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tv   Hardball With Chris Matthews  MSNBC  March 9, 2016 11:00pm-12:01am PST

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>> a couple of public school kids in miami. that's it for all of us. big thank you to our friends at florida international university. a wonderful host here in miami, florida. keep it tuned in here libera keep tuned in here for msnbc, the place for politics. have a good night. trump trumps, but bernie sanders stuns, let's play "hardbal "hardball." good evening, i'm chris matthews, in washington, bernie sanders pulls an upset in michigan. can he repeat the big 10 magic in ohio, and can anything stop trump after he bulled his way in
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michigan sale if he rubs out rubio in florida. let's talk about the do or die time for the trump forces, the new york billionaire grabbed three wins in mississippi, michigan and hawaii, trump showing another big win. >> of the four, they're pretty much all gone, okay? pretty much, they didn't do so well tonight, folks, okay, i'm not going to say anybody didn't do well. there is only one person that did well tonight, donald trump. lying ted, he holds the bible high, and then he goes down and puts the bible down and then he lies, he will say i'm the only one that beat donald trump, i beat him, but he doesn't say yeah, he won like four, and i won like 12 or 13. he forgets the other part. >> anyway, marco rubio's strategy is one last gasp state,
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florida, he hopes to avoid a defeat down there. they said today if rubio can't win his home state it would be time for rubio to drop out. right now rubio's chances in florida are not looking too good. trump leads rubio, look at this in the poll, trump is up 16 points on rubio. the new quinnipiac poll, he leads rubio by 23 points in rubio's home ground. trump also has a 23-point lead over rubio, the favorite son if you will, i'm being sarcastic. in ohio, trump is second, john kasich leads by five points in his home state. meanwhile, msnbc learns that jeb bush will plan to meet with every candidate left in the field. oh, boy, the establishment is fighting back. catherine parker is a syndicated
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columnist, and the republican strategist, been a supporter of marco rubio. you know, henry, just out of pure masochism, i'll start with you, please tell me that rubio's strategy, when he is double digit back in his home state. he keeps saying it's like the alamo, well, that went the wrong way, too. >> i think senator rubio will win florida. and one of the reasons is -- >> well, you would say that because you're for him ha. what does it mean to say he could, when all the evidence shows he loses by 27 point. >> donald trump has two thirds of the republicans wanting to vote against him. marco rubio is the vehicle this florida just as john kasich is in ohio if you want to stop donald trump, just as ted cruz was in mississippi last night. marco rubio has a big debate coming up tomorrow night in
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miami on his home turf. he has the positive -- he is going to have to have the positive vibes going again that he had had earlier in the campaign, where he looks like the visionary that he is, and had he has to get back to that. >> i agree with you, he doesn't have a prayer if he talks about donald trump's small hands and all of this ridiculous stuff he says on national television. i think that reduced him to the level actually below trump if that is feasible, below him. your taughoughts. >> there is no question he needs to talk about his record, if he wants to talk about donald trump's record, the lack of plans, trump's university where he says he tells it like it is. but the new york attorney general says that is a bait and switch plan. and -- 7% --
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>> sir, sir, he is not slowing down, you can wish it into existence, he won last fight in michigan and mississippi, what do you mean by slowing down? he won hawaii. >> look, sure, i'll grant you that. he had a good night last night. give him credit for that. over the weekend it certainly looked like he may be stalling. last night it looked like he had his jet engines going, but he needs about 788 additional delegates s to get to the magi 1,237 in cleveland. that is a high hurdle for him. he has to win in the big winner take all states like ohio and florida. so it will be a big battle in florida, but i think marco rubio on his home turf has a good chance. >> he won so far in puerto rico,
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nothing wrong with puerto rico, but that is not a measurement. >> marco rubio did diminish himself when he went off on these little bullying tactics that trump has used. the last thing he needed to do was look like the high school punk. he already looked so high, he let his shadow grow a little bit in order to look a little order. he will be grateful when he is 80. right now it hurt him, and then he is acting goofy. >> trump said his ears were too big, he said his hands were too small. it really got out of hand. >> i'm embarrassed for our country. >> i get over it pretty quick. what do you make of the numbers? they drive our business, hillary clinton did not win the most delegates, barack obama did, he won a lot of big states, she did, but she won. i don't see rubio getting in the game again.
