tv All In With Chris Hayes MSNBC January 6, 2016 12:00am-1:01am PST
dare to compete. it's because she did that she now stands as one of the very few people who could be our next president because you can't win actually if you're not in the competition. a lesson for all of us, not just women. and that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. tonight on "all in." >> the gun lobby may be holding congress hostage but they cannot hold america hostage. >> president obama's emotional call for action on gun violence. >> every time i think about those kids, it gets me mad. >> will a fight over gun laws cost democrats in an election year? plus, the predictable outrage. >> he's obsessed with undermining the second amendment. >> i'll speak with texas congressman michael burgess who calls the president's actions unconstitutional. then, donald trump refuses to say what he would do as president. >> the voters want to see
unpredictability. >> as one of america's closest allies considers refusing trump entry into their country. and i'll speak with bernie sanders about his bold new promise to big wall street banks. >> within one year, my administration will break these institutions up. >> "all in" starts right now. good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. today president obama signaled he would be opening a new contentious and politically risky battle over gun laws with a proposal that was at once both frustratingly small and highly ambitious. in a speech in the white house east room surrounded by the family members of victims of gun violence and other advocates he announced a set of executive actions including measures to expand background checks. the scope and effect of which will probably be minimal. more in a moment. what was far more important today was the president's
declaration of this as an agendaist defining fight, one he is eager to wage in his final year in office right into the teeth of conventional wisdom about the politics of the issue and the very powerful gun lobby and gun rights maximalists in congress. it's a fight that clearly comes from a personal emotional place as events when he referred to the massacre of children at sandy hook elementary school. >> from first graders in newtown, first graders and from every family who never imagined that their loved one would be taken from our lives by a bullet from a gun every time i think
about those kids it gets me mad. and by the way, it happens on the streets of chicago every day. [ applause ] so all of us need to demand a congress brave enough to stand up to the gun lobby's lies, all of us need to stand up and protect its citizens. all of us need to demand governors and legislators and businesses do their part to make our communities safer. >> the president acknowledged no real progress will be made unless and until congress acts without the restraints of the gun lobby. >> the gun lobby may be holding congress hostage right now, but they cannot hold america hostage. we do not have to accept this carnage. >> the president explicitly framed the battle as one that
will take years if not decades of constant engagement. >> it won't happen during this congress. it won't happen during my presidency. but a lot of things don't happen overnight. a woman's right to vote didn't happen overnight. the liberation of african-americans didn't happen overnight. lgbt rights, that was decades worth of work. >> despite the fact that measures like federal background checks are widely supported by the public, there appears to be no political upside to the president's actions today either for himself and for his potential democratic successors. those candidates did embrace it including hillary clinton speaking in iowa today. >> i know we are smart enough as a country to protect the rights of responsible gun owners
consistent with our constitution and to do more to keep guns out of the hands of felons, fugitives, stalkers, and for goodness sakes, potential terrorists. >> republican presidential contenders responded, many before the president had even spoken today with some misdirection about how the president is targeting law abiding citizens. >> this has been the most anti-gun administration in the history of our country. this has been an administration that has targeted law abiding citizens in particular rather than targeting criminals rather than targeting is terrorists. >> he's obsessed with undermining the second amendment. he's obsessed with burdening law abiding citizen who will follow the law no matter what it is. >> the impulse of the left is always to create more restricts on law abiding gun owners. that doesn't solve the tragedies of these well publicized cases where we see the vi and the press focuses on it. >> despite accusations, the actual executive actions focus
on mental health, gun safety technology, most prominent lit background checks including a new rule designed to expand sellers which must conduct the checks to potentially include sellers of guns on the internet and possibly narrow the so-called gun show loophole. as always when any kind of gun safety measure is proposed today was likely a great day for gun manufacturers with another spike in gun sales correlating to today's expected actions probably by people who have claimed from day one of this administration the president was coming for their guns. people will then say i told you so any time another marginal measure was proposed. today was a day they were happy to do that. >> joining me senator chris murphy of connecticut. senator, i want to make an argument to you about today. you tell me why i'm wrong. this is a sort of no upside sort of situation. the actual substantive thing today is pretty small beer by the president's own admission. it's what he can do within the
square of the law from an executive perspective and also will alienate folks who don't like the president's gun politics. so what exactly comes out of today? why was today in your mind, a good positive step forward? >> so today was a good day for two reasons. one because i think there is real substance here. gun sales have migrated away from bricks and mortar stores to the internet and these gun shows. by and large those selling online and at gun shows think they're immune from the law that requires commercial sellers to conduct background checks. so very few sellers are doing it online or in these gun shows now that this new guidance has been proffered, i think you'll see a rush of sellers worried for the first time ever of being prosecuted for not adhering to the criminal background checks law to do background checks and so i think you are going to see tens of thousands of new sales be subject to background checks. that will gave lives. second, this is an important signal to the movement to those
