tv The Place for Politics 2016 MSNBC May 17, 2016 8:00pm-9:01pm PDT
fashion in 15 seconds. steve kornacki, thank you. we will be checking in with the first characterization, in oregon tonight, it's both a democratic primary to be registe of those two parties in order to have participated in tonight's contests. but right now the polls have closed in oregon and nbc news has two characterizations to make and in both parties the race is considered to be too early to call. there is not much drama in terms of what's going to happen in the republican primary with donald trump effectively the last man standing. between him and ted cruz as you see there on the board too early to call and on the democratic side, where there is quite a bit of drama about what's going to happen tonight in oregon again nbc news has projected the between hillary clinton and winner of the democratic primary bernie sanders tonight, it is too early to call. in the great state of oregon tonight will be senator bernie sanders. chris, this is one of those i want to go now to some of our nights when we don't have any campaign correspondents who have magic information. some of these nights we have exit poll data or other poll been following the various campai data. we can't talk about it but we campaign, most of them are here in the building with us tonight.
know it's out there. no exit polls, we have no more we'll start with kristen welker. kristen? information than anybody else >> hey, there, rachel. does. >> it's in the mail. i think the headline is that i was thinking the way we used hillary clinton got a big moral to do baseball, the double victory. she regained the momentum she's headers, the second game is the headline. lost in recent weeks. so no matter what happens, all night long we cover kentucky but whoever wins oregon will she's suffered losses to senator probably be the top of the story sanders and campaign officials are touting that. tomorrow. >> well, there's true drama they're saying she's inching about what will happen in closer to clinching the oregon. if you squint, it looks like bernie sandersville. he won the washington contest nomination but the big challenge with 73%. remains she's fighting the battle on two fronts. >> portlandia. she still has the primary >> literally a bird land ee eed challenger bernie sanders, who as you just heard, is not going anywhere. he is taking this all the way him when he was in portland, the through california. biggest rally has been in through the convention. we are learning from chris partland. jansing he would possibly it looks like sandersville -- consider contesting the results oh, look, there's the bird. in kentucky. they literally put a bird on they'll look and make a decision portland which was a sketch in about that on wednesday and, of course, that according to portlandia that you can make clinton campaign officials is everything cuter by putting a complicating her efforts to set bird on it. as we heard from steve tonight, her sights on donald trump, this isn't a shoe in on the although she has been doing on democratic side. >> the one poll we have has on the campaign trail and tonight she talked about party hillary clinton way ashowed that unity. >> that's going to be the
certainly contrasts with what we challenge for democrats. who knew this would be the this kind of think the result may be way on the democratic side not kind of ought to be. we're going to have to see. the republican side with trump the presumptive nominee. maybe we'll start getting that we've been talking about the election results. raw vote that steve was talking the reality is the story that about and we'll be able to speculate based on that. we've talked much more about and but we don't know. that has moved farther along >> i don't want to get involved in who the bad guys are in -- today is what happened in nevada at that party convention and this weekend in nevada, it's a this back-and-forth between the video so you can decide clinton supporters and sanders supporters that i think raises yourself. but i thought -- >> wait, can i say something questions about how they're about that, guys, though? going to be able to draw these she did say that they were throwing chairs because they sanders supporters into the fold. were hungry and drunk. whether or not he'll be able to successfully do it. i mean they all seemed -- and you heard bernie sanders >> she said someone hoisted a tonight in that speech talk chair. >> i'm sorry. about working class voters and they all seemed bad to me. how he said he'll be damned if >> i'm trying to slide away from that question to another one. he allowed them to vote for >> oh, okay. >> if you're a bernie sanders donald trump. >> well, donald trump's going to supporter, like a lot of people try and get working class voters we see at these rallies but a as much as he can. lot of people in their early 20s, they're millennial, they he's already taking something of have big student loans. a populist bent, trying to pull their experience with capitalism support away from bernie is as a debtor. sanders. how effective that will be, not i have a daughter-in-law like entirely clear. this, she came out of law school, you have six figures, you can't join the peace corps,
