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tv   MSNBC Live  MSNBC  September 22, 2015 3:00pm-4:01pm PDT

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i'm steve kornacki right now on "msnbc live," breaking news. an the historic day as pope francis lands in washington for his first-ever visit to the united states. the pope landing at joint base andrews just before 4:00 p.m. eastern this afternoon. and even before he stepped off that plane, crowds began cheering and chanting. president obama and his entire family, as well as the vice president and his family, they were the first to greet the pope. >> welcome to the usa! >> and after meeting with several other dignitaries, the pope left andrews in a small fiat 500 en route to downtown washington, d.c. he arrived a to the vatican's diplomatic mission in washington shortly before 5:00 p.m. eastern time. all of this is the start of a busy six days for a man so
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popular, that he's been dubbed the people's pope. tomorrow, he'll start his day with a visit to the white house, and then a parade. then he'll hold a mid-day prayer service with u.s. bishops in a canonization mass at the largest u.s. church in america. then on thursday morning, the pope will address a joint session of congress, before flying up to new york to hold an evening prayer service at st. patrick's cathedral. on friday morning, he'll then address the united nations' general assembly, and he'll hold a service at the 9/11 memorial. and that evening, there will be a papal procession through new york city's central park. that will lead up to a mass at madison square garden. and on saturday evening, he speaks at the festival of families of philadelphia. and on sunday morning, he will visit a philadelphia prison before holding mass that afternoon. nbc's luke russert is at the vatican's diplomatic mission in washington. that's where the pope will be staying during his visit. and nbc's senior vermont analyst, george weigel, is at
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the national basilica. that is the largest catholic church in the country. and that is where the pope will say mass tomorrow. luke, let me start with you now. that is where the pope arrived just over an hour ago. set the scene. what was it like to be there when the pope arrived and what's going on inside there right now? >> well, steve, it was a raucous and joyous celebration out here. i would say the crowd numbered to at least 500. and many were chanting and screaming with glee. there is a drum circle with loud guitars the, singing spanish hymns, welcoming the pope. and i was really struck by the amount of children that were here. a lot bringing their kids for a once in a lifetime experience, putting them at the front of the fence for a small glimpse of a man in white robes. what the scene will be like here for a few days, the pope in
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d.c., expect there to be a steady stream of people here about a block across the street from that vatican embassy. it's directly across the street from vice president joe biden's house. if cup wanted a cup of sugar at night, i'm sure he'd have a willing friend to greet him. all that said, the pope will stay here during the duration of his visit. modest quarters inside. i can tell you, he will sleep on a brand-new memory foam mattress that will never be used again after the pope is in there. and some of the people here plan on serenading the pope at 4:00 a.m. with a traditional latino morning song. we'll see if the people's pope is excited to be woken up by the people at 4:00 in the morning. >> yeah, i've had the 4:00 a.m. wake-up call on the weekends for my show the last couple of years and i haven't enjoyed it too much. but maybe if that group was singing to me, it would be a little different. george weigel, obviously, this is not the first time a pope has visited the united states, but i do get the sense there's an extra bit of excitement surrounding this pope and this visit. what's your sense of that?