of us that are in the trenches every day working to combat gun violence that the president is committed to building this movement for the next 12 months. he's spending the entire first week of 2016 focusing on this issue. hillary clinton has made it a signature issue in her campaign. this is i think a very, very important moment for the movement. the signal is sent to all of us and the grassroots activists that this president and i would argue our future president are in this for the long haul. that's what every great change movement needs. every great changing is defined by early failures but the persistence to get the job done in the end. >> is this surprising -- this is his last year. he's coming up on what will be his final state of the union. this is the political battle that he shows very publically today and very effectively. this will lead all the nightly news programs tonight. is it surprising to you that this is what led off this year? >> no, it's not surprising to me in part because i know how
personally moved the president is by this issue. i saw it the day that he walked into the high school at sandy hook and told all of us that that day the sandy hook murders was the worst day of his presidency. i know right before his vacation, he went to san bernardino and he spent three hours with those families. these stories move him as they should move every elected official. i think he feels more personally invested in this than any other issue. so no, in that way, i don't think it's surprising. and i think you'll see he will come back to this issue over and over again. i really do think in the end in a general election context, this a political asset to those lining up with him. the republicans may get some purchase within the republican presidential primary but ultimately, general election voters i think increasingly are going to look to candidates' positions on background checks when casting their votes. that's what he understands, as well. >> do you actually anticipate
this to be an election year issue this year? i think there's some people who think this play until the convention, even jonathan alter told me last night this play out till the convention. but it's not going to make much of an appearance in a general election. >> i've started to see some polling coming out of districts that suggests that this issue particularly the issue of support for background checks is incredibly salient with swing voters. and i think that some of the issues that have started to divide the two parties in the last few weeks and particularly this issue of stopping terrorists from getting guns will be ballot box issues. people are concerned about protecting this country from terrorism. they say at a rate of 90 to 10 that they want more background checks. when those two issues join together, i think you have a salience at the ballot box that may actually play out in realtime this fall. >> senator chris murphy, thank you very much. >> thanks chris. >> joining me political analyst
joan walsh, national fairs correspondent for the nation magazine. msnbc political analyst howard dean, former chair of the dnc. howard, as one who was a vermont politics where the politics of guns are very different than they are say in washington, d.c. or in chicago on the southside, that the president represented, what do you make of today? >> i think it was -- i agree with chris murphy. i thought he nailed it. i think this is a big issue in the general election because what it does is portray the republicans or the republicans portray themselves as heartless. you have to be heartless to say that we shouldn't make any changes when you consider that the victims of sandy hook were 6, 8, 5 years old. this is a no-win issue. they'll beat it to death in the primary and everything those republican candidates say will be put up on a television ad in a general election in places like michigan and ohio, not to mention connecticut and i just
think this is -- it's smart politics and obviously, the president is incredibly deeply -- you rarely see barack obama get emotional. i think what we just saw was really a strong, strong picture. >> joan, there was one thing the president kept talking about i see liberals talk about a lot i think is a little bit misleading which is talk about the gun lobby. >> the nra is a remarkably organized organization. a lot of its power is because there are millions of people who really do care about this. >> sure. >> who love their guns and also think that barack obama is essentially coming to destroy american privacy. >> there are millions of people backed up at the ballot box, that is true. they are a minority of gun owners and gun owners are a minority of americans. there are over 300 million guns in this country. but only one in three americans owns guns, chris.
and even most gun owners support closing the gun show loophole. the president is right. i hope governor dean is right. i think there's risk in the general election in 2016 but i think going forward, the politics are really good on this for democrats because it's become a red/blue issue. your average gun owner is a republican donald trump voter already. the blue state, the rising obama electorate is the pro gun control. over time, this is going to matter. in pennsylvania, in colorado and ohio, it could be dangerous for bernie sanders or hillary clinton. i'm not going to deny that. >> joan makes a great point. the great sorting that's happened in american politics on every issue. and the sorting is happening such that the sorting happens and the issues comes later. people aren't sorting because they have and that issue. they sort based on where they live, what their sort of world view it, what their religion might be, practice, habits, friends. that's where the politics come from.
