tv All In With Chris Hayes MSNBC May 28, 2015 8:00pm-9:01pm PDT
all right. i've give them close to 20. >> they can be sit-ups if you like, but just do your 20. >> we'll give them 20 something. chris hayes is up next. shocking the federal indictment of the former speaker of the house, dennis hastert, over alleged hush money. >> then you have a prosecutor who acts and sounds like she's a political office. >> marilyn mosby under attack as conservatives try to score political points in baltimore. >> she appears to be a problem. >> all this as the officers charged with the death of freddie gray seek a change of venue. plus what happened to surveillance footage from the night chicago police shot and killed a teenager. then the corruption probe into fifa widens as its president speaks out for the first time. >> you can to the allow the reputation of fifa to be dragged through the mud. >> and the republican presidential field gets a little more crowded.
>> this is exactly what the founding fathers feared. >> who is this man? and why is he running for president? "all in" starts right now. good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. dennis hastert, speaker of the house for eight years, from the end of bill clinton's president through most of george bush's presidency has today been indicted, quoting the "chicago tribune" on federal charges alleging he agreed to pay $3.5 million in apparent hush money, to a longtime acquaintance blackmailing him then lied to the fbi when asked about suspicious cash withdrawals from several banks. the indictment from the northern district of illinois court reading, during the 2010 meetings and subsequent discussions, defendant john dennis hastert agreed to provide individual "a," unnamed in the indictment $3.5 million in order to compensate for and conceal his priority misconduct against individual "a." to help us make sense of all of this robert costner, political
reporter for "the washington post." robert, did this come as out of left field to gop politicos as it seemed to come out of left field to all of us today, when this crossed the wires? >> i've spoken to several top republicans and close friends of former speaker hastert and they're stunned. they never expected this. and he's someone who's always kept close counsel. someone who was a candid figure a colorful figure even when he was inside of the house. but most interesting about this chris, these references in the indictment, perhaps his time as a teacher at yorkville high school. >> so let's be clear on the dennis hastert buy bio here. this is a man who was famously high school football and wrestling coach. and every profile you ever read about denny hastert, the guy was every man, high school football and wrestling coach and teacher. it says that individual "a" is
someone who knew him, quote, most of his life. >> someone who was a longtime acquaintance. >> and we also obviously, we have no idea what denny hastert could have possibly done to individual "a," such that he decided to pay us $3.5 million. but the mind reels at the thought of what the original infraction could have been that he would pay this. >> well and the idea that it's hush money is fascinating. i spoke tonight with thomas blily, a former virginia congress manning, a former friend of hastert, and said what was the most defining thing about hastert in the house. he was coach, that's how he thought of him, coach and teacher. he was a quiet man, but always with us and telling stories about his time at yorkville high school. and so this is a shadow. if there was any kind of shadow or thing from his past that haunted him, that was so key to his persona that you could see why it bothered him and perhaps how he interacted with the fbi in such a way. >> we should be clear, the indictment basically is on two major infractions.
lying to federal investigators, at some point, federal investigators got wind of this and started questioning him about why he was making these cash withdrawals, and also essentially, evading currency reporting requirements. banks have to report right, when people are taking huge amounts of -- large amounts of cash out. he appears to have structured his withdrawals to avoid that reporting requirement. >> that's right. and according to the indictment when pressed by the fbi and federal investigators about why he structured his withdrawals in this way, he said he kept the money, and he did not mention any type of possible extortion attempt or any kind of donation or payment to an outside person. >> finally here, tell me a little bit about hastert's post-congressional career such that he had, he was liquid enough to have $3.5 million sitting around. i mean that's not a sum of money that your average high school coach and even member of congress has. >> he's been a highly paid and
prominent lobbyist here in washington, but not a high-profile lobbyist. he's not someone who appears in a lot of news stories, doesn't do much television. for someone at his level, he's kept a quiet profile. there was an investigation, however, by the "chicago tribune" in 2012 about his use of a speaker office. former speakers are provided offices and funds by the profit. there was a question about whether he misused his office in 2012 by the "chicago tribune." that's been the only blot on his political winter. >> all right robert costa, thank you very much. >> thank you. >> dennis hastert was the longest serving republican speaker of the house in this nation. only losing his speakership following the democrat's takeover in congress in 2007. >> dennis hastert was an accidental speaker thrust into the limelight eight years ago in the wreckage of republican losses and other scandals. speaker newt gingrich was forced to step aside. his heir apparent confessed, he had committed adultery. frantic republicans turned to a former high school teacher and wrestling coach from illinois. >> a good coach knows when to
step back and let others shine in the spotlight. >> hastert's poor handling of the mark foley scandal in 2006 almost brought him down. congress manning foley resigned after allegations regarding his sexually explicit messages to congressional pages. haas art chose not to run for minority leader in 2007 hastert resigned from congress. he's been working as a lobbyist in the years since. joining me now andy shaw former award-winning political reporter, and in full disclosure, my father-in-law. andy, you know denny hastert well, you covered him for a long time. your reaction to this news which seemed pretty shocking on its face. >> well, you know chris, normally these sorts of things dribble out long before indictments, and you have scuttlebutt that so-and-so is under investigation for such and such. this is one of the few times, in my 40 years of watching illinois politics that something has come completely out of the blue.