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>> i think there is, steve, although we really should remember that there was enormous enthusiasm for john paul ii in 1979, 1987, 1995 and benedict xlvi was a pretty good draw in 2008. this pope seems to have touched people across the spectrum of american life and that's is a wonderful thing. he's here primarily for the philadelphia meeting. and i think there's a cahance that this may get lost a bit in the shuffle. he's here to lift up and affirm the family, marriage, the beauty of marriage, those are perhaps themes they'll take up a bit in the congress. but so far, we are off to a robust start here in washington. and he looked in pretty good shape after a tough few days in cuba. >> it's interesting you mentioned philadelphia, george. obviously, a lot of the
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speculation, a lot of the conversation leading up to this has been about that address to the joint session of congress and the idea there, if the pope focuses on climate change, as he's focused on the past, obviously, that's a very divisive issue in our politics right now, an issue that cuts down those two parties. if he were to focus on or mention an issue like abortion, though, there's another issue that cuts right down between the two parties. what are you expecting from that congressional address? >> i'm expecting a high-ground call to moral principle in the united states yb a call to engine rgenerosit generosity, an evocation on the ideals on which the country was founded. i suspect the climate issues are going to be dealt with more on the u.n. speech on friday, but i do expect the holy father to challenge across the board in the congress. he's not a guy you can put in the dconventional boxes of our
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politics and i hope that challenge is heard across the board. >> and luke, we've been playing the video there of the pope disembarking from his plane earlier. and obviously, it was president obama and vice president biden and their families right there to greet him. went benedict came to this country a number of years ago, george w. bush greeted him. but there does seem to be -- this is a pope that it seems that this president, that president obama wants to be connected to publicly. >> reporter: oh, certainly. i think this pope is probably the most popular person in the world, that espouses some progressive viewpoints that president obama tends to agree with. particularly when you talk about climate change and income inequality. i also think that the keck this pope has with latinos is very significant. of the hundreds of people who were here earlier to dwreet tgr pope when he got to this residence, many were latino. many of them from central
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america, many from mexico. and so much of the time i spent talking to them, and a lot of it was in spanish, they said, we really feel this is our pope. he's the first pope from south america. and to see that connection play out in realtime, you know that's definitely something that president obama wants to be a part of. obviously, he's wanted to do more on immigration. he's not been able to get things through in congress, but you're definitely sort of seeing this pope, i think, reflected in the politics of our current president, and he wants to attach himself as tight as he can, not so much, i would say, on the culture of life issues where they still differ, but a lot of it is in the presentation of what francis' has done, and that's very similar to what obama's tried to do, at least the beginning of his term, which is, look, we can get along, we might disagree on things, but let's at least be conciliatory in a friendly manner. hasn't been like that for the last few years, but from the outset, that's what it's been. >> luke russert there in washington, outside where the pope is staying right now. george weigel, as well.
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appreciate both of you joining us. let's bring in congressman joe crawly. he's a catholic democrat from new york. he joins us on the set here. congressman, thanks for being here. you're going to have pretty much a front row seat. i don't know where exactly you'll be sitting for this seat in the joint session of congress, but what are you expecting when the pope speaks to congress? >> i've said this publicly and i don't mean to offend it or hurt someone, but he'll be an equal opportunity offender. he'll make everyone feel a little uncomfortable from time to time. because i think what he'll do is challenge us, as what george has said, as well as luke, i think that's what his role is, to challenge all of mankind, but particularly catholics to heed what he's saying. >> it's interesting, we think of the state of the union address, you know, president obama gets up there, you always think, where will john boehner applaud? where will john boehner sit -- >> there they sit, will they stand? >> you'll have biden on one side and get that contrast between the democratic reaction and the
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republican reaction. but it is striking that there are certain issues that this pope and the catholic church in general chooses to emphasize that don't necessarily hue to the partisan divide we have in this country. so we talk about, for instance, the issue of abortion. and i imagine if this pope were to address abortion in congress, john boehner will be on his feet cheering and joe biden may not be. >> i think we hope we show respect and the decorum of the house is respected as well as the presence of this incredible person, the leader of the catholic church, speaking not just for himself, but for catholics worldwide. i think we do have to approach this a little bit differently. this is not a rah-rah session, this is not our side versus their side. i think we should all listen respectfully to the pontiff and to his message. whether it's on abortion or if it's on climate change or gay marriage or it may be on immigration and reform and how we twreet migrants. i think we should with respectful and listen to what he has to say. >> we put a couple stats up on
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the screen. this is a poll of american catholics and their view of the pope. 88% favor his emphasis on income inequality and the environment. 95% support openness to divorce and remarried people. 81% applaud his push towards lbgt acceptance. i think i saw a statistic today that there are more catholics in congress now than there ever have been before. this is catholics historically. i'm from massachusetts. the dividing line in massachusetts is always, if you were catholic, you were a democrat, if you're a protestant, you're a republican. but it's not that simple anymore. i see stats like this and i'm wondering, is this a pope who can deliver a message that does cut across partisan lines? >> i think it's a healthy representation of both parties. both john boehner, the speaker, and nancy pelosi, the leader of the minority parties are both catholics. and it runs the gamut from state to state. i do think that it is remarkable in many respects that catholics have reached such prominence and as you mentioned, i think vice president biden, the first catholic vice president.
