tv NOW With Alex Wagner MSNBC July 20, 2015 1:00pm-2:01pm PDT
and hackers are threatening to release the names of 37 million users of an adultery website. and donald trump offends veterans. >> john mccain picked a fight with me. i'm not picking a fight. >> donald trump not apologizing. >> he he's a war hero because he was captured. i like people that weren't captured okay? >> he's not a fan. and. >> i think he mayo an apology to the families of those who have sacrificed in conflict. >> it is not just absurd. it is offensive. >> trump knows that. he should just apologize. >> john mccain a real hero by the way. >> suggesting most mexicans that came across the border were rapists was not enough for all of these strong brave candidates to call for donald trump's exit
from the race. >> he's making a mockery of perhaps the most important exercise i think in all politics. >> everybody loves me. everybody loves me. >> has the irrepressible unscripted sometimes unhinged donald trump campaign finally gone off the rails? today he's facing condemnation from the rnc, his rivals and veterans groups for initially saying saturday that senator mccain is not a war hero. >> he's a war hero. >> he's a war he roe because he was captured. i like people that were ntd captured, okay? i hate to tell you. he's a war hero because he was captured. okay? and i believe perhaps he's a war hero. but right now he said some very bad things about a lot of people. >> fellow candidates the remarks drew lot more outrage han his remarks on immigration.
but far from apologizing he released an op ed saying quote, i don't need to be lectured. and also accused the media of stretching his words. a point he reiterated. >> would you say that -- >> no. and if you go, matt. excuse me matt. because you are the media and you do the same thing. the next sentence was he is a war hero. i said that. but they never want to play it. and you don't want to play it. i do have a problem with what he's doing on the border. he's terrible. and i do have a problem with the fact the illegal immigration is a disaster and he's doing a horrible job for the vets. >> appearing today an morning joe, senator mccain dismissed call farce personal apology saying he should apologize instead to those who sacrificed for their country. >> lieutenant john petivilano shot down in world war ii. 92 years old.
he came to my office. he gave him a long overdue declaration. he was a prisoner and was 90 pounds when the tank core liberated the prison camp he was in. those are the people that frankly i find it just totally inappropriate for mr. trump to say that he doesn't like to be with people who are captured. >> lieutenant john was one of the american's most legendary bombing units and he joins us a day after his 93rd birthday. happy belated birthday. thank you for joining us. let me get right to it and ask what your reaction is when you heard donald trump say i like people that weren't captured. >> well i don't think donald trump knew what he was talking about. and he's of his own opinions but he should learn a little about what being a pow and if i may
elaborate. that [ inaudible ] when he died on the march from stall log. if he had any understanding he would have never made those remarks against john mccain. >> do you agree with gop rival rick perry that his remarks should disqualify him as a candidate for the president of the united states. >> i firmly believe that. if he makes these wild statements, i don't know what he would do as president. and especially as commander in chief of the military. >> do you feel like there is a sense that is shared by donald trump of self sacrifice, the same you had when you were fighting? >> pardon? >> the idea of self sacrifice, which was a major factor in the role that soldiers played in
world war ii. do you think donald trump understands that? >> no. i don't think that he does. and it's very hard to visualize when iyou are flying over europe in enemy territory and tens of thousands of planes are shot down over the period of the war and many many died and wounded and had to bail out of those airplanes and they surely didn't voluntarily want to be captured. >> lieutenant, i want to get to one more question. one more comment donald trump made about senator john mccain. this is what he said yesterday. that john mccain has made america less safe. i'm going to read an excerpt. "the reality is that john mccain the politician has made america less safe. sent brave soldiers into to wrong headed foreign adventure, the covered up for president obama and spent most of his time in the senate pushing amnesty.
