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tv   Lockup Fairfax Extended Stay  MSNBC  November 27, 2015 4:00pm-5:01pm PST

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ending in terms of his capture. no shots were fired as he was captured. there was some exchange of gunfire, a couple of hours ago earlier. -- vehicle you just saw in the picture there is an -- they have armored vehicles like that. and what the police apparently did is, they used these armored vehicles for two reasons, as we understand it. they rammed the building with these vehicles, partly to create a diversion so that the officers could enter from the other direction and begin to work their way through the building clearing rooms and trying to figure out where the gunman was. the other thing that those armored vehicles were able to do is basically punch holes in the walls and people could get out of there. they were able to also protect people that were getting out of the facility. they could get into those armored vehicles and be driven
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away. a number of the folks who were rescued safely were taken out in those armored vehicles. they call them bearkats. that's what the police call them. they're widely used by law enforcement throughout the country. and they use them quite effectively in this operation today. they eventually knew where in the building, we're told, he was. they were able to in essence have people on all sides. and one way or the other, this was going to end here in the next, you know, in the -- in a matter of hours after dark. they were -- he was either going to come out or they were going to have to shoot him. and obviously, he has decided to come out. the -- we can now report and didn't earlier that law enforcement was able to tie into the security cameras inside the building so they could get an
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idea of where he was. an idea wasn't a perfect view. but they had in essence inside eyes in that building. that could be watched at the command center. that word could be relaid to the officers on the scene. so i'm going to learn a lot more here in the days to come about exactly how this was performed. but the initial indications are that the colorado springs authorities here did an amazing job of bringing this to an end with the capture of this gunman with the release of additional people who were inside that building. we still don't know whether he was actually holding hostages in the building, whether he shot anyone in there. what we're told is this started earlier today when this gunman whose name has not been released arrived at this facility at the planned parenthood building in colorado springs. and started firing shots while he was still in the parking lot. and then, went inside the building with a rifle of some
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kind. it may have been a -- so-called assault rifle as some people would say that can hold a large number of rounds and fire rounds quickly. he went inside the building carrying something else. we don't know yet what that was. and at one point, he was shooting from the building outside, around at neighboring buildings and the area was, therefore, on lockdown. but now we can say that he has been arrested and this situation is, for the most part, over. >> pete, do we know who handles him from here? >> yes, it'll be the state authorities. in theory, there could be federal charges here because there is a federal law that against preventing the work that's done at abortion clinics. the federal access to clinic entrances law, there are other federal laws that could be used. but i would be very surprised that these are not state charges. there have been four, possibly
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five police officers wounded. there's -- they certainly will want to handle this case, locally at the local level, and there are very strong reasons why this should be a state case and not a federal one. i'd be extremely surprised if the state yields to the federal government or even if the federal government tries to get in here and handle these charges. this, i would be almost certain will be handled by the colorado state authorities. >> whoa takes over the scene itself, which includes the actual scene, the gunman's car, for instance? the gunman's home? >> all that, yeah, all the colorado springs police will continue as they have throughout this whole operation to do that. now, they can ask for assistance from the fbi, the atf. they can ask for the fbi's help in interviewing witnesses. fbi and atf both have the capability of doing these post incident reconstructions where they can go in and look at where rounds were fired and try to
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reconstruct the scene and look at ballistics and do that kind of work. they can certainly help. but this will be -- there's every reason to think this will be handled as it has been all day by the colorado springs police department who really, i think, have done a remarkable job here. >> it certainly appears that way. earlier hours ago, we were watching the events you were describing. circling around with great speed and then they would come back and circle around and come back. and hours ago, we were wondering about that. what they were up to. and sometimes they unloaded people. >> well, they were -- we don't know for certain, but my guess would be that what you saw was partly they were bringing people out of the building, we know that they were used to get folks that were -- as the police would go through the building room to room and clear people, they would be loaded into these vehicles. >> and now, all of these people who have had an incredibly -- is this a live press conference? are we taking this? okay. let's listen in.
