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tv   All In With Chris Hayes  MSNBC  May 24, 2016 8:00pm-9:01pm PDT

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what obama's folks did to mitt romney. >> and that will be our last word tonight, susan del percio and maria tereray teresa kumar, you. we're seconds away from the polls closing. kris matthews continues live coverage right now. >> good evening, i'm chris matthews in new york and donald trump is inching closer to clinching the republican nomination. right now voting has ended in the state of washington where trump is expected to add another victory and more delegates getting him closer to that magic number of 1237. as soon as we have a decision we'll have that for you.
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the death of the former clinton white house deputy council vince foster very serious. called the circumstances surrounding the death very fishy. a federal investigation concluded his death was a suicide. but in the past weeks trump is going after bill clinton as the worst abuser of women in the history of politics and hillary clinton as a nasty enabler. at trump's rally in albuquerque, new mexico, it was mar bid protesters and trump ratcheted up his attacks on clinton. >> hillary cannot even put away bernie, she can't put it away. she can't put him away and it will be a mess. hillary clinton will be so bad
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for our economy, so bad for jobs she will be so bad for the second amendment. we are going to save our second amendment, she wants to abolish your second amendment, believe me. she wants to take your guns away. and she wants s ts to abolish second amendment. she's got a thing called an fbi investigation. one of the things we have going and we have to do it, supreme court justices. if you get hillary clinton in there and appoint the kind of people that she appoints [ boos ] honestly? your country will never recover. >> nbc's hallie jackson is covering the trump campaign. she joins us from albuquerque. hallie, the one thing about trump, like him a lot -- and a lot of people don't like him -- he has this up-to-the-minute, up-to-the-second knowledge of what's being said on the airwaves, cable. the guy responded not just in the news cycle, almost instantly
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to what looked to be an opening the clintons were jumping into which is he had said it's a smart move to make money when the housing market pops and the balloon pops and instead he comes out and says "who wouldn't by house when it's cheap." he was right on top of this thin thing. >> we're going to get to this, chris. this is where the trump rally was, but i want to show you this here. there were protests happening outside. this is common to see at trump events, as people were trying to come out, cops continued to sort of barricade this area, security blocked it off and you can see the glass door was broken by these protesters, apparently, we believe, cops began barricading that window in order to keep anything from coming in or out. crew s outside said rocks were being thrown that it got pushed back from the line so another very active trump rally.
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when you talk about the nudes, you're right, he went after the clinton comments immediately. he said "hey, i'm a businessman, what else would i do?" he said he felt badly for the people impacted by the crash but that he was just doing his job. he talked about clinton, he said he hates to say it but she screams. he hit her on her tone yet again and there was another interesting and notable attack on governor susanna martinez. obviously the governor head of the republican governors' association. trump citing negative statistics about the economy, said maybe i should run for governor of new mexico and implored martinez to do a better job. when you talk about party unity, chris, that is significant. part nez holds that position as head of the rga and here comes trump -- we're going to head over here to see what's going on. here comes trump talking abouter in a way that is not conducive necessarily to unity. of course martinez has come out sharply against some of trump's proposed policies as well.
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finally, the other news we're following the continued protests at the trump rally. there's a police officer filling in members of the media as to what's going on so we'll find out and report back. >> what are the protesters? give me a sense of who they are and what's their protest? >> so what we've seen in the past at these rump rallies are dreamers, members of the latino community, what i can tell you tonight is we saw folks being escorted out from the rally with signs that said "undocumented and unafraid." the interruptions happen frequently at this trump events what made tonight notable is the heightened security we've seen. but that's? that's occurred at these rallies in the past. >> they're waving the mexican flag. does anybody understood what the message is supposed to be when somebody does that at a rally here in this country? it seems to me that it will simply agitate against the people who have come here from mexico illegally and that this is helpful to trump's argument.
