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tv   MSNBC Live With Tamron Hall  MSNBC  April 19, 2016 8:00am-9:01am PDT

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live from brooklyn bridge park in, of course, brooklyn, new york. new yorkers hillary clinton and bill clinton as well as donald trump all cast their ballots this morning in what could be their pivotal home state primary. the polls close tonight, 9:00 p.m. eastern time. the democratic and republican front-runners are each hoping for commanding victories that will help propel them toward clinching their party's nominations. both have big leads in the final polls ahead of today's vote. >> it feels great. and i am so excited about both campaigning here, voting here in new york, and i love new york. >> who would have thought. this was just a great honor. i think it's a great honor for new york. new york is a special place. also this morning, nbc news confirms a report of a new shakeup in the trump campaign
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and that the republican front-runner is ready to open his wallet in a way we've not seen before. more on those developments in a moment. meantime, right now hillary clinton is headed to washington, d.c., to address the building trades union legislative conference. that's in about a half hour. we will carry that for you live. as for bernie sanders and john kasich, both are looking forward to next tuesday's primaries with events today in pennsylvania and maryland. while donald trump remains in new york and ted cruz has his sights set on philadelphia. all after making their final appeals yesterday. >> we're going to win, win, win. and we're going to make america great again. america first, folks. america first. >> i hear a lot of complaints, but i don't hear a lot of solutions. >> do we nominate donald trump and hand the election to hillary clinton? or do we unite behind the cruz campaign and beat hillary
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clinton. >> i am hoping to do really well tomorrow. i'm hoping to wrap up the democratic nomination. >> new york state can help take this country a giant step forward for the political revolution. let's do it! >> as always, our nbc correspondents are all over the latest from the campaigns. even this early in the morning. so let's start off with peter alexander who's covering the trump campaign. obviously, peter, when we hear a campaign is making big changes, that often is an indicator or an admission that something is not going well. donald trump makes the case he's leading as far as votes but we know that he's had a consistent problem with the delegates in his party. >> tamron, i think that's right. early morning, you say. we're well into the day already. there's tens of thousands of people across the state already voting. we've seen both hillary clinton and donald trump do that today.
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donald trump as for increasing reports about infighting within the campaign and this shakeup that's being described, here's what we know right now. we know most recently there was a meeting with senior staffers that was held behind closed doors here in new york city where it sort of calcified the infrastructure that is existing right now. at the top of the structure is paul manafort and by his side is rick wiley, a recent hire, formerly the campaign manager for scott walker. what's a little less enclosure right now is exactly what this will mean for corey lewandowski and michael glassner, a senior advisor. there are rumors swirling that this may be the end of the road for those specific individuals as there are parallel political campaigns existing right now within the system. but the source tells nbc news that as in any campaign as you move forward and as the campaign
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expands, it becomes more refined and more disciplined. that's the way they're casting things today. they say they feel very good about their position here in the state of new york. donald trump's home state. the goal will be to sweep up all 95 delegates, but anything above 90 they would certainly be celebrating on this day as it would put them a little bit closer to nailing down a majority of the delegates before the convention later this summer. you've been talking about the money as part of that meeting. nbc news has also learned that donald trump has agreed to dip a little further into his personal billions, spending as much as $20 million in may and june in some of the significant states ahead, including california. that's a state paul manafort said would be crucial. as part of an aggressive advertising campaign going forward. $20 million is significant. that would be more money than trump had spent in any one month to this date so far. >> it's a significant dollar amount, but we know if he gets the nomination, peter, right now
