Skip to main content

tv   The Place for Politics 2016  MSNBC  March 1, 2016 3:00pm-11:01pm PST

3:00 pm
pretty good number for trump. very conservative, good number for cruz. just another way to watch this tonight. long night, early morning. don't change the channel. super tuesday coverage continues right this second. in the race for the white house, for those still left running, time is ticking away. >> we will not accept a rigged economy. >> we don't need to make america great again. america has never stopped being great. >> i've never been a politician. >> you all have friends voting for donald trump, friends don't let friends vote for a con artist. >> who actually has stood up to washington. >> seven candidates, 12 states. hundreds ever delegates. now the out come hangs in the balance.
3:01 pm
super tuesday. from new york and points elsewhere, good evening and welcome to the live super tuesday coverage. it could turn out to be the most consequential of election season, except for perhaps election night itself. we have a dozen states in play. the plot lines, pick one. number one, never before have so many been so wrong about the state of the american electorate. and number two, will tonight speak to the inn he ha-- challe or be covering something else by the end of the evening. which states will have a long night ahead of them. which ones will end by a landsli landslide. we'll be here for all of it. >> a big and long night. sort of exciting results throughout the eepg. y -- evening. we're settled in. i ate my breakfast and lunch together.
3:02 pm
i also slept last month. the thing that's going to happen tonight is going to be in part, all about the front-runners. we're looking to see if donald trump can do what the polls say is possible for him, which is win in ten out of 11 states tonight. that is within reach. we're looking at bernie sanders honestly to see if he can win the five states he says he'll win tonight. or if hillary clinton will dominate, approximaparticularly huge win in south carolina. down ticket on the republican side or down the field, honestly, the really tight races tonight, look, at least according to the polls, look like the races for second place in a whole bunch of southern states, where ted cruz and marco rubio are fighting basically to lose the best to donald trump. because the party wants to settle, the party elites want to settle on somebody who is not donald trump to go against him. those two candidates tonight are going to be fighting to see who is best positioned as a non-winner in the republican side. it's just phenomenal.
3:03 pm
>> geographically and numerically, they'll close at 10:00 p.m. eastern time. don't mess with texas, which few people know, started out as a keep america beautiful marketing phrase and got kind of hijacked. >> antilitter campaign. >> that's right. got hijacked as. chris matthews standing by in houston. give us your best prognosis. you get to cover this again tonight in the field. >> we have a great crowd at the smokehouse. i think that if you watch cruz tonight, i think it's sort of a win/win for donald trump. if he beats him down here, which is a long shot, then of course, he has blown them out of the race. no way cruz can come back to the race or come home afterwards.
3:04 pm
i think another win would be if it's a close race here. if it's close, then trump keeps cruz in the race, wounded enough, he could only split the vote with rubio. so he wins that way. if it's a blow out, it doesn't make any difference. i think trump will come down as a winner down here. on the other side, hillary, because we've been looking at the numbers, ever since we got them i should say about experience. i do believe experience, when a voter sees that question, in an exit poll, they go my experience with this candidate. have i had a long experience with this candidate. and the clintons win that hands down, because they've had this long experience in a positive one with african-american, i think they see the clintons as somebody they've known, felt a good chemistry with, good record, so i think that hillary will do well down here. i think cruz is likely to win down here, but i still think the great irony at the end of the night, especially coming out of this big state of texas, is that the establishment wing of the
3:05 pm
republican party, what's left of it is going to realize they've lost. they had questions now to them are two options. either they embrace trump, which they do not want to do, or they keep their distance from him now through the general election. i don't think they have an alternative to beat him at the convention. i don't see how you could deny the candidate who gets the most delegates in the briemry to be not maniny without a complete split without trump going out and running third party. the third is to accept him, and that's it. at the end of the night, the choice for republican moderates and republican establishment is swallow trump or don't. but you don't really have a choice in terms of another nominee. i think that's we're headed tonight, guys. >> that's stark. >> that is stark. >> republicans looking down the barrel, mr. trump has won three out of the first four contests. at the end of the night, there will be 15, if the results follow the polling, we'll have won 13 of the 15. at the point, if they have to undo, that's a pretty daunting
3:06 pm
process in terms of this being a small democratic process for choosing the nominee. on a night like this, when there are 11 contests on each side, and it's a slightly different list for democrats and republicans and the results will start coming in at 7:00 eastern, midnight, it's helpful to have a smart guy on your team like steve kornacki to tell you what to watch for and where to watch tonight as the results start coming in. >> let's take a look. let's start on the republican side. you know, sort of a cliché, but it really is. 600 up for grabs tonight. that's half you need to get the nomination. we know that texas, you're just talking about is a must win state for ted cruz. there is something else to keep an eye on, though. number 20, as in 20%. because we've seen the polls with marco rubio in third place, marco rubio not hoping win texas tonight, but wanting to collect delegates. if he is going to collect delegates, he needs to hit 20%. that is the threshold to get
3:07 pm
them out of texas. also in alabama, tennessee and we've also had indications in the polling leading up to tonight that that 20% number may be hard for rubio or even cruz in some cases to hit. so keep an eye on 20% in those states tonight. a couple of other things, the evangelical vote, if you're ted cruz, you've made your campaign about winning the evangelical vote in your campaign was built for tonight. so many states with big evangelical populations, two in particular. if you're thinking about ted cruz, besides texas to focus on, oklahoma and arkansas, one reason for that we're seeing this in the early exit poll data, the two states in the early exit poll data with the highest evangelicals voting tonight, over 70%, oklahoma and arkansas. if you are a rubio and thinking about a win, minnesota, we've had polling that has him competitive in there. keep an eye on virginia, because again, in had exit polling,
3:08 pm
we're seeing the state with the largest share of voters tonight on the republican side with college degrees is virginia, and that has been a dividing line we've been seeing in this republican race. donald trump does much better with voter whose do not have college degrees than with voters who do have college kridegrees,d rubio does better. two-thirds with college degrees. >> can i ask you a clarifying question, please. on the delegate issue, republican side, if anybody doesn't get 20% of the vote, that they get zero delegates, and the delegates they might -- does that mean that the winner in that case, if his opponents don't get 20%, the winner could get more delegates? >> so, well, it depends. let's take texas, biggest prize on the board. break it down. too pools of delegates in texas. you've got 36 congressional districts in the state. each one gets three delegates.
3:09 pm
that's, whoops, wait a minute. i'll get it right. that's a total of 108 delegates given out in texas based on the votes in the state. now, the rules for those delegates are if somebody gets over 50% in the district, that candidate gets all of those delegates. but otherwise, it's a splits. first place will get two, second place is going to get one, third place, even if it's only one vote behind second place, gets zero. so that's how that 180 is distributed. you have to hit 20% to get any of those. so you're marco rubio, you've been seeing polls that show you in third place, fairly far behind trump and cruz, your hopes in the congressional districts may not be good right now, but you want the pool of 47 and you have to hit 20% or you're probably getting zero. >> it's important who wins, but how people loose ends up being
3:10 pm
an important part. >> steve kornacki with the finger math. this is why we can't have nice things. let's introduce our other friends here. nicole wallace, a veteran of the bush political dynasty and mccain palin campaign, still standing, a trail of smoke coming up from her iphone. eugene robinson, "washington post" who wrote recently beautifully this week about what is happening to our culture, vi visa-a-vis. nicole, we're going to begin with you, we started the day with the speaker of the house and the republican leader in the senate taking on the topic of the kkk and by extension, donald trump. they are the republican establishment as "the new york times" forgive me, would ask, whither the republican establishment at long last. >> i've talked to folks who have been involved in previous
3:11 pm
presidential campaigns, put out the same message about the kkk, and i don't know that we've ever gone into a super tuesday where someone was going to clinch the nomination on the heels of his kkk scandal, right? so i think that this is an example of where there is legitimate concern about the senate and house tonight. there is no longer about sort of a pathetic or im potent establishment. this is about the rest of the people that govern under the banner of the republican party. and that's where it's a lot more serious than just, you know, sort of a withering class of people and no longer existing. >> since the pundit world was so wrong about donald trump's electability in the race, couldn't the establishment also be wrong about how badly he would lose in a general and what the down ticket effect would be. >> they could be. it's his behavior and temperament he has displayed. there is hope that in the midwest, where his support is
3:12 pm
very robust, he could actually bring new voters into the electorate. you can't do that if you're acting ambivalent about how the kk endorsement would have been. >> it raises the question about what is this about? what is the republican party about now? if it's front-runner takes positions so wildly at odds with those of the republican establishment, i mean, it's -- >> again. >> -- obviously the kkk thing, but on entitlements, military involvement overseas, on, you know, on -- >> immigration on a muslim pan, yeah. >> the whole range of issues, he simply differs from the party. free trade. >> the party could grabble with the policy debate. that's not what we're having. we're having a wall to wall, 24/7 scandal where the speaker of the house has to go before cameras and disavow the kkk. it is far more dire. other than bernie sanders, there
3:13 pm
is not a lot of message that centers around policy on either sides. that's not where we are. that we could figure out. there is strategy for that. >> real speculation today from very informed people that at least one republican senate incumbent if given the choice might publicly endorse hillary clinton. >> a republican incumbent. >> at least one that i've heard that could end up doing that making that choice. not because they want to, but because they need to send that message, look there is a bunch ever them running for reelection in a lot of states. that's what's going on here. on the day that the republican front-runner might cement his lead. but by the way, let's go back to this. this is about delegates tonight. we could have three candidates get over 100 delegates tonight. by the way, also a good night for donald trump. in an odd way, donald trump
3:14 pm
could rump, and both stick around. we know what that means come march 15th. >> speaking of stick around, i was going to ask the same of you. let's show our homework here. front load some of these breaks tonight so we have more time to go gavel to gavel. see how we do that. should news happen, we'll bust out of these commercials like they're nothing and come back here to the studio. please come back with us as we continue our conversation. we are adjust about 45 minutes from the close of the first polls of the night.
3:16 pm
3:17 pm
we are back with our freiens from new york. polls of the evening close. we want to continue the conversation with chuck todd. other races tonight, not getting as much attention. among them, a potential canary
3:18 pm
in the coal mines. >> three states over all are holding their congressional primaries simultaneously, in texas, arkansas and alabama. most interesting race is this alabama senate primary, richard shelby, who has been in the senate so long, he started as a democratic, switched parties after the initial republican tsunami of 94's and became a republican. has chairman of the banking committee. could you be a chairman in this political environment, right, the banking committee, you know, in an antiwall street firestorm, both sides. he has multiple candidates, one pretty well funded and a runoff state. if you don't get 50%, top two face off in a runoff. we know the new voters trump is bringing in. this is what makes it more precarious for rick shelby tonight. a lot of republican establishment types have done what they could to try to rescue him.
3:19 pm
he may get his 50% plus one and survive this, but i do think, look, this is the unpredictability of trump and the march 15th states, there are i think ohio and illinois, a lot of congressional primepres. nervous of the trump electorate. it's new people who are angry. throw the bumps out. >> imagine this from richard shelby's perspective. you're 81 years old. >> i know, why did i do it. >> you're running for your sixth term and looking down the barrel in alabama tonight, where donald trump is winning by double digi digits, running for your sixth term with that electorate. you think once you get elected, you're fine as long as you're alive, we'll see if he makes it. >> watching local news coverage on three stations the same day of shelby visiting the air bus plant, where they assemble air buses in alabama. his appearance looked forced and
3:20 pm
the local news anchors looked like they were getting their heads around the idea of richard shel shelby being -- >> he hasn't had a tough race in 20 years, you know, and we all know. these are tough, when you get a tough race and running for your sixth term in a good election year, you can lose. i'm not surprised. probably a little rusty on the campaign trail. by the way, his side kick, sessions, trump world. it separates chel shelby, the banking committee. the largest war chest in the united states senate for years, was rick shelby. why, senate banking committee. wall street, toxic. >> he could do an entire statewide campaign, just appearing at things named after him in the state. but at this point, in this kind of electorate. >> alarming for him. >> speaking of the electorate, we do have exit poll data that
3:21 pm
s steve kornacki has and where the conservative voters are. >> we're looking at the republican states, we don't get caucuses data, but the states that have right now in the exit polls that we're seeing, the highest share of very conservative voters on the republican side. you see oklahoma, arkansas, tennessee, georgia, put the numbers in perspective, before tonight, the highest number we had seen was 40. 40 in iowa, 40 in nevada. you see in these four contests right now, it is over 40. flip side, states with the smallest numbers of very conservative voters. you see massachusetts, vermont, virginia at 31%. one thing to keep in mind, if the numbers are donald trump has been performing pretty well across all the moderates, but strong in all of them, rubio has gotten better the closure you've got to moderates. cruz stronger with very conservative. we'll see if that continues tonight.
3:22 pm
more moderate states in the most conservative. >> coming up in about a half an hour, we'll take another break and fit it in here. we've got georgia, ver month, virginia polls closing. our night is just getting started as we preview super tuesday, live here on msnbc.
3:23 pm
3:24 pm
3:25 pm
we are back and that clock will be in the video wall behind
3:26 pm
us in no uncertain terms tonight. 34:15 until we see the first polls close of the evening. first, the large prize of the evening, down in the southwest, the great state of texas. chris matthews continues to stand by there. chris. >> thank you. we have a -- nicely. i don't think they've been prepped to do this. they're very nice here. we're with rick tyler, he was with the cruz campaign. now you're not. suppose he wins here narrowly. how does he beat trump in his eyes. >> look, he is going to win, harris county -- >> houston. >> in the state of texas, part of the rest of the united states. this is his home state. he'll win by double digits here. that's what he needs is a win. >> then what? >> juxtapose against rubio. >> how does he win the game of chicken?
3:27 pm
>> that's what it has to be. >> how do you win the game. >> if cruz wins, he's a better case. he'll have won two, rubio has won now. >> will rubio win any? >> it doesn't look like. >> it's a -- >> let me ask you this. chuck said earlier, the bible belt, tennessee. tennessee, alabama, georgia, arkansas, these are hard-rock fundamental states, heart of the cruz campaign. he is not going to perhaps win any of them today, maybe texas. deep south, nothing. >> he may win arkansas. >> he may, but that's his -- >> he may win oklahoma. >> why can't he win his base? >> well, the base is very conservative. you saw the poll numbers earlier. the numbers were very conservative. that's the one group donald trump doesn't do well in. that's marco rubio does terrible in. >> how does ted cruz win in
3:28 pm
michigan, illinois -- >> we have a lot of closed primaries. they'll change the dynamic. if we can get down to two -- >> you're no longer with cruz, right? would you bet on him being the republican nominee? would you bet money on that? >> i've learned a long time not to bet on politics. >> back to you, brian. this guy is not betting, which i understand completely. >> you gave him a brisket grilling down there. we should explain our guest, our friends and family here, we'll be rotating all night long, because we share our friends with the nbc television network. that is why mr. scmmitt joins us now. the miccain campaign. you love the party, you lover your political party. you love your country, patriot. republican. your heart must be hearting at this kkk debate that has
3:29 pm
consumed the last 24 hours in 2016 after all. >> look, it's an unfortunate debate, and as a republican and someone who believes deeply in the historic legacy of the republican party, which is the party of the north and the party of the west, that migrated south between '68 and 1988, to see a party, the party of abraham lincoln, so critical in the civil rights movement, we understand the democratic fick chan -- demo graphic change is taking place. no place for this. the person who is the front-runner for the republican nomination has to be unequivocal of his condemnation of hate groups. he has stumbled around for the last couple of days. i suspect it will hurt him in a general electorate composition, not tonight. but certainly, this is not a great moment for the republican party that this debate has erupted out into the open.
3:30 pm
>> can i ask why you think he has done that? the thing we've learned about mr. trump over the past few months he is a good politician, he is good at what he does, and usually not out of control. did he start stumbling or dancing around the klan and the white supremacist, because he is going to be -- or is it a screw up. >> i think it was a screw up. having been in the middle high level two presidential campaigns, we won one and lost one. every mistake these candidates make is out of fatigue. so they're now in the part of the campaign where it's nonstop. there are no days off. these rallies are draining. he is on an early sunday morning show. he looked tired to me. it didn't look to me like he properly understood the question. he had condemned david duke years earlier. he had condemned the klu klux
3:31 pm
klan years earlier. i think there was some confusion on his parts on the question. but as it started to blow up, what you have to look for in the candidates is nimbleness. i screwed that up. the incapacity to go out and to apologize, or to make the course correction, you know, the notion, the stubbornness, better to be wrong than right. >> i hope it was a mistake. >> that is on display there, you know, i think manifested itself. i don't believe it's possible for somebody who is running for president as the front-runner to be ambiguous about their feelings with the klu klux klan. >> do you remember, though, the stories of racist robo calls. he said he had nothing do with them and that was clear, but then also s-- you can't hold a candidate reliable for their supporters, but he hasn't been exactly resoundingly denouncing
3:32 pm
this stuff and a lot of it on his side. >> he was also an original birther with president obama. >> profoundly racial. >> now, i think steve is probably right. the initial gaff was probably just a mistake. but if your policy is never apologize for anything. >> yeah. >> then air kind of trapped. i mean, that's a reflex that you have to develop, i think, if you wants to be a major party presidential candidate. you know, we'll see. >> i wish we had better things to discuss. we will at certain times in the evening. another break for us. inside a half hour until the polls closing in georgia, vermont, virginia, long night and exciting for super tuesday, 2016.
3:33 pm
3:34 pm
3:35 pm
i am confident that if there is a large voter turnout across this country, we are going to do
3:36 pm
well, and if there not, we're probably going to be struggling. but i hope that there will be millions of people coming out and participating in what i call the political revolution, after a lot of deliberation, i know bernie sanders here in vermont, got one vote. i was working on my wife, so i think probably got two. so we're feeling pretty good. >> bernie sanders after admitting he was vicerated in south carolina. they can go ahead financially. 36 after the hour, coming up on the 7:00 p.m. >> this super tuesday, obviously they're back in a position in the campaign where hillary clinton once again looks like the front-runner, but sanders campaign is not being shy. they said we're going to win five states tonight, his home state, the two caucuses states, colorado and minnesota, oklahoma and massachusetts, and oklahoma
3:37 pm
and massachusetts, we're not used to thinking them of presidential battle grounds. the polling has been interesting in both those states. we've heard from the clinton campaign after a few polls in massachusetts showed secretary clinton with a lead there. we have heard from the clinton campaign tonight that they do not expect to win massachusetts. that of course would be really good news for senator sanders, if only because losing a state next to your home state, wouldn't look good for him. steve kornacki has more detail in terms of what we have on the exits so far. >> one of the most striking things we've seen in the race so fashion the reason that sander lost, the overwhelming support from black voters in that state. she won 90% of the vote in south carolina. the question was how close are the other states, particularly in the south, coming to the kind of black turnout we saw in south carolina. so in south carolina, on saturday, we saw that 61% of the
3:38 pm
electorate was black. again, hillary clinton got not close to 90% of them. what we're seeing in the exit polls right now, seeing 47% black electorate, alabama, 46, in georgia, 29, in tennessee, 26, in arkansas and 24 in virginia. those are the southern states in the mixed night. only states with concentrations higher than 20 mers. on the plip side, this goes directly to what you were just talking about, rachel, the lowest share of black voters that we're seeing tonight are not surprisingly, those states the sanders campaign is talking about. 13% in oklahoma, 4% in massachusetts and the smallest number we're seeing tonight, bernie sanders' home state of vermont, 1% black electorate. >> steph kornacki at the board. let's go to where steve just wrote the number 24, commonwealth of virginia. fascinating state politically. chris jansing in richmond for us
3:39 pm
tonight, chris. >> reporter: well, two big things we're looking for tonight, brian. one on the republican side, marco rubio has gone all in. he think this is is a place he can surprise. the only state where he has spent more money on ads than ted cruz has, and he spent the whole day sunday here. nothing more important than where he spends his time. we'll be watching that closely. can he pull an upset. on the democratic side, i was talking to terry mcauliffe tonight, hillary clinton vote with the black vote. as we saw in south carolina, can she dominate. in northern virginia, the hispanic vote. obviously two ckey constituents both sides going to be looking at it to see what they might glean for the general election, brian. >> all right, chris jansing, thanks. chris will be in rich mannmond the duration. 6:39 p.m. eastern time, within sight at 7:00.
3:40 pm
3:41 pm
3:42 pm
3:43 pm
you see on the big board, just over 16 minutes away from the first poll closings. we are back. steve schmitt. steve, a cliché question, what are you looking for.
3:44 pm
>> the share of cruz campaign was predicated on him doing well tonight. architected around evangelical voters in the south. improbable as it may seem, donald trump is poised looking at some of these polls tonight to run away with evangelical voters in the south. if he does, that collapses a key rationale of ted cruz's campaign as this race now moves out of the part of the country where naturally ted cruz thought that his base was and where he was going to be stronger. >> can he do anything else? does he have a lane to switch to? that's the way he set up his campaign. he was going to be the s echltd c primary guy, the guy that captured evangelicals. can he switch? can he be anything else? >> it's difficult to see that scenario playing out. cruz's campaign was predicated on getting into an ideological
3:45 pm
fight, at a moment in time where the right w, but donald trump h disrupted the political party and he is strong across all of the lanes in the party, you know, between college, non-college educated, across the board. and so we will see how that plays out tonight. >> you wanted to make a point about virginia. >> yeah, in virginia, anybody could vote in either primary. there is no partisan registration, so you just show up. and you vote. and the republican primary or the democratic primary. so one thing we could look for is if there is any cross voting. are there democrats who vote in the republican primary to stop trump, or just to screw things up, or for whatever reason. you know, it's a very highly educated electorate, a place where people might actually do some -- >> dave weegle had an
3:46 pm
interesting part on that in the "washington post." in virginia and a couple of other states they felt like usually they would have voted in a democratic contest, they feel they know the democratic contest will go in their state, so if they can, they're crossing over. strategically, they're not going to all do the same thing. some will vote for trump because they think he will be a weak duty candidate. so even if we see that tonight, i think it will be a scatter shot effect. >> i had one question i wanted to ask steve. you once told me campaigns end when they run out of money. >> right. >> so all these campaigns have money. after tonight, is anybody going to drop out? >> nobody is going to drop out. at the end of the day, super pac sponsor to be able to go forward. it truly, there is now, depending on where you are in the republican establishment, along the pathway of your five
3:47 pm
stages of grief. depending on what your reaction to tonight is. so there are feverish plans underway amongst republicans, amongst donors about how to intervene in this race, to put together outside money to begin advertising in florida, to make sure marco rubio wins in florida. there is a lot of talk in washington amongst republicans about a contested convention. marco rubio saying that, well, i'll be able to take this from the convention. i'll be able to take it at this convention, notwithstanding second and third place finishes. the republican party, even six, eight weeks ago, you talked to a lot of republicans in washington, d.c., they would look at you straight in the eye, and they would say jeb bush will be the nominee of the republican party. so the acceptance to what is happening has dawned on establishment republicans, and permeated the bubble very late in washington, d.c. you'll see that play out over the next couple of days with the results. >> you keep hearing about this.
3:48 pm
>> and then the party has to forever is the party that decided that their voters didn't know the right thing to do and they had to be big footed. >> or the party that got blown in chards. we'll see. we're going to take our last break of this hour. so when we come back, we'll be able to bridge the top of the hour, get the first results from the polls closing, at 7:00 in three states. he' we'll be right back.
3:50 pm
3:51 pm
3:52 pm
we are back on the air with eight minutes now until the top of the hour, when we will be able to broadcast our first characterizations of the poll closings of this evening. right now, our data is limited to exit polling, but it's interesting datety aa. steve. >> one of the fault lines we've identified on the republican side in all of the contests we've seen so far is when did you make up your mind? we have found that people made up their minds a long time ago, a week ago, a month ago, longer than that. that has been donald trump's best group. he has done the worst with voter whose are making up their mind on the day of the primary or in the final few days.