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>> no, and i think the most striking thing about most of the polls you see out right now, if you had had one-on-one matchups between john kasich and cruz, all of them show them beating trump. it is actually the ones in the race that are helping trump. it's really the establishment dysfunction that can't unite behind a single candidate and that is essentially the problem, they cannot lead to a unified group. you will never put the party back again. >> you think when it comes down to trump versus say cruz if it does come down to it, that people are going to like cruz more, i used to take that position, and trump got mad at me. i said rubio would be the logical one. trump made fun of that, he said what makes you think they're going to united around anyone?
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what makes you think they will like ted cruz when the spotlight is on him. i don't think they will like him anymore when they have to choose him for president. ted cruz. >> he is definitely not the most likeable of candidates, but in a sense, there is evidence. if you look at the polls where it is one-on-one and head to head, and both national state by state where they just do candidates state by state, each one of those candidates if you consolidate the anti-trump vote do beat trump. there is evidence of that. >> let me get back to henry on this. the exit polls we took last night in mississippi, fascinating. the voters down there say they will be satisfied with cruz or trump in a range of about 60 or 62%. but he said they would be satisfied with rubio at the level of 38%. i mean, what do you make of that? the fact when they look at all three candidates in mississippi, the state you're from, i
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believe, he doesn't make it. rubio doesn't make it. >> well, it's just the dynamics at the time. campaigns have ups and downs, ronald reagan in 1976 was pretty much left for dead. we had lost six primaries in a row, but he came back and lost three in '74 and came back in a virtual tie with ford. we are on our home turf, rubio has to be positive and has to show people he can united the party. and remember, chris, marco rubio is our strongest candidate in the fall. he has to remind people of why he is the strongest one. and he just has to get back to his bread and butter. >> in 1976, the reason why ronald reagan made a comeback in 1976 was because he went to north carolina and the help of jesse holmes, and how is rubio going to do it? he doesn't have a jesse helms or
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a panama canal. >> obviously, rubio is counting on florida, john kasich wanted to wait and take ohio, i think he will probably take ohio. but marco rubio can restate all of his positions over and over again but he is already -- i don't want to say he already lost it, but the fact -- >> can i say something? >> yes. >> you would do well, the op-ed, that is where rubio exists, he doesn't exist. they love him because he is pushing for war all the time. the average person has no interest in marco rubio. >> and he could have done it before florida -- if he loses it, his political career is pretty much over. >> what do you see down there?
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>> reporter: we're waiting for hillary clinton and bernie sanders to slug it out tonight. it is potentially the last debate they will have. they agreed to three more. we'll see if they have anymore after this. it is not really in hillary clinton's interest to have anymore. but in terms of the republican field, donald trump is here in the state rallying people in the past few days, he is trying to get back the votes that elected him to the senate. it is definitely feeling like there is a group of protesters out here in front of the hillary clinton and bernie sanders debate. and they're all trump protesters. you don't see any other protesters -- >> they're pro-trump. >> and trump's victory press conference, featuring by the way, ten flags last night. ten american flags up from six -- this guy is getting more and more presidential, or napoleonic, whichever, but he seemed to be making nice with
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the establishment. >> it is very, very important as a republican that our senators and that our congressmen get reelected. we have terrific people. not all of them are on my side, we have terrific people. i want to thank paul ryan. he called me a couple of days ago. he could not have been nicer, i have great respect to paul ryan, i say let's come together, folks, we're going to win. and believe it or not. i am a unifier, i unify, look at all the things i built all over the world, i get along with people. >> he says anything, anyway, meanwhile, this morning donald trump taunted rubio about the consequences of losing his own state but also didn't run out the possibility of putting him on his ticket as vp. let's watch. >> i believe with all of my heart that the winner of the florida primary next tuesday will be the nominee of the republican party. >> well, i guess that was not
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it. anyway, let's get back to henry, you have to explain this guy one more time. tell me how he will offset a 20-point deficit in florida and save his skin. >> well, look, we're going to have a big turnout. i don't think it is a 20-point deficit. most people do believe to i'm talking to today down in florida that rubio will out-perform on election day. they believe it will be a record turnout, 2.3 million, 1.5 million is the record so far. so a lot of new voters coming in. but one point i wanted to make, chris, last night donald trump said -- they're saying horrible things about me. well, mr. trump, they're just talking about your record. and that is his problem. and i'm hopeful that that will come to a head down in florida. >> henry barber, thank you. here is donald trump in his victory speech.
