tv The Ed Show MSNBC June 26, 2015 2:00pm-3:01pm PDT
tactical arms. and if he was shot that way that it would be a different type of injury. i can tell you from seeing most of the officers out there they were all equipped with tactical arms. >> two, sr. new york state law enforcement officials have confirmed richard matt has opinion shot and killed. he was one of the two prisoner who escaped from the clinton correctional facility 21 days a ago. reportedly shot near lake titus about 20 miles from the prison. and we cannot confirm the whereabout about sweat. and the ed show picks up our breaking news coverage right away. good evening, americans and welcome to the "ed show" tonight. we start with our rolling coverage breaking news unfolding in upstate new york. two senior new york state
officials tell nbc news that richard matt, the man on your screen right there, was one of the two men who escaped from upstate new york correctional facility, has been shot and killed by law enforcement officials. details of the shooting have not been released by law enforcement as of yet. the escape took place on june 6th. this is day 21 in a very heavily wooded area. and the shooting apparently took place in the titus mountain area, which is about 15 miles south of the canadian border. let's go to nbc's john yang who joins us from all's new yorkowls head, new york. >> reporter: we now know richard matt has been killed. and this is the first confirmed sighting since he left prison almost three weeks ago now tomorrow. this all happened very very
fast. they were having sort of for a long time looked like they really didn't have any idea where these guys were. and then the big break came, started last weekend when there was a break-in at the summer camp cabin near owls head about 20 miles from the prison. someone was going towards their cabin cabin, saw it was broken into or heard someone fleeing from it. went in and saw half eaten food. the police were able to take that food and determine from dna testing that at least one of the inmates had been there. then again they searched that area. things seem to have gone cold until yesterday. here in malone they found another break-in at a cabin. more evidence was found, sent to the state labs. again dna suggested or proved one of the inmates had been
there. this morning more evidence was found in a field nearby. and now this closing in on them. they have got richard -- i'm sorry. they have shot and killed richard matt. the question is is david sweat far behind? they have no evidence. they have said all along, they have no evidence two t two have split up. so the assumption is david sweat is somewhere in this area. they are clamping down here hoping he is still in the area and hope they can now get him rather quickly. ed. >> john, do we know where the shooting took place? and do we know any details of the shooting? >> reporter: we don't know yet. we do know it is apparently in an area around a ski area titus mountain. this has been where they actually moved a lot of the focus last night. they pulled down a lot of check points inside owls head and mountain view last night and moved a lot of the operations
here or to that area. we don't know anymore details. this has really just happened within the past hour or so. so it is unfolding rather quickly and we don't know many details yet. >> john yang reporting from owls head, new york. let's go to clint van zandt, msnbc contributor and former fbi profiler. thanks for your time tonight on this crucial story as it's unfolding. let's talk about the area the terrain. it would seem to me that this heavily wooded area of upstate new york was probably one of their biggest advantages being on the lamb. i mean to be able to elude law enforcement. what are you thoughts on that? >> reporter: i this think you are right. i think what we're going to find out is once these individuals escaped and once joyce mitchell who was theirs get away driver once she didn't show up it
looks like as complicate as their escape plan was outside of to get out of the wall once they got outside, they didn't have a plan b. plan b was let's go from cabin. let's hide from tree to tree. i looks like what these guys have probably been doing is working their way through some of the over perhaps 1 thousand little hunting cabins up there breaking in, using the food maybe the clothing. getting access to weapons. and then moving on again. and as i said ed i think these two -- the relationship that may have kept them together is obviously they needed each other. one needed to sleep. another needs to be on guard. they needed to protect each other. but once they were seen twice they were seen supposedly last week. once running out of a cabin and the second time their dna was found in yet a second cabin. once law enforcement had that i
think it confirmed what they believed, ed that these guys had not been able to elude the circle of between 800 and 1100 law enforcement officers that have kept these two confined in this heavily wooded thick area to move there. and i've heard people say why can't they catch them? they have planes and infrared? well the woods are so thick, ed, that if you and i were standing ten feet apart we might not see each other. as well as other things that move in the dark a deer a bear, a dog, a human being is going to give out a heat signal for the airplanes and helicopters. and that's been a tremendous challenge for law enforcement. and realize every police officer, f fbi agent, atf agent moving there thank you woods he or she is a potential target for these two individuals that the state police have said are armed and dangerous and i think most
of us believe likely would not allow themselvesing to be taken alive. >> clint van zandt, stay with us. i want to bring the audience up to date. in case you just joined us the two fugitives on the run, one has been shot and killed in upstate new york. matt had been shot and killed. david sweat is still on the loose and there is a very intense search taking place at this moment in upstate new york. searching obviously for david sweat. they don't have any information as to whether these two had split up. and details of the shooting have not been released by law enforcement as of yet. we're expecting that i would imagine pretty soon. but clint, it is very interesting that there had to be a definite strategy by these two fugitives. because they didn't steal a car. and they didn't take anyone hostage. what do you make of that?
