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tv   Hardball With Chris Matthews  MSNBC  October 30, 2015 4:00pm-5:01pm PDT

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it alienated him in the republican primaries. it is part of the reason he's doing so poorly. i think the anti-establishment view right now in the republican primaries is also hurting him. longer term, it is going to hurt him if he is that establish isment candidate with latino voters. we are seeing on multiple issues, but particularly immigration he is hurt by his flip-flop on that issue. >> thank you both for joining us. >> thank you. >> have a great weekend. "hardball" starts right now. the united states sends soldiers to syria. let's play "hardball". >> good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington.
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today president obama announced the deployment of military advisers on the troubled warring land of syria. the question is why? what's their mission? is it one they can possibly complete? is this a war we can reasonably expect to finish? can we be sure our role won't grow? what does this say about barack obama's position about military involvement in the east? by the way, at the white house today, spokesman josh earnest insist said the shift in strategy didn't mean there would be a combat mission in syria. let's watch that first. >> those special operations forces will be in syria and they will be offering some training, some advice and some assistance to moderate opposition forces that are fighting isil in northern syria right now. these forces do not have a combat mission. in 2003, president bush ordered a large-scale, long-term combat operation in iraq.
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that is something that barack obama, the state senator from illinois, spoke out against. he disagreed with that decision. he does not believe that's something we should do again. so that is why our special operations personnel inside of syria have a very different mission. >> richard, everyone like me grew up in vietnam know advisers quickly become soldiers. is this the case here? >> reporter: these troops are going to be involved in combat. every military analyst i've spoken to agrees with that. they will be in harm's way. people will be looking for them and trying to kill them. they will be going out on missions. even pentagon officials say, yes, they will be advising but they could also be partnering missions that other special operations forces other than the 50 that were announced today will be going out and engaged in
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unilateral direct action. so the idea that these troops are going to be in syria, partnered with a militia group that is fighting in very close quarters against isis, they will be armed. they will have air support above them. i don't know how that could be described as anything but combat. the white house press secretary today describing how it is not like iraq in 2003. no, it's not. there's not going to be 100,000 troops in tanks crossing a berm. but i don't think anyone suggest said that this is the kind of war that it would be, that it was supposed to look like that. but, yes, this small number of troops will be in situations that i think anyone would describe as combat. >> thank you so much nbc's richard engel in istanbul. and chris murphy. senator, the messiness of that
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irritates me. how do we avoid our guys getting killed in an all-sides war? >> there is no way nice there. what we have already seen when we try to run this training quick program, they are not interested in just fighting isil. they want u.s. help to fight isil and assad. this fine line to put special forces on the ground to only fight one set of bad guys which inevitably we will be drawn into the fight against assad. the people we are trying to help are deeply intertwined with al qaeda. it is hard to figure out how we will, say, stay out of the fight with assad. and how we would stop benefiting the al qaeda element inside syria. >> do we have a plan for destroying isil? >> i don't think we have a plan for destroying isil. i think our objective today is
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to keep them on their heels. you can do that with sustained air activity. you can continue to stand up the iraqi military to put pressure on them inside that country. ultimately, i don't know that 40 or 50 advisers are going to make a fundamental difference. >> what's the goal then? >> why put 40 or 50 advisers if it's not for a military action? >> you can see after escalation after escalation, this isn't the last announce. . we will start with 50 and it will be another number. that has been the pattern of activity so far. >> jack kennedy said that in vietnam. you have a drink. when the effect wears off, take another drink. over 200,000 troops after ted. there is never enough when we get in there. >> maybe this is a show of force
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to try to make a play at the negotiation table to suggest to russia and others, if you don't come to the table and negotiate, we have the stomach to put troops on the ground. that's a risky bet. if these negotiations don't work, you are struck with a strategy that commits u.s. forces to the ground in a civil war that could become a quagmire. >> very critical comments about the president's foreign policy. he said many of the decisions they've made i strongly support. but we are kind of going from crisis to crisis. the president has said don't do stupid stuff. that's not a big enough doctrine. by not doing stupid stuff you're not doing stupid stuff not to do. i don't think the administration really has a cohesive strategy. >> i think tim's point is congress needs to be at the table to set the strategy. i think the facts on the ground change on a daily basis.
