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tv   Weekends With Alex Witt  MSNBC  June 28, 2015 9:00am-10:01am PDT

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ace 300 of those. clean. clear. brita water. nothing is better. new reaction after the fbi and security own of terror attacks. a setback in space travel why this exploding rocket matters. the fight over the
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confederate flag intensifies today. we'll take you live to the heart of the battle in south carolina. plus the pride parade kicking off in new york city at this hour. why this one may be the biggest yet. >> hey, there, everyone it's high noon in the east. welcome to "weekends with alex witt." the search for david sweat enters its fourth week today. they escaped from dannemora on june 6th. matt was shot and killed on friday when he was found near malone. matt refused to drop the shotgun he was carrying. the buffalo news citing a law enforcement force saying that matt was probably ill from bad food and drinking at the time he was found by police. former accomplish told nbc news that matt was not someone to be taken lightly. >> he was dangerous.
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and as i said before evil. if you really wanted to know what the devil looked like take a picture of richard matt. look at a picture of richard matt. that was the devil. >> chilling description there. chris palone is in new york. good day. what's the latest from there? >> reporter: alex as you can see, state police are maintaining a checkpoint here on the northern part of the perimeter inside which they are searching for david sweat. this area is about 22 square miles and goes from this road right next to me along the salmon river down to the town of duane where police are conducting checks where they march across the landscape. it's a difficult search. this is thick forest land and the weather is not helping out at all.
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it has been raining heavily all day and that affects the ability of police dogs to find a scent. it also affects the ability for police helicopters to fly. we haven't seen any helicopters out yet this morning. when richard matt was killed on friday, they believed he was traveling with sweat though they have no visual confirmation of that but at this point that's their best guess. >> we've established a hard perimeter and law enforcement line of sight to line of sight throughout -- considered a very large perimeter. police feel there's credible evidence that inmate sweat is within that perimeter and if he's in there, we're going to find him. >> reporter: and out and about this morning, i have noticed a lot more activity by police driving up and down these roads on the northern part of the perimeter. as a matter of fact we've even seen search teams going into the
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grass and woods outside the perimeter a little bit and some of our teams have seen police going door to door in the homes back towards malone. it looks like even though the hard perimeter is established around this forest land that some teams are going outside of the perimeter to conduct searches or re-search areas they searched over the past week or so. >> chris appreciate it. let's bring in law enforcement analyst and atf agent jim kavanaugh. who's more likely to make a mistake, the fugitive or the police? >> it's going to be the fugitive. i would say sweat is in a mental sweat because he's been out there for three weeks. he's alone. he's going to be in a manic state. it's very hard to focus and think. he doesn't have a proper diet. he's in an extraordinarily challenging situation. the weather dropping down to 49 degrees up there. he has all the disadvantages but
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he can slip and he can hide so i've had guys slip perimeters like the sheriff described where you have troopers in line of sight but when dusk falls, one man can slip across that perimeter. and once he does in darkness he can move through the woods as well. he's not calling uber and he's not going to get any help from the local residents. if they think he's in that perimeter, they ought to be able to come up with him in a few days. >> you heard the report that richard matt before he was killed authorities say he had been drinking. what's the likelihood or mentality of david sweat, is he drinking to try to numb the pain or do you think -- that's not wise. you add that to not eating properly or drinking properly and there it goes. >> right, that's going to dehydrate you. these are guys in the pen been deprived the alcohol like that. they come upon it and revert
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back to their -- these guys are not the arch criminal of sherlock holmes fame they are vicious criminals. they plotted their escape from dannemora, but look what happened, once joyce dumped them at the manhole cover, it's all a race through the woods and dropping candy bars with a trail. they are not as smart as we'd like to assign them. but they can sometimes take advantages of things and try to attack people. look what matt did, shot at the guy pulling the camper probably when he was drunk. >> could be. >> not a smart criminal. >> when you look at the terrain, 22 square miles, the weather is hammering things if my director can put up the shot of the terrain as well. it is so dense, jim, does that work more for those looking for someone or for the guy so he can
