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tv   MSNBC Live  MSNBC  May 19, 2016 12:00pm-1:01pm PDT

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deliberate act that brought this plane down or was it mechanical failure. a senior u.s. intelligence official telling msnbc there are strong indications an explosion brought down that flight. this is not confirmation, however, a strong indication and a working theory of what happened to this airbus a320. egypt's administration saying a terror attack is more likely than a mechanical failure. egyptian authorities believe some wreckage found in the mediterranean was from this plane. and this new video showing a u.s. navy aircraft taking off from sicily, italy, searching, a part of this recovery mission. we start in paris where that flight took off yesterday. keir, you're at charles de gaulle airport. what is the reaction that is happening now as we start to learn more on this working theory from u.s. officials that
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this was likely an explosion? >> reporter: it's kind of surreal. behind me, you can hear the flights still taking off. we expect an egyptair flight to take off at some point in the coming hours. the reaction of course what you would expect from relatives gathering at a hotel. we have seen french government officials going through regularly to update them. let's update you on one particular piece of developing needs. the associated press reporting saying -- quoting a senior greek air safety official saying that the debris found so far in the mediterranean does not belong, and this associated press report says, to an aircraft. so whether that means it simply is not aircraft debris at all or whether that means this official is saying it's not debris from the aircraft that took off from here is not completely clear.
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as you mentioned egyptian officials have been saying that they did believe that some kind of wreckage, debris was found in that mediterranean sea. and that just adding to the jigsaw picture that we have been gathering through the day that has included the news from a greek official because of course this plane went through greek air space for a substantial amount of time, that the plane dropped very heavily at one stage and turned even at one stage 360 degrees. we'll see what exactly that means. combining it, though, with the news from u.s. officials that they appear to have spotted something at the time of the disappearance of the plane that looks like an explosion. just a note of caution. an explosion can happen on a plane that is not related to terrorism. we are beginning to get more and more of a picture. >> already. keir, thanks very much. as keir points out, nbc news has
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not confirmed that ap report. egyptair on its website, they put out a statement earlier saying it denied any misleading information regarding the reasons of the disappearance of ms 804. the company confirms that the reason of this disappearance hasn't yet been confirmed. bill, what are you hearing from egyptian officials? right now this is considered a greek rescue operation. >> reporter: yes, good afternoon, thomas. obviously whenever a plane disappeared from radar without any distress call, the specter of terrorism is raised. all the more so when it is an egyptian plane and coming from paris. egypt and paris seem to be in a nexsus of terrorism we've seen. the greek transport minister did say that terrorism was perhaps a
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more likely explanation for this than mechanical failure. but as ever, the egyptians are being extremely cautious about any early interpretation of debris that's been found, of a path that the plane might have taken. as keir said, it veered, it twisted and then it developed like a stone. that could be as a result of several things, both mechanical and an explosion on board. so the egyptians of course, as ever, being cautious. president sisi met his security council earlier today. whatever this is, it will have a profound affect on the egyptian aviation industry, tourist industry, and on the economy. let's not forget isis in the sinai peninsula is a very active terror organization here. in the last month, it has released about ten videos specifically threatening and
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targeting egypt. obviously that is something that concerns people here. isis is attacking egyptian security officials on almost a weekly basis. let's not forget that the metrojet crash was brought down, we believe, by isis using a bomb in a soda can killing so many russian tourists. there is history of terrorism here and every reason to believe that this may not have been mechanical failure, but of course as i say, we are at the very, very early stages. let's stick to the facts, thomas? >> still working all the different theories that could have been a portion of what brought this plane down. and bill, let me get -- you're in front of the egyptian ministry of civil aviation. they said they received an official letter from the egyptian ministry of foreign affairs declaring the finding of wreckage. have they talked any further