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with the russians there it's hard to have a coherent overwhelming strategy. but tim and i believe congress hasn't authorize said the war against isil and certainly not against assad. is so you have got to come to congress. >> we made a decision. we made a decision to fight in europe first. and then asia. so we made a decision. why can't we make a decision about dealing with assad later? it's just another baathist regime. we have been knocking them off for years. we knocked them off in iraq, libya, going after him in syria. it is a neocon thing to be doing? when are we going to decide who our real enemy is, isil or assad? >> that's the real issue. we proved we're not good at military engagement in the middle east. we're already fighting isil inside syria, inside iraq,
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trying to stand up a new government in baghdad, work with the kurds. add to that a ground combat mission against isil and assad. >> before you go, senator lindsey graham called the president's strategy shift in sufficient. let's listen to that. >> this is, in my view, an incemental change, so it will not change the issues on the ground. in the eyes of the enemy, this is weakness. in the eyes of our allies, this is unreliability. isil will not be intimidated by this move. >> he is getting hit from both sides. >> no doubt the republicans will come after him on this. i think the president has largely gotten it right. he has largely committed to keeping u.s. forces on the grouped. >> do you still have him on the w side and not the hawkish side? >> yes. . i think he understands the iraq war and understand this is has to be a limited engagement.
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i think he has gone too far here. let's hope this is the late escalation. >> thank you chris murphy of connecticut. today's announcement was the second major shift on war and peace. two weeks ago he announce said that more than 5,000 troops would remain in afghanistan beyond his presidency. in 2008, a major thing was his promise to end the war in iraq. >> as commander in chief, i will never hesitate to defend this nation. but i will only send our troops into harm's way with a clear mission. i will end this war in iraq responsibly and finish the fight against al qaeda and the taliban in afghanistan. i will give a new mission in my first day of office, ending this war. it is the first thing i will do. i will get our troops home. we will bring an end to this war. you can take that to the bank.
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>> washington bureau chief and msnbc political analyst. david, this is left versus right fight. it seems the president inched over on to the right territory on this issue. he is more hawkish, a bit. >> yeah. i think what we have seen is the reality on the ground has changed a bit. and he's had a hard time sticking to those words. josh earnest had a hard time today saying these are not combat troops. they are not combat troops in the way we tend to think of the iraq war sending in combat troops. they will be involving combat as richard engel and others have said. you know, talk to go people in the white house today, they were very clear trying to make this distinction that what's happening in syria with isis now is a counterterrorism mission. not a big grandiose scheme to use u.s. military might to achieve regime change. it is not about assad, which is a western syria matter.
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it is about trying to get the kurds to fight better against isis in northern syria. now, does that violate his promise? does that cut back on what he has tended to say as a candidate. probably to some degree. it is not full scale. there was no isis when he was running. no isis before the invasion of iraq. so i think he's been caught between his campaign promise, which is very bold and stark and very clear. and a much foggier situation in that part of the world. >> yeah. fresh focus on war and peace change how voters feel especially when it comes to ben carson and donald trump. they have garnered some criticism. >> you believe that had president bush simply declare said energy independence they would have turned over osama bin laden. how would they have gotten him out of the tribal areas of afghanistan and pakistan? >> i think they would have known
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where he was. >> now you have isis and others. you have isis cutting off christians's heads and others. anybody a's head. drowning them. cutting off their heads. we have to go in with force. >> let me go back to iran. you said they will do what i tell them. how do you make them do what you say. >> they will know i'm not playing games. >> who do you talk to about military advice? >> i watch a lot of shows. when you watch your shows is and you have the generals. you have certain people -- >> you know, this begins to sound like chancy gardener. i like to watch. that is chancy gardener and being there. i like to watch. these simplistic things. they'll know where i stand. if we tell them we are going to be energy independent, they will find this guy. nobody knew where osama bin laden was. >> they want to attack and criticize barack obama whether he does a lot or whether he does
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a little. it doesn't really matter. they want to play to their base. the one guy i give credit to is lindsey graham. lindsey graham says i'll send 10,000 troops in. you can have an honest policy debate, honest policy discussion with lindsey graham. but for donald trump to say they'll do what i tell them to and ben carson's magical thinking. it is amazing they have any credibility with any voter in any party. but that's because this is a really tough issue. the senator was on a few months ago saying congress should be involved. well, congress should be involved. but often congress, especially john boehner and the house republicans, have not wanted to be involved because they don't want to be on the hook for voting. they don't want to be on the hook. >> i have to agree about lindsey, clinically. he does show up in uniform. he doesn't do abracadabra.
