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tv   All In With Chris Hayes  MSNBC  April 5, 2016 5:00pm-6:01pm PDT

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and lest we not forget, how do we ensure domestic tranquility by building confidence, real confidence that our police and judicial system serves all of society in fairness to all of society. this is a tall order. having the job is a tall order. being a good and successful president is hard to imagine what to do. how to choose what to do. here in wisconsin, tonight, we'll show how the voters are going about vetting the men and women asking for the job. that's hardball for now. thanks for being with us. our prime time coverage of the wisconsin primary begins right now. donald trump will not be the nominee. >> i like everybody i defeat. >> i'm still here. >> i am telling you we can do this.
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>> i have one million more votes than trump and two and a half more million than bernie sanders. >> will cruz surge ahead? >> all across wisconsin, people are waking up, and help is on the way. >> is it a game changer for kasich? >> i have the sunshining on me. >> after three big wins over clinton, can sanders ride the momentum? >> we have path toward victory. good evening once again. it's been a while since we were at this. we have learned about these primary and caucus nights that they are a bit like snow flakes. no two are alike. tonight is all about one state. all the attention you'll forgive the phrase, is on wisconsin. our political unit would like us to focus on the three ms, momentum, the math and the map. how does tonight's results
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effect all of those three areas? no one will get out because of tonight, but people will move up and down tonight. delegates will watch voter id laws. we'll watch the wisconsin supreme court which was on a broadcast i always watch last night. >> the wisconsin supreme court is fascinating because it's technically a non-partisan race. you can't extrapolate that to anything larger. it's weird they are voting on judges any way. we don't do that all over the country. that is the microsm of a general election in wisconsin. it's a plainly conservative justice versus a plainly liberal challenger. it's a little bit of a rematch from a previous supreme court race. wisconsin has had this reputati reputation forever of being an inherently civil, technocratic
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state. they've had so much turmoil over the last five, six years, it's really changed the self-conception of who they are as a state. a lot of people will be watching to see if wisconsin can turn out a source of statewide pride for them, which is huge voter turn out. this is the first large race where they have new voter restriction, voter id and voter suppressive laws if place they've never had to do a big election with. one of the things we'll be watching is to see what the character of wisconsin is whether the vote turn out is suppre suppressed. >> one thing we learned about chris matthews is he insists on being in the ground, above and with the people. this is primary night, which means he must be in a loud establishment where alcohol is being served. chris, welcome to the broadcast. what do you make of wisconsin
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thus far? >> wisconsin is a wonderful state for primary. this is where jack kennedy beat hubert humphrey. it's also where jean mccarthy and just in polling here, against lyndon johnson. he took the news you're looking to mccarthy. johnson quits the race and leaves the presidency. jimmy carter got to wave the paper in the air the next day and show what an upset he had won. i think this week the challengers will do well out. that means ted cruz and bernie sanders. i think they will win out here. i just have a little fun. i think villanova wasn't the only upset this week. >> all right. putting it in final four terms. chris matthews who had a hand in
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this news circle this season out in wisconsin. more on that as we go into the evening. >> that's right. his trump town hall in wisconsin ended up being the closest thing trump has had to game changing media appearance yet thus far in the race. donald trump and ted cruz battling it out in wisconsin. ted cruz seems to be ahead in the polls but trump is not conceding. he's been campaigning really, really hard in t state. he hasn't walked away at all. with that in mind we've been wondering where donald trump's best chances are. where he needs to perform best in the state. if not for an entire win, at least holding onto delegates. for that we go to steve. >> what you said there at the end is the key. on the republican side in wisconsin, there are two battles playing out. one of them is on the surface. one just beneath the csurface. you win the statewide vote, you
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get 18 delegates out of 42. the one under the surface in wisconsin is for the other 24 delegates that are at stake here. if the polls are right and trump loses statewide, this is the difference whether he just loses in wisconsin or if he really loses in wisconsin. there's eight congressional districts. you see them color coded. each has three delegates. you win the district. you get the three delegates. coming into tonight, this is what the polls have been telling us. in an area right around milwaukee, metro milwaukee area touches four congressional districts. this is donald trump's worth part of the state. this is ted cruz's best part of the state. if cruz were to win the districts it's an extra 12 delegate there is. in green bay it's closer. it's evening cruz. where is trump strongest coming into tonight? it's the north and west part of the state. where is it a real wild card