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>> can you grab that one? >> okay. you've got that? okay. hold on. >> can you hold the mikes, please? >> somebody give me one. >> okay. are we good? >> yes, ma'am. >> i'm going to introduce chief peter carey c-a-r-e-y. the chief of police for the colorado springs police department. chief carey. >> so, very, very difficult afternoon in colorado springs. my heart goes out to many of the victims here. at this point, i have as many questions as you do. we're still trying to figure out exactly what happened, who our victims are and what we need to do from this point forward. i have some hurt police officers. they're at the hospital. that's where i'm heading to next. we'll give you some more information as soon as we know it. thank you. >> i would like to take this time to introduce mayor john
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suthers. he is the mayor of the city of colorado springs. >> the only thing i would add is that the perpetrator is in custody. the situation has been resolved. there's no continuing peril to the citizens of colorado springs. but there's a huge crime scene that has to be processed. we have to determine exactly how many victims there are. and we'll be reporting on that in the near future. >> i might add there's a lot of agencies that helped out this afternoon besides colorado springs police department. we have federal authorities h e here, federal state resources. and this was, like i said, a tough afternoon. but we had help from everybody in the community and the region and the state. thank you. >> i'd also like to -- hold on one moment. i'd like to, if you guys can step back. >> yep. >> chief chris riley with the colorado springs fire department. >> good evening, everyone.
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to what chief carey said. it's been a challenging afternoon. fire, police resources and public safety from all levels worked well together. we established unified command early on. but thankfully, the situation at this time has been resolved. but our hearts and our prayers go out to the family of the loved ones of the victims that were involved in today's event. so that's been a very difficult day. but our first responders performed very, very well. did an outstanding job. thank you. >> okay. >> christopher riley. do you have fatalities? >> so at this point, the information that i can tell you is that we have 115 colorado springs police department resources here on scene in addition to eight victim advocates working with us through the situation. we have the el paso county sheriff's office, the federal bureau of investigations, the university of colorado of
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colorado springs police department. the alcohol, tobacco and firearms bureau, the colorado bureau of investigations, and we also have regional explosive units here on scene. as i stated earlier, the individual brought some items into the building with him and that we have to work with our eod units to make sure none of those items are a further hazard to the people on scene. at that point, then, we're going to have to treat this as a crime scene. we're going to have to go through. we're going to have to identify if there are any individuals on scene that are injured and have not been transported or individuals on scene that are deceased. we do not have any numbers at this point. the only thing i can tell you is that there were 11 people that were transported to local hospitals. of those 11 people, five of them were police officers from
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various agencies that have responded today. >> do you know if there are any -- >> i do not have any confirmation of fatalities at this point. again, as i said, we're going to have to work through the scene. because we are now treating it as a crime scene and investigating it. we did get an individual in custody at 4:52 p.m. in our time zone here. that individual has been transported away from the scene and obviously we're going to start our investigation from there. okay. steve? >> was the suspect shot at all? is he injured? or was he at all -- >> i don't have information that he was shot. >> walk us through the last few moments. earlier you said there was no communication with the suspect. >> correct. earlier there was no communication with the suspect. we did get officers inside of the building at the planned
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parenthood, and the officers were able to shout to the suspect and made communication with him. and at that point, they were able to get him to surrender. and he was taken into custody. i do not have an identity on the suspect. as i've explained before, this is going to be a complicated scene that is going to take hours, probably days to process for us here. in addition to that, we are working through the state law that requires the sheriff's office to investigate whenever our officers are involved in a shooting. and since we know that some of our officers did fire shots, they will be investigating that. one moment, steve. we only just have the individual in custody. within the last 15 minutes. so to even speculate on a motive would not be reasonable.
