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tv   The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell  MSNBC  March 9, 2016 7:00pm-8:01pm PST

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that's 18 complaints filed every day by one person. that's a job. 18 complaints a day should come with comp time and a bonus. that person probably does need the extra money. they know in d.c. if there's enough noise around an issue, people will pay taattention to , maybe even vote for it. that does it for us tonight. we'll see you again again tomorrow. they want him to drop out of the race. they want to carry him to victory. >> rubio! rubio! >> through all the insults -- >> we cannot turn over the conservative movement to a con artist. >> the people of florida can't stand him. he couldn't get elected dogcatcher. >> all the finger pointing. >> marco supports citizenship for 12 million people here. >> now he's making things up. >> marco rubio is looking to win his home state and proves he
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deserves to be the nominee. >> a strong national defense is a better way forward for you, for me, for us, for the united states of america. >> this is an msnbc special town hall with senator marco rubio. from florida international university in miami. here is chuck todd. >> and good evening, and welcome to the msnbc town hall with republican senator marco rubio of florida. we're here on the campus of florida international university in miami, home of the fiu panthers. let's go, panthers. huh? don't tell my friends a little north of here what i just said. anyway, the question that in this is a critical moment for senator rubio to date. he's won just 2 contests out of 24 in the race for president which makes tuesday's primary in his home state of florida absolutely critical to his chances. so let's get started and welcome
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the senator from florida, marco rubio. [ cheers and applause ] thank you. [ applause ] all right. you happy when you're home? >> yeah. >> are you happy when you're home? >> home, home. i teach at fiu. >> some people got as in here. >> you a tough grader? >> no, they're voters. >> wow, the real trick, right? always get the professor who's running for office. all right. let's get started with stuff that you probably don't want to talk about. it was a tough night last night for you. >> yeah. >> you've only won 2 contests out of 24. you have a lot of even friends of yours saying they're not sure why you're going to keep going. >> i've heard that from the press. >> i understand that. >> the bottom line is this, first of all, running for president is tough. it shouldn't be easy. second of all, it is true we
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haven't done as well in some of the states that we wanted to. florida is going to award 99 delegates all at once. you can win more delegates in florida than across five or seven states in an apportioned process. even if i had done really well in all the previous states, if i had not done well in florida, it would be trouble for our campaign so we need to win here, that's our priority. we're focused on it like a laser. we're going to win. we feel really good at it. >> you at a point -- [ applause ] you have said a vote -- in the state of florida, vote for ted cruz or john kasich is a vote for donald trump. is that your attitude in ohio? are you telling your supporters, vote for john kasich in ohio? >> no, i'm telling you in florida -- >> why not? shouldn't that be the strategy? >> i'll let kasich say that to you. in florida, the only one who has a chance of beating donald trump is me. now, if -- [ applause ] if you like donald trump, that doesn't matter, but if you don't want donald trump to be the
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nominee, even if you're a supporter of ted cruz or even if you're a supporter of kasich, you vote for marco rubio because a vote for anyone other than me is a vote for donald trump. i'm the only one that -- almost a million votes are in. i'm the only one who has any chance of beating donald trump in florida because if he gets florida's 99 delegates we have a different conversation next wednesday about the state of the republican race. >> do you think you're struggling in florida because you're retiring from the senate? >> a couple things in florida, number one, it's a big, big state. no one can run a full-time presidential campaign in florida and run one in new hampshire, iowa, south carolina, the other states we were invest in. second of all, it's a state largely been operating off the national media and the national media, to be fair, has given donald trump ten times as much coverage than any other republican candidate combined. it's had an impact. we're working on reversing that now here in florida. it's going to be a hard work, but you know what, i've been in tough races before. it's an election. you have to earn these things. let me tell you, running for
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president is not nearly as hard as being president so you better hope your president went through a trial in the campaign, because being president is even harder. >> you know, the other thing i'm wondering about this is -- [ applause ] -- that as much of the personality of donald trump gets in the way, there isn't an ideological difference. the two of you have two different definitions of conservatism. you know, his is sort of an older version of it, small "c" conservative, less intervention, tighter borders, skeptical of trade deals. you're more of you look at america as a world power, sort of being at the center of the world a little more open to intervention. obviously a little more open to immigration. little more open to trade deals. that's really the debate inside the republican party that, perhaps, republicans just want to go back to an older definition of conservatism and not yours? >> i think you give donald trump too much credit in terms of ideological stand. he's all over the place about these issues. it's largely about an attitude, not about policy. >> if there's one thing he's
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consistent on, going back to '87. >> except for his own businesses where he makes everything overseas. the thing i would say to you about it, i'm a ronald reagan conservative. i grew up in the era of reagan. my view of conservatism is shaped by that experience. it's not an interventionist position. it is the belief that the world is a better place when america is the strongest country in the world. look, in the absence of american global leadership, there is no other nation or institution that can play that role and the result is chaos, and the evidence of it is every sector of the world today faces chaos. the absence of american leadership in the asia-pacific region led to the chinese taking over the south china sea, north koreans aggression. nato's reduction in capability inviting vladimir putin to be more aggressive. lack of american leadership in the middle east resulted in the vacuums that exist in syria, in iraq, increasingly in libya. there's a consequence for the lack of american leadership. you're seeing it all over the world. >> some might argue it's too
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much intervention that created, that sudden that that created -- >> i heard that in some cases. it's not accurate. libya, the uprising was caused by the libyan people. gadhafi was on his way out. the choice we had to make, did we let it go for two years? the same has been the case in syria. in the case of iraq, that was the withdrawal, the premature withdrawal by barack obama that left maliki in charge, allowed him to go hard after the sunnis and the sunnis welcomed isis in as liberators. not anymore but they did initially because they viewed the shia government in baghdad as a puppet of iran. >> you've been harsh on donald trump. we put together a montage. >> i've been harsh? i'll go anywhere to speak to anyone before i let a con artist get ahold of the republican party. i mine, he's so thin skinned. so erratic. and to think you're going to make someone like that commander in chief, i want people to think about that.