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one of the lines that he likes to tout is that he's self-funded and the big question is whether or not he would be willing to step into his own wallet with the kind of money that would be needed in a general election to be an effective candidate and he has yet to answer that big question. >> that's exactly right. recognize that donald trump has had infinitely more free media, by calling in to news contests and being on the sunday shows and that's helped fueled him for so long. with new managers on the scenes, he has not appeared on the sunday shows in either of the past two weeks. but donald trump, no matter what, is going to be a magnet for attention. many of his positions, i think most americans are pretty familiar with at this point. so the litigating remains to be seen how he will compete with that, whether by purchasing advertising or going forward and having a flood of cameras and interviewers follow him
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everywhere that he goes. >> i think we'll get a glimpse of that tonight because his victory celebration if it turns out to be that tonight will be at trump tower and we'll see if he tries to put on the spectacle that he's done before with mar-a-lago with the flags behind him and looking presidential. so we'll get a glimpse of how he tries to play the media tonight. hallie jackson joins us here in brooklyn. it is interesting, ted cruz in pennsylvania. >> right. >> because he could be last place here. >> and if you look at how the polling has been, tamron, that is probably where he'll end up if it's consistent. john kasich is running in second in new york state. the big question obviously has been how well donald trump will do, how big the margin will be. cruz would wanting to peel off some delegates but he's already made that shift. he's focused on what's next, not on new york state, because it
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sort of appears as though it's kind of done. if the polls holds, we'll know what might happen. >> he did make some strategic and targeted strikes here in new york with, for example, some in the jewish community. >> yes. >> so while he anticipated not winning here, and i love how he says he could be third place, which is last, let's keep it real he's last if these polls hold up, but he did make surgical and strategic strikes here to hurt potentially donald trump's delegate count. >> some of these areas where the campaign thought they could be strong. what that speaks to more broadly is this idea of coalition building as they move into the second sort of phase of their campaign. it's a strategic shift. so it's not just, for example, the jewish community. he wants to reach out to the african-american community, to women, actually to young voters. we had a moment last week we were at a state fair in pennsylvania -- or a fairgrounds in pennsylvania and he stopped and turned around and sort of -- look at these young people, they're coming out.
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if we can bring more young people to our campaign than hillary clinton or bernie sanders. if you look at where the numbers are, there's a question about that but he's trying to target those coalition and that's why he's doing more of these campaign events aimed at these folks. >> let me bring in now from houston, texas, ron nehring to follow up on the reporting from hallie. thanks, ron, for joining me. >> you bet. >> let's talk about some of the strategic campaigning from senator cruz. he's already on to pennsylvania. did the campaign play to the evangelicals too long and too much and now you have this pivot of trying to broaden the potential people who have said in polling they don't like donald trump but they have not gone to senator cruz? >> well, a couple of things on this. first is that there were 17 republican candidates for president. five have consolidated behind senator cruz. we're seeing that being reflected not only nationally
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but locally as well. the state of california we released the list of 50 state and local republican officials who were consolidating behind senator cruz. exactly what we said would happen is happening in terms of as this field has narrowed down to effectively a two-person race, we've seen that consolidation on our part on the part of senator cruz going forward. so we're well organized and prepared for the states that are now coming up. you saw that we've launched our campaign in maryland. we're in pennsylvania tonight. we're well organized in all of the states between now and june, especially in california which we've been concentrating on for some time. that stance is in stark contrast to the hot mess that you have over in the trump campaign right now where they're having to air all of these grievances in public and it looks like the trump campaign seems to have adopted the same management style as trump steaks and trump mortgage and these other failed business endeavors of donald trump. >> but, ron, n that has hurt donald trump and i think
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that is a part of what may be baffling to pundits and perhaps even to your campaign. you just laid out a litany of things that would all add to a donald trump fail, but yet as he said last night in front of all of his supporters, he's winning. 54% right now in the new york poll. yes, it's his home state, but we've talked also about pennsylvania, you and i. we've talked about maryland as well where senator cruz, the field is smaller, but he is not moving in the numbers. why is that? >> well, take a look at what happened in the state of wisconsin. we were down by 20 points about two weeks beforehand. we fully engaged there and every candidate made wisconsin a priority. donald trump predicted that he would win in the state of wisconsin and he got crushed. he got crushed by 13 points there. like i said, the day after he had predicted he was going to win. part of the problem with donald trump is that he's a bad manager, just like he's been a bad manager in so many of his failed business endeavors. he has a big problem in terms of