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coming into tonight? it's right around madison. you have trump doing better there, but also john kasich. if he's going to be factor tonight, it will be in that district right there around madison. if donald trump loses statewide, he could still win a couple of districts and pick up delegates. if he really loses tonight, not only does he lose statewide, but he gets shut out of 24 delegates and he gets zero. >> thanks. coming up on 52 minutes until the polls close, 9:00 p.m. eastern time. 8:00 p.m. central time across wisconsin. let's go to a great town in wisconsin. talk to tony who is standing by in green bay. what would an outsider notice at these polling locations across wisconsin today and tonight? >> reporter: you might notice that the line is about as long as the line outside a green pay
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pa -- bay packers game. it stretches all this way. people are doing all they can to stay into it. a guy is reading a fantasy novel. some people have looked at the line and left. it's a really hopeful and excit excited crowd here. there's a married couple, 41 years. they're getting some quality time in they didn't expect. catching up on e-mail, facebooking. we have three generations of women, grandma, mom and daughter. they're not sure who they will vote for. they are trying to make up their minds. that's new voter registration behind me. you see the family registering for the same time. wisconsin has same-day voter registration. again the line, the lines. turn out is part of it. there's also the new voter id law that's slowing things down. there's a bottleneck right here at check in.
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they also have a shortage of workers. they only have five people working. they would have liked ten. this is mary running the place. doing a great job. she's excited. >> very excited. >> you think this is good news. >> superb news. >> she would like to have another polling machine and more workers. >> we will. >> that's the situation here. we'll check in with you later in the night. >> i've watched mary in your live reportsnd she's getting small ner ter in the chair has y goes on. couples are enjoying conjugal visits in line. we're talking about this voter id law and how it lengths the line at a lot of these polling places. if you've been watching the previous hour, you saw chris hayes standing by on the campus of marquette.
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>> they are about to go with their student id especially issued student id. not the normal one. that wasn't allowed under the voter id law. they got enrollment for it. they are about to register to vote. these folks are at the back of line. we still have about 45 minutes until polls close. this line is going to snake around all the way as folks have gone through the first step. they got their special student id. they got the enrollment form. now all these folks here will have to wait all the way through. don't step on the child, chris. they've already -- they're going to be here for quite some time. they're going to be waiting. they got their laptops out. there will be a desperate rush for charges. these folks are waiting up to
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two and a half hours. earlier today they sent in reenforcements. there's been a backlog all day that's been like this. now they are processing at the highest level of capacity they can. all these folks here, they will get to vote. if they're online by the time polls close, no matter how long it takes to get through the process to register. they will register, will they be registered for november? students move around a lot. a lot of these folks may have to go through this process once again to re-register if back in fall and at another address and back here up at front. a bit of a hassle for the young voters of marquette university. hassle is the law that critics have zeroed in when they've been criticizing it. >> chris hayes on the campus of marquette yucatan peninsula somewhere martin scorsesi is saying that's how you shoot a movieing picture.
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more on that after this. does this voter id law address a problem that does not exist? let's listen to what the cruz campaign has to say. all the public polling heading in tonight has cruz at the top of the pack in wisconsin. why is this such an important critical, crucial state for cruz? >> a couple of reasons. it allows cruz to make the argument he can win as the calendar moves east. you talk about the map being one of the major factors. that's part of it. the other reason is the momentum. it's not necessarily because of the delegate count. it would make the math a little more difficult for trump if cruz wins. it's because of the momentum that cruz can point to. that plays into two things. what we expect to hear from cruz tonight and what we expect to see from him down the road. tienl tonight a campaign aid is saying when cruz deliver his speech, likely a victory speech and if
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cruz performs as his campaign predicts he will, they are looking at a double digit victory. you can talk about a resetting of this race. that's how he will frame this moving forward. talking about the need to unify the party. he heads over from wisconsin to your neck of the woods. he's over at the bronx tomorrow. he's in upstate new york the date after that. that is because he will be holding more, i'm told, coalition based events. last week he held a women for cruz event. you're going to see more of these events from ted cruz trying to bring together different parts of not just the republican party but groups that don't typically, necessarily vote republicans, different african-american group, reaching out to young people and hispanic demographics as well. all this part of cruz strategy moving forward. >> all right. body language on a primary day is interesting but not everything. donald trump is down tonight. nothing scheduled. hillary clinton is down, nothing scheduled.
