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tv   All In With Chris Hayes  MSNBC  April 6, 2015 8:00pm-9:01pm PDT

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cally. >> i have some of the biggest culprits on my desk. i have a couple 00hundred that is amazing. >> each almond costs a gallon of water to grow. >> that is amazing. we need to become aware of how much it takes to grow our food and we can make the appropriate choices moving forward. >> chris hayes is up next. >> tonight on "all in." >> it was not the subject or the source's fault. >> a legal troubles are just beginning for "rolling stone" as they finally retract their "rape on campus" story. let's see. i can't. the third one i can't.
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sorry. plus, growing food in the desert. why are california farms carved out of historic drought regulations? >> some people have a right to more water than others. >> throwing out the first pitch at a stadium with two working bathrooms for 35,000 fans. tonight, why the problems with major league baseball go way beyond wrigley field. "all in" starts now. good evening from new york i am chris hayes. months after rolling stone magazine published a shocking report about a gang rape at the university of virginia. a story that fell apart within days of the publication, the columbia school of journalism released a sober assessment of how rolling stone failed routine journalistic practice. rolling stone retracted the story and apologized to its readers, university of virginia and the fraternity and also
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published columbia's report online which was presented by the dean and dean of academic affairs. >> this failure was not the subject or the sources fault as a matter of journalism. it was the product of failed methodology. we did not feel her role in the story should be the subject of a report seeking accountability for the failure of journalism. it was the collective fault of the reporter editor and the fact checking department. >> it wasn't the source's fault according to the columbia report. the source identified as jackie in the rolling stone article was the subject of further comment today by the publisher. interviewed by the "new york times" acknowledged the pieces' flaws but said it represented an isolated and unusual episode and that the writer would continue to write for the magazine. the problem started with the source. an expert fabulous story teller
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that manipulated the magazine's journalism process. he said he wasn't trying to blame jackie but there is something untruthful. columbia's report on the other hand states the explanation that rolling stone failed because it deferred to a victim cannot quickly account for what went wrong. the editors made judgments that greatly increased their risks of error and have little or nothing to do with protecting jackie's position. it created a media sensation covered here on this program among many many others. it reignited discussions of sexual assault and fraternity behavior on college campuses. >> a major american university has a lot to answer for now that claims of a shocking sexual assault have been made public. >> we are hearing what one student said she went through. >> the university founded by
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thomas jefferson, university of virginia finds itself in total crisis. >> jackie did go to the school and the school did absolutely nothing. >> the statement has apologized to rolling stone's readers. we will talk about that in a moment. they did not apologize to the fraternity. rolling stone, through its publisher, said the magazine's managing editor will keep their jobs. both mr. dana and mr. wenner said that newsroom practices had been amended. the fraternity named in the rolling stone piece plans to pursue all available legal action against the magazine. the virginia governor blasted rolling stone for its abject failure of accountability today.
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what is the big takeaway from the report from your perspective? >> well, i think the columbia authors were extremely careful to say what they felt comfortable saying. i think there was a desire to say that this was a problem that feminists want to believe rape victims too much or that everybody wanted to believe that fraternities are evil. it is possible all of those things are true. but it is not within the purview of what these journalists were trying to do. the takeaway is that the failures here were astonishingly basic. basic. how did you know what you are saying? who did you talk to about what you are saying. did you give that person an opportunity to respond. it is what you learn on the first day of any class or conversation about journalism. >> here is what happens. you hear through someone who told you they heard from someone
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else that something insane happened. you think to yourself your eyes light up. you think that i have the most incredible story. and then you start talking about it. no. no. often it is a much different set of facts. that is the most basic. what i can't get over is how nobody asked the friends for comments. three friends there with her afterwards who are quoted in the piece via hearsay apparently. >> there are problems in reporting on sexual assault there are some unknowable things you have to take one persons word above anothers. but it involved three people -- >> that were not present at the assault. >> there were conversations in which they were being indifferent. they should have an opportunity to comment on what they remember
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happening. and besides covering your ass, sorry, even if she spoke to them she might have found out that jackie was being untruthful about things like i talked to ryan last week. that might be the point in which she said the source is not as credible as i believed and would have done additional reporting. >> it seems to me that there is a strange alignment of conservative critics of the article. whether out of terrible positions or not, many were skeptical at the beginning. there is an alignment between them. and the rolling stone people that want to make it about excess hiv excessive sensitivity to the victim of sexual violence. the report says it was a failure of the basic processes of journalism. >> if the woman was victimized in some way, they have done her