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i think the problem here is donald trump is not really a republican. he's not a conservative. i mean, donald trump basically has policy positions that are indistinguishable from democrats. do not give into the fear. do not give into anger. do not give into sham artists and con artists. trying to carry out is a scam to take control of the office of the presidency of the united states. [ applause ] >> i guess my question is, how can you support a con artist? just because you -- any regret on the idea that you will support donald trump as the nominee? you call him a con artist, scam artist. >> i think it's indicative of how bad i think hillary clinton would be or bernie sanders to even contemplate that. >> you think they're con artist, though? >> i think bernie sanders is a socialist which he admits. i think hillary clinton is unqualified to be the president of the united states, mishandled her e-mail server and -- >> donald trump -- >> the bottom line, i don't want him to be the nominee.
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if anyone else, if john kasich was where donald trump is now, if jeb bush is where donald trump -- the race is over. >> would you be out of the race if this were john kasich -- >> that's the point. the point is no matter what i say today about supporting or not supporting the nominee, there's a significant percentage of republicans that are not going to vote for donald trump. that is why he'll get destroyed in the general election. that's what will happen. >> it's one thing to say you'll support him. should we assume there's no way you could be on a ticket with a con artist? >> you put it that way. >> you are calling him a con artist. i can't imagine -- >> i'm not running for vice president, not looking to be anyone's vice president. i want to be the president -- >> can you be sherman-esque? if he offers it f donald trump offers you the slot, you will say no? >> i'm not interested in being donald trump's or anybody else's vice president. that's not what i'm aiming at. >> you didn't answer the question. >> i don't want to be vice president of the united states. >> if donald trump asked you, you'd say no? >> absolutely. by the way, i am not running to
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be anyone's vice president. i'm not looking to be anyone's vice president. i want to be the president of the united states or i'll be a private citizen. there's nothing wrong with being a private citizen. so i love public service, but it's what i do. it's not who i am. >> any thought -- there's been all these people that are trying to get you and ted cruz to somehow fuse together as a ticket to stop donald trump. you open to that at all? >> i said that in an earlier interview. that's "house of cards" stuff. looks good on tv, it doesn't ever work that way. bottom line is, you know, this process is going to play itself out. we are focused on florida. so don't be surprised if we don't do well in some other states next tuesday because we're not there. we're here. we'd like to pick up delegates in other states. we have good teams in other states. we're focus the on florida. my home state, 99 delegates. we do well here, we'll talk wednesday about the state of the race. i feel very positive about it. >> on that note, let me get some students involved in a couple of questions. here. we got a lot of them, actually.