3:53 pm
conversely, marco rubio has been doing better with the late deciders. so we took a look here. across all the primaries here, 22% of republicans voting, they made up their minds in the final few days, comparable to the number we saw in nevada. but there is a catch. these are the states that have the highest number of late deciders, and you see the numbers are higher significantly higher than 22%, up to about one-third. massachusetts, vermont, lots of states behind them. why is that. texas, text has has the smallest number of late deciders, because it's a big early voting state also. the biggest state on the board today. dragging down the overall late decider number. in a lot of these individual states, you're seeing a much higher late decider than 22. but 22s the average we're seeing. >> we would expect that to be probably good news for senator ted cruz, senator ted cruz thought of having a robust campaign in texas, but maybe slipping at the end. >> to cruz and trump, but again,
3:54 pm
we talked about this earlier. rubio needs to get to 20% in texas. he needs to squeeze out every last vote he can find. that number may not be the number he wants to see. >> let's go to robert costa, an ex ler excellent reporter. robert, what are you hearing tonight from the various campaigns in terms of levels of confidence and what's important? >> all the campaigns are watching a specific type of voter, voteder in the suburbs, late deciding. steve is spot on as he analyzes the exit polls, maybe turned off to trump, alarmed by his bad week, talking about the klu klux klan, and perhaps voters in virginia and minnesota, not part of the deep south. if they can turn to rubio, rubio feels they could have a big night. >> in terms of the overall level of confidence, obviously the rubio campaign has been sort of letting people know in a broad sense that they're not expecting
3:55 pm
a huge night tonight, they're not for example, expecting to win any individual states. as first state data has come in, have there been any bright signs for the rubio campaign. >> maybe a humbling night for not get a victory, strong second place finishes, leaving aside cruz wins texas and trump minutes many other states. m massachusetts, oklahoma, places not in the deep south, rubio could get 20, 25, maybe even 30%. >> thank you very much. we'll be checking back in. >> nicole wallace and eugene robinson. your level of nervousness? >> it exists on many levels. one thing about the rubio campaign, guaranteeing a win in florida, that's as much about the delegate math, all they need to do is wrack up delegates as it is about long-term viability in the eyes of their supporters,
3:56 pm
eyes of their donors and the context of this race. >> you need to keep people focused on something when you win. >> kasich in ohio. >> they've been alarming successful at turning second and third place wins into a rationale. >> he gives a victory speech every time he comes in third. >> i talked to an operative today who is not involved in the cruz campaign but very impressed by the campaign they put together. they said rubio almost occupies a space that cruz deserves. cruz is running a better campaign, placing higher. >> won a state. >> going to have a better night tonight, but we're talking about how it will be a victory if rubio continues to wrack up delegates. they'll all get delegates. but rubio has played the expectations game master fully. >> that's how you win. >> but eventually you do have to win. do you have to win. >> maybe you don't. >> i mean, their long-term strategy is to stay in this. no one is talking about getting out. i think florida will be a more
3:57 pm
decisive not. >> if he doesn't win florida, but what does it say about his long-term? >> one of the most interesting things i saw reported today, politico.com that not only are all of the campaigns other than donald trump planning on a convention strategy, because that's the only way they can win, but the rubio campaign has named their advisor who is going to run their convention delegate strategy. henry barber, in mississippi, announcing that is just remarkable. >> also critical for moral on a traveling campaign that is exhausting. speaking of exhausted, steve kornacki back at the board. i understand you have a mini category here. >> yeah, this is the basic difference between the psychology of the two parties right now. the exit poll for all the states combined. political experience or do you want an outsider. look at this. democrats overwhelmingly, 80-16,
3:58 pm
they want experience among republicans, 50% basically a plurality here. an outsider. big difference on that question. >> steve kornacki, on the board. that's the spin, rachel, and that is, we may see history made tonight into two ways. insurgent, outsider could take mathematical control of the republican race. and a woman president candidate could do the same in the democratic party. >> the further you get, the higher altitude from which you take your views, the more stunning your results are. we could get into the minutia, who is fighting for second and third. but honestly, we've got donald trump reality television star, and businessman and never before a politician, poised to lockup all but lockup the nomination tonight in a way that would require anybody else to win, to win at the convention, and hillary clinton, you know, maybe did put enough million cracks in
3:59 pm
that glass ceiling in 2008 to go all the way this year. it looks like with those two front-runners, we're going to make history. >> starting here in about one minute. here is how this process will take place. we're going to have poll closings in vermont, virginia and georgia. our decision desk, which is honest to god, seqestered. there they are, that's about as close as any of us will get to them. they're on a different floor from us. they make their decisions in a vacuum. they are not considering other news organizations that may make decisions. they are merely making decisions for nbc news and msnbc. so coming up here in less than half a minute now, we will learn what their output is, we will learn based on the preupon dr- w
4:00 pm
they say see the race. with that, the first thing we're going to look at is the 7:00 hour begins nextly five seconds, here are the polls we're talking about closing. georgia, vermont, virginia, it is now 7:00 p.m. on the east coast of the united states. we will start in the state of georgia with a projection. an early one, and that is when all the votes are counted, hillary clinton will win the georgia primary on the democratic side, 117 total delegates at stake. you see the man next to her, on the republican side in the state of georgia, donald trump the projected winner there. in virginia, for the democrats, we're projecting that when the votes are counted there, hillary clinton will be the victor in virginia tonight. on the republican side, here is a story. too close to call with trump and
4:01 pm
rubio vying for first in the commonwealth of virginia. up to new england we go. no surprise. vermont, bernie sanders has carried his home state as one of two senators from that state. the republican race in vermont, where the democratic -- the governor of ohio has spent a lot of time of late, is at this hour, too early to call with trump and kasich vying for the lead there. rachel, that's what you've got at 7:00. >> stunning. those are some actually very stunning and interesting results. i mean, obviously the top line there, georgia and virginia are both states that hillary clinton lost to barack obama in 2008. she lost georgia to him by 36 points, she lost virginia by 29 points. her looking them up on the democratic side is itself news. john kasich being in the too early to call lane. >> in the money. >> in vermont, is very interesting.
4:02 pm
john kasich is a very interesting factor on the republican side. he does have money. he is marshaling his resources. not trying to compete. trying to stay alive. he had spent money in alaska, massachusetts and ver month. if that spending kept him within shooting distance, that's a very interesting story to tell. john kasich the sleeper candidate of all sleeper candidates in this race. obviously the republican establishment in the marco rubio campaign are going to be delighted. it's too early to call between trump and rubio. virginia and minnesota where rubio is thought of having the best chance of being competitive. that too close to call in virginia. that's interesting. >> chris matthews, we're coming your way in an hour and 58 minutes, closing down the polls in texas. i would love your take on the calls we've already had here at the top of the 7:00. >> we haven't talked much, brian and rich i will about gender
4:03 pm
tonight. if you look at virginia and its history, it's very pro-choice. a lot of single women who have come to washington, live in the bedroom communities ever northern virginia. vote on the issues important to women. i think bernie was trying to make a run there, but among the women, i think the backgrounds you're going to see, they played a big part today. women in virginia tend to be very pro-choice and focused on women's issues. that's why hillary did well there today. >> sporadic applause in houston, texas tonight. >> i think chris has a fan base in houston he didn't know he had. a lot of appreciation for him. >> i think. so just a delay while they're getting his words back on the satellite. that's for chris. make no mistake. my role in life among other things has been reminding nicole wallace about the kasich factor in the republican party. yes, i know he bears the label as every democratic's favorite republican in 2016. but let's talk about rich aache
4:04 pm
talking about we're too close. >> too early. >> let's talk about the kasich factor. >> you get me in trouble. so thanks for that in advance. >> keeps you honest. >> they feel like they are running their own race. that is the only republican campaign about which you could say that. they have not changed anything about the candidate or their campaign, because of donald trump. and that alone puts them in a league of their own. you heard marco rubio talking about hand size for lack of any cleaner way to say that. you would never, ever hear anything like that coming out of john kasich's mouth. i mean, i think said this, he is alone in the dignity lane. if he wins the state tonight, a lot of people will be heart ended. >> one factor here about john kasich that hasn't sunk in but is true. we talk about these two separate things and nobody is seeing they're connected. one of them is john kasich's strange campaign, where is he running in this dignified way. essentially running as a general
4:05 pm
election moderate, even though he is is a republican governor. the other thing is we've recognized that nobody can win the republican nomination without going to the convention, other than donald trump. so either donald trump wins, or it's going to the convention. in which case -- >> it doesn't matter. >> primaries don't matter. so when the convention opens, a guy that might be able to win in november and alive. john kasich is staying alive and running a general election campaign. >> you need to win ohio. you can't be the republican president without winning ohio. >> if you told me 10, 15, 20 years ago that john kasich would ever be considered a moderate, i would think you were crazy. he is a conservative. back in the day, he was thought of an an arch conservative. now he is a moderate in today's republican market. >> he is deliberately casting himself that way because he can. he doesn't have to win a majority of the republican primaries in order to be viable as a potential nominee. if that gets decided in the
4:06 pm
convention, he has to look like he has a shot against bernie sanders and hillary clinton and if he is alive, he can do it. >> back briefly, forgive me for the news, we started this hour with and those were the states we've called and one notable exception, the commonwealth of virginia, let's put the board up, this is what started our conversation initially. donald trump, marco rubio too close to call at this point in the evening. steve kornacki has more on this race. >> this one right now is about psychology more than it is about math. the delegate difference between first and second is not much in virginia, but here it is. this is marco rubio's chance to put a marquee win on the board and to have an answer to people who say what state have you won. if he could get first place in virginia, that would be big for his campaign. what is happening in the numbers, very conservative voters. donald trump is winning them, rubio lagging badly. when you move to the middle,
4:07 pm
rubio bumps up. cruz falls off. the story in virginia, more moderates here than we see in most states, and those moderates going big for marco rubio. again, trump had been winning moderates in other states. not in virginia. john kasich also bumping up. i think rubio would have to have those kasich votes right about now. the college/non-college divide. the reason rubio is competitive, the reason he needs a win in this state, this state has the highest number, we were saying this earlier, the highest share of college graduates of any republican state voting tonight. this has been his constituency. winning with college graduates by ten, and the other end, high school or less, a route for donald trump. education, you continue to see the divides. very quickly, we can show you those who have decided a long time, something we've seen, donald trump winning a majority in this crowded field. but this is what the rubio people have been hoping for in the final few days. that is about a quarter of the
4:08 pm
electorate here in virginia, rubio winning the overwhelming plurality of the late deciders and making this a close race. >> even given his decision to join the dialogue with donald trump in kind. steve kornacki, thanks. because at this point in the campaign, nothing goes unnoticed more than that, everything gets noticed, and distributed widely, it is interesting to note where the candidates are going to be tonight, starting with this next one. hillary clinton has already been awarded two state victories, head quarters is in miami. that's where andrea mitchell is covering for us. andrea. >> well, brian, first of all, miami and florida are not voting tonight. but they're voting on march 15th, when hillary clinton is hoping to really narrow down this nomination if everything goes well. she has already as you know, virginia and georgia, the two
4:09 pm
biggest delegate states tonight has won those and both states that she lost to barack obama in 2008. they especially feel good about virginia where she won the white vote as well as the african-american voice. we're not going to stay up for those returns for america somoa, six delegates, five super delegates, pleading with them for their delegate votes. >> let's go to marla largo, the home of donald trump, where tonight, donald trump is giving what is being billed as a news conference and not any kind of hotel ballroom speech. victory or ear wise. katy tur covering for us. >> this is a nontraditional campaign, since the beginning. this is only another example of that. instead of having a watch party
4:10 pm
tonight, which is a traditional thing that most candidates do, a lot of supporters can come and cheer for the candidates when he comes out on stage or she comes out on stage and announces victory, he'll just be having a press conference behind me. it's unclear what he will announce. some sort of surprise, but no hints at the moment. there was some speculation that if he wins big tonight, he could potentially say he is not going to participate in any of the gop debates going forward. but today, he told a radio program that's not the case. he will be involved in the debates, even though he sduntd think they're worthwhile, they repeat themselves over and over again. the campaign feeling good right now. trump has already tweeted, which is his favorite form of communication, that thank you to georgia, as we've called for him. still, though, surprised to find out virginia is a close call with him and rubio right now, as well as vermont, with trump and john kasich.
4:11 pm
he is is expected to win big across super tuesday states and if he does not do so, it will be seen as many as a let down. >> katy tur with the trump campaign. it's interesting that the downside of high expectations is that when you do not meet them, even victories can feel like losses. there are definitely expectations on the races so far. in terms of the calls we've got. ted cruz has not been mentioned. donald trump with a projected victory in georgia. too close to call with trump and rubio. too early to call between trump and kasich in vermont. ted cruz is not mentioned. hoping have a big night tonight in texas. we're wondering whether or not trump will be competitive in other states as well. hallie jackson is with the cruz campaign. what are they telling you about their level of confidence? >> hey there. just a couple of moments ago, i spoke with a top campaign aid predicting a win in texas, saying that they will win here
4:12 pm
tonight. that's what they're seeing. they'll have what is being called a foundation of delegates to topple in this age with trump house of cards. they're feeling confident tonight. not just looking at texas, but arkansas, ho i'm told senator c is at his house in houston. he is going over his speech. unlike donald trump's event, this is a victory party. you have the bar on one side, the band on the other. cruz hoping for a celebration tonight. >> an attempt to cutback on the trump house of cards, the knit flicks for the cruz campaign. really on the eve of the next season of that show. any way, a quick break. when we come back, as you might be able to tell from the backdrop of that picture, we're waiting to here from bernie sanders at a campaign event any minute.
4:13 pm
4:14 pm
4:15 pm
4:16 pm
georgia, virginia, ver mont -- vermont, as you can see, 44 minutes in the next round of states, we'll show you the crowd in burlington, vermont. we'll awaiting bernie sanders. it looks like we hit them late in the wave. it will be coming around if we're willing to wait long enough. so a crowd of frenzy crowd. steve kornacki at the board about what we know about tonight's vote. >> we know he won his home state. he lost virginia and journgeorg. take georgia, we're seeing it again. white voters, exit poll,
4:17 pm
narrowly leading. but check this out, among black voters, boy, this looks like saturday night all over again. 83% for hillary clinton. 70% for bernie sanders. if this campaign doesn't work out for bernie sanders, this will be the epithet of his campaign. he could not win over black voters. his campaign could not have a repeat in south carolina throughout the south continue. but in georgia, we're seeing the same thing all over again. >> eugene robinson it, was john lewis, icon of the civil rights movement who had that devastating moment at the press conference who said, you know, i didn't see -- i didn't see him. >> i didn't see bernie sanders. i did meet hillary clinton and i met bill clinton. >> right. that's heavy artillery, right, if the clinton campaign could deploy him in georgia, that says a lot. i think bernie sanders frankly started trying too late to win over african-american voters.
4:18 pm
i think he -- there was no visible effort for a long time. it's not something you do overnight. there was this long-standing relationship between the clintons and african-american communities across the country really. and it's not that i think people think that bernie sanders is a bad guy. they don't know him. they go with the one they know and the one they like. >> it's fought linot he doesn't sizable credentials and was involved in the struggle. >> he was, he was a member of core and a member of snik and there are real photographs of that in addition to the fake photographs that got posted. but again, who knew from bernie sanders, you know, in african-american communities and in the south are really much of the country, he wasn't that much of a national figure. >> now lost three contests in the south, but sort of the steam in the sanders' campaign is
4:19 pm
elsewhere. he doesn't have a win tonight. second win. he won in new hampshire and just won in vermont. he of course was mayor of burlington, vermont and they absolutely love him. his approval ratings are like jesus level in vermont. we will find out he got a lot of crossover voters in vermont as well. he has also had a ton of huge rallies in states that he wouldn't expect to be bernie sanders territory. kansas city, missouri, tulsa, dallas, he has been getting, when i say big rallies, he's getting 6, 7, 8,000 people. he has raised more money on either side of the aisle. $42 million in the last month. we're going to go to bernie sanders headquarters where our own kasie hunt is there. obviously, they want to win more places than they are currently winning, but kasie, i imagine outside of the states in the south where they know they're
4:20 pm
going to keep losing. >> hey, rachel. i think that's right. i was having a conversation with tad devine, the senior strategist on the ground with bernie sanders, along with his whole team. i get the sense they're actually looking at some of these numbers rolling in and feeling fairly optimistic about things. i mean, expectations have been pretty low for him. they're still waiting to see places like minnesota and colorado, but they're feeling good about where things are in oklahoma, they're watching massachusetts very carefully, because that could be a bellwether, so many of those working class voters, sort of the basis for bernie sanders campaign. and bernie sanders himself, you know, gets so frustrated when people look at his campaign and say, hey, why aren't you dropping out yet. and that of course has been the narrative that sort of persisted over the last week. it is sounding like we're hear more from the hillary clinton
4:21 pm
supporters, that he should clear the way and let her run directly against donald trump. that's something that you can see him flash irritation when you ask him a question along those lines or a request that includes that presumption as you're pushing him. but i think that one thing that also has encouraged them over the course of the last 24 hours, even, is this fundraising number. most candidates when they start to lose, they can't raise any more money. and reality is, they raised over $5 million in 24 hours. supporters seem to be energized that he is down-and-out. if he continue that, he can hang in for a long time. >> bumping up against $6 million just yesterday alone. kasie, thank you. we'll go back when bernie sanders begins to speak. we'll fit another break in in the meantime. in the meantime, the live coverage continues on the other side.
4:22 pm
4:23 pm
4:24 pm
4:25 pm
we are back and we're 35 minutes away from the next round of poll closings. it helps to review the states we have already projected. let's look at the big board. starting with the state of georgia, we projected that for hillary clinton, at the top of the 7:00 hour, east coast, and on the republican side, for donald trump, in georgia. then up to the commonwealth of virginia, projected for hillary clinton. on the republican side, virginia, having interesting
4:26 pm
race. too close to call. trump and rubio vying for first. bernie sanders in a squeaker, won his home state of vermont, and in vermont on the republican side, too early to call with trump and kasich. vying for first. >> so those two unsettled races, which there is not a projected winner, both very interesting. v vermont, nobody thinking about john kasich, thinking about him for ohio, but too early to call. and then of course, too close to call in virginia. i'm sure the rubio campaign, his supporters are delighted to see that. steve kornacki, in terms of the virginia too close to call what, do we know about who has turned out? >> we can tell you if that's the about ig board, this is the pretty big board. let's look among white evangelicals, we see this divide. trump here in virginia is
4:27 pm
winning withwith, if there a pi of good news for donald trump, we're seeing slightly mothe vot are just starting to come in. this is the real time map now. the counties where votes are coming in shaded in here. still early from terms of what is out there. this area right here in northern virginia, right outside of washington, d.c., a four county area, you can throw alexandria, virginia in there. densely populated and highly educated pockets of people in the united states of america. that is the story for marco rubio here tonight. if he is going to win on the republican side, he is going to do it with more secular, college educated, more moderate republicans. and this in virginia is basically where you find them. a huge cultural difference between right here outside of washington, d.c. and the rest of the state. so if marco rubio pull this is
4:28 pm
off, it will be bigger turnout here and big margins in that area. >> all right, steve kornacki, thanks. we have been told that bernie sanders is making his way into the room in burlington, vermont. and ipre pr presume he is being introduced now. let's listen in now. >> bernie in vermont. you know, i know bernie has given vermonters just so much pride. we are so proud of this campaign. in ten months -- >> all right we're still in the inn p int introductory. we welcome lawrence o'donnell. lawrence, the first time this evening we've had to talk to you. your reaction? >> really amazing at this hour is the biggest news coming out of vermont might be made by john kasich. bernie sanders is going to win
4:29 pm
vermont by a giant margin, but for john kasich to be competitive there and possibly on the verge of pulling out a win is the real bigger vermont news tonight. >> shouldn't we watch massachusetts. >> the more surprising news. this is the biggest delegate is bernie sanders. >> does it vindicate the john kasich sleeper strategy? again, all these people in washington saying why kasich in the race? shouldn't he drop out. i see what he is doing, and it makes sense. >> he was very consciencely trying to pick up votes in vermont and alaska, which no one was paying attention to. >> bernie sanders will now address thundering fans in burlington, vermont.
4:30 pm
>> thank you! >> it's good to be home. >> thank you, all. thank you.
4:31 pm
thank you. it is good to be home. [ applause ] >> you know, i have been all over this country, but the truth is, it is great and great to come home. and see all my friends. you know, we want to win in every part of the country that goes without saying. but it does say something and means so much to me that the people who know me best, the people who knew me before i was
4:32 pm
elected, who knew me as mayor, congressman and know me as senator, have voted so strongly to put us in the white house. thank you so much. this campaign is i think all of you know, this campaign is not just about electing the president. it is about transforming america. it is about making our great country the nation that we know it has the potential to be.
4:33 pm
it is about dealing one in unpleasant truths and having the guts to confront the untruths. it is about recognizing that in our state, we have town meetings and people come out, they argue about budgets, and then they vote. one person, one vote. in vermont, billionaires do not buy town meetings, and in america, we are going to end a corrupt campaign finance system.
4:34 pm
we can disagree in a democracy, and that's what a democracy is about, but i hope all of us agree that we're going to not allow billionaires and their super pacs to destroy american democracy. in our state, in our state, you all know that we have many, many thousands of vermonters working not just one job, they're working two jobs, they're working three jobs. and you all know that while our
4:35 pm
people are working so hard, almost all of the new wealth and income generated in america is going to the top 1%. well, together, what we are going to do is create an economy that works for all of us, not just the people on top. and together, we are going to end and reform a broken criminal justice system. this country, the wealthiest country in the history of the
4:36 pm
world should not be having more people in jail than any other country on earth. that's wrong. so we are going to invest for our young people in education, in jobs, not jails or incarceration. now, i know many of my republican colleagues think that climate change is a hoax. well, i believe that you don't develop real public policy unless you listen to the science and the science is clear.
4:37 pm
together, we are going to transform our energy system away from fossil fuel to energy efficiency and sustainable energy. now, i know that secretary clinton and many of the establishment people think that i am looking and thinking too big. i don't think so. so let me go on the record and say as you have heard me say for years, health care is a right for all people.
4:38 pm
and let me also say that in the united states of america, when we talk about public education, it's not just first grade through 12th that has got to be expanded to make public colleges and universities tuition free. what i have said from day one in this campaign and i suspect many of you went down on the lake with me when we announced on that beautiful day. what i have said is that this campaign is not just about electing a president. it is about making a political
4:39 pm
revolution. what that revolution is about is bringing millions of millions of people into the political process. working people who have been so disillusioned, they no longer vote. young people have never been involved. the political revolution is about is bringing our people together. black and white, latino, asian americans. gay and straight. people born in america, people who have immigrated to america.
4:40 pm
when we bring our people together when we do not allow the donald trumps of the world to divide us up. when we bring our people together and when we have the courage to stand up to the billionaire class and tell them they can't have it all. that our government belongs to all of us, not just super pacs and wealthy campaign contributors. now, tonight, you're going to see a lot of election results come in. let me remind you of what the media often forgets about. these are not -- this is not a general election. it is not win or take all.
4:41 pm
if you get 52%, you get 48%, you roughly end up with the same amount of delegates in a state. by the end of tonight, we are going to win many hundreds of delegates. ten months ago as you know, better than any other group in america, when we were out on the lake, we were at 3% in the polls. we have come a very long way in ten months.
4:42 pm
at the end of tonight, 15 states will have voted, 35 states remain. and let me assure you that we are going to take our fight for economic justice, for social justice, for environmental sanity, for a world of peace to everyone of those states. now, wall street may be against us and the super pacs may be against us. but you know why we're going to win? because our message is resonating and the people when we stand together will be
4:43 pm
victorious. so on a personal note, i want to thank all of you for the love and the friendship that you have given our family. you have sustained me. and i am so proud to bring vermont values all across this country. so thank you again for helping us win here in vermont.
4:44 pm
tonight, and i look forward this evening to just saying hello to so many old friends. so thank you all very much. >> the democratic socialist senator from vermont, when he warns about the media, he is not talking about anything celestial. assuring his supporters as he put it, hundreds of delegates tonight. we're going to fit a break in tonight. we have poll closings 15 minutes from now. we're right back with more after this.
4:45 pm
4:46 pm
4:47 pm
4:48 pm
just over 12 minutes until we get the results as we know them from alabama, massachusetts, oklahoma and tennessee, the next round of polls to close. >> we've got some calls on the democratic side already. georgia and virginia, the projected winner is hillary clinton. vermont, bernie sanders, who we just heard from. we do have exit poll date that that tells us more, even for the states ahead in terms of what kind of democratic voters are turning out tonight. steve kornacki has more of that. >> when you look at the electorate, the story is how much more liberal the democratic electorate has gotten since the last time we did one of these in 2008. the states voting tonight, when you asked people eight years ago if they considered themselves a liberal, they said no. they didn't identify themselves as liberal. complete opposite. every state but one.
4:49 pm
clear majority saying they are liberal. the state of texas, 62% of democratics calling themselves liberal. 70% in new england. 61% in tennessee. virginia, 68%. only one state on here on the democratic side do less than 50% call themselves liberal, and it's close. oklahoma. that number is 47%. we have seen this in all four primaries before tonight and we're seeing it in every state tonight. big growth in the number of democrats calling themselves liberals during the obama presiden presidency. >> thanks. we're going to run the last break before we bridge the top of the hour as we approach 8:00 eastern time and the poll closings in four more states.
4:50 pm
4:51 pm
4:52 pm
4:53 pm
we bridge the top of the hour. our characterizations when the polls close in four more states. part of why they call it super tuesday. to texas we go. in houston chris matthews standing by with a special guest. >> thank you. i'm here with the lieutenant governor of this state. you're with cruz, right? everybody thinks trump will do
4:54 pm
well tonight except here. >> cruz wins the nomination for this reason. he'll win texas tonight. he'll do well in the delegate count. rubio will be behind the delegates. winner take all states kick in. that's where this race has to get down to two people. if it stays four and five people in the race that's difficult. once it gets to two then ted cruz wins. our polling shows the majority, two out of three voters go to ted cruz. however, for all the establishment who wants ted out and trying to back rubio, 75% of cruz voters go to trump. it's the only person to defeat trump is ted cruz. >> why should your guy win the battle, the chicken battle. two trucks going down the road aiming at each over and you're saying rubio will pull off. why is he going to pull off with
4:55 pm
the money he's got behind him. ? >> money didn't help jeb bush. he's a great guy. >> rubio has nowhere else to go. he's given up his senate seat. he's got to stay in this race till the end. >> if he stays in the race till the end he helps nominate donald trump. >> he'll say you did that. he'll say cruz did it. >> i don't care who did it. we have to have ted cruz. he's the only real conservative in the race. >> will you as lieutenant governor back donald trump if he's nominated in. >> absolutely. >> absolutely. absolutely. >> let me tell you what. i'll take a capitalist over a socialist any time. you have to understand. >> this crowd is divided. you booed him for saying he'll go with trump. >> you said if ted cruz is not the nominee. you said if donald trump is the nominee every has to coalesce to
4:56 pm
beat hillary clinton. we can't take four more years. [ boo ] >> we know we have democrats in here. >> we didn't call them. let me ask you this -- >> these are not conservative republican texans. that's okay. >> the only requirement for these people is do you like ribs. >> and do you like liberals. >> a question i started with tonight. i think at the end of the night you'll part have to begin to choose between embracing trump and celebrating from trump. it's too late for someone else to win the nomination. >> it's not too late. if we get it down to two after tonight, ted cruz will beat donald trump head to head. >> where will he win tonight besides home? >> i don't know. >> you're his chairman.
4:57 pm
you ought to know. >> he'll do well in texas. >> why are you gesturing like bernie sanders? your hand in my face. >> the toughest thing for my mom who is watching. she's in skilled nursing. she was waiting to watching her son and she had to put up with bernie sanders. it's killing you mom, i know. >> thank you very much. >> thanks. good to have you. even with your liberal circus in down. >> glad everybody is getting along. sound like they might serve lone star beer. keep the lid on in houston. >> say the lieutenant governor is not in charge of the tourism board in texas. berating the people who are there. it's amazing. >> nicole wallace is back. they hear people say this race goes down to two. you said earlier, nobody gets
4:58 pm
out tonight. >> i don't think so. here's the problem with declaring anything about anything. nobody knows. we're all making it up as we wake up. the time where we grope for the phone early in the morning. that's what it's like to be a republican these days. we grope for the phone to see the latest twist and turn. i will say cruz has an argument, as does rubio to stay in this. trump is volatile enough where there's a scenario to go to the convention and rewrite rules and take their delegates. you look at the uproar tonight, trump had huge rallies today. i made the mistake of glancing at my twitter feed, they say why haven't you mentioned the huge rallies today. there you have it, he had huge rallies. can you imagine trying to take this from him. you want to see combustion.
