tv The Rundown With Jose Diaz- Balart MSNBC May 18, 2015 6:00am-8:01am PDT
"mad men" a mediocre. what did you learn? >> i learned the tide is rolling at the university of alabama with a kid turning down all eight ivies. bianna, what did you learn? >> i learned my son should be doing house work. >> get out the vacuum. mike barnicle. >> i learned that marco rubio is the latest republican candidate for president unable to answer the question about iraq that anybody in the cross town bus today could answer. >> a lot of good stories today. if it's way too early it's "morning joe." now time for "the rundown." have a great monday, everybody. take care. good morning i'm francis rivera at 30 rock. developing right now on "the rundown," nearly 200 biker gang members are in a texas jail right now after a sunday brawl turned shootout left nine people dead and more than a dozen hurt. it happened outside a crowded sports bar in broad daylight and the fight spilling into the streets first involving fists then quickly escalating with chains knives, brass knuckles,
a club, and finally guns. police quickly responded, exchanging fire with several bikers. eventually getting the upper hand on this situation. >> 192 individuals are being booked and processed into the county jail. those are individuals that were involved in the twin peaks shooting last night. they are all being charged with engaging in organized crime. >> and here's the latest at this hour. nine bikers were killed, 18 others were injured. no police officers were hurt. and officials say five separate biker gangs were involved. one woman at the scene said her son was shot during that chaos. >> my son's in there and my husband is in there and the ban bandito gang members think they can do what they want to people. they pulled things out and shot people. nobody was doing anything and they started shooting people. they don't leave people alone. i don't know what the problem is. >> let's take you live to waco texas, and nbc's jay gray.
jay, what an absolute mess there in texas. do police have any idea who shot who? >> well, frances, at this point they say it started with rival gang members shooting at one another. they were staged already, moved into the area and they turned their gunfire on police. as you talked about, no police no people in the restaurants injured which is amazing when you consider it was just after noon in what is a busy highly populated very popular shopping and restaurant area here police say their cars are riddled with bullet holes, so are the cars of patrons at the restaurant but, again, a lot of those inside the restaurant rushed into a freezer. that's being credited with saving lives here. >> absolutely just chaotic, that scene. i can imagine. and to think this happened at a restaurant, jay, the twin peaks restaurant. it will be shut down for the next seven days. what are police saying about that? and also about the other
customers there during the time? >> at this point, those customers, witnesses and they're asking for help from those customers. they're thankful and frankly even veteran law enforcement officers here amazed that no one outside of the gang members themselves were hurt or killed. as far as the restaurant is concerned, the texas alcohol and beverage commission has pulled their license indefinitely. the restaurant will be closed for seven days. let's listen to what police said about that this morning. >> there is enough of a reason to believe that more violence would occur there had they been allowed to remain open for the next seven-day period. that's a good thing for law enforcement here that's one issue we don't to worry about, people coming in, going in thereunderthere and creating another incident after the tragic incident we had last night. >> let's talk about that.
there is still a concern by police on the ground that more gang members could be on their way to the area on the outskirts of town overnight. three gang members arrested they are being charged with organized crime and weapons charges. this is still unfolding. a lot developing here frances. back to you. >> a lot of tension there especially for the people in that community. jay gray for us in waco texas. thank you very much. i want to bring in now msnbc law enforcement analyst jim cavanaugh, retired agent for the bureau of alcohol, tobacco, firearms, and explosives. when you hear about this, a biker gang shootout in the middle of the day in waco, texas, what's your take on that especially for something in this day and age to happen? >> well, frances these criminal biker gangs, the one percenters, they have a long history of violence, a long deep seeded history of violent and all the law enforcement agencies that work on them know that
intransally. the banditos the key players in the shootout with the cossack which is apparently is affiliated or trying to be affiliated with the helds angel have a long and deadly rivalry. the police knew it was cooking. it's not over. these bikers are deep into revenge and revenge killings and bombings and shootings. there's more violence to come somewhere so we have to be on our game in law enforkment to watch out. >> it's astonishing when you thinking the threats are, isis homegrown terror now we're seeing nine people killed from this. you said police were already on the scene before the fighting broke out and they called in reinforcement. what are the biggest challenges for law enforcement when they respond to a situation reich this knowing that it's already brewing and knowing the threat and risk is still there? >> well, you have great law enforcement in waco and mcclenlennon
county. i've known those police and troopers and they did a great job. they were in the middle of the shootout protecting people so that's good news. and federal agents are there atf, fbi. everybody is trying to get a damper on it. these biker gangs are not afraid of going to jail or being arrested. they have long criminal records if they here in a one percent gang. i arrested a biker years and years ago and he had five handcuff keys secreted on his body. they're ready to be arrested. it's part of their life so we'll see if these charges will hold on the 192 members. but they have to make some big cases on some of these guys involved in this shooting to keep them locked up, the felons with the guns, the shooters, murderers. they have to make key case there is and i'm sure the district attorney and the united states attorney are aggressively pursuing that. then they have to branch out to damp down the violence.
it will boil down to be banditos versus the hells angels affiliated gang. >> certainly tough when you're not familiar with the biking culture you have to gangs which you call the one percent then you have to guys who just love to be on the bikes and around there. interesting to see that very fine and very -- divide we see. jim cavanaugh, thank you very much. we'll continue to follow the latest developments in waco and bring them to you live here on "the rundown." turning to politics and a busy day in the race for the white house. hillary clinton is heading back to campaign in iowa. today there are questions after financial disclosures show she and her husband hearned more than $30 million over the past 16 months. clinton was the main target over the weekend as at least ten republicans eyeing the white house spoke at the annual lincoln day dinner des moines. it was a republican not in iowa making the biggest headline. senator marco rubio now stumbling over the same iraq war questions that dogged jeb bush
all last week after his interview with megyn kelly. >> six weeks ago it made sense to invade iraq in 2003 now you say it was a mistake. >> two different questions. it was not a mistake. the president based on -- this is the way the real world works. the president based on the information -- >> you said based on the information -- she was saying based on what we know now. >> well, based on what we know now, i wouldn't have thought manny pacquiao was going to beat -- in that fight a couple weeks ago. >> but you were asked the same question and you said -- >> no it was not the same question. >> was it a mistake? >> it was not a mistake for the president to go into iraq based on the information he was provided by as president. today -- if the president had known there were no weapons of mass destruction at the time, you still would have had to deal with saddam hussein but the process would have been different. >> we have it covers for you with nbc's kristen welker in iowa and we thank all of you for being with us.
i want to start with you and that tension change we heard with marco rubio. this will be another what jeb 180 like we saw? how will he clean this one up? >> he started to do so over the week end in iowa meeting with iowa republicans trying to mend fences here, trying to gain some traction here. there were 11 candidates speaking to about 1400 republicans here. 246s that was discussed. rand paul jabbed at jeb bush over this issue said iraq had been destabilized by the invasion george w. bush authorized whereas lindsey graham came to bush's defense. >> we were just talking about how much iraq will come into play when it comes to republicans in iowa. how much will they care about a candidate's position on iraq now? >> well, turning it on its head, i think one of the interesting things will be how hillary
clinton handle this is question. in 2007 one of the reasons she did not do as well as early to line up support that the people thought she might having in the state is because of her vote to authorize the use of force in iraq so she will have that question to answer on the campaign trail. >> that and many more. many talking a bt how lopsided it's been with hillary clinton not taking too many questions. and kristen when it comes to hillary, can we expect more of these smaller events with hillary clinton in iowa? >> well, campaign officials say that's exactly what you can expect. hillary clinton is going to hold more of these small, more intimate events in an attempt to try to connect with the voters here in iowa today. she'll meet with grass-roots organizers in mason city but you're right, this two-day swing comes as she is facing mounting pressure to answer tough questions she's been facing in recent days, particularly about her finances.