>> the donald trump campaign is you have to pay off your debt. so your immediate reality -- and do you have any history with the focusing on countering hillary democratic party from? probably not. you don't know who jack kennedy clinton's billion dollar effort and hallie, he signed something was, who roosevelt was. so what do you know? big tonight. >> this joint fund-raising your condition. agreement. we found out just a couple hours your economic condition and here this guy comes along and says ago this was a done deal, i "i'm going to help you with the think 11 states involved in this problem you've got, maybe it's pie in the sky, but i'm the one agreement, the max contribution, trying. by the way, i'm going to help $449,000. why should anybody care? why does this matter? your grandparents with social this is going to be an security and everybody with incredibly expensive general health care so you won't have election campaign and to me the your parents banging on the door saying "get health care, start biggest headline coming out of buying health care." tonight when it comes to the that will be taken care of so he money side of it is how far has a tremendous connection with behind donald trump and the republicans are when it comes to catching up with the democrats most of the young voters. and hillary clinton. hillary clinton has to recruit clinton signed her jfa with the them the party. it's not like bringing them back democratic national committee to the party. she has to bring them in. back in august of 2015. it's a head start on the jfa bernie won't make it easy. he'll have some demands. side, it's a head start on the super pac side as we've been reporting as well. so lots of news in the campaign, rachel, there will continue to be lots of news politically. we're going to watch something we're back on the trail within great in american history. the next 48 hours. we will see you for the next smart politics on both sides. i hope it isn't like nevada. primary. >> thank you, hallie, thanks to hillary's saying, i'm going to all of you. win this thing, i'll be the that last point you guys were making about the turn to the
nominee so i can negotiate a lot in terms of party regulations. general. donald trump's big appeal we can stop the closed running in the republican primaries. by the way we can stop super primary, major part of his appeal, is that he is delegates. who cares? self-funding. now as hallie just said he'll be they're not democratic. bernie, the only thing i want soliciting $449,000 donations to from you is we'll stop caucuses, the combined committee of his too. own campaign and the republican [ laughter ] you want one person, one vote, party. i'll give you one person -- we'll be right back. >> it will be very interesting to see if sanders wants to reform the democratic party given that he never had any use for the democratic party until recently. >> good point. >> but if he wants to he could have a big impact. they found out who's been hacking into our network. we have our first vote in. steve kornacki said we'd get a big chunk in. we have 19% so far. nbc news is characterizing this as too early to call but as you can see from these numbers, bernie sanders up to an eight-point lead. steve, what do we know about what's in so far? >> well, we have a big chunk of portland here. i have to press that in the right place. okay, wait a minute here. let's try this one more time. >> if your magic board resists
your charms, we'll get you a new one. >> half the vote is in where portland is. the good news for bernie sanders, he's out to an early lead, we don't know what the vote distribution is going to look like. it's very much a mystery. the one thing you would say, portland you would expect a big number for bernie sanders. that poll i mentioned that had hillary clinton leading, by the way, they broke it down by region in the state. in the portland metro area, not just portland itself but in the portland metro area that had hillary clinton leading by eight points so you're getting here half the vote in right now. this is basically portland right here we're looking at and sanders up eight points there. it's coming pretty fast right now. look at this, 29% int. this is the state capital, salem. let's look at what happened there. okay -- that doesn't -- he shouldn't be willing by -- >> 98% to 2%? sorry? >> this is the university of oregon down here.
58/42. we'll check on what's going on in salem right there. but right now it's going to be a big dump of voigts. i'll check that number, though. >> we should say the three population centers in oregon, portland, salem and eugene, as we get them in we'll get a clearer sign but that one county at 98/2, we'll see if that holds up. at this point i believe we have a characterization? do we have a further characterization? yes, we do. shock, everybody. nbc news can now project that the winner of the oregon republican primary continue will be donald trump running against the proverbial ghost of john kasich and anybody else whose name might have lingered on the who? guess. ballot. donald trump is the projected i don't know, some kids in a basement? winner in oregon. it will be interesting to see you watch too many movies. what kind of margin he gets in who? a small business in china. oregon tonight if only because a business? they work nine to five. they take lunch hours. he hasn't kennel technically cl like a job? the nomination and there are like a job. we tracked them. anti-donald trump dead enders in how did we do that?