in that kind of universe, maybe the swing voters that so terrified democrats don't exist anymore. >> they do exist. joan just mentioned a couple of them. the counties of philadelphia are republicans. republican women in the counties of philadelphia are pro-choice and do not like the nra, and they do not like guns. i can see republican women in droves going to vote for hillary clinton or bernie should he win on this issue because the republican candidates are going to say a lot of this innings between now and their convention that will get them in a lot of trouble in the fall. colorado is another one. they kicked out two the democratic senators for tightening up gun control laws. now there's a backlash against this kind of stuff in colorado and the colorado independent voters are going the other way and want more controls that will help gun safety. so i do think it's an issue. there are swing voters. i think the public is not as
polarized as washington is. this is an issue that moves swing voters because it's about children and they can see this happening to their children just as barack obama talked about on the tape you had a few minutes ago. >> joan, i always think that the nra is a little like donald trump. i'm always waiting for the backlash. at what point did the rubber band snap back and it never does. wayne lapierre says things that are completely beyond the pale of all other american public discourse and then there he is. >> i want to say, i've been right about donald trump because i've never written him off and said this is going to kill him. i was so wrong about the nra after sandy hook. i was convinced -- >> we all watched that press conference. he is self-destructive. the american people are seeing these psychos and they didn't reject him. >> i would just add though a lot of this has to do with the incredible lack of courage with people who oppose the gun lobby. michael bloomberg has done a tremendous amount to stiffen spines of people as opposed to
the gun lobby. those people didn't exist after sandy hook. very few people as politicians stepped forward. they're afraid of the nra attack ads and the lies they tell which people believe. i think we may be past that at this point. >> i don't know if we're past it but we're getting there, governor dean. that's why i want to go back to something senator murphy said. movements need victories. s in a victory. winning is contagious. we say in baseball hitting is contagious. this feels good to the movement. >> it was the president as movement leader which was a very interesting role. thank you both. still to come, the problem with republicans invoking the second amendment when criticizing obama's executive action plus as republican presidential candidates focus on iowa and new hampshire, ben carson seemed to have gotten lost. where he ended up last night. and later bernie sanders has a warning for wall street. i'll ask him how realistic his plan is. those stories and more ahead.
three days after armed anti-government protesters seized control of a federal building on an oregon wildlife refuge, the local sheriff said the steps are in motion to end occupation by the militants telling an oregon newspaper "there are things being done. it's not visible to the public." schools in the area remain closed for a second day. the militants occupying the building in the name of two local ranchers were arrested on arson charges say they will not leave till local residents are in control of thousands of acres of federal land. that said, yesterday they urged supporters to send snacks because they didn't pack enough.
republicans today to president obama's attempt to side step congress on gun safety measures appears to suggest it's an act of aggression on the second amendment. for example, house speaker paul ryan released a statement that reads in part "no matter what president obama says, his word does not trump the second amendment." candidate jeb bush appeared to echo those comments righting "obama's declaration he will impose his gun control agenda by executive order shows an utter disregard for the constitutional process of making laws in the nation." >> his speech, obama appeared to hint at the silliness of these complaints. >> i believe in the second amendment. it's there written on the paper. it guarantees a right to bear arms. no matter how many times people try to twist my words around, i taught constitutional law. i know a little bit about this. [ applause ]
i get it. but i also believe that we can find ways to reduce gun violence consistent with the second amendment. >> in fact, to hammer home his point of reducing gun violence while remaining consistent with the second amendment, it's useful to look at the supreme court's decision on the amendment meaning. even though they found a right to bear arms, it also said that quote like most rights, the second amendment right is not unlimited not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever for whatever purpose. in other words, regulation that leads to gun safety changes is not unconstitutional. joining me now congressman michael burgess whose statement today on the president's actions on gun control reads in part america deserves a leader who does not regard -- congressman,
am i right in understanding you believe the move is unconstitutional because of the separation of powers not because it violates the second amendment or do you think it violates the second amendment, as well? >> as you'll recall, i prefaced my argument on this is an article 1, article 2 issue. article 1 dealing with the congress. we have the power to make the laws. the president as the chief executive is the executor of those laws but not the maker of those laws. that is what the state that exists in a monarchy. we said we didn't want to do that. >> there's all sorts of executive actions that every president takes all the time. president george w. bush took more than president obama if i'm not mistaken. something like having sufficient staff to staff the background check hot line 24 hours, you think that's an abrogation of the constitution. >> look one of the things that i think is probably frustrating to people when they look at the