he would rather protect the iraqi border that be arizona's. >> do you think he's made. >> john mccain is a american hero and a patriot. and -- pardon. and he's done everything for military that could have possibly done [ inaudible ] they just got done 40,000 american servicemen. they cut the budget. and senator john mccain is absolutely against that. >> lieutenant john thank you for your bravery and courage and service and happy birthday. >> thank you. >> i want to bring in our panel now. john stanton, i don't think you want to be on the other side of the lieutenant john. >> not a good place to be. >> do you think this is the
inflection point that begins his desen dance in theense or just another stage of the donald being the donald. >> he's talking to a part of the republican party that does exist. does not like john mccain. he's gone a little further afield than he might have wanted to. but he clearly i think believe this is. the problem for republicans is that unless they find a way in where at least in his mind he's being martyred so he can say oh they threw me out because they can't handle me then he gets to lay hands on a conservative that comes up to the next guy to take over the hard right part of this debate he's not going anywhere. he has tungs of money. he likes this. he likes fighting with people. it doesn't matter what happens around him i don't think. as long as he's not bored i don't see a reason for him to leave. >> do you think he can take what is generally accepted to be a moment to apologize and turn it into an opportunity to criticize
the media? >> not on this one. what's left? is he going to come out against motherhood, people who rescue puppies? he has a lot of people left to anger but he's running out. they are getting down to the bottom of the barrel at this point. and i don't think that you can say -- the stereotype of the base is liberal media, all that is is good about america. i don't think you can come out and that liberal media veterans darn them. >> liberal media includes the "wall street journal" and rupert murdock. >> basically i think donald trump trump's anger at the liberal media to the non donald trump media which is an extensive group of people. and i any he's going to have difficulty convincing the rest of the public that is a problem. >> steve schmidt was quoted in an really interesting piece in
the washington post suggesting that what trump represents has to be taken seriously. it has to be confronted seriously. my personal view is that it ought to trigger a fight for the soul and the heart of the republican party and the conservative movement? do you think it might? i understand that impulse to clear house if given the opportunity but do you think this will be an opportunity for the heart and soul. >> there is substantial constituency for some of his views in the party. and you can't just wash that away. why senator cruz is treading softly to get some of those supporters if trump dies out. on the other hand if there were less than 20,000 million candidates he would not be the leader. there is a constituency. it is not a huge one. and the field shrinks -- i
can't. >> you have done some great reporting on immigration. and it is flum uxing. concerning to some people. and his comments on veterans, but somehow his comments about being rapists and criminals were not cause for indignation. >> the whole idea that the mexican government somehow has a program to send people to the united states. >> do they? >> not true. they don't do a lot to stop people but they are definitely not -- at least from their population. >> but there is no export. >> right. i think the problem for a lot of t the republicans running is that republicans running. existential threat to the universe posed by immigration
that they didn't want to come out and belike that's crazy talk. so they did. and this is one where -- >> this is sanctioned enough -- this is akin to -- i think it says something about our society and perhaps the party that maligning an entire race of people is not as offensive as questioning john mccain's war credentials. both are offensive. and both should be called out. megan. to the question of where trump goes from here? it is interesting to me people have also not paid attention to his comments on religion. which is not obviously proving one's conservative christian bona fides tend to be a thing in this race. this is what donald trump had to say about whether he seeks, i think it is forgiveness in the church. >> when we go in church and when i drink my little wine, which is about the only wine i drink and have my little cracker i guess that is a form of asking for
forgiveness. and i do that as often as possible because i feel cleansed. okay? >> okay. when i drink my little wine and i have my little cracker. to certain believing christians the body and blood of christ. >> i think he's wrapped up the catholic vote. >> i'm just saying -- respond. >> yeah i think this is sort of the fundamental charm of trump as the candidate if he can be said to have charms is that he says whatever comes into his head. so because he's not messaged and it feels like he's really just channelling that id that people want to see out there. the problem with that is that he says anything that comes into his head. so instead of coming out there, all of the other politicians know how to not sound like a raving lunatic on the stage. and he's had some problems with the lunacy control. >> he is also not one of them. he's not conservative really. >> -- last week. >> yeah he's not a deeply
conservative conservative. and it is going to come out. >> also he doesn't have a campaign infrastructure where there are people behind him saying okay this is how we're going to respond. he's calling into the today show. morning joe. he's a tenacious fighter and some would say strategically that is not the way to go in a moment like there. >> i enjoy it. campaign is a hard fought thing and you can dot all of it at the same time. it sometimes helps to have someone who can say no to you. and all good candidates have at least one. >> i don't think he has anybody. that would be opposite to his personality. time smartest and biggest and everything type guy. >> technically has some staff that work for him. it is unclear if he has a serious campaign machine the way any other. >> he also has this thing that there are some rich people who get this thing. they are just surrounded by