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>> did you guys -- >> i'm sorry? >> how many rescues did your guys perform? >> i don't have the numbers on that. i know our officers acted with untold valor to make sure individuals were safely taken out of the planned parenthood building. we also had officers that immediately responded to the surrounded businesses and they made sure that people received any type of medical aid and they were safe in those surrounding businesses. this is still very much unfolding for us because we've moved from the active threat to people's lives stage. and now we're looking at doing our investigation. and those are the type of things that will come out as we do our investigation. obviously, we do have some concern because this is a criminal investigation. and we will be working with our partners towards some type of prosecution for this. and that means that there are things that we can bring forward
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and there are things that we can't bring forward as we work through the prosecution of this individual for the crimes that he committed today against our community. one moment. ms. kirby is identified. >> thank you. >> have the people been allowed to come out? >> we are working through the process of allowing those individuals out. obviously, we have to make sure there is no other items that would possess or -- excuse me, present. present a threat to them as we remove them from the buildings. >> do you know how many people are -- >> we don't. that's something that we're going to have to do as part of our after action and part of our report. >> do you know how many weapons, what kind of weapons? >> the only information i have is that the original information
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he had some type of a long firearm. >> so the officers have made it into the building and they're now clearing the building? >> the officers are actively clearing the building. >> does that mean the devices have been rendered safe? >> no, they have not. we don't know whether there are devices. those are things that we are currently processing and we're working through. >> and are those things that are in the parki lot? >> i'm not even sure if he has a car in the parking lot, sir. those are things we're working through. >> the folks that were transported to the hospital, how serious were the injuries? >> i don't have an update on that. >> will you look at the crowd. >> i don't have an update on the individuals transported or their status at this time. >> thank you. >> mayor suthers and now the mayor of colorado, what would you say to the citizens about this sad day and about how
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exemplary law enforcement has been? >> well, i spent a couple of hours in the command center watching as the officers were monitoring movement within the building on security cameras and communicating to the officers who were in the building. and it was the most incredible work on behalf of officers trying to minimize the number of fatalities and get this guy in custody. it was incredibly impressive. while it's a terrible, terrible tragedy, the way the police handled this, i think, minimized or kept it from being even worse. >> can you elaborate on some of the things you thought was really good? >> the fact that they were able to identify where this person was on cameras and communicate to officers in the building where he was located.
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>> you call it a tragedy. you're not yet willing to say whether there were fatalities, or not? >> no, i'm not. we need to fure ouexactly what the nature of those injuries are. >> okay. i would also like to introduce district attorney for the judicial district dan may. >> this is a horrible tragedy. and actually, a lot of bravery as a team. it was amazing how law enforcement and first responders came together today, worked very well and efficiently today. but it's still a horrible tragedy. i will not be commenting on any of the facts at this time. colorado springs police department is the lead agency. so katherine buckley would be responding to any facts. as we go through this process, certainly our office would be the lead prosecuting agency and will be transferred over to us and we will, then, be the lead agency and it would be
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appropriate for us to respond to any factual questions at that time. >> mr. mayor are you considering the possibility of terrorism? >> i'm not going to get into specifics at this time. it is a lead agency and all information should go through them. so the only thing that will be appropriate for me to comment on at this time is just the horrible tragedy for the community and the acts of bravery. >> if you were, would you bring in the u.s. attorney or handle this? >> i think he answered that question as far as -- >> what hospital were all the victims transported to? >> you had a question? >> are there still victims inside the building or everyone transferred. >> we are trying to ascertain whether we still have people inside the building. once the suspect was taken out of the building, our process is to go through and clear the building room by room, and then we turn it into a crime scene and look at it from that standpoint. >> everyone was transported to penrose, all 11 victims? >> no. >> how many rooms are they
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having to clear? how big of a building is this? >> this is a clinic. >> how many rooms? >> i'm not sure how many actual rooms were inside the clinic. but you have treatment rooms, you have waiting rooms offices, bathrooms, you have all sorts of different rooms because it is a medical clinic that provides medical services. so -- at this point, all further updates will either come from the colorado springs police department, the pio office. one things you can follo follow @cspd/pio for any types of information. or they will come from the el paso county sheriff's office in regard to the situation. we appreciate that you guys have been out here. and that you have brought this information to the public to let them know to stay away from this scene. the streets are still going to be closed. >> we have been hearing from katherine buckley of the colorado springs pd along with