as you pointed out, frances, we learned friday she disclosed she and her husband bill clinton netted an eye-popping $30 million over the past 16 months. $25 million of that from paid speeches largely to big corporations banks other organizations, five million from her book "hard choices." some republicans are crying foul saying it raises ethical questions. those are allegations that the clinton camp denies but the question is will we hear from the candidate herself on this point? republicans a that that big gop event over the weekend slamming her for not answering more questions and even some democrats. david axelrod on "meet the press" saying she needs to change her strategy and answer more questions. she's only answered nine questions since she declared. that's what we'll be watching for. >> and speaking to kristen's point, andy what is the approach? what is this strategy? we're talking about money here, yes. there's a ton of money here as
far as rich people running for president, they have the money, but it's how the money is made. what should that approach be from the clinton campaign? >> first off they put this financial disclosure form out legally as required in may of 2015 so they can deal with this early on. i think that they'll put it out maybe former secretary of state clinton will take a question or two on it or maybe not given how she's run her campaign so far. but i think what you'll see is the campaign double down on their message that focuses on everyday americans, is the middle-class middle-class, bread and butter issues for working people in states like iowa and not try to dwell on the fact that her and her husband were making $235,000 a pop per speech. >> i can imagine somewhere along the line if not more than once that question will come up. we thank all of you. nbc's kristen welker, o. kay henderson and andy krol thank you for your time, we appreciate
it. developing for the first time in a week amtrak rail service is running between philadelphia and new york and a little over an hour ago amtrak's northeast regional train safely arrived at new york's penn station about 30 minutes behind schedule. the train departed philadelphia's 30th street station after 6:00. about three dozen passengers made the trip. >> no problem as far as safety is concerned. i'm sure they've done all the right work and have installed all the right equipment. >> i'm okay with getting on. i have less to worry about than the people who have had the experience they had. >> about 15 minutes after departure the train slowed down as it approached the bend where train 188 jumped the tracks last tuesday evening killing eight and injuring more than 200 others. nbc's tom costello joins us from philadelphia's 30th street station. tom, good morning. >> reporter: this morning, the northeast corridor is again open for business, the site of last tuesday's horrific crash cleaned
up amtrak's ceo telling me new government ordered safety upgrades are already in place. >> everybody on this railroad has been emotional about this. focused and committed to safety. this is a safe railroad to ride. we know it. >> among the new upgrades, trains entering the curve where amtrak 188 derailed must slow to 45 down from 50. an automatic braking system that had been in place for southbound trains is operational for northbound trains too. meanwhile, investigators looking into the cause of the crash say engineer brandon bostian has been very cooperative but doesn't remember the crash. the fbi is looking at this grapefruit grapefruit-sized impact on train 188's windshield. was something thrown at the train before the accident in two other trains operating that night may have also been hit. amtrak says it's a common problem. it's been going on for years, kids throwing everything you can imagine at trains from on the ground but also from up here. locals say it happens when kids are bored? >> mainly kids throwing rocks at
the train, playing in this field, train comes by throwing rocks, playing on the track. >> often? >> yeah, often. >> reporter: if train 188 was hit by something did it disorient the engineer who was new on the route as he was supposed to be slowing down not speeding up? >> we obviously had an incident that occurred that has shaken the nation and we are going to get to the bottom of it working with our colleagues at ntsb. >> tom costello thank you. we'll continue to watch developments in the crash and bring them to you as they come. we're just getting started on this monday edition of "the rundown." still ahead, has a key iraqi city fallen under isis control? the iraqi government says yes, but the u.s. calls it all fluid. we'll talk about what's going on there with nbc's bill neely and analyst mia bloom. plus, a prominent extreme athlete dies while trying a base jump in yosemite national park. we'll tell you about the stunt that took his life. can someone hack into your
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wild within. [ muted ]. >> the aircraft was an mv-22 osprey, an aircraft that had been extensively used in iraq and afghanistan and in response to disasters like the earthquake in nepal. it flies like a plane but takes off and lands like a helicopter. in this case it was in helicopter mode attempting to land, along with two other ospreys, when it crashed and
exploded into flames. we'll go live to the pentagon in our next hour for the latest on this developing story. now to western iraq where government officials are responding and reporting a devastating loss in the war with isis terrorists. the key city of ramadi has fallen according to the spokesman of anbar province. isis militants are now in control of ramadi. this video, which has not been verified by nbc news, appears to show government forces7t fleeing the city. the pentagon however isn't willing to admit defeat calling the situation "fluid." here's what secretary of state john kerry said this morning. >> it is possible to have the kind of attack we've seen in ramadi, but i am confident in the days ahead that will be reversed. >> the chairman of the senate arms services committee on "morning joe" said -- we're talking about senator john mccain, said it's a mistake to understand estimate how significant this loss is. >> the fall of ramadi, it's huge
and the impact on the psychology of the people of iraq, now you've seen virtually everybody who's talked with you this morning have all said we need more bootsen the ground not the 82nd air born but we're going to have to have more people on the ground and is this is is really serious, the fall of ramadi. >> nbc's bill neely is live in london with the latest. bill, good morning. >> good morning, jose. i think there's no question the fall of ramadi is a disaster in three parts. firstly, the defeat itself. us sis now holding the capital of a province that accounts for a third of iraq's landmass. secondly the manner of the defeat. iraq's security forces simply retreated in chaos and proved again to be utterly incompetent. and finally, the consequences of that defeat, not just the momentum and weapons and the psychology a cal boost it gives isis but the risk that lies
ahead. iraq's prime minister is now begging the country's shi'a militias to retake a sunni city. . there are huge sectarian dangers that lie ahead that that assault might pose. thousands of shi'a militiamen have now been called up by the shi'a-dominated government. they're now preparing to attack the city. a short-term fix, maybe, but a long-term risk because those militias are loathe bid sunnis and many of them are backed by iran. and for the u.s., too ramadi's fall no question is a setback. as that isis attack was beginning a top u.s. commander was claiming the strategy to defeat isis is working. he said there'd been 420 air strikes against isis near ramadi. that claim simply underscored that air strikes alone cannot beat isis. they didn't stop isis retaking ramadi. so now the u.s. has to decide if it will use its air power to back any attack on isis in ram
-- ramadi by iranian backed militias. >> and air attacks are going to no doubt cause civilian casualties and it has to be a concern for american forces. i want to talk to you about the raid in syria that killed an isis commander and captured his wife. what can you tell me about that? >> it was a very daring raid. this man a tunisian was one of those who manages isis' oil revenues. most of isis' funding of billions of dollars comes from oil so this guy according to the u.s. was an absolutely key player. those special forces went in under cover of darkness into syria only the second time they have rated syria. they wanted by all accounts to capture this man, ended up killing him and capturing his wife. so it's a small blow. it was obviously a daring raid.
