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tv   The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell  MSNBC  September 30, 2015 7:00pm-8:01pm PDT

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chloride. instead they had something called potassium acetate. astounding. oklahoma invented lethal injection 40 years ago. they went through the disaster and legal dock pail. they defended the cocktail all the way to the supreme court and won that case. but then this. they show up to this execution with the wrong drug, having no idea until the last minute that this was there. this was a drug they didn't mean to have there, one that has apparently been used in an execution in any state at anytime. seriously, oklahoma? that does it for us tonight. we will see you tomorrow. now it's time for "the last word" with lawrence o'donnell. good evening. thanks. your reporting on these death penalty drugs for more than the last year has been extraordinary. and no one has covered it the way you have. thanks, rachel. >> we have new information tonight about who arranged the pope's meeting with kim davis. and republicans spent the day
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criticizing the president for what's happening in syria, but none of them would say what they would do with syria, except donald trump. a significant show of force from russia in its alleged fight against isis. but u.s. officials say the targets are anti-assad rebels. >> we are seeing the true intentions of vladimir putin. >> russia and iran and their proxies want to keep assad in power. >> that approach is tantamount to pouring gasoline on the fire. >> it is imperative that find a solution. >> the question was asked of me, why don't you tell us exactly what you're going to do in syria. i said i don't want to tell you. >> i will support the republican nominee. i don't think that's going to be donald trump. >> everybody thought hillary clinton was unbeatable, right? >> the surprisinged a middleweight about the benghazi investigating committee. >> we put together a benghazi special committee. what are her numbers today?
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her numbers are dropping. >> the dumbest statement i've heard since 47%. >> classic definition of a washington gaffe, which is accidentally telling the truth. >> demonstrates unequivocally that this was always meant to be a partisan political exercise. >> i would have slugged the guy and say i've been waiting to catch you. at the end of a day that saw russia's first 20 combat flights over syria, secretary of state john kerry met with the russian foreign minister, sergie ladrov. . >> we agreed the military should get in contact with each other very soon. we all want syria democratic, united, secular. syria, which is a home for all ethnic and confessional groups, whose rights are guaranteed. but we have some differences as for the details on how to get there.
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>> it is one thing, obviously, to be targeting isil. we're concerned, obviously, if that's not what is happening. we also agreed that it is imperative to find a solution to this conflict and to avoid escalating it in any way. >> the russian military actions in syria provoked republican attacks on president obama in the senate beginning, as usual on military matters, with john mccain. >> it's a time that president obama woke up to the realities in the world and reassert american leadership. and that does not mean that we're going to send thousands of ground troops back into iraq or syria. but it does mean that we develop a policy. what we should be saying to vladimir putin is that you fly, but we fly anywhere we want to, when and how we want to and you had better stay out of the way. that's the message that should be sent to vladimir putin.
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>> the republican chairman of the senate foreign relations committee appeared on "meet the press daily" to criticize the president. but like john maccain, he could not come up with a single specific policy recommendation of his own. >> if president obama came to you, called yo up -- and i know you guys have a good personal relationship -- and he said, what would you recommend, senator, i do right now in response to this. >> that's a great question. of course, we've gotten to the place where it's even difficult to get a good answer. i would recommend and voted for us hitting them back in 2013. >> by the way, you were one of a small minority, by the way, on both sides of the aisle. >> he asked for it and i supported it. i believe you support the commander-in-chief when he lays down a red line. >> today, former secretary of state hillary clinton said this -- >> i don't think it's clear yet what russia is really up to. from what i have heard.
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they may or may not be targeting known isis refuge positions. they may be going after assad's enemies and claiming that it's isis. that's the problem that we've got now in syria. there's so many players. so i think what president obama has tried to do is to keep focus on where it needs to be. >> and the front-runner for the republican nomination said this -- >> you have isis that wants to take on assad. so we're fighting isis but we want to fight assad. why don't you let those two fight for a little while and take over the remnants, right? >> joining us now, howard dean, former vermont governor and former chairman of the democratic national committee. also with us, jonathan alter, an nbc analyst. and e.j. dionne, an msnbc analyst.