there seemed to be a very direct strategy by these two to elude law enforcement in a certain way using the woods to their advantage, what do you think? >> i think you are right ed. they probably decided together if we try to steal a car, if we try to take a hostage, anything like this that is going to tell law enforcement exactly, to the square foot, where we were at a given time. so i think instead they made their way along these trails. and ed know there are hiking trails. there are atv trails that lead from the jail to owls head to malone. it passes through these trail, passes through all of these areas we're told these individuals have been, have been sighted. their dna has been found. but when you realize there are so many guys on the inside. so many convicts on the inside and they spend their every
waking hour thinking how they are going to escape and trying to develop information on what is outside. i would assume these two found out within a 55 mile square area how you move from point a to point b without a vehicle in this case on foot. but that was a very poor plan b. it didn't get them out of the area and again law enforcement has reacted so quickly to every potential movement. even though you can't reach out and touch them they knew that they knew these two were still in this area. and the tenacity that these men and women have shown i think is terrific. especially we've had these ups and downs, ed for the past two weeks or so. everybody runs to a spot we think we've seen them. then we don't see them. and then it happens again. but law enforcement has not given up. they have stayed on the hunt and as the state police told us yesterday there was a high probability that one or more of these individuals had secured a
weapon, a shotgun, a rifle, a handgun -- something from one or more of these hunting cabins. so i think every one of these 1100 law enforcement officers realized when they finally see these individuals, if they raise a weapon, knowing that these guys likely might not want to be taken alive. i don't think anyone was going to play games with them. this is a very deadly game of hide and seek. right now we know one of the two has lost. the search continues for the second. >> and thank you clint van zandt. stay with us tonight throughout the rolling coverage. joining me by phone is msnbc reporter adam rece who has been covering this from the start. adam. >> reporter: i can tell you the intense man hunt is probably getting under way right now. i want to tell you according to the sheriff of franklin county he was shot in elephant's head. south of lake titus and south of
malone, where the dna is located they told us about today. so sweat is either going north or south from there. if he's going south it is likely he's going right into the arms of this large contingent of law enforcement. but if he's going north and if he realizes how close the canadian border is. they have cameras all along. you are looking at the map right there. you see how close we are to canada. only a matter of miles. they have cameras on numerous trees all along the border there. they call it "buckeye." these are cameras that automatically take a photo when there is a sensor activated. so they have those cameras in force should he have decided to go north. if he's going south he's likely going right into the area where there are numerous law enforcement. so it will be interesting to see how quickly they can capture him. i can tell you they have swarmed that area.
as every day when there was a tip or a lead they would just swarm the area. so i'm -- i can imagine they have done this times ten now that they have got matt. and so the search for sweat continues. and you can bet they are just swarming that area. >> adam tell us again. your information is that he was -- richard matt was shot near elephant head which is south of the titus mountain area? >> it is south of lake titus. which is also itself south of malone if you look at the map. the area is called elephant's head. just like all of this other area of the adirondack mountains. wood wooded, difficult to get through. some of the pictures in front of you, those officers are standing on someone's home grounds. but once you go back into those woods, you have brush and all kinds of debris that's added up over the years.
