protesters marched down the road chanting "no justice, no peace," but like so many other proverbial day afters, here we are again in ferguson with folks trying to figure out what's what. protesters and police bracing and how do you pivot from here? throughout the day, community leaders have been meeting to try to figure out a way to minimize the harm here. so i was actually, interesting enough, a resident stopped me in the grocery store and said she's confused. the chief says the shooter was embedded with the protesters but the fire happened 125 yards away. so everyone is trying to figure out what's what. >> can you tell us what you witnessed last night during the shooting?
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>> yes. what i heard were about four shots that went off to -- that went off and i saw the police officer fall. when the police officer fell, another officer called the ambulance. the other officers hid and drew their weapons. i was at the bottom of the hill, so i heard the shots and i didn't see anything up there. i didn't see a car or a person. but that is what happened. what i know to be true is that the hill is not a space where the protesters stay in. it's not where we ever congregate. it's not where we park. it just isn't a place where protesters are. >> and has there been -- were there any discussions with your group and the activists involved about not gathering tonight for safety reasons? >> you know, the protests have been going strong for 216 days now.
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to not protest tonight would feed into this idea that less protest means less violence. mike brown was killed before anybody protested. so we're out here protesting police violence. that's been around for a long time. you think about the seven people that have been killed by the st. louis police since august. that's why we're still out here. >> we're seeing live imagery of people gathered outside the ferguson police station right now. joined on the phone you by representative emanuel cleaver. congressman cleaver, i know you've posted reward money in the hope of aiding with an arrest in this shooting case. but i want to go to the question of tactics and you're a veteran of the civil rights movement yourself, and i'm wondering about what your reaction is to the idea of being out there at night when we now know that -- at least last night, there was a shooter who was using the protesters as cover to try to
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kill police officers, and it's just a matter of luck that those police officers are still alive. >> well, first of all, i'm glad the police officers are going to be survivors of this. but let's keep in mind, the people who did this are hoodlums, low-class hoodlums. as we celebrate and commemorate the 50th anniversary of the march across the bridge in selma, just think about how far behind we might still be had some snipers started shooting at the sheriff clark and others the night after the march. it's unthinkable that someone would consider themselves to be helpful to any cause by shooting at police officers.
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congressman lacey and i put up $3,000 and we are willing to go out and raise more money to increase the money that would be given to anyone who would provide information to the arrest and conviction of individuals who participated in that shooting. we can't allow this to -- the racial tension in this country is perhaps at a higher level than it's been i think since the mid 1970s, maybe back into the '60s. and this racial kitchen is -- my grandmother did embroidery, and the only way we make progress is stitch by stitch. and not bowing down to the people who are creating this problem. the best thing that can happen is for us to turn them in and get them arrested. whoever knows anything about it ought to turn them in.
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>> congressman cleaver -- >> go ahead. >> one part that's interesting about this, and i've seen these protesters and these organizations mature over the last seven months. a lot of it is about how they continue to wrestle with the narrative. for the greater part of seven months, the protesters have been overwhelmingly peaceful. but as the congressman said, it takes one instance to change the narrative and give fuel to those who are already opposing what you all have been doing for so long any way. how do you as protesters, as people who are fueling this movement for black justice, how do you pivot from that? how do you all pivot and make sure you regain the narrative under these circumstances, which to a person no one has appreciated the violence against the police last night. >> see, the thing is, we don't -- we know very few things about what happened last night. we know shots were fired and police officers were hit. besides that, we don't know anything. the remarks last night saying the shooter was embedded in the
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protest community was indicative of his inability to lead what we believe should be thoughtful police -- who makes statements like that without any evidence, without talking to any witnesses? what we know to be true is what was true yesterday is true today. this is a place that racist policing has been proven, not only by lived experience but by the department of justice. we know those things to be true and we believe that is enough to get the movement back on track. there was an effort to derail us in august. there were efforts with other things that happened and we've remained sol it and we anticipate we will remain solid, because the work we're doing is so real. >> but you have some officers who are receiving fire in the middle from the darkness, they see muzzle flashes behind protesters. can you imagine circumstances where police officers truly believe there are gunmen embedded with you all? >> we don't --
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>> that is the danger there. i think for the people around this country right now, including the protesters. i know many of them. these are good and decent people who have the right to go out and protest. but let's think, if one of the police officers, just one, had begun to fire, it probably would have somehow triggers more fire from police. we could be talking about a massacre that is the result of some -- >> let's be clear, there has been a massacre. the police killed 302 black people -- >> duray, i know you're critical of what the police chief had to say last night in his instant analysis of what happened. but do you feel critical of the way the police responded tactically in that moment to
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being fired upon and two of them being hit? >> no, no. the police responded -- the police response last night was a very solid response, and it was indicative of what i believe policing should be. they were -- they showed restraint. they were really methodical in the way they moved up the hill. their response was solid last night. >> congressman cleaver, i want to get a last word from you. with your experience in the protest movement and the civil rights movement, what would you recommend tactically now to duray and other people interested in how to represent their position going forward in ferguson? i mean, would you, for example, say suggest a moratorium on nighttime protesting for a while? any tactical change you would suggest? >> well -- well, i think that any advise that we give is probably going to be viewed as advice from the previous
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generation. but i do think that it would be a great value, of significant value for the protesters to begin to notify police of who they are and where they're going to be. because i think the police, whether they are doing it out of love or whatever, are trying to exercise restraint. so it wouldn't hurt to have john lewis fly into ferguson and do a nonviolent protest lesson for them and for many other individuals, as well. it takes a great deal of courage to be nonviolent. >> john lewis did make a statement today very similar to the president's, advocating nonviolence. i'm sorry, we're out of time on this segment. thank you all for joining me tonight. thank you very much.