i would trol v to say the fall of ramadi somewhat overshadow this is single daring operation. if you look at in the the scales there's no question ramadi outranks the capture of the wife of a man and his killing. >> bill neely in london. thank you very much. joining me now, mia bloom, author of "dying to kill." she also wrote the book "bombshell, women in terrorism." mia, good to see you. >> good to see you again jose. >> thanks. i want to ask you about this guy, abu sayyaf and his wife. he's dead, she's in custody. what do we know about who she is and what information she could be given to authorities. >> well, i think the portrayal of abu sayyaf is top level is wrong. certainly mid-level. certainly the information that they will be able to get off the
cell phones ss and laptop will be useful but i don't know how much information the wife of a mid-level commander has access to. there have been allegations she might have been involved in some of the hostage taking, there's even been an allegation in an australian news media saying this is the commander who was given kayla mueller as a wife. so she may have some information that would be useful about hostages and especially about miss mueller. >> but what we really do know so far is that he was involved in the petroleum dealings, the financial aspect of isis' petroleum negotiations and dealings so this is not a guy who would have a lot of information necessarily on maybe al baghdadi and how the terrorist networks works as far as the warfare part. >> right, he would have a lot of information about the financials but getting isis' financial
forensically being able to take apart the financial network would be one way to undermine the strength of isis a because isis is strong and able to recruit foreign fighters and able to pay locals because they're giving them $600 to $1,000 a month. if they don't have that money, they will be weakened. >> mia bloom always a pleasure. good to see you, thanks. >> good to see you, too. still ahead, he's used to defying the laws of gravity. we'll tell you about extreme athlete dean potter and the stunt that took his life. we'll be right back. it's one of the most amazing things we build and it doesn't even fly. we build it in classrooms and exhibit halls, mentoring tomorrow's innovators. we build it raising roofs, preserving habitats and serving america's veterans. every day, thousands of boeing volunteers help make their communities the best they can be. building something better for all of us.
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this is our live shot coming in from los angeles. there's a big rig on the side on this freeway. let's see if we zoom in so you can see what i'm talking about. there you see it. this is causing major problems for what is the beginning of the peak commute for the morning this monday morning in los angeles. there you see it. we will, of course, keep this monitored and let you know how that goes. but right now, part of a los angeles freeway has been shut down as authorities deal with this big rig that has gone on its side. i want to now go to yosemite national park where an investigation into the death of an acclaimed daredevil and his friends who lost their lives attempting a base jump. jacob rascon has the latest from yosemite. >> reporter: wearing wing suits like these, dean potter and graham hunt leap from a 75-foot cliff at yosemite national park over the weekend and didn't survive. >> three, two, one, see ya.
>> reporter: in the world of extreme sports potter was a living legend. >> that's the things that really drive me reaching into the unknown and seeing whether you have it in you or not. >> reporter: the daredevil who always spoke of flying pushed the boundaries of human achievement for decades, refusing to wear a safety harness. >> when i'm in the air it's so powerful because you are playing with death right then. and it's like -- it's as cool as it gets. >> reporter: traveling the globe scaling the most difficult peaks in record time shocking even adrenaline junkies walking without a tether thousands of feet above the ground. and known outside the sports community for flying with his dog whisper. an estimated 200 base jumpers have died since 1908 according to wingsuitfly.com. others have been injured or arrested. two years ago, four men jumped from the top of one world trade center new york city and are still facing trial on felony
charges. base jumping is illegal at yosemite. officials are now investigating the deadly accident. the 43-year-old who thought of himself as an artist finally finding his limit. jacob rascon nbc news, los angeles. >> thank you jacob. developing this morning in the race for the white house and immigration as we've been covering this morning, hillary clinton is returning to iowa today. it's her first campaign stop since her big immigration push in nevada earlier this month where she suggested she would go further than president obama on immigration. meanwhile, on the gop side, senator marco rubio confronted with the issue of immigration on sunday asked why he "bailed" on the comprehensive immigration reform bill he supported in 2013 after it passed in the senate. here's what he responded. >> it's not that we bailed it's that we don't have the votes to pass it. in fact, we have less votes for comprehensive immigration reform today than we did two years ago when that passed because of the last election because of unilateral actions the president
took through executive order because of a border crisis because of minors. >> and in other immigration news, look at this number 445, 607. that's the backlog, number of cases our immigration court system currently is confronting. it's close to 30% more than it was in 2013. we will, of course continue to monitor all these developments here on "the rundown." think about that. more than 400,000 cases. just waiting. after the break we'll zoom through today's other top stories including a wrapup of a wild weather weekend. and could this surveillance video lead investigators to the person responsible for murdering four people and setting fire to a home in a prominent washington, d.c. neighborhood? i'll have the details next on "the rundown." right now, verizon is offering unlimited talk and text. plus 10 gigs of shareable data. yeah, 10 gigantic gigs. for $80 a month.
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a busy weather weekend. a d.c. murder mystery, and hacking into the cockpit? let's zoom through some of today's top stories. it was a wild weather weekend after a powerful storm spawned 34 tornados. this was the damage left behind in southeast louisiana. check out this video of a twister in elmer, oklahoma. the cows unphased by the weather around them. the system is now headed through the central plains and going towards canada. more trouble expected in texas over the week already being hit by major flooding. these are dramatic rescue pictures from the weekend. the lone star state expected to see daily downpours and the chance for more severe weather. now to a murder mystery in the nation's capital and surveillance video police hope will help track down a person of interest in a fire that destroyed a multimillion dollar home and prominent d.c. neighborhood. four bodies were found inside the house believed to be a couple, their ten-year-old son and their housekeeper. police believe they were
murdered. this person of interest was seen running near where the family's porch was set on fire. we'll have much more on this story and the exclusive neighborhood coming up in our next hour. and taking to the skies, the fbi is reporting a passenger on board a united airlines flight claims to have taken control of the plane by hacking into its entertainment system. cyber security expert chris roberts says he hacked commercial jets up to 20 times and even forced the engine of his friday flight to briefly drift the aircraft sideways. an ongoing fbi investigation has found there's no credible investigation to suggest passengers can do what roberts is claiming, though it's a violation of federal statutes either way. roberts has not been charged. later today president obama expected to announce a limit on military-style equipment for local police forces. this issue got increased attention following the police response in ferguson last
summer. the ban is part of the president's efforts to ease tension between law enforcement and the communities they serve. he's expected to make the announcement during a visit to camden, new jersey later today. camden a city plagued by poverty and crime but has recently improved police relations with its city force by replacing it with a county run system. and comedian stephen colbert is to deliver the commencement graduation address at wake forest university. we'll talk about that and other high profile speeches including vice president joe biden yesterday at yale. >> when president obama asked me to be his vice president i said i only had two conditions: one i wouldn't wear any funny hats even on class day. and, two, i wouldn't change my brand. [ cheers and applause ]
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welcome back live pictures out of winston say-salem north carolina. comedian stephen colbert will soon take the stage. on sunday, vice president biden spoke at yale. on saturday, former president george w. bush gave his first commencement address since leaving office. he spoke to students at southern methodist university. his wife's alma mater. there were a lot of jokes along the way but a serious note on religious faith. >> you can be hopeful because there's a loving god. whether you agree with that statement or not is your choice. it is not your government's choice. it is -- [ applause ]
it is essential to this nation's future that we remember that the freedom to worship who we want and how we want or not worship at all is a core belief of our founding. joining me now, dana milbank of the "washington post" and dean avila. dean, a lot of commencement addresses go viral because they're provocative. what'ss the deal in remembering it's their day but not yours. >> watching former president george bush in the golden days of comedy. if i gave a commencement address, it will be about me dean, dean, dean. not because i'm selfish you're inviting a speaker because they've done something notably.