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obviously john kennedy before this setting the stage. but i think the acceptance of catholics as elected representatives beyond the catholic community is also reflective in that presence. >> and there is, we should say, there's one member right now, one of your colleague is a republican from arizona who said, he is going to be boycotting this speech, the pope's speech, because of climate change. is that -- have you heard any rumblings of anybody else who might -- >> not really. and i think that's his loss. i think to say you won't listen to the pope because of one issue, i think every one of us can probably find one thing that will make us uncomfortable that he will say. that's not a reason not to listen to his message. you don't have to agree with everything he says, but we should at least give him the respect of listening to hmm. i think he'll challenge catholics, american catholics, in particular, but all catholics. remember, we're not here alone. our faith doesn't stop or begin at our doorstep. it has to be a part of our lives and how we conduct ourselves throughout the world. and we're not only living in a neat little box, that everyone's life is different and have
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unique challenges that needs to be met in dignity and not pushed aside as though they're worthless. >> and you're a new yorker as well. he'll be spending quite a bit of time here. will you be going to any of the events? >> i'll have a lot of events and i think i'll have the opportunity to be in enough of the pope's presence in washington. i know i've been invited to a number of events here. just a question of really getting around at madison square garden, at fifth avenue. >> getting around anywhere in this city this week for anybody is -- >> i tend to try to avoid manhattan at all costs during this time of year because of the u.n. and generally speaking, it's a tough time of year to be here. but i may venture out and try to get a glimpse here in new york as well. i was there for john paul ii, and it's something that will never leave my memory. and i think especially for this pope, i feel the same way. >> you will have a better seat in the house chamber. >> congressman joe crawly from new york, thank you for your time. and one last note, there was a lot of buzz today about the tiny fiat the pope is using for
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his motorcade today. essentially, some free publicity for fiat, during wall-to-wall news coverage, check out the imagine on your screen, the company responded on social media tweeting, hands pressed together in prayer with the hashtag, blessed. still to come, 2016 politics. ben carson say people misunderstood his comments that he wouldn't support a muslim running for president. >> again, it seems to be hard for people to actually hear english and understand it. >> plus, hillary clinton makes a big announcement about a key issue in the democratic primary, the keystone pipeline. will it affect her race against bernie sander. and also, we'll tell you how a drug ceo is reacting to the outrage over his decision to raise the price of life-saving medication by over 5,000%. and of course, we'll continue our coverage of this historic day in america, pope francis arriving in this country for the first time in his life. stay with us. hey babe, last one home cooks?
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some developing news from des moines, iowa, where democratic presidential candidate hillary clinton has now publicly taken a stand on the keystone pipeline, after months of declining to take a position, this afternoon, clinton came out and said that she opposes construction of the pipeline. >> i think it's imperative that we look at the keystone pipeline as what i believe it is, a distraction from the important work we have to do to combat climate change and, unfortunately, from my perspective, one that interferes with our ability to move forward to deal with all the other issues. therefore, i oppose it. >> now, clinton had previously cited her former job as secretary of state as a reason for delaying taking a position on this deal, until the administration formalized its opinion on the project. bernie of sanders, meanwhile, has long-opposed the keystone
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and now to 2016. today started with republican candidate ben carson trying to downplay what has become a growing controversy. his comments over the weekend that he wouldn't support a muslim presidential candidate. in his first public event since that remark, carson said that he's been misunderstood. >> well, i would say if people listen to the interview, they'll
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notice that i said that anybody, regardless of their religion or affiliation, if they embrace american values and they place the constitution at the top level, then i'm supportive of them. again, it seems to be hard for people to actually hear english and understand it. >> but hours after carson tried to throw cold water on one controversy, he may have created another with these comments, seemingly aimed at president obama. >> if i were in charge of this nation, and i was attempting to destroy it, let me tell you what i would do. i would drive wedges between the people. i would have a war on women and race wars and income wars. i would be inviting people in here from other countries and giving them all kinds of benefits. i would be giving people free
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telephones. i would be telling people that, you know, you need to get on food stamps. any relationship or similarity to what's going on is purely coincidental. >> carson there seeming to suggest that president obama is trying to destroy the united states. just days after donald trump raised questions about the president's faith. >> can you imagine supporting or being comfortable if a muslim ever became president of the united states? >> i can say that, you know, it's something that at some point could happen. we'll see. i mean, you know, it's something that could happen. would i be comfortable? i don't know if we have to address it right now, but i think it is certainly something that could happen. >> you said you would have no problem putting a muslim on your cabinet? >> -- already happened, but you wouldn't agree with that. >> joining me now, eric poller,