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some people want to believe that's the world out there. i guess they think that's the way the world works. thank you, david corn. >> okay. >> happy halloween. >> you too. coming up, 2016 race and the republicans are going against the republican national committee. that's coming up here ahead. plus, jeb bush said he is not demonizing marco rubio. but they are showing lines of attack. we'll talk about that. and a halloween edition of tell me something i don't know tonight. orks fast? take the zantac it challenge! zantac works in as little as 30 minutes. nexium can take 24 hours. when heartburn strikes, take zantac for faster relief than nexium or your money back. take the zantac it challenge. needs a systems check and tires. treads, what you got? lookin' a little bald, sir. with all due respect. got the perfect fit -- ready to roll. wheels up, flaps down, let's fly.
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at the government. these two factions go to sanders. we'll be right back. so what's your news? i got a job! i'll be programming at ge. oh i got a job too, at zazzies. (friends gasp) the app where you put fruit hats on animals? i love that! guys, i'll be writing code that helps machines communicate. (interrupting) i just zazzied you. (phone vibrates) look at it! (friends giggle) i can do dogs, hamsters, guinea pigs... you name it. i'm going to transform the way the world works. (proudly) i programmed that hat. and i can do casaba melons. i'll be helping turbines power cities. i put a turbine on a cat. (friends ooh and ahh) i can make hospitals run more efficiently... this isn't a competition! so don't trust your smile to any regular toothpaste. improved crest 3d white brilliance removes 5 times more stains than the red box. try the whole collection for a smile that gets you noticed.
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welcome back to "hardball". well, they are out on the right after this week's debate. politico reported republican presidential campaigns are planning to gather in washington, d.c. on sunday evening to plot how to alter their party's messy debate process and how to remove power from the hands of the republican national committee. nbc news has confirmed this weekend's meeting. last night on fox news, rnc writes assuring the party that every debate would be "reset." >> here's what i will tell everyone. everything is going to be reevaluate said and reset. every debate on the calendar will be reevaluated, reset. take the bull by the horns here. >> well, meanwhile the
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frustration with pribus is hitting fever pitch on conservative radio. >> enough is enough! and i say that reince priebecause should be fired over there at the republican national committee. he's in competent. he's a boob. the rnc has thrown these republicans under the bus. he is serving them up, serving them up to this idiocy. >> the rnc informed nbc news, we are suspending the partnership with nbc news for the republican primary debate in houston on february 26th, 2016. nbc news said, this is a disappointing development. however, along with our debate broadcast partners at telemundo, we will work in good faith to resolve this matter with the republican party. by the way, mr. priebus
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complained nbc handled it poorly wednesday night and nbc responded with this. people who want to be the president of the united states should be able to answer tough questions. cnbc, sister network, so everybody knows, of nbc news, and cnbc, of course. and chris jansing is up in new york and howard feinman, political analyst. thank you, chris and howard. what do we know about the meeting, chris jansing? >> everyone has signed on the representative. they will get all folks into the room sunday night. it is hard to imagine how this is all going to play out. they go in of course with competing expectations. and if you're carson or trump, you want to say how do i keep my place on top of the polls? if you're lindsey graham or
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bobby jindal, how do i get more airtime. does it benefit my candidate to have longer, more open-ended answers or keep to a shorter format. you go in with competing goals and expectations. the level of discontent is so high. i have talked to so many people in the different campaigns. i know i'm told by organizers the rnc called them several times last night, once this morning, wanting to make nice. they say it's a day late and a dollar short. >> here's what some of them have to say. >> why should we have these people that hate everything we stand for? >> in my view, republican primary debates ought to be
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debated by shawn hannity and mark levine and rush limbaugh? now, that would be a debate. >> what he was asked about cruz's idea he said i think he's right. i mean, here we go. it's interesting, howard, that he writes this very aggressively and a real show of strength actually before he is into this political season. i'm going to take control. we will not let the people run the debates. we will take control. i think especially he said no chris matthews which is fine when he was setting this up. then you get a ludicrous situation of people getting to pick who they would like to ask questions. then do they get to ask the questions themselves? >> well, i think there are two things going on. >> journalists can ask
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questions. let's face it, it is under assault. now the campaigns, which have the real power. >> one of the reason people ask debates, it does make it interesting. in baseball machines throwing balls at the batter. everyone asking, what do you think about the economy? what do you think about world events? what do you think about culture? what would those questions be? >> use the sports analogy. send softballs all over the plate and let them hit a home run. as somebody who asks questions for a living, that's what you want. you want somebody to be surprised. you want someone to get a question that sets them a little off their game. you want something ideally they
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haven't sat in three-day debate and already rehearsed an answer to. what do you learn with that? >> some of the best questions, do you think teddy kennedy, ran for president. he blew him out of the saddle because he didn't have a coherency answer. it isn't the job of journalists to give a softball so you can hit home runs all night. >> no. i would add for the credibility of the politicians, they may think it's more pleasant and easier and efficient to get served up the easy questions. >> wrong. >> they're totally wrong. >> pitch 100 miles per hour goes out of the stadium. >> it jumps faster. and that's what they are missing here. you want the tough tone. and you want to be credible as a leader of the united states. what do you think the world is like? >> that's true.