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coming up, john mccain says the letter to iran's leaders that he signed, along with 46 other republican senators, might not have been, as he put it, the best way to make their point. and later, the other democrat, there is one, the other democrat who is running for president. so we quit selling cigarettes in our cvs pharmacies. expanded minuteclinic for walk-in medical care. and created programs that encourage people to take their medications regularly. introducing cvs health. a new purpose. a new promise... to help all those wishes come true. cvs health. because health is everything.
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the united states and cuba have reestablished a direct telephone link. for now, calls have to go through a third country which made them expensive and reduced the quality. the now connection is for voice calls but could be used for data in the future. one small step for communication sanity between the two countries. coming up, how has a letter from 47 republican senators to iran's leaders affected the president's ability to negotiate with other countries?
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are you good to go hun? cleaner than ever. rotorooter approved. charmin is clog-free or it's free. to communicate around the president's back, i have trouble with that one. >> it's been done before. >> you could have achieved the same thing, all 47 of you, without rubbing the president's nose in it. >> what that letter did is tell the iranians, whatever deal they make, the congress of the united states is going to play a role. maybe that wasn't the best way to do that, but i think that the iranians should know that. >> maybe that wasn't exactly the best way to do that. john mccain described his decision to sign the letter as saying, i sign lots of letters.
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today, the german for minister said -- >> what senator tom cotton has an answer for anyone who warns him that his letter might ruin the negotiations. and he actually gave that answer long before he wrote the letter. >> the united states should cease all appeasement, conciliation and concessions towards iran, starting with the sham nuclear negotiations. certain voices offer congressional restraint urging congress not to act now, lest iran walk away from the negotiating table, undermining the fabled, yet always absent moderates in iran. but the end of these
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negotiations isn't an unintended consequence of congressional action. it is very much an intended consequence. a feature, not a bug, so to speak. >> joining me now, the atlantic's steve clemens, with msnbc senior editor beth fewy and howard dean. howard dean, a feature, not a bug. >> i'm very surprised at this. first of all, i was very surprised john mccain signed the letter in the first place. he gets what you're supposed to do. he was a prisoner of war in hanoi for a very long time, and i don't think he liked it when jane fonda had a few things to say. i think this is somewhat similar. i think cotton doesn't get it. he's a veteran, he had a decorated career in the army. of all people, he should know you don't do this. if you seven in the army with a commander of chief, you don't do this.