and it was described by many people to us as just incredibly difficult to get through. so these guys have been making their way through these mountains through these woods for days. but at least for one of them it's come to an end. >> and that is 48-year-old richard matt confirmed dead. shot and killed by law enforcement earlier this afternoon. let's turn now to jim calfvanagh. give a sense of the search at this point. does it intensify now that one has been shot and killed? and give us an idea of what we know of the possibility of them splitting up? >> you're hitting it spot on. they were together and they were very determined not to go back. they are not people that could be facing a trial. they are facing the absolute certainty of the cell. both serving live. sweat killed a police officer. matt a murder here and a murder
in mexico. with certainty they know they are going back to the cell and they also know they are not going to the honor building. so they are very determined to get away. and i think we may see that matt, as you have discussed might have had a shotgun or a firearm and he was engaged by a officer and killed. now sweat is alone on the mountain. his partner's been killed. he likely knows that. it is very hard to get your mind now set, no matter what great criminal you think you are, to be able to deal with all of this. imagine you are in the north woods literally. you have every officer and agent after you. and the border. it is hard to think straight. i don't think he's going to last very long. he's not got a lot of food. not going to be able to carry a lot. and he doesn't have a partner to enkaurj him. so the good news is hopefully he'll be apprehended without anybody else getting hurt.
but also he's a very desperate guy and doesn't have a lot of options. if he and get to somebody there is still potential for injury or disaster to a citizen. >> a very dire situation david sweat is feeling right now. the anxiety, not thinking straight. the pressure mounts, he doesn't have anyone to lean on. i does that make him in the eyes of the law enforcement more desperate? give us a sense how law enforcement is viewing the search right now. what changes? >> it does change for law enforcement. it is better for them to be after just one. two is worse. one can be the lookout. one can, you know, sleep. one can rest. they can encourage and help each other. they can egg each other on. they could jump somebody by one you know talking to somebody and the other jumping them in the back. so they lose a lot of advantage. when it is one guy you are dealing with one mind. and it is the collective wisdom of all the men and women of law
enforcement. and i like to call it the collective wisdom in the command post. there is a command post there and all the sheriffs and police in the region. federal agent, marshals fbi, atf. they are all there, they are all talking and using their wisdom and saying how is he going to move? what he's going to do? and they have done a great job so far. we don't know of any citizens hurt as of yet. if so that's good news. now if sweat can be captured tonight with nobody getting hurt, they can go back and revisit the investigation. i think that the real tale here is when you are in the penitentiary and you have been tried by a jury or found guilty and you truly are a guilty person. now there are a lot of innocent people that gets trapped in there too. but if you are truly a guilty person you are not held by the walls of the prison, you are
held by the citizens of the united states and its walls. and just getting over the walls is not good enough because the citizens and its i laws are going to track you down. >> jim cavanagh stay with us. continuing coverage. breaking news richard matt one of the two escaped convicts shot and killed in upstate new york. for more now on the telephone is mark clakston. 2,000 leads, 21 day, one man down and david sweat still on the loose. sum up the intensity of the search at this hour. >> reporter: i can tell you the intensity has really picked up significantly. and as previously stated especially on the part of law enforcement now. there are some advantages now that addressing or dealing with one person as opposed to two as jim laid out perfectly. but there is also a tremendous
amount of anxiety from law enforcement. you are hot on that trail. when you feel as if you are close to drawing conclusion to this situation. it becomes a lot more emotion, a lot more adrenaline and more focus on the obvious dangerous that exist. and i tell you just from personal experience having been fishing up in new york state, the cabin there and being lost in the woods right alongside the salmon river it took the three of us several hours just to find an occupied cabin to be rescued from. and that was without stress without the feeling as if the walls were closing in on us. but desperately trying to find our way through these thick woods and accurately describe that at some points you really don't see five feet ahead of you. it is tricky maneuvering and dense vegetation and under a lot of stress you are bound to make a mistake. and i think law enforcement has
done a tremendous job of maintaining that perimeter and trying to force a mistake out of both these individuals. one now at least in custody and reported killed. and the second one now, i'm confident, is desperately on the run and bound to make a mistake at some point. >> mark thanks for your time tonight. we'll have more on this breaking news story out of upstate new york after this. stay with us. you are watching msnbc. ♪ i built my business with passion. but i keep it growing by making every dollar count. that's why i have the spark cash card from capital one. i earn unlimited 2% cash back on everything i buy for my studio. ♪ and that unlimited 2% cash back from spark means thousands of dollars each year going back into my business...