administration's actions in this regard, number one, the first two years of president obama's administration, there was virtually nothing that the republicans could stop. so if this was one of the things that was of the highest importance to him, this would have basically taken a week out of his the first two years of his first term. so why that did not happen, i cannot posit a reason. probably the greatest financial crisis in 80 years. but continue. >> but the other aspect is we don't even have a director of the bureau of alcohol, tobacco and firearms. >> yes, because republicans have been blocking him in the senate. >> that is actual not true. >> it is true. >> it is because of the resignations of the previous directors. i don't know that the president can find anyone who wants the job. >> i wonder why. >> i wouldn't recommend to the people that he fill that position first. >> understandably. >> and the advice and consent of the senate is there for a reason, as well. >> i want to zero in here though. just to get specific for a moment. 200 more staffers to staff this
hot line 24 hours, right. is that an abrogation of the constitution? is that essentially a incursion upon the constitutional prerogative of the congress? >> not of the congress and the congress would obviously have to be the ones to authorize and appropriate those funds to hire those individuals. so no, that would not be an abrogation under article 1 or article 2. >> okay. let me ask you this. you come from a state that has just inaugurate this had year a fairly expansive open carry legislation. there was a long gun open carry in texas. lease now handgun open carry. there's also carry in the texas capital right now in austin. do you think that would be a good idea in the u.s. capitol? my understanding is advocates of guns think they make spaces safer. should we get rid of the metal defectors and have guns in the capitol? >> certainly a discussion we can have. although texas is now an open carry state, it was one of the
few states that did not have an open carry provision and i mean that goes back really to the time of reconstruction is it appropriate that texas has moved forward with this? i think so. >> i'm curious personally, you go to work in that building every day. would you congressman michael burgess feel safer if they got rid of the metal detectors and let people carry side arms in congress. >> i don't know that it would make a material difference to me. when i go into any public event, you don't know what you're getting into. >> so you would support that? >> in general do i feel safe when i go the into public venues where there are not metal detecters, of course i do. >> you would support people bringing weapons into the capitol? >> it can all be part of the direction. if that's the direction people want to go, i think it's something that needs -- deserves to be heard. but the bigger question here today is, chris, i mean the president put forward these proposals. it's not really clear, i mean on the gun show loophole, do you
really understand what he's talking about? there's no prohibition on the number or there's no limitation on the number that are sold? or the frequency of their sales? it's only if you have a business card? i mean, how -- what does that even mean when he says now he's closed the gun show loophole? i don't think a great many people know what he was talking about with that. >> it's going to work its way through the regulatory process and it will be interesting to see if legislation is taken up. michael burgess of texas, thank you very much. coming up, what country is having official genuine demand on banning donald trump from its borders. that's next.
if you were elected president and you don't like a deal, you're going to scrap the deal. are you going to bomb their nuclear facilities? are you going to do that. >> bill, i'm going to do what's right. i want to be unpredictable. i'm not going to del you right now what i'm going to do. >> don't the voters have a right to know how far you're going to go? >> no, because it depends on the circumstances. the voters want to see unpredictability. there's tired of a president that gets up and says pre single thing be. >> donald trump last night on fox news suggesting a game of nuclear pin the dale on the donkey saying he won't explain his iran policies is because what the voters want is a president who won't explain what he's going to do. donald trump would still be hanging on to his status as gop front-runner despite what some call policy proposals which have prompted pundits to predict he would finally fade.
a new surveymonkey national poll finds trump with 35% support, nearly the double the support for ted cruz and jeb bush who has been backed by nearly $50 million in ads. trump supporters appear to be the most committed. 51% say they're certain they'll vote for him and say the same of ted cruz and marco rubio. the intensity of trump's support was on full display last night at a rally in massachusetts where despite bitterly cold weather, a crowd gathers to cheer the candidate, wave signs and shout down a series of protesters. now, it isn't all good news for the donald at least if he wants to continue to travel the world. british lawmakers will debate whether to ban trump from the uk over his comments about muslims. after more than 500,000 people calling for trump to be denied
entry into the country. last month david cameron said trump would unite the country if he did show up. >> i think his remarks are divisive, stupid and wrong. if he came to visit our country, it would unite us all against him. >> thank goodness trump up that friendship with vladimir putin. today trump went full birther on rival ted cruz saying his canadian birthplace was a precarious issue. cruz responded and this is true by tweeting a youtube video of fonzie jumping the shark. the trump campaign declined in quality after a novelty stunt. there's ben car whose campaign jumped the verrazano bridge yesterday. i'll explain next.