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republican strategist, susan del percio. susan, let me start with you. this is the drama going on in your party right now. we've talked about trump's rise all summer, but the second story this summer has been the rise of ben carson. what has the last few days, these comments about muslims, his attempt today to walk it back a little bit, what effect has that had, do you think, on carson's candidacy on the republican side? >> let me start off by saying, this is the last type of issue that republicans want to be dealing with. this is not beneficial to the primary process. it's not beneficial to the general us taking back the presidency. so when it comes to ben carson, he was already kind of going on a downward trajectory based on the last poll. so much will be read into this, if he goes even further. i think he was heading down, because carly fiorina did so well and took a lot of his support away. this does not help him. it was also the fact that he's starting to -- it was one thing when he doubled down. now he's trying to back away
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from it. so where does he stand? watch the interview. it's very clear where he stood. he said a muslim should not be president of the united states. as far as the follow-up he did, it's inconsistent what he originally said, because when asked about, could a muslim be a member of congress, he was actually okay with that. so there's no parsing words on this. when it comes to donald trump, he's starting to really look like a politician now. he won't talk about this or say that. he kind of talks in code. he's not being the forward-speaking official that people want in their -- that they wanted from donald trump. he's not calling it the way he sees it. he's starting to hedge a bit, and i think that will also hurt him. >> we put a couple stats up here, too. this was a cnn recent poll, asking all americans, do you believe that president obama's a muslim? 29% of all americans saying, they do. that's nearly one in three. among republicans, though, that number jumps to 44%. so erika, it does tell me that
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at least in theory, there's an audience here that ben carson could be connecting with. and i wonder bhamaybe ben carso takes a fall on this, because maybe people think, it's too much of a distraction, but do you think this will hurt trump as well or just carson? >> trump has hi national campaign based on his birther campaign which he sort of hatched with fox news in 2011. this issue had basically been completely put to rest. they teamed up, that gave them a national platform after months and months of that chatter, that's what obama finally came out, the birth sector, everyone kind of had a laugh and everyone really thought the issue had been put to bed. it will never be put to bed. there are 30, 40, we've seen polls, 60% of trump's supporters don't think he's a muslim. don't think he was born in america. this comes from this hot house atmosphere of the right wing media. they believe it and they promote it. and they sponsor it. and then they wonder, why are these national candidates in
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trouble? why is ben carson trying to walk back for three days in a row? because this is what excites the base. this is what -- ben carson got in trouble years ago, comparing the u.s. to nazi, germany, you know, on fox news and things like that. so he has a long history of these sort of oddball excepts that within the right-wing media, is very typical. but when he steps out of it and wants to lead this country, people are scratching hair heads, saying, what's going on here. >> and what's amazing is he's calling these like gotcha questions. there was nothing gotcha with the chuck todd question. nothing gotcha with that town hall. when you prepare a client or someone to go out there, you tell them to be prepared for anything and everything. and these were all things that were brought up in the past. it's not hard. whatwear seeing are two people who are not used to being a candidate, who don't know how to run for political office and are taking their lumps as a result of it. >> first, i want to show, this is druonald trump now.
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he's trying to make the point that actually a lot of people agree with ben carson. this is what donald trump had to say. let's play that. >> people want to be politically correct. but there have been difficulties and a lot of people agree with ben. i do think that ben would also agree, though, if properly vetted, the proper people, properly vetted, going through an election, i think that anybody that is able to win an election will be absolutely fine. >> so, susan, this is what eric was talking about. i talk history to armstrong williams, an adviser to ben carson, his business manager, and he was basically saying, you would be surprised the number of people who actually listen to what ben carson said about muslims and nod their heads and agree. and maybe they're afraid to say it publicly. maybe they're afraid in some cases to tell pollsters, but you would be surprised how many there are. how much -- how much of that do you think exists within the base of the republican party? >> clearly, if you look at some of the polls, there is -- that does exist. and it's interesting to see what
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people will say public lly vers privately. the bigger problem for the republican party is, it is seen as being against muslims right now. when you -- because those polls do come out. and they need to start breaking them. this is why it's such a big problem when we have comments like ben carson gave for republicans to run. i mean, it's not just for running for president right now. you have to think that there's 24 republicans up for u.s. senate. how does this kind of conversation hurt them? so really, they need to move past that. i will say, ben carson is trying to move past it, but it's not working out that way and donald trump is certainly not helping him. i find it's interesting it's up for him to defend a question that's quichb to ben carson that he perhaps agree with ben carson's answer. but when it came to defending or questioning the person who attacked president obama, he didn't feel it was necessary to set the record straight there. either you're a straight shooter or you're not.