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about what may have been in the mediterranean in terms of pieces potentially linked to this craft? >> reporter: no. they haven't pitched in and they wouldn't confirm the earlier greek reports that debris have been found. i mean, just remember, thomas, the mediterranean is full of junk, basically. so there's -- you know, there's a lot floating on the surface that could be misinterpreted as aircraft debris. the average depth of the mediterranean is around 5,000 feet. this airliner would have hit it at some speed. it is possible that some very light seats and plastic could have floated to the surface by now, but it is of course dark there now. so the search will resume properly at first light. they're not taking any interpretation here of what has been found off the greek islands in the mediterranean. >> reporting there for us in cairo. i want to go to our colleague for the latest on the search and
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recovery in the greek city on the island of crete. this has become the home base for the search and recovery mission, the wreckage that is considered suspicious potentially a part of a debris field will be brought there. what are you hearing about the items that have been said to be potentially wreckage? has there been any further description of what those items coming your way could be? >> reporter: well, the greek authorities were the first, this actually early this afternoon, someone talking about a few hours ago, that said the greek defense minister said first that those were the debris that were part of the missing plane. now the egyptian authorities took some time to confirm that and finally as you mentioned earlier, both the foreign ministry and egyptair seemed to confirm and agree with the greek defense minister that those are debris part of the missing
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plane. well, now, it is pitch dark as you can see behind me, it is late in the evening. that can only mean that the search and recovery operation, because this is not a search and rescue operation any longer, has now been called off for the day. as you said, crete is the island, is the southern most island, one of the southern most islands of greece. it is about 210 miles away from that location where the debris was found. and that means that this is, as you said, home base of the recovery effort. now at least a c-130 airplane has been deployed from here. is now back here on the island, that was scanning the area, and potentially spotted those debris out -- in the mediterranean sea. is now back on the island and it will return there again tomorrow morning. this is where -- from where the greek frigate left to reach that
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area and retrieve that debris that was spotted. tomorrow, at least the investigators will have a lead, where to go and find for the rest of the wreckage, if of course it is confirmed as egyptair, as the greeks, as the foreign ministry in egypt agree those were pieces of the plane. even that is still being put into question. even though they know where to go back to, thomas, it's like finding a needle in a haystack. you need to consider that between now and tomorrow when daylight will come back, there's about 12 hours where pieces of debris can be taken away from the currents in the mediterranean, where heavier pieces of the wreckage can just sink lower and deeper into the sea. you see, this is -- the greek authorities will need all the help they can find. and they are finding it from the u.s., which is already deployed an aircraft from its military -- from the u.s. navy base in
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sicily. there are three u.s. ships around here in the mediterranean that may be called for help bit greek authorities. the french already saying they're sending also a plane. tomorrow is the day when hopefully we will get more answers, thomas. >> reporting there on the island of crete. this will be the home base for the ongoing search and recovery operation right now. i want to turn to greg feith, msnbc safety analyst, former ntsb investigator. greg, when we're working with the strong indication, this is from u.s. intelligence, that this was probably an explosion, explain the theories and break down what categories we would be working in from the unlikely hood of a mid-air stall all the way over to a potential explosion. >> if we take the stall equation and look at it from a pure
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aircraft performance, that means that the airplane would have had to slow down, the aircraft would have not been able to produce, the wings would not have been able to produce the lift necessary, similar to what we saw with air france 447. the pilots would have mishandled the stall to recover the airspeed to keep the airplane flying, and the aircraft would have gone into a relatively steep descent. it would have been recoverable by the crew if they were able to recognize the conditions and then input the appropriate flight controls. but that is probably the least likely scenario in all of this, especially now with this new intelligence information that possibly is coming out of the u.s. that they did see an explosion. when you look at the explosion, you can have a mechanically-induced or mechanical-based explosion similar to what we say with twa 800 where the center fuel tank exploded and caused enough
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structural damage to destroy the aircraft and have it come down. we would also of course see something similar to metrojet where there is a explosive device on the aircraft which when detonated, it rendered the airplane incapacitated to the point that the crew either lost control of the airplane or was unable to maintain control of the airplane because of the damage. on top of that, at 500 plus miles an hour at 37,000 feet, aerodynamics will destroy the aircraft. it will self-destruct at that speed and that altitude and spread debris over a large area. >> the suggested theory of an explosion, the therm is
