tv The Place for Politics 2016 MSNBC July 18, 2016 2:00pm-3:01pm PDT
>> so we've got obviously the commotion we just watched inside the convention sister in cleveland and obviously some activity outside as well. a very, very busy hour we just had. quite an exciting start for lack of a better term there at this republican convention. a special edition of "mtp daily" with chuck todd live from cleveland starts right now. good evening. i'm chuck todd in cleveland. and cleveland is rocking. but for a reason that donald trump isn't happy about. the drama is on the convention floor. welcome to "mtp daily." first day of the republican convention. the rnc are frantically trying to quell a delicate uprising on the convention floor. moments ago, a group of anti-trump delegates appeared to have enough signatures to force a roll call vote that could have
thrown out all of the convention rules. that's important because those rules right now bind trump's delegates to support him. that effort was shut down in dramatic fashion. this was the scene just a few moments ago when that measure came up for a voice vote. >> the question is on adoption of the resolution. all those in favor say aye. >> aye! >> all those opposed no. >> no. >> in the opinion of the chair, the ayes have it and the resolution is agreed to. without objection, the motion to reconsider is laid upon the table. >> well, as you can see there, the convention floor erupted. the entire colorado delegation walked off the floor in protest. chants of roll call vote clashed with chants of we want trump. the convention chair left the
stage amid the chaos. when he returned, he then informed the convention floor that a number of the anti-trump delegates had withdrawn their support and anti-trump forces then did not have enough signatures to force a roll call vote. critics on the floor were not buying that explanation. just some of that reaction amid the chaos a few minutes ago. >> the chairman of the convention walked off the stamg. left it completely unattended for 5 or 10 minutes. never seen anything like that in my entire life. this is a very simple, standard garden variety procedural mechanism that we were employing to ask for a roll call vote. it certainly isn't a good reason to abandon, for the chair to abandon the podium for ten minutes. >> we have rnc trampling their own grassroots delegates. they rolled through. they cheated. they cheated. that's what you just saw. you saw them violate their own rules. and if the rules don't matter, i'm not quite sure why we spend
all this time writing them. >> you heard an accusations of cheating. one of the delegates from new hampshire slammed has party leaders and called them fascists. this is day one, folks. so what happens next? jacob soboroff and leann caldwell have been all over this rules fight. kelly o'donnell live on the floor. ben ginsberg, our expert on these rules. former republican national committee general counsel. jacob, let me start with you. you have been navigating this, narrating the action for us. where to next, and how many state delegations are involved in this? >> i'm told, chuck, by a source involved in the whipping operation that the states that had withdrawn are minnesota, iowa, washington, d.c., and i believe maine. minnesota, iowa, washington, d.c., and maine. i'm told by that source that
essentially from their side, these people didn't know what they were signing on to. i have someone here who probably can clarify that. the one who was leading on the other side of that. i'll try to grab kendall when i can. this was an effort by the whip operation to withdraw the signatures from these delegates that have been submitted and met the threshold of what was required for a role call vote. they were confident they were going to be able to do it. >> i'm live again on msnbc. we've come to know kendall quite well. she's a schoolteacher from colorado. her husband is a chiropractor. she is the woman who decided to take on donald trump. there was some confusion in those delegations. they didn't know what they were signing on to. is that true? >> that's not true. all of our people were, obviously, educated about what it was. rule 39 was the asking for a roll call vote. that's not confusing to be asking for a roll call vote.