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either you're telling the way it is or you're not. and donald trump is just going to wherever the wind blows him, what makes him look better. >> eric wi, the flip side is tr sort of comes out in the defense of ben carson. nobody else does. the rest of the republican field does not come out and say the same thing. is there a chance here that maybe this ends up making a jeb bush, a marco rubio, even ted cruz who said, there is no rinlgs test in the constitution, did they look more reasonable by comparison? >> i think it's too late for them. i think if when trump arrived in july, if someone had said, i'm going to stake my campaign on fact checking, on pushing back, on pointing out the extreme rhetoric of donald trump, month after month, they could have carved out a niche, i think. they should have carved out a niche against the talk radio candidate of a dronald trump, bt nobody did it, because they were all scared. so now if someone now kind of makes a stand against outrageous comments about a muslim can't be president, it's going to be too little, too late, i think. >> but jeb bush came out, krmca
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fiorina came out swinging against that comment -- >> but months after -- >> at a certain point with trump, we start to say, which comment? >> that is a really, really good point. that's the interesting test, i think we saw it yesterday with scott walker getting out of the race. scott walker basically saying to the rest of the republican establishment, hey, it's time we winnow this down and come up with somebody who can go one on one with trump. that's a story to be watched going forward. thanks to both of you for joining us. appreciate that. coming up, the key move today by senate republicans trying to avoid a government shutdown, but is it too little and too late? and will conservatives revolt? and in 2016, has late-night television turned into the number one campaign stop for candidates trying to create some buzz? (vo) what does the world run on?
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there was some drama on
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capitol hill today from former cia director david petraeus. petraeus publicly apologized to lawmakers for sharing classified information with his biographer and mistress, paula broadwell. >> four years ago, i made a serious mistake, one that brought discredit on me and pain closest to those closest to me. it was a violation of the trust placed in me and a breach of the values to which i'd been committed throughout my life. >> petraeus was testifying at a hearing on u.s. policy in the middle east. it was his first testimony since he was sentenced to two years probation and fined $100,000 for sharing classified information. up next, we'll go live to capitol hill for another key story today. new attempts to head off a government shutdown. shopping online is as easy as it gets. wouldn't it be great if hiring plumbers, carpenters and piano tuners were just as simple? thanks to angie's list, now it is. we're making hiring anyone from a handyman to a dog walker
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senate battle that could lead to a shutdown of the government. senate majority leader mitch mcconnell just scheduled a vote for this thursday on a plan to strip planned parenthood of his federal funding. but it likely will not pass because democrats are strongly against it. mcconnell announced this new plan just minutes after democrats blocked a bill that would ban abortions after 20 weeks. the debate on the floor began both personal and political. >> it is simply about protecting ten fingers, ten toes, and one beating heart. >> today we stand in midst of yet another show vote designed to honor the political wish list of extremists. >> this fight unfolds with just eight days to figure out an answer and to avoid a government shutdown. nbc news capitol hill producer, frank thorpe has followed this debate all day. he's live on capitol hill. frank, i feel i've had this
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conversation with you about 62 gazillion times over the last two years. the clock is ticking. there's an issue that a group of republicans want addressed. the threat of a government shutdown is looming. bottom line this for us. this issue of funding the government while taking out funding for planned parenthood, which is what the conservatives on the republican side want. what are the chances that the government actually gets shut down over this? >> well, i mean, this bill, particularly, has really no chance of going anywhere. basically what this is is a hail mary from republican leadership, in which they know that the defense is going to bat this one down. so this vote on thursday is going to happen. there's an expectation not only amongst democrats, but amongst republican leadership that they're not going to be able to get the 60 votes needed to pass it. and then the expectation is that senate republican leadership or senate republicans will then sit back together, get together as a conference, and figure out a way forward. the most likely way forward, though, is just simply a clean,
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continuing resolution, a clean bill that would fund the government all the way until december 11th. but right now, the question is, is whether or not they would need democratic votes to pass it. you have -- but you have a lot of republicans who have already come out saying they're fed up with this fight. they don't want to continue with this fight. and they know it's a losing fight. so they've already come out and said that they would support a clean cr. so that does seem like the most likely way forward here. >> all right, nbc news capitol hill producer, frank thorpe, thanks for your time. appreciate that. in one of the leading voices for defunding planned parenthood has been texas senator and presidential contender ted cruz. in the last presidential debate, he told his fellow republicans, do not give up their effort against planned parenthood without a fight. but today on the senate floor, kelly ayotte offered a different perspective. she asked, what is the end game of a showdown? >> and so here we are, again,