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>> i think if he runs and loses, and you know, i don't think he would win right now. but if he runs and loses i think he will never be able to do anything very big politically in florida. i certainly don't think he would be considered by anybody as a vice president. >> if he dropped out before losing florida would you consider him, could he possibly be on a list as a vp of yours because he could outreach to hispanics and help your outreach -- >> sure, he has a lot of talent. i just don't want to say that, it's not appropriate to talk about it until he makes a decision. >> first of all he says he is through if he loses, he will beat him like a drum. as joe pushed him a little, he said he might put him on the ticket, what does that mean? >> well, i think he doesn't want to offend latinos anymore than he already has and is trying to
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make his trek back to the establishments and soften his positions on torture and make nice with paul ryan, and be more candidate-like and more presidential. >> more boring? >> yeah, more boring, frankly. donald trump, every day is a new day for him. you never know what he is going to say, what he will do. one day he is for it, he is against it. he loves everybody, he is a unifier, oh, absolutely, he is awesome and will be great friends with the members of the senate and the house of representatives. they're trying to figure out how can we get out of the frame with this person? >> it must be amazing having breakfast with a guy who you have no idea you will meet. that could be good for a marriage, though, it's always new. henry barber, you are a soldier, a soldier. anyway, coming up, donald trump is holding a rally right now in north carolina. he is in good shape with the republican race, look at the new
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poll numbers showing he is not the strongest candidate against hillary clinton and bernie sanders. these are numbers you may question but they are the actual numbers. plus, the democrats, bernie sanders won a stunning upset in michigan last night. and heading into ohio, very much like state even though they don't like each other in football. that is next week. while hillary clinton is the favorite in florida she may like the populist appeal, that could be trouble for her if she is the nominee in general. and the cover-up in the catholic church. a great interview coming up with the real reporter behind that story. finally, let me finish with the refreshing political battle. and i mean it. in the democratic party, it's so different than the republican battle. and this is "hardball." the place for politics.
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well, i just want to take this opportunity to thank the people of michigan who kind of repudiated the polls, and had a political revolution that we are talking about. it's strong in every part of the country and frankly we believe that our strongest areas are yet to happen. >> welcome back to "hardball," after trailing hillary clinton by over 20 point nes in the pol out there, bernie sanders pulled a big upset in michigan, taking the polls 50-48, but glenn thrush called it the michigan miracle, saying that bernie sanders is alive. the website called it one of the greatest upsets for modern political history. well, secretary clinton's loss
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was offset by her mississippi win, that tipped off by 62 points, michigan raises quest n questions about secretary clinton's appeal in the rust belt, which is a crucial region for the democrats this coming november. in a state known for the blue collar workers and former reagan democrats, sanders did especially well among the white voters without a college degree, beating clinton by 15 points. with the excitement over sander's victory was on full display last night in detroit, where sanders showed a giant puppet. they came in like that. by the way, afterwards, we invited them in to put on the demonstration to the coney island hot dog place. i got a note, there it is. it says thank you for inviting us in. we appreciate your willingness to hear what we had to say. that was addressed to me and
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msnbc. i'm joined by the mayor, philip levine, who supports hillary clinton. mayor, thank you for joining us. tell us about florida and how -- well, it's an amazing state. as we learned through the recount. one of the good things we figured out how diverse your sta state. down south, more like new york, it's got every accent in the country, every ethnic group. >> florida is really representative of what america is today with our hispanic community, the african-american community. it's the united nations here. when it comes down to secretary sanders and clinton, you can see tremendous enthusiasm for secretary clinton. obviously, there is a lot of trust that both of these candidates need. senator sanders is espousing a
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revolution, a lot of them have gone through it. we kind of know what it's about. i think you will find here the message may not resonate very well. >> are you saying that socialism brings in government control to ends up being somewhat despotic. explain. he will say you can be a democratic socialist and have just as much freedom as we have in this mixed capitalist system. you say if it gets more soci socialist, it's dangerous. >> well, clearly a lot of those people are moving to florida, they're all coming here. when you talk about the socialist democratic countries in europe once again i think you will find there is not a lot of growth or employment opportunities. those same people are moving to florida. >> what do you think of the appeal of bernie sanders,
