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tv   MSNBC Live  MSNBC  May 19, 2016 6:00am-7:01am PDT

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for any clues or debris. terrorism not being ruled out. pentagon officials now telling nbc news there's currently no intelligence indicating terror or an explosion in flight. the plane an airbus a320 was last seen on radar around 8:30 a.m. eastern time, 2:30 in the morning cairo time. it had just entered egyptian air space nearing the end of its four-hour flight at 37,000 feet when it simply vanished. the defense minister says the plane made a steep drop and sudden swerves before disappearing. there were 66 people on board. most were egyptian. none were american. some things we do know, the weather at the time clear. the plane a model with one of the best safety records in the skies. and both pilots veterans with thousands of hours in the cockpit. frantic search right now in the waters off greece. air space around the plane's
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last location is now closed indefinitely. the greek government has sent in ships and planes to search for any clues. and the u.s. navy is also now involved at the request of the greeks. family members and loved ones arrive at the airports, both in paris and cairo to wait for any answers. let's get right to our correspondents here in the united states and around the world. joining me live from chicago, tom costello who covers aviation. good morning. what's the latest you're hearing on this very early stages of the investigation? >> a couple of headlines. there are some unconfirmed reports out from other news agencies in that region, in the mediterranean region suggesting there may have been some pieces of debris spotted. nbc news is working to confirm that. the idea, according to these reports, was this debris may have been spotted near a greek island. we'll get more on that as we have it. in addition to that, you have the greek military chief saying that greek military radar showed
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the plane falling dramatically. in fact, doing almost a 360 as it was falling, as it was plunging some 27,000 feet. so the question becomes, was that some sort of a maneuver or was the plane at that point out of control, and are we, therefore, seeing pieces of the plane coming apart. we simply don't have the answers. it's going to be critical they get hold of those black boxes. >> and now, let's talk -- we spoke about this as this news broke overnight right here on msnbc live. tom, this is an extremely safe plane. a plane with an extraordinarily good track record as far as safety in the air. so very early on, tom, you were always bringing up the possibility that it wasn't maybe a mechanical issue on this plane. >> i think we have three -- at this point, and it's very early and let's say this once again.
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we have three possible scenarios here that are the most likely. the first one is there was some sort of a catastrophic breakup in flight. something happened with the mechanics of the plane, with either a mechanical failure or fuselage coming apart. i meant to say it was an aluminum frame. i think i said composite frame. that would be one scenario that the plane came apart because of a structural issue or mechanical issue. the second possibility it seems to me is terrorism and whether the plane came apart at 37,000 feet and 519 miles an hour because of an explosive device on the plane. and then the third possibility would be that somehow there was a combination of perhaps crew error and mechanical issue that contributed to the plane coming down. now i say that because it harkens back to the air asia crash in the java sea in 2014 in which an airbus a320 was having a rutter issue. and the co-pilot and pilot
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failed to do the proper procedures to deal with that rutter. instead they did competing procedures. one push -- one person pulling, the other was pushing. the plane ended up climbing dramatically. they stalled the plane and it crashed. we simply don't know what's happened here. the fact the plane seemed to have come to a sudden and violent and abrupt stop at 37,000 feet and the fact there was no mayday call and air traffic controllers were trying to raise the crew but they were unable to, that's would suggest something catastrophic happened very quickly and there wasn't even time for a pilot to click his microphone and say mayday. we're looking more towards whether this might have been a structural breakup, a mechanical failure or an explosion that caused that kind of a breakup. >> tom, thank you very much. we'll stay with you throughout the remainder of the day for the latest on this. president obama has been briefed