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with both sides and the political posturing. and i don't want to play this game anymore. i think it's too important that we not re-live the movie of where we were in 2013 when the government shut down. right now we're playing a game of chicken and it's a dangerous game. >> all right. i want to bring in kelsey snell. she's a congressional reporter for "the washington post." kelsey, we just heard from frank thorpe, talking about the senate side on this. a lot of action taking place in the senate this week. the dynamic that we've been seeing the last few years, though, is that maybe there's a little bit more ideological flexibility when it comes to the republicans on the senate side than on the house side. how does that factor into this? >> well, we anticipate that once this gets over to the house, you will lose a pretty significant number of republicans on the far conservative side who don't want to vote for a continuing resolution.
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but republicans have already basically admitted that they'll need democrats to make sure that they get over the hurdle. so they'll be turning to house -- to nancy pelosi and to the rest of the democrats to turn over enough votes to get a clean cr through to the president, before we get to a shutdown. >> so that's interesting, though. because we've talked so much in the last couple of years about the sort of tenuous hold that john boehner has over the republican conference. a number of republicans feel he's not conservative enough, gives in too easily, compromises too freely. the prospect of john boehner turning to nancy pelosi and turning to democrats to keep the government funded and to keep funding for planned parenthood, could that cause some jeopardy for john boehner within the republican conference? >> you know, it could, definitely, make it more difficult for boehner going forward, and we do expect that there will be a motion to challenge his speakership. but the fact of the matter is, it's very difficult to be speaker and not a lot of people want that job. also, it's not uncommon for republicans to have to reach
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across and get some votes from democrats. we've seen it happen actually fairly frequently over the past several years. and it's not a huge departure in this situation. >> you know, the other thing is, i think, politically, we're sort of conditioned to look at these shutdowns. we think back to 1995. you go back 20 years and the story of bill clinton's revival as president, as the republicans overreached and shut the government down. and we say that 2013, a couple of years ago, was a disaster for republicans by shutting down the government, and certainly the polling at the time showed that. but i wonder, a republican could also look at the 2013 shutdown and say, hey, a year later, we reached our highest level of seats in the house that we've had since world war ii. a year later, we took so many senate seats back, that we now control that chamber. was it really that big of a political disaster to shut down the government? >> you know, that is the exact calculus that a lot of republicans are making. and you hear people saying that, you know, that a shutdown really did serve their purposes in some ways, and there's been a comfortable amount of polling that says, you know, that people
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want to see republicans go after their beliefs and that their primary voters actually believe very strongly in having their members stand up. but, you know, it will be hard to say what will happen in this upcoming election, because i think a lot of the issues that are in voters' minds may be deferent than they were back in 2013. >> all right. kelsey snell from "the washington post," appreciate the time tonight. thank. >> thank you. and breaking news from the drug company ceo who sparked outrage for raising the price of one treatment by more than 5,000%. what he plans to do now with the drug. we'll tell you about that, ahead. and the kentucky clerk who refused to give marriage licenses to same-sex couples is speaking out. at the same time, a new legal complaint is filed against her. (wind noise) (road noise) what's happening here... is not normal, it's extraordinary. 291 people, 350 tons,
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we just need to make sure she has what she needs. welcome to windows 10. the future starts now for all of us. now that's a full weekend. ♪
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join in and guess the five stops they made by tweeting #altimaweekendcontest for a chance to win your own weekend adventure! car radio: with our monday morning traffic report... all right. breaking news now. in that story we brought you about a ceo of a drug company who overnight raised the price of a life-saving medication by more than 5,000% just moments ago, martin shkreli from touring pharmaceuticals told nbc news in the next few weeks he will lower the price to either break even or make a smaller profit, but didn't give any specific price. >> it's easy to see a large drug price increase and say, gosh, those people must be gouging. but when you find out the company is not making any money, what does that mean?