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a tremendous disservice and put her in a position where she is probably getting death threats. it does no one any good to have a story out there that is not true. you know if a lot of programs featured it it was partly out of the public trust that rolling stone would follow these processes. yes. part of it had to do with assumptions. part had to do with the fact that this is a problem on campuses. >> rolling stone article did a disservice not just to the fraternity, which was major, and they may be pursuing legal avenues, but also to victims of sexual assault, present and future. the magazine's failure may have spread the idea that many women invent rape allegations. records report that false rape
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accusations 2% to 8%. joining me now laura dunn. provides legal assistance to survivors of campus sexual assault. what is the lesson from your unique perspective as an advocate on this issue from the arc of this rolling stone story? >> i think the biggest takeaway for this is just make sure that we are doing what we always have done. collect documentation, create timelines, garner evidence and make sure whether we are helping someone through the campus criminal process or going to the media that we provide support for their statements. most survivors are telling the truth. and truthful victims don't often get justice even when they deserve it. we make sure we increase the odds of justice by having that
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documentation and talk openly and honestly about what it would take to go through certain processes and what information they need to hold someone accountable. that is the biggest takeaway everyone can have is to make sure that you are documenting and you are showing that someone is in fact truthful or that something did not occur the way it was told. >> the second point i want to stop and highlight for a moment. being honest with the person at issue who says they have experienced sexual violence been a survivor of sexual assault, about whatever process they are go to pursue will require. in the case of this article that required saying to this source that we are going to have to talk to your friends, we have to relay what you said happen that night to them and track down the people that you say did this to you. if the survivor herself, the person that is an alleged survivor says i don't want a part of that you do not do the piece, i think. >> absolutely. part of the columbia piece
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highlighted the center for public integrity, the organization that highlighted my story for the first time. i am a survivor that never got justice. they looked over 200 documents, called the people i accused and did a thorough job. that is the process for whatever you are doing, it has to be thorough and vetted. there are lives at stake, not just survivors and the justice they are seeking, but those accused and institutions. >> i think one of the things that gets muddied in this conversation is that whatever processes we are setting up they have to be processes with some integrity, transparency due process and some of the protection for the accused we would have in parallel processes in legal proceedings, even as we recognize that those processes do a terrible job of protecting the interest of survivors.
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>> absolutely. that is a challenge that we are faced with. we have had sush a push back of due process. now we have victims rights. we are trying to make sure they are working together to create a fair process. we do care about getting to the truth. that requires having both sides come to the table with information and support and following a procedure. i think the saddest thing that was lost in all of this coverage by rolling stone is that uva had been under investigation for title 9 violations. how sad is that it had to be a nationwide story and one sensationalized above and beyond what jackie reported because the journalist did not want to fact check. for what? there are so many other survivors that spoke out. i think all of it got lost because of the lack of journalist integrity.
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>> i also think that it is striking to me that this example of campus sexual assault that was printed and now retracted was so extreme and so outside the norm of the bell curve if you can call it that of routine sexual campus assault which is not as gruesome as the one that is depicted there, but as gruesome in every way to the actual survivors of them. and that is part of the problem. conceiving of things as crimes themselves. >> i think the media has done a service to survivors by covering them showing how much injustice has occurred. at the same time there is an underbelly of how sensational and dramatic can it be. it really is losing the vast majority of survivors. gang rape is rare. somebody you know and trust and may be in a dating relationship.
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they may be common day occurrences that are not featured because they are not gripping headlines. that doesn't mean the topic shouldn't be discussed. >> also mean its is not a story. laura dunn thank you very much. >> thanks. a night after edward snowden returns to american tv he made a surprise appearance this morning in a brooklyn park. i will explain that ahead. and as another presidential hopeful joins the war on peace talks, why are we not hearing more from iranian voices in the debate? my sister had to come help. i don't like asking for help. i took tylenol but i had to take six pills to get through the day. so my daughter brought over some aleve. it's just two pills, all day! and now, i'm back! aleve. two pills. all day strong, all day long. and for a good night's rest, try aleve pm for a better am.
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i'm sorry for your loss.
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today marked the annual white house easter egg role and the president's reading of his favorite childhood book to those in attendance. all was going well until unwelcomed guests showed up. >> look at them. who can do a wild rompus?
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that was a good rompusing. that is okay guys. bees are good. they won't land on you. they won't sting you. run. run. run. run. >> is it me or a president microcosim of the obama presidency. barack obama has to say it is all right. we are going to take care of ebola. everyone calm down. i am not sure the bees were the wild rompus the president was hoping for.