4:59 pm
>> the party decides the own voters are wrong, the decision must be overridden. how do you ask for anybody's vote ever again? >> they're arguing there is a scenario where you go to the convention and try to -- >> everybody other than trump. that's their scenario. everybody. ha. >> your whole role was to just toss the grenade. >> ganging up on you now. >> we're on 7:59. >> about to have a bunch of poll closings. >> we're about to have a bunch of poll closings. we're talking about massachusetts. we're talking about alabama. we're talking about tennessee, and we're talking about oklahoma. usual rules apply. at the top of the hour in less than 30 seconds, we will pause. we will show you the states where the polls are closing, and we will get the results her
5:00 pm
medically sealed into this moment from our elections union calling these races in isolation without regard to other calls. here we are. we'll show you the polls closing at this hour. there they are. alabama, massachusetts, oklahoma and tennessee. it is now 8:00 on the east coast. we're able to make the following projections. let's bring them on the screen. in the state of massachusetts on the republican side, nbc news and msnbc are projecting when all the votes are counted donald trump will have won massachusetts. on the democratic side, too early to call. hillary clinton and bernie sanders vying for the lead. in alabama, down south, donald trump, the projected gop victor. on the democratic side we are projecting a victory by hillary
5:01 pm
clinton. up north in tennessee, donald trump, the projected victor on the republican side. again, for the democrats, hillary clinton the projected winner. to the middle west we go. oklahoma. on both sides of this, the democratic race and the republican race, too early to call. we have some intel, based on raw vote coming in, sanders is in the lead if we took a snapshot of oklahoma now. there you have it. >> both of those democratic rates where it's too early to call, in oklahoma and massachusetts, i believe we're characterizing both of those with sanders having a lead even though it's too early. in oklahoma, we've been hearing from the cruz campaign that they don't think they are just
5:02 pm
competing in texas. they think they have a tow hold in oklahoma and arkansas. obviously the front-runner's night, still. both on the republican side and the democratic side in terms of states that have got their projected winners. in terms of the states that we don't have calls in, the other candidates here who aren't front-runners are doing what they want to be doing. >> that's right. they have exhibits b and c now in the argument they wanted to make to their supporters. >> talking about trump crowds and trump supporters send you numbers. people lined up at 6:30 this morning for his events. the report is his crowds were giant and growing in enthusiasm. to keep the big focus on it, even if cruz and rubio nod strong seconds, they're still not winning these states. trump is still the dominant figure in the republican primary. >> he's already tonight won georgia and alabama and massachusetts and tennessee, and people are fighting it out for second.
5:03 pm
we'll see about the states that are too early or too close to call. he's winning. >> he's doing well. >> for a guy who said he didn't know the definition of ground game, just weeks ago, have would require a ground game. >> right. he has a ground game. he has momentum and he has intangibles and he has a message. it's not a message that we're accustomed to hearing. he gives it in way that we're not accustomed to hearing. he's connecting with people in way that others, frankly, just are not. >> i think we hear a scandal about the kkk and talk about it for three days, his supporters hear a stump speech focussed on other things. they're aware of a scandal they view as a media scandal but because it's not what they lined up at 6:30 to hear, he doesn't talk about those in his speech. they see that as how he has the forces stacked against him.
5:04 pm
if anything, they double down in their commitment to him. >> we'll be hearing from him in a press conference. he says he has a surprise. >> it's a surprise any way that on super tuesday we have a front running candidate who will not give any victory speech. he's doing a press conference. that's a surprise. he said he will have news to make at that press conference. we don't know what that will be. i want to bring chris matthews in from texas. we just got word on the republican side donald trump is the projected winner in alabama, massachusetts and tennessee. we're characterizing oklahoma as too early to call between him and ted cruz. what's your reaction? >> it seems like we're seeing the pattern of the situation the republican party in replica. you see the most conservatives in the state is probably going to be texas which probably will go for the home guy.
5:05 pm
we won't know until 9:00. on the other states the more moderate, virginia is going, he's fighting it out with rubio. the much more moderate state of massachusetts he's fighting it out with vermont with kasich. you see someone doing well in those categories. no one candidate taking him on across the board. only one candidate is able to appeal to hard conservatives, centrists and more moderate. you see it happening tonight. he will lose in a number of places, perhaps, but not to one person. >> we want to roll, show you the statewide board for the state of vermont. an hour ago, we came on and said it was too early to call on the gop side. we are changing the characterization to too close to
5:06 pm
call between donald trump and john kasich. this is obviously an interesting development for the kasich campaign as we've been discussing under pressure from unnamed people in washington to winnow down the republican field down by one. john kasich made the decision to spend a bit of time in vermont. >> his spending totals are fascinating heading into super tuesday. you get these pieces of information to find out who spent what where. john kasich's ad spending doesn't look like a republican contender, but if he's won of the few people who pulls out a win tonight not named donald trump, that will be vindicated a bit. there's another thing i want to explain about the logistics. texas is the big kahuna in terms of delegates. texas is really big, so much so it's got a couple of time zones.
5:07 pm
most of texas has stopped voting at this point. the el paso part of texas that's still going to be open there. they're still going to be voting until 9:00. there's an interesting thing you see in the lower third that you may start to see over the course of this hour some vote totals come in from texas. you may get a lot of vote total come in from texas because so much of the vote is expected to be early vote. that is the sort of number that we could start to get from the secretary of state's office in that state even though there are still some polls in the western part of texas that are still open. don't be confused about that. all polls in texas will close at the top of this next hour, 9:00 eastern. if you're in the el paso region and you haven't voted yet, don't worry, your polls are still open. >> that would include my brother who lives in el paso. steve is at the large board with more on the trump southern swing tonight. >> we're looking at some big trump wins in the deep south. the scale of the victories could be bigger than they appear.
5:08 pm
tonight isn't just about winning states. it's about winning delegates. take a look at georgia now. trump is the projected winner. this thing is a land slide. a couple of things to take a look at here. trump near 50%. if he could get to 50% in georgia, he will win all the statewide delegates that are up for grabs in georgia tonight. that's 34-statewide delegates. that's about half the pool. if you look in other states, they have similar rules. in georgia there's a chance for trump if they don't clear 20% to clean up. in alabama, there's a chance for him to win every delegate that's up for grabs here. the exit polls are suggesting for rubio and cruz, getting to 20% is going to be a challenge tonight in alabama. if they don't get to 20% statewide and don't get to 20% in a congressional district, they don't get think delegates. donald trump could win the whole
5:09 pm
thing there. donald trump will have a harder time winner take offer there. get a chunk of the statewide delegates. you got to hit 20%. the exit poll is telling us cruz and rubio are going to have trouble getting 20%. they could, but it's going to be close. the other one to keep an eye on tonight is texas. the returns aren't in yet. rubio needs to get 20% statewide to get delegates. another story to look at tonight. >> thanks. to florida we go. tonight's clinton headquarters is at stage one at the ice palace film studios in miami. kristen welker is covering for us. >> good evening. i've been talking to clinton campaign officials. they tell me she's very pleased by these early returns. so far her southern firewall is holding. she's getting a lolt spovrt among african-americans like we saw. this south carolina, the question is will she pick off some of these states that have
5:10 pm
been competitive with bernie sanders like massachusetts and oklahoma. right now too early to call. the campaign tells me regardless of what happens tonight, no matter how strong a showing secretary clinton has, they won't be able to put this race out of reach. instead, they say they have the chance to do that on march 15th. that's when florida votes. that's why she's holding her watch party here in florida in the sunshine state. her supporters energized tonight. they have been erupting into cheers. the candidate has been turning her sights to the general election increasingly. if she were to face off against donald trump in a general election, she would focus on drawing sharp distinctions with him pointing all those controversial comments he's made, his controversial policies like building wall. one top democrat telling me she shouldn't get down into the mud with him and shouldn't engage in
5:11 pm
personal attacks unless he attacks her personally. then she should be prepared. another democrat saying that democrats are nervous about trump while he energizes the base, he could also bring a lot of new voters into the fold. we're waiting on secretary clinton here tonight. what i anticipate will be a rousing speech. >> democrats should worry about donald trump heading into the general election season. a break for us. then we'll come back and a reminder at the bottom of this hour, we have another closing in the state of arkansas.
5:12 pm
5:13 pm
my name is jamir dixon and i'm a locate and mark fieldman for pg&e. most people in the community recognize the blue trucks as pg&e. my truck is something new... it's an 811 truck. when you call 811, i come out to your house and i mark out our gas lines and our electric lines to make sure that you don't hit them when you're digging. 811 is a free service. i'm passionate about it because every time i go on the street
5:14 pm
i think about my own kids. they're the reason that i want to protect our community and our environment, and if me driving a that truck means that somebody gets to go home safer, then i'll drive it every day of the week. together, we're building a better california. welcome back on super
5:15 pm
tuesday. 15 minutes from now we'll have another closing. we already had a number of closings. we also have some too close to call states simmering along. we bring in steve at the board. >> take a look on the democratic side here. a couple of interesting numbers that explain why massachusetts and oklahoma are the too close wins at this hour. we're also asking do you consider this candidate honest and trustworthy. do you consider this candidate honest and trustworthy. when the gap is sanders plus 20 or more, that usually indicates that sanders is ahead or winning states. you see in oklahoma it's right at that 20 line. in massachusetts it's a 30-point difference. you get down to tennessee, it gets closer. you get down to alabama where clinton is winning in land slide and she's ahead on that honest question. that's one of those indicators we have been seeing. very quickly here, that is not how you do this?
5:16 pm
wait a minute. i'll show you the other one later. again, that's one of the i understand ci understand cay tors. >> that's fine. this is why we can't have nice things. >> your reaction to what we just learned. >> this honest and trustworthy question for many, many reasons is one that has dogged hillary clint clinton. it's clear she hasn't solved it to see how well sanders will do. that's got to be, in a sense, at the core of the problems, whatever problems he has. admittedly, she may not have a huge problem with democrats. >> that's what trump will pick apart. >> if she gets the nomination, it will be an election. that is a sign post.
5:17 pm
that's a big flashing arrow for republicans how to go after her. >> we know he watches a lot of news. we know that he is already honing in on that. at his rally today, i'm told he had 15,000 people there. one of the big applause lines is he said how he will be relentless at her e-mails. >> it's one thing to have somebody like bernie sanders going after hillary clinton on honest and trustworthy. it's another thing to have donald trump going after her. the pot kettle phenomenon. >> his whole base of support is being a non-politician and you're an honest and trustworthy person. >> he's going to be taken apart on that front. >> i think the hillary clinton campaign, hillary clinton understands his political assets and they include this appeal of the non-politician. >> the outsider who can't be bought because he's already a
5:18 pm
millionaire. another break for us. civil rights era icon and member of congress john louis along other guests. we're inside of 13 minutes to the next closing in arkansas.
5:19 pm
5:20 pm
5:21 pm
we want to update you on the situation in oklahoma.
5:22 pm
6% of the raw vote in. our call is too early to call. you see the two candidates on that graphic. donald trump and ted cruz. chuck todd has joined us at the big boy table. fascinating state. >> for oklahoma, if cruz can get a second win, themarco hoping t virginia comes through for him so he can notch his first victory. i still think the overall impression is what. even when cruz is fighting for first place somewhere. who is he fighting with? trump. meanwhile trump is dominating in the deep south. i'm finding another interesting split. a third of the electorate wants change. donald trump dominates change. cruz and rubio both win on values.
5:23 pm
sort of back and forth with trump a distant third. republican voters that care about values. there's not enough of them. trump is winning this change voter by such a large margin. i looked in the georgia, tennessee and alabama, he's just killing it. that's why he's going to have the delegate lead by a lot tomorrow morning. >> visual accumulation of trump, trump. red across the board. >> when you call at poll close that means double digit victory. that's a lot more delegates. >> when we call it at poll close that means the preponderance of the evidence. another break. when we come back, we'll bridge the bottom of the hour. we'll learn poll closing characterization in arkansas on this super tuesday night.
5:24 pm
5:25 pm
5:26 pm
5:27 pm
we're back. we're carefully watching the clock until our next closing in arkansas. we welcomed steve schmitz back. >> cruz and rubio have not been winning often and have been competing for second. competing for third place. they say that's enough of a rationale to continue on till the end. just another dominating performance. >> every called race is donald trump. the uncalled races in vermont it's kasich and trump. in virginia it's rubio and
5:28 pm
trump. >> the point that chris matthews made was right. the other three, each has his own little race but trump is everywhere. nobody is consolidating. who's in contention besides trump in like two races? >> we're two minutes away from the poll closings in arkansas. ted cruz has out spent everybody else in arkansas. rick tyler said tonight on our air that cruz may win arkansas. trump has sarah huckabee who was mike huckabee's daughter and campaign manager. there's been almost no polling at all on the republican side in arkansas. we have no numbers to guide us. we're about a minute and a half out from the polls closing. >> also wanted to record keep on the democratic side. we've been given a heads up from miami that we'll see hillary clinton within the next 15 minutes at that space right there. the crowd has been gathered and
5:29 pm
packed in there. around 8:45 eastern time. we have a rare bottom of the hour, half hour poll closing coming up here in one minute in the state of arkansas. we've been talking about our too close to call states. we've been talking about oklahoma where on the gop side we have trump and cruz in our graphic and too early to call in just about every other instance. a sea of red graphics saying trump, the victor especially in these southern states. here we are, half minute to go. you'll see the graphic saying the polls are closing across the state of arkansas. 8:30 eastern time and then we will have our characterization of what's happening there. arkansas former home state of
5:30 pm
hillary clinton when her husband bill was governor of arkansas and before that bill clinton an arkansas native. here we go. we're five, four seconds away from the polls closing in arkansas. it's now 8:30 eastern time. we can report the following projection from the election desk at nbc news and msnbc. on the democrat side, you see there hillary clinton is being awarded the state of arkansas when all votes are counting. on the gop side, this is the interesting race. too close to call, but you see the two candidates there. donald trump and ted cruz. >> interesting. marco rubio has the endorsement of the arkansas governor but ted cruz clearly knew he was onto
5:31 pm
something with arkansas. he spent a lot of money there. his campaign indicated they thought hay hthey had a real ch there. they have been trying to keep expectations confined to texas where they were guaranteed a win. this is another one of those states where there is no victor to proclaim at this hour, but it's donald trump and somebody else who are this contention for that top spot. >> chris christie, i believe, accompanied donald trump to an event there right after he gave his endorsement. clearly, that's going to be a slug fest tonight as they count votes in arkansas. >> no doubt about it. you look at ted cruz tonight, if he come out with a couple of wins adding it to iowa, marco rubio, say doesn't have a couple of wins. the rationale gets more and more difficult. marco rubio becomes a favorite
5:32 pm
sun candidate in the state of florida. a key state in the general election. ted cruz needs to have happen to have any chance here is to make this an ideological right where he can run to his right. >> that's kind of what he's been trying to do. he highlights ideology at every campaign stop that i'm the real conservative. he's not. the problem is the republican base, a lot of republican base doesn't buy that. a lot of republican base does not consist of ideological conservatives. >> it's almost impossible for him to do that in the context of a three, four, five, six, seven person race. >> let's bring into the conversation john louis. he's endorsed hillary clinton. congressman louis, as always,
5:33 pm
honor to talk to you. thank you for being with us. you must be happy about secretary clinton's win in your home state this evening? >> thank you very much. i'm so happy and very pleased that she's winning and she's winning big. i believe he's on her way to become the democratic nominee. >> the congressional black caucus pac made its endorsement. you said at the press conference announcing that endorsement that in your years as a civil rights leader you had met hillary clinton but you had never seen bernie sanders despite his own involvement at the university of chicago, that he's not somebody owe had ever come across in the movement. do you feel that senator sanders has oversold his civil rights background in trying to make his
5:34 pm
case to democratic voters? >> no. i'm not going to suggest that senator sanders oversold or tried to oversell himself. i did hear an ad on the radio in atlanta today that he said that he marched with martin luther king jr. for civil rights and maybe he did during the march on washington. during the '60s, i did not see him. i admire what he's doing. he's a colleague in the senate. i served with him in the house. i think it's time, the time is right, the time is ready for hillary clinton to be the next president of the united states. >> chris matthews is in texas. he has a question for you. chris, go ahead. >> congressman, when people in the african-american community are asked do you trust hillary clinton, do you like her
5:35 pm
experience? i wonder if those words mean different things to people in your community. trust, experience, is it about her civil rights vis-a-vis. i'm wondering if there's a different meaning because i'm seeing different results? >> mrs. clinton is well known in african-american communities. in south carolina, in georgia, in alabama and mississippi and arkansas, 11 states from virginia to texas, they trust her. you heard so many black women saying over and over again this is her time. they believe in her. they trust her to do the right thing, to stand up and fight for them and fight for their children. >> in your home state of georgia, there's been two projected winners. obviously, secretary clinton on the democrat side. donald trump is the projected winner on the republican side.
5:36 pm
your home state constituents have made a split decision tonight. i have to ask for your reaction to mr. trump winning your state, particularly, in light of some of the civil rights controversies that have started to dog him not only his comments about mexican immigrants and immigrants in general, but specifically this week the way he sort of bobbled the question of what he should do with the enthusiasm for his group of white supremacy groups? >> in this region, we've come so far. we made so much progress. we don't want to stand still. we don't want to go back. we want people to lead that can bring us together and not divide people. here in georgia we recognize the fight that we're one people, we're one family.
5:37 pm
we all live in the same house. not just the georgia house, but the american house. it doesn't matter whether we're plaq black, white, latino, we believe we're one people. >> in term of mr. trump's success tonight, do you think that mr. trump is a qualitative different kind of republican on those kinds of sufficienissues see him as a typical republican candidate? >> i don't see him as in keeping with some of the republican leaders that have emerged in the recent past. it is repugnant to suggest that you're going to keep certain individuals out of our country or that you'll build walls. who are you trying to keep in and who are you trying to keep out? >> congressman john louis of georgia who has endorsed hillary
5:38 pm
clinton this year. it's always an honor to talk with you. thank you for giving us your time. >> thank you so much. >> thank you. >> at this point we'll take a break in our coverage. when we come back we'll show you some of what john kasich is saying to a crowd tonight. also, in the deep south, jackson, mississippi as the man who is billing himself as the civility in common sense candidate. the governor of ohio continues on through tonight. we'll be back right after this.
5:39 pm
5:40 pm
5:41 pm
5:42 pm
we have an update on a critical race here. in massachusetts for the democrats, we've changed our characterization because we've gone from too early to call, as we labeled it at poll closing to too close to call between hillary clinton and bernie sanders. >> look at how close those numbers are. those vote totals are very, very, very close. >> on the democratic side. that is very close indeed. a reminder, with minutes to go until the top of the hour, we're coming up on colorado and minnesota caucuses and the numbers from texas and a characterization there as of poll closing. steve standing by at the big board. >> virginia is one of other stories right now. again, this is the one that marco rubio would dearly love to win.
5:43 pm
83%. you see rubio can close but he's 40,000 votes behind you say that might be a lot of votes, why hasn't that been called yet. we identified this area where you see green right outside of washington, d.c. huge population area. a lot of moderates and college graduates. why this is waiting is people want to see, this is the big county right here. fairfax. this is the biggest share of vote in the state. you see rubio with 7,000 votes ahead of donald trump. this is about with one-third of the vote counted in this county. right next door is arlington county. that's only about half in. these are big rubio areas. the question is will he get enough vote out of these parts of virginia to make up that 40,000. you would do the math now and say looks like he might be a little short when you get out of here. you look at the rest of the state and what's to come in. you see a lot of trump yellow. it looks like this is going to tighten. it's hard to see right now marco rubio over taking donald trump in the state.
5:44 pm
one of the reasons trump did well down here by virginia beach. delegate wise it almost doesn't matter. they'll get about the same out of this. if cruz wins texas, if cruz wins oklahoma or arkansas and rubio can't put a win on the board today, psychological that could be very significant. >> we have a mixture of trump blocking votes and pro-rubio rubio votes. many of which were decided in the last week. >> the other story in virginia is that one again we have ted cruz running the campaign that was trying to lock up evangelical voters, he's running third, specifically, with evangelical voters in virginia in terms of our exit poll. even if deted cruz is delightedy marco rubio not pulling out a win there, this idea he's the evangelical's vote, if he comes this third, that will be very hard for ted cruz to explain. >> you have a member of the republican electorate sitting alongside you.
5:45 pm
>> we should foreshadow about what we're about to get. minnesota and colorado are both going to be doing caucuses tonight. it's super weird. minnesota has a caucus. caucuses are always weird. minnesota has a caucus for both parties. colorado has a caucus for the democrats. in colorado they have having a reason caucus but not counting any votes because they don't want to bind any of their delegates to have to vote for the republican colorado winner at the national convention. colorado is having no republican contest this year. they tried to get it together and have a primary instead. they couldn't get that together either. the portion of texas that will close at 9:00 is the last western part of the state, el paso, western texas will be the final poll closing in texas. that's when we will get in a tide of numbers from that state. we're about to get a lot of weird information and a lot of information out of texas.
5:46 pm
>> we talked about ted cruz earlier. the foundation of his campaign is he would win e vevangelicals. i think that case is collapsing tonight. >> interesting that trump win in massachusetts. not a southern state which is sort of the base of the republican party. not a place that you associated with staunch conservatives.
5:47 pm
we called it close. >> before the early states voted and before iowa and new hampshire, it was weird that donald trump kept holding these rallies. he kept holeholding the rallies turning out really large numbers. everybody sort of explaining that by saying it's just over the border for new hampshire. he's trying to get people on their way home from work. it didn't make any sense. it's now clear he was locking in some of the vote for later states because it was going to pay off on nights like this. >> you look at the dominating victory that donald trump has in new hampshire. you look at the dominating victory that bernie sanders had. the loss of momentum in south carolina and now in the neighboring state of massachusetts, hillary clinton is right there despite her loss in new hampshire not too long to go. >> coming up on the last quarter hour before we learn the
5:48 pm
characterization this texas. largest prize of the evening. chris matthews in position when we go to home. another break. we'll be back right after this. we're thot goinot going to brea all. donald trump is our projected winner in virginia. we were just talking about that. >> this is a very big deal for the marco rubio campaign. >> this is a very big deal for the marco rubio campaign. rubio has made a joe nameth-esque pledge to win florida. this puts another big victory in the domnald trump category. >> marco rubio is thought to be
5:49 pm
trying very hard. we're going to have the minnesota caucus result in about 11 minutes. >> the other side of this is another donald trump victory. >> no doubt. virginia is a key state. he's a young man. he's got a lot of track ahead of him. he has to think about the scenario in a contested florida primary.
5:50 pm
most republican thom knees don't win the prize the first time around the track. having the stigma of having lost your home state will be damaging. this is an important calculation. >> also got be a soul searching moment for the republican establishment that's been trying to coalesce around him. if they pick him when their voters say 0-15 when they've had the chance to vote for marco rubio, that's got to be reality check moment for the republican establishment trying to will him into existence as an electable republican nominee. >> especially we know his push on northern virginia was not enough. we were going to break. we're going to go to that break. we'll bridge the top of the hour including the texas characterization as the polls close in the biggest state of super tuesday.
5:51 pm
5:52 pm
hillary clinton has taken the podium in miami to talk to her supporters. fair warning to all those with us. we will duck out of this event to bring you the texas numbers at the top of the 9:00 hour. here for now, is former secretary of state hillary clinton.
5:53 pm
>> you know all across our country today, democrats voted to break down barriers so we can all rise together. i am so delighted to be here with you in florida. i congratulate senator sanders on his strong showing and campaigning. i'm grateful to all of you who voted for me, to the volunteers and organizers. i know you worked your hearts out. to all my friends, many of a lifetime who traveled to all the states to tell people about the candidate they knew and the hundreds of thousands of people who went to hillary clinton.com to give what they could. most less than $100. now this campaign moves forward
5:54 pm
to the crescent city, motor city and beyond. we're going to work for every vote, and we will need all of you to keep volunteering, contributing, doing everything you can, talking to your friends and neighbors because this country belongs to all of us not just those at the top. not just the people who look one way, worship one way or even think one way. america is strong when we're all strong. we know we've got work to do. that work, that work is not to make america great again. america never stopped being
5:55 pm
great. we have to make america whole. we have to fill in what's been hallowed out. >> usa, usa, usa, usa. >> we have to make strong the broken place, restitch the bonds of trust and respect across our country. now, it might be unusual, as i've said before, for a presidential candidate to say this, but i'm going to keep saying it. i believe what we need in america today is more love and kindness. you know what, it works.
5:56 pm
instead of building walls, we're going to break down barriers and build ladders of opportunity and empowerment so every american can live up to his or her potential because then and only then can america live up to its full potential too. it's clear tonight that the stakes in this election have never been higher, and the rhetoric we're hearing on the other side has never been lower. trying to divide america between us and then is wrong, and we're not going to let it work.
5:57 pm
whether we like it or not, we're all in this together my friends. we all have to do our part. unfortunately, too many of those with the most wealth and the most power in this country today seem to have forgotten that basic truth about america. yesterday i was at the old south meeting house in boston where nearly two and a half centuries ago american patriots organized the original tea party. i had to wonder what they would make of corporations that seem to have absolutely no loyalty to the country that gave them so much. what would they say about student loan companies that overcharge young people, struggling to get out of debt, even young men and women serving our country in the military or
5:58 pm
corporations that shift their headquarters overseas to avoid paying their fair share of taxes. like johnson controls and auto parts from wisconsin, that we taxpayers helped to bail out with the auto rescue back in 2008, now they're turning their back on america. i'm interested this making things right. let there be no doubt, if you cheat your employees, exploit consumers, pollute our environment or rip off the taxpayers, we're going to hold you accountable. but if you do the right thing, if you invest in your workers
5:59 pm
and in america's future, then we'll stand with you. we all need to work together to break down the barriers holding back our families and our country. the middle class needs a raise. add more good jobs, jobs that pay enough for a family to live on. even put a little away for retirement. jobs that provide dignity and a bright future. that's wie we hahy we have to i manufacturing and business infrastructure. enough clean energy for every home in america. don't let anybody tell you we can't make things this america anymore because we can, we are
6:00 pm
and we will. together we can break down the barriers that face working class families across network especially in struggling rust belt communities and small towns that have been hallowed out by lost jobs and lost hope. families who for generations kept our lights on and our factories running. >> we interrupt hillary clinton's speech in miami to bring you the projection we have been waiting for all night. that is from the state of texas where senator ted cruz, texas senator ted cruz has won his home state. considered a all night tonight and for days prior essential to his campaign effort continuing. to the right, as you might have seen, hillary clinton won wonders. if she will learn while giving the speech she's just been awarded texas. projected winner in the state of texas. we're going to go back in to
6:01 pm
hillary clinton and resume coverage of her remarks to her supporters. we can break down barriers for family who is have seen too many black children harassed, humiliated and even killed. we can break down barriers for voters in north carolina who have been systemically disenfranchised. we can wrabreak down barriers f hard working immigrants who are too often exploited and intimidated. we have to defend all our rights, workers rights and womens rights, civil rights and voting rights, lgbt rights and
6:02 pm
rights for people with disabilities. that starl starts by standing w president obama when he nominates a strong, progressive justice to the supreme court. i know, i know too many americans have lost faith in our future. we hear it in the voices of parents who don't know how they're going to give their kids the opportunities they deserve. we see it in the eyes of working men and women who don't expect anything to come easy, but wonder why it has to be quite so hard. like many of you, i find strength and purpose in the values i learn frd my famied fr and my faith. they gave me simple words to live by. do all the good you can for all the people you can for as long
6:03 pm
as you can. that is why i believe, deeply, that if we resist the forces trying to drive us apart, we can come together to make this country work for every one. the struggling, the striving and the successful. if we all do our part we can restore our common faith in our common future. that's the spirit powering this campaign. it comes from the young janitor in arkansas who stopped buying junk food and put off getting a haircut so he could contribute to it. it comes from the disabled combat veteran from nebraska who sent in $10. in 70 years of his life he never donated to a political campaign until now. you can join us too. go to hillaryclinton.com. make a donation.