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it's east to want to villenize people and obviously we are in an election cycle where it's easy for people to point fingers. >> this morning, hillary clinton unveiled her own health care plan to decrease prescription costs and attacked turing for what she called price gouging. >> pharmaceutical companies that acquire an existing affordable drug that people rely on it, and then turn around and charge a fortune for it, just bet on the fact that desperate people will find some way to pay for it. that is bad actors making a fortune off of people's misfortune. >> turing pharmaceuticals raised the price of daraprim, that's a drug that's been around for decades and used to treat aid patients. the price was raised from $13.50 for a tablet to $750 if shkreli, a former hedge fund manager, originally said the price increase is necessary for future
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research. joining me now are cnbc's meg terrell and dr. cory a. bear, a practicing physician and professor at louisiana state university health sciences center. so, meg, you got a chance to interview him. you know this world, obviously, a little bit better than i do. so, he's not putting -- he's saying the price will come down now a little bit. we were at 13 bucks. now we're at $7.550. do we have a sense where in that range he can still make a profit but it's still affordable? >> you can presume he could have made a profit at the old price. but they bought the drug for $50 million to $60 million. after spending that much money to buy it, they had to raise the price to recoup the cost. so the old company, it was reported that it only took about $1 to manufacture each one of these pill. so they were making a profit at $13.50. so it's a little curious that he's reversing course today, when he was so solid yesterday, saying, no, he's not going to lower the price of this drug. and he was saying the price was up there so he could do research to develop better drugs. now the question is, is he still
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going to do that? are they still going to have the funds that are going to come in to do that? you have to question the guy's whole motive. >> if you're saying $50 million to $60 million to acquire it. and we're talking about a drug, i guess it's about 10,000 people that use this drug regularly, with it sounds like he probably can't bring it down that much without now losing a ton of money. >> and shkreli was also saying a couple handful of thousand of people who take this drug. and it is a very rarely used drug, be that doesn't mean that it's not important for those folks. it's very questionable where this price will end up and i hope he's very transparent about where he does price it. >> dr. cory a. bear, let me bring you in. that justification he offered, and we hear this a lot about one of the great things about the united states is innovation in pharmaceuticals. we're able to come up with these drugs that deal with niche diseases, niche problems, and you need money to go into research and development. so that justification of, hey, i am going to spike the prices here, but that money will turn around and it's ultimately going to have some kind of benefit in
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developing another new and potentially life-saving drug. what do you make of that? >> it's ridiculous. let's just cut to the chase here. this guy's a hedge fund guy and he bough the company so he could make a lot of money. that's what hedge fund guys do. and pharmaceutical companies do a lot of good, and there's also some issues with a lot of pharmaceutical companies. however, that is pure price gouging. and that is against the law in some states. and i would like to see legislation like hillary clinton put up today to make sure that this can't happen. because it is a drug that's been around for over 50 years. i mean, this drug was actually $1 a pill. not just to make, but $1 a pill to sell several years ago. so the point is, this guy wants to make money and also he wants to get his own publicity from this. and also, wants to get publicity for his country. and i get it, because i'm a businessman as well. however, on the backs of hiv patients? on the backs of babies? on the backs of people with malaria? come on, man. it's just ridiculous. >> so corey, how common is this,
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then? how many other drugs out there are there that serve a small particular market that are -- that can be gobbled up by a company like this and the same thing can happen? >> yeah, this is a common practice. i mean, there's a drug cyclecyrene that came out recently and had this happen. there have been several drugs over the past several years that this has happened with. because businessmen are out there gobbling up companies and large drug companies are selling off the generics. and what happens is, when you gobble this up, the company that buys the drug will make it very hard to get, so the demand goes up and then the price actually goes up as well. and that's just supply and demand. so as long as we're a capitalistic society, that's going to happen. and i'm for capitalism, don't get me wrong, but these guys are doing a disservice to the business profession as well as the medical profession. >> megan, in the short-term, the
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way out of it see, and i guess this happened in one other case like this, is maybe there's so much negative publicity around this, that he's able to sell it back, we can sort of all forget that it happened in the first place. is there any possibility of that happening? >> folks were calling for, you know, different foundations to come step in, like the gates foundation which works in hiv and infectious disease to come in and undercut this guy and make this drug. but there are questions about how widely distributed this drug can be, so generic drugmakers could potentially come in and make copies of it. when you have this kind of monopoly on the system -- >> is there the possibility of a generic drug? >> there could be the possibility of a generic drug, because this drug was approved in 1953, so it doesn't have patent protection anymore. but there's a question of is there enough of this drug that can get distributed freely enough for generic drugmakers to come and make a copy of it to sell. >> it's an amazing story. and again, we're talking about a pill that's 13 bucks one day and 750 buck s ththe next day and t guy says, maybe i'll bring it back a little bit lower so it's
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a little bit more affordable. that range blows my mind. >> and he's also really not a nice guy, either. he's kind of like a jerk, you know? that doesn't help. >> i got to say, it doesn't -- ynt know him personally, but it doesn't make a good impression on me. cnbc's meg terrell and dr. corey hebear. thank you so much. and coming up next, the court filing in the case of the kentucky clerk who refused to issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples. a dry mouth can be a common side effect. that's why there's biotene. it comes in oral rinse, spray or gel so there's moisturizing relief for everyone. biotene, for people who suffer from dry mouth.