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jonathan altar, starting with the last commentator, donald trump, why not just let them slug it out. >> that was our policy during the iran-iraq war, which went on for year, which was essentially let them both lose. but russia has complicated that strategy. and i think they have confounded the obama administration, which did not expect that russia would do this. when it became involved militarily, i think they assumed that at the beginning they would join isis. but we know tonight they are bombing positions in the hamas region of syria that are held by moderate opponents of the assad regime, not isis. they are bombing u.s. allies inside syria. so beau tin has double crossed the administration. and you can see whytin has doub
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the administration. and you can see wtin has doublee administration. and you can see wtin has double administration. and you can see wtin has double administration. and you can see wtin has double administration. and you can see wputin has doub administration. and you can see why the white house may have taken trump's strategy and let's wash our hands of this and let them fight it out. >> so now we have putin say i'm going into syria and i'm going to knock the hell out of isis, h esaid. and i'm saying what's so bad with that, you know? is there anything wrong with -- that's okay, that's all right. but i also say, we want to be strong. we can't let him push us around. >> howard dean, you could spend all day trying to find a republican who would tell you what to do next in syria. none of them are coming up with that. >> there are some things that have to be done. because you can't just let them quote, unquote, fight it out. literally, hundreds of thousands of civilians being killed. and it's also creating an
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enormous crisis in europe, which is a problem. i think it's time for a no-fly zone. and we may have to confront the russians. i personally think unless you confront the russians in their backyard, they're going to back off. syria is not their backyard. there are parts of syria, which are reasonably peaceful. we ought to put a no-fly net over those as we did in kurdistan after saddam gassed thousands of them. i don't think we should have ground troops in. the moderate syrians, i think obama was right to not get involved in that. all the arms we sent over there are going to end up in somebody else's hands. but this is a huge problem and it's time to intervene for humanitarian reasons. because it's a solution to the european refugee crisis. >> go ahead, john. >> the thing i don't get about that is if you apply a no-fly zone, you're basically going eyeball to eyeball with the russians. we've given them essentially a green light to get involved
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militarily. it's pretty hard for us now to say no, not only can you not become involved militarily, but we're going to enforce a no-fly zone. then you really are talking about a possible -- >> i don't think we gave them that. >> i don't think we gave them the green light to do worse. assad has been chlorine bombing these people. now russian is bombing the hell out of civilians is what he's doing. i don't see how we can put up with that. my calculations about the russians is, if you take them on in their backyard, they'll be tough. if you take them on in an interest that isn't really in their interest -- it's the only thing they understand. he lies every day. putin lies every day. there's nothing you can do. >> they lied on this. they said they were going to attack isis positions and they're not. >> people like that only respect force. i don't advocate attacking the russians, but i do advocate carving out a safe zone for
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syrians so we can a, deal with the european refugee crisis and b so we can have at least some part of syria which is reasonably well governed and immune from the kinds of attacks -- >> this could be become a crisis in u.s./russian relations. >> we've had a crisis for three years and nobody's done anything about it. >> have you heard a proposal today that sounds like the route worth taking going forward? >> well, i think the reason no one can come up with a really good option is there really is no really good option in syria. there's never been a great option in syria. you know what the end game has to look like. there has to be a negotiation that eventually gets assad out of power and that guarantees rights to the various peoples of syria. it's a lot of peoples cobbled together in one country in different religious orientations
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in islam. but gets there is nearly impossible. the russians really did double cross us. it looks like they were bombing the free syrian army who are the people probably closest to us in syria. and so i think that the administration has to push the russians back away from this policy. but that will not -- that will not be easy. the question is, what is putin really in this far. is he really trying to prop assad up for the long run? is he trying to strengthen him for the short run for negotiations, or is he doing this mostly for domestic reasons. he's got a slew of problems back in russia, and he wants to tell the russian people, see, i am making russia important again in the world. but where does that play out in the long run in syria. it's not clear to me, i have to say. >> donald trump made news tonight on the humanitarian side of the crisis. the refugees fleeing that area. he had a message for any of the