people who do nothing but tell them how amazing they are. and they start reading their own press releases. they forget like their staff is being paid to think that they are the most amazing person in the world. and because the rest of the population is not then they are vulnerable. and what politicians has as he says is they have someone that like, no dude. this is not -- >> come back and apologize. he was about to. you could see him almost but he couldn't do it. and instead of a one day story it's a like a week long. >> it's like watching an angry baby have the candy or bottle taken away. crying crying crying until at what point do babies stop crying. i don't know. maybe that is the point which donald trump apologizes. when we come back after the break, bill cosby admits he gave women drugs for sex in a 2000
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today bill cosby's representatives are declining to comment on new revelations that the comedian admitted to drugging women in order to help seduce them. according to the 2005 deposition reported on by the "new york times" cosby denied he was a sexual predator but he was unpolgtic about his pursuit of young women. i think i'm a pretty decent reader of people and their emotions and sexual things. he also admitted to seven precipitations for quaaludes,
pills that cosby said were used to drug women. according to cosby he gave women pills with their knowledge, quote, the same as a person would say have a drink. cosby has not been charged with a crime and has been denied past allegations which have now been leveled by 36 women. joining me now is linda kirkpatrick kirkpatrick. and her lawyer. linda, what was your reaction to hearing these words from cosby's mouth through -- in written text of course. but how did that make you feel hearing his explanation? >> thanks for having us alex. well, my first reaction was disgust. as i'm sure a lot of people felt. but the next emotion that took over for me was hope. i felt that hopeful for other victims that they would feel safe now to come forward and also speak their truth and begin their healing. >> there are a couple of pieces
of the deposition that i wanted to ask you about. and specifically how they compared to what you are saying your experience was with bill cosby. the first his saying of giving quaaludes was something women consented and it was the same as giving them a drink. how does that square with the experience you had. >> i never saw a pill. i never took a pill. i was never offered a pill. so that flies in the face of what happened with me. i am incredibly drug intolerant. i never would have take an pill from him or anyone else. >> in terms of obtaining multiple precipitations from a doctor and using them in an unlawful way, what was your read on that? >> well what was interesting was that he said that he did -- he admitted under oath in the deposition that he did obtain seven precipitations for quaaludes and also it was with the intent to have sex with young women. but when asked, did you in fact give them the quaaludes with their knowledge, then his
attorney objected and would not let him answer that question. he did admit to giving quaaludes to one person. i think he was trying to dance around with whether or not she had knowledge or agreed to that. but as to the seven, he's never really answered that question. i think that bill cosby, alex was trying to portray himself as a hollywood playboy. >> he also linda sort of positions himself as a guiding light, a mentor so some of these young women. talk about your experience with him in that respect. >> okay. i was not in the industry. i was not in modelling or acting or singing or anything of the sort. i met him on the same day he assaulted him. it was across a tennis court net. i was in a tournament. he was in a tournament. i'd never met him before. my mixed doubles partner and i,
mr. cosby waged a bet that if my partner and i won that we would be treated to his show at the las vegas hilton that night. and i went -- my tennis partner worked at the las vegas hilton as my bad luck would have it. so he saw his show often. that is how i ended up there by myself. i did not go to party. i did not go to his hotel suite. i simple went to accept the wager that had been won to go to his show. >> gloria all of this seems to be many of the these stories in the deposition specifically there seems to be elaborate planning around these interludes, these dates are these moments cosby had with these women. and i guess when you read that legally speaking what does that tell you about the nature of what went down? >> well i do represent 17 women at this point. one of whom we're litigating a case for judy huth and that is
now pending before the california supreme court. what i can say is yes he seemed very manipulative. he did sometimes choose random target, sometimes not but he did engage in planning and he has hurt a lot of women. and we're very glad this deposition is out. it shows how disgusting he is how really revolting his conduct is. and it is no wonder that he tried to hide this deposition from the public through legal battles. but now the truth is out and this will never be a secret again. >> linda, did you have any contact with mr. cosby after the incident? and did he ever try and offer you money? >> the following day he did call and apologize to me for his behavior. he said -- and he reached me via the tennis club. he did not have my phone number nor my address. he called the following day to say i apologize. i guess i got the wrong idea of what you wanted.