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the chief peter carey, mayor john suthers, the d.a. as long as the fire chief, chris riley, giving us an update on the outcome that we've been waiting for in this incredibly tense and dangerous situation that's been evolving all day in colorado springs where a gunman had been holed up inside a planned parenthood and it has been a very tense standoff involving a s.w.a.t. team and apparently some innocent people who are left inside that building for hours along with many other people who had been held inside their businesses in the area being told to hide and not to leave. this started at 11:38 this morning local time. so it has been a very long day for everybody involved. and local police obviously are receiving the praise that they deserve for reaching an incredible resolution to this very scary matter. let's bring in msnbc law enforcement analyst and retired atf special agent jim cavanaugh. you and i have been speculating all day about how a situation as
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tense as this could possibly be resolved. are you surprised? >> no, tactical teams tops, they did a great job. it'll be interesting to hear, you know, as it comes out, did they negotiate with them through tactical officers through an upfront negotiator, through telephone? or did he decide to surrender? because he knew he had no way out. and what they're doing now, melissa, they're going to sweep that building aggressively. of course, look for other suspects. while they're doing that, they're looking for wounded victims. and of course, they're also keeping their eye out for bombs or boobytraps. they're going to see if there's another gunman and help the wounded. if there's obvious fatalities, they'll have that count for the onscene commander. next thing that happens is the bomb squad will come in once the would bed are out, the bomb squad will come in and render any devices safe, packages, backpac backpacks, propane tanks whatever is there. and, of course, simultaneously going on right now is a very
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aggressive investigation. it'll be an interrogation of the shooter. he'll probably be spilling his guts singing like he's on "the voice" because he's probably proud of what he did. he doesn't want to hide it. he's out front doing it. and so he'll give all kinds of reasons. they won't make any sense, but he'll give all kinds of reasons why he did this. and of course, they'll want to search his house, his car, look for conspirators, confederates and that'll all be ongoing all through tonight and all through the weekend. >> they took him away already about 15 minutes ago, the suspect captured alive in his colorado standoff that it turned out -- to be. part of identifying somebody in this live situation. are they looking at cars in the parking lot? license plates? how do they track down who this person might be? >> probably had some leads on that.
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the first thing is when you get them to surrender, you're going to ask them. you know, this guy's not trying to make a mystery. he's trying to make some political vulgar, horrific statement, and he's not going to be wanting to hide his identity, motives, reasoning, because he thinks that's what he's supposed to be doing. his sick motives are all tangled up inside his head, but as far as who he is, melissa, they're going to know that. they're going to find that out. they'll be searching his house, computer, vehicles and all that. the big question is we don't know right now is there any fatalities in there? we don't know the answer to that. >> all right, jim cavanaugh, stay with us, please. we're going to take a quick break. but, once again, the gunman has been captured alive, swept away by police about 20 minutes ago at this point. we are waiting to hear on the
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conditions of the 12 injured including 5 police officers, very brave men and women of law enforcement who turned a situation that could have been dire into something that was far less than certainly what it could have developed into. we will be right back. kellogg's® frosted mini-wheats have 8 layers of nutritious wheat... and one of delicious sweet. to satisfy the adult and kid - in all of us. ♪ ♪ nutritious wheat for the adult you've grown into. and delicious sweet for the kid you'll never outgrow... feed your inner kidult... with frosted mini-wheats® plan well and enjoy life... ♪ or, as we say at unitedhealthcare insurance company, go long. consider an aarp medicare supplement insurance plan insured by unitedhealthcare insurance company... go long.
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so we are back with a resolution to the standoff in colorado. the gunman captured alive. that does not mean all the work is over. joining me now is pete williams. pete, before we went to the news conference, you were telling me about where things go from here. >> right. well, the scene is not by any means, they're not just going home. the police officers now will go through that building room to room and they have really three goals. one is to make certain that there are no other potential victims inside that building, that the building is clear for them, and they get anyone else inside that building out into safety. secondly, they want to make sure that there's nothing hazardous still in that building. the gunman was said to have brought some items into the building with him.