there hadn't been an inkling of acknowledgement that anything was going on with respect to denny hastert and past transgressions. so i agree with the previous guests and this is about as shocking as a political indictment can be. >> what was hastert's reputation like in illinois politics? obviously, illinois politics can be a bit of a cesspool. there's, you could line up quite a perp walk of illinois politicians. what's hastert's political reputation? >> first the context, chris. illinois's regarded as the third most corrupt state in the nation, chicago, the most corrupt city. denny hastert comes out of what's called the illinois combine. the combine was republicans and democrats, who controlled the political structure, and it was a mix of business and contractors and politicians, all of whom seemed to do extraordinarily well within the political confines. remember denny hastert spent four years in the illinois house, as a representative then
six years, did a number of years in congress and he as speaker, was one of the key figures in the illinois combine. this is a combine that basically takes care of contractors and business people and politicians. so he is no stranger to the rough and tumble and often corrupt world of illinois politics. remember, one of his closest friends, former governor ryan went to jail on corruption charges. there have been a number of le-level allegations over the years against denny hastert, one involving the congressional officer that your previous guest rfrd to, another involving a land deal near his home that he profited on and even in '05, there was an allegation in the "vanity fair" article that he had been paid off by turkish interests to help them in america. so he's no stranger to controversy, but he's been low-key all the time and the key is he's always been known as denny or coach. >> so i want to ask this question and i want to sort of tread carefully here. obviously, we're dealing with -- i mean the thing about this
indictment that is so weird and also tantalizing, frankly, is the fact that the allegation here the that there was some underlying infraction. that dennis hastert did something to individual "a," who's known him most of his life, that was so awful, that haas art was then going to pay him $3.5 million. and obviously, the question you got to ask is what the heck was that initial infraction? i guess, you know i don't want you to sort of irresponsibly speculate here, but i guess my question would be, were there rumors about hastert having skeletons in the closet in the world of illinois politics, in his person life in any way that you knew of? >> no there never were chris. and look you can only try to connect dots as best you can. in this case it feels like something that stems from his coaching years, that could easily involve a former student, because that tends to be the way these things play out. a student who, for many years, said nothing, and then perhaps, when hastert stepped down as
speaker, felt a little more empowered to say something or raise an issue. look i'm speculating, but i'm only speculating within the world that the indictment suggests it involves. i don't think it involves a next-door neighbor and barbecues. but you have a wrestling coach and football coach and former teacher and someone he's known all his life. that's the only place you can take this without knowing the facts. >> that's a really important point, in terms of what we have from the indictment. again, these are allegations by the federal government. nothing has been proven. this man is innocent until proven guilty. he -- the only facts we have basically, are, known most of his life which suggests this was a long-standing relationship and also, that the initial meeting happens in 2010 after that congressional career is over as you noted. andy shaw -- >> and chris, what we also know is, that this is a man who wanted to preserve his reputation and have his legacy be that of the longest serving republican speaker in u.s. is
history, certainly not having it marred by these allegations, which would explain the desire to have this go away at whatever cost. >> andy shaw the better government association, thank you much. all right. speaking of charges, a day after over a dozen people were arrested for corruption the head of the most powerful sports organization in the world breaks his silence. then the gross reaction from certain right-wing quarters to baltimore prosecutor marilyn mosby. and the governor of new jersey makes a decision for his state's children that smaxcks of 2016 politics. that's ahead. u can't see that? alright, let's take a look. the one on the right just used 1% less fuel than the one on the left. now, to an airline a 1% difference could save enough fuel to power hundreds of flights around the world. hey, look at that. pyramids. so you see, two things that are exactly the same have never been more different. ge software. get connected. get insights. get optimized. the technology changes the design