6:04 pm
text, join to 47246. let me leave you with a story that's inspired so many of us. by now we all know what happened in flint, michigan, don't we? our cities children were poisoned by toxic water because the governor wanted to save a little money. there's another story in flint. it's a story of a community that's been knocked down, but refused to be knocked out. it is hundreds of union plumbers coming from across the country to help install new water fixtures. it's students raising funds for water deliveries and showing up to distribute supplies. it's the united auto workers and general motors donating millions of dollars to help. when i visited flint a few weeks ago, i went to the house of prayer missionary baptist church. the congregation locked arms and
6:05 pm
sang. we've come too far from where we starred from p they're not about to quit now. we know there are many other flints out there. communities that are hurting and need help. we've come too far in this country to let us turn back. we're going to build on the progress that we've made. we save the auto industry thanks to president obama. now we've got to create new jobs and industries of the future. we now ensured 90% of americans thanks to president obama. now we have to finish the job and get to 100%. we have come too far to stop now. we've got to keep going. keep working. keep breaking down those barriers and imagine what we can build together when each and
6:06 pm
every american has the chance to live up to his or her own god given potential. thank you all so very much. thank you. >> a spirited end to her speech after multiple victories and invoking president obama there at the end. hillary clinton has concluded her remarks in miami. we're going to go across town to the ronald reagan equestrian center. marco rubio has started his remarks. what we're going to do is rerack to show you how he started just a few moments ago.
6:07 pm
>> thank you. thank you. thank you. thank you. thank you. thank you. i think you've heard this before from someone else, but i want to say it. i love you miami. thank you. it's great to be home. it's great to be home. we're so excited to be home and so excited about what lies ahead for america. we're so excited about what lies ahead for our campaign. you see just five days ago, we
6:08 pm
began to unmask the true nature of the front-runner so far in this race. five days ago, we began to explain to the american people that donald trump is a con artist. in just five days, we have seen the impact it's having all across the country. we are seeing in state after state, he loves to talk about polls, we are seeing in state after state his numbers coming down. our numbers going up. two weeks from tonight, right here in florida, we are going to send a message loud and clear. we're going to send the message that the party of lincoln and reagan and the presidency of the united states will never be held
6:09 pm
by a con artist. of all the places in america and i have traveled this country and there's to place in america that understands the american dream better than this community and this great state of florida. like our country, this is a police built by people who always work hard for a better life. here in this community, we have all been shaped and raised by people that know how special america is because they know what life is like outside of america.
6:10 pm
by millions of people who lost their homeland, by millions of people that lost their future, but thank god they found this great country where anything is possible. where every one can go as far as their talent and work will take them. we know that the things that make america special were not an accident. they did not happen on their own. they happened because for over 200 years, each generation of americans did what they needed to do to leave their children better off than themselves. i know of no place in america that understands that better than we do here. for every single one of us here is a generation removed from someone who made our future the purpose of their lives. only in america would that have been possible. that american dream -- >> we interrupt marco rubio to
6:11 pm
bring you call in oklahoma. for the first time tonight we're able to project a winner republican side of the primary tonight. ted cruz extends his reach beyond just his home state of texas. exactly what our gop analysts have been saying could give him campaign another shot against a formidable wave tonight of red on the part of donald trump. chalk oklahoma up as a ted cruz state tonight. rachel, there you have it. >> that is ted cruz out performing national expectations. the cruz campaign said they had a shot in oklahoma and arkansas. they're savvy enough to not have done that without some basis for that speculation. even still this will be seen as ted cruz doing better than people kexpected him to tonight. right now the nbc
6:12 pm
characterization in arkansas, 15% of the vote in is that's too close to call between donald trump and marco rubio. ted cruz is not far behind there though in arkansas. it will be very interesting the see if that could be in play as well. again, the arkansas race is not called. ted cruz said he has confident there as well. marco rubio's campaign polling is one thing, expectations are something that people spin. the marco rubio campaign had suggested they had a shot in virginia and other people thought they might have a shot in the minnesota caucuses. caucuses are basically not polled. if they are, the polls don't mean anything. it's hard to project what's going to happen there. we have the polls closed in minnesota. we don't have results to give you yet in terms of what the result will be. that may be the last place that marco rubio is holding onto tonight. >> we have hallie jackson at cruz headquarters tonight.
6:13 pm
>> senator cruz is backstage at this watch party. he cheering the results in oklaho oklahoma. obviously very excited about winning texas. the campaign did expect that to happen. i spoke with the campaign who said at this point, the combination of cruz winning texas, oklahoma now. rubio failing to win virginia, the reality is that, and i'm quoting here for other candidates moving forward is like the camel passing through the eye of the needle. cruz's campaign putting heavy pressure on other candidates to get out of the way, get out of this race and allow cruz to coalesce and what he wants to be a two-man race. you heard that speech from marco rubio. he's very much in the mix or he wants to be. while it's a three-man race, it does appear that trump is able to bring together the number of conservatives across a variety of spectrums. here is the significance about oklahoma. it's the first closed republican primary. meaning you have to be a registered republican. the cruz campaign that's
6:14 pm
significant. they feel that donald trump is peeling off more moderates, more liberals and some democrats crossing over. oklahoma is a sign of the true conservative base really wants. >> allow me to interrupt you. speaking of oklahoma. we have a second call on the democratic side. bernie sanders has extended his reach tonight. the winner of the democratic oklahoma primary. the state went late. 9:14 eastern time. 52% to 41% with about half of the vote in. >> the sanders campaign said they would win five states tonight. his home state, vermont. they did that. minnesota and colorado we still don't know. >> almost not reportable. >> the other two primaries they said they would win were oklahoma and massachusetts. at this point we do not have a result in massachusetts. i'm just checking our up to the minute results there. it's still considered too close to call in massachusetts.
6:15 pm
>> eventful couple of minutes here. we'll go to a break. if anything else comes in, we'll come out of that break. our live coverage will continue after this.
6:16 pm
6:17 pm
billions are spent to confuse and, dare i say it, flummox the american public. "save 16% on car insurance." "switch now..." well at compare.com, we say enough's enough. so we've created this mind boggling facility. where we're constantly scrutinizing millions of rates... answering the question: who has the lowest. go to compare.com, plug in some simple info and get up to 50 free quotes. choose the lowest, and hit purchase. it's fast and easy. compare.com saving humanity from high insurance rates.
6:18 pm
welcome back. 18 minutes past 9:00. one of the outstanding races is the arkansas republican primary which nbc is saying is too close to call. that becomes very important because it's one of the places where ted cruz is in the mix. marco rubio hasn't won anywhere yet. let's go to steve for a little insight of what's happening.
6:19 pm
>> take a look at arkansas here. one thing we want to focus on is evangelicals. it looks like arkansas will have the largest share of evangelical voters of any state. arkansas and oklahoma very close for first place. you see among white evangelicals cruz a one-point lead over trump. rubio running slightly behind them. this is a very tougher win to make sense. we had to look at the results as they come in. another thing to keep your mind on here is the delegate situation. the thresholds in arkansas is 15% to start getting the state wild delegates. the one thing that looks here is all the candidates will be sharing the statewide delegates. >> it's bragging rights this terms of who wins. >> there are the congressional district delegates too. it won't be too lop sisided.
6:20 pm
>> we just watched the rubio speech. we know they're thrust will be let us win florida as promised. let's go to gabe covering the rubio campaign in miami. gabe. >> it was early. the speech was quick. his campaign said they were very encouraged by the early results out of virginia. they're looking to those unpredictable caucuses this minnesota. this is a very tough night for marco rubio in the sense he's not yet claimed any victory. that could be a good argument for the cruz campaign who has won in texas and oklahoma.
6:21 pm
the rubio camp spent part of the day on conference calls to donors. over the last few days rubio has gone after donald trump with renewed vigor even launching personal assaults at trump. now what he seemed to set up is this battle for florida on march 15th. even though he's behind in one poll by double digits and behind by a wide margin behind trump. his campaign feels they can end up doing well here in florida. again, very difficult time here for the rubio campaign in the sense his momentum, they thought they could pull out a victory in virginia, now the question is can they pull out any victory
6:22 pm
perhaps in minnesota. they do hope to pull tolgt delegates here by tend of the night. the question is that coupled with ted cruz's victories in texas and oklahoma, whether that could convince his donors and supporters he's the best one. >> just a quick follow up question. is the rubio campaign mentioning any other state tonight whether they might conceivably have a shot? we have a naurm of states unsettled including arkansas whether mr. rubio is not out of mix. i know you mentioned minnesota. are they looking at the colorado caucuses. is there any place elsewhere they think they might be in competition. >> the rubio campaign has been trying to mansiage expectations this whole time.
6:23 pm
they have been saying because there were long lines in some of the districts they hope to do well in, they looking to high hopes with minnesota. a lot of critics point to marco rubio not winning any states at all. he's not the one that should be the anti-trump in this republican field. the rubio campaign not pointing to any sperveg state. >> to the lone star state we go. chris matthews standing by. >> we have chris hayes here. you have been patiently waiting for this moment. >> it was an amazing moment that was the perfect frame work for the whole election in which everyone was hoping the inside the beltway counties in virginia would push marco rubio over the
6:24 pm
edge. look at the map, all of virginia has gone for trump and in some ways that his actual base. marco rubio's base is the beltway accomplishment. we are seeing time and time again with cruz, there isn't a very big constituency in the republican party for marco rubio that matches him in the political consultant and pundit class that's been rooting him on. >> you've got texas. you've got arkansas. you got oklahoma. that area he's doing well. maybe not arkansas. >> a little bit of a proximity fact.
6:25 pm
there's a natural constituency for cruz. if anyone has an argument they should be left standing mano a mano against donald trump, it's not marco rubio. >> it was soft and being loved and nice. it's about the lack of loyalty of corporations that take their money overseas. i thought it was a nuanced way of saying i'm not trump. >> fascinating to watch her work this theme out. love, kindness. the kinds of things i think she's been counselled against and away from before. >> don't be too feminine. >> right. the 3:00 a.m. this is her recognizing if she's in an election against trump, it will be an election which she'll doct
6:26 pm
to lean into the contrast. there's nothing more anti-trump than talking about love and kindness. >> i also liked her tactic. she didn't stick to it. it's not about voice. it's about dealing with applause. i thought for three quarters of the speech she had the wonderful back and forth. she lets them applaud and then she speaks. didn't fight the applause. at the end she did, maybe she got carried away. let them have their moment. don't fight it. it can matter. >> elections are call and response. it's like stand up comics. they go to clubs, work the material out and see what gets laughs. the longer you do this, the more you figure out what are messages. we have seen trump doing it effectively and hillary clinton get much better. >> you understand from our religion, it's a back and forth. it's an anthem thing. chris hayes waiting to stay that
6:27 pm
powerful stuff. back to you. >> help a brother out. fedex some pulled pork. another break for us. our coverage continues at the bottom of the 9:00 hour.
6:28 pm
6:29 pm
6:30 pm
6:31 pm
this is the ornate ballroom. this is a private home built by marjorie merryweather post of the post food and general foods portion. married briefly to e.f. hutton and when he spoke, people listened. it was bought by donald trump for $5 million. 58 bedrooms inside this structure. it's his florida headquarters. he would love this to be the southern white house. he's holding what we believe will be a white house style press conference as opposed to a speech of some sort tonight. we want to say hi to major garrett standing there. we'll go to this event as soon as it starts. we want to update you on the states still in play. let's begin in arkansas.
6:32 pm
the gop race, you see there, too close to call. trump, rubio at the top. moving to our right and all the way to new england in vermont, the gop race there. trump, kasich, too close to call. moving to the right and a little bit to the south of vermont to massachusetts. democratic primary, hotly contested and much more money was spent here than either camp anticipated. clinton, sanders, too close to call. down one. democratic caucus, big asterisks, minnesota, too early to call. let's scoot you to the left a little bit. gop caucus, minnesota, huge asterisks because of the way the caucuses are run. too early to call. trump-rubio. the democratic caucus in colorado, too early to call.
6:33 pm
clinton-sanders. that's the big board at this hour. top of the next hour, unless we're in the middle of a trump event, which is likely, we're going to do the uber boards. all the calls to catch people up who may have come home from work or school joining us and want to know who is winning what. >> we heard some reporting earlier tonight, she said not only is donald trump going to be giving this press conference instead of any sort of speech, but there will be some news made at the press conference. we don't know for sure if that's the case or just trying to get people excited because they want people to pay attention to it because maybe we couldn't cover a press conference the way we would cover a speech. there was earlier reporting there was some news to make. >> got to hand it to him for home field advantage. few of us have a ballroom in the house, but if you have one, great backdrop. >> such tasteful and subtle
6:34 pm
lighting. >> it looks like it's place where there's maybe ice skaters on the other side right out of camera frame. like maybe ice skaters or chocolate fountain. >> fancy. >> how could there not be a chocolate fountain. >> you're the only one that has been there. >> no, i haven't. >> you're trying to convince us. >> we drove by once with both kids. >> someday if we play our cards right, we'll never go there. >> waiting for major garrett to sit down. we're -- control room. wow. crickets. >> i have a thing i would like to talk about. >> we're looking for things. >> which is arkansas. the republican primary in arkansas, i want to be clear here. we've only got just over one fifth of the vote in. it's only 22% in. the ted cruz campaign said
6:35 pm
tonight that they could win arkansas. right now ted cruz is running third in the results we have thus far out of arkansas. it's close. donald trump is 34%. marco rubio is 26. i don't understand why nobody polled. it's pollable. is it conceivable -- >> it's that time of the night. we sat here after the iowa caucuses that the only way to beat trump and to take him on and the polls to reflect his dominance is for the republican race to turn into a two-man race. >> whose theory was that?
6:36 pm
>> people much smarter than me. people nodded their head and said that would be good. the kasich campaign said when we get him one-on-one, we'll get him. it's not happening. there's still six people running. it doesn't matter. as long as there are four of them competing for the anti-trump vote, they guarantee his success. >> if you could wave a magic wand and designate one, who would it be, and would they win in. >> donald trump in national polling in some polls he has more support nation wide than all the other candidates combined. >> right. i think this notion that any of them are viable while all of them are in is a falsehood. >> even if there was only one left in, would that bern automatically beat donald trump in i think the answer is no. >> we'll never know if it would have happened. what keeps happen in the
quote
6:37 pm
republican race -- i'm sorry. news. >> look who's going to introduce. >> you summoned him with your voice. >> the wind is important for our country. tonight donald trump has won georgia and massachusetts, alabama and virginia. he's also won the great state of tennessee. tonight, is the beginning of donald trump bringing the republican party together for a big victory this november. tonight, is the beginning of donald trump bringing the people of our nation together to help america win again. tonight in all those states that supported mr. trump today, all the ones who voted across this
6:38 pm
country, our message is to begin to get ready for the fight that's coming this fall. the fight this fall is to make sure that a united republican party and united american people make sure that hillary rodham clinton never gets back in the white house. [ cheers and applause ] since june 16th when mr. trump declared his candidacy he's shown himself to be tough and strong and bold. he's shown himself to be a fighter. a leader who speaks plainly to the american people. he's listened to the american people. the american people are listening to him. he's bringing the country together. that, ladies and gentlemen, is not a campaign. it's a movement. [ cheers and applause ] america wants to come together.
6:39 pm
america wants to be strong and successful again, but they know that to do that they need to have a strong, bold, tough, decisive leader back in the oval office. they have that man after tonight. ladies and gentlemen, let me introduce to you the next president of the united states. donald trump. [ cheers and applause ] >> chris, thank you very much. i appreciate it. this has been an amazing evening. already we have won five major states and it looks like we could win six or seven or eight or nine. it's really been great. i want to congratulate ted on the winning of texas. he worked hard on it.
6:40 pm
i congratulate him on that win. it was an excellent win. we'll make america great again. we're going to make it great again. i watched hillary's speech and she's talking about wages have been poor and everything's poor and everything is doing badly. she's been there for so long. i mean if she hasn't straightened it out by now, she's not going to straighten it out in the next four years. it's going to get worse and worse. she wants to make america whole again. making america great again is will much better than making america whole again. it's an exciting evening. it's great to be in florida. it's great to be here with friends and the press and the media and everybody. i know it was a tough night for marco rubio. he had a tough night. he worked hard. he spent a lot of money. he is a lightweight as i've said many times before. you know what, we're going to go
6:41 pm
to florida. we're going to spend so much time in florida. we got about a 20-point lead. i know a lot of groups, a lot of special interests and lobbyists and the people that want to have their little senator do exactly as they want will put 20 or $25 million into it over the next two weeks from what just came over the wires. frankly, i think that's fine. as far as i'm concerned it's fine. if he wins, he'll have total control, but he's not going anywhere any way. we'll see what happens. we'll spend a will the of time in florida. the virginia win was a great win because it's a place that is just spectacular and place we have big investments in. we have thousands of employees in florida all along miami, dural and so many other places. it's been an amazing place to invest. it's been amazing to have so many wonderful employees some of whom are here tonight really urging us on. i have thousands of employees
6:42 pm
all over the country, actually all over the world. for purposes of tonight, we'll say all over the country. it's been just so beautiful to watch this company grow and to watch it grow so strongly. recent articles came out talking about how great a company we built. now we want to put that same ability into doing something for our nation. our nation is in serious trouble. we're being killed on trade. china is taking advantage of us. i have nothing against china. i have great respect for china. the leaders are too smart for our leaders. our leaders don't have a clue. the trade deficit set $400 billion and $500 billion are too much. no country can sustain that kind of trade deficit. it won't be that way for long. we have the greatest business leaders in the world on my team already. believe me, we're going to are do the trade deals. it's going to be a thing of beauty. you look at countries like
6:43 pm
mexico where they are killing us on the border. absolutely destroying us on the boarder. they are destroying us in terms of economic development. companies like carrier air-conditioner just moving into mexico. ford moving into mexico. nabisco closing up shop and moving into new mexico. we have to stop it. we're going to create jobs. we're going to create jobs like you've never seen. we're going to lower taxes. i have a plan that larry and so many others think is the best plan they have seen. we will lower taxes substantially for the middle class. the middle class has been forgotten if our country. it really helped and the predominant factor in making our country into a country that we all love so much and we're all so proud of. we have forgotten the middle class. we're lowering taxes on business. look at the companies that are moving out. when you see pfizer moving to
6:44 pm
ireland. they used to move from new york to florida or move from new jersey to someplace else, chris. now they are moving from here -- not that many people are leaving new jersey but chris understands the problem. now they are leaving from places they move to use to into other parts of the world. we can't let that happen. we have lost our manufacturing joh jobs. millions and millions of jobs. thousands and thousands and thousands of manufacturing plants, warehouses. we are losing so much. we can't let it happen. i tell this story often about a friend of mine who is in the excavation business. he always orders caterpillar. he ordered from japan because they devalued the yen to such an extent that it was impossible for caterpillar to compete.
6:45 pm
i don't want that to happen. we have tremendous power over everybody because we're really the source. we have great, great power. the problem is we have politicians that truly, truly, truly don't know what they're doing. we're going to work very, very hard. i'm so honored by this evening. if you would have told me on june 16th, when i was with my wife and we came down the escalator this trump power and it looked like this. you have a lot of cameras here tonight. it looked like the academy awards. i never saw so many cameras in my life. it takes courage to run. it takes a lot of courage to run for president. i've never done this before. i've been a job producers. i've done a lot of things, but this something i never done. i felt we had to do it. when you look at the incompetence of the iran deal where we gave $150 billion and we get absolutely nothing. when you look at all the problems our country has and look at our military that's being rapidly depleted.
6:46 pm
we will make the military bigger and better and stronger and nobody, nobody, nobody will mess with us. nobody. it's just an amazing honor to have you with me tonight. if you want press, i think we told you before it will be okay if you want to ask a few questions. go ahead. [ inaudible question ] >> a lot of support to or reject you. some strongly worded statements coming out including one from the senator of nebraska who said if donald trump ends up the republican nominee, conservatives will need to find a third party option. what do you say? >> they can always do that. then they will lose everything. that would be the work of a loser. let me explain something. if you've seen what's happened
6:47 pm
whether you go to south carolina where i had a huge victory, where we had a tremendous victory in new hampshire, tremendous in nevada. you look at what's happened and tonight is the best of all. they are projecting six, but could be seven, eight, nine in major states. it's georgia, alabama, massachusetts, tennessee, virginia. these are amazing states. we'll probably get a lot more. we're projected to have some pretty good additional numbers. i will say this, we have expanded the republican party. when you look at what's happened in south carolina and you see the kind of numbers that we got in terms of extra people coming in. they came from the democratic party or the democrat party and the democrats and long time democrats and they were never going to switch and they all switched. they were independents. we've expanded the party.
6:48 pm
look at the number of votes we had in that area as an example. four years ago they had 390,000 or so votes. we doubled it. we're almost 800,000. the democrats went down. there's much less enthusiasm for the democrats. i'm a unifier. i know people will find this hard to believe. once we get this finished, i'm going to go after one person on the assumption she is allowed to run. i don't know if she will be allowed to run. i don't think marco will be able to beat her. i think ted will have a very hard time. ted has a shot because he's won a little bit. i just tell you this, we are going to be a much finer party, a much -- we're going to be a
6:49 pm
unified party. we are going to be a much bigger party. you can see that happening. we're going to be a much bigger party. our party is expanding. all you have to do is take a look at the primary states where i've won. we've gone from x number to a much larger number. that hasn't happened to the republican party in many, many decades. i think we'll be more inclusive and more unified. i think we'll be a much bigger party. i think we're going to win in november. okay, yeah. >> the republican nominee and along those lines you have some things to say about planned parenthood. are you trying to adjust your tone to a more general election now? >> i'm just doing what's right. look, planned parenthood has done very good work for some, for millions of women. i'll say it. i know a lot of so-called conservatives they that's really -- i'm a conservative but
6:50 pm
i'm a common sense conservativc. millions of women have been helped by planned parenthood. we're not going to fund as long as you have the abortion going on at planned it. i've said it loud and clear. we'll see what happens, but planned parenthood, millions of people -- i've had thousands of letters from women that have been helped. this wasn't a set up, this was people writing letters. i'm going to be good for women's health issues. it's very important to me. maybe that's not a perfect conservative view, but i can tell you one thing, i'm more conservative than anybody on the military, on taking care of our vets, on the boarder, on the wall, on getting rid of obamacare and coming up with something much, much better and certainly get rid of common core and bringing education to a local level so that you're going to have good education for our children who are being
6:51 pm
absolutely starved for proper education. so i mean you can call it what you want, but i am a truth teller and i will tell the truth. okay. go ahead and finish it. >> reporter: do you feel like the nominee at this point? >> i feel awfully good. i'm watching your people -- i'm going to be very nice. i'm going to be very nice. i'm watching your people on cnn and i'm watching the fox people and the msnbc people too. see, i'm becoming diplomatic. and they are certainly being very nice to me tonight. they're being very strong and they are, they're declaring marco rubio the big looser of the night, which is true. he didn't won anything. he hasn't won anything period. he was very, very nasty. i've never heard a person get up and speak on an evening like this and be so nasty. he's not going to win very much. i do congratulate ted because i
6:52 pm
know how hard ted worked on texas and that's a big get. i did very well in texas. i came in second. one of the things my son eric told me, which i didn't realize, is that not only did i won most of the states and some are coming in and i'm expected to win them, but i came in second -- i came in no worst than second. it's not like i won and disappeared. the worst i had was a second. so i'm very, very honored by the turn out. yes. go ahead. >> reporter: the speaker of the house felt you were not clear enough about the role the k.k.k. played in your movement or your orientation to politics. are they wrong? >> they're totally wrong. i disavowed -- chris is -- when chris gave me the honor of joining the campaign, he called me and said, donald, what you've
6:53 pm
got is a movement. we spoke today in kentucky. you've never seen a crowd like that. that had to be 20,000 people inside this convention people. every place we're speaking it's like a small group. we had 35,000 people in alabama and when chris called he said this is a movement. in all fairness to the press, a lot of the press have said the same thing. they've never seen anything like what's happening right now. i'm jashonored by it. when chris joined and he asked me the same question, i said i disavow, right after the program we're talking about approximate and i thought it was clear, but we're talking about groups, dow have to know the name of the group because who knows. they have to give me the name of the group. when i reviewed it i put out a tweet and i put on facebook i disavowed. everybody knew i did that and i disavowed then and today on abc.
6:54 pm
i mean, how many times are you supposed to disavow, but i disavow and hopefully it's the final time i do it, but it you look at facebook and twitter i put out a statement because i wanted everybody to be sure. >> reporter: you call yourself a negotiationer is this campaign just a start of a negotiation for you taking extreme positions to move to the middle? >> no, there's not, but there's always going to be some negotiation. it's going to be a negotiation where we'll start at certain levels and hopefully i will make a great deal and lots of great deals for the american people. look, you can't go around just signing our little notices that the president signs all the time, executive orders. he signed executive order, executive order. does he ever go and deal with congress anymore? does he ever speak to the senate and speak with congressmen and
6:55 pm
get them in a room and get things done. a good example of this is something that's very important to me is corporate inversion. it bothers karl so much about it all the time we're losing companies and we're losing for two reasons -- we're losing for a lot of reasons. we're the highest tax nation in the world and they have tr trillions of dollars outside of this company the democrats and republicans agrees did should shall brought back in. i could sit in a room or the oval office for a period of a half hour and i believe i -- it's one thing they don't agree on health care or common core or other things and they fight. here's something every single -- almost everybody agrees.
6:56 pm
these trillions of dollars should be brought into the country. the president can't make a deal because he doesn't know how to make a deal, probably doesn't work it and doesn't care, but you're talking about tremendous amounts of money. so when you have something that everybody wants and you can't make a deal, there's something going on that's really wrong. what it means is you have the wrong leader. yes. >> reporter: is immigration negotiationable? >> we are going to have a wall, i can tell you. we are going to have a wall. i watched the ex-president of mexico and i get along great with the hispanics, i won in nevada, i have thousands of people that work for me that are hispanics, i've had thousands over my lifetime, the mexican leaders are too smart for our leaders and you saw it.