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should i run for president and be so lucky to be elected. one of my first actions would be to invalidate the president's iran agreement that jeopardized the safety and security of the free world. >> republican potential presidential candidates love barack obama's iraq deal. they love it's existence. rick perry just the latest to pan the framework settled on last week joined marco rubio, jeb bush, a man who graced three of the sunday news shows, benjamin netanyahu. >> the state of our economy should not have access to a vast nuclear capability.
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>> a better deal would role back iran's vast nuclear infrastructure and require iran to shot their aggression. >> i think it is important to change the deal, to toughen up the deal, get a better deal. >> benjamin netanyahu is now a regular booking when his country is not even part of the discussions. when the press coverages focuses on the reaction from israel or on netanyahu's allies it misrepresents the context of the talks. they are not between israel and the u.s. or u.s. and iran. as president obama pointed out, china, russia and our closest european allies are all involved. nobody has to take barack obama's word at face value. they can ask some of our closest allies that helped negotiate and endorsed it. think about that when rick perry said he would invalidate it if
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elected. he would be sticking his thumb in the eyes of france germany and the u.k. now the one country that holds the success of the nuclear deal in their hands. iran. that is who is sitting next to john kerand he who netanyahu warned us about in his speech to congress. there is little discussion of how iran's leaders or people or institutions in iran view the deal with the possibility of their country reopening to the rest of the world. iran's political dynamic has a kind of mirror image of our own. the deal here mobilized certain political factions so in iran it motivated the most conservative hawkish factions of the government whose political strength comes from their opposition to the west. joining me now is the founder and president of the national american iranian council.
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i guess i think there is a tendency to think of iran not a democracy like the u.s. but that does not mean there are not factions within the government. who likes the deal and who doesn't? >> iran has politics like all countries. but i think one important difference between what you described as hard-liners over there that don't like it and hard-liners over here that don't like it. the hard-liners on the american side are dueling the iranian hard-liners, the most important one, the supreme leader is behind the deal. we wouldn't have seen negotiations going this far had they not backed it. on the iranian side they are becoming increasingly isolated. >> okay. then the question is how should
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we interpret this. a lot of us saw the images of the people in the streets after the deal was announced. how should we interpret that? what was the meaning of that? >> people were delighted. this is not just a nuclear deal. this is a deal that ends sanctions on iran and would hopefully end iran's isolation and this young, educated in their outlook population would be able to reconnect with the international community and be part of the global society. at the same time from the iranian perspective safeguards their dignity. it was truly a compromise between the two sides. that speaks to their pride. as a result you saw the images. people were dancing, singing and chanting slogans from five years ago, slogans of the green movement. >> green movement a democratic up rising against the incumbent
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powers that be. we saw some of that state violence covered here on our air and other places. in terms of getting back to the american politics on this there is word that chuck schumer who is in line to be the senate leader is going to back this senate mill that would essentially create a congressional veto or disapproval, although it is unclear how it will actually be structured. what do you make of that? >> part of the reason why the president is not going full out and trying to sell the deal because he is go to need the public to come to his side in order to be able to prevent any congressional sabotage. he can't just deal with congress directly. he has to go to the american public. i think you have seen his case. he is saying this is a good deal. if we don't get this we will be looking to a form of a military
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confrontation and hope he can mobilize the american public to show their support for this. >> one of the things that critics of the deal have noted, and this gets to the internal politicals in iran to the extent there are struggles between reformers and moderates and hard-liners is a variety of other things the iranian government does that we in the u.s. or israel or other states may not like. support of tristerrorist organizations. there is an american reporter from the "washington post" who has been held captive for a very long time. there is a lot of concern against him. how do you think the out look for him, for the basic civic rights in iran look after a deal is inked than before? >> a couple of years ago people were saying when the president reached out to talk to the iranian government that was a
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betrayal of the iranian's people pro democracy aspirations. the images of people dancing in the streets and celebrating the deal is a refeudiation of that. clearly the people want this. they want to break out of the isolation. nothing helps the iranian government increase the population more is not being connect to the outside world. i am not surprised people are coming out showing their joy for this. the chances of seeing domestic change moving in the right direction is far greater once they are integrated with the rest of the world. >> california has been in a drought for four years. >> people should realize we are in a new era. the idea of your nice green grass getting lots of water every day, that is going to be a thing of the past. >> is california over? that is ahead. terprise and you can move the world. but to get from the old way to the new,
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early morning dog walkers and joggers in brooklyn got a surprise today, a bust of nsa whistleblower, edward snowden, museum quality, installed in the park just before dawn. the artist responsible for installing it allowed them to document it. wearing yellow construction visits they hauled the bust into the park and fused it to a stone
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column. monument a memorial to revolutionary war soldiers. the artist said we have updated this monument to highlight those that sacrifice their safety in the fight against modern day tyrannies. by 1:00 the parks department covered the bust with a blue tarp and a short time later authorities took it down. the nypd's intelligence division is intelligenting. it is likely had they not publicized the installation many if not all of the people would not have noticed. because as john oliver pointed out last night despite being behind what is the single most significant example of whistle blowing in american history there are plenty of americans who have no idea who the heck edward snowden is. >> i have no idea. >> i heard the name. i just can't think what it is.