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phanomanology is used. there was an indicator that would point toward an explosion. >> i think there is a lot more information that the egyptians, the greeks and certain folks in the intelligence community, even in the united states, know that we don't know. for us, when we look at what was posted on the internet when it came to the supposed radar data for this airplane, it's flying along at 37,000 feet and then you have one last radar hit and then the airplane, quote, vanishes. when the defense minister for greece talked about the aircraft descending, going through a series of turns or spirals all the way down to 15,000 feet, they have better fidelity in whatever radar they were looking at, and most likely that was radar from a defense position, one of the military radars or a mosaic from multiple radar sites that gave them a better picture. of course, the u.s. is using
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satellites to look for that explosion signature. and i'm sure there are other methods that they are using as well. so we don't -- i don't believe we have the complete picture. but it's interesting that the -- that the statements have come out that there's a higher likelihood of terrorism than a mechanical failure. that leads me as an investigator to believe that they know more than we actually know at this point. >> and also there has not been indication or reports of a distress call. the last radio contact from the pilots was through greek air space correct? >> correct. and again, if we go back to our earlier discussion and that is if this was a stall event where the crew is trying to get the airplane or keep the airplane flying, there would have been time for somebody to get a may day call off, tell them what was going on. in this instance, where we have normal conversation and normal flight profile and cruise attitude and altitude, and then
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all of a sudden, it all just disappears. that says that something catastrophic happened to the airplane, the crew was either surprised or unaware of what happened up until the final moments. by the time they did recognize something catastrophic happened, it was so fast they couldn't get a distress call off and the airplane was basically probably coming apart in flight. >> greg, thanks so much. i want to bring in msnbc foreign correspondent, paris based world news editor for the daily beast, as well as msnbc senior editor of digital media and video content cal perry. when we understand the world as it is right now, there have not been any claims of responsibility in -- in involvement with what took down this aircraft. what does your gut say to you how the suggestion of an
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explosion might be at play? >> look, it's obviously very speculative as we speak right now. the fact that -- or the idea that an explosion took place, it could be a technical issue and it could be a bomb. we know that when isis claimed responsibility for the downing of the russian metrojet, they later released an image of the alleged bomb that they used to down that airliner. so if indeed isis was behind it or al qaeda or whatever, the likelihood is they would have used an explosive device and not actually mess with the technical elements of the airliner. >> how does this fit into the profile if we are talking about potential terrorism? what's being ruled in and ruled out for the way to lead down the investigative path? >> well, in terms of the evidence that they're going to be looking at, right now you have egyptian intelligence as well as all of their allies, including european andist
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intelligence, they're going to be looking for chatter that may be taking place among militant groups that they are closely tracking. they're going to be taking the flight manifest, running their names through databases. looking at people who may have had access to this plane not only in charles de gaulle where it was very several hours, but in some of the stops that it had before that, including tunisia where security may be a little bit more lax than charles de gaulle. so officials are going to have their happennds full in trying determine various theories behind that explosion. in addition, cautioning this is still not yet known to be the result of a specific type of explosion such as a bomb, they're going to wait for that confirmation, they're going to start looking for the possible angles that may lead them to that conclusion as the search and recovery process takes place. this search and recovery process
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is being led by the egyptian military. so it is being dealt with as a national security issue. not just because they are at the helm of the investigation. as all the pieces come back into egypt, the security services are going to play a very important role in trying to determine what the cause of that explosion was. based on that, then the information will begin to come out. and depending on the egyptian government and the narrative it puts forward about what this cause might have been. >> stand by for us. cal, they brought up the idea of chatter and using that as a type of way to connect the dots for this investigation. have you been able to dig up anything that would lend itself to that narrative? >> if you take that and marry it with what lathe is saying, if we do get to the point where intelligence agencies start confirming that, i think it's quite likely that the islamic state will then want to prove it. that's what they've done in the past through the magazine dabiq.