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what do you -- i guess that's a comment by myself but it's one that i wonder about. >> people coming here to support donald trump are supporters of him so they are not going to be necessarily swayed by some of these protests you're seeing as trump himself has said from the podium he says, you know, hey either get them out or let them stay, if you can't hear him, don't worry about it. so he's used to dealing with these interruptions. >> we now have enough votes in that we can call the state of washington and the republican primary out there for donald trump. the projected winner for the state of washington and with that the victory he has is moving closer to securing the delegates he needs to clinch the 1237 delegates needed for a majority at the republican convention. now to the democrats, they fore cus is on the june 7 contest and
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the big prize, of course, california. hillary clinton head a rally tonight in riverside, california. nbc's kristen welker, there she is. kristen, were there any protesters against hillary tonight? >> there were, actually, some protesters at that hillary event, chris, you're right. doesn't seem as though it got as heated as what hallie was just described but not that un usual in this campaign. i think there were emotions on both sides. one of the headlines from the hillary clinton event tonight is that she went after donald trump for comments he made during the housing crisis, essentially saying he wanted to benefit from it. as we've been playing all night he said so what? what's wrong with benefitting from the housing crisis? but we're getting our first glimpse at the unfolds strategy from the clinton campaign to hit it -- one of the core parts of donald trump's message. is. he is a candidate for working
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class voters, he's going to make sure they realize the progress we have seen in the economy in recent years and the clinton campaign essentially trying to tear that argument down and they're taking a page from president obama's playbook in 2012 when he tried to paint mitt romney as gordon gecko. that was effective back in 2012. the question is, will this strategy be effective against donald trump. big question mark around that and of course secretary clinton not engaging in any of those personal attacks donald trump has been waging in recent days against her husband. the fact she's fighting on two fronts, this''s still locked in this primary battle with bernie sanders, the math is on her side but she wants to win a state like california which has the biggest delegate prize because if she wins california she would
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hid into the convention on strong footing. if she loses the state, however, that would give senator sanders leverage and he wants to have a big impact over the party's platform. chris? >> and we might have an announcement as to hillary using her super delegates -- her pledged delegates. by 8:00 pacific time she will be the winner of the whole fight and and bernie will make a last hurrah if he wins california. kristen welker covering the clinton campaign in riverside, california. bernie sanders, the senator, is still fighting hard hoping to beat clinton in california. he held a rally in san bernardino where kelly is with us tonight. thanks for joining us in the great inland empire. >> well, chris, bernie sanders is on stage here now and he is taking an approach you might
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think he was ahead because he began tonight in san bernardino talking to more than 5,200 people saying donald trump will not become president. sanders looking towards november. then as he works through his subject by subject plan for the country. and criticism of hillary clinton. there were several times where this crowd had a loud and sustained boo when he brings up secretary clinton. sanders is talking about how he is working hard here. his third hour plus long event tonight. he wants to be as visible as possible and as you've been discussing for sanders winning california if he can fall off is essential to his larger argument. we heard him tonight talking about sending a message to the leadership of the democratic party. you know there's been a lot of tension between the sanders campaign and the chair of the national party debbie wasserman
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schultz, the sanders team says she has not been handed -- even handed in things like debates. debbie wasserman schultz says she has been neutral but the tension is real and continues. so my sense of it from covering sanders events, he has kept a respectful tone, in in his crude have a lot of passion here and not a lot of support for hillary clinton. chris? >> thanks so much, kelly, covering the campaign in san bernardino, california. jacob rascon has more on the protesters on the trump rally. >> officers are moving the line away from the event. now earlier, just moments tag protesters were up against the glass banging and trying to break it. then the officers came in and they started to move the line forward and then we got smoke canisters and then you had rocks
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being thrown at protesters. here are the protesters now, there are hundreds and hundreds of them. you're seeing protesters who don't want to move back and we've seen instants of the officers who pushed the protesters that didn't want to move. and then you had rocks being thrown as i said and you had some of the smoke canisters that were going. it wasn't tear gas but you had smoke canisters going. moist are angry about trump and immigration, those are the chants an signs we see. that is their core issue and they vowed before it started that they wouldn't leave until they shut it down and so far they're still here. >> what are the hands throughout with two fingers from both sides. what is that message from the demonstrators? >> so what you're looking at are hands up with a peace sign and
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you saw this a little bit earlier when it got physical where you had the officers shoveling people down because they were refusing to move. and those who are not shy about saying they support bernie sanders. that they're out here protesting trump because they're upset about his immigration stance. sorry about that. >> it shows you're there, right there in the line of action. as always, steve kornacki is at our big board here. a relatively safe place to be covering tonight surprise us. >> a little bit of news on the democratic side. i want to stress what's going on in washington in the democratic side. this is a non-binding primary,
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hillary clinton and bernie sanders, they had caucuses that count for the delegates in march in washington and this is what happened. bernie sanders crushed hillary clinton. this was his biggest big state wi win. but what is bernie sanders always talking about in his campaign? you've heard it a thousand times. he said when turnout is higher we do better, we win. this is the second time this primary season we've gotten a experiment because today in washington they had a much -- and i stress much -- higher non-binding primary. they got all starts of primaries for state, for local office going on in washington state. there's a check mark there. presidential race, do you want sanders. do you want clinton? we got 30% of the vote in right now so no official declaration or anything but about 250,000 votes have been cast. you see how many were cast in the caucuses. with 250,000 votes cast in the primary tonight, hillary clinton has 51% of the vote and bernie sanders has 49%.