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talk about the technology of this search and what happens right now. what about the infrared technology? how good is that in this densely wooded area? how effective and how are they going to use it at this point? >> well it's been said in searches like this that law enforcement rules the night. i know various tactical teams. fbi, swat team, the hostage rescue teams. atf and marshals tactical teams. all have night vision capability as well as fixed wing aircraft that can do lazy 8s hours at a time in the air that you can't even hear when they are above. as well as helicopters. they all have this capability. but again you have to have a signal. you have to be able to differentiate from a deer from a bear from a dog. there is going to be a lot of heat signals that are going to be out there.
and just know ed i got some information that there has been potentially two different bursts of gunfire that have been heard in the area. one when an encounter was made with matt. and then there was a subsequent burst of gunfire that's supposedly been heard. i don't know what this is yet, whether this is a second sighting. whether it is just a second report of the same gunfire. but there is a hope that law enforcement may be getting very close to the second fugitive who you know is david sweat. >> okay. and clint, one of the things that has to be taken under consideration here as these two were on the run, isn't it rather amazing that there was never really a visual by anyone? that they were never really spotted. they left a trail of going into these cabins. but your thoughts on that that
they were able to elude a visual sighting. >> well as, you know there were sights in philadelphia. there were sightings along the u.s./mexican border. there were sightings in canada. over 2,000 tips and leads that came in but most of these if not all turned out to be bad. a cab driver in philadelphia suggesting the two fugitives got inside of his cab. that the philadelphia police were able to refute. you know there was one or two sightings we had ed that may have made sense. up in the area of the prison there was one report these two guys were seen walking down a street. cutting through a backyard. allegedly apologized and took off in a run. but again, every time law enforcement would move into the area we've got a hot sighting and let's go for it. they came up empty handed.
it wasn't until last week when i said i think the safe money said these guys if they were in that area, if they stayed within a 25 mile radius of the prison or so they had to be breaking into these cabins. they had to be getting food water, clothing, maybe guns and ammunition by moving from one cabin to the next, to the next. we know two different cabins within the last week. they found the dna of one if not both fugitives inside of that. so what that did was number one confirm for law enforcement they were still there. don't chase leads all over the country when we think the two are still here. and number two, that they had food they had water and most importantly they had perhaps firearms. we know the state police as of yesterday voiced the likelihood that one or more of these guys may have acquired a gun and i think that somewhat changes the perspective or law enforcement. we assume it is a dangerous
fugitive hunt when you are looking for two killers. but now when there is solid information they may have a gun in their hand i think every officer in that area was ready to deal with a threat if he or she saw it. and apparently at least in one and perhaps -- perhaps -- in a second case that may have happened within the last hour. >> and if i may get an analysis from you, clint van zandt, on what sweat is going through right now. is it harder for him to elude? how does his situation change right now now that one of them has been killed and he's now on his own? >> if he was anywhere close to the second fugitive to matt at the time matt was shot and killed, he would have heard that gunfire. he would be running through these wodsods trying to put as much distance as he could from that location and himself as he
could. that is positive for law enforcement again. we can hear him. he can see him from the ground. we can see him above. but i think right now you have really got the proverbial man on the run. and he's got to make a decision ed. because very quickly law enforcement is going to give him two choices. surrender or die. and he's going to have to make up his mind which one is he going to do. is he going back to prison? i mean he's doing life. he can't do anymore time than he's doing already. or does he want to go out. we realize this is a guy who killed deputy sheriff in broom county x number of years ago. 13 years ago. we know is a so-called cop killer. would he do it again? does he want that mark on his head stone that perhaps he shot at another police officer.
they will give him a choice but i guarantee you, jim cavanagh and i have some other guests, we've been in these searches. we've been in these hunts and there is nobody of the 1100 law enforcement officers out there are going take a chance with this guy whatsoever. it is hands up or feet first ed. and that is the reality of a situation like this. . i want to bring in now pat brown, criminal profiler. pat, good to have you with us tonight. your thoughts on what david sweat is going through right now. and is it easier to predict what he's going to do now that he's on his own? >> it's kind of funny in a way. obviously they completely screwed this up. you know, they had a plan and i think -- you know, joyce mitchell just might be lying she was going to pick them up at that manhole. and now i'm thinking that was probably the only plan they had and the woman did them in.