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ted cruz won, according to the people who watch this thing. 24% picked cruz. 20% picked rubio. 17% picked trump and 15% carson. it's interesting, chris jansing, his goldie locks performance. everyone said he would win. he walked up the w and really made a clown of himself. they don't change. . it is not to ask who won the debate but where do you stand after the debates? >> marco rubio's folks are talking about how much money has come in since the debate. i was talk to go carson's campaign. they brought in $2 million after two days after they got to the last poll. then we're in the middle of this
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debate. they do move the needle not just in terms of those numbers but in terms of the fund-raising numbers. having said that, if i can go back for a second to the meeting they will have sunday night. say somehow they come to an agreement and they say this is the best way to have a debate. what is the muscle? if you don't agree to this rnc we're going to do unsanctioned debates? so where does this go next? >> donald trump will probably offer one of the auditoriums in his hotels. we'll start there. who is going to organize it? who is going to sanction it? i'm skeptical they will come to any agreement. they will force priebus to be tough with the networks, which he is trying to be. i think there will be an agreement of some kind.
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the politicians need to be reminded if they want to be covered as real candidates covering real things, they have to let the press be independent. >> viewers know, readers know, consumers of news know when it is rigged and not. >> it is like a real book. >> ironically enough, the guy who complained the most at the time about the way the debates were going is the one who won the debate, ted cruz. >> and the guy who lost the debate, everyone says jeb bush, hasn't complained at all. very strange. >> when you think historically about some of the most memorable lines, one is either a tough question or, one, somebody is really quick on their feet and they have a great comeback. those are things that make debates. those are things that really propel campaigns, not people who you know and like and who think
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the same way you do, sit there and ask something you have prepped for. >> thank you. such a great guy. up next, jeb bush swears he's having fun running for president. this is what fun looks like? his campaign is plotting attacks right now. the young senator from florida rises in the eyes of republicans and probably is raising a lot more money. this is "hardball", the place for politics. but i keep it growing by making every dollar count. that's why i have the spark cash card from capital one. i earn unlimited 2% cash back on everything i buy for my studio. ♪ and that unlimited 2% cash back from spark means thousands of dollars each year going back into my business... that's huge for my bottom line. what's in your wallet? when a moment spontaneously turns romantic, why pause to take a pill?
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...or suicidal thoughts, or if these feelings develop. some people taking otezla reported weight loss. your doctor should monitor your weight and may stop treatment. side effects may include diarrhea, nausea, upper respiratory tract infection, and headache. tell your doctor about all the medicines you take, and if you're pregnant or planning to be. ask your doctor about otezla today. otezla. show more of you. you know how many votes john mccain missed? jeb, i don't remember you ever complaining about john mccain's record. the only reason you're doing it now is that we're running for the same position and someone convinced you that attacking me will help you. >> establishment threat to jeb bush. he hammered him for his absentee
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voting record during wednesday night's debate. sally bradshaw, bush continued the line of attack in the spin room. >> i think marco has got some s splainin' to do as we say in the south. he supported marco. he just believes you're elected you have to show up to vote. >> and top gunners in houston monday night to calm fears about the seemingly troubled campaign. yesterday u.s. news exclusively obtained 112-page blueprint presented to bush donors at that meeting. the document provides a rare behind-the-curtain look at the gritty details of a campaign at a crucial inflection point. the new details including internal polling numbers, vote goals in michigan, advertising
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strategy and marco rubio. time for the "hardball" roundtable. jessica with the daily mail. and dave broke that on jeb's campaign blueprint for u.s. news. and jane is a correspondent for "time" magazine. let me go to you, david. you're the hot hand. i love stuff. you found it. he was totally flat footed in the debate. rubio was ready for it and put the guy down on the floor. >> going into the debate we heard from jeb's campaign. we will see a new jeb. he will have more energy. there was nothing new. it is tough to change the guy on stage. and he missed a couple moments. >> why telegraph the punch on the absentee record. why would he do that? >> even if you telegraph it, it doesn't resonate with voters. fair or not, rubio is right to
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say obama did the same thing. mccain did the same thing. bush didn't have a response. the way bush went at rubio, in my opinion, is what have you accomplished? what have you done while you've been in the senate? then you get to the immigration bill, and that is rubio's weak point. talk about voting. how each time they show up to vote, that is not a smart line of attack. >> what do we know out of all of this? he keeps writing the death of jeb bush. he's not dead yet. >> i love that is is a 112-page report. it is geeky. so jeb bush. it is like such overkill, right. just drown them in paper. >> one of the prosecutors comes out with 112-count indictment. it looks like jeb doesn't know how to talk and rubio does.