>> and then did you tell them what he did to you? he sexually -- what did he do. >> did you say what you did to me is wrong? did you accuse him at that moment? >> i -- you know that is a really good question alex. my last memory of what he did to me was him being on top of me before i lost consciousness, being on top of me kissing me in his dressing room at the las vegas hilton. i have no conscious memory at that point until i woke up at home the next day where i completely wet the bed. i then began vomiting violently back at the tennis club. because i was still in the tennis tournament. had to default the match. he called the tennis club. i returned the call from the tennis club. he apologized, i'm sorry about what happened last night. i guess i got the wrong idea. >> when you hear about vomiting and incontinence. one knows about quaaludes through lore and anecdote.
does that sound like your normal sorts of precipitation? >> we don't know if in fact he used quaaludes on lipid.nda. we don't know that and we don't know quaaludes are the only drubg he obtained by precipitation and we also don't know if he used any non precipitation drugs but mixed with them with alcohol so they would have a potentially harmful effect and cause a woman to be incapacitated and not issue consent. we don't know any of these things. but we do know this stunning admission by mr. cosby that he did admit to the precipitation for quaaludes that he didn't intend to use them for himself and intended to use them for young women to have a sex and that is a misuse of the precipitation he obtained for quaaludes. >> thank you for your time. coming up, something just happened in america that has not happened in more than half a century. and sometimes i struggle to sleep
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and now the stories keeping this monday alive. 37 million cheating spouses are likely in a panic after the personal details of the adult website ashley madison were hacked. and protesting a ban on the word curvy. >> first scott walker supporting a ban on gay boy skut scout leaders. he said yesterday he wasn't sure if being gay is a choice. >> do you think being gay is a choice. >> i think that's -- that is not even an issue for me to be involved in. i don't know what the answer to
that is and again i'm going to spend my time focused on things i do know. >> in response they issued a statement. of course it isn't a choice. >> joining us now is a professor of english. is this something that it is -- in scott walker's words it is not even an issue for him to be involved in? >> i think in his life he's been rather involved in it and in terms of people who his family knows he is a man in his 40s. of course he's thought achblt i don't know whether he's a reader or not but he at least heard pod casts. he northeastknows what he thinks. when you say i don't know in that way, that is how you plakt your base while not seeming like
a complete idiot. >> right. it is the equivalent john i think to marco rubio's i'm not a scientist, man. like this is beyond my field of expertise. unfortunately presidents of the united states will have to deal with employment non discrimination acts and or climate change. >> if all the gorillas in the house are throwing poop at each other right now he's being really really still and hopes that it doesn't hit him. and that's seemingly his strategy right now. and partly that and partly the evolution question that got thrown at him. but it is kind of a tough thing to do in this day and age. these are questions that everyone has already thought about. so it's hard to not answer. >> it is megan to a point you were making during the commercial break when all good points are made. it is a game theory question to be like at what point do you
come out and say i understand being gay is not a choice. >> as a libertarian i don't care whether it is a choice or not. i kind of like politicians who don't proclaim great expertise on what are fundamentally empirical questions that i doubt scott walker has ever personally investigated. >> let me just push back on a second. i think argument being gay is a choice is actually being used by members of the right wing to repress perhaps gay equality in society. >> i think we're beyond that now. i'm not saying that that hasn't been true. but i think that in fact we're moving towards -- where we say like it doesn't matter whether you are choosing it or not. it's that we respect your right to do whatever you like with the person you love providing -- >> do you think scott walker is saying that? >> i don't think he's saying that. or actually maybe i do think he's say that.