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refugees who managed to make it into the united states. let's listen to that. >> now i hear we want to take in 2 h,000 syrians, right? and they could be -- listen, they could be isis. i don't know. did you ever see a migration like that? i'll tell you right now, and i'm putting everybody on notice, and hopefully this gets outside of this room and i guess it will with all these crazy cameras going back there. i'm putting the people on notice that a are coming here from syria as part of this mass migration, that if i win, if i win they're going back. they're going back. >> as he would say, that disgusts me. has he ever heard of the statue of liberty. these are suffering people. these are not terrorists and they faced enormous hardship. this country has been about
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welcoming refugees from violence. would that have been his view when jews who were suspected of being communist were fleeing nazi germany? there were americans in congress who argued that. no, we can't let the jews in in the 1930s, they might be communists. who cares that they've been suffering. and this is a really degrading contribution to our political dialogue. >> that's going to have to be the last word on this segment. jonathan, thank you very much for joining us. coming up, mitt romney says republicans won't pick donald trump as their nominee because, basically, they're not crazy. and hillary clinton responded tonight, kevin mccarthy saying the benghazi committee hurt her in the polls. and we have new information to report about who arranged the pope's meeting with kim davis in washington last week. ♪ ♪
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>> well, they huffed and they puffed for weeks but they did not blow the house down. the house voted to fund the government for two months, ending the threat of the a government shut down over the funding of planned parenthood. the senate passed the same bill 78-20. that bill funds planned parent hood in full. president obama said this about the shutdown this afternoon. >> the good news is that it looks like the republicans will just barely avoid shutting down government for the second time in two years. that's a somewhat low bar, but we should celebrate where we can. the bad news is that it looks like the republicans will just barely avoid shutting the government down for the second time in two years. up next, mitt romney versus donald trump. constipated?
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use dulcolax tablets for gentle overnight relief suppositories for relief in minutes and stool softeners for comfortable relief of hard stools. dulcolax, designed for dependable relief >> mitt romney let us down. he let us down. something happened the last month. he choked. like a golfer, he can't sink that last putt. something happened. that was an election that should have been won. >> i will support the republican nominee. i don't think that's going to be donald trump. >> idiot is the word that most frequently comes to mind as a one-word description for the front run fer the republican front-runner nomination, according to a new national poll. the words that post frequently
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came to mind about donald trump were idiot, and its synonyms, jerk, stupid, dumb, followed by arrogant, crazy, nuts and buffoon, clown, comical and joke in that order. mitt romney thinks the idiot, stupid, dumb, buffoon, comical joke is hurting the republican party. >> yesterday some of the things he said about other candidates have been childish. i think that's probably a fair characterization coming from him. i think it's unfortunate to have the kind of personal attacks we've seen in the process. but i think the 11th commandment was quickly lost in this race. and that i think makes it harder for us in the general. >> the usa stud/suffolk university poll shows trump leveling off, ben carson 13, carly fiorina 13, marco rubio,
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9. >> we're here with michael steele, former rnc chairman and msnbc political analyst, also back with us, howard dean. so alex, when your one-word association? >> so good. >> leads with idiot, how far can you go? >> i just want the trucker hat that says idiot, dumb, buffoon, clown, whatever else. that needs to be the sort of answer to the make america great again trucker hat. what's weird is that there's overlap between people who say they want him to be the nominee and people who say he's a buffoon, clown, idiot. what's maybe terrifying about that poll is if you tally up ben carson support, carly fiorina support and donald trump support, that's 49% of the republican electorate. and you look at those numbers. you know, you have establishment candidates polling in the single digits. and no matter how badly the donor class and the establishment want marco rubio
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or john kasich or jeb bush to be their nominee, it is hard to imagine how they are going to draw double-digit strength in a field like that. >> the republican establishment happens to be in person tonight, michael steele. >> oh, that's the last thing i am. >> i want you to listen to the real establishment, mitt romney, with the reasoning why donald trump will never be the nominee. let's listen. >> my party has historically nominated someone who is a mainstream conservative. and someone with foreign policy that can guide with confidence a ship in troubled waters. mr. trump over the weekend, i think, on "60 minutes" said that he thought it would be a good idea to let isis take over syria and then we can pick up the pieces. and i thought that was both absurd and dangerous.