there's nothing confusing about saying we want the votes to be counted. i think i could tell a third grader this is about making sure your vote is counted. >> now we've moved on. we're in this pause before the primetime late night programming. the question now is, what do you do next? are you going to try to get a new vice presidential selection in there? with mike pence, perhaps that's not going to happen. maybe folks like yourself are happy with mike pence. >> obviously that decision still rests with the delegates. that's going to be up to them. i'm not leading any movement to try to do anything about the vice presidential candidate because mike pence is a good conservative and he's actually a republican. that said, my organization is still about denying donald trump the threshold and the delegate he needs. this action you saw here on the floor does not bode well for wanting to have unity in the party and calming things down because all it did was take a fire that was already burning and threw kerosene on it and added a little wind and we still
have the roll call of the states. the roll call of the states is still an option. the party needs to take ownership of what they've done in the grassroots and own the way we've been treated through the rules, the power grab and taking the power away from the delegates, taking away the ability fo vote. they took away the ability of the vote to be counted. all we were saying is count the votes. that's it. very simple request. countor votes. and they said no. >> thank you, kendall. you heard it's an extraordinary process we've seen unfold here today. and ben ginsberg will be able to offer clarity in a little bit on what kendall is saying about the role call of the states if the stop trump movement has any other avenues to free the delegates here to become unbound and vote for whomever they want. from my perspective, it's not looking very good. >> that's for sure. minnesota, iowa, d.c. and maine, these are very, i can tell you,
delegates that end up at the convention because those states are caucus states. they know what they're signing. i'm with kendall on that. i would find it hard to believe they didn't know what they were signing on to. let me move to kelly o'donnell. you've been getting reaction to the strong tactics being used. >> you get different sort of reactions based on where they stand over this long election season. and some have been frustrated. this is the path where they've been heading out to their buses here and talking to so many of them as they take a break now until the evening session. what i've been hearing has been an issue of those who feel that party unity should take over some of these -- the difficulties. we're getting hassled here by the police. so we're just going to try and finish up what we're doing and then get out of the way.
sorry, chuck. the sense that i'm getting is those that believe that party unity should be the biggest priority are frustraitted by what i saw play out. at the same time, they are also saying, it comes with it. it is part of the process. it is a way on the early part of a monday to kind of let that sort of energy run its course and then to try to come together. so no one really surprised by what has taken place. they are a little frustrated that it may slow down the process of bringing the party together. and those when i was in the indiana delegation have some concern about what it means for governor mike pence who they are very proud of. and they don't want anything to take away from that. it has been a day where there has been the unexpected shouting from both sides. those who wanted to quell this. we saw the young guys from the republican party who were wearing the hats and trying to do some of the round-up.
and -- okay. yes, sir. yes, sir. okay. so i'm going back to you. they are asking us to leave. i'm going to go back to you. >> i don't want you to lose your credential. so we'll let you go. we'll let kelly go. let me go to leann caldwell. you've been on this story for weeks. is there any -- what are you hearing would be the next phase of this plan? >> chuck, most of what's going to happen is that's not a lot of options. what they do have left is they can walk out. and we saw the colorado delegation already walk out. and some other delegations are considering it later on in the process. but people were so angry. they were trying to reassess and figure out what could feasibly happen. the washington delegation might walk out. the virginia delegation is considering something in the next few days, too. but for all intents and purposes, their effort to stop trump is pretty much dead.
now it's just going to be a sign of protest. >> let me bring in ben ginsberg. counselor, i have to ask you. what kind of tactics were used to convince four states to suddenly decide we didn't know wat we were signing. >> yeah, i think they pulled people over to the side of the room or in back rooms by the podium. i think what the essential argument would probably be, you're hurting donald trump if you do this. you're hurting the republican party if you do it. and by the way, if you don't pass the rules package, you're going to have another 18-hour meeting where you've got to figure out what the rules are for this convention. do you want to pay the change fee for your airline ticket? do you want to pay for three more nights in a hotel? and so the moving along the convention is probably what did the most twisting in all of this. >> let me ask you this. you heard kendall talk about maybe she does something at the roll call vote. what would that look like?
>> there are a couple of difference things. one is absentia. they'd try to abstain, not have their votes counted. hold donald trump ideally in their minds under 1,237 delegates. that could take the form of a walkout or it could take the form of, and this is number two and probably the most effective way is request a polling of the delegation which is permitted under the rules of the house and the rnc rules so that each delegation that agreed with the never trump movement would have somebody rush the microphone, ask to have that delegation polled to register abstentions as well. that forces a parliamentary ruling by the chair and would make the point for them in a number of delegations that there was opposition. >> all right, ben. how effective do you think the rnc and trump was today?