6:57 pm
president fox -- first of all, he used a word -- if i would have used that word, nobody would have let me get away with it. this is the ultimate word. he was angry at the concept of somebody saying they were going to pay for the wall. mexico is going to pay for the wall. we have a trade deficit with mexico of $58 billion a year. the wall is going to cost $10 billion. it's so easy. i've had these guys i'm on the stage with say you don't mean mexico is going to pay for the wall. as sure as you're standing there 100% mexico is going to pay. 100%. and the reason -- the reason is i'm a businessman. i know how to do this. politicians are all talk, no action, except for chris christie. it's not going to happen with these people. when you think of it -- they say you'll never be able to build a wall, well it's 2,000 miles, but
6:58 pm
we need 1,000 miles. the great wall of china is 13,000 miles and they didn't have tractors. they didn't have tractors, cranes, excavation equipment. the wall is 13,000 miles. we need 1,000 miles. we have all the materials. this is going to be a serious wall. this is going to be a high wall. we're going to stop drugs from coming into new hampshire. when i won new hampshire those people were so incredible to me and when you go -- you wouldn't believe it because it's so beautiful. you look at the fields and everything, it's so beautiful and yet you go to a meeting in new hampshire, they're number one problem -- their number one problem is heroine. the heroine is pouring in. they have so many young people
6:59 pm
and other people addicted. i told them i'm going to stop it. i'm doing to stop it. we're going to have a strong boarder. by the way, speaking of people, people are going to come in and they're going to come into this country, but they're going to come in legally. i have a lot of respect for rick scott. i don't know about his endorsement, but he's a friend of mine and i have a lot of respect for him. >> reporter: on your plan to temporarily -- >> got to find out what's going on. >> reporter: this week governor christie -- >> we have a big, big problem. we have to figure it out. we're going to figure it out. radical islamic terrorism, big problem. not only for us, but look at germany and sweden and look at some of these places, it's like a disaster. we're not going to a allow
7:00 pm
people to come in our country and we have no idea who they are, where they come from and they're young and strong -- they're young and strong and powerful and you say why aren't they back fighting for their country? with all of that being said -- i have a bigger heart than anybody, we're going to build a safe zone. it's going to be in syria and i'm going to get the gulf states who have more money than anybody, we're going to loosen up their wallets. we're going to get the gulf states to pay for it because they should. >> reporter: i'm talking with your plan to ban them. >> you heard what i said. i gave you a good answer. go ahead. >> reporter: mr. trump if you are the nominated person, what are we going do to bring back some of these groups such as
7:01 pm
muslims? >> we're going to bring them back. first of all, we're going do great with the african-americans. you see that in the polls where i had one poll where i'm 25% and one. commentators who i think is standing in the back of the room said if donald trump gets 25% of the african-american vote, this election is over. you watch. the reason i'm getting that and i'm going do great with the hispanics and i'm going to do great with virtually every group is i'm going to bring jobs back. i'm going to get apple to start making their products on our land, not in china. how does it help us when it's made in china. i'm going to create jobs. >> reporter: if marco rubio cannot win florida, is it time for him to get out and do you plan to spend $25 million? >> i always liked marco until about a week ago when he decided
7:02 pm
to go hostile. honestly i always liked him, but somebody told him you're losing very badly, the only way you can possibly win, go hostile. it's hurt him. in fact one of the news cast said he went down 15% or 20%. i'm not going to tell him what to do. you have to run. he had a bad night according to cnn, fox, they say the looser of the night was marco rubio. at least you can say ted has won something. you have to be able to win. you can't talk. these politicians all talk, no action. you have to be able to win something. he hasn't won anything and he hasn't come very close. so we'll see what happens. go ahead. >> reporter: you criticized
7:03 pm
president obama for not working with congress. >> let's not ask it again. how many times -- listen, who are you by the way? who are you with? okay. very good. good job. look, i don't want to waste a lot of time. i disavowed -- i'm going to get along great with congress. paul ryan, i don't know him well, but i'm sure i'm going to get along with him and if i don't he's going to have to pay a big price. go ahead. on the right. go ahead. >> reporter: mr. trump, a question. you say a lot about what you're going to do. >> i'm going be a good president, but we have a country that's in big trouble. our infrastructure is going to hell, our schools, hospitals, airport
7:04 pm
airports, i go throughout the world, you go to so many places in china, different places in asia, different places in the middle east, you look at some of the airports they have, the roadways they have and the transportation systems and the trains they have, we're like a third-world country. so i'm going to be good for the world. i'm going to get along with the world. you will be proud of me as a president, but we have to rebuild our country. our country is going to hell and people don't understand that and hillary clinton doesn't have a clue. she can't do that. one of the things that has really bothered me and i have such great support is that people in the middle income groups are making less money today than they made 12 years ago and in a speech she just said they're making less money. that's been there with obama for a long period of time. why hasn't she done anything
7:05 pm
about it. practically everything she's complaining about, she picked up what i said. she's been there for a long period of time. why haven't they done anything with it? then you look at her record of secretary of state, it's aby abyssal. you look at what's going on with syria and everything, it's a disaster. so we're going to have an interesting period of time. i don't know that she'll be allowed to run. if she's allowed to run i would be surprised, but if she's allowed to run, honestly it will be a sad day for this country because what she did was wrong and what she did -- let me tell you -- what she did was wrong and other people have done far less than her and they paid a very, very big price. okay. one or two more questions. go ahead jeremy. >> reporter: you talked about how you plan to support undocumented immigrants living in this country and everythiyes
7:06 pm
you said everything is negotiationable. >> tell me where i said that. >> reporter: fox news yesterday you said that. >> i didn't say that. i'll negotiate. if the wall is 50 feet i'll take two feet off the wall. >> reporter: would you allow the people to stay in the country without having to leave the country? >> at this moment absolutely not. we either have a country or we don't. we have a country or we don't. we have boarders or we don't have boarders. at this moment the answer is no. how about another question. david, go ahead. >> reporter: there were some suggestions including some from your former aids that some people inside the republican committee are considering amongky wrenching with your nomination. >> i think david -- go ahead. >> reporter: suh may very well may have sewn up ten or 15
7:07 pm
states at this point, is that enough for them to honor their agreement with you. >> i have a lot of respect for the group and i don't know that i've been treated fairly or not, but i can tell you that i do respect them. what i really have is a great number of people. i have millions and millions of people and when i was watching those broadcasts just a little while ago before i came in here because i wanted to see where we were before i started speaking, i was amazed at the kind of numbers. the republicans have tremendous energy. the democrats don't. they don't have any energy. their numbers are down. our numbers are through the roof and people are making the statements i've never seen in modern times a party that was so energized. i think if somebody is doing as well i'm doing -- and i'm not speaking for myself, me or anybody else, or if i'm going to win five, maybe it could be
7:08 pm
nine, could win nine states tonight, if i'm going to win all of these states with tremendous numbers and if i'm going to come in the worst as second in the two or three that i might not win, i think we're a democracy, i think it's hard to say that's not the person we want to lead the party, right? it's very hard. but i really think -- i think it's a great question, david, because i really think that one of the biggest things that everybody is seeing happening and everybody is the republican party has become more dynamic, it's become more diverse, we have more people. we have a lot more people. look at south carolina, look at the numbers. look at the numbers from four years ago when nobody wanted to waste their time and vote. i was there and you had lines that went a mile long. it was virtually more than doubled. so we have a very, very dynamic party and i think we're going to be able to unify the party.
7:09 pm
i don't know paul ryan well, but i hope to be able to get along with him. i do know mitch mcconnell a little bit and i hope to be able to get along with him. i have millions and millions of people. this isn't like it's a close match. it's too bad that winner didn't take all because if winner took all, this thing is over. we're just having a celebration. we're having a celebration. so anyway i would like to -- look i want to end by thanking everybody. this has been an amazing period in my life. my wife just called and my daughter is going to be having a baby very soon and she's a special person and it's going to be great. she's back in new york. she wanted to be here, they all wanted to be here, and that could be within the next week, but this has been an amazing period of time. it's been amazing for me even from an educational standpoint and i think we've done something
7:10 pm
that almost nobody thought could be done and i'm very proud of it. i just want to leave you with this, i am a unifier. i would love to see the republican party and everybody get together and unify and when we unify there's nobody, nobody, that's going to beat us. thank you very much everybody. thank you. thank you very much. thank you. no matter what you feel of tonight's republican front-runner donald trump, that certainly was the intended use of homefield advantage, down to the introduction by governor chris crissie and including his remarks. it was said in this studio while he was talking it had almost the air of an event where someone names his transition staff. it was certainly donald trump's intention to look official in the role. and if you take away the pastle gels on the kurtans in the back and include the american flags,
7:11 pm
the podium, the ball room that was a different kind of donald trump appearance, a subject we cannot wait to discuss among our friends in this studio, but first we have business to conduct. we want to update our characterizations of three leading races at this hour starting with vermont primary on the republican side. too close to call. donald trump, john kasich and look at that, they are not separated by much. a couple of hundred in a shooting match with over half of the raw vote in. to arkansas, gop trump, cruz, too close to call. close to 60% of the vote in. more of a difference with trump in the lead. and massachusetts democrat hillary clinton in the lead, 63%
7:12 pm
of the vote in, but the characterization here still too close to call. now, let's run through tonight starting with the republican party. just to bring people up to speed who have not seen the march of the evening, early on we had a number of states and then the wait was on for 9:00 eastern time when we got this one, texas senator ted cruz hangs on to his home state. it was said that was the minimum for him tonight to continue, cruz the projected winner in texas, but then we have the trump run through the south. georgia, donald trump projected winner. tennessee, the volunteer state, donald trump projected winner. alabama, deep south, 50 delegates at stake, up to the old domon, virginia, the commonwealth of virginia went to
7:13 pm
donald trump tonight. oklahoma, neighboring state went to senator ted cruz of texas. massachusetts went to donald trump. delegate count tonight as opposed to the delegate county overall, these things are complicated. this is where we rely on rachel's education to explain these things. we'll see overall what that magic 123,700 needed by the time you get to the convention in cleveland, all numbers subject to change. let's look at the democrats, shall we. you see hillary clinton's face on that board a lot. texas, the big prize tonight for her. that was after the 9:00 eastern hour for us. she had quite a run through the south. georgia, hillary clinton. the commonwealth of virginia,
7:14 pm
hillary clinton. the volunteer state of tennessee, hillary clinton. alabama, hillary clinton. here we come to oklahoma, bernie sanders. one of the five his campaign confidently pointed to going into tonight. arkansas former home state of hillary clinton when she was first lady there, her husband was governor. then the home state of vermont went to bernie sanders. as you saw, we have some outstanding numbers, but here are tonight's delegates. 2,615 with just over a thousand at stake and that brings us up to speed. to let you know i was just about to say senator cruz was waiting for donald trump to complete his remarks. let's go to senator cruz in houston, texas, his wife also by his side.
7:15 pm
>> thank you, texas. [cheers and applause] >> god bless the lone star state. [cheers and applause] >> and god bless the great state of oklahoma. [cheers and applause] >> in 324 days marine one will depart washington, d.c. with a very important digny tear on board, former president barack obama. this much is certain, january 20th, 2017 will be president obama's last day in office. [cheers and applause] >> and on that day, we will have a new president of the united
7:16 pm
states. [cheers and applause] >> cruz! cruz! cruz! cruz! >> tonight, this campaign enters a new phase. we began with 17 republican candidates. through the first four states, the race narrowed considerably. tonight was another decision point and the voters have spoken. [cheers and applause] >> tomorrow morning we have a choice. so long as the field remains divided, donald trump's path to the nomination remains more likely and that would be a
7:17 pm
disaster for republicans. for conservatives and for the nation. after tonight, we have seen that our campaign is the only campaign that has beaten, that can beat and that will beat donald trump. [cheers and applause] i congratulate donald trump on his victories tonight, but we are the only campaign that has beaten donald trump once, twice, three times. [cheers and applause]
7:18 pm
>> 15 states have now voted. every one mu every one of those states so far has been won by either donald trump or myself. [cheers and applause] >> republicans, together we have a choice. we are blessed with a deep talented honorable field. for the candidates who have not yet won a state, who have not racked up significant delegates, i ask you to prayfully consider our coming together, uniting. [cheers and applause] >> for those who have supported other candidates, we welcome you on our team standing united as one. [cheers and applause] >> that is the only way to beat
7:19 pm
donald trump. [cheers and applause] >> head-to-head, our campaign beats trump resoundingly. but for that to happen, we must come together. [cheers and applause] >> and the republican primary voters in upcoming states, you too have a choice. in our nation's darkest hours, fdr told us that we have nothing to fear, but fear itself. jfk told us to ask not what our country could do for us, but to ask what we could do for our country. [cheers and applause] >> america shouldn't have a president whose words would make you embarrassed if you're children repeated them.
7:20 pm
[cheers and applause] >> our president should make us all proud, should inspire hope in all of us. [cheers and applause] >> we can nominate a washington deal maker, profane and vulgar, who has a life-long power for using government power for personal gain. or we can come nanominate a pro conservative who has fought consistently for working men and women and to defend the constitution. [cheers and applause] >> cruz! cruz! cruz! cruz! cruz! we interrupt the cruz event
7:21 pm
with news that won't go over big at cruz head quartersened that is that donald trump has now been projected by this news organization as the victor in arkansas as they say the cruz campaign badly wanted arkansas as a pick up tonight. ted cruz is going to be limited in victories in his home state of texas and oklahoma, but trump just added to his sizeable list of victories tonight the state of arkansas. let's go back inside to ted cruz. >> continue the washington just like he supported obama's wall street bail yout. i will stand with the people of this country and end korp rate
7:22 pm
welfare. abolli abollish the irs. donald trump funded the gang of eight. with your help, i led the successful opposition to the gang of eight's amnesty plan. [cheers and applause] >> donald trump supports planned parenthood. [ boo ] >> i will direct the justice department to investigate planned parenthood. donald trump promises to compromise with harry reid on supreme court nominees. i will never compromise away our religious liberty.
7:23 pm
[cheers and applause] >> and unlike donald trump, i will never compromise away our second amendment right to keep and bare arms. [cheers and applause] >> donald trump pledges to be neutral between israel and the pal pinions. america will stand with the nation of israel. donald trump says he will keep in place the iranian nuclear deal, to try to renegotiate it. i will rip to shreds this iranian nuclear deal on the very first day in office.
7:24 pm
[cheers and applause] >> if you're angry with washington, i understand. but donald trump has been part of the washington corruption for 40 years. he's harry reid's favorite republican candidate and jimmy carter's. just yesterday it was reported that "the new york times" has a secret tape recording of donald saying he doesn't mean what he's saying on immigration, that it's all flexible, that he won't build a wall, that he won't deport illegal aliens, but donald refuses to take allow them to release the tape. donald, release the tape. [cheers and applause]
7:25 pm
if you're telling "the new york times" editorial board that you're lying to the voters, the voters have a right to know. [cheers and applause] >> enough with the washington corruption, with the deception, with using government to benefit the rich and powerful at the expense of the american people. five years ago i promised the people of texas that i would be fight with every breath in my body to stop obamacare. [cheers and applause] >> to stop amnesty and to secure the boarder, to stop the deabt that is bankrupting our kids and grandkids, to defend religious liberty, the second amendment and the bill of rights.
7:26 pm
[cheers and applause] >> and i have kept my promise. [cheers and applause] >> that's why we were supported in this election by texas governor greg abbott, by lieutenant governor dan patrick, our campaign chairman, by former governor rick perry, a true patriot. [cheers and applause] >> by nearly half of the republican state legislators in texas. [cheers and applause] >> and by thousands upon thousands of republican women and grassroots activists. they know my record.
7:27 pm
they know me personally. they know my heart. and they know that i have kept my word to fight for them each and every day. [cheers and applause] >> america, i'll do the same as president. [cheers and applause] >> together, we will repeal obamacare. [cheers and applause] >> abollish the irs, pull back the epa regulators that are killing small businesses. [cheers and applause] >> stop amnesty and secure the boarders. [cheers and applause] >> and the results will be small businesses exploding millions of
7:28 pm
high-paying jobs, wages going up and young people coming out of school with two, three, four, five job offers. [cheers and applause] >> from this day forward, let us together show that reagan's love, optimism and faith in the american people were not misplaced. [cheers and applause] >> let us show that we will not let the american light go out, that we will fight for our constitution, for life and for freedom. [cheers and applause] >> you have shown that we remain a strong and just people, a people who do not give in to fear, but rise always in our righteous might to meet the challenges of the future.
7:29 pm
[cheers and applause] >> together we can do it. if we stand together and return to the free market principals and the constitutional liberties that built america. [cheers and applause] >> once again, we can have morning in america. [cheers and applause] >> thank you and god bless each and every one of you. [cheers and applause] texas senator ted cruz, who captured his home state of texas and one other, the state of oklahoma tonight, getting texas was considered the minimum to keep going for him. >> so it is a good night for ted cruz because he won his home state and he added a state to that. let me tell you one other reason
7:30 pm
why it's a good night for him tonight, that is the results for marco rubio. marco rubio was third in alabama, rubio was third in arkansas, rubio was third in georgia, rubio was third in massachusetts, rubio third in oklahoma, rubio third in tennessee, rubio third in texas, rubio so far third in vermont. he did get second place in virginia, but marco rubio not only has not won anything tonight, he was third place across the board. there was a fight for second tonight, the fight to lose the best to donald trump who basically ran the table tonight, ted cruz resoundingly won that battle for second place against marco rubio while putting two states on the board himself and that to me feels like a devastating series of results tonight. >> the bad news for ted cruz is that marco rubio is not going to get out so they will continue to split this vote and split it with john kasich as they move forward. >> john kasich who may yet end
7:31 pm
on the board tonight, the vermont race still undecided between him and donald trump, although donald trump is leading in that vermont race. >> you look at the future of the republican party, is ted cruz tonight has won his home state. it's not clear that marco rubio is on a trajectory to win his home state. ted cruz is now when we look at this enormous republican field so big that they had to divide the debate stages at the beginning of the campaign, ted cruz the outsider, has firmly entrenched himself into second place in the republican nominating contest. i think you look ahead for ted cruz, nothing but blue skies for him inside the republican party at this hour the campaign, even though donald trump tonight is moving very, very close to the line where he becomes the presumptive republican nominee. >> ted cruz is the best thing
7:32 pm
that could happen to trump tonight. ted cruz is the only person who can get washington republicans to think well, donald trump's not so bad. he is the only person who creates a preference for donald trump among many establishment republicans. >> you saw that play out in the remarkable donald trump news conference tonight and i think the calculation for washington republicans many of whom are reviled about the notion of a trump candidacy, there's a simple test, is donald trump expanding the republican party, a party that has lost the popular vote in five out of the last six elections. if he's seen to be expanding the party from an opportunity perspective into these rust belt states, appealing to blue collar union democrats, being able to grow the party, if he can convince the establishment republicans of that, a lot of the criticism of trump is going to fade. >> he did convince the
7:33 pm
establishment republicans tonight that a trump presidency would instantly be a reign of madness in washington. he threatened the speaker of the house who if he or anyone supporting him would ever check the constitution will discover the speaker of the house is far more powerful than the president of all matters of domestic governoring. the speaker of the house controls taxation. that puts paul ryan in complete control of anything, anything legislatively that donald trump wants to do. he threatened ryan tonight saying if he doesn't get along with me, he's going to have to pay a big price. tell that to nixon who got driven out of office by a speaker of the house, tell that to bill clinton. speakers of the house have proved over and over again their -- paul ryan is proving now, he has more powers than the president does on all issues of domestic government.
7:34 pm
having said that and that's from a veteran of capitol hill, let's go to chris matthews who is a veteran of all things washington. chris, i know you have a special guest who has been very patient waiting for us, but first i'd like you to talk about the optics of the trump event tonight, the content, the demeanor and the surroundings. >> well, i have to tell you that he did act like a president the formality of holding a press conference tonight of a big victory, he was on the road of winning nine contests tonight and on the way of doing it he tried to act like the president. it looked like he was about to name his transition team tonight. so it was a little bit of forward leaning i'd say as the president would say ahead of skis. i have mr. tom delight joining me here a veteran of texas politics who tries to convince me there's a big ball game ahead. he's like a sports announcer.
7:35 pm
this game ain't over yet. >> all you guys that are saying that trump is now the nominee are going to have egg on their face later on because the prize is 1,237 delegates. the popular vote is only important in allocating delegates. 60% of the delegates in the republican convention will be picked pore portion nally. so if trump never gets more than 40% in each state, tonight he'll only get 250 delegates. >> so no one has to beat him for him to lose. >> no. >> the american people have watched how the prime areas have decided the nominees for more than half a century. are you saying the party can nominate someone who is no the the leaders in the prime areas. >> if that someone doesn't have the votes going into the convention all hell could break loose. >> they would deny the person
7:36 pm
who won the prime areas. how do you deny the leader of the primaries the nomination. >> it's easy. 60% of those voting in the republican primaries didn't vote for trump. he's only getting 30%, 35%, 40%. the majority of the party, which is the majority of the republicans -- >> i hear this, but what doesn't come through is any precedent to deny the winner the nomination. >> this is all -- all of this has been thrown out with trump in the race. >> what happens if trump is the leader going into cleveland and you guys say we have this other guy we're going to nominate and he says okay i'm going and i'm going and trump walks? >> you have other candidates coming in with delegates. you'll have cruz in there with a lot of delegates. you'll have -- >> how do you give any of them -- we're going to circles here. you think the republican party
7:37 pm
can change precedent -- >> it's following the rules of the party. it has nothing to do with precedent. it has everything do with collecting delegates and there's already -- there's 20 more states that have proportional delegate allocation. >> i'm going to make an announcement here tom has just said to donald trump even if you get most of the delegates, almost all you need, we're going to give this to somebody else. >> well, the delegates get to choose. it is a party function. the party is putting up a nominee. the party -- >> will you support donald trump if he's the nominee, tom delay? >> i'm sorry? >> will you support donald trump. >> i'll have to search my soul. >> will you support -- >> i think he's very dangerous for the country and the party. [cheers and applause] >> he will tear the republican
7:38 pm
party apart. if you listen to what he's saying, he wants to be king. he doesn't want to be president and he doesn't talk about separation of powers, the power of the presidency, the lack of authority, the constitution, he doesn't even understand the constitution. so i'm looking for a man of faith that will stand on the constitution and a man of faith that has principals and trump ain't it. >> what would change your mind? >> nothing will change my mind. >> in other words, you already searched your soul. >> i've searched hard. i've been talking about this for over two years about the fact we are at a cross roads in this country. >> how does mr. trump reach you if he's trying to reach you? >> he can call me on my cell. >> well, now we've made some news tonight. he has decided donald trump doesn't meet his standards.
7:39 pm
>> no, that's why i voted for cruz. >> thank you. i think we got an answer here. >> wow. and for us to discuss the future of the republican party for the rest of the evening after this short break.
7:40 pm
7:41 pm
billions are spent to confuse and, dare i say it, flummox the american public. "save 16% on car insurance." "switch now..." well at compare.com, we say enough's enough. so we've created this mind boggling facility. where we're constantly scrutinizing millions of rates... answering the question: who has the lowest. go to compare.com, plug in some simple info
7:42 pm
and get up to 50 free quotes. choose the lowest, and hit purchase. it's fast and easy. compare.com saving humanity from high insurance rates. it was a very tough night for marco rubio. he had a tough night, but he worked hard. he spent a lot of money. he is a light weight as i've
7:43 pm
said many times before, but we're going to go to florida and spend so much time in florida. we have about a 20-point lead. i know a lot of groups and special interests and the people that want to have their little senator do exactly as they want, they're going to put $25 million into it over the next two weeks from what just came over the wires and i frankly i think that's fine. as far as i'm concerned that's fine. if he wins he will have total control, but he's not going anyway, but we're going to spend a lot of time in florida. >> the podium, the american flags, the trusted deputy behind him, it was quite an event tonight in florida. we have an update on the minnesota race before we bang this around the group and talk about it. too early to call with an interesting tabulation process.
7:44 pm
marco rubio, cruz, trump. >> 79% of the vote. this is the other place in the country where marco rubio hoped to compete. if he can win minnesota that will be a huge psychological win for him to get a win somewhere tonight as well as the delegate consequences of that. he's been third everywhere else in the country tonight except for virginia. >> steve and lawrence are with us. >> to see chris christie in florida on the very night where the biggest newspaper in new hampshire, the union leader who endorsed him apologized for their endorsement because of his now endorsement of donald trump and tonight in new jersey six new jersey newspapers writing a joint editorial calling on governor christie to resign, both over the endorsement of
7:45 pm
donald trump, which puts christie out of the state, which is to say out of his job as much as he was as a presidential candidate out of a job, they're making the case that he's ignoring the job and donald trump would be a harmful president for new jersey and that everything christie's doing now is both harmful to the governorship and the state, called on to resign by six newspapers. >> chris christie was positioned as the character in that presidential tabloid tonight. he did look like he wanted to be rescued. he did look nervous. i'm not about the staging of things and i'm a person who is not a great actor and can't stage myself, but as careful as that was chris christie looked like he needed help. >> he is governor of the state of new jersey. the state of new jersey is the most powerful governorship in the country. he just spent the last year plus
7:46 pm
running for president of the united states, he is a man acustomed to be alone center stage, tonight you see him in a supporting actor role. so i don't think it's a naturally comfortable fit. you look at marco rubio now in minnesota, you look at john kasich in vermont, we're out of stage -- >> the closer you get to the canadian boarder the more donald trump has. >> we're at a stage in the race once you have the primary states where we have voters going into election booths, it diminishes the importance of these caucus states where it is not the straight into the booth voting process. as we get deeper and deeper unless you're an extremely close contest counting delegates, the importance of those diminishes. >> one more quick note on chris christie, he has the lowest approval rating in the history
7:47 pm
of polling of governors approval ratings in new jersey. that's who is standing behind that presidential candidate. >> the big picture tonight, i don't want to lose sight of the one big thing tonight, "the washington post" said if you look at what donald trump has put together and look at the states he has won so far and he's now in historic territory, nobody has ever won this combination of states before in putting together a republican win, all in all he's run alabama, georgia, massachusetts, tennessee, new hampshire, nevada, no other nomination has won those states. the way that chris matthews pinned tom delay to the wall trying to explain to him and argue with him that it would be a difficult thing for the republican party to say somebody
7:48 pm
winning this sweeping a victory would be denied the nomination by the party because of some math you could do with the delegates, i do think that's something that the republican party large and small is going to have to reckon with. the idea that you would take it away from someone the voters have choose en, that's a big thing to try to do. >> it's a remarkable interview and it's a great glimpse for the viewers tonight for what is happening inside washington, d.c., inside the republican party. that conversation that chris matthews just had with tom delay, that is the conversation happening all around washington, d.c. amongst republicans and the thing about it is it makes no sense. you can talk about the rules all you want, but at the end of the day the notion that the person who is winning the vast majority of states, the overwhelming majority of delegates will somehow be denied the nomination by an inside rigged game in an
7:49 pm
election where the voters are saying we've had enough and are in rebillion against the game is just nonsensical. >> it would be one thing if the republican primary were so scattered that there were 17 different people winning everywhere and there was true chaos and the party was going to restore order, in this case the republican electorate in it country is speaking very loudly with one voice that they want donald trump. if the party decides that the voters are wrong, that party can be something but it can't represent the voters anymore. >> speaking just as loudly the voice in my ear from the control room saying we have to go to a break. we'll be right back.