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i just don't think that kind of proposal is likely to led him to become our nominee. >> michael, your reaction to mitt romney? >> he's absolutely right. that's what the party has done, but this is not a typical time in the party. it not a lot of rank and file and establishment lefs have going on. they have no idea what to do with this. and each day, donald trump is gaining the insight of himself that he can become the next president of the united states. you saw that a little bit in how he rolled out his piece on tax proposals. he actually went to notes and took questions reasonably well. so there's a danger now where donald trump has to break through the kreeling that he's reached in his number, 23, 22%. and if he does that, as we get
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closer to the primary, the establishment is going to be looking at jeb bush, marco rubio, kasich sitting in single digits numbers, wondering how do they get close to him? how do they do that? show me the pathway to that point. that's the frustration you have. and you heard it expressed optimistically, at the end of the day, we're going to get to that point. i'm not so sure we get there anytime soon. and when we do, is it too late? >> the rational that mitt romney gave, how to get tot republican nominee is the one i've always used. it's never really hard to predict. it was going to be mitt romney, it was going to be john mccain when his time came. but howard dean, precedent controls politics until it doesn't. until the table gets upset and a new precedent is set. >> what i'm waiting for a really smart reporter to do is write a
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story about the organizes that these folks have. they could be in 13% of the polls. if they can't get the polls out in iowa, it doesn't make any difference. so that's number one. it's too early to talk like this. the number two, though, is the republicans changed their rules so they didn't have their stuff going on. it turned out what they did was later in -- i mean early on, these are not winner take all states anymore. if you have one of these folks being a front-runner and they get in a divided field, 35% of the vote, they're going to get every single delegate from that state. so that militates in favor of trump or fiorina or carson. what we don't know is where is their organization? i want the establishment press to go look and find what they have for organizations.
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i question whether the establishment press -- donald trump seems to be a bellwether for the accomplishment of the press. ben carson is a rejoinder to that. he exists in conservative radio and media channels that didn't exist in 2008. and maybe even in 2012. that explains his support. so which is it? is it the establishment press has disproportional control over the nomination process? or it doesn't at all. you have two examples at one and two that are almost usually exclusive. >> all i'm asking for a substantive article telling me what their chances really are. we can't know unless we know what their organization looks like. >> what do we know about their on the ground organizations in early states? >> i'm glad you brought that pup and howard dean has it exactly right. he knows at the end of the day what this is all about.
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it's about your organization on the ground, which is why jeb bush is not really worried. this is a problem for him. jeb bush is laughing his tail off because he's concentrate on the one thing he matters. it doesn't matter if he wins iowa or not, he's got a long ball play exactly because of what howard said. you're probably going to have two or three different winners out of the first four primaries in caucuses. the organization on the ground is important despite what people have to say. you've got to look at that organization and he's getting it. >> before we go to the break, i want to play the word game one more time on this "usa
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today"/suffolk poll. they only did it with one ore republican candidate. alex wagner, you're the conte contestant here. smart, intelligent, knowledgeable. here's the second group of words. dishonest, liar, untrustworthy. who is this candidate? >> carly fiorina. >> correct, you win it. >> thank you very much for playing tonight. coming up, hillary clinton responds to kevin mar r mccarthy saying the benghazi committee hurt her in the polls. rheumatoid arthritis like me... and you're talking to a rheumatologist about a biologic, this is humira. this is humira helping to relieve my pain and protect my joints from further damage.
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built for business. . the speaker of the house is the second in line of succession to the president after the vice president. air force one took the president from florida to nebraska on 9/11 to keep him out of danger until washington was safe. the vice president was locked in a bunker below the white house, and the speaker of the house was safely helicoptered, as i said, to an undisclosed location. all of that done to preserve the office of the presidency. the speaker of the house is the second most important elected official in the washington. the speaker of the house is usually then a seasoned veteran of the house who has slowly worked all the way up to the speakership. not anymore. 50-year-old kevin mccarthy, a
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nine-year veteran of the house is the least experience speaker, future speaker, in over a century. he will be the next speaker of the house, and he is already the worst public speaker the speakership has ever had. >> everybody thought hillary clinton was unbeatable, right? but we put together a benghazi special committee, a select committee. what are her numbers today? her numbers are dropping. why? because she's untrustable. but no one would not any of that had happened -- >> i agree. i give you credit for that. >> that was kevin mccarthy 24 hours ago making his spebenghaz committee nothing but reducing her numbers. >> i knew those lost at benghazi. they were representing us in a
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very dangerous part of the world. there have already been eight investigations in the congress, one independent investigation. we have learned all we can learn about what we need to do to protect our diplomats and our other civilians and we need to be enforcing and implementing those changes, which is what i started and what secretary kerry has continued. so when i hear a statement like that which demonstrates unequivocally that this was always meant to be a partisan political exercise, i feel like it does a grave disservice and dishonors, not just the memory of the four that we lost, but of everybody who has served our country. >> there is already a fire mccarthy movement among republican, led by former georgia republican paul brown. but it is not because of how kevin mccarthy publicly undermined the credibility of the benghazi committee.