was that an effective move to shut this down? was it -- or were they balancing their risk? were they worried about the roll call too much? >> i believe they were balancing their risks. i think that they feared the roll call because there are perhaps 300 or 400 delegates who are pledged trump delegates on the presidential vote but aren't necessarily for him in matters like this. and it would show weakness in the convention. so the lesser of two evils here was to bang the gavel in a way that's never been banged in a republican convention and steamroll. >> ben ginsberg, what a scene. thank you very much. we have a calmer scene outside. let me bring in my first panel. tom brokaw, my running mate these days. alfonso, president of latino partnership for conservative principles. your group today officially
endorsed donald trump. wasn't an enthusiastic endorsement but you endorsed. >> difficult decision but for us, we have two candidates with high unapproval ratings. we need to support trump. >> and sara fagen. tom, i have to start with you. have you seen a convention -- this is the most raucous of a convention. >> yes, i have. >> '73 maybe. >> teddy kennedy n jimmy carter. >> when they couldn't find each other. >> those were raucous conventions. but for donald trump who takes such pride in managing everything, this is a political reality show, mr. trump. not a stage manager. and the idea that they didn't anticipate this would be the optics for the opening of their convention is quite surprising to me. paul manafort said earlier today about john kasich, the popular governor of ohio who will not
appear here because he so disagrees with donald trump on so many positions. and manafort came in to governor kasich's house and said, you are an embarrassment to the republican convention and to the state. john kasich has been at this a long time. he won't forget this. that's an important state. those two things really surprised me. >> not just an important state. no republican has ever been elected to the presidency without ohio. sara fagen, this was supposed to be, we knew this would be the hardest day for unity. no doubt about it. how are they doing? >> it's not working out so well in the first couple of hours. i thought ben's assessment was right. what's the lesser of the two evils? you pound the gavel down and you have an ugly hour. or you end up with all the coverage with some number, 400, 500 delegates that don't support their party's nominee, which is a high number if you think about you're only -- you're less than
2,000 total delegates. so here's the thing, though. one of two things also happened. either the trump campaign was not organized enough to know how bad this was going to be, or they knew it was bad and it was worse than we are even understanding. and they gavelled through it. and i think, you know, potentially they're in a situation where because they handled it the way they did, it's going to gain steam. that would be the worst for them out of this outcome. >> i brought up and introduced you, the fact you've been a reluctant trump guy. you worked in the bush administration. you come out today and endorse him. you see this. any regrets? >> no, not at all. it's certainly frustrating and i agree with your assessment. they underestimated the anti-trump forces. they're certainly not a majority but they're very well organized. guys like ken cuccinelli, they know the process, and this
should not have happened. but they weren't ready. it looks heavy handed. the anti-trump forces are going to gain some momentum. they'll have to do some fence mending here and so that they are willing to work with them. the same thing i think that tom said about governor case uch. you have the convention in ohio, a state you need the republican infrastructure to support trump's candidacy and you attack the governor? that's not a good idea. >> tom, it's going to feel weird to people. we've been covering all this action. there's a break. tonight is just going to be basically a tv advertisement. we'll not have any -- so then it's going -- which i guess the trump campaign -- >> here's the other part. because of what happened, they'll control what's on the screen tonight but we won't stop talking about what happened. >> already stepped on their first night. >> that's what's already in. the fact is that he does have a majority of the delegates. he arrives in cleveland with the
convention in his back pocket at this point. it's going to be very hard to take that away from him. how he manages the rest of the week is going to be critically important. you and i were talking off camera sara. it feels like they need some relief valve here. what does that look like? >> i think a couple of things. one, they'll have to let some of these anti-trump delegates have a vote on something where they can kind of release their frustration. you know, some of the speakers, they may need to tweak some of the speeches and say, i haven't already been a perfect candidate. i know not everyone supports me or mr. trump. you know, but i'm going to work hard to earn your support and run a respectable campaign this fall. that's the only correct answer to john kasich's criticism. i'm going to work hard to earn your support this fall. >> -- for some time. >> we have. and this event tonight, the
events earlier tonight may force him to actually do it. >> well, we're supposed to hear from him tonight. i'll be curious if he reacts to this afternoon's events. had one mild tweet so far. but does he react on the podium to the events. >> he's introducing his wife, obviously. and that gives him an opportunity to be warm n fuzzy in a way -- >> to soften himself up in a way we even seen. >> sara, alfonso, tom, brat sta great start. we'll find out how did he stop the uprising? this, of course, a special edition of "mtp daily" live from cleveland, ohio. it's not too steamy right now. we'll be right back. mary buys a little lamb. one of millions of orders on this company's servers. accessible by thousands
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a war of words heats up between team trump and ohio governor john kasich as the convention got under way in cleveland. up ahead, i'll talk to donald trump's campaign manager paul manafort. this is "mtp daily" live from the republican national convention. we'll be right back. i'm not a customer, but i'm calling about that credit scorecard. (to dog)give it. sure! it's free for everyone. oh! well that's nice! and checking your score won't hurt your credit. oh! (to dog)i'm so proud of you. well thank you. get your free credit scorecard at discover.com. even if you're not a customer.