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as kim davis faces a new legal complaint, the controversial kentucky clerk is speaking out about her faith and about her job. the aclu says that davis is interfering with her deputies who are issuing marriage licenses to same-sex couples. the group says she changed the forms to remove her name and the county's name. and in her first interview this morning, davis said that she doesn't understand why that form is so important to same-sex couples. >> i feel really sad that someone could be so unhappy with themselves as a person that they did not feel dignified as a human being until they got a piece of paper. i mean, there's just so much more to life than that. >> attorneys for davis say the aclu wants, quote, her scalp to hang on the wall as a trophy.
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but the aclu says it just wants the county to go back to using the original forms. no word on when the judge can rule on this new motion. it's more than the cloud. it's security - and flexibility. it's where great ideas and vital data are stored. with centurylink you get advanced technology solutions from a trusted it partner. including cloud and hosting services - all backed by an industry leading broadband network and people committed to helping you grow your business. you get a company that's more than just the sum of it's parts.
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ask your doctor about otezla today. otezla. show more of you. when it comes to politics, late-night television has become more important than ever this campaign cycle. this week is certainly no exception. ted cruz, carly fiorina, bernie sanders, all of them making appearances just last night. senator cruz was on with stephen colbert. one topic that came up, same-sex marriage. >> so if you want to change the marriage laws, i'm asking what you want. >> i believe in democracy. i believe in democracy. and i don't think we should -- >> no, no, guys, guys, however you feel, he's my guest, so please don't boo him. >> i don't imagine we should entrust to governing our society to five unelected lawyers in washington. >> carly fiorina was on "the tonight show," where she denounced comments made by ben
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carson, who said he wouldn't support a muslim running for president. fiorina has also had some fun. she showed off a song that she usually reserves for her dog. ♪ my name's snick and i'm lazy ♪ please don't take a walk with me ♪ ♪ i would rather stay right here at home instead ♪ ♪ i want to lie back down in my nice warm bed ♪ ♪ my name's snick and you're gonna have to carry me ♪ >> definitely a side of carly fiorina i've never seen before. and bernie sanders sat down with comedy central host larry willmore, where the two got into the meaning of democratic socialism. the black lives matter movement, and the historic legacy of the classic film, "weekend at bernie's." >> if you could just do this for my, just in case, bernie. could you just put these sunglasses on -- >> absolutely. >> just in case we have to do the "weekend at bernie's" thing. >> how's that? >> that's awesome. >> and just kind of do this.
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>> that's fantastic. that's awesome. >> and the beat continues tonight. donald trump is going to be on with stephen colbert and john kasich is going to be on with seth myers. that's it for us this hour. thanks for watching. i'm steve kornacki. "hardball" starts right now. pope francis arrives in america. he's coming to congress. is the pope gonna play political hardball? good evening. i'm chuck todd here in new york, in for chris matthews. he's attending the funeral of his aunt eleanor. we begin tonight with the historic scene just outside of washington, just hours ago at joint base andrews, formerly known as andrews air force base, the pope landed in the united states for the first time. and this was the scene.

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