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it is because he's not conservative enough. joining us now is jonathan allen, the chief correspondent for vox. jonathan allen, this was what hillary clinton was hoping for. she couldn't have hoped for it in her wildest dreams that the future speaker would make the whole point of the committee to knock down her poll numbers. >> the entire republican party in washington has spent the entirety of the benghazi committee's existence denying the idea that it is a political witch hunt, intended only to prevent hillary clinton from being president. and kevin mccarthy, the guy who's about to be speaker of the house walks out and says you know what, it is actually all about politics. he shouldn't have said anything worse for republicans. not only is it bad in that broad sense, it's also bad in the narrow sense that she's going to testify in a few weeks. now the republican are in a box. to the extent they wanted to turn it into a political side show, they can. everybody is going to be watching for that and they're
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going to call foul when it happens. this is a huge blunder by mccarthy and often as gaffes are, thes a revolution of the truth. >> michael steele, it sounds like the republicans kuld not have given hill kri clinton a bigger gift before her testimony on october 27. >> it's stunning that the one thing that, you know, since the early hours after the revolutions of what happened in benghazi, republicans have always tried to keep this above the political quagmire but at the same time dragging right into it. and then i think that the words that were used to describe the work of the committee, the chairman cannot be happy right now. as was just pointed out, he's going to hold these hearings, have the secretary there. and every word, every utterance is now going to be framed in the minds and consciousness of the
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people listening in terms of politics. and that undermines the effort all together. >> alex wagner, in our previous arrow, rachel mad doudow showed misspeaking on every other sentence. and these sentences were written for him. and they contained mistakes apparently both in the writing and the speaking. speaker is the worst title you could give to this man. >> this wasn't a gaffe insofar as sean hannity was pressing kevin mccarthy. this is something he planned to say on fox news including the word untrustable. in that respect, it's sort of like the houston we have a problem issue with regards to this man being the speaker of the house. 4 but i will say, you know, to say that this revealed the benghazi committee is a political action committee, effectively, this is not news to most people who have been
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following the select committee on benghazi. it has always been a political endeavor from the beginning of john boehner's announce. of who would be on it complete with a graphic showing all the people who were going to be on your select committee on benghazi. this was always a political witch hunt. now we have confirmation that it is. does it change anyone's opinions? i think that remains to be seen. republicans who want to see it go forward will be excited. democrats who are skeptical will still be skeptical. >> jonathan allen, what did it do for hillary clinton's supporters? is i would imagine this would give them kind of a new life and a new energy about this. >> i think they're absolutely hoping that this is the turning point, the break they have been waiting for, undermine not only the committee but some of the findings that will poison the fruits of that tree. it's been said kevin mccarthy gave them a huge gift. just one other thing, the idea that kevin mccarthy is not
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conservative enough, you mentioned earlier that some republicans are saying that. this is a guy who doesn't have a discernible ideology. he's extremely aimable, but he's not one you would say he is one of those rock rib conservatives. he's rocketed to the top very fast with very little experience. hasn't run a committee in congress, and i think it's going to be a real test to see if he has the discipline to not make these kinds of mistakes. >> michael steele, it seems hard to predict a long run for kevin mccart mccarthy as speaker. >> i don't know how long it will be, but i know conservative, the tea party conservatives in particular are going to be very antsy about his early steps. this certainly does not help those early steps. you're going to see for the majority leard post and other posts them wanting to put the personnel in those roles. in december, there's another vote on shutting down the
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government. so good luck. >> michael steele, thank you very much for joining us to night. coming up, another quiz for alex wagner. i don't want anyone to see your answer. write down for me who you think has -- which presidential candidate has the most online contributors. and i don't want to ruin the suspension for the audience, so just write it down there and i'll see if it's true. actually, we'll hold up your answer in the next segment to show that she wrote it down. okay, there it is. we're going to be right back. i take prilosec otc each morning for my frequent heartburn because you can't beat zero heartburn! ahhh the sweet taste of victory! prilosec otc.