...cleasee ya!ake off. when you're living with diabetes. steady is exciting. oh this is living baby! only glucerna has carbsteady, to help minimize blood sugar spikes. and try new glucerna hunger smart to help you feel full. what i do know is i'd like my questions answered. this is about the future of our party. this isn't just about this week or this year. this is about the future of the party. we want a party where people can now and into the future feel comfortable coming forward and making their arguments. where people can be heard. >> that was utah senator mike lee. one of the more influential voices in the stop trump movement. national conventions are typically meant to highlight the party as much as the candidate. this isn't a typical year. this republican convention probably could be rebranded the trump show.
the primetime speakers are all trump loyalists starting with his wife melania. and every night someone with the last name of trump will speak. we'll get started and preview tonight. i've got chris cillizza and alfonso aguilar n saand sara fa. chris, tonight they want to put on a show about make america safe again. tom brought up a good point. i'm sure trump will rail against the media for doing this. we're going to be focused on what happened over the last ten hours. >> the last 30 minutes. as i was watching the convention floor, it not only goes against the story republicans want to tell a unified party but it's people shouting saying, no, it's convention -- delegations, colorado, a swing state walking off the floor. isn't it great? we have this unity? did you see the thing that just happened?
it exposes the cracks the party was hoping to avoid. >> i think trump should address it tonight. and they should be in emergency control mode. send these lieutenants to talk to the anti-trump people. have a conversation and see how they're going to go forward. this can metastasize if they don't control it. >> sara, that was your point. how they went about this might make it worse unintentionally. >> they could have had a bad moment that was reported and could have gone away. and this feels like it's potentially a moment that could build. a lot of it has to do with what really happened with the withdrawing of these states. did iowa, maine and the others get forced out in a heavy-handed way where they left upset or some set of concessions made already that hasn't been reported or people don't know about? and people are feeling better and this is going to dissipate? i've been through a lot of conventions. state and otherwise. these things typically build
until you're right, there's a relief valve. it's unclear what that relief valve is. >> it's a roll call vote and some use that to talk, about we don't like trump. it's a roll call vote on the first day of the convention in the afternoon. you can do worse. like it is -- this is not like we'll check this box and donald trump will be the nominee anymore. sometimes you make it worse. >> it would have went back to the rules committee. >> this is an interparty fight that most would have no idea about were it not for this. >> this could get worse if trump takes it personal. >> he never does that. >> and he goes after the organizers. >> the thing that as an operative you watch for when you're on the other side of this is, how did they not know this? there's a lot of ways to prevent these things from happening. you know, did donald trump spend time with these delegations before monday?
that's a question i'd want to know. because a good operation would be able to telegraph that to the candidate. they'd know going in monday night this was going to happen and exactly how many votes were going to be opposed to this rules vote. >> let's remember, to your point, in their defense oddly, manafort gets brought in late. a lot of delegations have been filled out before -- >> he's brought in in april. they were brought in to basically, you know, chewing gu. >> that's the reality of a good operation. you know those things. >> the candidate, i agree he shouldn't necessarily engage in this stuff because it may make it worse. engine publicly as opposed to privately. but the candidate is out tweeting almost simultaneously about the coverage he gets at various networks. it's kind of like, this is like a problem, right? and it may not be a huge problem but just -- it speaks to the
little things don't get checked off by this operation. >> i'm going to pause you here. a couple of senators are joining us. including an iowan. joni ernst. she'll be speaking in primetime tonight on the convention's opening day theme make america safe again. and senator dan coates of indiana. senator ernst, you saw what's happened over the last hour or so. do you feel the need that you should make an effort to reflect the disunity and try to send a message of, well, let's figure this out, since the iowa delegation was a part of this? >> well, tonight i'm focussing on national security. and that's my message. but we do need to unify and push back against hillary clinton. that should be what we're discussing right now, not what divides our party but what brings us together. and that's the effort to push back against hillary clinton and her failed policies when it comes to national security.