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on what occurred overnight. no official reaction yet from the white house, but certainly the president is being kept informed minute by minute of what is happening. and it still is a mystery, as tom was alluded to just moments ago. i want to bring in msnbc aviation analyst john cox. good to see you this morning. >> good morning, jose. >> let's talk about what is going on. egyptian officials are making a concerted effort to say the plane is lost, not that it possibly crashed. do you believe we'll find out what happened in short order or could this be a long-term process like mh-370 was? >> i think it will come together pretty quickly. they've got a good radar track on the airplane. i expect they're going to be finding debris pretty quickly. that will lead us to the wreckage field. they'll at that point, their pingers on the two important roirders, the flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder, those two boxes will
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tell the tale. i agree with tom costello in a couple ever places. one, the track of the airplane having been so abruptly stopped almost and if they find the debris pretty much underneath that last radar position, that will lead investigators to look very seriously at the possibility of an in-flight breakup. this airplane type has been in service since the mid-1980s. it's a very proven design. it's very safe and has no history of in-flight breakups. now the question is what could cause that? and i think those are going to be central questions to the investigators. first we need to find the boxes, and we'll do that in pretty short order. >> john, let me ask you because if there was no human involvement in the seconds before whatever happened occurred, what i mean, if the pilots didn't call in a may day, didn't touch a switch that would have somehow automatically
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alerted folks that something was happening, if none of that happened, these black boxes, they are found because they turn themselves on in some way, the pinging. how does that happen? >> well, the voice recorder and cockpit and flight data recorder have special acoustic locators. they call them pingers. when they touch salt water, teyw activate. they're a clicking kind of sound that once the investigators are in the area, they can listen with hydrophones and they can hone in on this clicking or pinging sound that these make. so it's designed specifically for this case of an airplane being down in the water and to facilitate the location of these very, very important boxes. >> and they can do that for up to 30 days, right? >> that's correct. and you generally, the guarantee
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is 30 days. generally speaking, they'll go a little bit beyond that. but i'm very hopeful that they will locate these things in much less than 30 days. >> in contrast to what happened for example on that air france flight that disappeared over the ocean, when it was leaving brazil and it took a long time to find those black boxes because the area in which the plane possibly fell was much larger n t er and the depth of ocean was much more than it could be in the mediterranean right by those greek islands. there are 6,000 of them that greece calls islands that are its own between greece and egypt. so it's a much more limited area, john, and it's not as deep, although there are parts of the mediterranean that are very deep, but not as deep as in other instances where the black boxes were found. >> this is true. also they have a much better radar position so they know where the last transponder transmission was. and they also -- they have some
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data from the military radars. this is going to help them pinpoint a search area to a very narrow area. then in addition, they have a lot of surface assets, a lot of ships. a lot of aircraft that are going to be looking for debris. and once they find that, then that will lead them to the wreckage field. n once they can do a side scan sonar, look at the wreckage field, then they can start sending down the remote vehicles, remotely controlled vehicles to start looking for those very important recorders. >> john cox, thank you very much. good to see you this morning. i want to bring in keir simmons live at charles de gaulle airport in paris where flight 804 took off. what's the latest officials there are telling you? >> well, jose, the officials from the french government have been arriving here at this hotel -- airport hotel through
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the morning. family members, relatives of people who are on board that flight have been gathering here. and we know that they will be wanting to make sure that any information they have, they tell to those relatives first before they share it with the wider public. it was from the french president we first heard that confirmation that the plane has crashed, which tells us something, i guess, without knowing the details about what they are learning. they are clearly thinking they have enough information to be confident of that, even though both the egyptians and the greeks and, remember, this plane was flying through greek air space, are saying they have not found the aircraft yet. i think one of the issues, you were just discussing it. one of the issues will be that because the plane was just on that border if you like, between greek and egyptian air space, the two air traffic controls sort of hand over to each other as planes move between these different national air spaces.