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he has a right to say that, but to give comfort to the enemy, which is the hardline in iran, i think was shocking. just shocking. and i'm very surprised john mccain signed the letter. >> he's having second thoughts. all you have to ask john mccain about the letter and he gets wobbly on it right away. he also said this -- >> beth, the guy every once in a while is honest about these things. >> he's supposed to be the lion of foreign policy for republicans up there. >> except when there's a snowstorm coming. >> what really struck me about this is when john mccain is dialing back, even rand paul a little bit dialing back, and he's running for president in to 16. you have other people who are doubling down saying they would
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have supported the letter if they were in the senate, including rick perry and bobby jindal. so it's not like the republicans who hope to lead the free world are running away from this as john mccain appears to be, they are running towards it. >> steve, one of the striking things is the reaction of the iranian leaders. they could use this to kind of publicly play tougher with the president and with the other negotiators in this, the other countries negotiating. instead, they're dismissing the republican position, and the ayatollah himself is actually hanging in there and saying, you know, he's praising the iranian negotiators who are working on this, when this could be the moment, if he chose, to just pull out of the whole thing. >> honestly, it's a market indicator of the seriousness of iran. the iran that we've known for many decades would have grabbed the letter, stomped around, and
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used it as an excuse for all sorts of theatrics and drama. a serious iran that really wants to achieve something is going to shrug this off. he knows this country very well. the foreign ambassador to the united nations, many of us here in washington know him. he's a pro and he needed to react to a certain dimension for the audience back in iran, but they didn't overplay it and they're showing a maturity we're not used to seeing out of iran. >> howard dean, that is one of the striking sides of this. >> the interesting thing, i actually agree with cotton in a lot of this stuff, but there's very some hard line people in iran. >> why do you think the ayatollah is hanging in there? >> i think their economy, the sanctions worked. under barack obama, for the first time, the sanctions worked. they pulled iran out of the international banking system, which i advise doing with russia, so we don't end up with
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troops in ukraine. their economy collapsed. the rial lost 2/3 of its value, and they had to come to the negotiating table. the interesting thing that's crossed my mind, and i defer to steve, but wouldn't be interesting if these 47 or 45 republicans that signed this letter provided the offset and showed the people who were negotiating for iran, yeah, we have a bunch of far, very, very out there hard liners, too. we both have to throw our hard liners over the edge. >> i agree. we were just talking about john mccain. i think the thing that's lurking in the back of mcmain's minds is one of his life long friends is henry kissinger. he defended him recently from protesters. i think in the back of john mccain's mind, what if tom cotton pulled this stunt when henry kissinger was driving
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normalization with china? i think that's where mccain wishes his name was not on that letter. >> kissinger would have put them on the wiretap last, the henry kissinger wiretap list. that's going to have to be it on that. thank you very much. we'll take a break here. coming up, new video introduced in court today showing how one man escaped from the boston marathon bombers, and then how he helped the police close in on the bombers. when healthcare gets simpler. when frustration and paperwork decrease. when grandparents get to live at home instead of in a home. so let's do it. let's simplify healthcare. let's close the gap between people and care. i have a cold
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today, the prime minister of iraq declared victory over the islamic state fighters in tikrit, which has been under islamic state control for nearly a year. but 80% of the 24,000 troops who helped secure that victory were trained and/or equipped by iran. >> if it's iran that is at the tip of the spear here, if they're the ones sponsoring the victories, they're going to have influence in iraq, and that's going to be very, very difficult, very tenuous, very dangerous for the regional peace. >> they want us to destroy isis, they want to destroy isis. isis is a threat to them and the region. i think you're misreading it if you think there isn't a mutual interest. >> joining us, michael weiss. so michael, iran helps beat islamic state in one battle
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area. what does that mean? >> i think the congressman was quite right. this is iran taking over iraq. this is what i call the hezbollahization of iraq's military. you mentioned that the ayatollah is not backing away from nuclear negotiations and that he blames the united states for isis. shia groups trained and backed by the qods force, iran's elite foreign intelligence operations team, are going around saying the u.s. is dropping aid to isis. one group claimed that they're launching and moving anti-aircraft missiles to target american cargo planes. >> so they don't say that the americans created the islamic state by going in and knocking off saddam hussein. they say we're actively in there, like the 9/11 inside job.
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>> and this curtails with assad's regime from day one. the u.s. and the zionists and the saudis are responsible for the rise of al qaeda. so listen to the rhetoric. these shia militia groups, the ideology that is funding them, fouling them, this is an anti-american ideology. they are asking to kill american soldiers. so we are creating an enormous mess. this battle in tikrit, there wasn't a single u.s. warplane bombing isis. we had not a single u.s. equipped team nor that location. an iranian master spy, a terrorist, described by david petraeus as a truly evil figure, is running the ground war in iraq. this is an enemy in the united states. >> howard dean, how do you sort this snout >> it's very difficult now. we'll see what happens when they take over tikrit completely. these are shia, and
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historically, they've killed as many sunni as they can. the reason was isis was successful is we created this power vacuum by going into iraq. and two, the sunnis figured they were not as bad as the shia government, which may or may not be true. now tikrit will be taken over by militant shia. how the sunni get treated will have a lot to do with how easy it is to take other sunni cities. >> how does the united states influence what happened in tikrit now? >> it would seem the fact that it didn't involve american fighters going in there to take over as much of tikrit as it has is a good thing, and to some degree a validation of the president's foreign policy. but we have a situation we want to get rid of isis as done iran, but for different reasons. we had this change moment where
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john kerry schooled marco rubio explaining that no, we're not sort of stepping back here in order to please iran. there was just such a confusing conversation with marco rubio, who wants to be president, about what the heck we're doing with respect to iran over there in this fight. and it seems that nobody really quite knows where this is going to go. >> michael? >> i have seen the shia militia groups, abc did a six-month long investigation. one video, the shia militia are playing soccer with severed heads. we are creating a sectarian mess in this country. for them to take over saddam hussein's birthplace, the sunnis will not stand for this. >> that will have to be the last word. coming up, the man who might be pitching batting practice to hillary clinton in the democratic presidential primaries.