likely presidential candidate, chris christie, governor of new jersey is abandoning common core quite possibly because he's about to become a presidential candidate. christie denounced common core at a speech at burlington county college today, saying that the educational standards program that's been in place in new jersey for five years is quote, simply not working. now, christie's evolution on common core began with his strong support in september 2011, saying in a news release, quote, our aggressive implementation of these standards in partnership with districts will ensure our
children have an education that will serve them well in the next stages of their lives. common core has become of course, the latest hated target of the gop base and politicians looking to court it. except for likely presidential candidate jeb bush who himself has been attacked for that support. christie's gradual move away from common core whether authentic or not, would certainly be opportune, should he decide to seek the republican nomination. is getting relief. only nicorette mini has a patented fast-dissolving formula. it starts to relieve sudden cravings fast. i never know when i'll need relief. that's why i only choose nicorette mini. the network that monitors her health. the secure cloud services that store her genetic data the servers and software on a mission to find the perfect match. and the mom who gets to hear her daughter's heart beat once again.
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shot in the head. making this the deadliest month in baltimore in almost 20 years, since 1996 according to the baltimore sun. the wave of violence follows widespread unrest after the death of freddie gray who sustained fatal injuries while in police custody in april. and it raises fears of an intentional slowdown by police as payback for the protests. the horrendous violence statistically abnormal is now being used as a deeply cynical tool to score political points with the right trodding out very familiar and tired lines about quote black on black crime. it's also helping to feed the conservative backlash against baltimore state's attorney, marilyn mosby, who's being charge with ulterior motives. >> you have a prosecutor who acts and sounds like she's a political candidate for office. not an office involving the
administration of justice, was an office involving the administration of the government. >> like she is running for office and she's got an agenda. >> if i were the judge in this case i would seriously question her competence to try the case in a fair manner because her goal is not conviction. her goal is justice. her goal is the correct outcome on the basis of the evidence. >> and justice, what she said there, was by any and all means necessary. >> that's a little threatening. >> wrong! wrong, madame wrong! >> lawyers and the six officers indicted in the death of freddie gray have filed another motion demanding mosby recuse herself in the trial because of alleged conflict of interest and has also childed for a change of venue. joining me now, david fiega, author of the book "indefensible." so, my first thought about this motion, to change the venue was rodney king. before we talk about that precedent, because that proved key, what -- on what grounds do
you file these motions and on what grounds are they granted? what do you have to show a judge to get a venue change? >> you pretty much have to show a judge you can't get a fair and impartial jury and they're filed very regularly and they're denied almost invariably except enter rodney king when a police officer is involved. >> so in the rodney king case that case was tried in simi valley, outside of los angeles, and the community there was much whiter more affluent than the demographic composition of say, a los angeles jury pool and a lot of people think that was key to what ended up happening in the verdict of that trial. >> right. let's be clear. the venue is huge here. and in a way, you can understand this motion as a parable about the failure of policing itself. it's like this. the fact that different races and different cases will see this case as differently as they will tells you an enormous
amount about the sort of heartbreaking legacy of stop and frisk and of the kind of policing practices that the baltimore police department has been engaged in in baltimore. >> and by that you mean that the interpretation of this is going to be so dependent about whether people where people are,s in terms of their own life experience, how they've interacted with the police this is so much a product of the prism of race. and also where you fall in the socioeconomic scale. >> yes, but not just race it's about police practices. the truth is they police baltimore differently than they police for example, howard county right? which is interestingly, they sight this case in their motion that had to do with a civil suit against the police. and it's one of the only other ones where they found a case. their venue was transferred. and it was transferred in that case, and guess what happened? after a woman sued because they handcuffed her 7-year-old son, they moved that to howard