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not having a well organized and structured campaign in order to take advantage of the opportunities that are ahead. in the state of california -- >> but has your campaign taken advantage of all of those things you just said? you came out of wisconsin with a lot of momentum but here now, again if these numbers hold up, this will be a real gut punch to your campaign. you can lay out a litany of fails regarding donald trump and the disarray that reportedly is happening within his campaign, but where can you show me or tell me where your candidate has improved as a result of donald trump's ineptness as you've described, if that is the case? >> well, let's look at two things. first, you mentioned new york and donald trump will have a good night in new york. that's baked into the equation. everybody knows that, that's no surprise. even the insufferable john kasich was able to win his home state and he's lost every state before and every state since as a result. where we engage and i pointed out wisconsin. we were down by 20 points, fully
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engaged and won. there are lots of states up april 26th and then we move on to the month of may. we're well organized in every one of the five states that vote in the month of may, one state per week except one week where two states are voting. indiana, nebraska, oregon, washington, we're well organiz d ed and structured there. while donald trump is trying to figure out who's who on his org chart, we are well prepared for those states coming up and just watch. >> ron, are you just spinning us, though? where's your next victory here? we've brought up wisconsin three times in this conversation. give me another -- >> it's not only wisconsin. >> you say senator cruz will step out on that stage as -- go ahead. >> we've had five -- >> looking in the future, though. moving ahead. >> we've had five states in a row where we've won. as a result of those victories, even if donald trump wins all of the goodies in new york state
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today, we'll still have closed that gap by more than the delegates that are up in new york. that's what this takes. donald trump is not doing his homework in order to run for the most powerful office in the country. and he's not prepared. and we are. and we are. and so where we engage, our numbers move up, donald trump moves down. now, home state advantage in new york, we know about that. that's no mystery, everybody has been talking about that, everybody knows. so we're about at the top of the sixth inning as of tomorrow and one thing is also clear, donald trump would not be flipping out the way he is if he was on track to win a majority at the convention. he's not going to get it and he knows it. >> well, and i think what we also know is where his flip-out is happening is related to delegates and what his campaign alleges is some shadiness that's going on, even though everything that's been reported is within the rules, like it or not. there's no one who can point to anything that is illegal or that has somehow been a dubious play that he didn't see or should not have seen coming w that said,
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where you've engaged, you say the campaign has done well. you're engaged in pennsylvania right now. the senator is in pennsylvania tonight. will you win pennsylvania, for example? >> well, we're not going to get into this raising the curtain in terms of predictions, where we win and where we don't. >> he predicted he would win wisconsin. >> we respect the voters and we take the time, energy and effort to engage with the grassroots of this republican party. that's why we've had the five victories so far, that's why we're in maryland, that's why we're in pennsylvania, because we're asking people for their support and that's what a campaign is all about. >> i should note, though, he has predicted other wins in the past many times, so that's -- >> not much. >> that's why i specifically asked you -- not much. okay. i'll leave it at not much, ron. thank you very much. greatly appreciate it. >> thank you. so hillary clinton is casting her -- thanks, buddy. hillary clinton is casting her primary ballot this morning near her home in chappaqua, new york.
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it comes as the former secretary of state fights a new attack from bernie sanders claiming that she along with the dnc violated campaign finance laws. we'll take a look at this new allegation from the sanders campaign and get more perspective from clinton's former communications director, who will join us live as we continue our coverage from brooklyn right after a quick break. and we have breaking news regarding rescues that are right now under way in houston, texas. the historic flooding there just incredible. already several people have died as a result of these storms that have pounded the region. we'll have the latest in a live report from the ground.