the republican party who believe we have some new guys defending our network. without him clinching they can new guys? well, they're not that new. still somehow find some way to they've been defending things for a long time. make paul ryan president. [ digital typewriting ] >> that's not true. it's not just security. all of the "never trump" hopes it's defense. bae systems. and dreams are now centered around the idea of an independent party run. that -- >> unbinding the delegate stuff is still being described? >> not really. where there's still talk in the republican party is the idea of around an independent party run. >> who would that be? >> i don't know, there was a "washington post" story about a few names out there but the problem is ballot access this quickly. it's quickly upon us. >> a lot of big states are upon u us. >> you have a few more days but to the degree there is still a two races tonight on the conversation happening -- there democratic side. in the state of kentucky, nbc is. it's not around doing anything in these primary contests. news has projected hillary clinton as the apparent winner.
in the state of oregon, nbc news it's around the idea of an independent party run. >> is that the purpose to bring has projected bernie sanders as down donald trump in the general the winner, a split decision or do something else? tonight, joy, on the democratic side. >> yeah, i think a split >> the purpose is to deprive decision is a win for hillary either one of them perhaps of clinton, she needed a win, she reaching enough electoral votes hasn't gotten one in the most so win and maybe -- recent contests. >> to go to the house. add that to nevada, i think the >> yeah. >> so it seems like there's clinton campaign is happy two -- anything that's about tonight. >> nicolle? >> i think the clinton campaign trying to prevent trump from ascending in the republican won't be happy until bernie party seems a little crazy. sanders gets out of the way. i have heard two story lines -- one is about keeping him from i don't think she is strengthening at the pace she getting the nomination by trying should be strengthening if she's going to go up against someone to unbind the delegates at the republican convention. so asymmetrical as donald trump. >> that is among republicans really not talked about that has >> does the momentum start over again? >> a lull suggests traditional been extinguished in my reporting over the last ten activities like advertising would slow down. days. >> okay. and the other is trying to get trump with his tractor-trailer people to not prevent him from getting the nomination, let him get the nomination but try to fe -- twitter feed will never pick him off state by state as lull. >> gene? to make the general election not have a -- >> this is something we never expected. we're still having split decisions at this point in the >> different favorite sons. >> and the is this idea that is campaign. the republican contest is over. two months ago, three months still -- i think it will go away in another three weeks. ago, would anyone have imagined >> one person running nationwide
against him? this? it was unimaginable yet here's >> i think for the next three weeks you will hear where we are. republicans -- mitt romney was i think, you know, i think reported by the "washington nicolle was right, i don't think post" to have been on the phone trying to get someone to run as it's good for hillary clinton to continually be attacked from an independent party candidate. both sides, from both donald that's the only real and sort of trump and bernie sanders. reality base sober conversation it's not good for her. taking place any more in the >> the question i think -- i republican party. think bernie sanders has stopped >> a lot of support among the attacking her. the question is whether or not american people for our he starts convincing his supporters that they're political system where idaho has democrats and that's a pivot one vote in the house and that i think we haven't seen and california has one vote. that's a legitimately open question. [ laughter ] but there's lots still to talk >> and the house led by a unit about tonight. rule in the house of republicans our friend chris hayes will be will pick the next president in taking over with live coverage a totally undemocratic way. through the evening on msnbc. don't go anywhere. >> let's go to chris jansing who is with the sanders campaign. we're expecting to be hearing from senator sanders. chris, what's the scene like? how big of an event is that? >> it's kind of wild here. i'm having trouble hearing you. you can see danny glover there getting the folks here riled up. telling them we have to send a message that every vote counts.