if you have tim cook from apple you want to hear about what he's done. today you have stephen colbert. if they don't talk about themselves much it becomes this cliche speech inspirational go out there follow your dreams, that kind of thing. and that's nice but to be honest the more instructive is telling people what you've gone through, the challenges you've overcome and how you succeeded. colbert is funny. one quick line from his speech in 2011 at northwestern he said "you have been told to follow your dreams but what if your dream is a stupid one? thankfully dreams can change if not we'd be stuck with cowboys and princesses." so he made a point and was being funny at the same time. >> dana, we mentioned george w. bush's speech. how much does he eclipse his brother at a time when jeb bush is trying to gain national prominence as his own guy? >> oh, i think jeb would be delighted to be eclipsed at this point, the way it's been going for him. so maybe have nobody paying attention to him for a while. i'm not sure anybody does pay attention to these commencement speeches. if i were giving one, i would talk about dean the entire time.
>> thanks, dana. >> i think he's terrific. the truth is the lines people remember from these are the funny ones so more than 40 years ago is when john f. kennedy spoke where biden was at yale and said he had the best of both worlds, a harvard education and a yale degree. that's what we remember from that speech. occasionally if you have something profound, some huge policy announcement, but if you're a former president or vice president, the only thing anybody will remember is if you said something funny. they won't remember the hallmark advice. >> that's interesting. dean, first lady michelle obama made news at tuskegee where she talked about her personal experience of racism. that's a way of getting through talking about how your personal vicissitudes have made you who you are today and how that can help, i guess other people as well. >> i think so. i think it's the personal stories that move us frankly and that are memorable. michelle obama got pushback from certain people and certain
conservative outlets upset with her speech when she talked about race. that's who she is and the idea that if you can raise race you'll anger some people that you're playing the race card no she's talking about her personal experience, racism she went through. i wish there was no racism, i wish it wasn't out there but you have to talk about these issues and what she did was great, it was a personal story. even though it wasn't funny we remember that personal story about her life growing up with racism. >> there we see colbert about to give his speech. dana, do you remember anything prominent that was said at your graduation? >> jose, i don't remember who the speaker was. >> you know i don't, either. >> yeah, i so i guess it did not leave a lasting impression with me and, of course, the graduates are there just eager to get on with things and whatever partying is going to ensue. but i suppose if i had stephen colbert i would have remembered that. >> what about you, dean? any thoughts? do you remember who gave that speech? >> i don't even remember graduating college jose.
>> i don't remember college. >> i don't remember who spoke at it and if i had a jon stewart or colbert or matthew mcconaughey who spoke at university of houston over the weekend you'd remember that forever. or a former president so on some level this love of celebrities makes it more memorable. >> maybe we wouldn't remember because it was in my case so long ago. >> too long ago. >> i graduated college four years ago, jose. >> good point. dean and dana, thank you for being with us. dean, what were you going to say? >> well it was well into the last century. i don't remember college or when i graduated. don't ask me. >> thanks, guys good to see you both. up next is china trying to match the u.s.'s military might? we'll talk about the chinese maneuvering on the heels of secretary of state john kerry's visit to that country. but first, "saturday night live" couldn't sign off for the season without one last jab at hillary. >> i love your sand kas.
>> thanks. it's our dream house. >> oh neat. this is my dream house. [ laughter ] suspect that fun is? why don't you tell your parents to vote for me. hillary clinton. >> oh they don't like you. >> why not? >> i don't know. they just don't. >> well what can i do moving to ward to earn their vote? >> um, i think nothing because they said they don't like you and they just never will. >> what a fun thing to hear for almost 20 years. ♪ it's summer summertime ♪
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where the diplomatic visit was overshadowed by troubling developments out of beijing, including the re-engineering of nuclear missiles and steps to develop disputed islands in the south china sea. gordon chang has written multiple books about the region, gordon, what a pleasure to see you. >> thank you so much, jose. >> on top of the news about the missiles in the south china sea, where are reports of new cyber weapons being developed there? >> well, certainly, china is developing cyber probably much further along than the united states and we know china has been attacking not just the pentagon and government networks but also those of private companies, foundations, ngos, charities. and so this is a broad-based attack on the united states. >> when you say it's an attack what do they do, do they destroy, get information, what is the purpose here? >> well most of what they've been trying to do is obtain information, and you know, governments spy on each other, we spy on them, they spy on us,
but the united states doesn't look at state-owned enterprises to get commercial information that we then give to an ibm or general motors so we can compete against china. china, on the other hand, does that. and that really is the big issue, because there are certain limits the united states feels to all of this, and most countries agree to those limits, but china doesn't. so there's this big conversation essentially, about what countries can do in cyberspace. >> yeah, and kerry made a point to say he wanted the issue with the south china sea to be resolved. tell me what that issue is. >> well, china claims about 80% of the water of the south china sea is, essentially, chinese sovereign territory also claims all of the islands, reefs, and shoals in the south china sea and since the middle of last year has been reclaiming about four square kilometers, which is quite a lot in the spratly islands. the united states, on the other hand if it's had any consistent foreign policy over the course of two centuries it's been the defense of freedom of navigation
and china's reclamation and claims infringe on those notions, so this is a real problem we have with china and dominating the conversations we have with beijing. >> how do you solve that when they are hell bent? >> this is extremely difficult, because we're trying to maintain cooperative relations with china. what the pentagon is probably going to do is sail navy vessels within close to these islands that china is building up so that we can preserve freedom of navigation. we're going to fly our planes over those islands. the chinese is going to be upset because they believe that infringes with their sovereignty. china's claims are quite ambitious and they essentially claim area which is more than 1,000 miles from china's shore. countries in the region are concerned about that and looking to the obama administration for support and help. >> always a pleasure thank you for being with me, appreciate
it. >> thank you so much jose. coming up on "the rundown," we're going to take you to waco, texas, where police have arrested as many as 175 people allegedly involved in a biker gang shootout at a local restaurant. the developing news straight ahead. plus, what caused a marine aircraft to crash while trying to land in hawaii? one marine was killed, 21 others were injured. jim miklaszewski updates us next right here on "the rundown".