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>> bernie sanders is not down but he's going to be in wyoming. ted cruz is the only person that will be in wisconsin tonight ready to savor that victory. i would add one thing to what haley said. so far ted cruz has won eight states. five of the eight states he has won are caucuses. there are no more caucus ks on the republican side. of the three primary, no offense to idaho and oklahoma, the only large state he's won is his home state of texas. if he does win in wisconsin tonight, it's gateway to the rest of the calendar, but it would be the first state of this kind that he has won. it would be the first demonstration of that kind of mainstream candidate strength that he's made. so far even though he's had these few wins when you look at how people compete, he's won the marginal stuff in his home state an that's it. >> all about the politically crucial state of wisconsin. 45 minutes until the closing of
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the polls. our first break. we're back on the other side. they found out who's been hacking into our network.
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who? guess. i don't know, some kids in a basement? you watch too many movies. who? a small business in china. a business? they work nine to five. they take lunch hours. like a job? like a job. we tracked them. how did we do that? we have some new guys defending our network. new guys? well, they're not that new. they've been defending things for a long time. [ digital typewriting ] it's not just security. it's defense. bae systems.
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we are back. you see the long lines. we've been talking about the topic of the voter id law in wisconsin. more on that as the evening goes along. chris jansen is in the village of jackson, wisconsin tonight having spoken to donald trump earlier today. chris. >> reporter: i did indeed. here is one of three. these counties where republicans are very, very heavy. it's one of the most republican areas in the country. most reliably republican. it's been busy all day long. let any take a check of how many voters have gone through here. one of the reasons donald trump
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told me he thought he would do well is because of turn out. seemingly not understanding in these three counties, high turn out favors ted cruz. he was unaware of the reports in politico, by nbc news, on the cover of new york magazine, reports that his campaign is disarray. fighting between the people who have been with him for years and the new political types that are coming in. i asked him about some of the criticism he's taken. his criticism of the governor, his criticism of the speaker of the house. his criticism of talk radio h t hosts. here is what he told me. >> you don't feel ill served that you didn't know they had been leading an anti-trump -- >> i don't mind that. you go into the enemy camp. he's not smart guy, not a bright guy. if you listen to the entire show, you would have said donald
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trump won the debate. i was on the show for 15 minutes. everybody that listened to that show said you convinced me. i've had many people call me that were going to vote against me. they listened to the show. by the end of the show, they wrote and they tweeted and all of these and they said that by the end of that show, you have totally convinced me. i'm voting for trump. sometimes you go into unfriendly territory. that's part of the game. >> reporter: he also, by the way, dismissed the polls that show as many as three out of every four women view him as unfavorably. we'll see what happens tonight in the only poll that counts. they're in past the 50 percentile as well. brian. >> all right. chris in the small town of jackson, wisconsin.
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60% or over. the stop trump movement was robust this cycle. donald trump found there's a robu robust radio talk show hosts. one of them, charlie sykes. we were talking about his show. that got a lot of news agenda earlier in the week and then came the town hall. a young woman with a question on abortion. chris matthews, the moderator, used that as a basis and went in 12 times with follow up questions on abortion. that resulted in the other story. both gentlemen happen to be together in milwaukee. chris. >> i have charlie sykes with me. i don't know what to say. trump is going after you now. your interview was pretty simple. >> i thought so. apparently, i've been living in his head the last week. i think he spent more time
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talking about me than hillary clint clinton. he wants to be leader of the free world but he's kind of thin skinned. >> i do pay attention to rush limbaugh and sean hannity. it seemed to me there's almost the universality in the day-to-day, hour to hour conservative world. >> no. i think a lot of national guys have been drinking the kool-aid. here in wisconsin it's been pretty anti-trump. what you're seeing here in wisconsin is what happens when he doesn't have the air cover and people on the air who are making excuses for him or rationalizing or spinning. i think you'll see that in south eastern wisconsin that once donald trump is challenged once he's asked tough questions by me or you, he doesn't do well. you have voters here who are very savvy. they pay attention. they can see when somebody is faking it and when they are the real deal. >> what did you sense of trump having a penetrating opportunity with him?