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>> edward snowden. no. i do not. >> just for the record that wasn't cherry-picking. that was entirely reflective of everyone we spoke to. >> given the state of political engagement in the country the group could have come away with similar result fist they were asked to name a supreme court justice or the speaker of the house. john oliver flew to russia and conducted a truly remarkable interview with him. >> how many of those documents have you actually read? >> i have evaluated all of the documents that are in the archive. >> you read every single one? >> i do understand what i turned over. >> there is a difference between understanding what is in the documents and reading what is in the documents. >> i recognize the concern. >> when you are handing over thousands of nsa documents, the last thing you want to do is read them. so the "new york times" took a
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slide, did not redact it properly and in the end it was possible for people to see that something was being used in mosul on al qaeda. >> that is a problem. >> that is [ bleep ]. >> these things do happen in journalism. some mistakes will be made. it is a fundamental concept of liberty. >> you have to own that then. you are giving documents with information that you know could be harmful which could get out there. >> yes. >> what oliver did with snoed sen something sorely lacking in the coverage. he did not lionize him or villainize him. he engaged him. pushed him on what he did and what we have learned from what he did. the same way snowden has to own his actions, so do we as voters and elected representatives for blindly allowing a system of
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is the california dream fueled by cheap and easy water finally over? that is the question being asked by many including the "new york times" as the state is in its fourth year of consecutive drought. governor jerry brown called for water rationing, largely excludeing agriculture and ordering cities and towns to cut down water usage by 25%. it is easy to blame it on plush developments or mansions with lawns and swimming pools. here is the thing. california is an agriculture state. out of all of the surface water consumed in the state, the vast majority of it roughly 80%, goes to agriculture. the remaining 20%, the yellow wedge in that pie chart, that is everything else. lawn, office building pool
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shower car wash sprinkler system, you name it. meanwhile agriculture production accounts for 2% of california's economic activity. while a 25% reduction of cities towns, just that. a much smaller reduction can go much further. a 10% to 15% reduction would be the equivalent of a 50% decrease in residential usage. here is the thing. so far agriculture has been largely spared from rationing. how long will that last? and will california reckon with their post climate change future before it is too late. "new york times" economicic reporter and coauthor of california drought history in test growth. i am so glad you are covering this with so many resources. >> definitely. >> can we start very basic.
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we have all seen china town. we have a vague idea of the west was a desert. someone came in and figured out how to get water to people to make it bloom. where is it and how did they get access to it? >> basically a lot of the water you are talking about is in the northern part of the state, up in the mountains, the big reservoirs and dams. that has to be brought south. farmers, residents, businesses are getting water from a combination of state and federal government projects. >> there is a system of local water authority. but people have say i am a rice farmer. by the way, america, we grow rice in the desert which is weird. say i am a rice or almond
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farmer. i have a plot of land. just to be clear, i am not growing the stuff with what falls from the sky. >> it is irrigated from a river or dam. that is what is used. >> and i have a right to that water? is that in the title that the acreage of my farm? >> it basically goes like a first come first serve. if you have been there longer you have more senior water rights. other newcomers may have junior rights. the problem is that there is no market. basically water for farmers or even for people that live in the cities and suburbs is pretty cheap. say this were gasoline. cars would be bigger and less fuel efficient than they are. everyone would be driving a suburban or escalade. water has been cheap. people are go to use it. >> right now you can also
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imagine a situation in which people start think do i want a market or price on water. i understand that. you can also imagine a world in which essentially there is a difference between how water is treated for these huge agriculture purposes and how it is treated for a resident of los angeles with two kids and a house. >> farmers are paying a lot, lot less even though they use a lot more water. >> now the farmers will turn around and say hey buddy, first of all, screw you. second of all we are growing food for everyone all over the country. everyone loves our almonds. people are lining up to get almond milk. >> or china. >> what is the long-term solution here right? say we got more sensible water policies which you started to price this and see conservation happen. you can sustain the output in california that you have now?