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and as bernie sanders says "when more people turn out, i do better." here we go, in the caucus he cleaned up. people have to check off a name on this ballot and more are checking off hillary clinton's name. >> so you don't have a winner? >> we won't make a projection. we'll let the votes come in, 30% of the votes come in on the democratic side. 250,000 votes. hillary clinton leads 51% 49%. >> just for people curious about this. we called these things beauty contests. >> the delegates are given out in the caucus. >> why do they do it like this? >> the party decides they want to hold the caucus. that's how they want to give out
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their delegates. they think activists deserve more of a voice but the state holds the primary. the state is paying for this thing today and the sate says you have to put the names on the ballot. >> if hillary clinton wins the beauty contest and bernie sanders wins the delegates, is that democratic? >> well, it gets that argument because one of the things the sanders campaign is talking about at the convention pushing for is reform in the democratic nominating process. you hear them floating this idea of doing away with super delegates. >> how about doing away with caucuses? >> that's it. when you raise that question -- >> i always raise it. it drives them crazy. >> this is why, chris. bernie sanders, this is his best big state win. not only did he win washington but because it's a caucus state he was able to win it by 46 points. that meant a massive delegate hall for him. if it had been a primary, he's probably not cleaning up like he cleaned up. >> i get the feeling that like somebody said, you don't have to agree with me but the argument some people say about the
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sanders people is they believe the only -- the sanders people believe the only true democrats are sanders people that everybody else is not a progressive and everybody else that doesn't show up are not really sanders people. that sanders is a democrat -- clooes for a while -- it gets complicated this argument. but anyway, i think we're better off with one person, one vote, a real pure democratic process for the democratic party would be great. no more super delegates, everybody gets a vote. that would be my vote. thanks, steve kornacki. when we come back, our panel will join us as we join the protest outside the trump rally in new mexico. this is a special edition of "hardball" the place for politics.
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protests continue in albuquerque, new mexico, where donald trump held a rally
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tonight. trump is the winner in the primary in the state of washington. let's bring in the chairman of the washington state republican party susan hutchison. susan, thank you for tonight. i guess the question is a wide open question. i keep looking at polls showing the republican party is uniting, men and women both overwhelmingly, really, around your nominee for president. >> well, i think it's happening slowly but the rand-and-file voters are getting to -- getting used to the candidate and the grass-roots the following suit. it will take a while for the establishment and the d.c. folks to jump on board but over time they're getting used to the idea and that donald trump is going to win in november and he's certainly going to give it a good shot in washington state. >> do you think women will be as enthusiastic as men among republicans. >> that's up to the candidate. the candidate has a chance in the next five plus months to win
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over all kinds of folks and i'm convinced donald trump is smart enough to figure out how to do that. most of all we say in our state that our candidate is better than the democratic candidate so we expect as time goes on people will see that. washington state has been blue for a very long time and we haven't had a republican conditioned date for president campaign here. and we have a chance to change the electoral map. we have more electoral votes in washington state than any state west of the mississippi except for the countries of texas and california. so we matter out here and so i'm delighted that donald trump decided he wants to help flip this state. >> you're a good arguer. good argument. susan hutchison, chairman of the republican party of washington state. our special coverage continues after this.