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florida state, university of florida, free tuition, that is quite an offer. >> well, you know what i think, in socialist revolutions, they offer everything free. he is offering free education, and welfare, how do you pay for it. i understand he is offering free uber and free netflix as well. clearly you have offer anything, but you have to be realistic. i think secretary clinton's plan brings opportunity. >> where did you go to college? >> go blue. >> what a great school. a national school, one of the best, the difference between michigan and florida, where in michigan, senator sanders won the election up there. what do they say in florida, based on the nature of the state? >> i think florida is very international, there is a lot of people that believe in free trade. but understanding secretary
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clinton believes in free trade, she wants to make sure we protect workers and have a plan for more exports. i think michigan, the experience has been where they have seen jobs go overseas, maybe the people in florida haven't seen that as much, but we need to fix the ills in michigan. >> who are you with? >> i'm with nobody. >> as a democrat -- >> what about this debate? he just took a shot at bernie sanders's socialism, denmark, socialist, swedish is socialist, he identifies with the worst kind of socialism. >> and frankly, i think it's a red herring. nothing bernie sanders is talking about is outside of the progressive agenda of the democrats, outside of probably half of the party right now because that is about what he is getting. >> how did you give free tuition
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to the big state schools without controlling the schools? >> the same way you do high schools and grade schools and states all across the country today. you just expand it for four more years. there is nothing socialist -- >> no, if you pay michigan for education, the government writes the check. suppose somebody in new hampshire says we want the same amount of tuition you spend at michigan, or berkeley, and the federal government says the schools are not the same. how do you decide that? somebody in washington? >> or maybe there are block grants to the states. republicans love to do that into that is not what bernie sanders is offering, he is offering free tuition. >> i honestly don't know how you would administer it, but i don't think it is such a problem as some people make it out to be. >> i think it is fascinating when they say you can't build that student center, or that building, it will be interesting
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when the government tries to do that. and philip levine, the mayor of miami. and up next. donald trump may be riding high right now. but new polling shows he is hardly the best candidate to run against hillary clinton. these polls amaze me. they show an amazing advantage. one-on-one with trump. and hillary clinton. i don't know if it is counterintuitive. but this is "hardball," the place for politics. then simply select the best candidates from one easy to review list. you put up one post and the next day you have all these candidates. makes my job a lot easier. (announcer) over 400,000 businesses have already used ziprecruiter. and now you can use ziprecruiter for free. go to ziprecruiter.com/offer99
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the new poll shows hillary clinton beats trump 51-38, hillary clinton over trump. and in the matchup over the outsiders, sanders beat trump at 37, an overwhelming victory predicted by the polling. right now, david cornish, washington bureau chief for "mother jones." and john stanton is with buzz feed. i'm just going to throw this out. how do you react to that poll? does this sit with you that hillary clinton is so much weaker up against trump come november projecting it out -- than bernie sanders? >> i've been saying all along, until -- i'm going to call him senator sanders, goes through a negative campaign of hundreds of
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millions of dollars spent against him, calling him a socialist. >> you just heard the mayor of miami. >> he is a democrat, and until he goes through that he is not on equal ground with hillary clinton. i think at this point there is probably perfect knowledge on the populous about what people think of hillary. and perfect opinion, and not yet on bernie sanders. so i think it's not apples to apples. it's not a fair comparison, although he does do as well as she does against trump. and it's more of a reflection of what people think of donald trump. >> is he more of virgin forest, to keep my metaphors straight? is there a lot of opportunity to nail bernie sanders since she has already been hit so hard? >> well, you know, i talked to republican leaders, and they expect hillary, hoping for bernie. but either way -- >> so they don't believe this
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poll? >> for, no, no, they don't. i was in the inner sanctum with the leaders, they're actually expecting hillary clinton but hoping for bernie. either way, they know the candidates will be their expected nominee. >> john, sometimes politicians are wrong. i went through a lot of campaigns, they begged for this. i mean, reagan, he will be easy. >> it's the same thing as people were saying last summer about trump and they're saying it this fall about trump and were saying it two weeks ago about trump. he defies all of this. and anybody who looks at these polls and says had ththis is a predictor of what is going to happen -- >> he is superman. >> at this stage and time if you talk to the democratic strategists, and we just had steve mcmann on, they conduct focus groups and are blown away by the reaction of women to donald trump. >> what is the women?