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that may be making it slightly trickier to establish exactly where it was. having said that, even though, as far as we can tell, there was no distress signal from the plane. we know that it would have given off all kinds of electronic signals making it impossible to establish where it was. the mediterranean sea, as you say, may well be an easier place to try to find an aircraft like this than other searches of this nature we've seen in the past. the question of what caused it, of course, will be answered by all of the kind of information that they'll discover when they find the plane. but people are holding their breath here because if there was some kind of terrorism involvement, and we simply don't know that at this stage and it's possible the plane disappeared without a distress signal with no terrorist involvement but if there was a plane that took off from a major airport like charles de gaulle in paris, that
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will raise so many questions, six months and seven days since the paris attacks. >> those horrible attacks in paris at charlie hebdo and in november where 130 people were killed in three different parts of the city, and then the search for those terrorists and the brussels connection. charles de gaulle is an extremely secure airport. and this plane was leaving from charles de gaulle to egypt, another country that had been involved and has been the victim of terrorist attacks. >> yeah, exactly right. and so that's going to be something that they are going to be looking at and remember, we know that islamist extremist groups have always wanted to target aviation. we know that, for example, from the attacks in brussels where
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they attacked brussels airport. but, of course, when you think about that attack, for example, it was in the big picture if you like, relatively crude. those men walking in with bombs in their bags so to be able to have an effect on a plane like this, just a note of caution. we don't know whether terrorism has anything to do with this. but to have that kind of effect on a plane like this, flying out of this kind of airport, well, that would be extremely concerning. by the way, some of the questions in previous attacks that have been raised have been about the airport workers, whether it would be possible to penetrate the security of an airport through the staff that are employed at the airport. but, of course, that's why staff at a place like charles de gaulle go through so many checks. >> keir simmons at charles de gaulle in paris, thanks. we have this in to our newsroom. i'm going to read it for you.
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and this is from different sources. commander zadni, the deputy spokesman of the greek army general staff is confirming that at this time, there are, quote, findings reported by the egyptian air force aircraft taking part in the search and rescue operation. the area of the findings is 130 south-southeast of capathos island. this is all the information he was able to give in one interview that we had with them. of course, more information is going to be coming shortly, but again, according to a deputy spokesman for the greek army general staff, that there are findings reported by egyptian air force aircraft taking part in this operation. as i mentioned, president obama has been kept updated on egyptian air flight 804. joining me is ron allen who is outside the white house. ron, good morning. >> good morning. yes, we understand, and this is standard procedure that the
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president has been briefed and is asking for update s throughot the day. that's not an indication the u.s. thinks there's terrorism involved but this is obviously a huge concern that the united states has. we also understand that there are american naval assets in the area that are involved in the search and rescue operation. again, something to be expected, and we'd expect there to be more american advisers going into the area to help with the investigation because, of course, these are very important allies. egypt, france, who are on the front lines if you will, in the war on terror in that part of the world and the united states wants to know exactly what happened. we know for example, in monaco, the homeland security adviser and recently returned from europe. certainly daily calls and meetings between u.s. and european officials since those attacks in brussels and paris. there's a lot of concern here in the united states about security
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at european airports and, of course, what's going on in egypt where it's well known that isis has been stepping up its attacks. pressure on the egyptian government trying to bring pressure on the egyptian government there. something that concerns the united states very gravely. but at this point, there's nothing from the american side based on analysis of intelligence or satellite imagery that indicates whether or not there was a terrorism attacker whether the plane exploded we understand from various defense officials. clearly the investigation is moving along very quickly, if, in fact, debris has been found and spotted and determined where it is. that will certainly help determine what happens. very early stages and, yes, the bottom line here, a lot of concerns about whether this was or was not a terrorist attack. >> ron allen, thank you very much reporting from the white house. before we go to a break, i want to go back to that map showing some of the communications and radar findings of egyptair as it was