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protests continue outside the trump rally in albuquerque. i don't know if it's gotten violent. i don't think so. it's restive. let's bring in the panel, joy reid is the host of "am joy" on weekends, michelle bernard is president of bernard center for politics and public policy. howard fineman is the global editor of the huffington post. also with us is republican strategist steve schmidt, chief strategist of 2008 mccain/palin campaign and msnbc political analyst. it's your fight now. you've won this washington state thing tonight, donald trump did. this question, i thought the chairman out there was smart when she -- susan hutchison, she
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said basically trump is doing okay but if he wants more women voters he's got work to do the next five weeks. she wasn't cheering him yet she was admonishing him, i think it's fair to say. >> there's no question if donald trump is going to win this election in november he has a lot of work to do with women voters. he has record high unfavorable numbers with women voters. that being said, this is not a popularity contest, it's a choice and the choice is between candidate "a" and candidate "b." we watch these scenes playing out. you see the mexican flags, you see the intimidation, you see some of the broken windows, the rumblings of violence, you look ahead to the convention, this is going to be a tumultuous election. donald trump is going to be poised to take advantage against some of these things and as you look out over the next couple months we'll get a better picture in donald trump is going to expand his base, whether he'll grow as a candidate or do
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the things necessary to rehab his image with those women vote voters. >> howard, right down the line here i normally thought that marcus of queensbury rules applied and you didn't punch below the belt but below the belt doesn't exist, there's no belt anymore in politics. you can hit as low as you want. going after someone's husband and their behavior, call it that, is pretty well known but using it against them and saying they're an enabler, trump seems to be winning with this strategy so something is different than what we thought it was in terms of decency. >> there's no question and even the term "decency" seems antique. especially when the candidate himself is doing it. what's interesting here to me, all this stuff would be happening at a lower or outside level in the campaign. >> by a whispering campaign. >> yes. this is donald trump himself with his own twitter account doing it directly on his own. guiding what few interviews he gives in that direction, using social media in this way.
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not only admitting he's the guy putting the stuff out, proudly portraying himself as the combatant who knows no rules. and -- >> so transparency cleans up what would normally be dirty pool. >> he's calculated that we're at a time in american politics when somebody who plays by the rules is not what the american people want. the american people want somebody who knows no rules. i know why he thinks that. whether that's true will be the real test of this election season. >> as we talk we're watching these scenes here of the protesters in concern and some of thet quite offensive. i think this is not helping their cause. >> so many people in trying to figure without will win the election and how, we keep talking about demographics and the obama coalition and, you know, whether or not donald
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trump can win this race without the is -- without women's votes and everything about this election is so different than what we've seen. i'm going to stand by my belief that donald trump doesn't care about the women's vote. i think he is out there -- >> well, it there's whether he cares about them or not. >> but i'm saying if he can get out the vote for the group of people that most politicians have never had anything do with, haven't spoken to. >> it won't work. >> i hope you are right but let me tell you, it's been bubbling up for a long time. he's doing what we saw coming out in 2008, people saying i can't stand hillary clinton's voice, she sounds like my ex-wife. how is sarah palin going to win the vice presidency? >> the numbers don't add up. he needs women. he needs women. >> you're seeing this happen on the republican side. when you get down to 88-8 or something like that, that includes an awful lot of women. >> and here's the thing we have to keep remembering, donald trump is channeling the i.d. of a certain kind of man who feels
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put upon because he can't call women gals in the workplace, because his facebook has to be -- >> you know he's getting half the vote. >> of the republicans. >> no, in the national polling matchup. >> because he's brand x republican. any republican will get to 45, that's what happens. as soon as the republican candidate consolidates think get to 45/46. most people default to the republican party. >> it's party loyalty. >> but here's what we have to remember. mitt romney had a 14-point r-plus 14 advantage among white women in 2012 which was double the r plus seven advantage with white women john mccain had in 2008. the result was the same in both of those elections. in the case of mitt romney, it was a five million vote margin in favor of the democrat barack obama. the reality is, yes, he will -- donald trump will get some republican women because they are republicans, they're going to vote for whoever. >> and that's the only reason. >> he isn't hadding anyone to his coalition. if you don't get white women,
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you can't women. >> what i thought is shrewd and interesting republican chairwoman in washington state was saying -- >> susan hutchison. >> susan hutchison was saying don't put -- quit putting obstacles in the way of getting more women votes because the numbers will not add up for donald trump no matter how popular he is among men -- >> he doesn't care. >> unless he gets some more women. >> he doesn't care. >> he doesn't care. >> you're saying he doesn't care about the majority of the population? >> no, exactly. i don't. >> i'm going to -- >> what he cares about is winning. >> i'll be as crass as he would. he doesn't care about any part of the population he thinks is okay looking. if you can put on your skirt -- >> i'm talking about numbers, he wants 50% of the vote. >> what has he done to demonstrate to you that he is in any way willing to change his language? >> he's not going to. >> exactly. so what does that tell you?