the dozens and dozens of 016 campaign events that have taken place over the past few days, many occurred in places that make sense given where we are in the campaign season. potential iowa caucus goers were treated with a coffee with kasich while chris christie held a town hall in manchester, new hampshire. hillary clinton has been crisscrossing the state of iowa while carly fiorina set up shop in new hampshire. needless to say, some were confused by the location of the latest ben carson event held last night at the hilton garden inn. staten island, new york state. proud home of the 37th in the nation contest three months after the iowa caucus. apparently they're clamoring for carson. one volunteer remarked the event was standing room only because people got to hear the man. carson explained to one news outlet staten island is a pretty cool place. the latest move from a campaign that has been difficult to predict from the beginning.
the campaign finished off 2015 battling a sharp decline in the polls while three top staffers including the campaign manager quit in the midst of campaign infighting and after the candidate publicly hinted at a staff shake-up the day before. it has raised a lot of money and it's spent a lot of money mostly on raising money. in the third quarter of last year, the campaign raised nearly $21 million while spending just over $14 million. campaigns spend money to get a president elected. it's not clear if that his campaign is doing. it's not what they call the burn rate in campaigns. rather where the campaign spent its money. carson campaign told nbc news that $14 million spent, over $11 million went to fund-raising. as the atlantic pointed out, carson spent $3 million on everything else, from field staff to travel, the stuff needed to build a campaign infrastructure and strategy. last week the campaign pulled in $23 million in the fourth quarter. we don't know yet how much the
campaign sent spent in that fourth quarter or whether it spent less money on fund-raising and more money on getting carson elected. joining me dean parker, senior advisor to the carson campaign. thank you for joining me. >> thank you for having me. >> i have had two different republican consultants e-mail in the last week who basically say the carson campaign is adrift. this is what people are saying. this is a consultant grist in which money is being raised from small dollar donors. he's a beloved figure, raises money. the money goes back out the door to people hired to do the fund-raising and mailers. when you look at the numbers, $14 million spent, $11 million on fund-raising, there's no other campaign in the field that has numbers like that. >> you got to remember a couple things. dr. carson didn't have a political fundraising list. we star this had campaign with zero donors on the list. that's the first reason why a traditional political candidate can say it a little different. number two, when you go to it,
it's the people in the pundit status that the lift that have a chance to speak to the voters that want to talk to us. they just put money back into their pocket and back talking back to you. number three, the people are interested in raising money and giving it to dr. carson. as we go through the process, we're continuing to do what we need to do and that's get voters aligned with us. we now have a strong list and strong mailer. if you look at the end of the third quarter, we ended the campaign with as much if not more than any other political campaign with $11 million in the bank. >> about half of that has been burned through according to the ftc. are we going to see in which you're spending $14 million $11 million on fund-raising? that is contracts with consultants doing the fund raising. > that is contracts with people that have to give us their list that we have to buy to get to the donors. secondly, if you look at our people and when they spent,
they're less than the industry averages of what's happening because dr. carson was not for working through ultra additional political. >> let me talk about the mailers. >> happy to. >> i've seen a number of people including someone who is a registered democrat in massachusetts. reliable liberal voter who in the state of massachusetts got a huge ben carson mail per it's got like a lithograph portrait of the guy. there it is right there. that's an expensive piece of mail for people that work in campaigns. that to me looks like a mail consultant essentially trying to come up with the most expensive piece of mail they can find and send it so they can make a lot of money. >> that's entirely false. at the end of the day, and the people on the list came in because they endorsed him. they signed up for support or registered to a similar set of value system that allowed us to go after a prospect. our direct mail guy specifically is one of dr. carson's closest friends. he's an advisor. he's doing this 100% it the thing to help get ben elected, not focused on making money. if you look at what he gets, it
was a small percentage of those numbers that you would expect. >> this guy's not going to come out rich out of this? >> not at all. >> if things were going swimmingly, why the shake-up. >> think of it like this. do you ever watch baseball? >> yes. >> understand there are different pitchers for different sections of the game. weep had a team that was in there. there was things dr. carson wanted to change. he met with the team. >> they brought in the middle reliever. >> maybe it wasn't the right aspect to keep going in that perspective. he said let's move on. he handled it with respect like he would as a presidential candidate should and he's moved forward and put people in place. the people he kept in the organization were still in the organization before they started. his chairman and ed brookover as campaign manager. >> i really appreciate you coming in. >> i appreciate you having us. >> still to come, the group bernie anders needs to keep his campaign alive. how he's doing ahead.