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seeing some serious new accusations from the sanders campaign against hillary clinton. the sanders campaign is accusing clinton and the democratic national committee of conspiring to funnel money to her campaign in an apparent violation of campaign finance laws. the clinton campaign denies these allegations, calling sanders' attack, quote, baseless and shameful. it is the latest salvo in what has become an increasingly bitter fight and this morning sanders is sounding more confident. >> secretary clinton implied that she could wrap up the whole nomination today. >> i'm afraid she's going to be disan pointed. we're feeling very good. there is a large voter turnout despite the impediment of 3 million people not being able to participate, i think we're going to do just fine. >> nbc's kasie hunt has been covering the democratic race for us. she joins us. let's go through these new allegations regarding this funding and what sanders
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campaign is saying is happening. >> the sanders campaign is essentially saying that hillary clinton's victory fund, which is what they use to raise money for the democratic national committee and other entities is essentially at least giving in kind contributions to the clinton campaign by converting some of their big donors into small donors. hillary clinton has had trouble raising these small donations. now, the clinton campaign says everything is above board. whatever is benefitting their campaign is being paid for by their campaign. they say that this is more down in the mud campaigning and this ultimately is going to divide democrats going into this race. >> as far as what the sanders race wants this to read to the average person who doesn't understand all of this, is it that the dnc is in with hillary clinton and have declared her the nominee even though he is still challenging her? >> basically, yeah. that's been one of their fundamental frustrations all the way along. they felt it at the national level, with the democratic national committee and also felt it at the state level. in iowa, for example, they felt as though the state party in
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iowa was setting things up to help hillary clinton win here. you've got a couple of different things going on. one is a legitimate frustration with the system and the way it's set up. but secondly, this is something that they feel like really motivates their core supporters. so a lot of people who are donating money to sanders and are most energized about him, the sanders campaign pays very close to agency to what their supporters are saying, particularly online, and sort of track that. this is a way for them to raise more of these small donations because a lot of people are motivated by saying, hey, i want to punch back against a system that's rigged against my guy. >> let's talk about how this plays out. you made a great point of the sanders campaign paying close attention to what's said on social media. so does the trump campaign. the trump campaign is saying that the system is rigged, the rnc does not want him to be the nominee. bernie sanders is saying the dnc does not want him to be the nominee. when you make these kind of accusations, you're saying the deck is loaded. how sensitive is the sanders
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campaign to these comparisons that are hard to ignore when you look at strategy? obviously not policy, obviously not their philosophy on where america should go and the direction, so avoid sending us the tweets, but we are saying strategywise here. >> sure. look, the comparisons are a little bit inevitable, right? and that goes to the anger that's driving both sides and the frustration with in many ways, it's different sides culturally of america, but at the same time there are people who are feeling alienated from the system. you know, i think you're seeing obviously people coming out of different sort of backgrounds, maybe sets of beliefs who are supporting trump and vice versa with bernie sanders. >> but the notion that the system is rigged. >> exactly. and it's motivating so much of the anger on both sides of this election. and we've talked so much about kind of this idea of populism, people feeling left behind. yes, a lot of it is economic, it's driven by the recession, it's unemployment or underemployment, but it's also this sense that the system as it
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is isn't working and we should throw the whole thing out. >> even if senator sanders doesn't get the nomination and we don't know that, we don't know the future of donald trump, cruz could get the nomination, the conventional wisdom is that they have both started a conversation that could greatly change the next general election and change the parties as they operate and pick their nominees. maybe not fully, but to some incremental status. >> you know, i think it could be more than incremental. on the democratic side, the challenge for hillary clinton is going to be figuring out how to capture this energy. i mean she to date has not been able to figure out how to speak to these young people, how to raise the kind of money senator sanders has. for the republicans, it's existential. this is something we've been seeing building for years. you've seen it in the house with john boehner all the way along and now it's on the verge of tearing itself apart. >> howard wolfson, democratic strategist, former deputy mayor of new york city and former communications director for