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whether these were improvised bombs or something hazardous, we don't know, and the police, i think, at this point don't know either. but they've got to go room to room and make sure that the building is safe for other people to come back into when the clinic reopens. and the third reason they want to go through that room is to collect evidence. there will be a prosecution, this man walked out under his own power and was arrested. so he will be charged. he will be taken to trial. and it will be a long time, it'll be many days -- certainly many hours, could be a couple of days before this building is reopened because all the evidence technicians will go now and look through and see whether any shots were fired inside that building at people inside. it's known that he -- police believe he fired from the building outside it in neighboring buildings. and perhaps, that's where some of the police officers were wounded. but we know that 11 people have been transported to hospitals of which five were police officers. so six other people, it would appear, were shot, whether they were inside the building or
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outside, we don't know yet. but in any event, those are the three things. and that evidence collection part will be very, very important. and then, of course, a fourth thing that will be going on by the police away from the clinic, and that is to try to figure out more about this gunman. who was he, where did he come from? why did he do this? were others involved? those were the sort of standard things going through in the days to come. >> and the questioning has already been done, but pete, we know that a lot of people were caught up in this today. spent a whole day terrified whether they were in planned parenthood or the neighboring businesses. they were holed up inside trying to protect themselves under orders of police all day long. all they probably want to do right now is go home and pour a glass of wine, but that's not going to happen because police need to question them, too, don't they? >> well, the police have been questioning, as the people were taken out of the building and bear in mind that the -- again, as i said earlier, i think this is a remarkable piece of work by the colorado springs police. and i would bet that other
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police departments will be looking at this as a potential case study into how to do this. because it would appear, at least the initial impression is that the gunman finally gave himself up when he realized, as they say in the movies, surrounded. people were coming at him from all sides, no way to get out, he wasn't at that point holding any hostages. he had no -- he basically was going to come out dead or alive and chose to come out alive. and the police created the atmosphere, created the environment in which he had those choices. it's really an amazing piece of work. and what we believe happened here and we'll be learning more details about this in the days to come is that the police made use of these armored vehicles they call berkats. armored wheeled vehicles and they use them for two purposes here. one is to get close to the building so that people inside could be brought to safety and they could quickly come out of the building, get into that armored vehicle and be driven away so they were out of harm's
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way once they left the building. but secondly, we believe that they used those to basically bash into the building and created a diversion so that while the gunman thought the police were coming in one way with the vehicle bashing into the building, the police could make entry through another way and begin to get people out of there, go room to room and finally figure out where he was. so it's really, you know -- and you have to remember that these police officers are operating under a lot of stress because, a, it's an active shooting situation, they know he's shot people. and b, they know he shot friends of theirs, fellow officers. so it creates a special kind of pressure on them. but it's -- it's really a great job. >> well, and great job by you, too, pete, for breaking the news he had been captured alive. i believe this will go down as being described as nothing short of heroic on the part of all the law enforcement that were present today. >> yeah. >> especially the local pd.
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because, as you said, they were truly, their lives were on the line. >> that's right. and this really is their operation. and just to be clear, they did ask for some help from the federal government from the fbi and the atf and those people were on the scene and may have been advising them. but this was a colorado springs police department operation. and we don't know yet who is going to handle this case. there could be federal charges. that's always possible in a case like this. but i would be very surprised if the feds didn't step back and let the state authorities take this case. especially when you had four police officers or, perhaps, five police officers who were wounded in this case. but we'll see. these things have to be sorted out. the state and federal officials will work out who goes first and where one main factor will be where they believe they can get the toughest charges. >> much lies ahead. pete williams, as always, thank you very much. >> you bet. >> joining me now by phone is a
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law enforcement instructor and former s.w.a.t. team leader of jefferson county, colorado. and we're having a very different conversation now than we were about an hour ago. and we're wondering how on earth this was all going to be resolved. and given what you said earlier, are you surprised he came out alive? >> i am very much surprised he came out alive. statistically, there was not going to end that way, obviously. so it is surprising it is. congratulations to the colorado springs police department for bringing this successful ending. certainly, i hope all their officers are going to be okay in the long run as well as all the citizens. i'm sure all the officers now have a very long night ahead of them. all that were involved in the shooting earlier and the s.w.a.t. team members that were involved in the shooting all now have to go through review. they've got a long night ahead of them. >> well, much lies ahead. we still don't know the conditions of all those who were injured. we're anxiously awaiting more information on that.
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and a huge investigation lies ahead. but grant, what we were talking about earlier with the situation and we're wondering how, you know, the police got in there and what are they doing? what is your reaction to what pete williams describing with the vehicles that were used to haul people out, create distractions and supposedly ram the buildings? are those -- are those tactics that you're familiar with? >> very much so. now we speak a little more freely about what i believe is going to happen inside there. the s.w.a.t. teams will go into that room or into that building when they knew they had the room, two things would happen. they would build a team that would respond to an emergency if he started shooting people. the second team would do the deliberate plan where they would put explosive entry charges on walls and doors to make -- to make an explosive entry to get to them if needed. and in addition, they have the armored vehicles. so i'm sure they were hitting it from three fronts that way. if the shooter actually started
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shooting somebody. the explosive charges now are very common for s.w.a.t. teams to use and i'm sure they had them in place. >> grant, stay with us, if you will. i'd like to hear much more. we're going to take a quick break. but we'll be right back.