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one guy can talk. >> he was prepared. he was absolutely right. he was prepared for that attack. and he hit him back hard. he did a very good job at it. one thing that struck me about the memo is they are spending so much time hitting rubio. but they did not spend much time hitting john kasich. what i would do is i would be having three, four pages on john kasich, who is the one who is tied with him in new hampshire. and jeb has to win new hampshire to stay in this race. >> they did have internal polling in the document too. it has kasich tied with bush. >> public polling has him behind rubio and bush. >> let's run through some of the things. no accomplishments. that's one of the shots at rubio. >> yeah. >> tie to scandal-tarred former congressman. >> who is that? >> florida congressman who rubio went and bought a house with. then it went into foreclosure.
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it ties into his financial program. >> closeness to norman braman. is he a sugardaddy? >> he is a billionaire auto dealer. he will invest in rubio's campaign. >> those who have looked into marco's background in the past have been concerned what they have found. that is for midding. >> that leaves it open ended for people to wonder what don't we know about. >> it is innuendo. >> it is. when rubio went through 2012 to be romney's list of running mates they found some stuff. i think it leaves it open. now you have stuff bouncing around the internet, unsubstantiated, about what it could be. >> not having the nerve to put down what it is. >> the same thing, on the night of the debate too, bush's campaign manager danny diaz was
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sitting in the spin room, and i also was in the spin room. i asked him about this. the debate. the attack they had on rubio. and he tried to tell reporters, oh, it was just the dynamic at the moment and tried to suggest this wasn't some planned thing. then you come out with this memo. it shows they have been planning it the entire time. >> the super a pac released its memo of its own today. they don't consider jeb bush to be a competitor. they said when you consider all angles, as we dorks we believe there are really only four candidates with a reasonable chance of become the republican nominee. senator pwhar koe rubio, ben carson, donald trump and ted cruz. here they are writing him out of the list of top competitors. is that a war? >> he is not in the list of top competitors.
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he's behind rubio. you know, there's trump, there's carson, there's cruz. he is tied with carly, basically. >> i think they are trying to suffocate jeb. they know he's down. he has had a horrendous 10 days. this is throwing more shade. >> what did that start, throwing more shade. can we use standard english. >> you can't push bush out. john kerry in 2003. they have lost campaign managers. they have had multiple shakeups. they have had no money. and they recovered. bush still has a ton of money. >> i agree with that. except he doesn't look like he's capable. >> he doesn't seem like he wants to win. >> i mentioned it to ted kennedy when he ran in '80. he ran a decent race. he didn't seem to really wanting to be in the race.
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poor jeb. the roundtable is sticking with us. up next on this halloween eve, the three try to scare me. it should be fun. you're watching "hardball", the place for politics. ... asking questions.... having new experiences. are you ready? the key to a happy satisfying life is to always be curious. jibo, how are you doing? i'm great! every moment is our moment. are you enjoying this? it's been such a whirlwind. i want to get to know people and understand their ideas about everything. so you can too. when it comes to helping you reach your financial goals,t taking small, manageable steps can be an effective... and enjoyable approach... compared to the alternatives. push! i am pushing! sfx: pants ripping how you doing eddie? almost there.