and if they had gotten a ride out of there we'd have matt on the border of the mexico. but we've had them running around in the bushes for a very long time and that can't be very much fun. matt's dead. and sweat has got to be pretty much at this point at the end of his rope. he knows he's not going to get out of this. he just knows that. and the how much energy does he have to fight? okay fine and he's going to put up his hands or like clint just said is he going to have one last try at the last moment in the sun and, you know -- it's hard to predict that. but i can say again with clint the police aren't going to take any chances because quite frankly he's worth shooting down. if he makes a move they are going to do is that. >> pat, your thoughts on the
escape plan. you believe that mitchell was clearly a big part of this and once she didn't show that they were really winging it and had no plan b? that is your guess? >> i really do at this point. now in the beginning because -- matt had a successful run before. got all the way to mexico and of course killed somebody down there and ended up in jail. when you are dealing with a psychopaths they change their minds quickly and they are erratic and really can't predict. and they are not as smart as people are. a lot of times they are bullies and are willing to do stuff the rest of us ant r aren't. but look at the plan. it looked pretty good. the way they manipulated some people or got them to cooperate and planned this break. you would think they would have some kind of plan besides completely depending on her. because they should have known she wasn't necessarily reliable. maybe they didn't have anybody
else. and now there you are and you don't have a way to get out the area. and you can survive a pretty long time in the summer. it's summer. all you need is water. you can go for days without food. and you can walk around in circles. but the problem is you are walking around in circles if you don't have a real way to get out of the location. eventually somebody is going to close in on you what is exactly what happened. obviously they had no plan b. it was joyce mitchell. and that was foolish but maybe that is all they had. >> are you surprised they didn't steal a car or get access to some kind of vehicle to get out of the area? >> yeah. you know i mean i don't know the area. and this is one of the problems when you try to do any commentary or profiling from just -- i've found often times doing work on cases i thought one thing and when i got to the actual location i looked around and well oh no wonder. i don't know how much access
they had to anything out there. first they are thinking the police are after this em and looking for them. and they have lost their ride. and i don't know what they are say seeing from the ground they are at. maybe they have to go hide. maybe they don't know where the roads are. i don't know how close anything was. if there was a close road and houses and cars i would be very surprised and, you know, if that's true. yeah i would be surprised. what would be the harm for them just to go up to a house, break in grab the key, grab a car. take a hostage. i mean they're killers. and, you know, it's surprising no one's been injured up until now and only think thing i can think is maybe it wasn't that easy to access. and i don't know what it looks like up there arn the prison. >> criminal profiler pat brown with us here on our continuing coverage on msnbc to bring you up to date. 48-year-old richard matt one of
the two convicted killers and escapees from the clinton correctional facility in new york city on the run for 21 days until today. richard matt shot and killed by law enforcement. david sweat, the man on the right of your screen is still on the loose. there is an intensive man hunt taking place right now in upstate new york. this all unfolded around the lake titus area. we'll have more on msnbc, lots more to cover as our continuing coverage continues.
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>> reporter: i just got off the phone with u.s. customs and border protection. under that heading is the border patrol. it is the border patrol tactical unit that took matt down. it is another version of a s.w.a.t. team. they carry side arms and m-4 rifles and go in four man teams and 16 man teams. we don't know the details exactly how he was captured and why and how he was killed but the unit who took him down were about 10 miles from the border is the border patrol tactical unit. we spent some time at their headquarters in swanton, vermont. and they have numerous assets in the air, on the ground and a lot of dogs. and they have cameras all along the border on trees.
they are sensitive and they react to any movement and they snap a picture. those pictures are fed back to their headquarters in swanton. we don't know -- that system is called buckeye. we don't know if that was the system that led them to matt. but again, it was their tactical unit that brought him down. their version of a s.w.a.t. team. >> so u.s. customs border patrol tactical unit is the group that engaged matt. there was a shootout. the 48-year-old convict is confirmed dead. and these cameras that you are talking about adam are very basic cameras that a lot of sportsmen use when they go deer hunting. and they will set them up and put them up and look at the bait and see when the game comes in from time to time. and i'm sure that is what you're talking about, isn't it? >> reporter:
>> reporter: exactly. they have sensors and take a picture when there is movement. and one of the pictures showed two men running. they are very accurate very sensitive. and again we don't know if that was how they picked up richard matt. but it was their unit. and i can tell you speaking to one of their members, they are very proud men tonight taking the credit for bringing down richard matt. >> all right. also adam, stay with us. the "new york times" is reporting there's been a second round of gunfire. can you tell us anything about that. >> reporter: i don't know anything about that. but i can tell you the location is elephant's head which is just south of lake titus. i don't know where this second round of gunfire was. but this is all in the area near malone where authorities did locate a second spotting of dna in a second location. and that was reported to us today. i don't know about the second situation of gunfire. but it is quite possible they