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jose andreas. >> how are you, senator? >> hi. >> my question is, how can you sacrifice basic christian principles like loving your neighbor, as we saw with recent verbal attacks on trump? you justified this by saying if anyone deserves it, it's him. the bible says, we deserve hell, yet we still receive grace. as a christian as well, this question is important to me. >> well, let me say on the policy issues i don't think that violates my faith because the result is righteous indignation. we're talks about the presidency of the united states. so you're going to elect the next commander in chief, someone that will have a real impact on the future of our country, representing themselves as someone who they're not, it's appropriate to the campaign to point those out. personal stuff, at the end of the day it's is not something i'm proud of mind kids were embarrassed by it. if i had to do it again, i wouldn't. not on the other charges. not on the other things. when it comes to the fact he's portraying himself as he's not,
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the stakes are not a worthless degree at trump university, the stakes are the greatest nation on earth. on that, i think i'm well within the reaches of my faith -- >> you regret the schoolyard stuff? >> you know why, because in the end what happened is, first of all, i think he had to be stood up to. i really do believe that. but that said, but that said, that's not the campaign i want to run. >> took a toll on you. >> well, i don't know about political toll. >> i'm saying you didn't look comfortable doing, to be honest. >> he need to be stood up. this is a guy who's basically offended everyone for a year. literally has mocked a disabled journalist, a female journalist, every minority group imaginable on a daily basis. it becomes -- use profanity from the stage. that said, yeah, i don't want to be that. if that's what it takes to become president of the united states, i don't want to be president. i don't think that's what takes to be president. i know it's not what it takes. it's not what we want from our next president. if i had to do it again, i would have done that part differently.
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not his record on business. that's legitimate. the people need to know what they are electing is not who he says he is. >> let me bring up adrian. >> thank you, senator, thank you, chuck. >> you got it. >> senator, you received money from hedge fund managers like paul singer and mega corporations like the geo group, private prison corporation. how often are you influenced? >> none. my agenda in is writing. i'm the only candidate who has an extensive agenda online. when someone gives money to my campaign, they're buying into my agenda, i'm not buying into their agenda. it's there to be held accountable to. everybody in this race has contributors. every issue in america has money on both sides of it. everyone in this race, even donald trump who said he'd self-funded loaned his campaign $17 million, he expects to be paid back by contributors. you have to be willing to say,
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look, here's my agenda and because of my agenda there are people who don't support me. multimillion dollar checks were written and used to try to defeat me in this campaign. those people have interests. some of them were hedge fund people as well. ultimately i take a clear positions on issues. you can hold me accountable to where i stand. there are people that support it and people that oppose it. in america you have a first-amendment right to participate in the process that way. >> in addition, i'm sorry, chuck. >> it's okay. >> candidates like bernie sanders don't receive any money from any interest groups unless it's the people, people like sitting this room. so how would you compare yourself to bernie sanders? >> there's no comparison, bernie sanders is a socialist and if you want to live in a socialist country -- [ applause ] -- i think if someone -- if you want to turn america into a socialist democracy, win an election, fight you every step of the way. if you want to live in a socialist country, there are
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dozens of countries around the world you can move to. i'm going to fight every day to keep america a free enterprise society so there's no -- [ applause ] >> quick before we go to break. if you could change one thing about the campaign finance system after going through all this, as a candidate, what would you change? >> i don't know. to be honest with you, i don't know. >> you think it's broken? >> well, look, there's a lot of money in politics. here's the bottom line. if you look at what's happened in this campaign, the dominant feature of the trump campaign has not been that he ran a bunch of commercials. he's been able to dominate the media. the head of cbs, may not be good for america but he's good for cbs because of ratings. i think that's true in every one of these networks. there's millions and millions dollars of media that's out there. the other point i'd make, every time we tried to run a commercial, all these media outlets charge us. we have to raise money. you keep charging us to run commercials. >> that, i hear you. there's no magic wand you'd wave here. >> the first amendment is so broad it allows people to run
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ads that are lying about me. they're allowed to do it. >> speaking of television ads, i have to run a couple here. take a quick break. when we come back, we're going to do immigration, health care. some real policy wonk stuff. some real policy wonk stuff. be right back.
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welcome back to the msnbc town hall. we are here with senator marco rubio. we're going to dive in to an issue that comes up pretty much at every debate. immigration. >> yep. >> garicia hernandez has our next question. >> hi, how are you? >> to you recognize the underlying cause of illegal immigration from central america is a lack of security? what are you willing to do to help solve that problem? >> el salvador, guatemala, honduras there's a terrible security situation, many ways a breakdown of government. i know there's this effort,
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alliance for progress, work to be done. as chairman of the western hemisphere subcommittee, we've worked with the vice president's office, tried to, anyway, to kind of figure out the contours of what we can do. i think the model for that would be what we were able to do with colombia. contributions made on the colombians they were able to turn around the security situation in colombia. the situation in honduras and guatemala is tougher. we should work with those countries to build up the infrastructure necessary, law enforcement, judiciary, so forth to deal with the violence that is driving people out of those countries and seeking harbor in the united states. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> is there -- [ applause ] how much of our immigration issue, or the perceived -- first of all, do you believe we have an immigration crisis? because net migration is down.