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>> it's visceral. he is the abusive boyfriend type that i left. they think it is insurmountable. and there are things about hillary -- >> but could he be the perfect opponent for a woman? because hillary is a woman. she would be the first presidential candidate wouho is woman. could she build her case on the gender? saying we got to beat that guy? >> but donald trump will slip up. he did with megyn kelly, and z rosie o'donnell. >> who won that fight? >> i'm not going to say who win, but -- >> a lot of people rooted for megyn kelly. >> she did a wonderful job. >> but the mob never starts off
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as the mob. they're just people and people if you ask them before they became part of the mob, i would never be that. i would never be a person who burns somebody's house down. but suddenly when there is a guy who speaks to that fear, people, your family and friends, speaks to the mob. it's been going on for a long time. >> he is not -- >> he puts his foot in his mouth all the time and we have not found the kryptonite. >> and he -- >> what did he say -- >> the pope, pretty classy guy, right? most religious, everybody likes him. he sort of won that fight, trump. he went after jeb bush that made him into this. and made rubio into this. >> but the fight against jeb
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bush is different, he had his brother around his neck, and also the name bush, he is a dynasty. >> i told you one guy who beat donald trump, who is it? i'm waiting. >> wouho? >> barack obama. >> but he ran right after that and decided not to run for president. >> he beat him on being dismissive and knew how to get at him. hillary clinton will have a lot of head wind on her side -- tail wind, a lot of americans are not going to buy all of donald trump's taught trump's sthick, and a lot of others may even hold their nose -- >> i want to ask all three of you, who is the strongest candidate to go against trump in the fall? >> probably hillary.
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>> april? you don't have to say who you're for? >> i think both of them actually are. >> what is the matter with you? >> both women -- >> who is the strong -- who is the strong guest? >> okay, hillary. >> i'm just saying -- >> what do you think? >> i would say hillary, bernie, 53-47, i think it's close. >> you want to do it on one of those things? >> no, he got enough out of me already. >> this is a surprise endorsement. carly fiorina announced, anybody but trump, ted cruz, she says it's necessary to stop trump. here she is. >> now you know there are other people in our party who are actually kind of horrified by donald trump. i'm one of them. but here is the thing. we're thought going to beat donald trump by having leaders in our party tst tsk over our
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voters. we're going to have to beat him. the only guy who can beat him it ted cruz. >> what do you think that is worth? >> you have to consider the source. >> it shows the anger he creates among the people who fought with, like jeb. >> he attacked a woman personally, publicly on looks. i mean -- >> that is when he lost. >> the fight, yes -- >> but it didn't help her. >> she has a bad record, she ran hp down the hole. >> her best line was, every woman knows what he meant. whenever you generalize like that, i thought it was great. anyway, the round table will stick with me long enough until i hear something i want to hear. tomorrow at 11 eastern, we'll give you the coverage as the
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republicans face off in miami. again, trump going after rubio, trying to rub him out for next tuesday's primary. you're watching "hardball," a place for politics.
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welcome back to "hardball" -- david, my friend, tell me something i don't know. >> last night, donald trump for his victory speech said he would be more presidential than any president except perhaps abe lincoln. well, at mother jones, we found him roasting joan rivers, it was full of gross jokes -- >> roasted joan rivers, it's silly, not presidential -- >> and you're not going to
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forget it. >> believe me, i wish i hadn't heard it. >> and i asked josh rivers about the supreme court vacancy and he said that progress is being made. what is the definition of progress? the definition is from a senior administration official. the fact that the president has put the nominees, given both sides of the senate leaders to see and view. he -- >> so he has given the names, the possible names -- >> the possible names to senate leaders on both sides, also reviewed the information himself as well as the fact he is talking among the senior staff about the progress that has been made. we're hearing it's less than ten. >> do you think it's a smart move for somebody to accept that nomination? you have to get vetted but you will probably never get confirmed. >> loretta lynch said i'm never
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going to go through this process again. >> she said when the president calls you, though, it's hard to say no. >> and they're wishing to ban the death penalty. >> where is the church on that? >> the church has stayed out of it which gave the lawmakers to look at and sort of figure out on their own, a subcommittee voted on it. it would be the second state that has done this after nebraska last year. it's surprising to us because it's happening in red states as -- >> something about that makes me happy that states actually vote on that. especially when they vote to end it. and then it's the people doing it. you know? so -- anyway, i spent a lot of time in utah politically. working for the last liberal senator in utah, that is how i began. anyway, we don't have time pressure tonight. my friend, we argue more than you can imagine in the dressing room. up next, the real life reporter,
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one of my favorite movies, spotlight, an inspiration to journalists, non-journalists, alike. this is "hardball," a place for politics.