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hide out? >> it works for guys who can hide out because we've conducted a lot of surveillance from the woods ourselves in law enforcement. if you wear green clothes or camouflage clothes and don't move you can sit 20 feet into the woods off the hard road and watch everything going down the road. they are not going to be able to see you. when they see you is when you move. so as long as he lays low, they won't be seen but he's got to travel to try to get out and that will be the weakness. i don't think he's very strong physically. if he's in there and likely is i think he'll be caught in the next few days. >> appreciate it as always. breaking news,en anne manned space exrocket broke apart shortly after liftoff this morning. the failure is a severe blow to nasa counting on private industry to transport cargo and eventually astronauts to the orbiting lab. scott kelly spending a year on board the international space
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station tweeted this picture and message, watched drag on launch from space station, sadly failed. space is hard. teams assess below. secretary of state john kerry in vienna word that those talks could slip past the june 30th deadline on tuesday. chief foreign affairs correspondent andrea mitchell joins us from vienna. welcome to you. that's a fast approaching deadline deadline. will they meet it? >> they are not going to meet it. we've been told that's not going to happen. that is the news today because the iranian foreign minister zarif is returning tonight from vienna to tehran to get further instructions and consultation there are hard line statements from the iatola khomeini putting out new red lines that backtrack from the agreement
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reached in switzerland. this has come to a real deadlock here in vienna in the last 48 hours. secretary kerry arrives, zarif arrives, european leaders arrived and in the initial meetings they've discovered that they need clarification. was that posturing or bargaining position from the ultimate authority in tehran or was in fact a new negotiating position. that needs to be clarified. our own reporting from the iranian delegation and my colleagues here is that there is some flexibility on one key issue which is sanctions, that the iranians would agree to a three-stage process and wouldn't be until the beginning of the last stage when the agreement is fully operational several months from now, even as late as november that in fact the sanctions would have to be lifted. that would indicate some flexibility on that. u.s. officials are telling us there is a real problem on accessibility for the weapons, nuclear inspectors from the
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international atomic energy agency, u.n. inspectors were head quaurtrtered here in vienna. that's one of the reasons why the foreign minister is going back to figure out what are the real red lines from iran. are they backing away from what they agreed to in april or coming closer? the deadline is tuesday and it's very clear to everyone here they are going to work past the deadline. all of the officials say that everyone has agreed to stay for a few more days and see if they can reach a comprehensive agreement. >> red lines or not, can it be interpreted in an optimistic sense if he is heading back -- the fact he is going back to talk and consult and continue negotiations from tehran and presumably bring that back correct? >> that is exactly the way u.s. officials are interpreting it. this is a good thing. he's going back. they believe he is very determined to try to reach an agreement and that the fact that he's going back to find out what
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is the flexibility and might be bringing back iran's atomic energy agency head mr. salhi, who is a key player here and sidelined with some surgery. if he does come back with zarif, he is the counterpart to moniz, i think the glass is who half full han half empty. >> we like hearing it that way. we look forward for your show at noon eastern time tomorrow. developing news in taiwan. a massive fire at the water park left hundreds seriously injured. the water park is located in the northern city of new tie pay. most of them sustained burns on the lower parts of their bodies. kerry sanders has the developments. this is a horrific story. how did it happen? >> it's just so unexpected. it was a hot day, about 100 degrees, people went to the
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water park to cool down and have fun when the scene turned into a scene of disaster. around 1,000 people were partying at the popular water park when theatrical colored powder was thrown from the stage for dramatic effect. the powder caught fire and set off an explosion sending panicked crowds screaming and running and images captured on this amateur video. >> he says suddenly it was sprayed and there was sparks then fire on our bodies. rescue workers treated hundreds on the scene. the young victims were still in their swim suits. inflatable water rings were used as emergency stretchers. the mayor of taipei says use of the powder is now banned and official investigation is under way. hundreds are still hospitalized and many in critical condition. >> the authorities say that there are the possibility of charges of professional
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negligence as well as possibly endangering the public. this is so weird because the base of this ignition was corn based starch which is not something that would ignite. they are trying to determine what this product may have also had in it maybe something to do with adding the color, that resulted in making it a flammable situation to begin with. >> i tell you, those pictures i don't recall anything seeing anything that horrific in a long time. those people running on fire through fire. okay -- >> yeah horrible. >> thank ug for that story. >> yeah, horrible. >> a celebration of gay pride interrupted when shots ring out and security expert on alert for new terror threats ahead of the july fourth holiday. e home without it! and someday, i may even use it on the moon. it's a marvelous thing! oh! haha! so you can replace plane tickets, traveler's cheques, a lost card. really? that worked?