>> senator ernst, iowa was one of the four delegations that pulled out. what can you tell us about iowa's role in this? >> what i will tell you is that iowa, the majority of those in the iowa delegation pushed back against that. there were some reports that they left the floor but that's incorrect. there were only a few of our delegation that left the floor. so overall, iowa stayed the course. they will be supporting trump in the long haul. >> senator coates, you've been in politics a long time. how would you rate how this was handled today by the party? >> well, i think the party saw it coming, and i thought it was handled very well. it was clear that donald trump has the strong majority of support. it's a democracy. people have the opportunity to speak up and not submit to or commit to a particular candidate. i think they had an opportunity to do that. but the overwhelming majority
came through here tonight. >> senator coats, our own kelly o'donnell reported, did some interviews with members of the indiana delegation concerned that anti-trump forces may use the vice presidential nomination and the mike pence nomination to express their frustration. how concerned are you about this scenario? >> i'm not concerned about that at all. i'm absolutely confident that donald trump made the right choice in mike pence. he reaches out to conservatives. he has got a strong record in support of conservatives. he's going to gain that support and i think adds a great deal to the trump ticket. donald trump reaches out to people that don't ordinarily support republicans in an extraordinary way. mike pence reasures those conservatives that this is going to be a solid ticket. they'll work together for the future of this country. >> senator coats, i know you've known john kasich a long time. what did you make of paul
manafort, trump's campaign manager calling him embarrassing to his state? >> well, i didn't call it embarrassing. i don't agree with john kasich on this, but i know him to be a principled person. he's trying to follow what he thinks is the rule of law. i think there could be an exception having been made for this. but he's the governor of ohio. and i think we ought to respect his decision. i simply don't agree with it. >> senator ernst, tell me about your speech tonight. it's supposed to be on national security. but specifically, what are you hitting on? >> well, just a broad overview, i will be speaking to the fact that we have seen america slide back and abdicate its role in leadership in the world. we've seen the rise of isis under president barack obama and the message is that hillary clinton has failed in so many ways. what we will see is she continues the same failed policies as barack obama.
what we need is a strongl leade, one willing to step up n support our men and women in uniform and our allies. that's what i'll be visiting about this evening. the need for leadership. >> senators ernst and coats, thanks for coming on together. obviously we had a lot of moving parts here, and you guys were very cooperative. thank you very much. enjoy the convention. >> thanks so much. a little more breaking news here. we have confirmed the trump motorcade was involved in an accident in new york. the campaign tells us donald trump is okay. a staff car, though, was involved in what is being described as a minor accident. as you know, in a few minutes, trump campaign chairman paul manafort will be joining me. a lot of questions for him. we'll see what he has to say. you're watching msnbc's live coverage of day one of the republican national convention. we'll have more from cleveland right after this. atching. soon, she'll be binge-studying.
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well, early this morning, trump campaign chair paul manafort got into a bit of a back and forth with ohio governor john kasich. kasich, of course, is skip the convention, even though his home state is hosting it. manafort today called that decision embarrassing. here's what he said to my colleague mika brzezinski earlier on "morning joe."
>> paul manafort said you're embarrassing your state by your failure to participate in the convention in your state. does that offend you? >> i heard about it, i loved. ohio is doing great. and people in the state, at least today, still like me. that's just politics. >> you laughed at that? >> i did. i laughed at it. it's so -- it's come to ohio and i don't know what he's even talking about. >> well, we have our stuff in reverse order there. that was john kasich reacting to paul manafort. here's the original manafort quote from this morning. >> he's the governor of the state. >> kasich is -- and you know what, he's making a big mistake. he's looking at something that's not going to happen. he's hurting his state. he's embarrassing his state frankly. but most of the republicans who aren't coming, most of the republicans who aren't coming are people who have been part of the past. >> well, paul manafort joins me from inside the convention floor. mr. manafort, welcome, sir.