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welcome back to "the rundown" on msnbc. deadly shootout between biker gangs at a texas restaurant that spilled into the streets. law enforcement giving us an updated number saying it's between 165 and 175 the amount of people being processed and charged at a police station in waco after the fight broke out sunday at a local twin peaks
restaurant. >> it's a pretty severe charge engaging in organized crime in reference to nine individuals being killed, doesn't get much more significant than that. there may be warrants on individuals that may be attached to that arrest as well but that's a pretty serious charge. >> authorities say the fight started between five rival gangs, quickly escalating into an all-out gun fight that involved police in the streets outside the restaurant. nine bikers killed, 18 injured, no officers were hurt. jay gray is at the scene in waco. good morning. >> reporter: good morning jose. local, state police, as well as federal agents on the ground right now, their investigation continuing, so is the concern. we've seen a lot of those agents and police on the ground and looking through what's left here after the chaos yesterday. you can see the motorcycles. they've been poring through those, looking for any evidence they can find here.
the restaurant also a focus for this investigation right now. we learned this morning that the texas alcohol and beverage association is pulling their liquor license, trying to make sure there is no more violence in the wake of what's happened here. nine people dead 18 injured after what was a turf war between at least five outlaw biker gangs here. more than 200 gang members on site. there's concern that more could be on the way to the area today. we know that overnight at least three gang members were arrested on the outskirts of town. they are being charged along with 192 others that have been arrested as a result of this incident. you name it if you can name a state, local police agency, federal agency, waco police say they are all helping in this investigation and continuing to watch for what could happen next. that's the latest here, jose, a lot unfolding. for now though, back to you.
>> jay gray, thank you very much. joining me now is msnbc law enforcement analyst jim cavnar, retired agent for the atf, also played a key role in the branch davidian standoff in waco. police are saying it's about 165 to 175 people that are being booked processed, and charged. this is huge. five rival gangs going at it. it's like a war, literal war broke out last night. >> right jose, exactly. well, it is a gang war. it's a war over territory by criminal gangs. it's much like they have certain gangs, they try to control territory, because what they are trying to control is the drug trade, the trade in stolen motorcycles and parts, the prostitution control, all the things, just like la koez nostra will control and the banditos they think have a lock on texas especially gangs that may be affiliated with like the hell's
angels to be in their territory. this is a war over criminal territory by one-percenter motorcycle gangs, not confused with people who ride motorcycles for pleasure or clubs. very different groups here. as you know in florida, florida was covered up with them. warm weather states have a lot of motorcycle gangs because they can ride most of the year. south texas is no different. >> so jim talk to me because when you think of gangs nowadays, you know the ones that make news a lot, gangs that have theys even with the cartels in mexico. these are longstanding historic gangs you don't hear much about until something like this breaks out in texas. these are still very powerful? >> yeah, they are very powerful gangs. the banditos probably have
9,000, 10,000 members in the united states, maybe 25000 worldwide, so they have a lot of context around the globe. the big five motorcycle gangs, hell's angels outlaw motorcycle gangs, pagans in the northeast, mogrels in california deep rivals over money. it's all about money and power and their criminal territory. that's what's broke out in waco, and this is not over because there's going to be a lot of revenge here and it may happen far from waco, where other groups, banditos and hell's angels fight so it could happen anywhere in the country now, it's become a big investigation. >> jim cavnar, thank you keep it here on msnbc as we continue to get new details on this still developing story. but also developing amtrak is running from philadelphia to new york nearly a week after that deadly train derailment. after 6:00 this morning,
amtrak's northeast regional train departed philadelphia's 30th street station 15 minutes ago, the train slowed down as it approached the bend where train 188 jumped the tracks last tuesday evening, killing eight people and injuring more than 200 others. about three dozen passengers were onboard. >> i trust amtrak executives and all the amtrak people will not put us back on these trains if they didn't think it was safe. i'm sure with their resources they've done what they needed to do to get us here the last couple days. >> in the wake of the tragedy, amtrak has lowered the speed limit at the crash site from a miles per hour to 45 and an automatic braking system has also been added to northbound tracks. let's get more now from msnbc's adam reese in philadelphia. adam, good morning, what's it like there this morning? >> reporter: good morning. very busy here. amtrak back on track resuming full service here in philadelphia as the investigation continues.
the fbi looking to see if there's a pattern, a link between the three trains hit last tuesday night, a septa train, asella train and, of course amtrak 188 hit with what officials are calling a fist-sized projectile through the windshield. engineers call it getting rocked and they have to protect themselves, some of them putting grills up in the front windshield to protect themselves from projectiles. the federal railroad administration ordering changes over the weekend for amtrak slow down at that curve, as you mention, jose to 45 miles per hour, post signs for speed and keep an eye on the curves. amtrak's ceo telling tom costello the changes have been made and the trains are safe. finally, jose there was an emotional service last night mayor nutter honoring those eight people who lost their lives, doves were released. today, 20 people remain hospitalized, five critical.
>> adam reese in philadelphia thank you very much. turning back now to politics and the race for the white house, where today all eyes are on iowa. that's where we will see hillary clinton hit the trail later today, whether we'll hear from her, not sure. the presidential candidate is under increasing pressure to answer questions about her finances, as new disclosures show her husband bill raking in more than $30 million, mostly from speaking fees since 2014. republicans are pouncing pointing out hillary clinton's only taken nine questions from members of the media since announcing her candidacy last month. joining me now from iowa, alex scythes wald, benjy sarlin and perry bacon. what are the clinton folks saying about why they are keeping her away from the press? >> well jose, they say they want to keep her focus on voters, not on us so today she's meeting with democratic
activists at the home of one of the first gay couples to marry in iowa. the press won't be there, we're not expecting too many questions. and the truth is, they really don't need us right now. she has 100% name recognition, she's leading in all the polls sherks has 3.5 million twitter followers, so they can get their message out without us and avoid the tougher questions. eventually that will start to change, but for right now they can do what they are doing without having to worry about us. >> yeah i'm not sure that that strategy is necessarily in the long-term going to be beneficial to her. i think it's good for everybody, anybody who wants to be a leader in this country to be available to answer questions, but benjy, you're in philly aved of rand paul's event, how are republicans using this silence from clinton to their advantage? >> well republicans have been bringing it up with increasing frequency lately and it's worth noting a lot of these issues that people really want to ask clinton about with her
foundation, speaking fees, have a lot to do with transparency, so really the republicans see an opportunity to jump on this message of look, we're transparent, we're answering questions. jeb bush for example, all this trouble stumbleing over from the iraq war but he said in iowa, look, at least i'm taking questions, look at hillary clinton. carly fiorina has been one of the most vocal with hillary clinton, recently pointed out she's taken well over 300 questions since declaring in contrast to hillary clinton and i guarantee you'll hear rand paul say something similar today in philadelphia where he's talking about constitutional issues at independence hall. >> perry, speaking of republicans, push appears to be going all-in in iowa after some thought he might skip the state altogether. what's the policy and the thought here? >> the thought here is, you know, you're one of the leading candidates in the race you've got to compete everywhere they are going to compete in iowa. the challenge is iowa is a place where, you know they
don't like to necessarily vote for the front-runner, hillary clinton lost here in 2008, so did john mccain it's a place where they really do kind of choose where they want to and the danger for bush is there's a very small group of people who vote in the iowa caucuses and likely he could finish behind ted cruz, rand paul. he's seventh in the polls right now. the voters here tend to be very conservative and he's not very conservative, so it's an uphill climb for him. at the same time, of course, george his father and brother both won the state and he's going to have much more money in terms of campaign funds than any other candidates will. >> yeah, he's got to announce, as well, which is pretty much a foregone conclusion for everyone, but still hasn't said it. alex what sense are you getting about when hillary clinton might be doing larger events as opposed to small controlled round tables? >> right we're in what they are calling the ramp-up phase of their campaign. very small very tightly staged events. at the end of this month or
maybe in the beginning of june formal declare of candidacy, a lot of dignitaries, then the more typical kind of events and hopefully interviews. she hasn't done a single sit-down interview, she hasn't -- there are different accounts out there, but somewhere between nine and 15 answers she's given in total to reporters, so hopefully that will loosen up once she gets further out here on the trail, but the clintons have a long history of not getting along particularly well with the media and so far that seems to be the posture she's taking in her second presidential run. >> alex, benjy sarlin, perry bacon, thank you very being with me this morning. up next, a potential loss against isis ramadi believed to be in their control. and you heard of back seat driving, what about back seat flying? a man claims he hacked into a commercial flight. now the fbi is getting involved.