county, more white, more affluent, the jury found against the plaintiffs and for the police. >> and this was in a civil suit. >> if you were the defense attorneys for these cops you would be filing this motion absolutely, right? >> absolutely. it is absolutely critical. and frankly, i think there's very little chance these officers will ever face a baltimore jury. i think it is likely that the venue motion will be granted and if it isn't, i suspect they'll waive a jury. >> that's interesting. talk about that waiving a jury. we saw that in the cleveland case. that was what's called a bench trial. the judge presided over that. and handed down the verdict of not guilty to the officer in the shooting of that couple that was being chased in a car. why do you think they would waive a jury? >> i think they've made it clear in their papers that is they do not believe that they can get a fair trial from a jury in baltimore. they just think this the dynamics are too, sort of not in their favor -- too against them. and by the way i don't think
they're wrong about that. chris, let me say this too, i'm for changes of venue. i'm for fairness. i just wish that this doctrine meant something outside these cases. >> right, basically, your frustration, having worked as a defense attorney is all of a sudden, things become so much -- the scales that are so tipped against the defense in all normal circumstances all of the things we talk about, about due process, innocent until proven guilty, going through all these checks on overreaching of prosecution, suddenly start to mean something when the people being prosecuted are the police. >> it's astonishing. and what's really funny is i mean, think about it. dzhokar tsarnaev the boston marathon bomber, no change of venue. >> if there's ever someone who, you know, who had an uphill battle, with a jury pool in a city that was unbelievably traumatized and terrorized by this mass murderer it was that trial. >> i'll give you another one, jeff skilling in houston, denied! but what's really crazy is rodney king granted. and here's what's really funny
about that whole thing. is that one of the better sentencing decisions ever to come from the united states supreme court, u.s. v. koonce that's stacy koonce. >> oh, right. and disturbing details from the surveillance video from the area where police shot and killed a chicago teen. and dha that really matter for heart health. not all omega-3 supplements are the same. introducing bayer pro ultra omega-3 from the heart health experts at bayer. with two times the concentration of epa and dha as the leading omega-3 supplement. plus, it's the only brand with progel technology proven to reduce fish burps. new bayer pro ultra omega-3.
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shown moments before and after mcdonald was killed. as we've reported on this show 17-year-old laquan mcdonnell was shot and killed by police last october. at the time of the shoog, with cpd did not offer an official account, but a spokesperson said at the time and i'm quoting, that the teen began walking towards pulaski road a major street in chicago, and ignored the officer's request to drop the knife. officers got out of their car and began approaching mcdonald again, telling him to drop the knife. the boy allegedly lunged a at police and one of the officers opened fire. mcdonald was shot in the chest. he was pronounced dead at a nearby hospital. the medical examiner's report showed that the teen was not shot just once in the chest, but 16 times in the chest, scalp, neck elbow, legs arm, hand and back. that revelation led us at "all in" to file a foil request for police dash cam video, which we
had heard existed, of the actual shooting. cpd rejected that request saying that releasing the video would, quote, interfere with active administrative enforcement proceedings and create a substantial likelihood a person would be deprived of a fair trial or an impartial hearing. and then last month, a bombshell development. the city of chicago's top lawyer went before the city's council finance committee and urged the committee to approve a $5 million settlement for the family of laquan mcdonald. a lawyer telling the committee, the officer who fired all 16 shots claimed he was in fear for his life and cited the unreleased dash cam video, that dash cam video we are trying to get released and show you, as crucial to the city's decision to settle the case for that astonishing sum. now, the city council unanimously approved the $5 million settlement. and that dash cam video still has not been made public. but the lawyers for the families of laquan mcdonald have seen it and one of them described the footage to "all in."