are on to david sweat. i don't know. >> all right. i also want to point out that the cameras that you are talking about that are set up on trails that would record game or anything that moves. they are light sensitive. they are also many of those cameras have documentation on exactly when it happened. they are also time sensitive. to this would be very helpful to law enforcement in the search. >> reporter: right absolutely. and as i mentioned a little earlier, you can be guaranteed that they are swarming this area. now they know where matt is and was, they are probably guessing that sweat is not too far behind. if he went south or if he went north closer to the border they are just swarming that area. they have got numerous agencies working on this. all kinds of assets bringing to bear in the air on the ground military assets. so they are probably a lot of
excitement among law enforcement that they got one of them. they want to get the second one. >> msnbc reporter adam reiss who has been covering this from the start with some vital information tonight. u.s. customs border patrol tactical unit is the unit that engaged richard matt who has now been shot and killed. for more let's go now to clint van zandt, msnbc contributor and former fbi profiler. what can you tell us about the u.s. customs border patrol tactical unit? i did not know that u.s. customs had a tactical unit that did this kind of work. your thoughts? again, obviously they do and they train with all the other agencies and this is kind of their forte too, ed. anything along a border this is something they train for. as we know they have issues along the u.s./mexican border
they deal with all the time. and even though we don't have people necessarily running across from canada into the u.s. we know we've had fugitives come back and forth across and terrorists come back and forth across that border. and i guarantee you because they are so close right now, they are only about 10 miles away from the canadian border. we have long sensed this 4:30 4:10 shooting that took place this afternoon. canadian authorities have flooded that area on their side of the border too. they are standing there waiting to see if this guy had got any way whatsoever to try to work his way across. so the state police put out information yesterday suggesting their belief that the two fugitives were likely trying to flee north up into canada. if in fact sweat continues this path, if the information was correct and they were going that
way, he's in a panic now. he's running. he is relying on just adrenaline. and the adrenaline very well might drive him to keep going the same direction he was going. so between the canadian authorities north of the border the u.s. authority south of the border and as your correspondent says the 1200 officers flooding that area right now, our hope is that he can't be too far ahead of us. >> clint stay with us. we're following the breaking news out of upstate, new york. and of course u.s. customs border patrol tactical unit has been credited with the kill of richard matt. 48-year-old man on the left of the screen. and david sweat still on the loose. "new york times" reporting there was a second round of gunfire. that is the latest and newest information and we'll continue coverage here, stay with us.
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we are back on msnbc with breaking coverage. the two convicts that have been on the run for 21 days one of them has been shot and killed by law enforcement. 48-year-old richard matt is dead. david sweat, the other convict, is on the loose. there is an intensive man hunt taking place at this hour. john yang joining me from owls
head, new york. >> reporter: actually i'm in malone at the state police barracks. we are anticipating a briefing. they are really flooding this zone where they encountered richard matt. all sorts of activity. all sorts of state police. their customs and border patrol car i saw go by me. new york state forestry officers also involved in this. the assumption is that david sweat is not far behind. they have said all along they had no evidence these two men had split up. that they were working on the assumption that they were together. so that now that they have gotten richard matt. they believe david sweat is in this area. they are really closing down on this area. this is the closest they have come. whoever's got richard matt in their cross-hairs is the first guy to make a confirmed sighting of richard matt since he was last seen in his last check in
the prison three weeks ago tonight. so this was the first time that they got them. they are not hot on the trail of david sweat. and some optimism that they are going to get david sweat tonight. >> john yang nbc reporting at malone, new york. and we'll keep following the breaking news out of upstate new york. what do you think of when you think of the united states postal service? exactly. that's what pushes us to deliver smarter simpler faster sleeker
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msnbc msnbc. one of two of the escaped convicts has been shot and killed by law enforcement. let's go back to clint van zandt who has some information on that shooting. clint, what can you tell us tonight? >> reporter: ed, a couple of things. number one i think the reason the state police suggested these individuals were armed, and as you had talk to one of your correspondents about trail cameras, evidently state police had a trail camera of the two fugitives earlier this week in which matt was in fact holding a shotgun. that allowed them to suggest that they were armed and dangerous. and the shooting of matt today by at least one person that i'm getting information from suggests that at least matt if not matt and sweat, attempted to hijack a vehicle in the vicinity of malone. when the driver eluded them they shot -- or matt shot at the driver. that driver was able to get