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did you have a sense he hadn't given thought to the issues you care about? >> i think that's exactly right. it's not so much he's not a conservative or a liberal. he really hasn't thought about that. >> could he have run as a liberal democratic? >> he could have. his positions on socialized medicine or tax increases, a lot of those things could have been a populist democratic candidate. we have a lot of conservative republicans. >> let me interview you. >> okay. >> trump has grabbed hold of something with the republican voter. 45%. something about nationalism, something about we're getting pushed around too much. it's not just the white working class guy. it's a sense we've been shoved afternoon on immigration, stupid wars, trade. has the establishment in your party failed to address those issues convincingly as he has? he's taken the votes away from them. >> obviously, yes. you have to ask why couldn't we
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have come up a a messenger. rick santorum did talk about some of these things with -- >> he talked about the working guy. >> exactly. talked about that blue collar worker from central wisconsin who doesn't understand why those jobs are going to china. these are legitimate -- >> who is that guy or that woman's party? do they have a party now, the working class white? >> a lot of them have been voting for republicans. i think a lot of the republicans and elite have taken it for granted. >> have they exploited it and not responded? >> right. donald trump doesn't have the substance to bring the jobs back. >> you did your job. you're on the map. are you going to write him thank you note? >> i'll see if he keeps talking about me. >> he did it. he was trashing you right here. the center of the hurricane right here. thank you. >> thank you, charlie.
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you're not going to hear the word demogogic. >> aftermidnight we'll spell it. >> we're going to bring in our friend hees here in the studio we come back from a break.
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polls close. we're back tonight. just one state on our agenda, but it's big and politically
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crucial. remember the three ms. momentum, math and the map all critical tonight. >> the even broader picture in the republican race right now is the prospect of this being decided not in the individual states but after the convention in cleveland this summer. it looms so much over the race now that it's no longer just something that political insiders and junkies are talking about. we asked about it in exiting polling. >> that's why this is interesting in wisconsin because of the stop trump movement. you deny him 1237 opens up all the possibilities at the convention. the trump people are counter. they say if they emerge with the most delegates, the most states won, they should, in all fairness, get the nomination. that's the question asked of wisconsin republican voter tonight in the exit poll. if we get through the primary,
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caucuses, nobody has a majority, what should that convention do? should they honor the candidate who got the most vote in primaries? 56 of republican voters in wisconsin say that's what the convention should do if that happens. 42% of them say no. it should be a truly, open convention, somebody else, a cruz, a kasich. maybe a candidate we're not talking about right now should be able to win. if you break that down even further, 83% of trump voters in wisconsin are saying it should go to the candidate who gets the most support in the primaries. 42% of the other candidates saying the same thing. a clear divide there that's pretty easy to understand, i think. >> thank you, steve. let's bring in our friends at the stable. you know them. you love them. nicole wallace, communications director for president bush. eugene robinson has a pulitzer prize this his den, and a lot of people don't. chuck todd is the moderator. >> do people call them doens?
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>> i call mine a den. >> does it have wood panelling? >> it has book lines. >> book line study. >> you were expecting maybe knotty pine? >> yes. >> start with nicole. >> i'm going to add a couple of ms. meltdown and mojo. this is arguably, the two weeks since we were last year. we should get together every tuesday. >> we should have just faked one last tuesday because we're weird. >> tgi fridays or something. >> we're awaiting the returns from narnia. >> trump had the first real meltdown in terms of what happened to him in the media where he has said outrageous things. you can probably go out onto fifth avenue if you're donald trump and your supporters won't peel away, but you can't take
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five positions on abortion. you can't look so plainly like you're doing what charlie sykes talked about on national security. you've had the president and secretary of state talking about things they are heari ining fro world leaders. trump is still the only person running in the republican primary with a path to the nomination. he's the only person that can get to 1237. we shouldn't lose sight of that. he's going to have a bad night. it has a lot more to do with the meltdown. any sort of magic the stop trump movement. >> shouldn't they get credit? the second most spending is by the anti-donald trump super pac. >> i think trump is in control of his own destiny in a way that nobody on either side is. i think that cruz was arguably stronger, but this is also point where his strengths, i've talked about how he has the best campaign and he's the most disciplined candidate.