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we have to take our country back. we've lost our jobs we've lost our money. we're a third world nation and debtor nation at the same time. i built a great company. i have some of the great assets of the world and talk about that only from -- not bragging i talk about it because that's the mentality that this country needs. >> that of course gop presidential candidate donald trump talking about his run for the white house. he's close behind jeb bush in the latest republican poll in the state of new hampshire. mean while an array of hopefuls weighed in today on among other things the landmark supreme court decision on same-sex marriage. >> i think it's a transformational moment. there are a lot of upset people that believe in traditional marriage that are disappointed and they are down right now. but the court has ruled. i would not engage in the constitutional amendment process as a party going into 2016 accept the court's ruling and fight for the religious
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liberties of every american. >> i think it is wrong for the federal government to force christian individuals, businesses and pastors and churches to participate in wedding ceremonies that violate our sincerely held religious beliefs. we have to stand up and fight for religious liberty. >> if you're going to have a new celebration that we're not going to discriminate are we going to now discriminate against people of conscience and faith who may disagree with this ruling? >> well tuesday it is expected chris christie will join the growing ranks of republican candidates to assess the changing landscape, i'm joined by fred yang and msnbc contributor robert trayhnum. does chris christie muddle in already muddled gop picture? where do you think he fits? >> he fits there's no doubt about it. the more the merier, if you
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will. this is a two-tier race the top-tier race of scott walker if he gets in the race and jeb bush and john kasich and others if you will. i think you see that based on the debating structure that fox news and others have put out there. i'm not surprised. it's a wide open field and republicans reserve the right to run as many candidates as they want. this is a good thing for the party because you have a lot of ideas out there and you also have clearly a lot of people that have something to say as it relates to the overall direction of this country. i personally wish that more democrats run on the democratic side because it is the democratic process. this is a good thing. >> two questions here, there was a time when the democrats might have feared chris christie how would he stack up against front uner hillary clinton now? and how do you explain donald trump. >> let me take the second first. a lot of things right now,
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especially for republicans is about name recognition. through his various business ventures and tv shows, he's got clearly a high name i.d. but i think our nbc wall street journal poll showed that beneath the venear of name race there's not a lot there. he's like a horse at the kentucky derby who sprints out ahead but doesn't have the qualities or the strength to make it to the finish line. the first question is i agree with robert i think there's a lot of different voices for the republican primary. there's no other option other than to say it's good for the party. maybe there will be a lot of airing of different voices and it doesn't remember who the republicans nominate given the way the countries are going and president obama's strong approval ratings. mrs. clinton whoever is a democratic nominee will be a strong candidate. >> with the new polls showing that bernie sanders has modest gains on hillary clinton in both iowa and new hampshire, modest
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being the operative word here. here's bernie sanders this morning. >> we are going to win new hampshire we're going to win iowa and i think we're going to win the democratic nomination and i think we're going to win the presidency. the american people are sick and tired of seeing the disappearance of the great middle class of this country. they are sick and tired of working longer hours for low wages while at the same time 99% of all new income generated is going to the top 1% and the top 1/10 now ownsome almost as much wealth as the bottom 90%. >> is he a better messager on that than hillary clinton? >> i would argue that mrs. clinton, other people in the democratic nomination for president, also have very strong credentials on this whole issue of the disappearing middle class and income inequality. he's a strong voice and eloquent
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voice but to alex to say he is the leading voice on this i don't think is 100% right. >> robert want to get to you regarding ted cruz on same-sex marriage, the supreme court decision there. let's take a listen. >> today's decision was a travesty. it was not constitutional. it was five unelected lawyers imposing their own radical views on this nation. what we saw today was five unelected judges setting aside the constitution and saying the preferences of over 300 million americans don't matter. >> so robert one propping up obama care and other supporting same-sex marriage, should the gop candidates drop their overt opposition? how do they negotiate these waters to their benefit now? >> well two things number one, to speak to senator cruz specifically, that was a bunch of hyper bolly we heard.