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severe storms rolled across parts of texas, causing massive floods that left one person dead and another missing. three suspected tornados have also been reported a man is under arrest in connection with two fires in st. louis. and welcoming children for a halloween celebration and trick-or-treating. the president and first lady were on hand to pass out cookies and candy. back to "hardball".
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welcome back to "hardball". a shooky halloween edition of "hardball" roundtable. on this halloween, they are going to try to scary me with something i don't know. anyway, francesca. >> i don't know phil scare you. i will try to make you laugh. in boulder, they were upset carly had a jacuzzi in her room. >> how did they find out? >> rand paul tweeted out pictures of what the greenrooms looked like. and carly's had a jacuzzi. i have since learned gave it up in the peace-making deal. but they were upset because kasich had a basketball goal in his room. it is because they were in a gymnasium. the debate was in a gymnasium at a sports center.
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>>. >> david? >> what about a brokered gop convention. >> that's not scary. that's what i want. >> next week they will push for a rule change that would say any candidate who gets any delegate will put their name in in cleveland. this guy, sort of a rogue player. he believes the primaries aren't going to matter as much. he will push for it to be a floor vote. >> maybe you would like a long, long, long battle with three or four contestants in it. rubio, cruz, trump, and of course dr. carson. all four battling on for eight months, ending up at a convention where two or three of the other guys who lose can make demands on the platform. and one might get on the ticket, one of the other ones. >> that would be really fun. >> it would be like the old days. >> i don't know if you saw but speaker boehner has left.
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>> do we still call him speaker boehner? >> i think we do. if you ever driving in cincinnati any time soon, one of his first plan is to buy a car. but he hasn't driven in a decade. so people on the road in beware. >> a new driver driving in the area. thank you so much at the roundtable. francesca, david, jay. coming up from the segregated south to the west wing, one political adviser's rise serving as chief of staff for jimmy carter. this is "hardball", the place for politics. (patrick 1) what's it like to be the boss of you?
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(patrick 2) pretty great. (patrick 1) how about a 10% raise? (patrick 2) how about 20? (patrick 1) how about done? (patrick 2) that's the kind of control i like... ...and that's what they give me at national car rental. i can choose any car in the aisle i want- without having to ask anyone.
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who better to be the boss of you... (patrick 1)than me. i mean, you...us. (vo) go national. go like a pro. a special edition of "hardball" november 6th from 6:00 to 8:00 as we talk 2016 politics ahead of the first in the south. democratic forum hosted by my colleague rachel maddow. rachel's conversation with hillary clinton, bernie sanders and martin o'malley. and we'll be right back. [ female announcer ] if you don't think "i've still got it"
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kiss >> not a fool enough to answer that question on national television. >> we're back. that was president jimmy carter's chief of staff in an interview with tom brokaw back in 1978. well, known for his quick witted southern charm, jerden served as a top agent to jimmy carter for 13 years. he was the one who devised the strategy that would put the little-known southern governor into the white house. jerden was so young at the time of his arrival in washington "time" magazine dubbed him and his colleague jody powell the
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georgia boys. but when he died after a long battle with cancer in 2008 jerden left behind a memoir about his upbringing entitled "a boy of georgia: coming of age in the segregated south." the book was completed by his daughter kathleen jordan. kathleen joins us right now. i'm a student of politics as everybody knows. there's only a couple of people who have ever figured out how to win the nomination of a party from nowhere. one was jim row. clark clipper got credit for harry truman getting elected. bobby kennedy did it for his brother. and hamilton jordan did it for jimmy carter. how did they beat all those liberals? >> they were political outsiders. they were looking at the establishment. and looking at who was running. and they said, well, jimmy can beat these guys. so they went to jimmy and they told him he was able to win. >> you beat scoop jackson, george wallace, fritz mondale.