are getting ready to hand volkswagen a bailout. a bill that was introduced in april expected to be voted on this week titles the fairness in class litigation act would make it impossible for thousands of volkswagen owners to sue the company. the u.s. justice department announcing they are suing volkswagen for allegedly violating clean air act. remember that in september when volkswagen admitted to installing software in hundreds of thousands of diesel cars to systematically lie and cheat emissions tests. volkswagen owner who's thought they were doing something good for the environment found out they were doing just the opposite volkswagen could be facing billions with a b dollars in fines but to date no one at the german automaker has faced charges over the scandal. if republicans have their way, volkswagen owners won't be able to get any justice either. can't, you have to rinse it first. what's that, alfredo? no, that can go in. no it can't! what are you, nuts? that's baked-on alfredo.
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addressing finance workers directly, he promised in elected president, he will break up the big banks within his first year. >> here is a new year's resolution that i will keep if elected president and that is, if wall street does not end its greed, we will end it for them. >> hours after he delivered the speech, i pressed for the details of his plan. >> legislation that we have, and i think there's a lot we can do through executive power but essentially ask the treasury department to give us a list of banks that are too big to fail and our job is to break them up. i look forward to working with congress to make that happen. >> you know as well as anyone the power of the banks. they. >> yes, i've heard about it. >> that's the point, right? it's not an accident that they are still together, right?
so there's no magic wand to wave. >> look, here's what you got. you're dealing with a powerful ruling class in america and at the pyramid of that ruling class is wall street. they have unlimited sums of money. they have huge influence over the congress. but i think there is such anger at what wall street did to this country and the understanding that it may happen again and anger at the packet that after all of their criminal activity and destroying the lives of millions of people, not one of these guys has you know been prosecuted. i think people want change on that. >> hillary clinton campaigning in iowa sat down with chris matthews and distanced herself from sanders' brand of socialism. >> what's the difference between a socialist and a democrat? >> well. >> is that a question you want to answer or would you rather not? >> you'd have to ask. >> i'm asking you. you're a democrat. he's a socialist. would you like somebody to call me a socialist? i wouldn't. >> i'm not one. >> what's the difference between a socialist and a democrat.
>> i can tell you what i am. i am a progressive democrat. >> how is that different than a socialist. >> who likes to get things done and who believes we are better off in this country when we're trying to solve problems together. >> latest polling shows bernie sanders is nipping at hillary clinton's heels in iowa down by just five points in the state. he's leading the former secretary of state by 14 points in new hampshire. the problem on the democratic side as opposed to the republican side is iowa and new hampshire are the first two contests are not representative of democratic voters an as i whole. they are among the whitest states in the country. new hampshire 94% white. the next two democratic contests will take place among a far more diverse population with voters of color who have so far leaned heavily towards hillary clinton. nevada, for example, is 76% white. south carolina just 68% white. the big question is whether or not bernie sanders can play in the other more diverse states. i'll ask a surrogate who switched allegiance from hillary
joining me now nina turner former ohio state senator and bernie sanders surrogate who previously supported hillary clinton and the president of brilliant corners research and strategies. anita, you personally switched and there has been a really concerted effort on the part of the sanders campaign to make an outrage to voters of color. how is that going? >> it's going well, chris. i mean i think it is one-sided
for anybody to assume that african-american voters are only going to vote for one candidate. african-americans want their votes to be earned just like everybody else. it's going well. i've been in chicago with the senator. i've been in baltimore as you know. and the african-american community is being introduced to senator sanders just in the same way as many other folks. let us not forget he's a senator from vermont and he's been serving honorably and nobly in that state and now he's running for president of the united states of america. it's going well. he understands that they are going to have to earn the votes of the african-american community. >> you know, cornell, partly what strikes me when you look at the numbers bernie sanders is lagged far behind hillary clinton among democratic voters of color. that margin has narrowed over time. two things, name recognition, he's a senator from vermont. she's a national figure. two, the fact that the democratic primary is set up in a weird way for the modern