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going from paris on to egypt. and if we can go back to the map we just showed, that's one. i want to draw your attention to where this is, these last moments of communication of egyptair, the flight going from paris to egypt. on the top right, you see cyprus. that's an island which has disputed territory. turkey disputes the north and greece the south. but there are a lot of islands and there are a lot of land masses between greece, which has the mainland and has 6,000 islands just south and both southwest and southeast of the mainland. as we see a bigger picture there. cyprus to the right and just south is egypt. this plane was in the final moments of its flight from paris to egypt. 66 people were on board that plane. and it simply vanished. we're getting a whole lot of
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information. we're processing it for you. we're going to take a short break. when we come back, the very latest on the search for egyptair. the flight from paris to cairo that has vanished. you learn a lot about people's tastes. honey, what do you want for dinner tonight? oh, whatever you're making. cheesy chipotle pork quesadillas? mmmm... ravioli lasagna bake? yeah, i don't know... grilled white chicken... grab something rich, sharp and creamy. triple cheddar stuffed sliders. sold! we aim to cheese! kraft natural cheese: we make cheese for how you love cheese. if legalzoom has your back.s, over the last 10 years we've helped one million business owners get started. visit legalzoom today for the legal help you need to start and run your business. legalzoom. legal help is here. ...to cook healthy meals... yet up to 90% fall short in getting key nutrients
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news morning, the greek military is confirming to nbc news they have discovered, quote, findings off a remote island. an international search effort under way in the deep waters of the mediterranean sea. that's the plane where egyptair flight 804 that departed from paris' charles de gaulle airport disappeared overnight on its way to cairo. the capital of egypt. the largest city in egypt. the word from france and egypt is this aurbus a320 crashed. terrorism is not being ruled
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out, but u.s. officials tell us they currently have no intelligence pointing to a terrorist attack. there were 66 people on board, including three children. let's go live to london. nbc news foreign correspondent kelly cobiella is with us. you have more on the time line of this plane that simply vanished. >> good morning. we've been talking about this through the early morning hours on just how this unfolded and ureally, for the 50 three hours, nearly three hours of this flight, everything seemed to be completely routine. it took off from charles de gaulle airport at 11:09, not even close to being a full flight. 66 people in total. 56 of them passengers on board. nearly three hours into the flight, greek aviation authorities say that they contacted the pilot to transition into on out of greek air space into egyptian air space. talked to the pilot. the pilot was in good spirits
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and thanked the controller in greek. then about a half an hour later, greek civil aviation tried to get in contact with this plane yet again to essentially hand over control to egyptian aviation and to confirm that. they weren't able to get in contact with the pilot at that point. and then about two minutes later, the plane disappears off radar. we have since heard from the german -- the greek defense minister with this plane dropped some 22,000 feet. it spun. it swerved. and then dropped to 10,000 and disappeared. that's the time line we have right now. a search launched almost immediately. and it is yet another crisis on top of many for the egyptian air safety industry. you'll recall the metrojet crash from back in october of last year. that flight taking off from
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sharm el sheikh headed to st. petersburg, russia. all 224 on board killed. that flight disappeared, vanished from the sky, 23 minutes into the flight. and just back in march, that hijacking of an egyptair flight. again, in this case, nobody harmed. it landed safely, and the purported bomb on board was, in fact, not a bomb, you'll remember, but this is a continuing issue now for egypt and it is not reflecting well for them, and they know it. >> kelly cobiella in london, thank you. i want to go to ayman mohyeldin. there's no immediate indication of whether terrorism was involved as of right now. but egyptian aviation security has been under scrutiny since that metrojet crash that kelly was telling us about last october which had taken off from sharm el sheikh. talk to us about that and the
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reaction of egyptian authorities to what very possibly showed to be a terrorist attack with isis then later ayman putting that photo of that soda can they had rigged with explosives. talk to me about how egypt reacted to that. and as we do that and show the timeline, you see that we're putting on the timeline from the eastern standard time position. 8:30 p.m. eastern time in the united states. kelly cobiella was giving us a different hour because she was talking about either london time or paris time or athens time or later cairo time. but let's talk about, ayman, what exactly egypt has been doing and its reaction it these kinds of incidents in the past. >> you're talking about the issue of terrorism and they'll all be picking up right now looking for any kind of chatter that may be taking place if there's any potential claim of responsibility. they'll certainly look into the credibility of that.