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the constitution makes the supreme court matter it is a co-equal branch of governance. and at the end of the day, everyone knows about my personal life. i'm gay, proud gay american and aploud the supreme court's decision on friday but i think a lot of republicans and maybe even some democrats that disagree with the supreme court decision will say elect me. if you in fact elect me you perhaps may be voting for the next supreme court justice because as we know there are three supreme court justices that are at or near retirement or at least gave the impression that they may be retired at some point. i think this is going to be a rallying call for many conservatives and fund raising tool. but the reality is the affordable health care act is here to stay. and also the reality is that marriage equality is the law of the land and all 50 states and thank goodness for it. >> so fred will these issues
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either of them be on the minds of voters in 2016 or as senator lindsey suggested, be on the lines of religious liberty. >> to give a pollster answer yes and we don't know yet. they will be very much on the mind of republican primary voters, when senator cruz and other conservatives talk on these issues obamacare and same sex, they are not looking ahead to november 2016. they are looking ahead to the republican primary. so yes, i think these issues will be top of the mind for voters. the billion dollar question will be how much will these issues matter in the general election next year and that i don't think we know yet. >> good to see you both. >> thanks. >> new debate at the south carolina statehouse this weekend after a protester tears down the confederate flag.
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>> how about monuments and schools and renaming streets and completely do away with everything that 260,000 people died for, it causes -- >> that was the scene outside the columbia statehouse yesterday where folks on both sides of the issue gathered. two activists arrested in columbia have been released on bond. both charged with defacing monuments on state capital grounds after 30-year-old climbed the flagpole and took the flag down. sarah dallof in columbia. good day. >> reporter: good afternoon, alex passions an emotions still running high on both sides of this debate. you can see a small group of supporters from removing the flag are behind me. over my other shoulder two police cruisers parked near the base of the flagpole keeping an eye on it since it has become a symbol of this renewed and controversial debate. earlier this morning a crowd of
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about 50 motorcycle riders actually stopped traffic at this intersection with the help of a police escort. the group is comprised the several motorcycle clubs on their way to charlton. they did pause here to take a group photo. one of the bicyclists telling me it is high time that that flag came down that is a sentiment we're hearing echoed by many here today. >> a constant reminder of racism of hatred and bigotry and has to come down. >> of course there is another side to this story. pro-flag demonstrators out yesterday say it is their right to have it flown. it is a symbol of their heritage and part of their history and that that flag should remain up. now the south carolina legislature has agreed to debate this issue. that will happen later this summer to remove it would require a two-thirds super majority vote by both the
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house -- >> thank you so much. the pride weekend celebration in new york takes on added significance in the grow of that historic supreme court ruling. we're going to look at the festivities. bring us your aching and sleep deprived. bring us those who want to feel well rested. aleve pm. the only one to combine a sleep aid... plus the 12 hour pain relieving strength of aleve. be a morning person again, with aleve pm. head & shoulders with old spice. america's number one male dandruff brand. keeping you 100% flake-free. guaranteed.