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hillary clinton's 2008 campaign. i'm sure you were listening into our conversation here. bernie sanders has said this this morning, that senator sanders -- that hillary clinton is afraid that she's going to be disappointed. he says they're feeling very good. there's a large voter turnout despite some of the impedestrian minut -- impediments and despite these allegations working in concert with the dnc. what's your response? >> i think there's a question about just how much earth the sanders campaign wants to scorch in a heretofor losing effort. at some point this process will conclude. if it goes how it has gone, secretary clinton will be the nominee and then it will be incumbent upon everyone involved in the process on the democratic side to come back together and to support her candidacy. when i worked for then senator clinton in 2008, there was a point at which it became clear that then senator obama was
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going to be the nominee and it was incumbent upon all of us to support him and work for him. so i'm not sure at this point as we are in now april whether or not these kinds of attacks serve a particularly useful purpose in terms of uniting the party behind a strong nominee and defeating republicans in november. >> but how do you say to senator sanders it may be time to shut up the shop or shut down the shop when some of the national numbers out just yesterday show nationally he's closed the gap? so some, pby the thousands, fee that he is still in the race despite the delegate race. why should he close shop and not go after her if he wants to be the nominee? >> i don't think he should shut down the shop. i think he has run an extraordinary campaign.
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i think his team has done an extraordinary job. they have come from very far back to compete very strongly. but the bottom line is that he is well behind in earned delegates, delegates earned through primaries and caucuses thus far. it is unlikely that he will be in a posion to catch up going forward. and i think, you know, he has to look himself in the mirror, his campaign staff has to look themselves in the mirror and say what kind of damage do we want to do to the person who will likely be our standard bearer in november? it doesn't mean that he shouldn't compete, doesn't mean he won't compete. he will have resources. i suspect he will win more states going forward between now and june and california, but unless something very strange happens, the math remains the math and secretary clinton is very likely to be our nominee. >> but, howard, it's no trade secret some of the things that senator sanders is going after secretary clinton on. so it's not as if he gets out of
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the race these things will disappear and the eventual republican nominee won't bring them up. you already have donald trump calling her corrupt hillary. it may carry less weight depending on how this plays out, but these are no secrets about her background and some of the concerns from voters. i want to read what the hill says. the left of the democratic party has long been uneasy about clinton's coziness with the corporate world, but the emphatic, persistent way in which sanders is ak at thatting her on the topic risks painting her as a cipher of wall street and such a charge could draw liberal grassroots enthusiasm if she locks up the nomination. by comparison since you're a veteran of the 2008 campaign, i was there, we interviewed you many times, which do you measure as being more bitter, what we're seeing now or what we saw in 2008 between hillary clinton and barack obama? >> it's an excellent question. had you asked me a month ago i would have said the 2008 campaign is more bitter. i'm now at the point seeing what
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senator sanders has said and done in the last couple of weeks that i'm ready to say that this campaign is more bitter. most of the bitterness coming on his side. you know, look, campaigns are hard. they are hard fought and he has run, as i said, an extraordinary campaign. but every campaign has to strike a balance between projecting a positive message and ensuring that at the end of a bitter process, that all of the elements in the party can come back together and unite behind the standard bearer so a democrat can be elected in november. >> looking back at 2008 you had allegations involving race, you had secretary clinton accusing obama of representing a sluml d slumlord. they both said the tenor had gotten out of control and yet they united and eventually she became the secretary of state. so if you can get past i think people believe some of the race back and forth in 2008 alone, then there might be hope for
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whomever gets the nomination on the democratic side to be able to pull in all sides but that is to be continued. >> i think that's true, but at some point everybody became cognizant of that fact in 2008. on both sides there was a realization as the campaign was winding down, people did need to come back together, democrats did need to unify. i think senator sanders and his team will begin, i hope, thinking about that going forward in the days and weeks ahead. >> all right, howard, thanks for your time. we greatly appreciate it. we did invite the sanders campaign to join our conversation this morning. they did offer us someone at the last minute, but we were unable to get them on at the last minute. we hope to have them on an upcoming show in the upcoming days, of course. and a quick reminder to stay with us throughout the day for the latest as new yorkers head to the polls for today's primary. our special coverage begins tonight at 5:00 p.m. eastern time. chuck todd, chris matthews,
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rachel maddow and steve kornacki will have the results. we're going to turn to breaking news out of houston, texas. rescues under way following deadly flash flooding. some incredible and heart-breaking images coming out. the rain is not over yet. the latest on the forecast and the effort to help those people in texas. we'll be right back. proof of less joint pain.his is a body of proof.