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you raised a really good point which is egyptair's checkered history and the first and most recent incident is in march of this year, the hijacking. an egyptian man hijacked an egyptair flight from alexandria to cairo and diverted it to cyprus. there's a checkered past in egyptair's history that connects to technical problems, crashes, as well as hijackings and in some cases, according to the americans, flight 990 back in 1999 that the americans allege was a suicide attack where the pilot commandeered the plane into the atlantic ocean killing everyone on the flight. so the egyptians never really acknowledged that being a terrorist attack. they said a result of mechanical failure. but egypt air has had hijackings in the past going back to the 1970s and 80s and fatal crashes as well. in 1992, i believe they had the crash in tunisia, in 2002, not
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1992, but 2002, egyptair crashed in tunisia killing some of those on board. this is a sensitive subject for egypt. egyptair is the national carrier of the country. it affects and undermines the country's image of stability and tourism. given the current climate. you have president assisi who has run on the platform of stability and security. they're deal with an insurgency in the sinai peninsula. isis has managed to get a hold in the northern part of the peninsula. they've launched attacks and claimed responsibility for the metrojet airliner back in november where they allegedly snuck a soda can full of explosives on to the plane. what we've seen and you asked this question about how does egypt react? in the initial stages, egypt tends to deny or downplay the possibility that it is terrorism. they tend to encourage the media to wait until all the facts come into light. and in the case of metrojet, it
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was up to british prime minister david cameron who suggested that this was, in fact, a terrorist attack and then the egyptians began to explain that as a possible theory. they're doing that again today. they're not saying it's not terrorism but they're encouraging everyone to wait to find out what the results are. given the checkered past of egyptair, security lapses at airports in that country, it's a valid question that a lot of people are starting to increasingly ask about possibly being the cause of today's fatal crash. >> ayman mohyeldin, we'll continue speaking with you throughout the remainder of the day for any and all information. this is a mystery. there's very little information coming from the area where this incident occurred, but both greek and egyptian authorities are combing the area. the sea that you see right there for information, clues and anything that we find out, we will share with you immediately. we'll take a short break and be back with more on the disa
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here's the latest on the search for egyptianair flight 804. the deputy spokesman of the army general staff confirmed that at this time, there are findings -- findings reported by the egyptian air force taking part in the operation. the areas of these findings is 130 miles south-southeast of karpathos island in the greek mediterranean. it would be the first sign of it since it disappeared from radar more than 13 hours ago. let me bring in nbc meteorologist bill karins on what the weather conditions were like in the mediterranean overnight and now. >> these pieces of the puzzle are starting to come together. let's start with the weather in the flight of the plane. the yellow arrows show you the path it took. the x is generally where it went off the radar. conditions had been clear and
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are clear. it's now 3:30 in cairo. sunset at 6:44. only three hours left of daylight. if we're starting to get some of those findings, they have three hours to send as many boats and planes in that region and see what's in that region. this is the search area in general that's you're looking at. as we come off the island of crete, the island of karphathos. this is where they're saying 130 miles to the south-southeast of there is where they had the reports of some of those findings. that takes us down in general right about this vicinity in here. that's about south-southeast. that's pretty close to where it was lost off the radar screen, maybe a little further to the northwest of that location. that's -- would make sense. as far as that area that we were just looking at on the map, around the "r" here in the mediterranean. temperatures around 68 degrees. as far as hypothermia, if he had
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survivors in the water, we lost it about 12 hours ago. 12 to 40 hours in water temperatures around 68 is how long someone can last. the clock is ticking on that but it's potential even into tomorrow we could find someone in the water if they survived the crash. as far as water depths, that would be located around the 3,010 foot mark. it's not the deepest but deep enough you'd need an underwater submersible to find the black box and retrieve it. the air france took two years to recover was in 13,000 feet of water. so that's a huge difference here. that's why we're optimistic that things can start happening fast once we find where the debris is. only three hours until sunset. >> let's go back to the map of exactly where karpathos is, vis-a-vis the larger area just because it's almost toward the
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end of the island chain. more than 6,000 islands, right? >> greece is located up here. see where alexandria is and northern egypt. it's slightly closer now it appears to be to the greek side than the egyptian side. that's if those findings happen to be where our debris field is going to be. they only found a couple of pieces. you showed that map with all the boats going into that region. skies are crystal clear. we should be finding out a lot of information shortly in the next three hours while we have daylight. >> just to reconfirm what this staff source is confirming to nbc, there are findings reported by the egyptian air force taking part in the operation. we don't know exactly what findings includes, but we're getting information by the second which we are, of course, sharing with you. there's a timeline for this egyptian air flight 804. last contact with the flight at
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8:30 p.m. eastern time. look when the attempts to reach the flight were unsuccessful, 20 minutes after that. it wasn't a long period of time. it is relatively easy to pinpoint where that plane was last flying before it disappeared. it's a relatively small part of the mediterranean. i want to bring in keir simmons live at charles de gaulle airport. what are the latest in findings that french officials are confirming? >> yeah, they are just learning here of that news that potentially, perhaps something has been found. we have been watching french officials arrive at this hotel where relatives of some of those on board have been gathered, giving them, it's clear, information. and those conversations we're not party to. the whole purpose is to make sure they know about things first.