away, called the police state police and border patrol swarmed into that area and then a shootout took place between matt and the that i have right now, ed. >> so there is a very brave and a very lucky citizen out there tonight who was shot at reportedly by richard matt and that, of course then he went and told law enforcement where this guy is and they closed in on him. i mean that's quite the drama, isn't it client? that's really unusual how these things unfold, isn't it? >> yeah if this is true as the information is coming in and realize you and i have to take the first information and then we have to source it multiple times. but if in fact this is true this is something, ed we've talked about the last three weeks. why haven't these guys attempted to hijack a vehicle, why haven't they stolen a car? well i think this speaks to the degree of desperation that they
have right now and that should this be true they were willing to expose themselves. they were willing to step out and try to steal a vehicle. they were willing to shoot at the driver they were so upset or in such a desire to stop that driver and, as you say, if this story is true as it's coming out right now, this guy was extremely lucky, number one, to elude these two, and number two, it didn't take law enforcement long in that area. once they get a report like that you send everybody in that area crashing into that area. that confrontation took place with matt. a gunfight took place between the authorities and matt. he was shot and killed but this information that i have also suggests the belief that sweat was in that immediate area if not actually with matt at the time this shooting took place. if that too, is true ed that
means that he's only best case scenario, a few hundred feet maybe a mile one way or the other away at this particular time. so what we're going to see, ed is this ring that's going to close in that area. you're going to see law enforcement right at the site of the shooting that are going to be pushing out. then there's going to be a ring of law enforcement officers on the outside closing in and they're going to try to get the last fugitive sweat, boxed in between them. and again, that makes him probably the most dangerous man in america on the run right now because he fully realizes what's going on. he realized that he's only a foot away perhaps from being grabbed by law enforcement. >> and clint, we've got about 3 1/2 hours of light left before darkness tonight. does the -- does the intensity
change for law enforcement? does it speed up their movement? what changes, if anything in this search? >> they would like to be able to find him, obviously, in daylight. as you and i discussed, law enforcement rules the night with night vision glasses for those underground and aircraft overhead. ed they're also i'm sure bringing in dogs that would have the scent of sweat, and they would be using those dogs. so they're coming at him a lot of different directions but i think anybody in law enforcement would tell you we'd rather find him in the daylight than we would be looking for him at night, but again, if they think he's in that area right now they have to press the hunt. this is as close as they believe they've been to these guys in three weeks. they don't want to lose the ability to find him now. >> okay. clint van zandt. thanks so much. we'll have more on this breaking news event out of upstate new
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we don't have john yang. we're setting up the camera there. i'm joined again -- i'm joined -- let's go now to msnbc reporter adam reiss. you reported that u.s. customs and border control was attributed with the kill of escaped convict richard matt. can you tell us more? >> sure we're getting more details from wnbc's jonathan dienst who is reporting that tactical unit heard shots. this happened a little over two hours ago, 3:45. they heard shots around route 30. they went to that area and apparently richard matt may have raised the shotgun that clint van zandt was talking earlier they knew that he had, he may have pointed it at the officials and they responded with gunfire. again that border patrol tactical unit around 3:45 this afternoon along route 30 heard
shots. they responded, confronted richard matt and apparently he may have raised a gun at them and pointed it at them and they responded with gunfire. now, they are in hot pursuit. of course, they want to put an end to this and find david sweat. >> okay. tell us about route 30. is that like a two-way -- two-lane highway, a road through the woods there in upstate new york? what do you know about it? >> i'm actually not familiar with route 30 but i can tell you generally in the area there are two-lane roads. but it's just open country coming out of the mountains. the pictures that you're looking at, everywhere around you are mountains, woods, 6 million acres of this type of terrain in the adirondack mountains. so whether or not he was coming in from the woods or headed towards the woods, there was some kind of gunfire. this might have been what clint van zandt was talking about before the confrontation with the driver.
he responded, and that's what they heard. they bent towent to the area and confronted him. >> adam reiss, great reporting. thanks for your time tonight. that's "the ed show." i'm ed schultz. our continuing coverage is now picked up by anchor chris hayes. good evening, chris. good evening, i'm chris hayes and this is msnbc's special coverage. breaking news in hunt for two escaped murderers on the loose for three weeks. police have shot and killed a person they believe is richard matt. cell phone video caught some of the mayhem including the dramatic moment a police officer drove past bystanders saying we got him. >> it went pretty fast. >> one guy