7:50 pm
7:51 pm
7:52 pm
7:53 pm
these are the states outstanding at this hour. we are waiting to call, gop race in vermont, too close to call. trump in the lead. john kasich close behind separated by 724 votes. democratic primary in massachusetts separated by 25,960 hillary clinton in the lead over bernie sanders and in minnesota bernie sanders in the lead over hillary clinton with 6% of the raw in, too close to
7:54 pm
call. gop caucus in minnesota, too early to call a rubio lead over cruz, though these numbers are on the move and the democratic caucus in colorado too early. bernie sanders leading hillary clinton. we want to go now to hayley jackson at cruz campaign. >> reporter: we're here with the senator. congratulations on winning texas and oklahoma. where do you go from super tuesday. how do you get the republican nomination. >> the whole process of this primary has been a windowing. we started with 17 candidates a year ago and the first four starts brought that down consid considerly. i think tonight will continue to narrow the field. at this point 15 states have voted and only one candidate has
7:55 pm
beaten donald trump three different times. more the republicans and it's about 70% of republicans nationwide who recognize donald is no the the best candidate to go head-to-head with hillary, that he almost certainly loses to hillary. for the republicans who don't want to see donald as the nominee, i would encourage them we have to come together and ify. the only way to beat donald trump is to stand together. >> marco rubio at his speech promised to take this to a contest in had convention and vow vowed not to get out the race. what's your strategy to try to make it a two-man race. >> every candidate is going to look at the election results, they're going to reflect on it and pray about it and give it careful consideration. >> should somebody drop out? >> i think the people who are running, all of them love this country and they're putting this country first and if it becomes clear to a candidate that that candidate does not have a path to the nomination, has not been able to win a state in 15
7:56 pm
contests or rack up delegates, i think there comes a point where you have to ask do you want donald trump to be the nominee. it donald trump is the nominee i think the republicans get cloberred. i think we lose the senate, lose to hillary and lose the speert. i know the other republicans running don't want that so i know people are going to look at the results and consider what do and it is my hope that as a party we come together and say stop this madness. do not nominate a candidate who will drive the party off a cl f cliff. >> reporter: you talk about wanting to unite conservatives. i assume that means establishment conservatives who back donald trump. how do you expect the same people that you rejected to come back you? >> very much the way reagan did in 1980. we have said that i believe 2016 will be an election like 1980.
7:57 pm
ronald reagan started off and washington resisted him but in time he brought republicans together and un ified them. today every republican is a reagan republican. if we're going to stop donald trump, we can't have a divided field. if it remains a divided field, then donald's path to the nomination remains much more likely and i think that would be catastrophic. at this point for republicans there's a clear choice. if you want a candidate who agrees with hillary clinton on foreign policy, on fiscal and economic policy and on social policy, that's donald trump, but he has been a washington deal maker for 40 years. he's supported liberal democrats for 40 years and i don't think republicans want to hand the election to hillary clinton and the democrats. >> reporter: last question donald trump is your ultimate rival here as you see it, but you've lost to him among evangelicals in several states, the very conservatives, the exact people that you are trying
7:58 pm
to bring together. so put aside the rest of the field, how do you beat donald trump when he has performed as well as he has performed tonight? >> we beat him the same way we did in iowa, texas and oklahoma. we beat him by bringing together the reagan coalition. the role of these early primaries is narrowing the fi d field. we have to get one on one. he has a ceiling of about 40% beyond which he doesn't go and what he benefits right now is everybody else being divided. it's my hope that the party will say it is reckless at a time when the stakes have never been higher, it's rek lckless to rol the dice and nominate donald trump. donald trump may be the one candidate that hillary clinton can beat. the democrats are celebrating. we can't let that happen. it would be one thing if donald trump agreed with republicans on
7:59 pm
policy, but he agrees with hillary clinton, he supported barack obama and hillary clinton on the wall street bail yout. he agrees with bernie sanders to make obamacare socialized medicine, he agrees with hillary clinton in support of planned parenthood. he agrees with hillary clinton in support of john kerry. he supported john kerry against george w. bush and his position on foreign policy he said he would be neutral with israel. that's the same position as hillary clinton. i don't think the republicans want the general election to consist of two rich new york liberals, one republican and one democrat running against each other. we should nominate a real conservative and i believe that's what we're going to do. >> reporter: yes or no, you're not calling on anybody to drop out of the race. >> each candidate will look at the numbers and make a decision with their best conscious.
8:00 pm
>> reporter: brian will toss it back to you. >> thank you. hailey with ted senator, ted c on two different fronts tonight. let's join folks at the top of this hour. and at the top of the hour, we have learned tonight that the projected winner of the colorado democratic caucus is bernie sanders. not quite the night they had hoped for, but 78 delegates at stake, with 19% of the vote in, these numbers are still on the move, obviously, 58-41 victory. the headlines tonight, as we come to the top of this hour, a good outing this evening for donald trump, a good outing for hillary clinton. we have heard from both. and observers found differences in their tones, respectively,
8:01 pm
concerning the campaign just passed and where we're going to go. trump, most notably, as we look at his line of victories and here's the states won by hillary clinton tonight. trump had an event at maro largo, his florida home, that looked for all the world, again, with added pastel light gels on the curtains and flags behind him. >> like a tinkerbell version of a presidential press conference. >> looked like something in the east room of the white house. >> these events are hard to pull off, so you had to give him credit for audacity. >> that's more than credit, that's a compliment. >> it was incredible if. >> he made a real turn tonight. >> what were we seeing there? what happened? >> he made a turn, and i'm going to call it the chris christie effect. i think he got some feedback that the last seven days were not helpful, if he hopes to do what ted cruz just described, which is to bring what peggy noonan called tonight a broken republican party together.
8:02 pm
and i think that hillary clinton and donald trump, in very different ways, tried to do the same thing. she did it with the content, the substance of her message, a unifying message. he tried to do it by toning down some of the bombast of the last two weeks. >> while still issuing threats. >> he's still donald trump. >> but did it in a calmer tone of voice. >> but there are two donald trumps, and the one of the last seven days two takes three to disavow the kkk, really, you know, there's a pill we all need to take to get through that. but the one of tonight was someone -- some will never go for, but he's one that people could come to terms with more quickly. >> this one had chris christie standing over his shoulder, in the shot at all times. chris christie,ed t head of the republican governors's association, an establishment figure. they don't get much more establishment than the jobs he has had. and that added a certain -- boy, i'm going to use a word i've
8:03 pm
never used with donald trump -- gravitas -- i was going to say it! i'm sorry. >> i felt it! >> you felt it coming! >> word score, gene! >> i'm sorry -- >> talk about your feelings right now. >> i had to use the word. i'm sorry. but it added that. >> i agree. >> to trump's appearance. now, tomorrow, he could be, you know, like a balloon that you just let the air out of. he could, you know, be zapping around the -- you know, the room on one of his antic trump things. >> i feel like we're all going to say, "hello, eugene." make sure you put money in the coffee box. >> we've got a couple of races where we still don't know what the result is. the minnesota caucuses, obviously. the rubio campaign clinging to that as their possible win for tonight. also, we do not have a winner yet in vermont, where the second place runner -- or the person who's in second right now to donald trump is john kasich, of all people.
8:04 pm
with that in mind, and with a lot of other races settled, steve kornacki's got an eye on the delegate count, and what this means in terms of the overall formal mathematical race for the republican nomination. >> and i want to start by saying, look, this is really complicated math on the republican side. this is sort of an estimate here that we're putting together, a sort of back of the envelope calculations. but the key here, remember, on the republican side, you're looking for 1,237 delegates. we'll get to the scoreboard in just a minute. but to set it up, i want to explain something that's happened tonight. we were talking about this earlier. these thresholds that exist in some of these states. you see them in alabama, in tennessee, in texas, in georgia, in vermont. to get a share of the statewide delegate pool there, you basically need to be getting 20% in these states. what we're seeing right now is that rubio, with about two-thirds of the vote in texas, right now is under that 20% threshold. you also have to be in the top two in congressional districts there. he's in danger of pretty much being shut out in texas right now. alabama, right now, he is short
8:05 pm
of the statewide threshold of getting any delegates there. tennessee, he's right at the number. vermont, he's right at the number. that's one thing to keep in mind when we go to this next screen and give you the actual delegate estimates. this is where it stands. this is what nbc news is allocating to these candidates. but there'll be more coming in tonight. and when we look at all those states, look at the trump wins, look at rubio right now, seeming to do well in minnesota. the rough estimate we've come up with here at the end of the night, we think donald trump will be sitting somewhere around 350 total delegates in this thing. we think that ted cruz will be sitting somewhere around 195. again, winning texas is huge for him tonight. that accounts for the lion's share, the bulk of what he's putting up there. marco rubio, we think, is going to be somewhere north of 100. we're thinking about 115. john kasich will get a couple more too. but these are sort of the three big ones in contention right
8:06 pm
now. and in terms of where this goes from here, 1237, that's the number you need to be nominated, over the next week, we'll start to get into some other big states. this weekend, you'll have kansas, you'll have kentucky, you'll have caucuses in those states. louisiana will have a primary. next week, michigan is a big one. michigan is a state that john kasich has been targeting, but his campaign says they think donald trump can win there. and you get to the 15th, and that's where you get that winner take all state of florida. that's 99 delegates in that state alone. you'll have ohio, north carolina, missouri. some big states. these numbers can start to add up fast, but this is roughly where we think this is going to end up tonight on that road to 1,237. >> steve kornacki, thanks. it's also been proffered there are two conversations. there's the existential conversation about the future of the republican party and there's anything you want to say about delegates. but anyway, that's the theory of others. chris matthews remains in the
8:07 pm
great state of texas, and chris, i just want to get you on the record, on all of it, or part of it, as they say at the supreme court. >> well, you know, i think the big story tonight is the incredible loyalty of african-americans to the democratic party, of the clintons. i think that we saw in hollywood this past weekend, that they don't have clout in hollywood, but they sure have great clout on the democratic party. if you look at these victories, last week, south carolina, alabama, arkansas, tennessee, and georgia. it's the black vote. it's the black voters going out, individually. not because of some leader, especially, but because individually, they feel, they give trust to hillary clinton. we heard it from john tonight, john lewis tonight, talking about the clinton relationship with african-americans. it is so powerful, so if hillary clinton does welcome the next president, her constituency begins with african-americans, because of what they've done for her. they have absolutely given her this nomination, because of the
8:08 pm
force of their loyalty, in come oug ing out and voting individually. it's a stirring achievement that's of loyalty to a person a family, we saw tonight. and i think it's going to continue in states like kentucky and it's going to keep going, starting in the deep south, the old cotton south and working its way around the country. it's powerful stuff. and i think it is, to me, the big story of the night, the african-american community showing its clout. >> chris, one more question, chris, and it has to do with eugene's use of the g-word tonight. gravitas, where it pertains to chris christie. and that would be early evidence that that event at maro lago tonight with chris christie in the background, donald trump in the front, and what that would mean chris christie conveyed to donald trump and a change in trump's tone. do you agree with it? >> well, speaking of the oscars, i would give him the oscar for
8:09 pm
best performance in a supporting role. i have no idea what he was thinking, but it was probably the same thing that trump was thinking when he had had to stand behind sarah palin a couple weeks ago. not exactly satisfaction, just guessing. >> all right, chris, thank you. thanks to the folks assembled in the great state of texas behind chris matthews. we have another call. the projected winner in what was tonight a long-fought race between senator sanders of a neighboring state and hillary clinton. our projection is that hillary clinton has won the democratic primary in the bay state of massachusetts. >> i should say here that there's a couple of things about this that are important. first of all, is that the sanders' campaign had said, and senator sanders personally had said that he was going to win massachusetts. so this is going to be a
8:10 pm
disappointment nor tfor the san campaign. so regardless of whether or not they had ever said they were going to win, massachusetts is the kind of state that you would expect senator sanders to do well in. obviously, he won in a rout tonight in his home state of vermont. he won by a very large margin in the neighboring state of new hampshire. massachusetts is also a neighboring state, and one that he spent a lot of money in, and tried very hard to win. i should also mention that at about 6:15 tonight, i heard from the clinton campaign that they did not expect to win in massachusetts. and that may be spin from the clinton campaign. they may be trying to lower expectations so that a victory seems all the more sweet. it didn't seem to me like spin, but it doesn't mean that it wasn't. i think this massachusetts victory by hillary clinton tonight, there were mixed polls heading into this tonight. i think if you are a supporter of the sanders' campaign, or indeed, the sanders' campaign itself, that one's got to sting a little bit. we can find out, though, directly, because joining us now is a very high-profile endorser of senator sanders.
8:11 pm
senator sanders does not have a ton of congressional endorsements, but this week he got one from the vice chair of the dnc. the vice chair resigned in order to make this endorsement for senator sanders. thanks very much for being with us. good to see you tonight. >> good to join you both. >> this massachusetts results is obviously a disappointment for senator sanders' campaign and his supporters. as somebody who has just become a formal endorser, has just signed on with the sanders' campaign, do you feel like the campaign is where it needs to be? >> i think that senator sanders' approach to this is really looking at the delegates, understanding the proportional way they're distributed, and really looking at the vast majority of the states across the country, where the american people have still yet to cast their votes. and this is where i felt it was important to come in, to resign from the dnc, set aside that
8:12 pm
neutral ground, and endorse senator sanders and to help make very clear to the american people about the stark contrast between our two democratic candidates for the presidency. in particular as it relates to secretary clinton having a record and positions that will take us into a future that will include more interventionist wars of regime change, and skon trasting that with senator sanders, his record and his positions of fighting against those who threaten the united states, but stopping these interventionists wars and regime changes that have cost our country so much and inhibited our ability to actually invest in rebuilding our nation here at home and in these programs that are important to communities all across the country. >> i have to ask one strategic question, in terms of the way the democratic primary is being fought. obviously, the timing of your endorsement is a real boost to senator sanders, especially because it came at great political sacrifice of your own, having to give up that leadership position in the dnc, but the thing that's going on
8:13 pm
right now, in the democratic primary, is that senator sanders, despite all the money that he's got, and the big crowds that he turns out, and the big appeal of his message, he's done so much better than people expected, and at the very start of this campaign, he didn't contest every state tonight, effectively, on super tuesday. there were 11 states at stake tonight. he only really competed for about five of them. he ran a few ads in texas, but that was it. is senator sanders actually trying to win, if there are whole swaths of the country in which he's not even really running. >> i'm going to leave kind of the political punditry and analysis to you folks and to others. i know, from my conversations with senator sanders, that he believes very deeply in the mission that he has embarked on, he will carry out this cain to every single state across the country, yes, to win the nomination, because he understands, as i do, how much is at stake for our country. and how much is at stake for our
8:14 pm
next generation and our future. obviously, it's a very tough race, but, it's important for this message to get out there, that's focused on these critical issues, and as you know, we spoke last night about the impact of these issues of war and peace, and how very little the american people, many in the media and others are even talking about the cost. this is something that's deeply personal to me pip lost friends in that iraq war in 2005 during my deployment there. i saw in my job at a medical unit, every day that high human cost. and now here in my work in congress, that economic toll that continues. so, this is a central question to any other issue that presidential candidates talk about, because if we continue down these -- this path of interventionist regime change wars as we're seeing in syria, if this syrian war continues, we will not have those resources to fund these important social programs and to really provide
8:15 pm
that investment into our future here at home. >> and congresswoman, i know that as an iraq war veteran, you don't scare easily, but you obviously have gained doubt, what happens if by splitting with the debbie wasserman schultz, hillary clinton dnc, and let's say senator sanders is not successful, how unpleasant like can become for a democrat in the house under a president clinton. >> yeah, brian, i'll be very honest with you. a lot of people warn me against doing what i did. but this is a very serious issue and what i did speaks to the high stakes that exist. war is a very real thing. it's real to me. it's real to our service members and their families, those who have borne this heavy sacrifice of war for so long and over many different generations. so for those who simply dismiss
8:16 pm
this idea that, you know, well, they're not really going to pay attention to secretary clinton's foreign policy record as it relates to these interventionist regime change wars that have cost us so much win respectfully ask them to think again and really look at this heavy toll that these wars have taken and that this isn't a question of the past and what happened in iraq, this is a question of today and tomorrow and what kind of commander in chief as we as americans and myself and other service members can be confident will not continue to take us down this failed path of more costly regime change wars that do nothing to strengthen our national security, and simply serve to strengthen our enemy. groups like isis and al qaeda and others. that's -- it's very serious. >> congresswoman tulsi gabbard, rank in the army reserve is major, if memory serves? >> you got it, brian. >> congresswoman, thank you very much.
8:17 pm
>> have a great night. >> and we will be back with more coverage right after this break.
8:18 pm
8:19 pm
8:20 pm
at 11:20 eastern time, we are back with a call. the minnesota gop caucus goes to marco rubio. we saw him speak earlier tonight with his family in miami. rubio campaign coming off a less-than-stellar super tuesday was all about pushing forward to florida. that was his ticket to the bank, joe namath pledge that he was going to win his home state of florida. donald trump certainly has other plans for his adopted part-time home state of florida, but rubio, nonetheless, the gop
8:21 pm
caucus in minnesota. we are back with our guests, our friends at this table. can i summarize your position this way at the end of a long night? >> okay. >> is it the end? is that -- >> well, no. >> okay. >> you contend, a, that chris christie has already had a centering effect, a mollifying effect on donald trump. >> based on tonight's performance. >> and -- >> do you know if he was trying to do that? >> i mean, i think that he saw an opportunity to be involved in the campaign. it's not -- it's katy tur's report, it's not a big campaign, there's not a big campaign staff, and i think that anyone who has done this before, and i think trump admired christie's political acumen has an opportunity to influence the candidate. >> and eugene, is it your contention that we are witnessing a republican party, not unlike a crystal goblet on its way down to the ground that's about to shatter into a
8:22 pm
thousand pieces? >> unless it's already hit the floor. i mean, yes. that's -- i think the party has cracked. i don't think this is a coherent political party anymore, that knows who it is, what it stands for, what it's trying to accomplish. there are very differing visions of all of that within the republican party, at a time when, ironically, the party in many ways is very successful. it controls both houses of congress, it controls most state houses, most state legislatures, so it's huge. >> very good point. >> it's huge. it's a very big tent. but beneath this big tent are warring factions that -- and this whole thing -- i mean, trump is not solely responsible for what's happening. he came at a time when you had
8:23 pm
these various points of view and sort of incipient groupings under the big tent and he certainly has been the catalyst in his own -- >> and he -- >> way. >> and he has to own his language. to your piece this week, using language a lot of us did not raise our children to -- >> no! >> -- use. and prohibited it. >> no. and in a sense, that just kind of gave everyone permission to act out and to say things that just are not said in our polite political discourse. and i'm talking not just about rubio's mimicry, essentially, of trump's transgressive language, but by being -- by not playing by the rules, he kind of gave everybody else permission not to play by the rules, as well. it's -- i am not sure how this all gets put back together.
8:24 pm
i really am not sure. they used to say, democrats fall in love, republicans fall in line. today's republicans, they -- >> they've fallen apart. >> i agree with the glass is shattered. i would say two things. you know, a lot of this started building during the bush years, when compassionate conservatism included a growing federal government. there were rumblings, we heard it a lot on talk radio, that the prescription drug benefit was too expensive, that the federal role in the no child left behind act was too much of a -- so this undercurrent has been present since 2001, 2002. it's been building. i would say the failed campaign of john mccain and mitt romney sort of cemented this idea that national republicans are losers. and donald trump came right in, tapped right into that, and made them feel like they could win again. and i would be cautious about assigning too much commitment to the policies he's talking about. yes, large numbers of his supporters do support a wall.
8:25 pm
and some of them do support the very unconstitutional idea of a ban on muslims. but the vast majority of them are enamored with the idea of winning and with the strength that he projects. >> it's a strong arm campaign more than it is about any individual policy. >> another break. our coverage will continue. steve kornacki at the board with new numbers right after this.
8:26 pm
8:27 pm
8:28 pm
8:29 pm
at 11:28 eastern time, we have another call from the great state of minnesota. the projected winner of their caucus on the democratic side tonight, bernie sanders over hillary clinton, 59-41 with about a third of the vote in. nevertheless, it's our projection that he will add to that his pile from the evening. also, let's check in on vermont. republican barn-burner there tonight. donald trump, john kasich. john kasich, who, to a lot of people who know vermont politics, made sense as a republican whose message right then and now would make sense to voters in vermont. well, it turns out they were right. there's an 809-vote difference right now in the raw count. trump leading.
8:30 pm
too close to call. we just updated, 842. slipping away. too close to call. about 80% of the vote in in vermont. interesting stories all around. >> i think john kasich has got to be as surprised as anybody to be in the running for any individual state. but if there was going to be one, there were three states he was really trying in terms of his ad dollars. it was there, massachusetts, and alaska. we have yet to have a poll closing up in alaska. that will be coming up at midnight eastern time, i believe. in terms of the sanders' campaign versus the clinton campaign, obviously tonight has been a very good night for hillary clinton. she has swept all of the races in the south. she, in addition, has won massachusetts. and massachusetts is one of the five states that bernie sanders said that he could win and wanted to win tonight. senator sanders has achieved four of those five goals tonight. he didn't there in massachusetts, but he got there everywhere else. we also saw senator sanders tonight in essex junction, vermont, at his victory rally
8:31 pm
after he won in his home state. the senator said, i will win hundreds of delegates tonight. he said, we will win hundreds of delegates. we're going to check in with steve kornacki to see if it looks like that part of senator sanders' expectations and his promise tonight is going to come true. steve? >> that's right, hundreds is what he'll walk away with. unfortunately for him, hundreds is also what hillary clinton is going to walk away with. and the target is over 200 delegates. the delegate math a little different on the democratic side. we want to give you our best sense o of where things stand right now. this is the official nbc delegate count at this hour. you have counts coming in from these various states that have reported. what you have are the delegate they've won before tonight and also a bunch of super delegates. and the super delegates, remember, they're elected officials, they're party leaders, they automatically vote at the convention. they are not given out in any of these states, but a lot of them have publicly declared which side they're on. so they are being counted in here as well. sew with want to take you through a few steps of the math
8:32 pm
in this thing right now. first of all, if you look at all of the states that have been projected, we have a rough estimate. i want to say, this is a rough estimate we put together, again, back of the envelope, but we think when this night ends on the democrat side, we think hillary clinton is going to pick up, just from today's contest, a total of about 525 delegates. now, their target for the clinton campaign was 500. that would be a little bit over that. we think the sanders' campaign, again, this is rough, will pick up about 335. this is just from tonight. what does this actually mean for the delegate math? look at it this way. we'll give you the best estimate we have of everything here. hillary clinton walked into tonight with the following. she had won 113 pledged delegates in the contests that took place so far. she won them in south carolina and new hampshire and all those states. she also had 428 super delegate commitments. so you add those together and you've got 541 that she walked into tonight with. if you add what we think is
8:33 pm
about 525, that's going to put her -- quick math here, about 1,066. sanders walked into tonight with 66 pledged delegates from those first contests. he had an additional -- and this is where the big difference is on the democratic side, only 22 super delegates who pledged to him. and again, if we say he's walking away with 335 tonight, you do the math, 88, 4, 23, something like that? that's roughly what we're -- what we think the spread is going to look like at the end of tonight on the democratic side. that puts hillary clinton roughly halfway to where she needs to be to win the nomination. >> i just had a bad math flashback to sister rosemary. i'm working through it. >> a note on the degree of difficulty in minnesota for bernie sanders, both of the democratic senators from minnesota endorsed hillary clinton. caucuses are very much about organization, local
8:34 pm
organization, very impressive for bernie sanders to go into that state and pull that off with the basic, with the local party institutions lined against him. >> on that note, there is one -- there was one side bar story tonight about that massachusetts race that i found absolutely fascinating, which is that we all -- one of the things we get excited about in political punditry and this type of political reporting and dirty tricks in the campaign. south carolina republicans are the most famous for the best, aka worst, dirty tricks. but in massachusetts, ahead of this massachusetts vote, somebody started circulating online today a fake "new york times" story that purported to report that elizabeth warren had endorsed bernie sanders ahead of the massachusetts primary. she has not done so. but this "new york times" report circulated online making it look like she had. nobody has claimed credit for it. it has since been taken down but democrats don't do dirty tricks like that against each other very often. >> hillary clinton, she won it in boston, which is the way you win massachusetts. i got the word before i could
8:35 pm
say it here, that she was leading by 15 points in the city of boston. when you hear that, you've won massachusetts. >> she apparently also won worcester, and his stronghold was central and western massachusetts. but let the record show elizabeth warren has not made an endorsement. she's the only female democratic senator who hasn't endorsed hillary clinton. >> let's see here. i think we're going to go to andrea mitchell down in miami. and andrea, the question is kind of one of those, what have we learned tonight in the political arc and life of hillary clinton? we can't forget that this has been quite a stack of states on this super tuesday for her. >> reporter: indeed. and as you can hear them tearing down the stage around me, this was a big celebration. and she held her own in the south, she ran up the minority votes, she did well in texas across the border, and she, for the first time in a number of states, won the white vote. less so well with the white men,
8:36 pm
but she overall did win the white vote. they believe that she has proved that she can have a diverse national base that she is on her way toward, but not yet there, winning the nomination, that she's going to be respectful to bernie sanders. she congratulated him, but did not take any shots at him. all of her shots were reserved for donald trump tonight, and not nearly as nasty as the shots that donald trump lobbed back at her. so game on for a general election campaign between these two front-runners. neither of which has narrowed down the nomination, but both of whom feel that they are going to be running against each other. >> campaign season is always so lucrative for rigors and staging companies, as they do the takedown tonight. >> andrea mitchell, thank you so much. another break for us. our live coverage of super tuesday continues right after this.
8:37 pm
8:38 pm
8:39 pm
hey how's it going, hotcakes? hotcakes. this place has hotcakes. so why aren't they selling like hotcakes? with comcast business internet and wifi pro, they could be. just add a customized message to your wifi pro splash page and you'll reach your customers where their eyes are already - on their devices. order up. it's more than just wifi, it can help grow your business. you don't see that every day. introducing wifi pro, wifi that helps grow your business. comcast business. built for business.