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right under this tree. ♪ (man) some things are worth holding onto. they're hugging the tree. (man) that's why we got a subaru. or was it that tree? (man) the twenty-sixteen subaru outback. love. it's what makes a subaru, a subaru. welcome back. we are following a couple of live events today on this huge primary day for new york. hillary clinton is focused on union support in washington, d.c. as soon as her remarks begin at this conference, we will bring it to you live. you see the audience now assembled. we're expecting secretary clinton to speak in five minutes or so, so we'll bring that for you. meanwhile let's take a break from politics as we follow another major development in the flash flooding in the houston
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area. right now crews are rescuing people trapped in the northwest part of the city. this as the city is on edge bracing for even more rain. at least five people have been killed, all of them found inside submerged vehicles. dozens of neighborhoods are still under water and most schools in the area remain closed. it's the worst flooding the city has seen in nearly 15 years. the severe storms and torrential rain dumped up to 17 inches of rain in some areas in only a matter of hours. hundreds of thousands of people have been left without power and just one north houston neighborhood alone, a thousand residents had to be evacuated. at the height of the flooding yesterday, news cameras captured this incredible moment as a local reporter rescued a driver trapped in high water. >> you've got to get out. >> what should i do? >> swim. sir, come here. >> thank you.
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>> yeah. so we're here -- >> nbc's janet shamlian is in houston and she joins me now. janet, as we mentioned, there are rescues going on. a lot of people believed or thought this was over and it is far from. we've heard that from city loaders as well. >> yeah. there's really an urging of caution today. tamron, you're from texas so i know you're familiar with this area. i want to give you a look at buffalo bayou on the look of downtown. it is much higher than normal at this hour. as you can see, it's spilling onto the sidewalk here and we have a 70% chance of rain for this afternoon. it would not take much at all to send buffalo bayou and the other bayous in this area over their banks again, the ground is so saturated here. schools in the houston area are still closed, at least the houston independent school district, which is several hundred thousand students. i will say that mass transit has reopened. businesses have reopened. mass transit is running, rather.
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and the city is trying to get back to normal. but we've got pockets of places like the one you're looking at now from a helicopter where there are rescues going on from places like apartment complex and where you're seeing still high water areas. but as quick low as the water comes up in the houston area, it often goes down. what it has left behind in its wake is a muddy mess that will be more than a one-day cleanup and families in 100 neighborhoods across the houston metro area that have had water in their home are now discovering that for themselves. again, the chance of rain increases this afternoon and that could spell more trouble for the houston metro area. tamron, back to you. >> janet shamlian, live for us in houston, texas. thank you very much, janet. still to come, the kasich factor. polling shows the ohio governor is in second place over ted cruz in today's primary. george pataki will join me to talk about kasich's chances in today's contest.