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and developing news now out of hawaii officials are still trying to figure out what caused a marine aircraft to crash land and explode into flames killing one marine onboard and injuring 21 others. joining me now, jim miklaszewski. jim, good morning, what do we know about what happened there? >> jose, there were three ospreys, airplanes that take off and land like a helicopter, involved in a routine training mission there in hawaii when apparently the three were trying to land. and the one that crashed apparently was attempting to land when it was in helicopter mode and so far there's no exact cause for that crash that killed one marine and seriously
injured the 21 others all of those aboard that osprey. now in the past, they've had what they call the ring vortex, and as a helicopter, or in this case an osprey with rotary blades is landing, you will get some downward pressure. in fact, they will get caught up in their own down wash and the harder you stand on the throttle the more intense the force is downward, and that happened to an osprey back in 2000 and killed all 19 aboard that osprey during a training mission here in the united states. so that is one of the key elements, possibilities, that they are looking at now. but so far they have no exact cause for what caused that crash, or that caused that osprey to crash, killing that one marine. >> the other two ospreys landed without incident, right? >> that's right. you know, was it more complicated by having three working in the same area at the
same time, that's something investigators are all going to look at. but again this ring vortex effect where the helicopter in this case the osprey, actually pushes itself down faster into the ground the harder they stand on the throttle is suspected as a possible cause. >> jim miklaszewski, good to see you, thank you. >> okay. i want to bring in steve clemens, msnbc contributor and washington editor at large for "the atlantic." good to see you, i want to talk to you specifically about iraq, reports ramadi has been taken by isis and militants are headed east closer to baghdad. what's going on? >> it's very serious. ramadi of course, is the capital of the anbar region. isis now has control of the city as iraqi forces have pulled out. ramadi is about 75 miles from baghdad, where we've been talking about mosul about 260 miles from baghdad, so this is very close to home. it controls strategic roads that go both to syria and jordan, so
it's a very dramatic point of -- and a real big win, and it shows beyond the military capabilities of isis, it shows that what really has happened, in my view, sunni tribes there are still unreconciled to baghdad's leadership right now, because 500 people have died but it's been a remarkable transition and you have a lot of tribes that are still very much ambivalent about what is going on in the region and i think they've largely acquiesced to isis at the home. >> you add now the solution is shia militants heading over to ramadi? >> yeah the body has called for shia militants to come in, and what people don't understand, the same shia militant groups went into ramadi and other areas of anbar at the end of 2012 through 2013 and really went on a terror rampage capturing and kidnapping various sunni members
of parliament, killing members of their families, and these sunni tribes in the region organize protests against these same shia militias that they felt are controlled by iran and which many think control the government in baghdad. so it's in that environment in which isis has taken over within ramadi and it's led to a lot of people leaving the city and fearful for their own lives fearful of you know great killing and actions inside ramadi, but it's one of these things where fundamentally politically, the sunni anbar region still remains quite ambivalent, either about baghdad, not thrilled with isis either, but they are not necessarily jumping in to protect themselves. >> so, steve what is happening with the iraqi armed forces as a national force? they seem to not be able even today to handle this type of
opposition. >> well, contacts of mine in the department of defense that are working and advising them say that things are improving, that the iraqi military is showing some degree of back bone, they are getting more military aid and equipment from the u.s. and coming in but it's still not enough and it seems both in tikrit and now again in ramadi they are not able to pull off the deal without backup from these controversial shia militias. >> doesn't sound good to me. steve, good to see you, thanks for being with me this morning. up next secretary of state john kerry's tough talk against north korea. and look at this, moments before a train slammed into a commuter bus in georgia, look at that, all captured by surveillance cameras. those details and more coming up on "the rundown". ok. this role is about energy.... we're looking for a luxury hybrid, with the best city fuel economy rating... the lincoln mkz hybrid... and...who has one starting price for gas or hybrid?
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plane crash and train versus bus. let's zoom through some of today's top stories. secretary of state john kerry met with troops earlier today after reassuring the country of u.s. commitments to its security. kerry urging north korea to drop its nuclear weapons program and end recent actions, saying increased sanctions and a referral to the international criminal court. flames lit up the sky in nevada following an overnight plane crash that left one person dead. the four-passenger plane went down near the colorado river, sparking a brush fire that forced the e vkuation of nearby homes. one passenger trapped for nearly an hour, two suffered substantial burns and air lifted to local hospitals. finally, take a look at this incredible surveillance video showing a train slamming into a bus in decatur, georgia. you can see seconds before a csx train smashed into a marta bus
wednesday. first everyone was like i'll walk out casually then look what happens, there you go got hit. you know the bus driver could be heard on the video before the crash telling people the bus was on the tracks. six people were injured running for safety. after the crash, five people taken to area hospitals with minor injuries. the bus driver was issued a citation for improper stopping on the train tracks. let's go to wall street, stocks seem to be in a holding pattern. cnbc's mandy drury joins me. good morning. >> good morning, jose. what little gains seemed to have completely disappeared now but even though the color is red, the losses are very small. as you said, we're kind of marking time here but the dow crossing its all-time high of 18,288 and at the time the biggest impact there on the index was coming from names like goldman sacs, home depot and apple. the s&p had a whopping seven closes this year, wu what we
really want, jose, what we haven't had yet are the record closes followed by a major breakout and that's really proving tricky. a number of things you know extended evaluations, lackluster revenue growth, weak economic growth last week really highlighted that and this morning home builder sentiment unexpectedly fell, not great news right in the middle of the spring selling season but before i let you go gas prices here at the start of the week, another weekly increase. the national average is now -- >> what's going on, mandy? >> pegged to what's going on with crude. >> i know. >> we were a week ago $2.66 a gallon, now $2.71. gradually creeping up. creeps up on you, doesn't it? >> just in time for memorial day. thanks, good to see you. coming up major announcement from the president this afternoon expected to lay out a blueprint for policing across the country. and the fbi now
investigating safety in the skies after a possible commercial plane hacking. yep, hacking. those stories and more next on "the rundown". ♪ [music] ♪ jackie's heart attack didn't come with a warning. today her doctor has her on a bayer aspirin regimen to help reduce the risk of another one. if you've had a heart attack be sure to talk to your doctor before you begin an aspirin regimen. i am totally blind. and sometimes i struggle to sleep at night, and stay awake during the day. this is called non-24.