>> when laquan is about 12 to 15 feet away from the officers the width of an entire lane of the southbound traffic one officer begins shooting. laquan immediately spins to the ground and the video then clearly shows that the officer continues to shoot laquan multiple times as he lays in the street. 16 seconds pass from the time laquan hits the ground until the last visible puff of smoke rises from his torso area. an officer then approaches laquan, stands over him, and appears to shout something as he kicks the knife out of his hand. >> the fbi, the u.s. attorney and the cook county state's attorney office are all investigating now laquan mcdonald's death, along with the independent police review authority, known as inra. now, come revelations, first reported by nbc television station in chicago that over an hour of surveillance footage from a burger king located less
than a hundred yards from where mcdonald was shot and killed is missing, according to his family's lawyer. listen to this. the footage may have shown mcdonald running through the burger king parking lot and witnesses in the parking lot. we spoke to jay darshayne, a drigt manager for burger king. while he was not there the night of the shooting he told us that several police officers entered that burger king after mcdonald was shot and requested to view surveillance footage. he said he authorized employees at the burger king to give police the password to access that footage. he says police stayed for around three hours, then left. the next day, darshon says he was present when the independent police review authority, that's the chicago version of internal affairs, came to the burger king and asked to review their security footage. he said they discovered a chunk of surveillance footage missing from around the time 17-year-old laquan mcdonald was shot and killed.
according to a mcdonald family lawyer, 86 minutes was missing. in a statement to nbc television station in chicago, a spokesperson for ipra said we have no credible evidence at this time that would cause us to believe that cpd purged or erased any surveillance video. chicago police did not respond to our request for comment. joining me now, michael robins who is representing the family of laquan mcdonald. mr. robbins, your react to this report? >> well the fact that the police entered the burger king restaurant without a warrant or a subpoena accessed the system upon demanding the password and then left and that 86 minutes or so of video is missing from all 11 cameras is something that gave us a great deal of concern. now, the video would not have shown the actual shooting, but it would have shown the events leading up to the shooting and
some of the witnessing leading up to shooting and the police interaction with the witnesses following the shooting. there is no credible explanation for why this video is missing. >> are you in contact -- i mean this case is really really kind of stunning to me identify got to say. it's something we started looking at people we knew at chicago brought to our attention. and the more it goes on the more it feels to me that something's not right here. are you in contact with the various law enforcement authorities that say they are investigating this? are you confident there's actually a process in place right now to investigate whether a crime was committed? >> yes well during the five months or so that we investigated this during which we found out about the missing burg king video, we were able to contact or come into contact with one or more of the witnesses. we were able to -- and then we got the dash cam video. and we saw that the dash cam
video depicted an incident that was completely different than what was represented as having happened by the fop spokesman. so, there's a couple of aspects of this that are really quite shocking. the absence of the burger king video is very difficult to understand. as i understand it, the police claim that when they arrived, immediately after the shooting and accessed the system that it was off. that it was powered off. burger king has told us it's never powered off, and insofar as they know, it was boricworking. so this 86 minutes during the relevant time frame is missing, and it would be an enormous coincidence if it just happened to be powered off during this particular time frame. but in addition the police conduct, in connection the witnesses, is very troubling. there are current witnesses, two of whom we have spoken who witnessed the actual shooting itself, because they became stopped in traffic, at the moment when the shooting
occurred and they were within feet of the shooting and observed it from their stopped car. and immediately after the shooting, the police went up to these witnesses, these individuals who were witnesses, and told them to leave or be arrested. so these people who were motorists were ordered to leave and no one sk asked them what they had seen or even their identification. >> i want to make sure i'm understanding this. this all happened in the middle of traffic on pulaski. there are motorists who are stopped because this has happened in the middle of pulaski. there are multiple police cars. you're telling me there are motor vehicle drivers who are in stopped traffic, who actually witnessed the shooting and are then, after a man is shot and killed by police instructed by police to leave the scene without any information collected or interviews conducted with them? >> that's correct. or be arrested. now, as it turns out, these were motorists, because as this developed, many police were on
the scene, were arriving on the scene. and traffic was stopped on this busy four-lane street. this commercial boulevard. and immediately after the shooting, the witnesses were told to leave. and what happened in connection with one of them is when this individual, who was there with his son, and witnessed this fatal shooting heard what the fop spokesman said had happened and with his own eyes saw that was not true after a great deal of searching of his conscious, he came forward and presented himself to ipra the independent review police authority, and gave them a statement to tell them what actually had occurred. >> michael robbins, this case we are going to stay on. we're filing an appeal of the rejection of our foya. michael robbins, we'll stay with this and thank you for joining us. really appreciate it. all right, the president of world soccer's governing body is defying calls to step down amid allegations of widespread bribery and corruption. so why does a prominent world leader have his back? we'll tell you, next.