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the sanders campaign hit this mark faster than barack obama did in either of his campaigns dp. bernie sanders is still trailing hillary clinton in actually dollars and cents. tonight, t"the washington post" reports bernie sanders pulled in $24 million this quart per .hillary clinton's campaign says she raised $28 million this quarter. in an interview with david axelrod, bernie sanders said he hopes to keep his campaign positive. >> i've never run a negative add in my life, how's that? >> that's pretty remarkable. if you can get through this whole cam feign -- >> well, i surely hope so. >> that's not a eyes or no. >> it is my hope i will never run a negative ad. i never have after all these year, but we'll see. >> congratulations on another win of the quiz show tonight. i find it stunning that bernie sanders is so close to hillary
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clinton on total dollars raised. that makes it a very unimpressive outcome for hillary clinton. she's the one that everyone said had the giant fundraising capacity. >> you talk to certain democratic operatives and there is not an emerging consensus, but maybe the beginning of an emerging consensus that bernie sanders may win iowa and maybe even new hampshire 37 and for the hillary clinton campaign, that is a damming emerging consensus. also the person watching all of this transpire with very perked ears and keen eyes is joe biden. there's a story running that the clinton campaign has been reaching out in earnest to donors, trying to shore up support against a potential joe biden run. this is not good. and for many, many democrats who presumed at the end of the day it will be hillary's race to lose, this is cold comfort.
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>> reading tomorrow's news to eight noosh -- we call that thaet chaeting on this show. >> this is one of those things. the clinton campaign has all insisted and they can still insi insist, they have a firewall in south carolina. . bernie sanders does take iowa or his neighboring state of new hampshire and they have been doing some spinning, indicating they could live with that, they will take control after new hampshire. >> i feel like we could be running this episode of "the last word" in 2008. this within spin of we're going to lose this state and that state and in the end we're going to win because we're the big machine. until bernie sanders shows that we can win latino voters, until he can win african-american voters, it's hard to see how he builds a coalition in the big states. and particularly you were talking earlier with howard dean about delegates.
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when you look at democratic delegates, they are clustered around zis in the big states. and particularly in african and american and hispanic parts of the state. you know, we're talking about a situation where bernie sanders hasn't broken through that wall and as long as he doesn't, hillary clinton probably ends up winning the nomination. it's not good for her that he's at $24 million the last quarter and she's at $28 million in the last quarter. those numbers are moving in the wrong direction for her. >> another surprising number that came out, ben carson, $20 million. with bernie sanders and ben carson raising that kind of money, we're starting absolutely to defy all previous conventional wisdom on where the money goes in these campaigns. >> there's a great piece in vox that tuck talks about the question of the establishment. that only effects media, right? ben carson is an example of a grassroots campaign that -- and bernie sanders to a certain degree, too.
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it's not just media, it's also donors and the question is, are we actually beginning to see the changing of the landscape that wre eve been long predicting on a host of other levels, independent of politics. is it now finally affecting the political arena? is 2016 the year that all bets were off? >> and jonathan allen, the candidacies like this i don't think could have raised this kind of money before the internet age. in the old days when you had to do it through direct mail if you were trying to do that kind of fundraising. that was very expensive. compared to doing it allline. >> absolutely. you had howard dean on earlier, he pioneered this in 2004. the first real online do nation candidate fuelled his campaign until obviously it ended in iowa, basically. >> jonathan allen, and winner alex wagner. >> cheater. cheater. >> can we both be winners? >> cheater/winner belongs to me.
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>> jonathan, this is not little league. you don't always get the trophy. >> alex wagner is the trump candidate. >> make america great. >> thank very much. coming up, we have new information on who araenged that meeting between the pope and kim davis. (vo) what does the world run on? it runs on optimism. it's what sparks ideas. moves the world forward. invest with those who see the world as unstoppable. who have the curiosity to look beyond the expected and the conviction to be in it for the long term. oppenheimerfunds believes that's the right way to invest... this big, bold, beautiful world.