they're hoping he'll make a big announcement that he has one in oregon. that this has always been his strategy, to sweep out west. he won the washington caucuses by a big margin. they have a lot of hope in california. they think he'll be able to barnstorm the state, get these kinds of crowds. we don't have an official crowd estimate but this stadium holds 8,000 and there are people hanging off the rafters. they're filling the ground here so this is a way that they can get a lot of free media even as they're talking tonight for the first time, rachel, and i know you were bringing this up, about them deciding not to do ads in california. well, we've just learned they're reconsidering that strategy now. they have seen where ads have worked for them. they have seen how they worked for hillary clinton when she went in late on kentucky and squeezed out a win there. they think that is part of it so
there may be a change in strategy for california and if they get a win in oregon tonight as you hear the shouts of "bernie, bernie, bernie" if they get a boost out of oregon, particularly a fund-raising boost, that could make that more possible. i just want to make one more quick point. i was very interested to see the results in those college towns. they spent a lot of time and money and ground effort in those college towns making sure people were registered, doing their get out the vote as well as going anywhere they could find progressives in those large progressive town, farmers markets, places like that. they felt like that was going to be the key for them in oregon. they'll be very interested in some of those results in places like salem, rachel. >> chris jansing, let me ask you to reiterate that news that you just broke here that the sanders campaign may be reconsidering its decision to not run ads in california. they may be getting back up on the air in that state? >> the two top people in that decision-making process, his
campaign manager jeff weaver and tad devine, his add guru who produced more than 200 ads, obviously besides bernie sanders and his wife in making that decision, they are looking at states where they won, places like wisconsin, places like west virginia where they ran ads and hillary clinton did not run ads and they also have what they considered to be sort of this objective now look at what happened in kentucky with the fact that hillary clinton came in late, she doubled, even tripled his ad spending, we'll see what it is and seems to have helped her squeak out a win so, yes, i'm being told by weaver and devine that california ads are back on the table. it's very, very expensive. a lot of ad markets but if they're going to do it, they should do it quickly because a lot of people have already voted and everyday that goes by when you're not running those ads, those are potential voters you're missing. rachel? >> chris jansing in carson,
california. chris doing a great job being heard and hearing me through the deafening cheers there of a huge number of bernie sanders supporters out tonight to hear him. we're going to listen in tonight, hope we'll get response to him to tonight's election results as we still await the good evening from new york, results in oregon where nbc is still calling this race too technically good morning here on early to call. the east coast. let's listen in. nbc news is projecting bernie sanders of the winner of the oregon primary. donald trump, the presumptive nominee cruised to victory [ cheers and applause ] there. perhaps not surprising. john kasich pulling in a strong 17%. hillary clinton wins 47% to 46% with 99% of the vote in. >> whoa! if those results stand, this would be clinton's first thank you. outright state victory in thank you, carson!
let me -- let me begin by thanking all of you. what a fantastic turnout. thank you so much. [ cheers and applause ] and let me thank jim soble and nick sano and frances fisher and adriana aravalo, kendric sam psn and a special thanks to a very good friend of mine and one of the great actors in our country, danny glover. [ cheers and applause ] danny is not only an extraordinary actor but as many of you know he has spent his entire adult life fighting for economic justice, social justice, racial justice. danny, thank you for all that
you've done. [ cheers and applause ] let me also take this opportunity to say a word of thanks to the people of kentucky. [ cheers and applause ] in a closed primary -- something i am not all that enthusiastic about where independents are not allowed to vote -- [ boos ] where secretary clinton defeated barack obama by 250,000 votes in 2008, it appears tonight that we're going to end up with about half of the delegates from kentucky. [ cheers and applause ] [ crowd chanting "bernie" ]
i want to thank you all for coming out because this is, in a sense, the beginning of the final push to win california. [ cheers and applause ] when we -- and by the way, i should tell you that there are a lot of people out there, many of the pundits and politicians, they say "bernie sanders should drop out." [ boos ] the people of california should not have the right to determine who the next president will be.
[ boos ] well, let me be as clear as i can be, i agree with you, we are in to the last ballot is cast. [ cheers and applause ] you know, when we began this campaign a little over a year ago we were 60 points behind secretary clinton in the polls. we had no political organization, no money, very little name recognition. the media and the pundits determined that we were a fringe candidacy. [ boos ] and nobody thought that this campaign was going anywhere. and on top of all of that, we were taking on the most powerful political organization in the
country, an organization that elected bill clinton twice and ran a strong campaign for hillary clinton in 2008. [ boos ] well, a lot has changed in the last year. [ cheers and applause ] as of today, we have won 19 state primaries and caucuses. [ cheers and applause ] and over nine million votes. [ cheers and applause ] no one can predict the future. but i think we have a real shot to win primaries in a number of the states that will be coming up. [ cheers and applause ]
and don't tell secretary clinton, she might get nervous, i think we're going to win here in california. [ cheers and applause ] and as all of you know -- [ crowd chanting "bernie" ] and as all of you know, california has 475 pledged delegates. [ cheers and applause ] and let me mention something else. i am especially proud that in i believe every primary and caucus, those we won and those we lost, we have received a significant majority of the votes of young people.