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>> you can. but you mentioned china town. you have a real distrust between the farmers and city folks. vilifying or demonizing the farmers is not going to get you where you need to be. neither is having people in the city telling the farmers what to grow. bottom line is that farmers have to become more efficient. less flood irrigation. even more sprinklers is better than flood irrigation. at the same time the farmers say, for city dwellers what is the down side of saving water? your lawn is brown. car is dirty. we can live with that. if you cut water to farms, people get laid off. >> the idea of saying that you don't water your lawns. it is a lower cost to the person at issue than saying we are going to cut your crop in half. >> you are going to have to send your farm workers to the unemployment line or what have you. >> we will go out to california
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to do a week of story busy this. i am fascinated by it. >> great to be here. >> all right. from the desert the west to the shores of lake michigan ahead we will tell you why that white hot spot there, what that was in the picture was shining so bright you could almost see the lines for the bathrooms. audible safety beeping audible safety beeping audible safety beeping the nissan rogue with safety shield technologies. the only thing left to fear is you imagination. nissan. innovation that excites. kellogg's® frosted mini-wheats®... have 8 layers of nutritious wheat... and one of delicious sweet. to satisfy the adult.... and kid - in all of us. (supergrass' "alright") plays throughout ♪ ♪
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♪ nutritious wheat for the adult you've grown into. and delicious sweet for the kid you'll never outgrow... feed your inner kidult... with frosted mini wheats®. last night the chicago cubs held their home opener at night. me i was parked in front of the television watching my beloved cubs with excitement and increasing misery as they were shut out by the cardinals leaving so many runners stranded on base for the love of god! 3-0. both of chicago's mayor candidates headed to wrigley for the game. election day is tomorrow. rahm emanuel probably did not think he would still be campaigning at this point. he was forced into a runoff.
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polls showed a very tight race. rahm could actually lose. and there is a tremendous amount of dissatisfaction towards rahm emanuel, particularly among the city's african-american voters and his abrasive personality hasn't helped. things got so bad he had to cut an ad apologizing for being a jerk. >> they say your greatest strength is also your greatest weakness. i am living proof of that. i can rub people the wrong way. or talk when i should listen. i own that. >> here is the thing. rahm emanuel's greatest strength has nothing to do with his personality either way. according to the "chicago sun-times," rahm emanuel raised more than $30 million for his campaign compared to $5.2 million for garcia. more than $18 million comes from an elite group of donors many having received a benefit from
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city hall. a powerful hedge fund manager was described as rahm's fixer on economic is shes. the campaign has taken a lot of money from republicans some was used in the ad blitz attacking garcia. it is fair to assume that all that money helped rahm emanuel a lot. polls now show him with a big lead over garcia heading into tomorrow's election. chicago has few limits on campaign spending. this offered a window in how things work on a national scale. a billionaire can hand you a huge check. hey. who knows what they will ask for the day after the election. if emanuel does indeed win it won't change the fact that chicago's finances are totally hosed. they are in terrible shape. in fact they look even worse than wrigley field's bathrooms did last night. i will bring you all of the
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well, people were peeing in cups at wrigley field. i may have seen that happen myself while sitting in the bleachers. wrigley is in the midst of a $500 million renovation project that is nowhere close to be finished. opening night as seen from here from a plane above chicago, the cubs covered up their unfinished bleachers with a tribute to ernie banks. that was the least of the problems. with all of the constructions there were only two working bathrooms in the main concourse. the team had to apologize after fans had to wait an hour or more to pee. some couldn't wait.
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this picture on twitter. i am rather certain this is not flat beer. deadspin with people took to openly paying on the openly peeing on the walls. this is gross but i'm fascinated by it. it is a metaphor for what is happening in baseball as a whole. the cubs want to hold on to traditions which is why they haven't knocked down wrigley but they want to embrace the new renovation which includes a new monstrous jumbotron. walking the line is easier said than done and not just when it comes to making sure people have someplace to pee. when we return baseball's coolness problem and the threat to its long-term survival. that's ahead.