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new friskies 7. for cats. by cats. and now to developing news out of the white house this morning. the obama administration expected to announce a ban on certain military style equipment given to local police by the federal government. from grenade launchers to bayonets. the hope is to provide images again like these from ferguson missouri, last summer and improve relations between the police forces and communities they patrol. all ahead of the president's trip to new jersey later today, where he will promote these efforts. joining me now from the white house, nbc's ron allen. good morning, what's the president announcing? >> reporter: well, as you mention, jose there's going to be an announcement on ban of certain types of equipment that police have been acquiring over the years. he's also going to try to focus
on this whole idea of community-based policing. camden is something of a success story. if you gooback a few years ago, camden was one of the most dangerous cities in the country had a very high homicide rate and poverty rate, which still endures, but over the past couple years they've reduced those numbers significantly and one way is to have the county police take over for the local police, but the effort there is focused on community-based policing, about having police officers out of their cars out from behind their desks, and on the streets of the city, getting to know residents coaching their softball and little league teams and so forth so there's a real connection. and this ban own these other restrictions on military style equipment to police isn't fitting with that because the president, many activists around the country, see a lot of that weaponry as very confrontational, and the idea is to have police be seen as guardians, or as protecting and serving the communities, not confronting it. so that's part of that issue. and just for background, you know, a lot of police officers and police chiefs around the
country will say they need this kind of equipment because they are facing dangerous criminal elements, so there's going to be pushback, but the idea to try to find a balance, which is why we have continuing protests and so forth around the country. jose? >> ron allen at the white house thank you very much, good to see you. now to dramatic developments in texas after a teen went missing in mexico eight years ago. the 13-year-old arrived in houston over the weekend with her mother who lives in texas. diaz, a native-born u.s. citizen was taken to mexico in 2007 by her father without her mother's consent after the couple divorced. diaz's mother says she never lost hope she'd see her daughter once again. >> together, being happy. i love her. and i'm so happy having her. >> the case grabbed
international headlines last month when a judge in mexico mistakenly identified another girl as diaz and ordered her to the u.s. dna tests showed she was not diaz. joining me now from los angeles, julio, good morning. >> good morning, jose. >> how was she finally tracked down after all these years? >> this case has been dramatic in mexico and the u.s. and it all started with this mother looking for her daughter relentlessly for eight years and it's not clear what made her lead the authorities to the wrong girl in the first place when this young girl was taken again, away from her family, and that's a video we just saw, but that mistake is what made the story come into the spotlight, and that video was all over the place. witnesses captured the moment when the wrong girl was taken away from her family, how she was screaming and kicking and
she was very afraid of what was going on. that video was all over the place, and apparently that's what made the real girl's father decide to do the right thing and he took the daughter to authorities last week and he decided to bring everything to an end. that's finally how her mother here in houston could come to mexico and do some dna tests and finally find out this was her daughter. jose? >> the mother never accepting the reality her daughter had been taken away from÷ sent to another country. she lurked everywhere during eight years. julio, los angeles telemundo anchor, good to see you thank you. >> thank you very much, jose. developing now police may have a new lead as they investigate a mansion murder mystery. and fire in an elite washington, d.c. neighborhood. peter alexander joins us with the very latest. peter, good morning. >> reporter: jose good morning to you.
this is just an awful case and baffling investigators. this is one of washington, d.c.'s most exclusive neighborhoods. this is the home, now the scene of an arson investigation. investigator say the fire that took place here last thursday is, quote, very suspicious, but they do have one significant clue, it's a piece of surveillance video. this morning investigators want to know who this is, calling the individual seen in this surveillance video a person of interest in the murders of four people. the mystery and the man hunt began last week after firefighters responded to a fire at the multimillion dollar home of iron works executive and his wife both were found dead inside. the other victims believed to be their 10-year-old son philip and housekeeper. >> at least on three of the four victims there were injuries discovered appear to be blunt force or sharp object injuries. to three of the four victims. >> reporter: police say one of the victims smelled of gasoline.
the person of interest authorities say, was possibly driving the family's porsche later found torched. >> it's going to be a black porsche convertible sitting behind the church. >> reporter: the family lived in one of washington's most exclusive neighborhoods, just blocks from the vice president's home. >> this is shocking this neighborhood is pretty quiet and tranquil. >> reporter: authorities believe the attack may have started as early as wednesday, one day before the fire. that's when he reportedly left a message for another of the family's housekeepers, telling her not to come to work. his wife following up the next morning texting i'm making sure that you don't come to work today. still unclear why anyone would want to harm the family. >> the first thing, obviously who did it. if i don't have that, i want to know why was it done. >> reporter: the family also have two teenaged daughters who are believed to be away at boarding school when the attack happened. on mother's day days before the
attack abigail reportedly posted this moving message to her mom on facebook, "thank you for the past 19 years and i look forward to the many more to come, she wrote i love you so much." washington, d.c.'s police chief says there is no sign that this was random or of any forced entry, but neighbors report suspicious activity in the days leading up to the fire including an aggressive door-to-door salesman. jose back to you. >> nbc's peter alexander, thank you very much. now to safety in the skies and the fbi launching an investigation into one passenger's troubling claims that he hacked into a commercial jet's avionics. the computer security expert says he hacked into an airliner's inflight entertainment system and briefly took control of the plane mid fight. kerry sanders is in ft. lauderdale with more. kerry, good morning. >> reporter: good morning, jose. it's hard to believe that anybody in the back of the plane could somehow take control of
the avionics up here in the cockpit, but a hacker claims he did just that by tunnelling through that seat-back television in the seat in front of him, through the entertainment system, right up here into the cockpit. and now the fbi and united airlines are investigating and they are taking it very seriously. >> we're trying to make the system better and more secure. >> reporter: chris roberts is either a hacker who's uncovered a dangerous back door that could allow a passenger to take control of a plane. >> it is definitely possible to manipulate the electronics through the inflight entertainment system and satellite communications to get to the avionics of an airplane. >> reporter: or an exaggerate tor needlessly scaring the flying public. the fbi says in a newly public affidavit roberts claims he hacked into an entertainment system up to 20 times and at one case caused one of the airplane engines to climb, resulting in lateral or sideways movement of the plane. while agents continue to look
for evidence of that the fbi issued a statement to nbc news late sunday "there is no credible information to suggest an airplane's flight control system can be accessed or manipulated from its in-flight entertainment system." roberts has now stopped giving interviews, but on sunday tweeted, "my only interest has been to improve aircraft security." but there's widespread skepticism about his claim, recently retired commercial airplane pilot jim tillman. >> the folks at air bus and boeing are far too smart to create some system like that. >> reporter: bob sullivan is also skeptical but -- >> there's a long history of computer hackers on the right side of things tinkering maybe around the edges of the law and we don't want to shoot the messenger here when a messenger has an incredibly important security problem to talk about. >> reporter: the plane i'm in right now, owned by trinity air
ambulance, it doesn't have that entertainment system, but they allowed us in here to show how advanced the cockpits in planes have become. meantime, the gao just released a report, its investigators say the experts they spoke to say any cockpit linked to the internet should be considered vulnerable, even to malicious actors. jose? >> kerry sanders thank you very much. i got to tell you if i'm on a plane, if you're on the plane and the person beside you brings out computer stuff and plugs into the entertainment system and starts wiring it differently, i think you could do the call button. they don't like it press and say this guy is a little odd. what do you think victor. coming up, the death sentence for the boston marathon bomber unsettling. more on the legal proceedings for dzhokhar tsarnaev. and congress divided as ever over powers to tap into phone