[ cheers and applause ] and by the way, one of the things about getting older, the older you get, you know -- >> the better you get! >> well -- [ laughter ] people who are older appear to be younger. that's what it is. so we are winning people 45 years of age or younger and what that tells me is that our vision, a vision of social justice, economic justice, racial -- [ cheers and applause ] and environmental justice, that is the future of this country. [ cheers and applause ]
as of today, i am proud to tell you that taking on virtually the entire democratic establishment, almost all of the senators, the members of the house, mayors, governors, we have won over 45% of the pledged delegates. [ cheers and applause ] and in a couple of weeks, if we can win big in new jersey, new mexico, north dakota and south dakota, montana, california, we have the possibility -- [ cheers and applause ] it will be a steep climb, i recognize that. but we have the possibility of going to philadelphia with a majority of the pledged
delegates. [ cheers and applause ] now, some people say that we've got a steep hill to climb to do that and that is absolutely true. but you know what? together we have been climbing that steep hill from day one in this campaign. [ cheers and applause ] and we are going to continue to fight for every last vote until june 14, and then we're going to take our fight into the convention. [ cheers and applause ] you know, there is a lot of discussion about the role of super pacs. [ boos ] and i am very proud to tell you that i am the only candidate running for president who does
not have a super pac. [ cheers and applause ] we made a decision when we began this campaign that we were not going to beg wall street or corporate america or billionaires for campaign contributions. [ cheers and applause ] and as of today, without a super pac, we have received almost eight million individual campaign contributions. [ cheers and applause ] anybody know what that average contribution is? that's right! [ cheers and applause ]
$27. and what that shows the world, at a time when big money is dominating our political process that you can run a strong winning national campaign without begging billionaires for campaign contributions. [ cheers and applause ] let me -- [ crowd chanting "we love bernie" ] let me also mention that a lot of people may not be aware of and this is that virtually every national and state poll taken in the last six weeks, in all of those polls, we are defeating
donald trump. [ cheers and applause ] and not only are we defeating donald trump in most cases by double digits, in almost every case -- in almost every case, whether it is a national poll or a state poll, we do much better against trump than does secretary clinton. [ cheers and applause ] a poll just came out i think it was yesterday in the state of georgia, not a very good state for us, trump was beating secretary clinton by four points, we were beating him by five points.
[ cheers and applause ] [ crowd chanting "bernie" ] if the democratic party wants to be certain that donald trump is defeated -- and that we must do -- [ cheers and applause ] we together are the campaign to do that. [ cheers and applause ] and it is not just the polls. polls go up, polls go down. what it is is that our campaign has the energy and the enthusiasm and the grass-roots capability. [ cheers and applause ]
the grass-roots capability to make certain that in november in the general election we have a huge voter turnout. here is a political truism -- when the voter turnout is low and people are demoralized and don't come out to vote, republicans win. when there is excitement and energy and people are prepared to stand up and fight back, progressives and democrats win. that is our campaign. [ cheers and applause ] i don't have to explain to anybody here that the american people will not elect a candidate like donald trump who insults mexicans and latinos.
[ boos ] who insults muslims. [ boos ] who insults women and veterans. [ boos ] and who is a leader of the so-called birther movement, tried to delegitimize the presidency of our first african-american president. [ boos ] we will not accept as president a man who want to give hundreds of billions of dollars in tax breaks to billionaire families like his. [ boos ] but who has told us that we don't have to worry about raising the starvation minimum wage of $7.25 an hour.
[ boos ] we will not accept a president who recklessly talks about using nuclear weapons and who changes his mind everyday on every issue. [ boos ] let me also say a word to the leadership of the democratic party. [ boos ] and that is -- that is that the democratic party is going to have to make a very, very profound and important decision. it can do the right thing and open its doors and welcome into the party people who are prepared to fight for real economic and social change.
[ cheers and applause ] that is the democratic party i want to see, bringing in people who are willing to take on wall street. [ cheers and applause ] to take on corporate greed. [ cheers and applause ] and to take on a fossil fuel industry which is destroying this planet. [ cheers and applause ] so i say to the leadership of the democratic party -- open the doors, let the people in. [ cheers and applause ] [ crowd chanting "bernie" ] or the other option for the
democratic party, which i see as a very sad and tragic option, is to choose to maintain its status quo structure, remain dependent on big money campaign contributions. [ boos ] and be a party with limited participation and limited energy. [ boos ] and a party which incredibly is allowing a right wing extremist republican party to capture the votes of a majority of working people in this country. [ boos ] now, i come from the working class of this country and i will be damned -- [ cheers and applause ] i will be damned if we will allow the republican party whose job is to represent the rich and
the powerful to win the votes of working class americans. [ cheers and applause ] now -- [ audience yelling "bernie or bust" ] let me say a word about why i think this campaign is doing so well. and you know why? because we are doing something very unusual, we are telling the american people the truth.