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being that your polls are not up to snuff, okay, and you're still going -- >> thanks, dad. >> pardon? >> no, go ahead. go ahead. >> and you're still going, okay, is that a thing to derail trump? >> no. what have we heard? here's what we've heard. if you are not of the right religion, you're not coming into the country. and by the way, i'm going to patrol your neighborhood if you're of the wrong religion. and, by the way, i'm going to go around and pull 11.5 million people out of their homes and ship them back. and the mexicans are going to build a wall. yeah, that's really going to happen. then we might use nuclear weapons in europe, we might use nuclear weapons in asia. i mean are you kidding me? and you're asking me why i'm in
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the race? >> governor john kasich facing some interesting questions about why he's still in the race. from a voter in upstate new york, it's a region where kasich's team is hoping to pick up delegates, despite donald trump's wide lead in the state. i'm joined by former new york governor george pataki who's endorsed governor kasich. thanks for joining us. >> good morning. nice being on with you. >> donald trump tweeted out this, we know tweeting is one of his favorite forms of communicating. he said kasich only looks okay in polls against hillary clinton because nobody views him as a threat and, therefore, have placed zero negative ads against him. he and others have made the point that john kasich has only won his home state and you heard from a potential voter there who's wondering why is he still in the race at this point. after tonight, even with a second place, where do you see the next point of victory for this campaign? >> well, i think there's a good shot in pennsylvania and other parts of the country as well,
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but the big thing is today. and i'm hopeful that governor kasich will come in a strong second and not just that, but he could win, actually win a handful of districts and take delegates that would be his delegates at the convention. there is no path, it's quite clear, for john kasich to have a majority of the delegates between here and the convention. but if he goes into the convention with enough momentum and as he just indicated, he's the only republican candidate who doesn't just beat hillary clinton, he trounces hillary clinton in the general election. i think those delegates are going to look and say who can win, who can govern successfully and it's john kasich. >> what's interesting when our new nbc news/wall street journal poll asked that question regarding who should be the nominee, 62% say the person with the most votes. you just made the case against governor kasich based on what these potential republican voters would like to see happen. he would not be the person with
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the most votes going in. >> let me make a very clear point here. donald trump is not going to be president of the united states. if he is the nominee, he will be crushed by hillary clinton or whoever the democrat is. the question is, does he drive the republican party off a cliff before we realize he's not going to be the president. the more important question is who could be president and if we give him the opportunity, a great president. there's no question in my mind that that is john kasich. you know, maybe he's not in first place in the polls, maybe he's going to be in second place, but it's about choosing the leader of the united states of america. it's not about who's ahead in the polls at this point or who won a primary a few months back. if we get to the convention and the delegates are free to choose, ask yourself two questions. who can win this race, and when they win the race, who can best govern america, lead us together, and that is governor john kasich. >> so essentially if i can just
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paraphrase here, nothing matters until the convention and john kasich sees himself as potentially someone who will go in hopefully holding up the nbc poll saying this is what the nbc poll says regarding a head-to-head matchup with hillary clinton or bernie sanders and, therefore, i am your guy. is that his basic strategy here? >> it's part of the strategy. but the other part is that he can actually lead this country. it's not just about winning the election. you have to do that, but it's about governing successfully. john kasich has done that in ohio very, very well, bringing democrats and republicans together. if he has the chance, he will do it in america. let me just make one point, americans seem to be divided, but it starts at the top with a political leadership that divides for their own interest. john kasich brings people together in the country's interest and that's what we need in a leader and that's why i believe he should be the next president of the united states. >> and while you believe that based on voting, the party, the
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people that you represent, they don't believe it. so when you go into a convention, are you then saying that the voters don't matter -- >> no. >> -- but an nbc poll does that shows john kasich doing better against hillary clinton? >> not at all. what matters is the judgment of the people there as to who they think can best lead the country. if you're going by your criteria, abraham lincoln was a distant third or fourth or fifth when the convention chose him. that worked out pretty well. >> i've heard that comparison. >> they picked teddy roosevelt. that worked out pretty well as well. i'm not adverse to having a convention come together, look at who can lead the country best and it's john kasich. >> but the essence of what i'm saying and you rightfully bring up abraham lincoln and i've heard a lot of republicans bring that up as an example. with that said, set aside those two examples in history. the overarching message from the people or at least that the people are receiving is that
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their votes do not matter by the millions. let me finish the question. and as you've pointed out, what happens with the delegate, the people that the party trusts will make the better decision. than the people. do you need see that, how people -- not journalists, your own party, some within your own party believe that to be the case. >> the primary process often reflects the views of a percentage of the registered voters in a party who come out to vote. all all the registered voters in that party. we have the primary in new york today and i'm hopeful that governor kasich will actually win a handful of districts and come in second in a number of districts. but probably the majority of registered republicans aren't going to vote today. and so does that mean that we're going to let a minority, if they don't constitute a majority, decide that we're going to drive the republican party off a cliff or are we going to exercise our best intelligent judgment as to who can lead the party and lead the country? i think it's the second part.