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those things are starting to pay off. he was sort of laying there waiting prepared and organized for trump's collapse. that's what happened. >> i think this is the best case scenario for the stop trump movement. you have the governor. you've got the talk radio hosts. you've got this whole republican machine led by the governor that's mobilized already. it's been mobilized for years now because scott walker been through the campaigns. >> the scott walker era has been in turmoil. >> you've got the army ready to march. they're trained up and ready to go. that's knnot the case in a lot states. if he has a bad night tonight, i'm not sure. clearly some of it will be his indiscipline and lack of curiosity and interest and failure to study issues or think about abortion. eventually, somebody will tell him what he thinks about
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abortion. >> he'll memorize it. >> and there will be two weeks, if he loses tonight, two weeks of really bad kind of press and then the new york primary. >> i don't think so. chuck, you and i had this debate this morning. i think the plus side of being unmoored to any set of principles is you can throw everything away and start over. i think he's do a remarkable job. he's already announced and washington post reporting a series of policy speeches. he's already announced changes that will talk about something other than that. >> if this were a normal candidate and normal campaign, all of this will make sense. i understand it's only one policy speech. it's not a series of them. that's number one. it may take a while to get off the ground. a lot of people close to him have said, when he turns, he knows how to do this. he will stay disciplined.
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he's yet to show us any discipline. past performance is indicative of future behavior. maybe he does change, but a lot of people have been saying that very thing about donald trump for six months now and he didn't do it. >> thank you for mentioning discipline. allow me to show some as i often have to. >> yes, you do. >> we'll be back after a break right after this. when it comes to medicare,
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so, call now, request your free guide, and explore the range of aarp medicare supplement plans. sixty-five may get all the attention, but now is a good time to start thinking about how you want things to be. go long™. we're back. it's all about one state tonight, wisconsin. at 9:00 eastern time, top of the hour, the polls will close. let's check in at the university of wisconsin madison. jacob has been reporting from there all day. hey, jacob. >> reporter: hey, brian. straight up, got to tell you, we're not seeing the long lines. this is where some shorter lines were earlier today at this location. we're not seeing lines at the biggest university in the state of wisconsin. we're seeing some limited
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same-day registration right here. the we in bernie sanders stronghold, is not a good sign who was polling about ten points ahead in this area. we can check the tally of the overall votes. the big question to ask is, is this because of the voter registration issue and the voter id issue. we have 1607 voters at this location at one of the busiest places at a school with 43,000 people. limited people voting at tend of the day. the issue is that everybody that wanted to vote could not use their school issued school id. this is a voter id issued by the school. students were able to come and pick this up. what i need to stress here is, we're not seeing these long lines. that's because people were discouraged because they couldn't find these. >> all right. thank you. let's go out to laramie, wyoming. that's because sanders is in
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laramie, wyoming. it's yours to explain. >> reporter: we're getting the grand tour of the united states with bernie sanders. he's here because this is next up on the calendar for democrats. the caucus will be on saturday. the sanders campaign is following it tradition of continuing to push ahead on these election nights. when they have known they would potentially have a good night, typically instead of trying to take a victory lap in the state where they are, they are focusing on what is a more important message, which is saying we're going to keep fighting this. they still feel like the central challenge for his campaign is convincing people he's capable of winning this nomination. i talked at some length earlier today with jane sanders who is sanders wife, but a close political advisor who used to do his tv ads before they hired tad devine. she's still frustrated by this perception that he can't win or
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the idea that he was never in this to win it. he was in it for cause campaign. we saw some of that reporting that maybe they would have done some things differently in 2015. she disputes that. she said it's always about winning. why they might come out of wisconsin doing well, they are getting tough headlines in new york. this new daily news cover calling it bernie sanders sandy hook shame referring to this interview he did with them where he said that gun manufacturers for sandy hook families shouldn't be allowed to sue the manufacturers. >> all right. more on that later tonight. reporting from the wide west with the candidate. another break for us. 8:41 p.m. eastern. coming up at 9:00 we'll have our poll closings. we're right back. , we'll have our poll closings. we're right back.