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i can pull that up and show you the -- let me show you this real quick, thomas. you heard that the search is on hold. there's a lot we can tell from what's going on online. this is a live look at what's happening in the mediterranean. this is a british warship that's settled in this one spot. we think this is where the search is taking place, this area right here just to the south of crete. the key to this search is going to be what do they pull out of the water and what does it tell them about this explosion that we know from u.s. defense officials took place. it was an explosive device or caused or triggered by a mechanical failure. that in the next 24 hours is going to be the key. >> christopher, while we wait for more reportable facts to figure out exactly what happened for those 66 passengers on board, the french parliament officially extended the country's state of emergency for
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another two months. obviously this is a big concern for french and european allies trying to work against this fight against terrorism. france seems to be on the forefront on this. are they taking the right steps or is this a show that there are more porous problems? >> they're doing everything they can do. they have several events coming up this summer, several events that are worrisome to them. including the soccer cup, the tour de france. all of that is going to be happening. perfect kind of target for terrorists. so they are -- they are turning up the screws in terms of security and also in terms of surveillance and intelligence gathering. that said, i think that it's interesting that flights -- as keir pointed out, flights are continuing as normal out of charles de gaulle. my impression is that the french investigators believe that this
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is not targeting france. this was an attack -- it was a terrorist attack, it was targeting the egyptian airplane and may have involved egyptian personnel on that airplane who would have had some access and ability to move in and out of the plane possibly with explosive devices. >> but for the security of france and its allies within the european region, is this another black mark -- >> oh, look, i mean, we are all going to be living a nightmare as a result of this. not only in france, not only in europe, here in the united states. any time there is a terrorist attack that even comes close to sick seedi succeeding, let alone one that brings down a plane, we all find ourselves more and more constrained when we travel. those were failed terrorist attacks and they've changed our lives. already, we are seeing with tsa here in the united states long, long lines.
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it's going to be that way in europe, too. in france, they may do a few things they aren't doing yet. for instance, they don't have those full body scanners in the airport that we have in many of our airports here in the united states. maybe those will come in there. but you can't stop everything. particularly with an airport like charles de gaulle with 86,000 employees, it's very hard to secure it. >> christopher, thank you so much. much more when we come back and looking exactly for the clues for determines if this was a mechanical error or an act of terror. msnbc live back in a moment.
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so we have new details on the crash of egypt flight 804. just reporting that fwregreek officials are disputing that debris from the aircraft was discovered in the mediterranean. here domestically, we have l.a.x. heightening security in light of what happened with this egyptair plane saying that passenger safety was of vital importance. we can imagine the ripple effect this is going to have for aviation and travel. joining me now, robert hager. bob, let's talk about what's being said, what's not being said. there are different people from different organizations, different groups, especially egyptair itself confirming part of the plane's wreckage was found in the waters. but what are the key things investigators should be looking for, the signatures that are going to help them unravel the mystery? >> i think it's physical evidence. you want to find the wreckage field and get the black boxes and more important even, get
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pieces of wreckage up. that's not an easy task. this could be weeks, could be months to do this. so far, speculation, just gut signs would indicate we're looking at an act of terrorism and probably a bomb of some sort. but as i say, gut reactions don't work in an investigation. you need hard evidence. it's unsettling that they're arguing back and forth about whether these first few pieces of wreckage may have really been from this crash or not or even from an airplane or not. it's a little unsettling, this intelligence information says strong indication of an explosion. because the pentagon says it's not their normal look-down system that scans the globe for signs of a missile being launched, but intelligence forces saying this is something else, that gives a strong indication, a suggestion of an explosion. so there are a lot of questions
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and as i say, it's going to really take a long time to sort out. >> investigators are looking for not just what they're ruling in, but what they can cross out, what they can rule out of this. as we say from the u.s. intelligence officials saying a strong indication of an explosion, and if this was not terror-related, the facts about any type of mechanical failure or mechanical type of problem that led to an explosion, the facts that we know about this airbus a320, it was a newer aircraft and recently serviced. going off of those facts, how do they cross out the possibility of mechanical difficulties? >> well, you go over the recent mechanical records with a fine tooth comb. so far the preliminary report on that is that it's all very ordinary. we know the 320 has a wonderful safety record and so forth. i think the real indication of whether there was some other