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these are unprecedented and difficult times for fifa. i must stress that those who are corrupt in football are a minority, like in society, but like in society, they must be held responsible for their actions. >> sepp blatter spoke today for the first time since yesterday's shocking indictment by top fifa officials by the u.s. department of justice, which alleges widespread corruption within the multi-billion-dollar organization. >> we will cooperate to make sure anyone involved in wrong doing from top to bottom is discovered and punished. >> blatter who has ruled over fifa for 17 years, and faces a
re-elect vote tomorrow, is defying calls to step down. as pressure builds to re-open the bidding process for both the 2018 and 2022 world cups which fifa awarded to russia and the tiny oil-rich nation of qatar, respectively, amid allegations of rampant bribery. the situation is extraordinarily grip in qatar, where migrant workers are building world cup stadiums in slave labor conditions, with hundreds, perhaps thousands dying in the process already. with investigations into fifa continuing in the u.s. and switzerland, many are wondering whether the 79-year-old blatter himself will eventually be charged. and while that would be welcome news for many of blatter's longtime critics, it would represent an outrage from the perspective of one of his few allies. today russian president vladimir putin accused the u.s. of overreach and suggested it was part of a plot to keep russia from hosting the world cup. joining me now, a man who knows a lot about who can and cannot be prosecuted in the u.s. eric
sniderman, state attorney general. so to talk about this corruption case it seems so strange when i saw it. everyone thought, well that's great, because we have all thought that fifa's corrupt and it seems like there's good evidence they are. but what does the -- how does the u.s. do this? what's the jurisdiction here that allows u.s. to pring this case? >> fiefa is an umbrella organization over confederations in different continents. a lot of the charges in the indictment theory relate to the confederation for north america, south america, and the caribbean. a lot of the activity took place in the u.s. they were using banks in the u.s. offices in the u.s. wire transfers here. more than enough reason for jurisdiction. and this was not just an allegation of bribery and money laundering with the world cup. there were other tournaments -- >> tons the of them. >> sure if the gold cup, the north america confederation's premiere event, there were organizations of bribery, money
laundering that spread to different confederations around the borld. the u.s. has more than enough jurisdiction, but the remarkable thing about this case is that it's multi-generational. and i have to disagree with president blatter saying, oh, this is trying times you need circumstances. read the indictment. this has been going on for decades. people come and go and the corruption stays. >> that seems like a segue to our great state of new york here. i mean it's -- there's been a raft of indictments, what is it the fifth straight senate majority leader is that right, has been indicted. five in a row. we were just talking about denny hastert in illinois where they have a long line. how do you go about building and making corruption cases and do they do any good? that's the real question right? so maybe these guys get prosecuted at fifa or maybe you get someone at new york state, you know, a majority leader, but it seems like these institutions are very very very hard to change. >> i think that's a very important point. and it's clear that when the
attorney general and the acting u.s. attorney and others announced this they clearly had their eye on this ball as we do investigating corruption in new york. catching inging bad guys is good but the goal has to be reform. changing systems and conduct so there aren't more bad guys to catch. and i've come out with comprehensive ethics reform proposals, in connection with cases we bring, to send the message, there are only two paths for it. either we'll have more indictments and further erosion of public confidence in new york, 90% of those polled say corruption is a serious problem. not sure how high it has to go before people take action. the goal is not just to continue the prosecutions but path one is more prosecutions path two is real reform. same thing is going to go on in soccer, and it's clear that the u.s. attorney's office has their eye on that ball. their goal is not just to finish with these indictments, catch more bad guys it is to give what they call a fresh start. >> there's an interesting
political role you play as a prominent law enforcement official particularly the u.s. attorney or an attorney general like yourself or you know, a state or for the national attorney general, which is that you know you're an impartial arbitrator of justice, but you're also a politician and also operating a political, and in your case you're elected, loretta lynch is pointed. what was your read on here's this woman who's introducing herself in the u.s. with her first big case right? and it's not a terrorism case. it's not a bank case, right? it's an international soccer organization. she couldn't control that, because it started ahead of time, but it was a sort of remarkable way to introduce herself to the u.s. going after these bad guys alleged bad guys, that most americans have no idea who they are. >> well no but this is clearly a case that she was pursuing in her capacity she was the u.s. attorney. >> it came out of her office. >> it was the u.s. attorney for the eastern district of new york. and i have to say, to undertake an investigation like this when you go back decades and you have