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folks about 15 minutes left until the closing of polls. usually, if you're in line you're more than accommodated. it's still going to be a while. this is the marquette campus in mil milwaukee. people are tired of television cameras making the walking shots
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where they are ie trotrying to to place their votes. we'll try to be respectful of that. robert is easily 50 feet away from us in our news room. you and bob talked to donald trump. he's still going to control a lot of the conversation. your colleague out here wrote to caution everybody. this is not the beginning of the end. we've had so many beginnings of the end with donald trump. what do you make of this moment in the political life of donald trump? >> wisconsin is a critical moment for trump. i think it will be a clarification about where the movement right within the republican party stands on trump. this never trump movement it has a center, a home base in wisconsin. this is the firts place of republican party nationally. this is place in that's el gaitgait -- elevated scott walker.
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>> robert, it's rachel here. looking down the map in terms of what comes next and how wisconsin fits into the rest of it. one of the things about the wisconsin republican electorate is it's very well educated. he does better with less educated voters. is that something that's going to continue to resonate in the republican electorates and mid-atlantic states. massachusetts, delaware, maryland, pennsylvania, rhode island. if he has trouble with wisconsin and suburban, highly educated, white collar republicans, is that bad sign for him in the states that come next? >> it could be. they often point to massachusetts, a state the trump campaign didn't think they would win early on but ended up having a pretty sweeping victory. they think they can turn out people. if you look at pennsylvania, trump struggles with the voters
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in the voter rich area, suburban area, the communities outside of pittsburgh where you have well educated republicans. he has to have high, high turn out in the center of the state. >> robert, what did donald trump say to you about, let's call it the, cult of personality. >> he said the aura of personality will be at the core of his presidency. he thinks whether it's negotiated trade deal, he thinks the force of trump, rather than a certain policy agenda or anything else will be an important factor. it's him at the end of the day. he called himself the lone ranger. >> robert costa, thank you very much. we're going to take our very last commercial break before we'll bridge the top of the hour. the poll closing from wisconsin and whatever characterization we can give in just over 11 minutes. please, stay with us.
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we're back. current appearances notwithstanding. we have a live shot in green bay and also in milwaukee as we have been saying tonight, the voter id law in the state of wisconsin is playing a role in this primary election. >> we should just keep in mind, you're looking at the bottom
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left hand corner of your screen, that's when the poll closing is. the rest of the screen shows the very, very long lines that we have been told that the lines still are two and a half hours long in some places. there aren't long lines everywhere in wisconsin, but there are some places where there are long lines. this is where we should tell you if you're in one of those lines or if you're just about to join one of those long lines or just getting out of your car, listening to satellite radio and thinking whether or not it's worth it to join the long lines, it is. the poll closing happens in less than seven minutes but everybody in line should be allowed to vote. even if you're at the end of the long line that will not have you voting, it's still worth doing it. it's worth sticking with it at this point. >> let's bring tony into this conversation. he is in green bay in the midst of one of those lines. hey, tony. >> reporter: people are still persevering here.