democratic coalition, frankly. really, to start in iowa and new hampshire when you look at what the obama coalition actually looks like. >> well, two things. one is the campaign should be the clinton campaign should be concerned they are pulling people of the caliber of senator turner who was a former client. so i've got a little personal interest there. who can connect with the african-american community. bernie sanders problem, i'm going to drop real heavy political science on you if you're ready for this. voters don't necessarily rote for the best ten-point plan. they vote for people who they can connect with. they can connect to. and i would argue that bernie sanders has had a problem connecting with the african-american community and to a certain extent connecting with the hispanic community. he doesn't have to win minority voters but if you look at the states those southern states on super tuesday with large segments of african-american
population and even when you said 68% of the population in south carolina is white, 6% of the democratic primary will not be white. african-americans will overperform in that. he has to be able to compete with minority, with, minority voters because you cannot win this nomination if you can't compete in georgia and alabama, mississippi, arkansas, tennessee, what have you with these large segments of african-american populations. he cannot be the democratic nominee. and i think this is a problem that they need to focus on fixing. and if i were in the hillary campaign, i would sleep -- i would have a hard time sleeping tonight knowing they're beginning to figure this out and bringing people like nina turner in the campaign. >> obviously, in the past there's been similar splits and there has been a -- voters of color in democratic primaries are incredibly crucial bloc.
they've only got many more powerful as time got on. and barack obama was a really kind of, you know, a novel breaking of the tradition partly because he is of color but because he was able to win that constituency and people forget, barack obama himself had to climb an uphill battle with african-american voters in 2008. >> that's right. absolutely, chris. i'm glad you brought that up. until then senator barack obama won iowa, a lot of folks didn't think he had a snowball's chance in heaven. they predicted he would not win against the clinton machine but absolutely he did. so this is really about senator sanders introducing himself. i do agree with cornell. senator sanders and nobody else that's a democrat can win without the african-american community. let us not forget the african-american women were the highest voting bloc in 2012. guess what, senator sanders does not want to win without having the african-american community. when he talks about increasing the minimum wage to $15 an hour, that will give an instant raise
to african-americans. 51% of the african-american community. when he talks about k through college education being offered to all, that helps the african-american community. when he talks about racial justice and how in this country as the next president of the united states he's going to work hard to eradicate institutional racism and he doesn't just say this to african-american crowds. he will say this to all white crowds. so the african-american community is being introduced to senator sanders. he is the president for the african-american community. and dare i say all you have america. we're going to do everything we can to make sure his voice and his message is out there so that the african-american community will know that the senator bernie sanders is the president for them. >> cornell, let me ask you this. you mentioned nina mention the sort of the way everything turned around in iowa. this kind of cascade effect can happen in primaries. polling national numbers and the results come back and things really change. how do you think that would
happen, what would be the effect of a bernie sanders win in iowa or new hampshire? is that going to change the polling in terms of people's calculation of how possible a candidate he is? >> well, i kind of push back on -- i know there's a mythology around that iowa, you know, we want iowa in 2008 and then we started to win south carolina as if african-americans were waiting for white people to say he's okay. if you look at average polling going into the end of this week and january in 2008, we have basically caught up tossup in iowa and a little bit ahead in new hampshire and so we're building there. we were building there anyway. >> nina turner cornell belcher, thanks for joining me. we'll be live from burlington, vermont, this thursday night. donald trump will be holding a rally in bernie's backyard. that's going to be fun. more details to come.
that is all in for this evening. "the rachel maddow show" starts right now. >> donald trump campaigning in vermont is a smart thing to try to see up close. >> i love it. i love it. it's got everything. >> politics in vermont is so amazing anyway, but politics in vermont with donald trump smoothed in. >> i'm already hearing all sorts of, the lefties of burlington are hatching all sorts of plans we'll be reporting on. >> pack long underwear. it's cold. thanks, chris. and thanks for joining us this next hour. president obama made a big announcement today on guns, course. we'll be talking about that. basically throughout the show tonight including with a very special guest who is intimately involved with what happened today and he's here tonight for the interview. you are not going to want to miss that.