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thing other than a terrorist explosion would be to get the black boxes. the black boxes would give you the conversation in the cockpit. if it was an invasion of a cockpit or a pilot that intentionally pushed the stick forward and took the plane in, if that were the case, then there would be evidence of that on the cockpit voice recorder. otherwise, the voice recorders may not tell you much. if it was an explosion, they frequently in that case end with the absolute end of any kind of data. so you've got to go further in, find the wreckage, bring up pieces of the wreckage and do a physical examination of that. it's a big job. >> this is under greek operation in terms of the search and recovery operation. u.s. resources are being given to this. but is there an issue with who takes point over trying to figure out exactly what happened here? >> well, i would think since
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it's in egyptian -- rather -- yes, egyptian territorial waters there that they have the strongest hold on who's the lead. there are a lot of competent agencies in western europe that can help and they're closer to it than the ntsb is in washington. they have a stake in the pie because the engines were american made. i tend to think this will be more of a european operation. >> bob, great to have you with us. >> thanks very much. >> we're going to give everybody now what we understand from the white house as president obama has been updated. nbc's ron allen joins us now from the white house. what has been the reaction, what have they been saying. >> reporter: just to echo what bob was saying, the white house is emphasizing that the lead investigation of this incident is going to be handled bit greeks, by the french, by the egyptians of course because it's
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their plane. and that the united states has offered assistance. it's unclear what assistance will be accepted yet. clearly they're very concerned here about the possibility of terrorism. but they're also trying to keep this in perspective and the response has been very measured. there wasn't a comment from the white house several hours until after this had happened. the president we understand is being briefed by his counterterrorism and homeland security teams. we do not think he's reached out directly to the presidents of egypt or france as of yet. the white house wants to keep this possibility of terrorism again in perspective. the last thing they want to do is give isis or militants credit for something that they didn't do. part of the mantra has been to keep this threat of terrorism and the capabilities of terrorists in perspective. of course it's a huge national security concern. here's some of what josh ernest
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had to say about the u.s. role in the investigation. >> this obviously took place near greek waters. so there are reasons why there are other countries who were immediately responsible for dealing with the situation. given the strong relationships between the united states and france and the united states and egypt, i'm confident that we'll be able to provide them the needed support. >> reporter: and part of those relationships with egypt and france and others is airport security. the tsa homeland security has been involved in enhancing security at airports in europe and elsewhere where there was a direct flight from that airport to the united states. that was not the case here in that this aircraft was not coming to the united states. it was going from france to egypt. that's ongoing. a lot of concern about intelligence sharing, security, and of course the obama administration trying to keep close tabs on what's happening because of the possibility that this was a terrorist incident. >> ron, thank you very much. after we come back, as ron
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was telling us there, the greek officials, european officials will take the lead on this investigation. but the u.s. intelligence community is part of this. they have said to nbc news there was a strong indication there was an explosion. we're going to talk to our pete williams after this break. bounty is two times more absorbent. so one roll of... ...bounty can last longer than those bargain brands. so you get more "life" per roll. bounty. the long-lasting quicker picker upper. and now, find dory in the paper towel aisle! get disney pixar's finding dory prints before they're gone. whenouaren't moving in the right direction, it can be a burden. but what if you could wake up to lower blood sugar? imagine loving your numbers.
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i want to express my condolences to egypt and to all other countries impacted by the disappearance earlier this morning of the egyptair flight over the mediterranean. the united states is providing assistance in the search effort, and relevant authorities are doing everything they can to try to find out what the facts are of what happened today. >> there we have secretary of state john kerry saying the united states is providing assistance in the search effort in the mediterranean. investigators trying to figure out what happened to that egyptair flight going from paris
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to cairo. here is exactly what we know right now. u.s. intelligence officials say satellite data is providing strong indications that there was an explosion of some kind. that doesn't necessarily mean it was intentional although egypt says a terror attack is more likely than a mechanical failure. here at home, los angeles international airport is heightening its security saying passengers' safety was of vital important. pete, what more are you hearing about this investation, especially with senior u.s. intelligence officials saying it really is a strong indicator because of their radar data about an explosion happening? >> i don't know that this is based on radar data, thomas. what we're told here is that a number of different kinds of data points, something that's described by those who deal with this as phenomanology.