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each brita filter can replace 300 of those. clean. clear. brita water. nothing is better. the search for escaped murderer david sweat enters its fourth week today. they escaped from the clinton correction alpha silt june 6th. matt was shot and killed near malone new york. searchers are coopsncentrating on a 22 square mile around where matt was killed. earlier i spoke with an investigator and asked him if he's surprised. >> law enforcement has taken their time in a deliberate way, not to place themselves in harm's way and i'm certain over the next 24 to 48 hours we'll get more information and
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hopefully he'll be in custody. >> when you mention that about the kind of harm that police officers and those searching for david sweat are in what is that like? given that terrain that these guys are walking in relative darkness half the time because of the thick brush and trees there, there's going to be incredible nerve-wracking for them? >> i don't think it's as nerve-wracking as you might imagine. they prepare for operations like this. we're in a situation where mr. sweat may actually see law enforcement before they see him. and because there's a possibility that he may be armed, we have to always be mindful of that fact in our attempts to apprehend him. >> you make a good point. we know that richard matt was armed with a shotgun and he was found after he fired a shot at a camping trailer. are you surprised that he did not surrender? >> no in cases like this you're only going to have a couple of different outcomes either the person is going to engage police in an attempt to flee and have a suicide by cop or commit suicide or continue to
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run. >> is it more difficult for law ep force. officers as they focus in on a fugitive not willing to surrender? >> i don't think it's any more difficult. it gives us a glimpse into how they may respond. the dragnet is tightening and the suspect is getting desperate and tired and we'ry and dehydrated. to me he's more dangerous now than days ago. >> it appears these two fugitives have spent most of the their time together since making their escape back on june 6th. how common is that as opposed to splitting up? >> it depends on people we're dealing with but in this case they enacted a plan together. they escaped together and been together. i'm sure they had planned in different ways to be together and now i think law enforcement is a distinct advantage now that he's on the run alone. >> the first break became when the dna was found in a cabin 15 miles from the prison. it is indeed owned by corrections officers. we know two prison workers are
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already facing charges in connection with this case. i'm curious about the dynamics at play that could drive prison workers to assist convicts in a plot like this? >> it's hard to say. in similar escapes in the past and other facilities, there have been cases where prison employees were involved in different aspects of the break. in this case, i think you're going to see more employees investigated and reinterviewed to try to determine exactly what the scope of their involvement was in this escape. >> that was former atf special agent matthew horace. intelligence and law enforcement sources say there are no concerns of possible isis inspired attacks in this country over the fourth of july weekend. those concerns were voiced before friday's deadly attacks. peter king a member of the homeland security committee said friday's attacks showed the threat of ice is inspired terror must not be ignored in this country. >> what does that say about the reach of isis? >> they are incomparable as far
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as being able to reach the disaffected and deranged and also reach the idealogically committed. police officers attacked with hatchets and attacks in garland, texas. >> let's bring in alan goldman, co-author of "enemies within" good to see you. from your experience as a national security reporter does this warning feel different than others issued over the years? >> no not particularly. the fbi is taking this seriously and they are -- the particular field offices across the country are spun up. and they are watching the people they need to watch. there's a large number of people. i think there are 4500 domestic terrorism cases, all at different stages. >> do you get a sense given that this concern was articulated before those friday attacks overseas, will those attacks likely cause u.s. officials to reassess possible threats here? >> i don't think so. i think they have their wake-up
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call with garland. then you had an incident in new york where they shot and killed terrorism suspect and another incident in new york where another individual there the joint terrorism task force was watching. we didn't need tunisia or other eevents to happen to know there's a possibility of a threat. >> johnson urged local law enforcement to be vigilant as well as the rest of us as citizens, see something, say something. how strong are the concerns of isis inspired terror attacks here? can you put that in perspective? >> clearly they are strong and clearly the u.s. intelligence is taking it very seriously. you know we started with a crackdown on people trying to travel. we put enormous amount of emphasis on that. the word among some of these deranged people as pete king likes to call them you're not going to be able to travel
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overseas. here's the big problem for law enforcement. many of these people hundreds they are tracking, are just talking about doing things. it's all talk. they don't know in the end whether somebody is going to do something. take what happened in charleston for instance that guy had been talking about doing something bad and in the end he did it. apparently the people around him didn't take it seriously. the same applies when we're talking about domestic terrorism as well. >> adam you wrote about the more than 50 men and women charged by u.s. officials with these alleged islamic state activity. do you see a common thread beyond talking about it that's driving these people towards the isis philosophy? >> yeah if you look at the individuals who are involved in this i think a large majority of them these are rudderless people with no future looking to be part of something bigger. many of them you could just call losers.