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so is this more of a perception problem that we have when it comes to immigration? >> that will fluctuate. you'll have years where there's not a lot of jobs so people go back. people are still coming in. that's not the question. the question is whether we have a system in place today in which an uncontrolled number of people are able to unlawfully either enter the country or overstay visas. what that does is, as long as that exists, as long as that is problematic, we can't make the legal immigration system work. makes people reluctant to improve it or move forward on it. irrespective of the net numbers you still have a substantial number of people entering illegally every year and overstaying. you're seeing that with cubans who instead of coming on rafts through the florida straits are going to mexico and crossing the border to get in. people crossing the border from mexico are no longer just from mexico, they're from all over the world. it is a problem. a serious problem. visa overstays are a problem in miami and in florida and does have to be dealt with. until that is dealt with, i don't think we're going to make progress on anything else on immigration. >> you said on day one you would eliminate the daca order. >> that's right.
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>> i know that doesn't mean everybody's deported on day one. >> they can't renew their permit. >> when their permit expires, do deportations begin? >> deportation is the final process in a longer process when someone's in this country without status and here illegally, that's not the way it's reported sometimes it makes it sound like you have hit teams out there rounding people up. that's not the way the process works. my preferred outcome would be we bring illegal immigration under control, prove it to the american people and are able to move forward on the rest of it. i believe if we can prove to people illegal immigration is under control, the american people are going to be very reasonable about what do you do with somebody who came here when they were 3 years old, doesn't speak another language? >> why rescind the order? >> it's unconstitutional. i leave in cutting taxes enter this specific order is -- you believe in the overall -- >> i believe that we should do something to accommodate young
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people in the country who were brought here through no fault of their own. i would love to cut taxes but if the president ordered the irs to stop collecting a certain percentage of tax, i would be against it. if you undermine the constitution, you lose your country. we have to solve this but through a constitutional way. it can't be by the president doing whatever he wants. >> how quickly of a priority is it for you, though? >> it's an important priority. >> first 100 days type of priority? >> enforcing the immigration laws has to be, securing our border -- >> if you're going to rescind the order, don't you need to immediately have a basically some dreamer legislation ready to go? >> you can't pass anything until illegal immigration is under control. it's been tried three times and it fails every time. you say to people this law requires a fence, more border agents and they say, we don't believe it, we don't think the federal government will do it. we've heard this promise before. if you do it and prove it to them, it unlocks the door --
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>> how do you ever prove it then? i just think you're moving goal posts here. i'm not saying you, everybody is. >> i think you can see when the 700 miles of fencing and walls have been completed -- >> you think we need to physically put a barrier. >> across 700 miles. key sectors. what you want to do is funnel traffic to areas you can control and that's why -- that's the purpose of fencing is to ensure that any traffic -- we have legal traffic that comes over the border. we have trade. a lot of people that come back and forth to shop and do business. so the point is, but you want crossings to happen in an area that is controlled and monitored. right now you have porous orders and inviting trafficking groups. >> let's go to the next question. >> hi, senator rubio. how are you, chuck? if you institute your merit-based immigration policy, wouldn't you be shutting out your people like your parents? >> you wouldn't shut them out. it's a different process. my parents came in 1956. the world is a different place from 1956.
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when my parents arrived in the u.s. in 1956, my dad had a fourth grade education, maybe. my mom had about the same. if they came today under those circumstance, they would struggle to succeed. in the 21st century economy unless you have a certain level of skill or education, it's hard to find a sustainable job. so we always change policies when times change and immigration policy is no different. and so today in the 21st century, immigration policy has to be primarily based on merit. that doesn't mean everyone's a ph.d. it does mean before you come in, you should be able to prove what skills are you going to bring to the u.s.? it also, by way, would open up more green cards for graduates from our universities graduating at the top of their class in sciences, technology and other fields and can't stay. the priority and the base of the system needs to be merit based. absolutely. it's not the same system my parents came across in 1956 because nothing looks like it did 60 years ago. >> thank you. >> thank you, daniel.
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i want to ask you a quick one on h1b visas. there's been controversy. disney brought in a whole bunch of people on h1b visas and essentially made some americans -- put them out of work. >> it's wrong. i'll tell you how that's happening. >> you're an advocate, mostly an advocate of the visa programs. >> i want to get rid of handicap parking stickers because i saw some guy abusing the handicap parking sticker. the h1b program is not the central issue. the central issue is the abuse of it. >> a lot of abuse of it. >> it is. disney and other companies hire an outsourcing agency like this company, tata, a consulting agency. these companies control an inordinate number of visas. you're not hiring the workers. you're hiring the company. the company is bringing them in as contractors. they don't work for disney. they work for the company. that's how they get around the h1b environment that you're know replacing americans. there has to be reforms to limit the number of visas controlled by these consultant companies. also a stricter enforcement only whether or not you're hiring people to replace american workers.