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they believe that that adds up to the possibility of an explosion. at the same time, i think we should emphasize here, they are not saying that means there was an explosion. at the same time, the u.s. military sources tell us that their satellites that look for bright flashes that would indicate -- the reason they have these satellites is they look for bright flashes that would indicate the fires of ballistic missiles, that they did not pick up anything that would suggest an explosion. now, even if there was an explosion, that doesn't tell you anything about what caused it, whether some problem that arose from the plane itself or explosives on board the plane or something else. i think that's the best way to explain it, to be as transparent
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as possible. in are conflicts data, but nonetheless, that's typical at the early stage of something like this. you look at different things and add it up. but that's an indication that there may have been an explosion. >> and the term you used, it's pulled together through infrared and multi-specteral images. we have been told it's like a persistent stare on the region. collecting information through sound waves and pressure, that's what the collective response is that paints the picture for the potential of an explosion in this region. the bigger picture now is whether or not this was mechanical or whether or not this was something more nefario nefarious. what is the u.s. position and their involvement? i know we've seen resources. do you know anything about interactive communication between at home and abroad --
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>> wherever there's something like this, the tsa people talk to their counterparts, the white house people talk to theirs, the fbi to theirs, the intel to theirs. all through the various levels of government, there's lots of communication. one of the things the u.s. would do in a case like this is run the names on the passenger list past the database of terrorists and we're told that that didn't come up with anything, no known terrorists that were among the passengers. of course that was -- you'd hope that those people would be screened before they got on the plane in the first place. but that came up negative. you're right. that sort of thing goes on any time there's an event like this. >> pete, thanks so much. coming up next, we're going to talk more about this and go out on the campaign trail where we have presidential candidates getting on the record about the egyptair air crash. what hillary clinton is saying about the quote, threats that we face. that's next. ♪ staying in rhythm...
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let's get you caught up to the speed on the latest about the egyptair flight 804 and it going missing over the waters of the mediterranean after leaving paris en route to cairo. greek officials are disputing egyptair's report that debris from this aircraft was discovered in the mediterranean. nbc news has not confirmed that report. here at home, there has been a ripple effect to this with l.a.x. heightening its security in light of the crash saying that passenger safety was of vital importance. obviously the news and the ongoing investigation of this search and recovery mission in the mediterranean has also made its way onto the campaign trail with those seeking the white house giving their reaction today. and hillary clinton's first response to the egyptair crash came earlier. she talked about it in an interview on cnn. take look.
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>> chris, it does appear that it was an act of terrorism, exactly how of course the investigation will have to determine. but it -- once again shines a bright light on the threats that we face from organized terror groups. isis of course, but then there are other networks of terrorists that have to be hunted down and defeated. and i think it reinforces the need for american leadership, for the kind of smart, steady leadership that only america can provide in working with our allies, our partners, friends in europe, the middle east and elsewhere. >> so hillary clinton getting on the record there. we want to talk to brian fallon. the national press secretary for the clinton campaign. good to have you with me. hillary clinton was second to get on the record today. donald trump tweeted out this morning, looks like another terrorist attack, when will we get tough, smart, and vigilant. we had secretary clinton many that interview saying it does
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appear to be terrorism. we're waiting to get an official confirmation about that. what is the hillary clinton answer for u.s. leadership? what does that mean if she were to be elected president to thwart a terrorist attack like this? >> the threat we face it continues to evolve. if you think about what we know and the possibility of terrorism that has been discussed, we know this flight emanated from paris. right now, we have to be mattered up and linked up between the united states and our european allies. you have foreign fighters going over to the middle east, being radicalized, returning home. many of those citizens can travel freely to the united states so we need to be sharing information and lipg edlinked u our european allies. you have donald trump going around suggesting we withdraw from nato, insulting david
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cameron at the same time he's praising the dictating leader of north korea. i think this incident is shining a spotlight on how dangerous the prospect of donald trump as president would really be. >> there is quite a difference between policy agendas between a president hillary clinton and a president donald trump. hillary clinton remains in a real slug fest with bernie sanders. we know that bernie sanders isn't afraid of damaging hillary clinton. that was in a piece from the "new york times" saying mr. sanders says he doesn't want mr. trump to win in november, his advisors say he's willing to do harm to mrs. clinton and arrive at the philadelphia convention with maximum political power. so sanders and his supporters, they really want a floor fight against hillary clinton and the establishment. doesn't that weaken hillary clinton and her electability if she does go up against a donald trump in the general? >> that report that quoted
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certain top advisers to the sanders campaign was concerning. that's a different tenor than we've heard from the sanders campaign of late. just yesterday, we were expressing our openness in terms of how the convention process is taking place in terms of making sure that the representation on the platform committee is open and diverse and includes sanders supporters. to wake up to that report this morning is very concerningme ic. i think what you're seeing is some concern that senator sanders' campaign has lost track of why they got in this race in the first place if they're now suggesting their top goal is to do damage to hillary clinton's campaign. if you step back and maintain perspective, the reality is we still need to, as a party, come together on june 15th, after the voting is done. that's what hillary clinton did in 2008. it wasn't easy. we suspect it won't be easy for
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senator sanders either. but that's something that needs to happen. both sides bear responsibility. >> you point out, she won nine of the last 12 contests leading up to that point. she understands where the excitement and some of the frustration comes from senator bernie sanders and his supporters. but does that put you at risk for trying to unite the party in the long run if senator sanders really does want to take this to a floor fight and there are sanders supporters who feel disenfranchised by a system they think is rigged? >> like i said yesterday, we want this convention process to be open. we realize that senator sanders has brought many people into the process that might not otherwise have entered into the democratic primary contests. so we want to include them. that said, i do think there will come a time where the party will have to unite and both sides will have to do their part.