let me get you to react. governor kasich responded to you. i give you a chance to respond to what he said. >> i really have nothing more to say. i think that the incumbent governor of the state should be speaking whether it was a republican or democratic convention. it's his decision. this convention is moving forward. it's going to be a very good convention. the future of the party will be speaking here. we're very happy about it. >> on a day that you want to emphasize party unity and begin that, do you at all regret going after him and calling it embarrassing? >> we're moving forward. i was asked the question. i answered it. what we're talking about tonight is donald trump and we're introducing him to a niew way t the american people. >> let me ask you about what just happened on the floor about two hours ago. obviously, you successfully beat back this potential rebellion. why didn't you let the roll call happen? why did you not want to let that
happen? why not let the steam out? >> first of all, it wasn't a rebellion. had nothing to do with the trump for president campaign. this had to do with party rules and there was very little support for not adopting the rules package. having a roll call vote would have taken a long period of time, almost two hours, and we have a convention to start later this evening. it would have gotten complicated. but it had nothing to do with the trump campaign. this is internal rules issues that have nothing to do with presidential politics. >> there were some reports you guys were concerned that 300 to 400 delegates who are bound to donald trump would perhaps peel off and vote with the rebellion here. were you concerned about that? was that your whip count? >> no, not at all. the reality is delegates who have withbeen elected supportin other candidates are now supporting donald trump. they are republican delegates. now there's only one candidate, most of the convention is
supporting trump from the start or once their candidates dropped off. so we probably would have had 2000 to 2100 delegates if there would have been a roll call. but it was a party position and not necessary. donald trump cares about the rules, too. what we said in the rules committee was the time to deal with rules for 2020 is after the political process is over when there's a new president elected. when you don't have the politicized atmosphere of a convention. and then we're going to be supporting changes to the rules because as donald trump said during the primary process, he doesn't like some of the rules that exist right now. he wants a more transparent process. this wasn't the day to do it or the place to do it. i'm very happy that we move forward with adopting the rules which basically had overwhelming support in the rules committee as well. and notwithstanding what
happened here today, we closed the convention's first session on time and we're moving forward. >> are you at all concerned that between the little back and forth between now and governor kasich and what we saw today that it's the pictures. the pictures tomorrow are going to be about the disunity and you're trying to create a unified party? do you feel like day one was mismanaged. >> day one hasn't really started. tonight is the beginning of the program of the convention. it's going to go fine. this is a convention. there are people elected representing all political stripes. some of them wanted to do some things. they did it. the will of the majority overwhelmingly was heard. and we move forward to the next session. >> what do you do to bring the colorado delegation back? this is a swing state. one of the states you have to keep in play is colorado, and you'll need the activists back on your side. is there something -- what do you do to get them back?
>> we have plenty of activists on our side in colorado. we've seen polls that's show the race tightening. we have an organization that we've put in place that will be beginning its political work right after this convention. we're comfortable. we're where we need to be in colorado. we're also comfortable that in many of the battleground states the race has gotten to the point where we're either tied or ahead. we're excited about where we stand today and haven't even started our convention. >> do you want to bring colorado back to the -- you want that delegation -- you don't want empty chairs. >> we're not going to have an empty chair. the delegates in colorado were elected in a process that didn't even have voters participating from colorado. it was a closed process. it's one of the things that got mr. trump concerned about the rules of the party. however, the republican party of colorado and leadership in the party in colorado are supportive of our campaign, and will be working with us. >> so who is in those chairs if they don't come back? >> activists elected in a closed
door caucus that was not very well publicized. it's not at all representative of the state. but they represent the state here. we recognize that. but that doesn't mean they are the only people that will be representing the colorado republican party in the general election. >> paul manafort, campaign manager for donald trump, thank you, sir. good talking with you. still ahead, the debut of sorts on the national stage for melania trump. probably the biggest name that's taking the stage tonight. we'll have more of what to watch for on night one of the republican convention after what's been quite an active day one. we'll be right back.