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they are attracted to violent ideology. look frankly, you also have people in certain neighborhoods who get attracted to violent gangs too, right? and they go out and kill people and gangs kill more people in this year than terrorism ever will. it's the same sort of model. >> so can you put a scale of one to ten, the level of alarm about this fourth of july terror that we're talking about? >> i mean i wouldn't quantify it. look obviously it's independence day, law enforcement is going to be prepared. it's just something they would obviously be ramped up to deal with. you know i don't see a need to hype the threat. >> okay. adam goldman, good to talk with you as always. >> at least four shots fired in san francisco saturday evening when an argue the turned violent at a gay parade. people went running and screaming. a 64-year-old bystander was injured. police officers rushed in with
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hand guns and took several in for questioning. the fight was not tied to the gay pride event there. here in new york millions are expected to attend the annual parade pride particularly after friday's supreme court decision and joining me now emma margolin. what's it looking like? >> reporter: hi, alex i'm in the center of the biggest part in america right now. there are thousands of people here organizers expect 2 million will watch this parade. we have uptown funk madonna playing, andrew cuomo, sir ian mcallen and we had a chance to catch up with scott stringer. here's what he had to say about the parade. >> this may be the greatest day for a parade in new york city ever. the fact that marriage equality is a law in the land and new york city played such an important role in making this happen. i'm here with my wife three and a half-year-old and 2-year-old
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and my boys never have to worry about who they love or what they love or believe in. we have changed things not just for our generation but people who come after us. amazing day for this country. >> reporter: and there you have it. obviously a lot to celebrate here two days after the supreme court's historic ruling legalizing same-sex marriage nationwide. there's no rain, no storm could upset this parade. it's a total party. >> i'm glad to find you in the middle of. the rain has lifted. it may be a little damp but i get offset in 20 minutes, i'm going to watch things off 30 rock. enjoy. new developments enfolding in the talks to limit iran's nuclear ambitions and raising questions about what a deadlock in the standoff really means. trucks ♪ boys? ♪ mamas, don't let your babies...♪
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iran's nuclear program are dpog past the june 30th deadline. iran's foreign minister has headed home for consultations before returning tomorrow for push for a break through. six world powers are pressing to resolve some key issues with iran and they include, sanctions relief, u.n. access to iranian nuclear sites, reducing iran's stockpiling of low enriched uranium and ability to interview iranian scientists. the president of the global security foundation author of "nuclear nightmare." it's good to see you. >> my pleasure. >> we have this deadline that will not be met. does it mean anything much or think it's just fine? >> this is a self-imposed deadline. wanted to wrap up by june 30th. it's very clear negotiators are telling us they are not going to meet that deadline, they need a few more days and that's what they are talking about, days not months not an extensive deadline extension. not a breakdown of talks.
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i personally expect the deal to be wrapped up sometime between july 4th and july 8th. >> okay. as you recall, in april, there was a lot of public posturing after the sides agreed on a framework for a deal. could these public declarations back then ultimately get in the way of a final deal? >> yes, they could. particularly the statements by iran's supreme court leader where he appeared to be backing away from the conditions they agreed to in april, particularly on the critical issue of inspections, where would inspectors be allowed to go? would it be all facilities? what would be the length of time they would be allowed to visit those facilities? i think that speech that statement is more aimed at two things one just toughening the bargaining position of iran going into this final round and more importantly, aimed at his domestic audience. the hard liners who are against the deal the supreme leaders saying i'm the tough guy. i'm not going to be pushed
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around by the great satan, you can be sure it's the best deal we could get. >> it's one thing to try to get a deal past these negotiators from the u.s. uk china and russia and germany france. but with regard to stateside, getting it past congress is difficult. bob corker the chair of the foreign relations committee said on wednesday, i have become more concerned about the direction of these negotiations and the potential red lines that may be crossed. so how much of a wild card is the u.s. congress here and could that scuttle a potential deal. >> you see the u.s. senators in essence being the mirror image of the supreme court leader in iran. they are drawing their own red lines, they are trying to stiffen the spines of u.s. negotiators so they won't make many concessions. in the end -- this could complicate things as you want to narrow differences, this could be pushing the sides a little further apart from the posturing on both sides.