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we are continuing to follow what is still very much a breaking news situation in colorado springs where a gunman has been captured alive following hours in a standoff and a shootout with police. where several people have been injured. we are still trying to get word on their conditions for you. but this all took place outside and then inside of a planned parenthood clinic that is inside a shopping center in colorado springs. cecil richards tweeted we'll never back away from providing care in a safe, supportive environment that millions of people rely on and trust. as at this point, it does appear planned parenthood was a target.
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joining me now is kristin welker from the white house. we know the president has been keeping an eye on this. have you heard any word from the white house? >> well, we know that president obama was briefed by his homeland security adviser earlier today. and we know that he's going to continue to get briefed as necessary. i'm in touch with the white house officials. at this point, it doesn't appear as though president obama's going to come out and actually speak ant this incident today. however, it would be very likely that we'll get some type of update from the white house before the end of the evening. i want to read you a little bit more of the reaction that is coming in, melissa. as you know, planned parenthood has been at the center of battles on capitol hill over the summer. battles over whether to continue federal funding of planned parenthood. that is why you're seeing in part some of this strong language. in addition to what you tweeted, she tweeted out, quote, still following the unfolding events in colorado springs closely.
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statement from pr rocky mountain is here. she provided the statement earlier today while she was monitoring all of the events. she also said the staff at pr rocky mountain provide care every day no matter what. please keep them in your thoughts and prayers. and we got this from hillary clinton who is, of course, a democratic candidate for president. she tweeted out today and every day we stand with planned parenthood. at this point, that is all the reaction that we have gotten from the presidential candidates. i anticipate we might be getting more in the coming hours. but, again, melissa, as the events unfold, authorities obviously trying to determine if they can actually confirm planned parenthood was targeted. the president of the organization using strong language to make it very clear she and those in her organization are not going to be intimidated. >> at this point, is there any word of any kind from the other side of this issue? >> at this point, there's not, melissa, but we are monitoring twitter quite closely. that would probably be the place
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where we would get a reaction, initially. so we're monitoring twitter. in terms of the white house, you asked about that, i would anticipate we would get some type of written statement before the end of the night. if not some time early tomorrow morning. i would anticipate that president obama will be briefed on these developments, which you and pete williams have been reporting on in recent minutes. melissa. >> kristin welker of the white house, thank you very much. we'll take a quick break. we'll be right back. now more than ever america's electricity comes from cleaner- burning natural gas. and no one produces more of it than exxonmobil. helping dramatically reduce u.s. emissions. because turning on the lights... isn't as simple as just flipping a switch. energy lives here. nobody's hurt,but there will you totstill be car.
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in the near future. >> there's a lot of agencies that helped out this afternoon. and besides the colorado springs police department, we have federal authorities here. federal, state resources. and this was, like i said, a very tough afternoon. but we had help from everybody in the community and the region and the state. >> it's been a very challenging afternoon. fire, police resources and law enforcement, public safety. from all different levels throughout the area worked well together. we established unified command early on. but thankfully, the situation at this time has been resolved. but our hearts and our prayers go out to the family of the loved ones of the victims that were involved in today's event. it's been a very difficult day. but our first responders perform very, very well. did an outstanding job. >> those are local authorities and colorado springs, colorado, looking tired and very much relieved after a long day in a terrible situation that happens in their area where a gunman
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shot at police and innocent civilians. 11 or 12 of them hurt or injured were trying to check on conditions for you. but they're being lotted with an effort to turning a terrible situation into something that could have been far worse. and we know the gunman has surrendered. he's been arrested, taken away by police and now the investigation begins. joining me now by phone is grant, law enforcement instructor and former s.w.a.t. team leader of jefferson county, colorado. you have been in this situation, i believe you said three times. can you take us through the day piece by piece and tell us your idea of how all of this started and went down ultimately? >> certainly. and, again, what a great job by the police department and their response, first off. secondly, their response from the initial output sounded like it was great. they got officers there as quick as possible. tried to engage him, obviously,