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i've got to tell you, having covered mh-370, mh-17, all of those different air accidents of different natures, for us to start to hear right now that they may have found something, that's pretty quick and suggests they may get answers pretty quickly. meanwhile, we are hearing from our own jim miklaszewski at the pentagon. the american defense officials, u.s. defense officials are saying that they did not from their satellite imagery pick up any sign that this may have been some kind of a terrorism related attack. they did not see an explosion in the air around the time the plane disappeared. and you remember that same u.s. monitoring did spot some kind of an explosion over egypt when that metrojet flight went down. they did spot an explosion when
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it went down over ukraine. perhaps another piece of the jigsaw while the people here who really are at the center of this want more than anyone else to know the answers to so many of these questions. wait here and try to understand as everybody is what happened to a flight that took off last night from charles de gaulle airport on a routine flight to cairo with seemingly nothing wrong and no signal from the plane before it disappeared that there was anything untoward aboard that aircraft. >> keir simmons, thanks. i want to check in with tom co costello in chicago who covers aviation. what are you hearing? >> can we talk about the search for the pingers. if you look at this graphic on your left, this moving map, let's talk through this for a moment if you haven't seen this already. this is naval assets moving towards the target zone.
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these could be various ships moving to that area in an attempt to find debris. we know we've got reports of some debris found but there are tremendous numbers of ships in the mediterranean. to have those assets in the area looking is going to be helpful. but they're going to also need to be dropping those devices to listen for the sonar pings. for the pings coming from the flight data recorder because those pings will hopefully tell the tale of where this particular piece of wreckage is, where the plane is resting on the bottom. i want to tell you about the pinger. we talk about it often but it's attached to the flight data recorder. it's this underwater beacon that's mountod a bracket, boltod t bolted to the front. and it's operates while immersed in water.
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30 days of battery life, 20,000 feet. you heard bill say we're talking about 4,000 to 5,000 feet of water depth there but we've seen in the past problems with -- there are layers if you will, temperature layers in the ocean or in the sea in this case. and those layers can make it difficult to hear a ping. if a pinger is going off on the bottom of the sea it can kind of bounce around, echo around. so you might hear it on a microphone that picks it up quite a distance away because it's echoing and bouncing off almost a wall. it's going to be listening for the pinger and hopefully finding it n triangulating it and figuring out where it is. that's not always easy because of the various temperature layers in the water. but they are in a lot better shape here in the mediterranean searching for that pinger than they were and are searching for mh-370 in the south indian
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ocean. >> tom costello, thanks very much. after the break, we're getting new information on this mystery. now 13 hours-plus in the making. 66 people aboard an egypta egyptair plane that took off from charles de gaulle airport 14 hours ago, actually more than that, and scheduled to land in cairo about four hours later. it did not land. there were attempts to have contact with that plane. unsuccessful at 8:50 p.m. eastern time in the united states. we're going to take a short break and be back with new information right here on msnbc. , absolutely. i did not think chantix would work as well as it did. along with support, chantix (varenicline) is proven to help people quit smoking. chantix reduced my urge to smoke. some people had changes in behavior, thinking or mood, hostility, agitation, depressed mood and suicidal thoughts or actions while taking or after stopping chantix. some had seizures while taking chantix.