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law, he should stop it immediately and we shouldn't be doing this. >> rand paul and i agree on most things, he doesn't agree on this. he doesn't like the house-passed bill either. we're in a different place on this. reasonable people can differ. i think it is an important tool if we're going to have the maximum opportunity to defend our people here at home. >> senator paul isn't the only republican not seeing eye to eye with the majority leader as the senate tries to figure out what to do about the patriot act, specifically a provision that authorizes the collection of american phone records. the provision expires two weeks from today and the senate is scheduled to be off next week for me moil day recess. with me now msnbc's chief legal correspondent, airri melber also co-host on "the cycle." good morning. >> good morning. >> the program not authorized by the patriot acted, so why are we even talking about this? >> that's a great question. the way the court ruled in this
case is as you reported jose this program, this bulk collection of data is not legal because it was not authorized by congress, but it's a lower court and what it basically said was it was not going to immediately halt the entire program. in fact, it specifically referenced this ongoing debate in congress and said, well, let's let them weigh back in on this before doing anything drastic. >> well, mcconnell wants a two-month extension to keep his options open. what are the options and do you think he'll get those two months? >> i think that is unlikely. we see this in congress a lot but there's a reason why the patriot act was scheduled to initially expire when it was passed after 9/11 and why it continues to have that sun set. it is because even those who supported it said you need times because it's so extreme, such a strong measure, you need times for the country to step back and reassess it. this would be i think, the most critical time for that reassessment we've seen. why? well, number one the court ruling you just mentioned
that's significant. independent federal jujts saying this thing is not working as planned, two, the edward snowden revelations which brought to light and showed while the nsa certainly has a right to keep certain legitimate secrets it had broadly misled the government and public about the scope of this program. now people who say, hey, i don't care, let them do espionage, let them keep quiet and let's authorize a big old program that's a fine public political position jose, but one of the congress ought to get on record for. what you see senator rand paul and a lot of democrats frankly as well, in the house saying, look, this went too far and we're going to either let it expire or try to move some of that data collection out of the nsa and over to third parties like verizon, they would hold the data. it's not actually such a significant or big change, but it would take a step back from having the government hold all this material. >> and ari, let's talk about another issue, because i want to move to the issue of what's next after the jury in the boston
marathon bombing trial sentenced tsarnaev to death. a lengthy appeals process is expected after the decision, which came after just 14 hours of deliberations. >> i have to watch my two sons put a leg on every day so i mean, i don't know, closure but i can tell you it feels like a weight has been lifted off my shoulders. so i think there's some form of a good feeling. >> i want to also bring in msnbc contributor host of "the docket," thank you both. talk to me seema if you would about the appeals process. how long is this going to take? >> easily a decade jose, if not more. and the strongest basis for the appeal, i foresee, is this whole idea of change of venue that they were trying -- the defense team was trying so hard to move the case and it seems like they were unsuccessful, but perhaps may have an issue on appeal. >> and ari, since '88, 80
federal death sentences but just three have been carried out. why is that? >> largely because there is a very lengthy appeals process. that is as it should be by the way, jose. this is a very serious, irreversible act and we also have layers of appeals to double check all kinds of rulings in our system. the federal death penalty process even more significant. there's also been issues around the different -- the state level, the different drugs used in the lethal executions and what is proper and how that should proceed, but at a nuts and bolts level, a lot of these get tied up for years. i think that is okay. i don't think there is a good alternative. you want to have a very safe, careful process, and you don't want to have any kind of avoidable error. so we have a system that does still under federal law meet out the ultimate penalty, but checks to make sure there are no mistakes with regard to accuracy and legal error. >> seema some of the family
members against the death penalty raised concerns about being put through this again and again and again. will they have to offer their testimony again in court? >> i doubt it, unless the appeal goes somewhere. and jose, they have a reasonable concern, but really it's up to the prosecutors and the defense attorneys and the judges and the appeals process and they have so many things to consider, such as the law, that sometimes the victims and the families of the victims have to be set aside because like ari was saying, it is an irreversible act. and the appeal must take as long as it has to take. >> yeah, the irreversible act was also the people that were killed there, there you see them on screen. >> heavyjose a lot of us have covered this trial there in boston, absolutely terrible anyone watching at home may feel they want the ultimate justice for this individual but many prosecutors have pointed out, including many involved in this case, that part of the
difference, and i say this quite seriously, is our system provides the type of fairness and the type of justice and the type of civility, if you will, civilized system, that this killer never provided. you'll also hear prosecutors say, yes this is harder, yes, this is different, but that's because we're a nation of laws doing something different, that's what makes us so different than this person who's a convicted murderer that will meet their fate. >> ari melber, great point. seema iyer, thank you for being with me. "the cycle" here today at 3:00 p.m. coming up, look at this video of a twister in oklahoma. you can see there the bottom of your screen the cows just kind of hanging out there. yeah, it's a bad day, but good day for me because i'm still eating. and from cows to an escaped bull charging along a california highway. and that bull is the inspiration for today's five things el toro
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so we're feeling a bit bullish on this monday. let's take this one by the horns in five things el toro. number one, this is a scene in california on saturday 85 miles northeast of l.a. a bull escaped from his home stalling traffic for more than an hour before being lassoed by its owner on horseback. number two from the highway to inside a house. this is what one texas couple woke up to last weekend a bull at the edge of their bed. it led to a very interesting 9/11 call. >> this is going to sound really stupid, but we need to report that there was a cow that got into our house. >> okay, mr. riggins. >> number three, if you've been
downtown to the financial district in new york city, you know this one the famous charging bull. it weighs 3.5 tons dropped to make a statement in '89, took the exchange all day to find a truck big enough to move it. number four, if you've been to spain this time of year bull fighting season from march to october. earlier this month number five take a look at this, that's me in the mask with the king of all cowboys, ty murray. no word on what happened to the bull i rode, but my performers tell me the face mask is a good look. finally, this is no bull our line producer walked into 30 rock with extra hardware on the ring. she got engaged over the weekend. jen, congratulations to you. that wraps up "the rundown" on msnbc. thank you for the privilege of your time. "news nation" with tamron hall is up next. i'll see you here tomorrow. it's time for the "your business" entrepreneur of the week. christina shelden and her mother have always been close.
so it was only natural that linda started helping christina out when she started her jewelry company, christina v. neither guessed linda would become the number one employee. for more, watch "your business" sunday mornings at 7:30 on msnbc. american express for travel and entertainment worldwide. just show them this - the american express card. don't leave home without it! and someday, i may even use it on the moon. it's a marvelous thing! oh! haha! so you can replace plane tickets, traveler's cheques, a lost card. really? that worked? american express' timeless safety and security are now available on apple pay. the next evolution of membership is here. put your hand over your heart. is it beating? good! then my nutrition heart health mix is for you. it's a wholesome blend of peanuts, pecans and other delicious nuts specially mixed for people with hearts. i said people with hearts.
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this is "news nation." police in waco, texas are on alert this morning after a deadly shootout between rival biker gangs left nine people dead and 18 others injured all of them gang members. and police say they are very concerned today about more gang violence. >> i will tell you, the threats have gone so far as major motorcycle gangs putting out hits on officers threats that we're getting are towards law enforcement. they are threatening to kill uniformed officers. >> nearly 200 people have now been arrested and charges with engaging in organized crime in connection with the shootings, which began around noon yesterday, when a brawl at a local bar and grill spilled out into a parking lot. now waco police were already on the scene when the fighting broke out having anticipated trouble at this gathering. what followed shocked even veteran officers there.