to get cooperating witnesses and wire transfers and records and it was an extraordinary complex conspiracy including dozens and dozens of people -- >> alleged conspiracy. >> yes. all of these are allegations. but the quality of the work that goes into a case like this or into the cases that have been brought against public officials in new york state, you really have to get -- you have to surround those you're accusing of corruption with cooperating witnesses, with documentary evidence. i think that this case sends a message that is a very powerful message for the new attorney general, which is that she's prepared to go not just after individual malfactors but after the much harder cases of endemic corruption and big institutions and whether it is a bank or a nonprofit or a government it's the same sort of complex conspiracy that a lot of prosecutors have shied away from in the past and they're not doing that anymore. >> that's an excellent point and that is something to look at as we go forward. always a pleasure to have you at the table. yet another republican has
entered the presidential race, though you shouldn't feel bad if you only have a vague idea of who this guy is. the insanely huge gop field, next. yea, sorta the valet. both drive for a living, both like to save money on car insurance and we both know you may not get this car back in the same condition. watch your toes. wo! ya boy... get it! sorta you isn't you. with drivesense from esurance, you can earn a personalized discount based on how you drive not how someone sorta like you drives. you'll even get a discount just for signing up. esurance. backed by allstate. click or call.
i'm going to go with number 22. >> number 22. >> number 22. >> feeling lucky on the big board. number 22. here it is. first pick of the 2016 "all in" fantasy candidate draft. >> george pataki. that's p-a-t-a-k-i. look it up. he's the former governor of new york. george pataki. >> here's the benefit to george pataki. >> okay. >> living human being. >> he's alive. >> american citizen. >> yes. >> over the age of 35. could actually run for president. >> he's also very tall. >> he's also very tall, which -- >> so i think you're looking at least between 0 and 100 points. >> that was one of many predictions i completely nailed.
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we're here in exiter new hampshire, birthplace of the republican party, abraham lincoln's party, who saved the union and who brought the promise of freedom to all americans. teddy roosevelt's party, who fought for the square deal so that the rich and powerful couldn't limit the freedom of working americans. and ronald reagan's party, who restored american's belief in ourselves, and in the tran sen dent value of freedom. it is to preserve and protect that freedom that this morning i
announce i am a candidate for the republican nomination for president of the united states. >> former new york governor george pataki is officially running for president. and there are a lot of reasons why his observers. for my money, the number-one reason he's not going to be the gop nominee is this -- he is pro-choice. he is a republican who supports abortion rights. in 1999 he went so far as to call on the republican party to change its platform and get rid of language calling for a ban. but in the year 2015 it is simply not possible in any way, shape, or form for the republican no, ma'am fee for president to be a perp who supports abortion rights. it will not happen, cannot happen. a cbs poll in march found that 75% of republicans think abortion should be banned or more strictly limited. these people are not going to nominate a pro-choice candidate, so you have to ask the question, why is george pataki running for president? there are now eight republican candidates officially running with another seven potential on deck. it's going to be a historically large field. what is going on? why is this crowded republican field so large?
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right now, verizon is offering unlimited talk and text. plus 10 gigs of shareable data. yeah, 10 gigantic gigs. for $80 a month. and $15 per line. more data than ever. for more of what you want. on the network that's #1 in speed, call, data, and reliability. so you never have to settle. $80 a month. for 10 gigs. and $15 per line. stop by or visit us online. and save without settling. only on verizon. joining me now, jess mcintosh, vice president of communications for emily's list and sam seder, msnbc contributor. let's start with -- let me just start with a disclaimer here. i think it's great people are running for president. there's a certain kind of weird undercurrent to some of this coverage, like why are these people running for president?