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we're not supposed to suspend our brains once someone has voted. you engage and look to see who can lead best and that's governor john kasich. >> but, governor, just quickly again as a follow-up here, as someone who is seen as a part of the establishment, when you say use their best brain or your knowledge and intelligence, there are everyday republicans all around this state who will read that as saying you don't know. we know what's best for you. we know, not you. everyday working man and woman in staten island who may support a candidate that you don't. >> not at all. i very much respect -- there will be a lot of people who come out in the republican primary and vote for donald trump, and i respect that. what they are saying is they are angry at washington. they believe the political class in washington doesn't act in the interests of the people, and i agree with them. but the solution is not donald trump. he will not be president. the solution is governor kasich, who if he's nominated would be president. i am enormously respectful for
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the political process. the political process says if a majority of the delegates are behind a candidate, that candidate is the nominee. if donald trump has a majority of the delegates, he'll be the nominee. if he doesn't have a majority of the delegates, then it's free for the delegates at that convention to take another look. and i think they should take another look. >> and i get what you are saying in the process and the allegations of it being rigged, that donald trump has made those assertions are not true, this is what's been in place. however, going back to saying we respect the people, we respect the process, but the delegates know what's best. that these people who take off from work -- >> no. >> who reschedule and go in to vote for a candidate that you are not supporting that they don't know what's best for the party. >> no, no, no. >> i'm only telling you what republican voters, and i know you're aware of this, this is how they are processing it. therefore, when they look at the establishment, and if this plays out against them, this further
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divides the establishment from the people and if it it's not donald trump or ted cruz as the outsider who prevails, it is another outsider eventually that will challenge the establishment, who is essentially telling them they don't know what's best for them. >> no. what you are saying is if that less than a majority, less than half of the republican primary voters or caucus voters have chosen donald trump, that the majority who voted for someone else cannot choose someone else, that they're obligated to support the candidate who got less than half but more than the others. i don't think that makes sense. and when you talk about a division at a convention, look at the democratic party. eight of the nine last contests were won by bernie sanders. he trounces hillary time and again, and yet their system is stacked where because of superdelegates and the way the system is rigged, it's highly unlike low that hillary won't be the nominee.
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i think you're going to see far more dissatisfaction when hillary's team steals the democratic nomination from bernie sanders among bernie sanders voters than you will if a majority governor, with all due respect, i think people will see that. people will see that pivot to the conversations of bernie sanders and hillary clinton as an attempt and not to address what's happening within your own party which maybe an historic and divide between the republican party. i appreciate you joining us. there will be more conversations ahead as john kasich said he's in this all the way to the great city of cleveland. thank you very much. >> good being with us. >> yes, next the polls of the people. we are checking in the polls throughout new york state, we'll be right back.
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welcome back, we are following a live event in washington dc. hillary clinton is set to speak. the big union event in washington. she's expected to pull out a victory here in new york. it is a windy day, like the weather, politics are always changing. we'll keep an eye on this event, we'll be right back. my mouth feels super clean! oral-b. know you'r getting a superiorlean. i'm never going back to a manual brush.
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thank you for watching this hour of msnbc. live, i am tamron hall. what a beautiful day but bad hair day from moi. up next, is andrea mitchell reports.
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