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that's a live picture of a semi empty floor of the republican under way. got under way this afternoon just down the street from here in downtown cleveland. the theme tonight, though, is called make america safe again. this slate of speakers will focus on immigration and foreign policy. some of the featured ed speake include former new york city mayor rudy giuliani. retired lieutenant general michael flynn. my guest from earlier in the show, iowa senator joni ernst and the wife of the candidate, melania trump. so joining me now, msnbc political analyst and former bush communications director nicole wallace. chris cillizza is still here and larry kudlow, how are you? nicole, you and i have done a little of this rodeo this
morning. how does tonight, what can be done tonight to fix what happened today? >> well, paul manafort back and forth with kasich is so wild. they were trashing each other on twitter. this is nasty stuff. it's shocking to me that donald trump is as close to hillary clinton as he is without having learned the single first lesson you learn in politics. when you are in a hole, stop digging. they have just dug and dug all day long. it's a weird way to start the day but it's very trump-like. >> larry, you are a trump supporter. you have been helping him out. you had this weird smirk on your face because i get the sense that maybe you know secretly she might be right about this. stop digging. >> nicole has a lot of political wisdom. i have known for a good many years. i also know this is in private conversations, nicole wallace likes a little rock and roll on the floor of the convention. i kind of agree with her on
that. look, what i'll say is this. john kasich has been a friend of mine for 30 years and his wife, karen. >> a good friend. you guys were tight. >> one of the best interviews i ever got in this whole process was with john in his bus before the new hampshire primary. i'm not the candidate, i'm not the campaign manager. that's up to mr. manafort. i have a little different style. i wish john were around. personally. and i think in terms of policy, i wish he were around. i really want to see starting tonight about security, i want to see an issues-driven republican party. i want to see an issues-driven republican candidate. i know mr. trump has it. we have had conversations. i have assisted him along with my buddy steve lawrence. just stay with the issues. if he does, i believe he will defeat hillary clinton who has basically no issues but if he doesn't and these spats keep cropping up that's a different story. >> i totally agree with the analysis. i just think it's impossible for him.
he couldn't even stick with his vp on the day he picked him. i totally agree with the analysis. >> i have helped trump. but i might start a trend, hash tag never tweet. >> good luck with that. >> just saying. just saying. >> should have jumped in on the manafort interview. >> nicole's point, i continue to be struck by the fact he literally does almost nothing that you would say okay, this makes sense. he gets off message, he gets in the way of bad stories for her many times, and yet, i keep coming back to it, 46-41. 47-44. in swing states, he is a little -- he's -- he is not behind by -- if we did this campaign you would think he would be behind by 25 points. >> it's important, for all hillary's ads and negative stuff
she's not nothing. trump has picked up in recent weeks, i think. i say never tweet. mr. trump is mr. trump. that's why he's here. he beat 16 very qualified candidates. he's in the thick of the horse race. i think he's going to have much better policy issues than mrs. clinton but i'm just saying, he is who he is. i don't think he's going to stray far from that. all i ask, i say this when i'm with him, please stay with the issues because you have good pro-growth issues. >> let's talk about the issues. you and i talked about this this morning, nicole. on paper, they have the right message goal tonight which is to be talking about, look, i think coming back to this, the last six weeks, what have americans been digesting? whether it's what's happening with racial strife, terrorism, we're not -- people going crazy and maybe being terrorists or not. but the whole idea.
so there's opportunity here if they learn how to do it. >> rudy is speaking tonight. you both covered the 2004, we all covered the 2004 convention. >> on national security. >> 2004, it was a night about making america safe. i think he stumbles into success. i think he branded his campaign about 12 days ago the law and order candidacy, gave a speech that i forget, maybe in pennsylvania, and it didn't get as much notice as making america great again but it is again mainlining into the central anxiety of every american about the times we live in. >> i was going to say if you look at the last six weeks, what's the overwhelming feeling? anxiety and uncertainty. he is a great messenger for that. everything, all these people, everything they have done hasn't worked. they don't know what they're doing. look at the world. if he could -- it's not to larry's point, it's not -- it's not beyond his capacity as he
has defined himself as a candidate to do these things. it just means you decide what you're going to say and keep saying it. >> can he stick to it. >> that's the reagan rule. let me tell you, tonight's going to be very interesting. it's not a throw-away by any means. you will see i think some very important issues. number one, economic growth is crucial to international security. i think you will hear that. number two, from trump and the republican party will defend the thin blue line. they will defend the cops as they should and all this racism talk from the other side is already backfired and will continue to backfire. trump has seized the high ground on this issue which we read about unfortunately every day. >> i got to run. i got to get to a break there. thank you all. more after this quick break. ♪
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it's already been an exciting afternoon so imagine what the night's going to bring. keep it right here on msnbc for full coverage of the republican national convention. we'll have special edition of "mtp daily" all week at 5:00 p.m. brian, rachel and chris lead prime time coverage beginning at 7:00. chris hayes picks up coverage right now. >> enjoy your selfies, chuck. good evening