[ cheers and applause ] and here is a very important truth. if we as a nation do not get our act together, this great nation is going to slip into an oligarchic form of society where a handful of billionaires control our political and economic life. [ boos [ boos ] let me tell you how absurd it is. just announced the other day, the koch brothers, second wealthiest family in america -- [ boos ] a family worth tens of billions of dollars, extremely right wing are contributing over $40 million to try to make the united states senate stay republican.
$40 million. [ boos ] and here is what is even crazier. a guy named sheldon adelson -- [ boos ] also one of the wealthiest people in america, this is a billionaire who is prepared to contribute huge sums of money to another billionaire named donald trump. [ boos ] the american people are sick and tired of billionaires running our economy and our political life. [ cheers and applause ] together we are going to overturn this disastrous citizens united supreme court decision. [ cheers and applause ] >> we're going to interject here
to make a call. nbc news projects that the winner of the democratic primary in the state of oregon tonight is bernie sanders. there had not been much polling, there has been, frankly, one poll heading into this primary tonight. it looked very much like bernie sanders country. it was a closed primary, however, in oregon and there had been some signs that hillary clinton might keep it close in oregon but right now with about two-thirds of the vote in, nbc news has projected that bernie sanders is the winner. we were just watching bernie sanders there live in carson, california, talking about how he's going to stay in the race till the very end. obviously when he started that speech he didn't know who would be the projected winner of this race tonight but nbc now just making the call, chris? >> i think that's the big news that he said i'll stay through california. but if you listen to the text, it did have hope for a
rapprochement between he and hillary clinton. he basically said the enemy is donald trump, we must stop him from going through the election. and basically what he would need to get his supporters to shift to hillary clinton. he sedley not let the working people of this country and be taken by the republican party -- >> he said i'll be damned if i let that happen. >> that was a strong statement to make sure he'll make sure the left of the progressive people, the diehards, he says i'm going to bring the diehards in and lot let them seep over to trump. i thought it was a powerful statement. >> the other thing you reacted to live was then sanders asserted point blank that he can get the -- go to the convention in philadelphia in july with a majority of the pledged delegates. when he said that -- and you reacted that way. >> i really thought steve kornacki. >> on fact checking? >> well, yeah, and that jumped out at me too because the wording seemed precise. what sanders said was it's a steep hill to climb but we could have a chance to go to the
convention. if you read between the line there is, we've been talking all primary season about the difference wean the super delegates and the pledged delegates and what the sanders campaign when you strip it all away, what they've been arguing is that if they can win the pledged delegate count during the primary season, those are the delegates actually given out in primaries and caucus, they would have ammunition to look at those super delegates who right now are supporting hillary clinton and say "you cannot defy the will of the voters." so to win that category, pledged delegates, at the end of this primary season, let me show you, when he says steep hill, this is what he means. i don't know if steep hill is the way to describe this. right now coming into tonight, hillary clinton led, little thick marker here. hillary clinton led the pledged delegate count by 282. what do we know? it was a nail-biter in kentucky, she wins in a squeaker, looks like she's probably going to net one delegate out of kentucky. boy i wish we could have thinner marker here. 283. hillary clinton would lead by 283. oregon she's leading by about six, eight points, somewhere in
there. let's say that holds -- excuse me, he is, sanders. let's say sanders nets 11 delegates out of that. that means he'd leave tonight with 272. this is all that's left. let's be real generous to bernie sanders. let's say wins 70%, 80% of the votes in south dakota, north dakota, montana and new mexico, these look like they could be sanders states. let's say it's landslides and he nets from these states a total of 45. he wins by 45 delegates over hillary clinton, that 272 then would come down to 227. now, where could he erase the rest? puerto rico, the virgin islands, district of columbia, these look like, again, to be really good -- if sanders does well here, he's breaking even. let's see say he exceeds expectations, breaks even, new jersey. look at new jersey, 126 delegates up for grabs there. let's say sanders breaks even. do you know why that would be a