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it's common sense. >> it's about strategy. >> he's going out for the republican man who is sitting around who is aggrieved and will say look, honey, go out and vote for that donald trump. >> in his crabbed view, attacking bill and hillary clinton for what happened with bill clinton is a way to go after some women voters. >> they're republican. >> you may find that laughable -- >> for all of the women he attacks because hillary clinton stayed with her husband, how many women is he offending? her age group and older who might have wanted to leave their husbands and didn't have the ability to do so and they grieve for hillary clinton. >> and he's getting women who are already going to vote vote republican. he has to do some addition. you have to add to your coalition. if romney couldn't win with an r plus, again, 14 point advantage with white women -- >> i have to go.
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>> if he couldn't win with that, trump has to add somebody. >> so the election is over and hillary won? >> no, but the demographics are severely against the candidate. >> if he loses women, he'll lose the election. >> he doesn't care. >> then he'll lose the election. >> he doesn't care. >> he's not running for president. >> he's running as a narcissist. >> yes. >> i think part of the problem is donald trump lives in a bubble. he lives in a bubble wherein i think they believe the vanishing white voter strategy. he's listening to the same people who said that if mitt romney could have unearthed six or seven million more white male working class voters he would have won. he lives in that bubble now and he thinks it's true. >> i've spent a lot of time in trump tower. they want to win the election. >> but he thinks he can with the vanishing white voter. >> how would you do that? >> there are conservatives who believe in this theory. bill and i have talked about this. there are people who have written papers believing there are six million unearthed white voters, that they're out there. that if you can excite them and get them to vote, you'll win. >> >> let's go to hallie
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jackson. hallie, you're with the protesters in albuquerque? >> yeah, we are. we can turn our light off. take a look, we'll have our cameraman walk over and head over. this is what we've been seeing mostly all night if you can hear me. again, immigration protesters, at one point we were inside the convention center, your saw it looked as they were we were hearing reports from albuquerque police of pellet guns fired, rocks being thrown, shattered doors and a hole in the window. cops barricaded that door and we walked outside, people were trying to exit, they were blocked from a couple different entrances and exits and again it's quite the scene out here. this is also, chris, what we often see at these trump rallies is protests where he goes this tends to follow given his positions of immigration and where you look at where we are. albuquerque, new mexico. we talked about his rally
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tonight in the evening, his comments about hillary clinton and the housing market crash, his comments on new mexico governor susanna martinez, a fellow republican and head of the republican governor's association as well and it's loud so hopefully you can hear me okay. but again we're monitoring what's happen iing and we'll ke you posted. it looks like this crowd, at least the this smaller group, we're seen some folks disperse is going to be out here for a little while, so that's the scene in albuquerque downtown.
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we saw the smoke when we heard what sounded like rocks and people hitting glass, there were audible gasps of surprise. people were talking about the protesters outside. we have to stress, again, not unusual to see these kinds of protests, see riot police at a trump campaign event. when you look at where we are, new mexico, a state where campa events. we are in a state where immigration is a major policy topic it's not surprising you are going to see these protesters and it's something we have been expecting. >> i don't think they're winning their argument in terms of the tv cameras right now with the signal we got there. thank you so much. more as we continue to cover the protests at the trump rally down in new mexico. this is a special edition of hardball. man 1: you're new.
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man 2: i am. woman: ex-military? man 2: four tours. woman: you worked with computers? man 2: that's classified, ma'am. man 1: but you're job was network security? man 2: that's classified, sir. woman: let's cut to the chase, here... man 1: what's you're assessment of our security? man 2: [ gasps ] porous. woman: porous? man 2: the old solutions aren't working. man 2: the world has changed. man 1: meaning? man 2: it's not just security. it's defense. it's not just security. it's defense. bae systems.
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welcome back to this special edition of hardball. we continue to watch those protesters in new mexico with donald trump held a rally tonight. he will likely be facing protests at campaign events like this one. joining me now is jim -- robert. you've been following these kids pulling their shirts off and it's a demonstration of anger going.