8:40 pm
in just about 20 minutes, we will have our last poll closing of the night, when the alaska caucuses close their doors, and we may start to get our first characterization of that race. there was one race tonight where the polls are closed, but we cannot yet project a winner. and that's in the vermont republican race. very interesting, john kasich and donald trump battling it out there, less than 900 votes between them in vermont. as you see, about 81% of the vote in. but this race has been too close to call for several hours tonight. vermont was in our very first round of poll closings tonight, but this one has been a nail biter all night long. let's go now back to texas, to our friend chris matthews, who's got some guests with him there at the smokehouse.
8:41 pm
>> thank you, rachel. let's go to rick tyler. we have a great crowd here. rick tyler with howard fineman. my great question, what are we going? howard, where's this party, the republican party, let's start with the republicans, where are they headed after tonight? >> well, they're -- >> picking a president. >> they're headed towards a confrontation with donald trump if they attempt to gather together to stop him in a way that he finds to be unfair, which, of course, for him would be any way at all. talking to his inner circle tonight, first of all, they're pretty feisty and they're almost daring people like paul ryan and mitch mcconnell and marco rubio and lawyers for the rnc, past and present, to come after him. and they're planning their own counterattack against the possibility that this goes to convention and some shenanigans are pulled by people looking at the fine print and rules. the trump people are going to be doing the exact same thing. >> so the empire strikes back? >> well, it's -- >> really?
8:42 pm
the washington types? >> well, i think what the trump people are doing right now is planning for that possibility. they're very seriously planning for the idea -- >> but isn't that something we've gotten very good at? the pope attacks, they look good. vicente fox attacks, they look good. they love these foils. >> and this would be the ultimate foils, as rick knows. the best thing you could have happen to you to politics today is to have what's called an establishment go after you. >> let's go over to you, rick. cruz said tonight, he made an appeal to the party to unite behind him. he's never been exactly a party guy. >> lindsey graham echoed that tonight. he said, we may have to rally -- >> he's desperate. tell me how that works. tell me how cruz gets to be nominee at this point. >> well, look, he won texas tonight. >> and won oklahoma too. >> he won oklahoma, too. >> and he won iowa once, so that's three. >> he's got three wins. so he's got -- he'll roughly come out about 100 delegates
8:43 pm
ahead of marco rubio tonight, and marco rubio does not want to see donald trump -- >> but rubio won't quit, because rubio won minnesota. >> he won minnesota. he's got to spend all this time in florida now, because today according to the polls, he wouldn't win florida. so he'll have to sacrifice other states to win florida. >> so you spend the next two weeks with rubio planning to hold it off. he's the alamo now. he'll try to hold it. if he doesn't, he's probably finished in florida politics, so he'll fight for that, right? all this time, your guy's waiting for him to quit the race. he's not going to, he's going to stay in at least two more weeks while your guy is waiting for him to quit. there's no theme here. >> the theme is they have lost control of their party. >> howard, i don't see any clear one on one establishment by cruz or rubio. >> actually, this is a somewhat advantageous position for donald trump to be in right now. >> yeah! >> as rick was pointing out, there are some closed primaries coming up, closed primaries in which only republicans can vote that are helpful to cruz. but there are also a number of
8:44 pm
primaries coming up that are winner take all, and what that means is first past the post. it means you don't have to win an outright majority. if you finish first, you get all the delegates. >> by one vote. >> so it's in donald trump's advantage to have rubio stay in, to have kasich stay in, to have ben carson linger around. and that dilutes ted cruz's possibility of getting into a one-on-one situation. i don't think cruz would be the guy to lead a revolt against donald trump at a convention. i don't think that would be the case. >> so give me any scenario besides trump being the nominee. give me some other scenario. howard, you've heard about one. they've got this intrigue in the washington capital. they're plotting against him. how does he win? >> i think that's the big fantasy right now or the big game plan by what's left of the republican party establishment. the problem is, they don't have candidate. marco rubio is one out of 14, i believe. you know, you don't win nominations that way. >> and lindsey graham's given up
8:45 pm
on him. >> and cruz can't clear the field. i agree with ted cruz. i've covered a lot of cruz events. his people are committed and they love him. if he could make it a one on one contest, i think he'd have a fair shot. but whether he has the time to get there is highly questionable. >> let's be honest, you were loyal to him and you'll be loyal to him in the next couple of minutes, but cruz is a guy that makes trump look okay, because they don't like cruz in washington. he's called a liar. >> that's okay, chris. >> tell me how it works. >> the washington establishment has been bankrupting this country for a long time. people are getting hammered, people are sick of it. and the people of texas sent ted cruz to go to washington, not to get a law, not to go to cocktail parties -- >> -- that's what i thought was odd. >> but around the country, if you go to a ted cruz event, people are unified -- >> he's asking the other republicans to drop out of the race in favor of him. -- always been a maverick. >> they're going to have a
8:46 pm
choice. >> what's this prayerfully drop out? he said it twice tonight. it's a religious experience. it's an odd -- >> this may shock you, chris, but some people do look for divine guidance. >> but he's asking for those people to be inspired to back him. >> i think he might need divine intervention for that to happen. but you make a very good point. ted cruz, whatever you want to say about him, is not known for collegiality in politics. collegiality with his supporters, but not in politics. and for him to say i want to unify the party is a big change in his public personal. >> are you two guys impressed by hillary's performance tonight, her ability to rack up vote after vote. >> she may have sealed the nomination tonight. i think bernie being in the race serves a good person for her. it makes her look rational. this crowd may not agree with that, but that's -- >> howard? >> i wish i could say that bernie winning oklahoma would turn things around for him.
8:47 pm
i don't think that's necessarily going to be the case. >> i'm just impressed -- back to you guys -- >> he's sticking in there. >> rachel knows massachusetts, but most people on the outside will say elizabeth warren's state went for hillary clinton. >> leave all the southern states out of it. the big win for hillary tonight was massachusetts. >> back to you guys. >> i think that's -- i do think that's right. i think on the democratic side tonight, i said it in advance of tonight, i said it in advance of knowing what the two campaigns expected from massachusetts, it's not only a big delegate haul tonight, but it is important, in terms of the course of this race. i think everybody knew that hillary clinton was going to do very, very well in the south. oklahoma was a wild card, and the sanders' campaign felt like they had a wild and they did. they knew they had those caucus states wired. they also thought they knew they would get massachusetts. so that massachusetts result, i live in massachusetts, i'm there every weekend.
8:48 pm
the amount of campaign material and the amount of campaign effort put out by the sanders' campaign was absolutely overwhelming. so for them to try that hard in massachusetts and then not pull it out, that is, legitimately, a disappointment for the sanders' campaign. now, i don't think it's a fatal one. i think anybody who raised $42.5 million in february, including $6 million yesterday. >> he raised more -- >> yesterday! >> bernie sanders raised more money yesterday than marco rubio raised in the entire month of january. bernie sanders is minting money and all the people he's getting it from are giving it to him in small amounts. so he can go back to all of them, over and over and over again. there's no reason to count bernie sanders out until he wants to be out, if only because he can float on a sea of money all the way to philadelphia. >> let's match chris matthew's use of latin. we have to ixnay to a break. we'll be back on the other side.
8:49 pm
8:50 pm
8:51 pm
8:52 pm
at about eight minutes before the hour, i want to take a look at the vermont board here. still too close to call, though this margin has been back and forth all night, it presently stands just north of a thousand, between donald trump and john kasich. we're getting up there, 83% of the vote in. lawrence o'donnell, steve schmidt remain with us. steve, my question to you, i'm listening to chris and howard
8:53 pm
out in texas, using past tense language to describe the republican establishment, which i could have sworn six weeks ago was a thing, a real living, breathing thing. are we really shoveling dirt on top of the notion of a gop establishment? >> when you look at the totality of all of it, and you hear the stories of the republican donor base are going to raise $25 million for a last-ditch rescue mission for marco rubio in florida or marco rubio can continue on having won the minnesota caucuses, being 1 for 14, or ted cruz talking about prayerful consideration of everyone dropping out to rally around him, or mitch mcconnell and paul ryan and the oppositional forces to donald trump gathering now in washington, d.c., i'm always reminded -- i always love the quote that winston churchill ended his first volume of his memo memoirs, the gathering storm about world war ii, on the night that he became the prime
8:54 pm
minister, reminiscing about how he went to bed that night. he said, i had no need for cheering dreams, facts are better than dreams. and the facts tonight are this. donald trump is winning many states all over the country. the republican establishment in washington, d.c. is powerless to stop it. and they're powerless to stop it, because what's animating these voters is rebellion against the establishment in washington, d.c., who they view as complicit, corrupt and bankrupting the country and weakening the country, and rejecting the policies that they believe favor the top at the expense of everybody else. >> lawrence? >> 66% of trump supporters believe that president obama is a muslim. that's where the rage begin. 60% of them believe that we have a president of the united states who was not a natural born citizen and therefore not legitimately and legally president of the united states.
8:55 pm
85% of trump supporters walking out of the polls today say they support the ban -- unconstitutional ban on muslims entering the country. these are people who share trump's unconstitutional dreams. they have no concept of what this government is actually capable of doing and what it cannot do. paul ryan came out the day trump announced the muslim ban and said that will never happen. the speaker of the house controls all such legislation that would be necessary to make that happen. he won't allow it to even have a hearing. if it even did get passed, it would be ruled unconstitutional instantaneously. >> and what about the fear of a lot of republicans that trump runs to the right, governs to the center, and leaves in the process, although supporter who is supported him -- >> oh, he will. >> what about the frustration it creates. >> once you get into governing, there is no trump section of the government. absolutely none. and so, there would be -- there would be zero votes, zero movement for, let's build the
8:56 pm
wall, for example. there will be no building of the wall. no one's going to appropriate the money from that. to appropriate the money from that, you have to take it from something else. tell me what it is you're going to take it from. >> i thought mexico was going to pay for. >> mexico's not going to pay for it. we're going to find that out very, very quickly. so, yeah, they're going to be -- and trump's going to do that fast-talking salesman thing that he does that usually includes a bunch of pathological lies that casually fall out of his mouth as he's saying it. >> which has nothing to do with the fact we have to go to a commercial break and we'll be right back after this.
8:57 pm
8:58 pm
8:59 pm
9:00 pm
welcome back as we begin a new hour tonight. especially for folks just sitting down in front of the television wanting to be updated and wondering what tonight's super tuesday night looked like. we have the following summary for you. the story of this evening. starting with donald j. trump. these are the states he came away with. arkansas, georgia, massachusetts, virginia, tennessee and alabama. senator cruz from texas. texas and oklahoma. senator rubio, minnesota. now. we are waiting for vermont.
9:01 pm
the gop race there. very tight. this has been a slug fest tonight between trump and john kasich. bernie sanders, vermont, oklahoma, colorado and minnesota, just awarded. late this evening and hillary clinton, massachusetts, big prize for her. arkansas, tennessee, virginia, texas another big prize. georgia and alabama. that, thus far, the story of super tuesday night. which brings us to our little collection. >> on the democratic side i think things have gone mostly as the campaign has expected tonight again with massachusetts being the exception there, and likely to be a surprise but also a big win for secretary clinton. there are a lot of delegates there. it is interesting, it is one of those states where they have a lot of delegates and you look at
9:02 pm
the number and it doesn't look like there are that many until you have the combined number. she overall had an overwhelming lead with the super delegates that that will stack up her numbers towards the nomination in a very unbalanced way as you can see there. on the republican side, donald trump won six states tonight. fighting it out for john kasich with one of them. marco rubio winning minnesota, you wouldn't expect it to be there, but there you have it. and ted cruz, the addition, sort of gravy for him is oklahoma. i think the real question i have right now on the republican side and as somebody who is not a republican and doesn't have x-ray specs in terms of how they're going to start this out is whether or not there is anything that explains the love for marco rubio inside the republican establishment. the republican party, when trump started winning everything decided let's annoint rubio, you
9:03 pm
saw the endorsements flood to rubio. marco rubio had his first win, the minnesota caucus. hard to see why he was the one to pick out of everybody. >> he says his next one will be his home state of florida and on that he has thrown down. let's go to texas and chris matthews. chris, every time we get together i ask you this question. what just happened? >> well, what just happened is the general election has begun. i think if you watched hillary clinton tonight you watched her wrap it up. i think if you watched trump he thought he wrapped it up at least, he may have done that. his attacks against hillary clinton until november, calling her a criminal. there is no limit to what he will say about her. that is the strength of the
9:04 pm
republican party, the strength in getting him elected is her. and her best argument for getting elected is him. and that is the nature of american politics right now. the only way you can win between those two is to make the other one the darth vadar. neither one of these people are perfect and get the country inspired enough but they can certainly build the republican party hatred that is already there for obama. and to get the hatred directed. hillary clinton is not going to forget what he did say or not say about david duke. that will be remembered and memorialized and will galvanized those who thought we could have a president that is undecided about the klan is unimaginable. so this will be a very, very
9:05 pm
tough election with the paramount message -- >> chris i have to ask you, at heart, you're an irish romantic, and you find grandeur and beauty imbedded in the world of politics. and i'm guessing that is just going to take a couple of years off. and that side of the business is going to be absent for a while. >> reporter: well, all of these candidates have something that i can think about that i would say positively about them. but if i do that, people will think i'm positive about them. it's more complicated. every one of them has an attribute that i do respect deeply and at least consider on the mark. but no one adds up so far. trump, in his own way has a sort of romantic quality, a sort of gatsby quality, the country we took from the indians, he sort
9:06 pm
of appeals to the motherland, unfortunately it has a racial aspect to it that can't be put aside very easily. but it's there. america, he knows how to do it. the bad guys are the russians, the chinese. hillary clinton is a lover of government, she is not a great salesman for it but she is a believer in it. she is absolutely committed to government service. i can tell you every day of her life is about what she can do through government. part of it her methodist background. it is what she can do through good works. that is who she is. and i want to say that rubio -- on the issue of immigration has been really good in the past. he chickened out to use the grade school expression because he walked away from his belief.
9:07 pm
he really did believe in a comprehensive setting. as a man who came from the heart of it, the heart of it, take care of people who are here. and the lure of illegal jobs, deal with that fact through everify, and he did it. he was courageous in doing it. he walked away from it. that is his weakness. now he is trying to get the party united behind him. i think we have a lot of incomplete people running for president right now. >> chris matthews, thank you for that insight. >> chris is so good, in terms of what he was just talking about there with trump and cruz, because he didn't want to go there about what he didn't like about ted cruz. one of the things we're getting from the exit, the republican electorate's position on basically the acceptability of the potential nominees, ted cruz winning three states overall
9:08 pm
iowa, texas and oklahoma. marco rubio won minnesota and donald trump having won everything else. when the republican electorate looks at those potential nominees, steve kornacki, what are we seeing it? >> it is interesting, on the republican side he has got his voters. but what about the rest of the party? they say they would never support him. all the primaries today, the exit polls from all the voters and the primaries. we asked a simple question would you be satisfied republicans if cruz is your nominee? 66% said they would be, 65% would be satisfied with marco rubio they say. 50, satisfied with donald trump. so not actually a huge difference between those. but here is where you start to -- oops, i made this mistake before. if cruz is nominated, break this down by the other voters, 59% of them saying i'm not satisfied. much more of a mixed verdict for
9:09 pm
marco rubio supporters. what about the next one? what about if marco rubio is nominated? look at this, donald trump is in a war of words with him publicly. 56% of them say i'm not satisfied. if marco rubio is the candidate, on the flip side cruz supporters say they're ready to live with marco rubio as their nominee if they have to. there is one where there is an agreement. cruz voters saying they would be dissatisfied with donald trump as their nominee. but keep in mind here, donald trump is winning, with the most support overall he has the first choice voters. so really what you're seeing is the rubio and cruz group saying we would be dissatisfied with donald trump, the other side, they're not satisfied with rubio and cruz. >> and from the other side, the democracy poll did a national poll of republican voters and
9:10 pm
they say if it comes down to a general election fight between donald trump and hillary clinton will you know who to vote for? and this is republican voters, 20% of voters say in that scenario i don't actually know who i would vote for. dovetailing results in terms of this rubio and cruz -- >> i'm worried that kornacki is going to pull a muscle. it seems like we should have people -- thank you. they say there is new technology up there. i don't believe them. nicole wallace, eugene robinson, both back with us. i ask you what, hourly, what is the status of the republican party. >> well, i want to answer your question about what the fascination is with marco rubio who until tonight had not won anything yet. when -- >> now he has won the minnesota caucus. >> when you look at electability i haven't had time to look at it
9:11 pm
tonight, but that was the one number where he really trounced trump. in november, is your candidate electable? rubio is in the field of folks left standing. cruz, trump and rubio, and john kasich is still in the field. rubio is viewed as the most electable. the most potential to appeal to more of like a george w. bush -- getting 44% of the latino vote. no one has neared that figure in the two presidential elections. rubio is also viewed as somebody who can grow the republican party. his age is listed as an asset. he has polarized the republican establishment. you see this in the media. there are republicans that are worried about trump. he is a polarizing figure -- >> can we get specific? my perception of this is that the fox news channel is being
9:12 pm
viewed by more insurgent conservative media as basically this the tank for rubio. and there has been a little friction between the rest of the conservative media and fox news for a while but the perception that fox news is in the tank for rubio has driven hostility, not just right wing hostility. >> it's a big story on the right. and we have been talking about this shattered glass that represents the republican party. there is no greater symptom of that wreckage, in my view. i watch fox news that are hosts that are enthusiastic about someone other than trump. there are shows that are viewed as a platform for anti-trump journalists and print-out lists. there are hosts as viewed as putting their finger on the scale as pro-trump. this division in the republican party among these three candidates is playing out among
9:13 pm
conservative media in a vicious way, one i have never seen before. there are bold statements made, hash tag in some circles, never trump. and i think trump supporters, they really stunned everyone. really, the three days it took to disavow the kkk, and this, the fact that the conservative media expressed disbelief at his slow pace in responding. but his supporters, this is where they start to part ways with the national conservative media they dug in and stuck by him tonight. >> sure, and they excused. >> because the rest of you, that is all establishment. >> but -- i have actual news and that is we have a different kind of projection. we'll explain. note the label at the top. first of the evening, apparent
9:14 pm
winner. donald trump has broken the log jam we are projecting in vermont. and here is what this means. we're not trying to be too cute by half. this differs from a full-on projected winner. because in working the math models our folks at the election desk have decided that there is no way john kasich can catch up. can make the numeric difference. so donald trump has added vermont, which in so many ways was kind of ideological match. where john kasich had things worked out differently. states won tonight, arkansas, vermont, georgia, massachusetts, virginia, tennessee, alabama. if you sat down to put together a list -- >> nothing to do with -- >> you really did.
9:15 pm
>> that would be a good list. >> i will tell you. this is historic, there is nobody that ever won the republican nomination in the modern era putting together a coalition of states like this -- >> he has gone for 7 for 11, or 7 for 10. >> we don't yet know about alaska. >> don't know about alaska. >> so if you -- so you put that against rubio, who won in minnesota. and how do you make the electability argument for a guy -- >> because it's the imagined electability -- we have had actual tests of who can win with republican voters. there is only one person that can win with republican voters and that is donald trump. >> in a primary, he is making -- the rubio message is about electability in november, not about winning primaries. >> so at what point do the republican candidates start make
9:16 pm
a -- making a republican argument, because ted cruz, before a republican electorate he loses to donald trump. >> he makes the argument that he is the only committed orthodox ideological conservative in the race, therefore he should be nominated. but half of his party doesn't believe in that orthodox party -- to say nothing about the democrats he would be trying to win in a general election. >> the electability argument should be in the november, not in the primary, because the primary argument is settled. >> here is the other argument, no one is getting out. i watched ted cruz' interview. >> in your defense, the first thing you said -- >> yeah, no one is getting out. i want to say what he has said, ted cruz has run a difficult campaign, everybody that is running, it's very difficult.
9:17 pm
he has put together possibly the best one on the republican side. >> although admit it is hilarious when he says nobody in the field has beat donald trump not once, not twice, but three times. he can be huge 12 times. >> without the math party -- that is for nerds like you. but i will say that ted cruz will have a hard time getting anybody else behind him, because there is no one to get out. >> everybody else got out, people who joined ted cruz. >> i don't believe that is the case, but that is why they're not getting out. >> this way continue through the commercial break. we'll be right back.
9:18 pm
9:19 pm
9:20 pm
hey how's it going, hotcakes? hotcakes. this place has hotcakes. so why aren't they selling like hotcakes? with comcast business internet and wifi pro, they could be. just add a customized message to your wifi pro splash page and you'll reach your customers where their eyes are already - on their devices. order up. it's more than just wifi, it can help grow your business. you don't see that every day. introducing wifi pro, wifi that helps grow your business. comcast business. built for business. 20 minutes after the hour,
9:21 pm
well into the shank of the evening, especially on the west coast this is the only place we have a genuine race going. and they're getting started in alaska, they're starting the suburu, going to the caucus, so too early to call. we have donald trump businessman and marco rubio senator. winning streak, robert costa of "the washington post" -- saying there is no rivalry between the two publications, same thing. we have not introduced them yet, but chuck todd, you have rachel, me and nicole wallace, so keep that in mind as you answer. what have you filed for the web tonight and tomorrow morning on paper edition of "the washington post"? >> my colleague, phil rucker and i just filed our story, super
9:22 pm
tuesday. trump owns the night, he routed and showed depth across the country from massachusetts to georgia to tennessee, there are glimmers of hope, cruz with texas and oklahoma, this is an extended race not ending on any time soon but trump is trying to turn to the general election. >> now, i have watched you the last couple of days talk about what we keep hear iing as athe anecdote, very serious talks and opposition in the republican party of how to get this thing back. how to wrestle to get the party back. what can you add to the record tonight? because their case only intensified tonight? >> i think the key story for wednesday based on all of my reporting tonight, brian, all the anti-trump forces within the republican party are gathering tonight via phone, and e-mail
9:23 pm
tonight here in washington and elsewhere. look for the anti-trump super pacs that are already operating the get more money, look for major seven-figure donors to step out. because as the party remains divided over the candidates on the opposition side, there is still a thought that trump has to be stopped. i expect more ads and money and more people to make themselves known. maybe they're not going to back a specific candidate, but on romney, they step out more forcefully on the trump zone. >> it's very hard to super pac your way out of an idea. a notion that has caught fire with an audience that is more like a group that is kind of a perfect message for the time. and then add to that the stagecraft we saw tonight of a man in full to borrow tom wolf's
9:24 pm
phrase. this candidate was matching a backdrop of great grandeur. what do we do about that? >> it is a fascinating one, when i spoke to republicans tonight, trump seemed measured and seemed to have an eye toward the general election. that more than anything is scaring the elected republicans, thinking that trump is more seasoned as a candidate. he seized the prize and maybe will not make as many mistakes as he did with the kkk comment in recent days. there is a movement within the republican party, a populous one toward trump. the thought is now brian, the convention, july, cleveland, maybe trump could be prevented from getting the 1200-plus delegates that he needs. maybe something could happen. that whole process could break the party apart. >> final question, do you agree with nicole wallace's hunch with
9:25 pm
chris christie, that the whole trump phase in these last few days has been a steadying influence on his demeanor and message? >> i think that is the key point here. because christie has brought an established republican, an elected official who has won in the blue state to the trump campaign. when i looked around the news room, we thought the christie quotes were great in terms of capturing the trump moment, he is a steady hand. somebody who has political instincts that are helping to guide trump. and most importantly he gets trump and knows how to talk to him and guide him. >> robert costa, a first rate reporter with a first rate newspaper, thank you, forgive me, robert, thank you very much for coming on the air. this entire conversation would point toward one man, really, ben ginsburg -- >> what shank --
9:26 pm
>> shank -- >> it's a whole different idea -- we'll take a break.
9:27 pm
9:28 pm
9:29 pm
using that area as an example.
9:30 pm
four years ago, they had 390,000 or so votes, we doubled it to almost 800,000. where as the democrats went down. there is much less enthusiasm for the democrats. >> you will have to trust us, donald trump actually spoke behind the podium with the gold leaf. >> anyone who has a house with a name they're doing okay. built by marjorie post who had had a lot of money of the 58 bedrooms, that is the house. >> is that a home or a resort? can other people go stay there -- >> i don't know, i think it is on the national register, so if you buy it as a home you have to agree to keep it up. >> but does donald trump charge money for people to stay there? >> you're asking the wrong guy. we have the right guy for this conversation, however, ben
9:31 pm
ginsburg is with us, chuck todd is with us, nicole wallace remains with us. all right, counselor, what do you do with your republican party and establishment? >> well, good question, you have to face the reality you have to do a lot in the election, march 15th is kind of the cutoff day and if you care deeply about where the party goes you get into the rules a little bit. and you learn that 73% of the delegates are chosen at state conventions or by state party executive committees with little or no input from the candidate who wins that state. who the actual delegates are is a product of the state parties for the most part. so they're bound to vote for the presidential candidate on the first ballot. they're not bound to vote for the presidential candidate for rules issues. for credentials challenges.
9:32 pm
for the vice presidential nominee, so if you were to devise a plan, you would have to do a state by state number to win the delegates. >> so if you were to organize the numbers to deny donald trump the nomination even though he won the numbers and the most primaries, you would have to organize 50 state parties -- >> it wouldn't be 50. it would probably be 40. that is true. but by the way, trump people also recognize that is a large part of the ball game. so had this is not sort of a -- freebee. >> let's talk him up, this is what ben ginsburg did four years ago, i remember bugging him. he was going to state convention after state convention to prevent ron paul people from essentially stealing delegate
9:33 pm
slots. they would agree to be romney voters but then very quietly do other things around. so you were trying to -- that is what ben is talking about. he has done this. he is the guy making sure this did not happen to romney. so you could use that same skill set. >> it's a wild and romantic life to be able to go to state capit capitols. >> here comes south dakota. but that is what you would have to do. you would have to win over the delegates at the convention who are committed to the person who wins their state on the first ballot but not for the other things. >> but can we do something that is more realistic here? you said march 15th is the cutoff. this is a two-week sprint to deny trump. this is no longer trying to beat him, just to deny him a majority of the delegates before the convention, right? this is where we're at tonight? >> yes, i think realistically this is where you are tonight.