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now that i work there, i value dothe food even more. i feed it to yoshi because there are no artificial colors, preservatives and it's made with real chicken. i'm so proud to make dog chow natural in davenport, iowa. is caringing because covering heals faster. for a bandage that moves with you and stays on all day, cover with a band-aid brand flexible fabric adhesive bandage. news in the mediterranean where a search operation is under way for egyptair flight ms-804 after it disappeared from air approximately 13 hours ago. according to egyptian officials, the search is focused near the greek island of karpathos. 66 people were on board the
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airbus a320. they're not ruling out the possibility of terrorism but at this point u.s. defense officials tell nbc they've seen no evidence to suggest the egyptian plane was the target of a terrorist attack. u.s. defense officials say that they continue to monitor this situation. i want to bring in msnbc's cal perry who has been covering this story all night. >> the island of karpathos is just to the east of -- sorry, crete, which is right here. the search area would be right in here which is where we thought it would be, right on that flight path from paris to cairo. this is where those trenches get really deep. the concern being that some of that debris has gone under the water under the surface. they'll have to get there and find it. hopefully this is the debris field. that's going to lead to more and more evidence and hopefully more and more answers. u.s. defense officials telling nbc news they're not seeing those flashes on the satellite
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um a imagery that would indicate an explosion on board. just because they haven't seen that so far doesn't mean we can rule out a terrorist attack but there is perhaps evidence there wasn't one. we'll have to wait and see what else comes out. >> you've been covering this all night. i want to tap into your experience in that area. you lived in lebanon. you've covered that region for many, many years. this is an area that is heaviyi patrolled by greek officials in no small part because of the crisis we've seen over a year ago that started after the problems in syria, in libya. folks have been getting out of there because of the blood that's been just, you know, everywhere in syria you have a civil war. talk to me about that area, and then give us a little geographic picture of it. >> we're looking at a refugee crisis of near biblical proportions. you look at the countries surrounding egypt, libya to the west deal with a refugee crisis. people fleeing the violence
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there. syria, iraq, countries where people are trying to get out and get to europe oftentimes through turkey, through greece. one of the other things worth mentioning here, the mediterranean is a very dirty body of water. it has a lot of debris in it already. and you have to think this is something the searchers are dealing with. >> cal perry, thank you. much more on this morning's disappearance of this egyptair flight over the mediterranean when we come right back on msnbc, live. it's time for the" your business" entrepreneurs of the week. oron and ronnie frank, founder of talk space, are reimagining mental health care. using technology they're connecting are the pifconnect ing therapists with patients. the idea is not without detractors, but the company is growing quickly. for more watch "your business" sunday mornings at 7:30 on msnbc. our cosmetics line was a hit.
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what are you doing? sara, i love you, and...
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[phone rings] ah, 's my brother. keep going... sara, will you marry... [phone rings again] what do you want, todd???? [crowd cheering] keep it going!!!! you sit on your phone, you butt-dial people. it's what you do. todd! if you want to save fifteen percent or more on car insurance, you switch to geico. it's what you do. i know we st met like, two months ago... yes! [crowd cheering] [crowd cheering over phone] i want to bring in aviation correspondent bob hager and former ntsb senior air safety investigator greg fij. you've heard technical failure terrorism, do you ever any other thoughts on what may have happened? >> i think that pretty much pins it down. if you have to speculate and of course it's speculation, you'd say that terrorism at this point fits the scenario the best.
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is it people in the plane taking over the cockpit? is it a bomb on the plane? and to answer those sort of questions, you've got to locate the wreckage field. it's interesting that the greeks say that they have sighted a couple of pieces of wreckage that may be wreckage from the plane already. but then you have a long, long job of trailing listening devices to try to hear the pings from the black boxes, locate the black boxes and then eventually, if it were a bomb, even the cockpit voice recorder and cockpit data recorder may not tell you that precisely. it may just show that all of the data stops at once. you have to find the wreckage to really pin it down. we're into a long haul here. >> and bob, just your thoughts on -- because according to this greek army general staff source,
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they found -- and excuse the reputation, but findings reported by the egyptianair force taking part in the investigation, it is a broad term to define what? >> are you talking about seeing pieces of wreckage? >> they are calling it there are findings reported by egyptianair. i don't know they said wreckage pieces yet. >> well, i thought i had heard that they found a couple of pieces of wreckage. findings, i don't know what else there would be physically to report on at this point that would tell you anything about it. >> it's -- it's so early in the investigation, bob, that i think we all have to -- as we get the information we'll digest it. i want to go over to greg now. these pilots had 9,000 hours of flying time between them. these are pretty experienced pilot and co-pilot? >> absolutely. and so when you look at the flight path, you look at the
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flight, it's hard to try to put together a scenario where this crew would have found themselves in such a position that between the two of them they couldn't handle any kind of typical or abnormal situation that pilots are trained to handle. whatever happened was very catastrophic and probably by surprise. and it either rendered the airplane incapacitated enough so that they lost control and were unable to regain control. >> and greg, talk to me about this airplane. it has an extraordinarily safe track record. >> it does. the a-320 has been around a long time. it's a popular airplane just as the boeing 737 is. it's a very versatile airplane depending on which model you have. in this particular instance, they are carrying people on a four-hour flight. it's a comfortable airplane and electronic airplane. it's very dependent on computers
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to not only guide the aircraft as far as the navigation is concerned but it runs all of the aircraft systems including all of the flight controls. and because of that, the computer sets limits. so even if a pilot were to mistakingly input some abrupt control movement or at least perceived control movement by moving the side stick controller, the computer will actually limit rates and that kind of stuff based on speed. so whatever happened to render this airplane into a high speed dive and in flight break-up, would have been beyond the capabilities of that of the crew to handle it and probably even the computer. so you know, you have to look at the nefarious act, that is the explosive device damaging the aircraft. >> greg and bob hager it is so good to see both of you, unfortunately under these very difficult circumstances, it's always a pleasure. blake mccoy is live at o'hare.