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so i think you're going to see a robust conversation in the democratic party. >> an nbc nows, "wall street journal" poll shows 86% voters could support a hillary clinton campaign. but senior democrats are worried that hillary clinton is not ready to run for president, fearing the clumsy handling of the nine-day frackus of her e-mails was a warning sign. many democrats who want clinton to succeed lament that she's stepped back into the political arena in a defensive posture. we're joined by josh barrow of "the new york times" on this. josh, i don't know who these democrats are that they're talking about. i haven't heard anybody concerned about this. they have a candidate who has a prohibitively, just huge in the polls. yes, we've had front runners before but never with those
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numbers. >> but what democrats are concerned about is hillary is out of practice and an easy primary will cause her to continue to be out of practice. >> enter martin o'mally. >> as you said, batting practice. i'm surprised how sort of tepid martin o'mally has been. if we were someone really intending to beat her for this nomination, we would have been a lot more aggressive. if he is intending to run against her and maybe get a position in her administration like vice president, like something else, so i think it's remarkable to me the vacuum that seems to exist in the democratic party right now. if i were duvall patrick, i would be salivating. there was an interesting quote from him saying, you know, the electorate doesn't like inevitability.
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>> howard dean, the big campaign investors like inevitability. >> this is just not much different than what you call it, whatever gate it was with investing and suicide, the vince foster. this is nonsense. this is the press froth. the reason martin is wise not to get out there is a, not to offend somebody with a 50-point lead in case he does want to be in the administration. but b, democrats don't think this is an issue. this is nonsense. >> because democrats have decided the freedom of information act doesn't matter anymore. >> no. >> it's very clear. if you care about the freedom of information act, and its proper enforcement, you care about how official government e-mails are maintained. >> i would argue that the press has been so ridiculous about
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this, that most people do not think it's anybody's business to see what hillary clinton and chelsea had to say. >> no one suggests that. >> the ap is suing the state department to find out. >> the ap is not suing the state department for reports about chelsea clinton. they're suing the state department because they filed for documents they have a right to receive more than two years ago. >> under the freedom of information act. >> because i covered her campaign from soup to nuts in 2008. i saw something in her at that press conference at the u.n. a couple of days i did not see in 2008, which was this profound weariness of, i can't believe i'm going through this again. even in 2008, her toughest days in 2008, there was always a fire there, a fire in her eyes that she wanted to keep going. she kept it going to the last primary. here at the u.n., before she's even announced, she's so tired of it. >> i thought what she was going for was kind of cool -- like
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you're not upsetting me. >> i thought she was going for, i hate this. >> howard, the other thing about martin o'malley, if he really wants to knock her off, i think he can't go out there and attack her on anything, because what he needs is for her to make some kind of a mistake, for that campaign to falter so people turn to him. because if he's ever going to move toward the nomination, he's going to have to get people who really like hillary clinton to switch to him. >> that's always the rule. the rule is by attacking somebody that everybody knows you lose, unless you have your own resume out there. he's got a great resume. >> he does. in any other year he has a great resume. >> he's got to be out talking about -- making the case for himself before he goes after the opponent. that's pretty much the rule. >> he also left the governorship of maryland with such a low approval rating that a republican replaced him.
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he doesn't come in with a lot of juice anymore. >> how does a republican win by nine points in maryland? >> it was just not great campaigning going on. >> thank you very much, guys. coming up, new dramatic surveillance video of the attempted getaway of the boston marathon bombers that was introduced in court today.