run for president. it's a free country. i wish more people ran for office. i wish we had 15 candidates on the democratic side. that's great. i'm not hating and i'm not judging. that said, why is george pataki running for president? sam. >> i don't know. to be honest with you, i don't know. there used to be a time where we had this premise that to run for president was a very difficult thing to, do it was very hard on your family, there's a lot of downside, and i think frankly, particularly on the republican side, i've said this, there's very little downside, and particularly there becomes even less downside the more people that enter the race. so george pataki, when he ends up getting no more than 1% -- >> doesn't matter because other people will too, because it won't be an embarrassment. >> 15 guys. >> this is important. you said this before, the more that enter the more the downside diminish, ergo, the more people
enter after that. if he's in, i'm in. if he's going to get 1%, i can be better than that. what you yao never know in politics what way the winds blow. rick santorum, jess, this i think is part of what's driving this, my grand theory of why this feel is so big, rick santorum didn't have a thriving political career, i would say it's fair to say. heed been out of politics when he ran in 2012. he did surprisingly well. >> came in second. >> he came in second. it probably revived his political career, people want to hear from him. >> and everybody's like if that guy came in second then i should at least give it a shot. remember when it was mitt and rick at the end and everybody was like why did tim pawlenty drop out? this would have been his moment monopoly.
>> right. >> nobody wants to be tim pawlenty this year, so now we have george pataki running for president. i don't think it's going to be the pro-choice thing that's ultimately his down first of all. i think it's going to be the boring thing. >> yeah, well, but, yes, he's not a particularly super charismatic public speaker i think it's fair to say. >> he was my governor for 12 years and i forget his name all the time. >> subdued. >> i think it's not just -- i think it's less that there's a chance i could win, although, you know, there is a chance, i mean, you know, no one in the republican race now has more than ten points, you know, so there's only ten points that separate number one and number 16 or 17 or wherever we're at at this point. but the bottom line is this is going to help pataki at the end of this, he's going to be able to get a job as a commentator, may be sitting next to me next time we show up in a year. and there's value in it. i mean, i think every one of these guys realize there's value in it. herman cain has a radio show. he may not have needed the money but he wanted that type of celebrity and he has it. >> the other big thing to me is the debate stage is a big deal.
if you can get on the stage, there will be tens of millions of people watching those debates. you can have a real effect if there's issues you're passionate about. jess, i don't know, like if -- to come back to the choice question, i think there's a lot of reasons george pataki will not be the nominee before you get to that, but do you agree with me that's just a disqualifier? essentially impossible. >> yeah. i mean, george pataki is pro-choice like a republican can be. he once endorsed the idea of making late-term abortion a felony even if the woman needed it in order to survive. but compared to this field where you have scott walker today sign an abortion ban with no exemption for rape and incest, rick santorum, who thinks contraception is abortion and should also be wrong and jeb bush who intervened as goff november to force a disabled underage rape victim to carry her baby to term, these guys are a completely new breed of republican when it comes to
choice. and george pataki actually can distinguish himself that way. i just can't imagine he would want to. the huge problem, they alienate women who ought to be their supporters with these hard line doctrinarian advances and can't get out of it. >> there's been a sorting process. democrats could never nominate anti-abortion candidate and the republicans could never nominate a choice candidate. >> in 2004 there was a little bit of talk about how the democrats should soften their portion on abortion. hillary clinton was part of that, of that movement. >> i think that's gone. >> that's gone. >> i think that's very gone. >> very much gone. let me get back to a guy like pataki. a guy like pataki, he could stick around far lot longer than anybody anticipated because we've said this before, too, if i'm pete peterson and chris christie is not going to carry
my message of cutting entitlement, i'm just going to pay for pataki. >> stick around. thank you both. that is "all in" for this evening. the "rachel maddow show" starts now. >> good evening. thanks, my friend. thanks for joining us at this hour. this is kind of an amazing story. historically speaking one of the things that will always be awkward about the bill clinton impeachment era is that newt gingrich, who was speaker of the house at the time of the clinton impeachment, right, leading the impeachment crusade against president clinton because of president clinton's extramarital affair, newt gingrich later had to admit that at that time that he was leading that crusade against president clinton because of the president's affair, he, too, newt gingrich, he was also himself having an extramarital affair at that time. one of several as it turns out. that is like the, you know, neon glowing hypocrisy asterisk that will always float over that