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why are we hesitating? he told us to -- >> we need the full scope, that is the only thing that will end this. we'll take it to ben and let him decide. >> it's time, robby, it's time, they knew and they let it happen. two kids. okay? it could have been you. it could have been me, it could have been any of us. we got to nail these [ bleep ]. we have to show people that nobody can get away with this. not a priest, a cardinal, or a freaking pope. >> we're back, that was a scene from "spotlight, a dramatic true story how a team of investigative reporters exposed the widespread sexual abuse of children by the catholic priests in the archdiocese, and the
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decades-long cover up by the hierarchy. we'll look at the power of abuse and how they carefully navigated around boston's sensitivities. mark ruffalo played to boston globe. joining us now at msnbc, and 92 street wide partnership, with thoughtless innovation of science, and journalism. thank you, michael, was that scene real? the way it makes things seem more light in a complicated situation? >> well, it's a bit of dramatization. it's a credit to my boss, he
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knew i had a tendency to rear up. we did have our differences from time to time, but i think everything turned out in a spectacular fashion. >> it seems watching you, investigative work is patience. the ability to absorb pain, and humiliation and attacks, and moves. >> a lot of the work is tedious, getting doors slammed in your face, a lot of it is accepting humiliation. but patience pays off. >> i love how you found the directories of catholic priests, and how all of a sudden they were deemed to be sick but you found out they were transferred because of abusing children. >> we discovered the
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strange-sounding assignments, they were euphemismss of priests put on the shelf who had been abusing children. we put together a list of suspect priests which proved very useful in our investigation. >> we're looking at him played by liev schreiber, is thats affect, the way he does understatement, beyond believe. >> yeah, that is marty baron, i think he loosened up in the last few years, that was marty baron's affect, no doubt about it. none of this would have happened without marty, his fresh set of eyes that was the trigger for this entire investigation and he deserves all the credit in the world for it.
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>> i worked with the speaker one time, they were very proud of that sunshine thing. that is not a big part of the catholic church, is it? >> not at all, the catholic church is a secretive culture, they often hide behind the first amendment, which protects freedom of religion and speech. it was piercing that veil of secrecy. >> you're talking to a kid, a male, young adult, tell them why they should or shouldn't become investigative reporters, because it's a challenge. >> well, i hthink the reason thy may have wanted to become an investigative reporter, this is a chance to make your life meaningful and make a better choice, it's a way to pursue a satisfying life, it may not be satisfying financially, but in terms of contributing, it's a wonderful job.
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>> you have proven that, i love seeing you out there at the academy awards. when we return, let me finish with this refreshing political battle. going on right now in the democratic side, interesting to watch former secretary clinton and sanders, versus the other side, which is a battle on how big your hands and ears are. anyway, you're watching "hardball," the place for politics. the opportunity she deserves? is it finally witnessing all the artistic wonders of the natural world? whatever your definition of success is, helping you pursue it, is ours. t-i-a-a. i'm spending too muchs for time hiringnter. and not enough time in my kitchen. (announcer) need to hire fast? go to ziprecruiter.com and post your job to over 100 of the web's leading job boards
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let me finish tonight with this refreshing political battle in the democratic party. i say refreshing for a number of reasons, most of them by way of comparison, contrasting what is happening in the faltering republican batting, it's an actual debate over policy. trump makes fun of rubio for sweating too much, of being a choke artist. rubio accuses him of having small hands, you know what that means, he charges, and charges him with wetting his pants. the question is whether the free trade policies going back to president kennedy have been good for the constituents of the democratic party, the working people in industrial states like michigan, ohio, illinois and
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pennsylvania. the two democrats argued on the campaign on the issue of war, with sanders taking on the policy of the war with iraq, that is an important debate. it gets to the all-too serious of where the united states should engage militarily in a world where civil world is not abetted by the conflict. with all the finger-pointing and raised voices there is a distinction between the democrats fighting and the republicans, one is embarrassing and the other is really something quite valuable. one is a test of on-stage macho. the other is a pretty good debate over matters that matter. that is "hardball." thank you for joining us, right now, stay tuned for a special town hall with marco rubio, hosted by chuck todd.
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>> good evening, from new york, i'm chris hayes, tonight, bernie sanders and hillary clinton faced off for the first time since sanders' upset victory in michigan last night. and the running centered on immigration issues to keep focus on the democratic voters in next week's florida primary. under pressure, clinton for the first time vowed not to report the undocumented people living in the country who has not committed crimes. >> i would not deport children, i do not want to deport family members either, jorge, of the undocumented people living in our country i do not want to see them deported. i want to see them on the path to citizenship. >> sanders also broke with

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