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replay to that text. suddenly a car stopped behind him and a man jumped in his car and hijacked it, telling him he had just murdered a cambridge police officer and that he was one of the boston marathon bombers. he told his story in federal court today where, for the first time, video was released documenting how he escaped from the boston marathon bombers. >> reporter: it was the dash to safety that he believes saved his life. dun meng from china was driving this suv when the brothers jumped in. they stopped at a shell station in cambridge, where dzhokhar tsarnaev is seen buying snacks. as jurors listened, meng said he had to escape right then, calling it the most terrifying moment of his life. he saw his chance while the car was parked here. undoing his seat belt with one
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hand, opening the door with the other, he dashed across the street to call 911. that's him on this surveillance video running to a nearby mobile same. tamerlan leaps out of the car and the two leave. meng crawls down low in the mobile station, finds a hiding place and the attendant calls 911. >> reporter: then he takes the phone. >> reporter: a short time later, he's safe and police begin tracking the g.p.s. in the stolen car. pete williams, nbc news, boston. >> i know those gas stations so well. stopped at both of them so many
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times. his quick thinking may have saved not only his life, but possibly many others. the information that he gave police led them to track down the brothers soon after that in watertown, where tamerlan was killed and dzhokhar was captured. coming up, today the secret service arrested a woman who dropped something outside the white house last week saying it was a bomb. they didn't bother to arrest her until she became part of the latest secret service scandal. this one involving drunk driving on the white house grounds. i've just arrived in atlanta and i can't wait to start telling people how switching to geico
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and now for the good news. college student albert manero builds and donates 3-d bionic limbs to kids around the world. after he heard about 7-year-old alex, he got a very special guest to bring the young boy a bionic arm, bionic expert tony stark, also known as robert downey, jr.
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>> hey, alex, how are you? pleasure to meet you. i have another bionics expert on hand. >> thank you. >> nice bow tie, by the way. >> thanks. >> i think yours is more right than mine. >> the lights work. >> it's a marriage of robotic technologies. bang, nailed it. >> do you know who that is? >> iron man. >> what is his name? >> robert. >> great. coming up, the latest secret service scandal involving the number two agent in the president's security detail. health can change in a minute. so cvs health is changing healthcare. making it more accessible and affordable with walk-in medical care, no appointments needed and most insurance accepted.
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the only one to combine a safe sleep aid plus the 12 hour strength of aleve. evidently, we're talking about a very, very senior person who is regularly within arms length of the president, and if this person, if it's true, is making those types of decisions to show up on the job perhaps
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drunk, doesn't get any worse than that. >> according to the latest washington post report on the latest secret service scandal, the two agents suspected of driving under the influence and stroking a white house security barricade, disrupted an active bomb investigation and drove beside the suspicious package itself. according to the post, before the drunk driving incident, a woman had driven up to the southeast gate of the white house, got out of her car holding a package and told the officer that there was a bomb. after struggling with the officer, the woman got back into her car, managed to escape after hitting the officer with the door of her car. it was less than an hour later the two apparently drunk secret service agents trove through the police tape that was marking that scene. they hit a barricade and almost ran of the package where it was left by the woman. they did this in the middle of the investigation. about that package, which was revealed to be simply a book. one of the agents in the
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suspected drunk driving incident is mark conley, who was second in command on the president's security detail. the other is senior supervisor george ogilvie. they have been temporarily resigned. another agent who intervened has been not suspended or reassigned at this point. the new director of the service service has had absolutely nothing to say about this incident. joining me now by phone is former secret service agent patrick lynn. what is your reaction to all this? >> i'm hearing mixed allegations on the entire incident. the first thing i heard earlier was they hit a barricade. from what my research was, it has been they hit a cone, a four-foot cone. they were, according to what i'm
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hearing, is they drove into -- they drove very slow into the area, and when they found out that there was an incident going on, they tried to back out and that's when they almost ran of a package. also, i think the weather had a lot to do with it. whether or not they were drunk, from what i'm hearing, i'm not sure if that's been a total fact at this point. >> well, it can't be, because the supervisor intervened and prevented them from being subjected to a breathalyzer and prevented the officers from pursuing a drunk driving case. >> right, right, and i understand that the officer there was told not to give the test. the officer then backed off. now, i'm sure the investigation is ongoing, and at this point,
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i'm not quite sure if this is being blown out of proportion. if, in fact, these agents came up to an area that was suspicious package that had been identified, and they came in and they embarked into the area, they were totally wrong. i'll be the first to say that. >> howard deep, as a presidential candidate, you had a secret service detail. what was your experience with them? >> they were great. unbelievably professional. they're just stunningly prepared and really good at what they did. i'm very surprised at all this. i just don't get how such a change could be made. i've never heard these stories before. >> beth, i don't know anyone in washington who doesn't think this is new. >> it seems that to me, as well. i traveled with hillary clinton, barack obama, john mccain, all
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in 2008, all surrounded by secret service. i found the same thing. incredibly professional. the idea that these guys are turning into keystone cops over the last five years seems very troubling. >> we're out of time. patrick lennon, thanks for joining us tonight. hate mail. let's play "hardball." good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. if you're in public life, you get hate mail. you also have people saying things that aren't true. nothing has been quite so underhanded as passing around this letter to sabotage the serious talks with araujo.

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