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did as quick as possible. some of them were injured. unfortunately, but they had initial involvement with it, which we learned from columbine that you can't stay outside and watch this happen. those initial responders have to go in there, get involved in it and try to stop the loss of life as quick as possible, which sounds like they did. then it transitioned, obviously, over to a hostage rescue. with an outstanding outcome. i didn't see it, and frankly, they wouldn't believe it was going to end this peacefully. >> you were saying that earlier because given the situation where you have a gunman now for a while they didn't -- said they didn't know where he was. but we now know he was inside planned parenthood for most of this time. it began outside. but now we know that he was in there with s.w.a.t. team and with innocents inside the building, as well. tell us about how complicated a situation that is. >> it really is very similar to
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where the gunman we aren't in and started firing shots inside the school and barricaded himself inside a room. it sounds like it was very similar. where they were deciding where they were going to make entry. an explosive interview charges to make that as well as probably knocking a hole with the armored vehicle to another location within that building. they probably had a front of three entries at one time if that person started shooting citizens or they decided it was time to go in, perhaps he was saying the bomb was going to go off at a certain time. they had to make entry. i'm sure all of those things were in place when he gave up. i'd love to know why he just gave up. and i'm sure the details will come out soon. >> they drove him away immediately about half an hour ago at this point. did they bring him in? put him in a table? and just start questioning him? >> they do.
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it's a perfect opportunity to find out why. and, you know, they're going to -- if they're going to speak at all, it's going to be right after the incident. >> why is that? >> well, they're still in the moment. so they're going to want to tell their story. and explain why they did it. they give them that opportunity to take time and think about, hey, my whole future here. you want to get the in there quick? set him down, asking him questions and get as much on tape as they can from the get go. and you want a full explanation, if possible of why it's going to happen before -- i'm sure he is. you know. i hope now reality's going to set in, certainly going to set in soon when the doors close on his jail cell tonight. and he's all by himself. so, you know, his reality's going to set in shortly. but, yeah, i hope he's starting to come down from that high now.
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you think now he's going to be in jail until trial time and prison after that. got a long road in front of him. >> so we have the investigation that now essentially begins. but first, they have to secure the area. which begins with what? we know that people were inside not only that building but the surrounding shopping center, as well. they spent their whole day hiding inside. being told not to let anybody in or out or go near windows. are they evacuated first? or are they told to stay put? for police to come and get them? >> yeah, that's a great question. what i would do first is bring in the bomb team and make sure the bombs if they are in there can be diffused prior to moving anybody. what you don't want to do is start moving people and one of the bombs will go off. so the bomb team needs to come in diffuse any bombs if there are some.
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and start backing everybody out slowly and secure the entire scene. and i assume they're going to have probably have about 100-yard crime scene in all directions from where this occurred. so a lot of that will be a crime scene for days to come.come. >> right. they have to pick through pieces of evidence, not just here but also the gunman's car, the gunman's home, the gunman's relatives. >> absolutely. and like we've seen here with the holmes case you've got to go to the gentleman's home, and so many times they will booby-trap that home knowing it's going to and end someone's going to come to their house, law enforcement looking at their home. they've got a long night ahead of them looking into that. certainly before they do that they've got to start evacuating citizens. if he was in an apartment they've got to evacuate the apartment building before they get in there. that's also another investigation that's going to go on another long time. >> all right, grant, stay with us. thank you. let's bring in msnbc law
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enforcement analyst and retired atf special agent jim cavanaugh. jim, as we were talking about just a little bit earlier, they probably got him into law enforcement, put him at table sxrt stad rig and started right away, right? >> i'd a seize sitting in an interrogation room and he's being questioned right now. they're going to give him his rights under miranda and they're going to ask him if he wants counsel and if he wants to waive his right to counsel they're going to talk to him. and they're going to try to get as much information. i don't think it's going to be that difficult. i agree with the commander there that he's probably going to talk and he's going to tell you why he did it. he's going to tell you how awful he thinks planned parenthood is if that's his apparent target. he's going to be vociferous about it, outspoken about it, how they're in there murdering people and how he's avenging it. if there's obviously all these aggravated assault charges going to come, shooting police