major accomplishment? number one, closed primary state. in umb number two, poll has him down 28 points. let's say he erases a 28 point gap and breaks even, he's still down 227 even though he's vastly exceeding expectations and that would leave one state, california. and if you want to erase a 227 pledged delegate gap in the state of california, you need to win 73.5% of the vote roughly. statewide. bernie sanders would have to win an incredibly large, diverse state with 73% of the vote or more to erase that gap and, by the way, if he loses new jersey by anything near the margin that the polls suggest or if he fails to meet the incredibly incredibly generous projections we're allowing here, that 73% shoots up close to 80%. bernie sanders gets a win tonight, this is impressive, it's a closed primary state, the first one he's won but keep in mind the scale of this. when he wins states, big states, he's going to win this thing by
maybe six, eight points tonight. when he won michigan, he won it by a point. he'd need to win california by 50 points. you want to call it a steep hill? maybe there's another term. >> steve kornacki. 50-point margin. nicolle wallace, you feel like you're -- >> i just want to get up. i feel like i might drop something. i want to get up and hug steve kornacki because y'all look at me like i'm crazy sometimes. >> we don't think you're crazy. >> it isn't going to happen. i listened to sanders' speech and i felt like it was baloney because if he wants to make sure the democrats don't lose to donald trump, he would get out of the race so donald trump stopped echoing his attacks on hillary clinton. >> will he keep echoing his attacks whether bernie sanders is still running? >> well, you run out of fresh material. >> what he could do is he obviously is determined to stay in the race -- can i say that when i said i wanted to hug steve kornacki, he ran faster than anybody i ever saw run.
>> he was a blur. >> sorry, start over. >> so he could change the tone of this campaign. he could campaign in a different way. he could campaign in a way that allowed the people of california to have their say, which he says he's going to do no matter what we say here, right? but he could do it in a way that doesn't gratuitously give donald trump more ammunition to use against hillary clinton. he could do it in a way, as a matter of fact -- >> less personal. >> that makes clear to his supporters and to anybody else listening if it's, indeed, true, that he and hillary clinton are roughly on the same page. and roughly of the same party and roughly on the same side. >> he's not running against -- >> he could do that. >> we've heard this long speech from him tonight. he's not running against hillary clinton. he's not making that same point that he and hillary clinton are pulling in the same direction. >> he did not do a bill of particulars against her trade policy or anything else. >> not tonight. >> he was going after trump
tonight. >> tonight he was different what from what he usually does. >> he said what i want is party reform, even though he's just become a democrat. he said i want to get rid of these closed primaries. that was his demand. i think it was an offer hillary should respond to. >> lawrence o'donnell is listening in. we have an apparent win for hillary clinton in kentucky and a projected win for bernie sanders in oregon and we just heard bernie sanders' remarks tonight in california. >> and you saw all those voters in california, bernie sanders supporters, who want to get their chance to vote for him on the very last day of the primaries, he's going to give them that and, listen, donald trump is not echoing bernie sanders. donald trump is talking about things that happened -- bill clinton's personal discretions of the 1990s. that's what he's talking about. donald trump hasn't used any of bernie sanders lines here, bernie sanders is not supplying any ideas to donald trump. bernie sanders is the only person who's ever run directly in the primary against a
presidential candidate who is under fbi investigation because in the history of the fbi, in the history of presidential candidates there has been exactly one candidate under fbi investigation during the campaign. bernie sanders has never mentioned that. donald trump does. that's where donald trump goes on hillary clinton. he's not using any of bernie sanders' material. >> lawrence, do you believe that the sanders/clinton split is not actually hurting clinton's eventual chances against donald trump? >> i don't see how it does. the previous model for this is hillary clinton running against barack obama until the very last day, until very last vote was counted in the primaries. barack obama went on to win. bernie sanders has said donald trump has to be stopped, he has said that consistently, that means there's no question that if bernie sanders isn't the nominee he is going to be out there with the nominee running hard against donald trump. he's left no doubt about that. >> lawrence o'donnell, thank you, my friend.
we'll take a quick break. there's more ahead, including what some of the sanders' campaign, former staffers and supporters, are saying they want to work on after the democratic presidential primary is over. it's not exactly what you might think. we've got that ahead tonight plus chris hayes is going to be taking over coverage at midnight. stay with us.