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there's a guy that shoved somebody here. the mexican flags. has this become part of the display of the american division, these mexican flags and the other gestures we're catching here. >> reporter: the anger in the streets underscores the challenge trump faces with hispanic voters. he has moved to the far right in his party on immigration talking about a boarder wall and this has settled into the national consciousness. in talking people close to trump they recognize they may never be able to close that gap. >> what do you think of the 20% figure in the poll this weekend among latino voters? >> reporter: in terms of support for trump, trump believes a celebrity his anti-democratic appeal, his ability to go after clinton, he can be changed and if the county wants change even hispanic voters who are weary of his policy he thinks he has a
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shot at them. >> how does he do that? how does he get a strong minority from a group that he has made fun of them as rapists and bringing evil and crime to this country when they're coming here to get a job 90% of time. how does he win their hearts and minds. >> reporter: i've spoken to donald trump about this recently but his theory of the case because that's not running as a right wing he comes out of the business world he think his success could be a way he wins appeal with voters who may not see him as a traditional republican. >> i think he made a mistake the other day when he was asked by someone what dangerous places in the world have you visited or you know about and he throughout a word that is negative. he throughout ferguson. i don't know if ferguson is a
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dangerous neighborhood. but it has a racial connotation which is clear. then he threw in oakland. why does he do that if he's trying to win minority voters. >> reporter: covering trump it's hard sometimes to see a strategy. what you're looking at is a reactive personality that is forceful and overwelcomes at times and that's part of his appeal but its his limitation. >> there's dangerous stuff going on with this police car. look at that smashed window. we've seen rock throwing and yet the crowd looks pretty calm so far. it's a young crowd. let me ask you about trump and minority people wh. what is he doing? i've heard that people that live in the northeast part of the country are hispanic. they are citizens voting for a couple of generations perhaps
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that that's his target, have you heard that he's helping to get that group at least. >> reporter: look at these scenes we're watching unfold tonight. >> this is the southwest. >> reporter: right, but these scenes of unrest at trump rallies, unrest in the country it reminds me when trump first started to run for the presidency last year he revived the silent majority. he's not running on identity issues and he's not making identity politics appeal. this is a law and order candidate that is appealing to the suburbs. the normal way these republican campaigns are run but that's how he sees his appeal. >> it's very nixon, any degree of rioting that's a way to get the more conservative white person energized. let's go to the scene outside the trump rally.
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>> reporter: so we were behind the police line at one point. we saw the police on horseback move. i'm going to have our cameraman here flip around to show us the street scene behind us here. what we saw a couple of minutes ago were a number of protesters, a small handful running down the street and cop cars have been parked here and you can see now the riot police coming out to try to keep the protesters back. it's a tense situation. you've seen some interaction and back and forth between these protesters and people coming out and walking the streets. you can also see people remaining in the streets, police are trying to get them to leave but if you look over on this side here as i direct my cameraman to come back there's this person in his car trying to get out. this intersection a couple of
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minutes ago was almost entirely blocked by people. we can see off in the distance what appears to be some smoke seeing some of that deployed by police. at this point the officers are trying to get the situation under control. we are working to find out reports of arrest. we've seen a couple of people escorted away by police but at this point as you can see they're trying to make sure that everybody stays as safe as they can out here. >> why isn't anybody trying to get to you to make a statement for the camera. don't they come up and say what they're angry about and have a chance to speak into a camera and reach a national audience wouldn't they want to do that. is anybody talking to you. >> reporter: i think you're asking why people aren't coming up to us and talking with us. at one point in the evening that was happening. people were trying to interact with reporters to get their
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message across. at this point you see the police trying to keep people out of the street to get some order here. i'm looking at some signs. i see fewer signs than we saw earlier. oftentimes when these protests happen you see people who come out who are maybe not a part of the original protest. >> i know what it's about. thank you so much. take care of yourself. much more on these protests.
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we continue to monitor the protests out there at that trump rally in albuquerque. we didn't expect this to go on this late. let's check in with steve kornacki. >> we're going to take a quick look here and move ahead from the washington stuff tonight to
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the general election to the probably matchup between donald trump and hillary clinton. a lot of polls in the last few days is to average them all together so when you do that one of the sites that does that donald trump with the polls that have come out in the last couple of days has actually moved ahead of hillary clinton by .2% of 1%. what does this look like in some context? at this point in past campaigns we can show you in 2012 around this time barack obama led mitt romney by 1.7 in the average of polls. that's where he stood at the end of the may. he went on to win that election in 2008. barack obama was fighting off hillary clinton at the time. his average lead in 2008 was close to five points won by over seven but this is not a perfect indicator of where things are going because back in 2004 john
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kerry emerged in may of 2004 there he was a little more than a point ahead of george w. bush in the polls. george w. bush won that election. donald trump barely ahead in that poll. >> let's talk about some things here in terms of what changes between now and say july at the conventions. i think there's a there's this thing about we're all watching the republican party co el less fall in line if not in love. it blows me away. i wonder whether there's something in the culture of the republican party that says that the very fact that he won legitimatizes him. the very fact that he's the presumed nominee now makes him acceptable to people, republicans. you got to understand a lot of republican culture is based on conformity. everybody plays god. these are generalizations but
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i've been to a lot of rewards convention where all the guys play golf and they're all vaguely republicans. i grew up watching the democratic conventions. will the delegates please clear the aisles. it's a different culture. >> it is. >> there for i'm wondering does that give donald trump a bump here. >> politically speaking the cultures are different between the two parties but they are the same in the sense that for the most part democrats are going to vote for democrats and republicans are going to vote for republicans. >> they didn't in '72 and they didn't in '74 and lot of them didn't in '80. >> i didn't say they always vote. you gave us three examples over the history of the repubic.