maybe by ducking the question he's actually -- >> keep in mind that last week he also said the ban on -- allowing gay troop leaders was bad for the boy scouts because it -- >> i'm not defending -- >> i know you are not. but in the context of which he supports or does not support equality. >> i actually think it would be a more productive political conversation if instead of in order to get respect for what you do having to say well i was born this way and therefore i'm entitled to certain things and instead being able to say -- >> this is how i am. >> and it doesn't matter -- like i -- >> just because it is the right thing. >> -- even though no i don't think scott walker is going to make that point. >> he's not going to get there and i think that unfortunately the country, that is probably going to take another generation. which leaves him quite slick. in that scott walker might know
that science has had a hard time identifying particular biological structures that correlate with homosexuality. so he can hide behind that as cover. so once again there is something that he's doing well oddly enough. despite how unpleasant to see. >> it is a strategy. no doubt. speaking of strategies or lack thereof, hackers have stolen and leaked the personal details of millions of users of the adultery website ashley madison. a group or individual known as the impact team, like anonymous claimed to be behind it and is threatening to release all the information unless the site is taken down. the reason? they believe the full delete feature, wiping out all information in history is a scam. okay so i just think if you are signing up for ashley madison in this day and age, the expectation should be my information will get hacked. do you feel sympathy here?
>> i guess, sure. it's a weird sort of decision. like woe think you're scamming these people so we're just going to out them to show that you are scamming them. >> also a strange position to defend people who are signed up to willingly cheat on their spouses. >> also 37 million is extraordinarily large number. >> john, 37 million americans. do you glean anything about our country from that figure. >> well it is humanity isn't it? i mean after you get after a certain age it seems to me that if you find it's almost unusual if someone hasn't pulled something like that in one way or another. >> signed up for a cheaters website. >> not signing up but that doesn't number doesn't surprise me. and now you can do it online. just like drugs delivered to your door that strikes me at perfectly normal i'm not saying i approve but that is what life is like.
and most people especially those who do it serially understand that you are going to get caught. chances are you are going to get caught and the world only gets smaller and smaller so they are taking that risk and well it wasn't their day. >> and that goes back to another game theory question megan, which is at what point do you tell your spouse you signed up? >> at this point they are basically blackmailing ashley madison saying shut down or really release this. and they are very profitable and they were looking at going public. so it will be interesting. it is actually interesting in either way i think you have destroyed the company. because if it leaks no one is going on anymore. >> and if it -- >> -- then you're shut down. but for the person who has perhaps unwisely gone on ashley madison, at what point do you say honey, i have to tell you something? and what you want to do is be sure they are not going to shut down. because i think it is true that
most spouses in america, if that list is download they are going to be on there just to see. >> look at the team of cynics. all right. last one, instagram users are fighting against ban on the word #curvy. over the weekend hundreds of users responded by using curvee with two es. porino star dill doe. and also free the nipple. the nipple is not free on instagram either. >> certainly weird that people still use hashtags honestly. like who does that? >> i'm done with them personally. >> what is it like 2012? >> yeah i do think it is kind of odd they have seemingly sort of random morality decisions they make at instagram and i don't know why they feel the need to really police the hell out of people's lives. >> i know you think they should
just do whatever. right? >> more doctoring thaninteresting than that. this is actually something you are getting now with these vast data mining things. if i was going to sit down and make a porn filter which is apparently what this is. what i would do is start with penis, vagina or dildo. >> it picks words that offense our sensibilities because dildo is not on there and curvy is. and that seems strange. but if you were trying to build a porn filter and i think it's fair for them to say you know i don't feel like i want my business being a pornography distribution center. then you may come up with something that is going to seem weird. and we're going to face more and more of this. >> so you go for something oblique. but it is still arbitrary because there are so very many things that must have come up other than curvy. and it's a political statement again. they are just trying to do a little something because the
kids use instagram so much. the idea that we're trying to keep this clean. and you know there was a time actually, i was thinking, where they tried to get rid of the eggplant eggplants. >> the purple -- not the actual food stuffs. >> right. and because they were assumed to look like man in a certain state. and i must admit i really thought that is what they were. >> i didn't even think of that because i'm so chaste in my thinking. though i have said the word dildo now three times an national television. you are welcome standards. >> i'm still 2012. >> you're just going to to #eggplant. >> we're going leave it there. thank you very much. when we come back bernie sanders and martin o'malley take on black lives matter. that is just ahead. cl squlp next.