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in the end, however, i think you're going to reach agreement. people close to these negotiations tell me they can see solutions to all of these difficult issues text has been written. but it's bracketed. there's a solution a, b and there's a good sign that the foreign minister is heading back to tehran to get blessing we think, for some of these solutions that have been hammered out. you're going to see this kind of shuttle diplomacy playing out intensely over next week. >> you're expecting a decision or an agreement by say the 8th of july. what do you think is the biggest sticking point? >> it's two of them. one is the pace of sanctions relief. what does iran have to do before they get relief from sanctions that have hammered their economy? the second is this issue of inspections, more than anything else we want to catch iran should it cheat on this agreement and that involves us going to sensitive sites, talking to scientists. we want to have maximum access.
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iran wants to restrict that access. those are the two toughest points remaining. >> thanks so much. how has pop culture turned the tide in the support for same-sex marriage. that's next. dude totino's blasted rolls. sweet. totino's blasted crust rolls... yeah. flavor at full blast benny's the oldest dog in the shelter. he needed help all day so i adopted him. when my back pain flared up, we both felt it. i tried tylenol but
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it is the second attack in as many days and the sixth in the past two weeks. a new claim on who gets some of the credit for the historic ruling on same-sex marriage variety is highlighting how the industry paved the way for this landmark decision in a special issue out tomorrow on nus stands and joining me now is senior editor, this is pretty cool. if you think about it hollywood had tremendous influence. >> if you look at gay rights and what has happened in the last 20 years, gay people have come so
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far since ellen degeneres came out in 1997 she was on the cover of "time" and many people in middle america didn't know what a gay person looked like. you think about gay rights now, we've come a long way in reflection of celebrities that have come out and been very vocal and let us look in their personal life and see their marriage is the same as any other marriage. >> absolutely. there's elen. are there others that have come out in support? >> ellen led the way in 1998 and in 2008 had her gay wedding on the cover of "people." rosie o'donnell, that was a big deal. elton john came out. lance bass. ellen page at 26. there's so many examples and if we look tv i think was ahead of the movies on tv shows like "modern family". >> even "all in the family" dealt with that. >> three's company joked about
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it. tv has been more daring than movies and the reason is because the movies need a box office and still regions particularly in asia and russia where the audiences aren't as accepting of gay people. >> you talk about movies that did powerful impact on the subject and that's got to be "brokeback mountain", philadelphia", well made films heralded for the quality of the films and very sensitive issues. >> we talked to directors and writers on this issue. it's the tenth anniversary of brokeback mountain. he talked about how he was worried people wouldn't see the movie in shopping malls in all of america and it went on to make close to $180 million. but that was a ground breaking movement and april a lot of people went to see the movie and they were interested in watching a gay romance on the screen. >> could you categorize this is probably an age-old question does hollywood reflect culture
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or does hollywood sort of jump start and get culture ultimately to reflect it? >> i think it's a little bit of both. when we see images in the movies or on television we look to hollywood as a representation of how people live their lives and so when we see chris on glee and couple on "modern family" being normal i think it shifts our own opinions and people start to believe, they are my friends, i'm friends with ellen. we want to have an attachment to celebrity. when we see people being so open about who they are and who they love, we become more accepting as a population. >> can you get a sense of how hollywood is? >> incredibly happy, everyone has been so excited and people have weighed in and talked about how happy they are, gay and straight people and a lot of straight allies have helped with the fight. >> out tomorrow?
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>> out tell tomorrow yes. >> that is a wrap. thankds for watching. we'll have live news updates throughout the day. taking the hill with patrick murphy is next. there's some facts about seaworld we'd like you to know. we don't collect killer whales from the wild. and haven't for 35 years.
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