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i'm saying for the most part democrats are going to vote for democrats. >> republicans are going to vote for republicans. i never thought we'd see all these people falling in line for donald trump. >> you said you didn't think they would do. >> i didn't. >> therefore it surprises you. >> absolutely. >> isn't it also partly that you've had a reckoning among the republican elites. they're falling in line behind him. paul ryan has signalled his coming any minute now and mitch mcconnell the leadership of the republican party realizing they were wrong they are getting on the train because they think they're out of step. >> they're surprised. >> it's not just the golf playing conformity of republicans. most of the people voting for donald trump do not play golf so far. >> the ones falling in line. >> the reason they're falling in line is not the conformity
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thing. it's because they're both impressed and scared that donald trump is somehow captured some kind of lightening in a bottle here that they didn't know existed and it suddenly dawned on them that they may be able to ride that energy to the white house and not lose the house and the senate. mitch mcconnell the republican leader who i know from kentucky i said what you are all skeptical what happened, he said sometimes those pesky voters decide. he says basically he's going with the pesky voters because of the energy that's there. they think they can ride it. of course everybody thinks they can ride the energy of donald trump. donald trump always has the last word. they're going to maybe ride him into the white house and not like what they see when he gets there. >> the tea party -- they did the same thing with the tea party. they saw it coming and they thought they better get behind it. >> the thing with donald trump is when he hits you, he makes
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sure you're not going to get back up. that's why they're falling in line. >> so there's no way he wins. >> i think we're in serious trouble of having a president trump. >> there's no way he wins. >> absolutely. >> sure there is. you can have a 1927 -- >> a white male that you refuse to believe. >> i'm asking. >> it's simple. if you have low turnout and this becomes such muck that voters stay home and we have a low turnout election -- >> you think the minorities are going to stay home in the face of a trump presidency. >> it happened in '72. >> the government wasn't exactly -- >> i'm trying to figure out what you think. bernie wants this thing on television. do we have hallie jackson still in the street there to tell us what's going on here in these pictures. we're looking at her camera here
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and i'm just watching this thing. is this going to die out. these are young people. it's early at night out there. they're horsing around. there's some i guess you call it violence. it's roughhousing right now. it's showing off really. we'll see. give us a sense -- we're waping the game here if you will because people are hugging each other and shaking each other up more than they're protesting. what's going on here. shirts are off for some reason. jacob? >> reporter: there we go. so we're at the intersection of copper and third and protesters have taken over a couple of streets and intersections. we're about a block and a half away from the trump venue and it's almost a party at steer. a lot of protesters that were here left. you had two groups, those that were peaceful and then the more
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aggressive group, maybe the most aggressive we've ever seen the protesters as we follow the trump campaign around the country. we see a lot of aggressive protesters but not usually like this. a lot of them have their faces covered. a lot of them are looking to pick fights. the officers are -- there they are. the officers were a block away or so. now they're moving up. you see them on horseback in the distance there. but again you've had this intersection sort of taken over by these protesters as they burn out their tires and they make a lot of smoke for the last almost half hour or so. >> we'll be following this for the next hour. it looks like you're going to be there for. thank you. we're coming back for another hour live coverage here tonight as the protest in albuquerque continues outside the trump rally. we'll see when it ends. back with more after this.
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we're covering breaking news this evening. donald trump has whop the republican primary in washington but all eyes are on albuquerque, new mexico. protesters have gathered outside a rally. police say they've used smoke grenades. let's go live to the scene and again with hallie jackson. give us

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