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hillary clinton has been extending an open hand to sanders supporters. i think senator sanders at the appropriate time will also need to make that same ask of his200y heated primary. >> the latest national polling, fox news, hillary clinton losing to donald trump in that very same poll it has bernie sanders beating donald trump. without the outside three-point margin of error in all of this. right now donald trump. s his steady attacks against secretary clinton, one of the stronger ones personal attack about the fact she enabled her husband through some of his sexual misconduct. is hillary clinton not willing to engage donald trump on that level to combat that personal attack, and if not, why? we were not surprised that donald trump is immediately going to the nastiest style of personal attacks. that is what he did during the republican primary. it's what is he's advertised he's going to do against hillary clinton. >> but he won. >> there's a critical
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distinction between the general election and primary, republicans were paralyzed to take on donald trump because on most issues, they fundamentally agreed with him. now, donald trump may have said things more provocatively, or in higher volume, but they fundamentally shared agreement on many of the top issues. that is not the case in the general election. we're not going to shy away from calling him out on the position of the minimum wage, he wants to give huge tax breaks to the wly or opposes pay equity for women. he's going to respond with personal attacks because he doesn't want to engage on the issues. marco rubio tried it and it didn't work and we fundamentally believe the public at large rejects that approach. >> brian, great to have you with me. pressure it. for everybody we're learning no passengers on board that air flight were on the terror watch list. the latest in the ongoing investigation. that and more after this. what's it like to be in good hands?
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there is only one place where real and amazing live. seaworld. real. amazing more on egyptair flight 804. and trying to figure out exactly what happened to this flight that left paris and was on its way to cairo. joining me tom sander son, co-director and senior fellow with transnational threats project that analyzes threats and networks around the world. as we talk about the working theories that go into trying to figure out what happened to this plane, have you heard of any chatter before or after the crash that would suggest terrorism? >> well, nothing other than what we've heard already in the public media. my concern and my idea here is that perhaps given the location of the departure of the flight and given the large presence of isis in france, you simply could
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have had penetration of ground crew, baggage handlers, anyone involved at airport who could have put a bomb on this plane. if the passengers all turn out to be cleared and pilots and employees of egyptair are cleared, you have to look closely at who's working at the airport given the high and large number of isis operatives and operatives from other groups, al qaeda and in paris and neighborhoods. >> is that the logical place where the investigation is happening? they are not searching in waters because it's dark over the mediterranean. >> no doubt about it, on the ground, in paris now, the police and intelligence services are looking at all of the folks who have worked at or currently work at the airport. and they are focusing on them very closely. >> here, looking at actual video from yesterday of the waters, as they're attempting that search. as i pointed out, it's dark over the mediterranean, so they can't continue that search right now. that's going to do it for this
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hour of msnbc live. stay tuned, chris hayes picks up the coverage after this. this is joanne.
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i'm chris hayes, taking over at msnbc world headquarters in new york. we are, of course, following breaking news, multinational search for the egyptair flight that disappeared over the mediterranean on its way from paris to cairo. just before the sun went down over there about three hours ago, the airlines said wreckage was found but the associated press says a greek official is disputing that claim. on top of that, u.s. intelligence says there are, quote, strong indication there's was an explosion of the 76 passengers and crew on board, state department says there are no indications any of them were u.s. citizens. but u.s. navy says, one of its surveillance aircraft is helping out at the request of the greek government. families are waiting for news on an exact cause. we can't conclude with certainty this was annt

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