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black lives matter. >> those were activists this weekend taking over the stage at the democratic presidential forum in arizona and interrupting events featuring 2016 candidates martin o'malley and bernie sanders, both of whom responded. >> black lives of course matter and i spent 50 years fighting for civil rights and dignity. but if you don't want me to be here, that's okay. >> black lives matter. white lives matter. all lives matter. >> martin o'malley has since apologized for saying all lives matter. saying this was a mistake and he meant to disrespect. joining us now --
sam, so martin o'malley has gotten heat for his record on criminal justice, specifically the incarceration while he was governor of maryland and the legacy created disproportionately of course putting black men behind bars. how much do you think this hurts him among people who are looking fur a candidate that addresses the issue of racial disparity head on? >> not much. to be perfectly frank about it there was not much further down for him to go. he's about 1% in the polls and would like to increase but there was lar lot of skepticism about his record in maryland. so this isn't exactly his strong suit. i will say he did handle himself after the initial gaffe with a head down attitude. went out there and addressed eded
crowd. and but it is a big hill for him to climb. >> the idea that black lives matter. that refrain coupled with white lives matter really got the boos. and i think people still don't understand why that is not okay to do. >> black men and the police i think is the issue when it comes to race in this country and if we could actually get past it. and for the first time it looks like we might make progress. we would be on a new terrain. the protesters were exactly polite but i get what they are coming from. i it should not be really be shorthand for black lives matter when white people take it away. and athink a lot of people are tired of it. but the main point was to say that black men and the police matters. the main reason i think most black people like we're oppressed is the police so that event needed to happen.
sometimes you have to get messy and that is what that was. >> it's worth noting that originally the focus of the process was much more on bernie sanders than martin o'malley. and i guess maybe that may wonder why they may be. and where -- your assessment. but where do you think bernie sanders is on issues of the racial justice? >> the problem he's had is he hasn't really spoken to this issue at least with a passion that he's spoken to the issues of income inequality. and it was telling that hill clint in a facebook chat just concluded made a specific point addressing the topic of saying that racial inequalities and injustices cannot be cured by curing income inequalities. and i think that was a deliberate contrast to the message bernie has which is very very income specific. so he has a trust deficit in that respect too.
because he hasn't actually been at the forefront of the problems. senator sanders to his credit said, you know, i have been fighting for these things. i was involved in civil rights doing these marches. but unlike o'malley he kind of drifted away from the crowd after this whole thing happened. he didn't stick around and mingle. and i think if anyone turned the lemons into lemonade it would have been o'malley. >> you are seeing how a protest movement can shape a field. and i guess i -- one can imagine black lives matters will be at those other events as well. >> that frankly doesn't matter. i think in a context like that the people involved aren't interested in listening. there will be the simplistic idea of why do you have to brick race into things? but there will also be the issue of black men kill one another too at massive rates and as much as we don't like to talk about
it there is no way we can draw a bright line between killing by keepers of order and killing by people in the community. both problems are massive. but in terms of the racial descension between blacks and whites particularly, the issue of the cops is the most important. obviously i think it is democrats who are more in a position do something real about it. >> thank you both for your time and your thoughts. coming up fifa president sepp blatter just held a press conference and things got really awkward. that's after the break.
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blatter was set to announce reform plans to rehabilitate fifa's battered image. it includes publishing salary introducing integrity checks and setting a term limits for president. imagine that. blatter confirmed fifa will elect his successor on february 26th of next year. that is all for now. the "ed show" is coming up next. good evening americans and welcome to the "ed show." live from detroit lakes, minnesota. let's get to work. tonight trump attacks. >> he's not a war hero. he is a war hero because he was captured. i like people that weren't captured. >> i'd like to apologize for the families and those who have
served. >> it is california. it never rains this bad. >> wild fires sweeps across highways and forcing camp evacuations. >> later hecklers and hashtags. >> it's not like we like shutting [ bleep ] down but we have to. >> that is -- okay. shall i continue when we -- >> hold on one second. >> and scottish issues. >> do you think being gay is a choice? >> i don't know what the answer to that is. >> thanks for watching. we start tonight with the most popular republican presidential candidate in the lot, in the country, donald trump. do you ever ask yourself what does trump bring to the table? sometimes you can't see the forest because of the trees. he brings everything to the table. he's got the money, the polling, he's got the