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he's a volunteer handing out candy. what gave you this idea? he's a defender of democracy making people have the substance they need. as you said, it's a really good point from rachel. if you're listening and deciding whether or not to go out to vote, come. even if it's a long line, they're going to let you vote if you're in this line by 8:00 p.m. they put a barricade at the end of the line. i can only assume it's a giant wheel of cheese knowing this crowd. got some laughs on that. a very hopeful crowd. this is a crowd that's persevering. i've been thinking why is that? why are these people, earlier in the day we saw peeling off. we're not very far from lambeau field. these are the same people that tailgate in freezing temperature, sub minus temperatures. this is a hearty kind of person here. one of the biggest concerns, biggest complaints is not the long lines. it's the fact they are close to
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running out of "i voted" stickers. a couple of people came back and said mine blew off in the wind. come out and vote. you still have time. >> they don't call it the frozen tundra. >> i love the pride of the i voted sticker. >> it's like going to the doctor when you're a little kid. >> we have some exit poll data in terms of who is turning out on the republican side and democratic side and how voters describe themselves. >> this is a part of the national story. we're seeing chapter 25 or 30 tonight or however many exactly caucuses and primaries we've had. check this out. this is in wisconsin on the democratic side. it was 2008. it was clinton versus obama. back then, eight years ago, we asked wisconsin voters in the primary are you liberal, a m
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moderate, conservative, this was the break down. a huge jump. more than 20 points over the last eight years over the democrats who call themselves liberal. two out of every three now call themselves liberals. it wasn't even half eight years ago. you see the number of moderates has dropped. the number of self-described conservatives. this is a story we have seen in state after state. democrats call themselves liberal much more frequently than before. the scale isn't as dramatic but it's something we're seeing on the republican side. we see it tonight in wisconsin. eight years ago when it was john mccain winning the nomination. 61% of the wisconsin republicans call themselves republicans. tonight it's three and four. the numbers going up on the republican side. this really is sort of this national story we talk about a lot about polarization. we use the term sorting out. liberals have found a home in the democratic party. conservatives have found a home in the republican party.
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there isn't much mixing between the two. >> that's fascinating. >> that's why no one gets along in washington, d.c. chuck todd who joins us here. this is head for your respective corners. >> it is. wisconsin's an outside version of it. they've been -- you have two very mature movements on the left and the right in here. people have mentioned this is the -- the state that claims the birth place of the republican party. as we learned from wayne's world, milwaukee has elected multiple socialist mayors. >> first socialist ever sent to the congress was elected from milwaukee. >> you have this sort of, it's just, there's just a lot of interactive energy. >> they've been at it too. >> one of the things, we don't talk about it enough because the republican race dominates everything. there is a massive shift that's taken place in the democratic party. it's being papered over because hillary clinton is going to be the nominee and she's not
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someone you think as this liberal stallworth. we may look back on hillary clinton and say she's the last progressive non-democratic to win an election in a generation. four or eight years from now, the next democratic primary, this stuff isn't going to go back. >> even this year she would clobber you for saying she's not a progressive because she identifies her that way. >> in her defense she's not when you think about her roots of a 40-year career. she's right to say i've got real progressive roots, and it's true. there was a time she was on the progressive wing of the party. the party's moved. >> we say in state after state, there's a bit of movement but the democratic slide is much more pronounced. >> much more dramatic. we've not missed the story. we said it every night. >> can we break the labels out into the policies.
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i'm wondering if it's just that people are willing to call themselves liberal or do they favor different policies? >> i think it's a mix. i happen to think when you have a president of your movement, i think part of it is that barack obama has branded progressivism. >> perhaps. >> it made -- for a long time the democratic party was embarrassed to call themselves liberal. >> it was a dirty word. >> because republicans would you describe use it against you. now there isn't that sense. it's something about obama winning two terms. >> obama hasn't identified all that overtly as a liberal or progressive. i think the democratic party, which has wanted even more from barack obama has identified itself as being in some cases to the left of barack obama. nobody is running to his right. >> i don't think anybody will run, whoever runs for president the next time the democrats have an open nomination, it will be to the left of whatever hillary clinton did this time. that's my point.
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the mainstream democrat candidate will be to her left. >> we'll all standby. it is 8:59. coming up at the top of the hour, 9:00 eastern time, 8:00 p.m. in the central time zone and a politically crucial state has now closed the polls. as we said, 9:00 out east. let's start with the republicans here. here is our official characterization. too early to call. no surprise if you've been following the polling into tonight, we have ted cruz in the lead over second place donald trump. on the democrat side, too early to call is the central determination there. bernie sanders leading hillary clinton. rachel i asked you what we make of this, but there's nothing to make. >> no. this is pretty much what we expected. that said, being able to characterize a lead in this race is not necessarily what i might have picked


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