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it is illegal now to use h 1b to replace an american workers. >> we're driving down wages from pretty good jobs. $150,000 job goes to an $80,000 job. >> it's illegal under the law now. that's the process of more enforcement. catches companies that are doing that, using the consultancy group and outsourcing loophole, punish them, if you do it once, you'll face a penalty, do to twice, you'll be prohibited from using the h1b program again. >> your work with the gang of eight has made your campaign more difficult? >> we've been attacked on it. the bottom line is i tried to solve a problem. i told people when i ran for the senate, i told people that i was going up there to do two things. to stand up to the obama agenda, but also to offer an alternative. so in 2013, i was a member of a senate controlled by harry reid and there was going to be
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movement on immigration and i said, i'm going to get involved and try to make it the best possible legislation, as conservative as i possibly can because the way this process works is even if the senate passes a law, it has to go to the house, controlled by conservatives and they're going to make it better. it's not what i'm saying now. it didn't work that way. the house never took it up. the senate bill is the only thing that happened. i didn't believe the senate bill should be the final law. >> you may be out of step with where your party is right now? >> the problem is worse today than it was three years ago. in essence we continue to have an illegal immigration problem, still don't have a fence, don't have the 20,000 new border agents, you have 12 million or 13 million people here illegally. i tried to do something. it's a messy process. at the end of the day -- >> doesn't it to have be done bipartisanly? i can't imagine one party being able to jam this through. >> if i'm president of the united states, it's not going to look like the senate bill. it's going to be our way. i was skeptical at the time of being able do it comprehensively -- >> you don't believe comprehensively anymore?
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>> i don't believe the support is there. i don't think comprehensive has any chance of passing any time in the near future and we're wasting time. >> all right. speaking of time. take another break. when we come back, health care, economy, cuba. we'll be right back. (avo) after 50 years of designing cars for crash survival, subaru has developed our most revolutionary feature yet. a car that can see trouble and stop itself to avoid it. when the insurance institute for highway safety tested front crash prevention nobody beat subaru models with eyesight. not toyota. not ford or any other brand. subaru eyesight. an extra set of eyes, every time you drive. when you think what does it look like?
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when we are back. welcome back to our msnbc town hall with republican senator marco rubio. six days before the crucial florida primary, as senator, himself, said, it's always about florida, isn't it? some form or another, it's always about florida. >> we like that way. >> i take it as a badge of honor as a floridian. the next question, i believe, has it and it's on cuba. go ahead. >> good evening, senator. as a cuban-american businessowner, i'm curious to know, would you roll back all of the changes obama has made regarding cuba? or would you keep some of them? >> probably all because i think they're -- [ applause ] i think they're illegal. relations between -- relations between the -- we have to get back to this idea of rule of law in this country. relations between the u.s. and cuba are law. these are laws that regulate any sort of changes and it outlines how there can be a change between relations between the united states and cuba. it requires reciprocal measures on part of the cuban government.
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so i ask why couldn't we have gone toward cuba the way we did toward myanmar, burma, whatever the right term is these days? if you look at the opening toward them, the u.s. made diplomatic recognition, economic openings and exchange the government there, a dictator ship allowed a political opening. by no means am i arguing they're new zealand or canada or australia, it's better than they used to be because it was a requirement. we made no requirements in cuba for political openings, freedom of the press, human rights. the situation in cuba today for human rights and democracy continues to deteriorate on the hopes somehow american business and american tourism is going to lead to a political change. it will not. it will provide more resources for a dictatorship to carry out a transition and become permanent. i will roll back those changes and say if there's going to be a change in u.s./cuba relations it must be according to the laws as written by congress and be reciprocal. >> what do you roll back? the travel bans, you roll
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everything back? or is there some stuff you keep in place? >> first of all, cuban-americans have been allowed to travel to cuba for a long time. the problem you have now, people are going -- the problem you have now is this. you have people coming from cuba and say they're here coming as exiles then they travel back to cuba 42 times a year. the question is why are you going back 42 times a year? number one. you have today people living in cuba that came to the u.s. a year and a day later became u.s. residents, qualified for all sorts of assistance from the u.s. government, and are living in cuba. and their check is being deposited in a u.s. bank account, their relatives are taking the money and wiring it back to cuba. that's an abuse of the system and abuse of our generosity. that's what this has opened the door to now. >> so what's the better solution? rolling back what the president has done, or do we get rid of wet foot/dry foot, do we reform so that basically cubans have to be under the same immigration law as everybody else? >> first of all, we need to close this loophole that allows
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people to come into the u.s., claim residency and live in cuba -- >> you support legislation that would change that? >> it's my legislation. that's why i support it. the other point i would make to you, i've always said the cuban adjustment act is endangered given the current patterns we see. there are people in cuba legitimately fleeing oppression. and those people should -- we should continue to receive them. then there are people abusing the system. i do think the cuban adjustment act should be revisited. wet foot/dry foot is the way the law is implemented. if you land on u.s. soil, you get to stay, if they catch you at sea, they send you back. that's the way they're addressing the law. >> do you buy the argument the obama administration makes which says doing what they've done with cuba improved relations with the rest of latin america and more importantly they will argue has actually helped to isolate venezuela in a way you couldn't isolate venezuela before? >> no. venezuela is isolated because they're run by a crazy guy and they have no money.