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♪ before ♪ he knows his own ♪ 100 days ♪ 100 nights ♪ to know a man's heart ♪ we have news tonight in the fatal shooting of eric harris in oklahoma. you'll recall that occurred in april when a volunteer dpepty, 74-year-old robert bates says he accidentally shot and killed eric harris. he claimed that he was reaching for his taser but used his handgun instead.
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robert bates has been indicted for second degree manslaughter and he has pleaded not guilty to that. but a grand jury in oklahoma has now indicted tulsa county sheriff stanley glans for not providing documents and covering up evidence in an internal investigation of that shooting. today, the sheriff announced his resignation. the grand jury indicted the sheriff on two misdemeanors in the investigation related to his friend, the volunteer deputy robert bates. coming up, new information on exactly who arranged for kim davis to meet pope francis. to "♪ ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪
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and now very good news. i told you in our first five years of this program, "the last word" family has had three babies with three on the way. well, now there are only two on the way because ava mcdermott
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arrived today on her due date. ava is seven pounds, 11 ounces. her mom and dad, swann and todd could not be happier. welcome to "the last word" ava. ? it's the brand more doctors recommend for minor arthritis pain. plus, just two aleve can last all day. you'd need 6 tylenol arthritis to do that. aleve. all day strong. trust number one doctor recommended dulcolax constipated?
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use dulcolax tablets for gentle overnight relief suppositories for relief in minutes and stool softeners for comfortable relief of hard stools. dulcolax, designed for dependable relief ♪ ♪ the beautiful sound of customers making the most of their united flight. power, wi-fi, and streaming entertainment. that's... seize the journey friendly. ♪ >> it was really humbling to think that he would want to meet me or know me. >> the vatican has confirmed that the pope did meet with kim davis in washington.
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she says her meeting with the pope validates everything she has done. >> he said stay strong. that was a great encouragement. just knowing that the pope is on track, you know, with what we're doing and agreeing, you know, kind of validates everything. >> in a statement, a vatican spokesperson said i do not deny that the meeting took place but i have no further comments. >> back with us, e.j. dionne. this story was breaking before we went on the air last night and i didn't see anything in it that looked like confirmation to me. i kept refusing to do it within the hour. it also made no sense to me that of all the people in the 50 united states to work through that filter to get into a room with the pope, it made no conceivable sense to me that kim davis would be one of them. but now we know it happened. >> right. it still makes no sense. what happened, as i understand
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it is that this meeting was not arranged by the american bishops. in fact, i am told there was a lot of opposition to this meeting among the northwestern bishops. it was arranged by the vet caat ambassador. that is consistent with reports that say the meeting was arranged by a vet can official. and the meeting itself happened at the vatican embassy. archbishop vicino is known as a cultural conservative. he was appointed by pope benedict. i think the vatican is going to have to say more about this, because so many conclusions are being drawn from this. and it flew in the face of everything the pope was saying here. i mean, yes, he's talked a lot about religious liberty. the conservatives here were
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quite happy he visited with the little sisters of the poor. they didn't expect this meeting. but he didn't talk about same-sex marriage as such. he was fighting against culture wars. so they have a lot of explaining to do about this meeting. you know, i hope they do just make public that yes, it was the nuncio who arranged the meeting. >> e.j., i was wondering, were there 100 people in the room? were there 200 people in the room? did the pope know who everyone was? kim davis' lawyer said it was a private meeting just for kim davis. if that was the case, then the pope had to be told why he was meeting with this woman. >> right. cane the question is, as a friend of mine said today, who's been following this, the pope doesn't read the american flups, so he may have known only the version that was given to him by whoever arranged this meeting. as i say, i'm quite sure it's the archbishop vigino.
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but it's a very troubling thing given .the rest of his message. a lot of people are making a great tonight on "all in" -- >> everybody thought hillary was unbeatable, right? >> giving up the game on benghazi. >> we put together a benghazi special committee, a select committee. >> a top republican confirms it, the benghazi committee was designed to stop hillary clinton. >> what are her numbers today? her numbers are dropping.


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