9:34 pm
given the delegate spreads, we don't know where the numbers are right now. >> but we see what it is. >> with about half of the delegates, cruz will get about a third, and rubio a coupkucouple >> then it has been suggested since the end result is you're going to anger trump supporters. you can anger them when you find out it is suggested that trump is going to govern to the center. or you can anger them by saying your movement doesn't matter to us we're going to run somebody else. is that fair? >> well, i think it is and it is not. but the donald trump phenomenon is pretty interesting from an establishment republican perspective. on the othne hand he has done a terrific job of gathering the republican base. the turnout is up so much, while the -- that is a really strong indication changing the form of the electorate is one of the rare skills of a rare politician, barack obama did it,
9:35 pm
for example. george bush did it no ohin ohio 2004 to essentially win the election. donald trump is doing it this time, the note to all the senators in the contested districts that is the plus on donald trump. if he has to expand that electorate by not repudiating david duke, when you see a lot of american flags behind a republican candidate that screams presidential in republican talk. >> i just want to -- i feel like i want to take a big picture of you because you are exactly and only the person who can answer this question that has become central to the entire country's understanding of what is going on with this trump phenomenon. and that is, people really think there is some way for donald
9:36 pm
trump to not get the nomination, even if he effectively wins the nomination by an overwhelming number of primaries and caucuses and heading out not with the conclusive number of delegates but the majority of the delegates. we have had this in a debate in terms of whether or not this is realistic, whether in mathematical terms, could you deny somebody the nomination? do you think realistically donald trump could be denied the nomination if he continues with this kind of momentum in the process? >> so what we're talking about and what i'm describing is the equivalent of a triple bank shot. it has not happened in history, but neither have presidential recounts. every once in a while you get a random event that nobody sees coming. and it could be this, if ted cruz or marco rubio do better on march 5th or march 8th and winner take all on march 22nd,
9:37 pm
then that changes the numbers votes -- >> you're saying if -- >> if marco rubio got his o one-on-one rhetorical shot at donald trump in the last 72 hours, he did everything that was begged of him, went after donald trump. spent more money, he out-spent at least everybody in virginia, it didn't work. so i guess what i'm trying to figure out where is this going to work? >> so there are a couple of -- donald trump can knock out john kasich and marco rubio in one day by winning florida and ohio. if marco rubio manages to win his home state then he is going to be -- he is going to have a plausible case for going on, but not otherwise. >> okay, but meanwhile we have mississippi and michigan and kansas, then nebraska. my guess is three out of four will be trump. maybe cruz pulls off a caucus or two in kansas or nebraska, before we even get to march 15th.
9:38 pm
>> yeah, and again that is going to have to be the proportional dividing of the delegates that manages to keep them sort of in the hunt. that is what they're hoping for. >> you heard the statements tonight. >> counselor, that was very well done. don't move a muscle, we just have to fit a break in. stay with us. please.
9:39 pm
9:40 pm
billions are spent to confuse and, dare i say it, flummox the american public. "save 16% on car insurance." "switch now..." well at compare.com, we say enough's enough. so we've created this mind boggling facility.
9:41 pm
where we're constantly scrutinizing millions of rates... answering the question: who has the lowest. go to compare.com, plug in some simple info and get up to 50 free quotes. choose the lowest, and hit purchase. it's fast and easy. compare.com saving humanity from high insurance rates. i don't care what chuck todd says, it's the shank of the evening. and we are back with the man, rachel, appropriately labelled as the only guy at this time to have this conversation. >> and ben ginsburg is here, a
9:42 pm
republican lawyer extraordinaire. i want to show you marco rubio's performance this evening. marco rubio came in third all over the country tonight. not first, he did come in first in minnesota, second in virginia, all of those states he had third place finish. obviously, we've seen a huge surge of mainstream support for marco rubio both in the form of about $20 million uploaded into his super pac in this last week and a half, and also if you look at his endorsements, just endorsements, it made him look like he was the frontrunner. >> they're funny that way. >> what is the case for marco rubio's viability or ted cruz' viability or indeed john kasich's viability relative to one another if this thing does get decided at the convention? is anything about the primary performance, is there anything
9:43 pm
that will help them win that is decided at the convention in cleveland? >> look, i think if you win a few states, if you get into a contested convention situation, a contested convention has a mindset of its own. it does not necessarily bear any resemblance to the rational world. so in that context avid supporters who understand the rules and know how to build coalitions in chaotic situations can sometimes achieve results you would not predict. >> we also have steve kornacki on deck right now, he has more in terms of delegates. >> yeah, you're having the conversation about delegates how precious they are right now. if you're rubio, you need to accumulate as many as you can and keep trump from getting as many. i want to show you the technical rules here. the problem marco rubio has is thresholds tonight. here is an example, vermont, not all in yet but this could change. right now, rubio at 19%, in
9:44 pm
vermont, the rules say you need 20% or you get zero delegates, you can get some with 20%, but zero with 19, and trump, who is leading, he will benefit from that. check this out, this is alabama, one of trump's best state delegate-wise tonight big reason because marco rubio failed to hit the threshold. he did not get 20% in alabama, he will get zero. also in alabama you need to be in the top two in congressional districts to get delegates, also over 20% there. not looking good for marco rubio on that front either. and then of course there is the mother of them all tonight. texas, you need to be in the top two in the 36 congressional districts there to be eligible for any of those 108 delegates. rubio may be second place in a couple of districts, otherwise shutout. you need to be 20% to get any
9:45 pm
delegates statewide. he also had congressional issues in georgia and arkansas tonight so this is a perfect example you need to get as many delegates as you can. marco rubio left a lot on the table tonight. >> ben, you would be disfranchising a large, sizeable movement. there is a reason behind this trump effort. so who is going to go on record as doing this work, as launching this effort? >> i'm not sure. >> the meeting tomorrow morning -- >> the meeting we were not invited to. that robert costa is talking about. >> it has to be done in shadows and anonymously -- >> you wouldn't be able to do it anonymously from the shadows. you would have to be public from the state conventions to make it work. there will be forces i think aligned with cruz, rubio and
9:46 pm
john kasich. and they will go out and have slates of delegates who will y win, i think you're right about disenfranchising the movement. if somebody goes into the convention lacking a majority of delegates that is a sign of weakness. and so kind of the rules that we were talking about at state conventions they start to apply. nobody goes in with a majority of delegates. that is a historically weak frontrunner. there are rules at the convention that do apply and people will take advantage of those rules and use them to their advantage. >> nicole, you have argued if this were democrats it would be covered and handled differently? >> well, and we've talked about
9:47 pm
the super delegates. if there were republican super delegates who were putting their finger on the scale for marco rubio or ted cruz our party would be in greater revolt than it is. this is in some ways a messy process. one point, though, the rubio campaign acknowledges that part of its purpose now is to stay in to deprive trump of the necessary delegates. >> all campaigns -- they're recognizing the only way to win is at the conventions. >> and cruz didn't seem ready to acknowledge that tonight but that is his only hope, as well. >> essentially the campaign manager will acknowledge it but the candidate is not acknowledging it. which eventually they're going to have to meet. >> one thing, i want to get a clear understanding, there will be rules that say that delegates
9:48 pm
may have to stick with whoever their state voted for on the first ballot. but after the first ballot, the states may be freed out. >> you get to a second ballot with the majority of the votes -- >> that is what sets the free for all. >> you go through the numerical of what is half of 2471 delegates, what people don't always realize is that delegates pledge to candidates whose names are not put in the nomination, are probably unbound delegates so all that math is probably a little bit loose. >> he is just rolling out strategy here. >> thank you. thanks, very much for being with us and taking these questions on during this dicey time. and another break for us, we'll be right back in a few minutes.
9:49 pm
9:50 pm
9:51 pm
when you're on hold, your business is on hold. that's why comcast business doesn't leave you there. when you call, a small business expert will answer you in about 30 seconds. no annoying hold music. just a real person, real fast. whenever you need them. great, that's what i said.
9:52 pm
so your business can get back to business. sounds like my ride's ready. don't get stuck on hold. reach an expert fast. comcast business. built for business. . super tuesday night, as interesting as the story is in the democratic party the republican party is by all accounts facing something of an existential crisis. and we're covering a moving history lesson day by day, night by night, our thanks to ben ginsburg for playing a part in
9:53 pm
that conversation. you mentioned there would be transcripts made of his remarks on air. >> because people will start to study what somebody like him says about what is supposed to be done in a case like this. they have never decided a nominee like this in modern times, and you end up turning to guys like this who know how to do the mechanics of this. it is a dark art, there are not a lot of people who know how to do it but the people who do know how to do it will start to teach other people inside the party. we also had interesting things in the democratic party tonight. some of them unexpected, some of them expected. some of them say the unexpected win was hillary clinton's win in bernie sanders hometown of vermont. and what steve kornacki has been able to break down is the racial breakdown. >> we looked at all the primaries today, put all the exit poll data together to give you a profile of the entire
9:54 pm
democratic electorate today. so the things we're seeing first of all. the black vote, clinton, 83-15, this is what we saw in south carolina, this is what the sanders campaign said they saw six months ago and said they're going to fix. they didn't. hillary clinton cleaned up with the black vote today. this is a little new. we finally have a statistic reading of the vote. we have a lot of latino voters tonight thanks in particular to texas. you can see it's a clear 2-1 victory for hillary clinton among latinos tonight. among white voters this is also interesting. among some of the states, bernie sanders was cleaning up with white voters. but you are seeing hillary clinton a slight advantage over bernie sanders when it comes to white voters. why that is, there is a gender gap among white voters, hillary clinton winning them handily. among white women, bernie sanders wins by ten points.
9:55 pm
when you look at it this way, bernie sanders won white men, hillary clinton won everything else, white women, black men, black women, latino men and women. >> wow. gene robinson, hillary clinton losing white men, that is sort of the thing that democrat men are freaked out about, is the appeal to white voters. is that something she should worry about? does this translate to an election concern? >> i have no idea, i don't know if it translates. the reason i say that is that eight years ago, hillary clinton was quite strong with white men compared with how barack obama was doing with that group. and was thought to potentially in a general election you know, have greater appeal for that group of voters. i don't know what has -- you know what would change that in -- or that calculation, you
9:56 pm
know, she is the same candidate, basically, i think she is a bit better this time around. so that could be a quirk of the comparison between her and bernie sanders. and i actually don't know why bernie sanders would be doing better with that group. than hillary clinton. i don't have a theory. >> i was going to say that is the democratic race. we are out of time for this hour. luckily we'll see you at the top of the next hour. as our never-ending coverage of super tuesday -- >> still don't know about alaska. >> no longer super tuesday here in the east. it's like marvelous wednesday, or whatever we're calling it. we're back in a moment.
9:57 pm
9:58 pm
9:59 pm
10:00 pm
at the top of this new hour, we are back and let's look at the story lines of tonight, beginning with the democrats, and beginning with hillary clinton. quite an impressive haul. at the top of that list, up in new england, massachusetts, down into the south, arkansas, tennessee, virginia, texas, georgia, and alabama. we move over to bernie sanders, one short of the five states they were assuring journalists they would take home tonight. one of them his home state of vermont. sweeping south and west into oklahoma, colorado, and up north to the maligned minnesota
10:01 pm
caucus. here's your democratic map tonight. >> we love it. >> we love it, minnesota. the clinton states in a goldish, orangey, yellowy thing. we need to talk about our colors. let's go down to the republican race, because this really has dominated our conversational time tonight. this is the story. that's a pile of states as the now part of the trump empire. as diverse as arkansas, vermont, georgia, massachusetts, virginia, tennessee, and alabama. that's a diverse pile of states. ted cruz, not so much.
10:02 pm
his home state of texas, and neighboring oklahoma. rubio, not so much. the maligned misunderstood some would say minnesota caucus tonight. and that is the story of super tuesday 2016. as full of defeats and victories and intrigue as we thought it would be. >> there's one big story line out of super tuesday. we could see this coming that led up to tonight. it is the issue of turnout. republicans are excited about what's going on about turnout. democrats are not. heading into tonight, we've already seen democratic turnout down in all four states democrats have voted thus far. down 27% in iowa. new hampshire, down 13%. 30% in south carolina. in contrast, all four republican states voted before tonight, had set records. and tonight we can now say that
10:03 pm
14 of the 15 republican states that have voted so far this entire year, this entire election year, 14 of the 15, all of them except vermont have set new turnout records. looking back at least in the modern era, back to this series of primaries, back to 2000. republicans have blown through their ceiling there. and it seems to me that's important for a couple of reasons. one, it worries democrats, because maybe this means that there won't be democratic enthusiasm to drive voter turnout in a general election. that is a complicated extrapolation. it's not a one-to-one comparison. the other part is what it means for donald trump. there are two competing narratives. and only one of them can be true. about donald trump and the general election and turnout. one of them is that it's him who's driving all of this turnout in the republican side. he's expanding the republican party, bringing up people who are willing to get off the sidelines and cast a republican vote because they like him so
10:04 pm
much. and so donald trump will be great for the republican party up and down the ballot in november if he's the nominee. that competes directly with what everybody else thinks, which is, oh, my god, if donald trump is the republican nominee, republicans should just jump off. >> the party as we know it will be -- >> forget it. nobody will win. there won't be a republican dogcatcher in the country as long as trump is at the top of the ticket. both of those things can't be true. i don't know how we find out which one is. we have stark numbers on the republican side. >> hey, kornacki, what do we know about turnout tonight? >> everything you're saying on the republican side, we've been seeing the whole year. they're having their best turnout for a republican cycle. on the flip side, down on the democratic side. that was 2008. that was clinton, that was obama. again tonight, oklahoma, on the democratic side. compared tonight to eight years ago, down 22% in democratic
10:05 pm
turnout. virginia, down 14%. vermont down 13%. massachusetts down 5. georgia down 2. tennessee down 40. there's two ways to look at that within the democratic party. one is you talked about this before, bernie sanders, the entire message of his campaign is, this is a political revolution that is going to bring all of these new people into the process that have never participated before. if that were coming to fruition, it might have something to do with why he's behind. the one thing we can say, 2008, there are democrats who say yes, it's troubling republican turnout is up. troubling the democratic turnout is down for us. they would also say that 2008 was something we may never see again. that race between hillary clinton and barack obama and the type of support that both of them motivated, the climate, you had the iraq war, post-katrina, it was bush fatigue, all this. they might say there were so many other factors in the air in 2008, it's unfair to compare to
10:06 pm
democrats of '08 of any year in the future. >> steve kornacki, at the big board. just to set the scene for folks at home, nicole wallace, eugene robinson are here with us. nicole has to be up in around five minutes to do the morning show. to elongate her suffering, we're first going to go to chris matthews in texas. one of the big players tonight. the state, and chris. and chris has a special guest with him. chris? >> thank you. i've got rick power here. rick, i guess we -- can you tell me why he told us all that? >> i have no idea. >> we shouldn't be speculating. trump did better. the establishment was firmly defeated today. >> what do you think of rubio coming in third everywhere practically? >> look, we've said that he doesn't -- his path forward is not as good as cruz's. and it's got to become a
10:07 pm
two-person race if we have the hope of beating donald trump. >> we heard five candidates for tonight. rachel and brian as well. we had five candidates speak tonight. i have lost the ability to tell the difference between a concession speech and a victory speech. i never heard -- >> a press conference. >> maybe that's the way you do it. sanders gave a speech, never congratulated hillary, never said nice try. it's like a systolic universe. >> rubio comes out every time with a victory speech. tonight he actually won something hours later after the victory speech. >> bronze winner in history. he wins in third place every time. >> everybody gets a trophy, chris. >> i thought that was -- the protocol was definitely different than it used to be. it used to basically say nice try to your opponent. and tonight they just go on.
10:08 pm
the fingernails keep growing on the cadavers. it goes on and it goes on and it goes on. but i do think who know who the winners are going to be. >> that was the greatest thing i've heard in many, many hours tonight. that was really good. >> what a mind you have. wow. >> fingernails growing on the cadavers. chris matthews, you're amazing. >> i'm already looking half of that up on my iphone. thank you, mr. davis. thank you, chris matthews. let's change our call. because more data has come in. we have gone from apparent winner to projected winner. meaning it's more than just the math. it's math plus models plus human intelligence. john kasich, this was his best run tonight. he gave it a good run.
10:09 pm
in the end it was not enough. look at the size of the relative universe in vermont. this is the republican primary there. 33% to 30%. 19 and change to almost 18,000 with 92% of the raw vote in. another state on the projected pile for donald trump, part of the trump electoral -- >> interesting thing, the one state where republican voter turnout does not seem to have set a record tonight. >> they like to keep it cool sdple kept it cool in vermont. >> honestly, i live in western massachusetts, where we're quite close to southern vermont, and having seen the bernie enthusiasm close up, both in my part of massachusetts, which bernie won western mass, where senator sanders won and in his state tonight, one thing that will explain why republicans didn't get record turnout in vermont in that republican primary tonight, i think bernie sanders will have taken a lot of
10:10 pm
crossover republican voters tonight who crossed the party line in order to cast a vote for him in that democratic primary. >> nicole wallace, answer the question that chris just posed, why did ben ginsberg tell us all that he told us tonight? >> well, ben understands the answer to the question you put to him. what would happen to this movement. i mean, trump is the leader of a movement, whether the establishment likes it or not. i think what ben was laying out is the legal process. i don't think that -- ben is also a political adviser. he's got a great political sense. i don't think he would give someone political advice to proceed in that manner. i think the notion -- it does become a little bit of a fairy tale. i'll answer your question about how donald trump could be expanding the electorate, and burning down all of the establishment washington. the reason the establishment is fearful of donald trump is
10:11 pm
because there's a concern that the new people that are coming to trump may actually expect him to do all the things he said he was going to do. ban muslims from entry, build a wall, deport 11 million people. those things are not in line with the rest of the -- again, i want to stop using establishment republicans, just say those who govern under the banner of republicans. so there is trepidation that vulnerable republican senators will lose their seats to democrats, because of that policy debate with hillary clinton. but it is also true that donald trump is bringing new people into the electorate and into the party as he accurately claimed in his acceptance press conference. >> it should be noted, i think we can talk about the terms of the proposal to ban muslims. in terms of the proposal to build a wall and deport 10 million people in this country,
10:12 pm
donald trump's success has also led to his chief rivals on the republican side, signing on with those policies as well. you may think that the wall is nutty, or that the forced deportation of more than 10 million people is nutty, but ask marco rubio and ted cruz about the policy poxes right now and they're not just trump now. they've lined up behind -- >> i mean, it's not going to -- that's not going to happen. here's a theory about turnout that just occurred to me. 2008, democrats had been out of the white house for eight years. and were rearing to get back in there. that's the case with republicans this year. and so in that sense, it's a sort of enthusiasm factor that's built into the structure of, you know, alternating parties. >> in political science, right? i remember before we had any idea who was going to run this year, i remember people asking me, you know, as a matter of
10:13 pm
conversation, what do you think's going to happen in the presidential race in 2016? i always say in the absence of having any idea who will run, i will tell you that the next president will be a republican. the reason i can tell you that is that after eight years, after a party is president has had two terms, it's hard. george h.w. bush did it. the party in the control of the white house is going to flip after eight years, because of the dynamics like that. that's why democrats were chortling over the prospect of trump being the nominee of the republican party. structurally speaking, anybody who gets the nomination has got a 50/50 shot. and structurally speaking, a republican has a better shot generically than a democrat does winning this year. donald trump, or mickey mouse is the nominee, that person could very well be president. >> it's not just earnest civics
10:14 pm
class for adults to say this is the first election in a long time where all three branches are in play. the court, the congress, and the white house. and that's for real. >> and that's very animating on both sides. >> it's funny, the supreme court issue, you talk to political pros, on the democratic side, i don't know if this is true on the republican side, too, democrats say in the absence of a supreme court vacancy, that motivates donors. that's the republican donor class and what they want, what they want to be assured about. it doesn't really motivate the democratic base broadly speaking. but the donor class that's what they want. once you've got a vacancy, it's what everybody wants. >> on the republican side, i'd say it's the grass roots that are very motivated by the protection of the constitution. if it is, i'm ignorant of it. very much a grass roots issue on the republican side. >> we've been calling the trump
10:15 pm
movement a movement. and one of the great motivators, this election season, has been anger. as much a juxtaposition as this is, steve kornacki has more on anger. >> yeah, this is a fascinating one. we asked democrats and republicans across all of the contests tonight, the entire democratic and republican electorate, are you angry at government? more than 3-1 margin, republicans, not democrats, who are angry at government. the flip side is, a lot more democrats who say they're satisfied with government. donald trump says, i will take the mantle of anger in this campaign. the angry at government republicans, there it is, donald trump wins 42%. ted cruz up there, too, with 33%. marco rubio way back at 14%. if you want to know why it was a good night for trump, maybe surprisingly good one for cruz, it's anger. >> have you seen inside out?
10:16 pm
anger is a very lovable, cute character. anyway, it's so late. >> we did warn our audience that she has to be up in about five minutes. >> i just want to throw one other thing out here. which is that michael bloomberg has said that if it looked like it was going to be donald trump and bernie sanders as the nominees, that he would get in and run a third party candidacy and self-fund. >> i want to learn more about this. >> i would like to learn more about that. hillary clinton is the more likely democratic nominee. but it looks like donald trump is the prohibitive favorite to be the republican nominee. >> chuck todd seemed to know something about this tonight. >> it will be interesting to see if not just michael bloomberg, but any other potential third party, organized within the republican party, or truly independently, come to pass now that donald trump looks like he's really locking it up.
10:17 pm
>> look, after saying some of the things i've said about donald trump, how can some republican officials ever support him. lindsay graham can never support donald trump. >> he can't. >> calling him a con artist to say, i'd like you to give him your vote. never going to happen. >> there's a super cut of christie on trump and trump on christie -- >> this has taken a decidedly more personal turn, if that's possible. i think the remaining candidates, i can't imagine any of them -- cruz did say after the last debate both he and rubio would make a better president than trump. but i can't see cruz and rubio getting behind trump. >> hold that thought. we're going to fit in another break. i swear, shank of the evening is a thing. late on super tuesday.
10:18 pm
>> it's official. >> marvelous wednesday.
10:19 pm
10:20 pm
we're always looking for ways to speed up your car insurance search. here's the latest. problem is, we haven't figured out how to reverse it. for now, just log on to compare.com... plug in some simple info and get up to 50 free quotes. choose the lowest and hit purchase. now...if you'll excuse me, i'm late for an important function. compare.com. saving humanity from high insurance rates.
10:21 pm
20 minutes after the hour. well into the shampg of the evening, especially on the east coast. this is the only place we've still got a genuine race going. and they're just getting started in alaska. they're starting the subaru, they're turning on the defroster, they're going to caucus. so too early to call. and we have donald trump businessman and marco rubio, senator. welcome back. robert costa of "the new york times" has joined us. >> "washington post." >> i'm so sorry, robert, it's late. there's no rivalry between the two publications. same thing. we've got -- we haven't introduced them yet. but chuck and ben have joined me here at the desk. keep that in mind as you answer. what have you filed for the web tonight and tomorrow morning on
10:22 pm
paper edition of the "washington post"? >> my colleague and i filed a front-page story on super tuesday. the headline coming out of this is it's a trump owns the night. he routed. he showed the depth across the country from massachusetts to georgia to tennessee. but there really still are glimmers of hope for rubio picking up minnesota. cruz with texas and oklahoma. this is an extended race. a race that's not ending anytime soon. trump's trying to turn to the general election. >> i've watched you the last couple of days talk about what we keep hearing anecdotally, kind of whispered. that is, very serious talks, very serious gatherings among operatives of the republican party of how to get this thing back, how to wrestle the party back. what can you add to the record tonight? because their case only intensified tonight. >> i think the key story for wednesday, based on all my
10:23 pm
reporting tonight, brian, is all the anti-trump forces within the republican party are gathering tonight via phone, e-mail, meeting tomorrow for breakfast here in washington, and elsewhere. look for the anti-trump super pacs that are already operating to get more money, look for more major donors, seven-figure donors to step out. because as the party remains divided over the candidates on the establishment side, there's still a thought that trump has to be stopped. i expect more ads, more money, more people to make themselves known. maybe they're not going to back a specific candidate, but a mitt romney, others like him, may step out more forcefulfully on the anti-trump front. >> maybe this is them and not you talking, but it's very hard to super pac your way out of an idea, a notion that has caught fire with an audience that is more like an affinity group. that is kind of a perfect message for the time. and then add to that the stage
10:24 pm
craft we saw tonight of a man in full, to borrow tom wolf's phrase, this candidate with matching back drop of great grandeur. what do you do about that? who do we see about that? >> it's a fascinating point. it's a compelling one. when i spoke to establishment republicans tonight, they mentioned exactly what you did. trump seemed to have an eye toward the general election tonight. that more than anything is scaring the elected republicans. they think trump is becoming more seasoned as a candidate. he sees the prize. and he's not going to make as many mistakes like he did with the kkk comments in the recent days. i think what we're also watching is it is a movement within the republican party toward trump. the thought is now, though, brian, the convention, july, cleveland, maybe trump can be prevented from getting the 1,200-plus delegates he needs. but that whole process could break the party apart. >> final question. do you agree with nicole
10:25 pm
wallace's hunch that the prepares of chris christie in the political life of donald trump, just these past few days has been a steadying influence on his demeanor and message? >> i think that is the key point here. because christie has brought an establishment republican, an elected official who has won in a blue state to the trump campaign. and when i was looking around the newsroom tonight writing our story, we thought the christie's quotes were great, even more than trump's comments themselves. steady hands, political instincts helping to guide trump. and he understands how to talk to him and guide him. >> robert costa, first-rate reporter with a first-rate newspaper, have i mentioned that today? the "washington post." thank you, forgive me, it's late at night. thanks, robert, very much for coming on the air. this entire conversation would point toward one man, ginsberg.
10:26 pm
i'm telling you. >> late night. what shank are we talking about? >> shank of the evening. like francis albert. >> a whole different idea. >> we have to take a break. we'll talk to ben ginsberg on the other side. i'll take some nourishment.
10:27 pm
10:28 pm
10:29 pm
10:30 pm
we expanded the party. look at the number of votes we had in that area, as an example. four years ago, they had 390,000 or so votes. we almost doubled it, almost 800,000. the democrats went down. there's much less enthusiasm for the democrats. >> you'll have to trust us, donald trump actually spoke during the event tonight behind the podium with the gold leaf on it. anyone who has a house with a name is doing okay. built by marriage ri merriweather post. who had a lot of money. 58 bedrooms. that's a house. >> i realize this is just plainly ignorant of me, but is that a home, or is that like a resort? can other people stay there? is it a hotel? >> it's on the national register. i think if you buy it as a home you have to agree to keep it up. because it's history that belongs -- >> can donald trump charge money to people to stay there?
10:31 pm
and there's a desk? i don't know. >> asking the wrong guy. we have the right guy for this conversation, however. ben ginsberg is with us. chuck todd is with us. nicole wallace remains with us. couple lo counselor, what do you do with this establishment? >> i think what you do is face the reality that you have to do a lot electorally in the next two weeks. march 15th is the cutoff date. if you care about where the party goes, you get into the rules a little bit. and you learn that 73% of the delegates are chosen at state conventions, or by state party executive committees with little or no input from the candidate who wins that state. who the actual delegates are is a product of the state parties for the most part. they're bound to vote for the presidential candidate on the first ballot. they're not bound to vote for
10:32 pm
the presidential candidate for rules issues, for credentials challenges, for the vice presidential nominee. or even who the permanent chair of the convention is. so if you were to devise a plan to stop a runawa