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officers, all kinds of charges on this, and we don't know if there's any fatalities. it could be a murder charge, very serious in this case. so this guy's going to have a long prison term. it's not going to be a mystery that he did it. he's going to need clarence darrow and all his associates to get him off of this because he's clearly caught in the act. this is a guy that's made this wild triem and tore up this community and this clinic. and you know, justice sometimes is not so sweet. it's kind of bitter when we get to do it and we get the taste of it. but our systeming will through and he'll get all his constitutional rights. there will be court hearings and trials and motions and it will drag on for years, but most likely this guy will be convicted of these crimes. >> we don't know anything about him yet other than the things that we know, that he showed up with a high-powered rifle, that he brought other devices with him, that apparently it appears now, but you know, we'll know
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whether he acted alone or not. my question is -- and you can't really answer this solidly. but when somebody targets such a hard target such as planned parenthood, is it always ideological? is it always connected to a purpose? or is it possible that somebody would do this because they wanted attention and this seemed like a good enough place as any? >> well, it could be attention. but attention shootings tend to be just more random and not so targeted. the motives for violent crime are greed, power, hate, revenge, and escape. and someone who just wants attention can go to any crowd of people. this seems like a much more focused attack. he went to planned parenthood. planned parenthood. clinics that give abortion services to women, have been under attack for 40 years in america. so that's got to be the obvious motive. now, whether that will hold true, the investigators will have to tell us.
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but your point, milissa, is excellent. this guy might have went there, he had no plan to egress. in other words, he might have went on a suicide mission. but we have the ambivalence of suicide. we know about this as negotiators. we know that people want to kill themselves but they might not kill themselves. we even might have saw some examples of that in paris where some of these attackers might have wanted to kill themselves with the vest and didn't. so suicide, even though you're certain going into it, may not be the thing you want to do at the moment when you really have to do it. and so this guy might have found himself surrounded by the colorado springs s.w.a.t. team, the a-1 s.w.a.t. team in the nation tonight, and he couldn't do it, he couldn't go out and get killed. and i'm sure some of those negotiators worked on him a little while, either yelling down the hall or on the phone or on the throw phone we call it, throw him a phone and worked on him a while and maybe got him to come out. we'll have to see. maybe he just came out on his own but he decided in the end he didn't want to die.
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for as fervent as he was to go out and shoot everybody, he wasn't willing to die for his cause, at least tonight. >> jim, as a person who is trained to do this, unfortunately we live in a world now where things like this can happen anywhere at any time for any reason. but as you're training for something like this, to hanltd a situation like this, would planned parenthood be considered something like a hard target? so this is politically controversial in our country, it's in the news all the time. does this factor into training? do you take that into consideration? >> well, yes, that's always part of police training. they know the hard targets. we used to routinely go to these clinics and talk to them about how they could be attacked by bombs and explosives and arson and other attacks because they were being attacked by those things. i remember a case they had years ago where they put six sticks of dynamite at the clin nick wichita, kansas that was run by dr. tiller, who was eventually,
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you know, shot. all of these things were scenes of violence. so we would talk to the people. and of course the tactical teams and police officers on patrol all knew that. planned parenthood and other clinics do take security precautions. they do have usually some kind of door buzzer or security or plan to lock, plan to barricade, watch who's outside. the subject of demonstrations when those are peaceful there's no problem. but if they turn violent, you know, they're prepared to deal with that. >> jim cavanaugh, as always, thank you so much for your expertise. you are absolutely invaluable in situations like this, of which we have far too many. >> thank you, milissa. >> you have been watching our breaking news coverage of the shooting at the planned parenthood clinic in colorado springs. the gunman is in custody after previously exchanging fire with officers. he walked out of the building and surrendered. he has not been identified and
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has no motive so far that has been established or heard has been established. there are at least 11 people injured. we know at least five of them are officers. police say the gunmen brought some unknown items with them into the building. authorities say they plan to investigate those and they are combing through that building now. people who were forced to shelter in place are now being allowed to leave. which means you can watch in the house, in a treehouse, or even in miss pepperpie's house. pause in your pjs and hit play during a pb&j. nice! and enjoy some cartoons instead of listening to dad's car tunes. (dad) ♪meet you all the way! get the best of both worlds. directv at home and 2 wireless lines. from directv and at&t.
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