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they have no money. that's why they're isolated. >> if cuba is closer to the united states, that's farther away cuba is from venezuela. >> venezuela has no money, they're bankrupt. they destroyed the economy. cuba can be as friendly as they want to venezuela. they wanted the oil. they wanted cash. they needed to survive and needed it for subsistence. that was not going change. as far as the rest of latin america is concerned, our relationship with argentina improved because they elected a better president. our relationship with colombia is solid. our relationship with panama is strong. our relationship with honduras and guatemala is good. our relationship with el salvador is mixed. our relationship with mexico is unaffected by our relationship with cuba. that's a myth that somehow it's improved. the only difference is when we go to the summit of the americas we don't have to sit through a 30-minute speech about get rid of the embargo. >> that's not a small thing, though, is it? >> it's a small thing. in terms of public policy. all those countries want to have a good relationship with the united states. >> we're going to move on. brandon rodriguez, you have the next question. topic change.
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>> i'd like to thank both of you for being here and hosting the town hall. i first have to say i'm a strong advocate for maintaining and advancing america as an energy superpower. however, rising sea levels have become a concern for many citizens here in florida as well as citizens of other states, in new york, california. what are your views on this in what will you do as president to ensure us a future? >> if you're having flooding, we've had flooding for a long time. sweetwater a few blocks from here used to have massive flooding before they put drainage. i live in west miami, waterfront property 20 years ago every time it rained. we happen to live in a swamp that's been filled in and now we have people living here. rising sea level impacting flooding, i'm in favor. of course we want to do all that. you're getting at a broader question, what public policy can we pursue? i want to lead the world in energy resource, fully utilize oil, natural gas, coal, nuclear energy, wind, solar, biofuels.
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i want to lead in all of them. i want the u.s. to be number one in every source of energy, have the most diverse portfolio possible. as far as what impact that's going to have on the climate, not even the most stringent advocate if they're being honest of these laws can tell you you're going to see a measurable difference in sea level any time in your lifetime or mine. the other hand, if we pass laws that mandate things on our economy, an economic cost will be associated with it. innovation and technology are driving us in the direction. my only argument is allow the market to drive it, not government mandates. >> where are you on climate change? >> that's a measurable thing. first of all, the climate is always changing. this notion that the climate used to be the same for 1,000 years and now it's different, climate is always changing. most scientists say humans have contributed to it.
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>> you're saying it's your responsible to deal with it? >> flooding in miami beach, you have to deal with it. we had flooding in west miami where i lived 15, 20 years ago. we dealt with it. >> part of this is, are we risking too much of the economy by developing to the point where if a small flood could create too much damage? >> we're developing in coastal areas in this country because people want to live near the water -- it's overdeveloped or not, it's too late now. >> shouldn't those folks help pay for the mitigation? >> yeah, i'm not going there. they'll have to figure that out locally. the bottom line is, that's already there. going to roll back miami beach 100 years? miami beach is an artificial island. it's there now, it's a key part of our economy. we're going to protect it. we want it protect it. we want it to be a vibrant place to live. there's. we need to deal with. >> arianna rodriguez. new topic. >> thank you for being here today. my question is earlier last month the florida house approved
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a campus carry bill that would allow handguns on college campuses. what is your view on this policy and how would you regulate it to make sure students and professors are safe? >> well, i think that if you have a law, law-abiding people will follow it and criminals will ignore it. if god forbid this afternoon some lunatic or someone who has mental illness or dangerous criminal decides they want to come on the campus of this university, god forbid, harm someone, they're not going to care it's illegal to do it, they're criminals, they're going to violate the law. the only people that follow laws are law-abiding people. i am a gun owner. if the law says i can't do something, i won't do it. these thugs that are shooting up our community, it is already illegal to shoot up our communities so they don't care if it's illegal to have a gun on campus, they'll bring it on campus because they're criminals. i would just say to you on the realm of that, here's why it's difficult. think about it this way. i'm a gun owner and like to drive in my car and have a gun in my car for my protection but i have to go to fiu's campus. what do i do when i get to
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southwest avenue, do i dump the gun in the bush, park my car and pick it up after class is over? you can't. that's why the laws are justified. you want people to be able to protect themselves to and from work or to and from school. it's not just on campus. it's being able to not have to throw it out. that said, it is illegal to use a gun in a crime and criminals don't care because they're criminals. >> all right. thank you. all right. we're going to sneak in another break. when we come back, little more in-depth on the economy and housing.