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symmetrical all-wheel drive plus 34 mpg. love. it's what makes a subaru a subaru. baseball season kicked off last night with today being the official opening day. at first glance the sport seems to be in good health. revenue at an all-time high. they are facing a challenge similar to republican party, the fans skewed as old, white, male. 55% of baseball viewers are 55 or older. participation declining one or two parent year. it dropped from 3 million kids in the '90s from 2.4 million two years ago. median viewer age for baseball has risen to 53 compared to 37 for the nba. ratings for the world series and other baseball games have
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steadily fallen. last year's series was the lowest rated series ever. that's the chart on the right. andrew mccutchen says the sport is dying in economically challenging communities. he laments few kids idolize baseball players the way he once did. major league baseball teams know it has problems keeping people's attention. they instituted new rules including a batter keep one foot in the batter box. with young people and people of color increasingly tuning out, many say it has to do more if they want to reclaim the mantle of america's past time. joining me to discuss this chicago tribune editor clarence paige and from the games tonight richard justice, correspondent for richard, i'll start with you. how much sense of panic is there inside of mlb about all of the trends we have been talking about? >> well it's the first thing on
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commissioner rob manford's to do list in his first 100 somedays. he's met with youth groups, solicited opinions of people in and around and out of the game. the bomb line is that in inner cities baseball diamonds are expensive to maintain. as part of the effort baseball is open seven urban youth academies across the country. the most recent in cincinnati. i'm very familiar with the one in houston. it offers after-school tutors for kids and gets them to play baseball. the problem is not that kids don't like or enjoy playing the game but they don't have the facilities to play the game and that's where the effort ge begins. >> clarence i'm fascinated by wrigley as this kind of perfect physical metaphor for the challenge here which is they are trying to do all of this stuff that a new fancy stadium will have, hotel and expand it and they have a footprint that is the footprint and it's causing a massive mess in the middle of the north side.
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>> that's right. that's my old neighborhood chris. it breaks my heart to see what is mess is happening over there. this whole situation about the loss of inner city fans an young people is hardly new. i think it is part of the heart break of the jackie robinson west fiasco, the little league champs on the south side of chicago turned out to -- somebody violated the rules there, in so as far as a residency was concerned and their championship was taken away from them. that was a big set back. that's the sort of thing that could help to attract more young people in the inner city. like a good cub's fan i have to say wait until next year. maybe it will be better. >> that team was a perfect example of the kind of thing that major league baseball wants to see. first all-black team that won the national title and didn't win the international game. lost that game but it was hugely celebrated in chicago.
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kind of was iconic in certain ways for a sport that recognizes that there is this kind of attenuating relationship to african-american fans. >> yeah. there's been an effort for several years now. the first urban youth academy was open in compton, california. there's been kids drafted out of that. i think we have to be careful in overselling it. there's an area of concern. it's a matter of getting the kids there. it's a larger problem. ncaa scholarships. commissioner rob manford, it's the first thing on his list. everything that he can do he will do. having said that in terms of the aging audience and all of that, the mlb at bat app is open 7.5 million times a day and the average age is 30. it is about getting the kids involved. >> the cubs have been so horrible for the last five years basically in the are building
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era. >> it is all relative chris. >> horrible many times throughout my 36 years, this is one of those periods in which they were horrible. i was watching the game and i had a friend over. i had my laptop my phone, my friend and i found myself jonesing for more fim stimulus. is there something about what has happened to our attention spans in the mobile phone era that is incompatible with what it takes to watch a baseball game? >> no doubt in my mind. i have to confess i have never liked watching baseball on television except when i was a kid with my dad, grandfather and uncles. it was a family affair. watching on tv i'd much rather be at the ballpark and excitement and ambience at the ballpark. wrigley is the kind of place where banal out to be played. you ought to sit out in the bleemps and pass food down the aisles. that's what the promoters of the game were building it up over the years that way. we don't have that excitement
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these days in this tv age. but some places like wrigley field or the green monster in boston, some places have that local folklore to them that still attracts a lot of local people. >> thank you both. >> chris, just let me say, the game in terms of attendance is over 30,000 a game. it's over 73 million. it's never been more healthy in that respect. a lot of people like going to games. local tv and radio ratings have been skyrocketing. >> great point about attendance. particularly in the internet age. thank you both. that's "all in" this evening. rachel maddow starts right now. >> welcome back. missed you. >> i missed you. although i liked being away. >> i was going to say you didn't miss me and that's okay. our friendship is strong enough to bear that. i get it. thank you for you at home joining us as well whether or not you missed me. we have a big show


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