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all these amazing -- udall. you beat every one of them. >> and i think on the heels of watergate people were really looking for outsiders, people outside the establishment. and from their experience in georgia politics they were able to come in there and do that with president carter. zwlu didn't have a lot of time with your dad. but did you get a sense of his charm? because he definitely had, it i'll tell you. the troops loved him. >> he had an abundance, maybe an overabundance of charm. he had a huge personality. and there are a lot of stories in the book where you can really see his personality come through. his irreverence, his sense of humor. >> he gave all the cowboys -- i call them cowboys in races. they're the kind of people who join campaigns with no hope of getting some prestigious job in washington, they don't even want one. they just love the excitement of running a presidential campaign. and he had them loyal to him like -- i mean, a cowboy king. they were so -- hamilton jordan. >> he had a big heart. he was just a people person. he had this real keen social
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sense. and i think that's what made him such a political mastermind is he really understood people. >> how'd he put together the good old boy personality and the enemy of segregation? sometimes you think of the good old boys as happy with the old deal. he wasn't happy. >> not happy at all. that's what this book is about. it's about his journey to slowly understand that almost every person that he loved and respected in his life was on the wrong side of history when it came to race. one of his heroes was senator richard russell. >> who was a seggy. >> absolutely. and that was a problem for my dad. he was really -- this whole book is about his internal conflict and kind of -- >> so this flag meant something different to him. >> absolutely. >> flag for the confederacy. >> definitely. we struggled with whether or not to put that on the cover but we ultimately decided that it's the perfect symbol for his journey because segregation is something that went from generation to generation and here it is he's holding a flag, kind of blissfully unawafer its -- >> so i worked with your dad,
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under him as a speechwriter for president carter-w jody. especially jody. but those guys never got over the civil war. those guys looked at us as northerners. we were yankees. we were suspect. and that -- even though they were progressive on civil rights, they definitely had an attitude about northerners. >> i think they just were banded together. i think it's something that made them kind of a family. and i think they needed a family and a community when they really were outsiders. i mean, my dad wore blue jeans in the oval office. >> but they never understood there's guys up north like me and other people and friends of mine who really thought just like they did. we were moderate liberals and we liked what they believed in too. >> absolutely. >> back in those days. thank you. your dad was great. this book is great. it's a great story. i always like southern workbooks. >> we're good people. >> just a lot less complicated.
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kathleen jordan. that's the way you pronounce it. "jerden," not jordan. coming of age in the segregated south. when we return let me finish with the fact as we celebrate halloween that donald trump is still at the top. do you believe it? in the latest poll today. you're watching "hardball," the place for politics. nothing-to-worry-about, man-that-feels-good simple. quicksilver earns you unlimited 1.5% cash back on every purchase, everywhere. it's a simple question. what's in your wallet? i use what's already inside me to reach my goals. so i liked when my doctor told me i may reach my blood sugar and a1c goals by activating what's within me. with once-weekly trulicity. trulicity is not insulin. it helps activate my body to do what it's supposed to do release its own insulin. trulicity responds when my blood sugar rises. i take it once a week, and it works 24/7.
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let me finish tonight with this. i've said for a while now that donald trump still leads the polls in november, why do we not think he'll be leading come february when the 2016 voting begins? well, happy halloween.
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he's still here. he's still up there. i'd say he's got as good a chance as anyone to win the republican nomination. sure, he's got some company from dr. carson but the more we talk about commanding the troops against isis the less dr. carson will fit the uniform of commander in chief. there was something powerful, by the way, i've noticed about trump. trump not only lives off the land, grabbing free attention based on the latest news every day, he also adjusts to the environment around him him. you'll notice how subdued he was at this week's cnbc debate. he's realized that a candidate surrounded by nine other candidates gets only about 10% of the time. so there's no sense in getting frustrated and wounded up there. you take your time, you grab your shots, you play your game. that's what cruz and rubio did. it's what trump has learned to do. for his part dr. carson didn't need to learn to slow it down. patience is a weapon that fellow was born with. so here's my bet. thanksgiving will come, then christmas, then the holidays. before we know it new year's will be upon us and the eve of the iowa caucuses and whatever happens in iowa trump will head gangbusters into new hampshire. that's where the real fight is
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coming among all three major candidates, trump, carson, rubio, and because of a strong showing in iowa cruz will still be there. if donald trump has his stuff, he'll fight this out till cleveland. if he has the stuff he'll either win the nomination or have to be okay with who does. either way he goes back to gotham a winner. that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in" with chris hayes starts right now. tonight on "all in" -- >> gotcha. >> republican candidates stage a coup, holding a secret meeting without the rnc. >> don't overly micromanage the process. >> while reince priebus is doing damage control. >> i just can't tell you how pissed off i am. >> then jeb bush ramps up his attacks on marco rubio and tries to reassure panicked donors. >> it's going fine. >> are you having any fun? >> oh, yeah. you saw it. having lots of fun. >> plus the white house announces it will deploy u.s. commandos to syria, despite

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