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(team sing) ♪safelite repair, safelite replace.♪ ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ we are back. welcome back to the msnbc town hall. i'm here with republican senator marco rubio. six days before the florida primary. we're going to talk about an issue that is pretty big here in south florida when it comes to all things having to do with the economy and what happened with the financial collapse and we
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have the next question. >> good evening, senator. good evening, chuck. now, my question is, the financial crisis of 2008 was caused in part by the irresponsible actions of banks and lenders. although we currently see economic recovery, experts say most problems were simply thrown under the rug. as president, what course of action will you take to prevent another economic meltdown? >> that's a good question. first of all, i was personally impacted by it. i bought a home in 2005 in miami. anybody who bought a home in 2005 bought at the peak of the market. and a year and a half later, i did nothing wrong, in fact, i improved the home but it was worthless than the day i bought it and my neighbor went into foreclosure because he died of an illness and -- his family went into foreclosure and that reset the prices in the neighborhood as well. again, none of us were in trouble, none of those homes have been foreclosed except for that untimely death yet our home was worth less a year and a half later than the day we bought it because of these actions. i think there are a lot of culprits here. the federal reserve is a big part of it.
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the federal reserve understood there was an overheated housing bubble and kept interest rates low artificially nonetheless. inessence, they kept goosing up the housing market despite the fact they knew or should have known interest rates were too low. banks created -- lending institutions created exotic packages for lending. they sold them as tradeable goods. and then add to all of that a law that basically required these banks to create these sort of packages because we wanted every american to own a home even if they couldn't make the payments and result is the housing crisis. so i think the best way forward is twohold. number one, have a rules-based system for our federal reserve. the federal reserve is not supposed to run our economy. it is a central bank. it is supposed to maintain the stability of our currency and it should have very specific rules that trigger when interest rates go up and when they go down or when they stay the same. and number two, very simple rules to regulate banks that have a very clear capital requirement of how much banks need to hold in reserve, very clearly deleniated.
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it's not so complicated that local lenders and regional banks and community banks can't comply. it's not a coincidence after dodd/frank, local bank, regional banks, small community banks are being hurt. they're disappearing while big banks are bigger than they've ever been because complex laws help big industries at the expense of small ones. >> you know, a lot of the fervor behind trump and sanders is this whole people feeling we got the shaft. nobody went to jail. do you think that's a problem? >> well, they committed a crime, they should go to jail. >> but the attitude has been unfortunately there was no law in the books that whatever they did was all actually technically legal and it shouldn't have been. >> well, you can't -- here's the bottom line. if it was legal, it's legal. i don't think it's right. just because something's legal doesn't make it right. people did things that are immoral and wrong and cashed out knowing their practices were unsustainable.
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it makes it negligent, makes it irresponsible, it makes it immoral, but that's different from saying illegal. if someone committed a crime, they should go to jail. they should not be protected because of who they are or what influence they might have but it has to be a crime. >> one of the things miami is experiencing, new york city experienced it. foreign money comes in, raises property values to the point where average middle-class residents here in miami can't afford to live here. >> that's right. they're paying cash. >> foreigners come in, they pay cash. again, it's good for property values short term. >> it's good for the seller, bad for the buyer. >> it's not good for average working people who are looking to own a home. what do you do? >> largely the answer to that comes from local government through a combination of things. this is going to get complicated. i did zoning work early in my legal career. the density requirements, development. if you create a -- for example, the highest and best use of a waterfront property is not
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affordable residential housing. it's going to be high-rises with good views that are expensive. other communities you have to make it -- you have to have zoning and comprehensive planning laws that make it feasible to create workforce housing and family housing for a developer who is only going to take on the risk of a project, if, number one, they can get a good rate of return per square foot, and number two, if they can qualify people to buy. i think rental stock is important. not everyone is at a stage in their life where they need to be buying so you have to make a cost-effective for rental housing and rental apartments and so forth to be cost effective but a lot of that is a function of local government. it is not really a federal issue other than the banking and the interest rates and thinks of this nature. >> our next question. david neighbors has a question. >> yes, sir. >> i'm an inspiring law student, so -- >> my condolences. [ laughter ] >> issues presenting to our federal judiciary are of particular importance to me, but i feel a lot of people, especially people my age, don't fully grasp the importance of those issues.