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any changes there specifically for example as terms of security? >> reporter: we've not seen any noticeable changes but you have to keep in mind that security with the tsa in the united states has been at an elevated level since the paris and brussels attack and the tsa tends to not have knee-jerk reactions until they know exactly what happened and that way they can take focused steps going forward. this is fred mckinney just got off a 20-hour travel flight from bangkok. you're a foreign service officer. when you land in chicago coming home and hear something like this happen, does it make you think twice about flying? >> not really. i think that it's been pretty amazing over the last five to seven years in terms of my travel, that i've seen how much the security overseas has improved. and so you know, traveling is part of living in this century.
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you have to do it and the security precautions they take are really pretty vigorous, almost all over the world. >> thank you for speaking with us after such a long flight. i appreciate it. >> no problem. safe travels. >> so again, no noticeable elevated security here at chicago's o'hare international terminal or anywhere across the country but we continue to monitor that for you. >> blake mccoy, thank you very much. we'll have much more on pt disappearance of egyptair flight 804 after a short break. es you are going to be 67. and on that day you will walk into a room where 15 people will be waiting... 12 behind the sofa, 2 behind the table and 1 and a half behind a curtain. family: surprise! but only one of them will make a life long dream come true. great things are ahead of you when your health is ready for them. at humana, we can help you with a personalized plan for your health for years to come. prge! a manufacturer. well that's why i dug this out for you.
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the possibility of a flare was almost always on my mind. thinking about what to avoid, where to go... and how to deal with my uc. to me, that was normal. until i talked to my doctor. she told me that humira helps people like me get uc under control and keep it under control when certain medications haven't worked well enough. humira can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. serious, sometimes fatal infections and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened; as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems,
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serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure. before treatment, get tested for tb. tell your doctor if you've been to areas where certain fungal infections are common, and if you've had tb, hepatitis b, are prone to infections, or have flu-like symptoms or sores. don't start humira if you have an infection. raise your expectations. ask your gastroenterologist about humira. with humira, control is possible. good morning, i'm tamron hall coming to you from headquarters in new york. we're continuing following breaking news. some debris has been found that may be from the egyptair jet liner that suddenly disappeared over the mediterranean while in route from paris to cairo. that debris spotted near the island of karpathos. the plane vanished from radar 13 hours ago from where we are now, 66 people were on board. the airbus a-320, no americans
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among them. in a news conference in cairo just over an hour ago, egypt's aviation minister said it's more likely the plane was brought down by a terror attack than a mechanical failure. meantime greece's defense minister said the plane fell 22,000 feet and swerved sharply before it disappeared from radar. the jetliner was about a half hour from landing in cairo when radar contact was lost. the weather reportedly good. the flight crew very experienced. families of those on board have been gathering at the airports in cairo and paris. we have all of this covered for you this morning. nbc correspondents standing by. let's go straight to london. nbc news foreign correspondent kelly cobiella with the latest. having such a strong statement from an official saying this is likely a terror act, certainly changes

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