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last month, our country suffered a great loss with the passing of justice scalia and it seems the next president is going to be in a position to appoint multiple justices to the high court. so can you speak a little bit about the importance of appointing principled conservatives to the court and also about what specific qualities you would look for in potential appointees? >> people say conservative and i believe that. i think what you really need is someone who understands that the constitution is not a living and breathing document. it is a document that is supposed to applied as originally meant. the job of the court is not to change the constitution. the job of the court is to apply it. there is a way to change the constitution. it's article 5. it provides for amendment process. and we've had amendments in this country. there are a couple i'd like to see. i'd like to see term limits on congress. i'd like to see term limits on the court. i'd like to see a balanced budget amendment. i don't think the court can impose that. so i do believe irrespective of the personal views of a judge, of a justice, at an appellate level, their job is not to be a policymaker but apply the
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constitution as originally meant. if the constitution ends up meaning whatever you want it to mean, it's meaningless. limits the power of the federal government, reserves governmental power to the states and we need more judges that understand it and do it that way. >> you said something interesting -- what would you make, you have an idea in mind, what would you make for term of a federal judge? 20 years, 25 years, a generation? >> i don't believe anyone should be in any position inperpetuity. it makes them immune to pressure. if you're on the court and -- >> didn't live as long back then. do you think that had something to do with it? >> yeah, i guess. >> i don't mean to be that crass about it. >> life expectancy was quite less than it is now. term limits are good.
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whether 8 years, 12 years in the legislative branch, i don't know, but i think it was good. our system was built for people not in there for 50 years. some had real-life experience, they come in, go back out. >> let me ask you about a litmus test. overturning roe v. wade. would you ask a potential supreme court nominee that question? would you ask, what tells you that's going to be somebody -- >> first i want to make -- >> somebody that's going to be a scalia conservative. >> number one, i'm make sure they have the intellectual capacity to defend their views. one of the things that made scalia effective, he was an excellent communicators of his ideas and positions. >> do you think that matters a little bit, little bit of charisma, a little bit -- >> it's not verbal. in his writing, he's able to express, and the clerks do a lot of the work but i think it's important to have someone who has the intellectual capacity to express their views in the majority of the dissent. and the ability to understand and comprehend complex issues, number one. number two, i want to make sure it's someone that has the view of the constitution i do, that
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it's a document of limitation to be applied as originally meant. as far as how they would rule in a particular case, no nominee will answer that question. no -- >> does justice roberts not have enough, in hindsight, not have enough of a record to make your comfortable? >> i wasn't involved in this nomination process. >> i understand that. that's come up in this campaign. >> i haven't gone back and looked at what his record was before then. i believe he was in private practice. >> you want more of a track record? >> i want someone that has a proven record whether it's on the academia or on the bench of defending, the job of the supreme court justice is to apply the constitution according to its original meaning, not to reach policy conclusions they'd like. >> speaking of limitations, one more break. back with more with marco rubio here in miami, florida, on the campus of florida international campus of florida international university.
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that's why comcast business doesn't leave you there. when you call, a small business expert will answer you in about 30 seconds. no annoying hold music. just a real person, real fast. whenever you need them. great, that's what i said. so your business can get back to business. sounds like my ride's ready. don't get stuck on hold. reach an expert fast. comcast business. built for business. all right. we got our final minutes here with florida senator marco rubio. and i'm going to end where we began a little bit of state of the campaign, state of your political ambition a little l bit. first of all, there's some reports that jeb bush is having a meeting with you, john kasich, the four of you getting together. >> i spoke to jeb bush a number of times but don't discuss
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private conversations. >> would his endorsement help you? >> sure. he's a respected person in the state. i throughout the campaign said i have great respect and admiration for him. i still do. >> you said something in your victory speech when you won the u.s. senate seat. this is what you said, washington is "a place that literally changes people and within a short period of time, they forgot why they even ran." six years later, is there some truth to that with you? >> not with me. i'm running today for the same reasons i ran in 2010 only the stakes are higher. five years later, we see many of the things that made america a special country in a lot of trouble. both parties are to blame for that. remember why we're exceptional. it's the one place on earth where you're born doesn't determine how far you go. they understand that here in miami and fiu especially. and we're losing. we have the potential to lose that. and i want this to continue to be a country where parents can do for their children what my parents did for me. if we have another four years like the last eight, we're going to lose it.
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that's why i ran for president. >> all right, senator rubio,vy to leave it there. pleasure, sure. >> all right, senator rubio, i got to leave it there. pleasure, sure. that will be it for all of us. a big thank you to our friends here at florida international university. our wonderful host here in miami, florida. keep it tuned in here for msnbc, the place for politics. have a good night. [ applause ] ♪ good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes, tonight, democratic presidential candidates bernie sanders and hillary clinton faced off for the first time since sanders' upset victory in michigan last night shaped the race. the debate hosted by univision centered on immigration issue, a key focus in next week's florida primary. under pressure from co-moderator


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