tv MSNBC Live MSNBC August 5, 2016 10:00am-11:01am PDT
not undercutting your efforts to rebuild trust with the american people? >> well, kristin, i appreciate you're asking that because i was pointing out in both of those instances, that the director comey had said that my answers in my fbi interview were truthful. that's really the bottom line here. and i have said during the interview and many other occasions over the past months, that what i told the fbi, which he said was truthful, is consistent with what i have said publicly. so i may have short circuited and for that, i, you know, will try to clarify because i think, you know, chris wallace and i were probably talking past each other because of course, he could only talk to what i had told the fbi and i appreciated that. now i have acknowledged repeatedly that using two e-mail accounts was a mistake.
and i take responsibility for that. but i do think, you know, having him say that my answers to the fbi were truthful and then i should quickly add, what i said was consistent with what i had said publicly. and that's really sort of in my view trying to tie both ends tonight. >> the one inconsistency said you never sent or received, there were three marked classified at the time. is that an inconsistency. >> here's what, here are the facts behind that as well. you know that i preside -- i sent over 30,000 e-mails to the state department that were work-related e-mails. director comey said that only three out of 30,000 had anything resembling classified markers. what does that mean? well, usually, if any of you
have ever served in the government, a classified document has a big heading on the top. which, makes very clear what the classification is. and in questioning, director comey made the point that the three e-mails out of the 30,000 did not have the appropriate markings. and it was therefore reasonable to conclude that anyone, including myself, would have not suspected that they were classified. and in fact, i think that has been discussed by others who have said two out of those three were later explained by the state department not to have been in any way confidential at the time that they were delivered. so, that leaves the 100 out of 30,000 e-mails that director
comey testified contained classifies information, but again, he acknowledged there were no markings on those 100 e-mails. and so, what we have here is pretty much what i have been saying throughout this whole year and that is that i never sent or received anything that was marked classified. now if in retrospect which is what is behind the 100 number. if in retrospect some different agency said, but it should have been, although it wasn't, it should have been, that's what the debate is about. but, director comey said there was absolutely no intention on my part to either ignore or in
any way dismiss the importance of those documents because they weren't marked classified. so they would have been hard to do. and i will go back to where i started, i regret using one can the. i've taken responsibility for that, but i'm pleased to be able to clarify and explain what i think the bottom line is on this. >> and just very quickly before we get to our panel, donald trump says this whole thing means that you can't be trusted with national security. today you were endorsed by former cia director michael moral who says it's trump who can't be trusted, and he went to far as so indicate that he's been turned by putin. do you agree with that assessment? >> well, i have the great honor of working with mike moral, spending a lot of hours with him in the situation room in the white house. he is a consummate professional who has devoted his entire professional career to protecting our country.
i was honored to receive his endorsement. i will let his comments speak for themselves, but i really appreciated his explaining as he did in his op-ed, some of what's at stake in this election. >> thank you, madam secretary. i believe we have a question from one of our panelist -- could you stand up? >> hi, i'm off the political reporter with the new york times. my question is you've accused donald trump of using racist and sexist language, what does this say about the electorate so that many americans are supporting him? >> well, i really, i really blaef that the core of his support -- i'm not going to speak for everyone who supports him because i think there have been some quite distressing statements coming out of his
rallies and his supporters and who has aligned themselves with him, but i think the core of his support really centers on the disappointment in the economy that so many americans feel. and what i have been saying is, you know, i want to bring this country together, we have three goals, we need more economic opportunity, we need to protect our national security and we have got to word toward american unity. so i have been trying to understand what it is that has driven people to support trump. and i have met with people and i have listened to them. and so many are looking for an explanation as to why they lost the job they had for 18 years when the fact ril closed and nobody cared about them. what they've going to do when
their whole life was spent mining coal and made 80,000 a year and now they can barely make a job making minimum wage. why the centers of so many old industrial towns in america are hallowed out and people are turning to open yids and heroin and the list goes on, that's what i've heard. we have to recognize that, of course, some of the appeal is zen phobic and racist and massage nisic and offensive, we have to acknowledge that, but let's not lose sight of the real pain that many americans are feeling because the economy has left them behind. so i have said, i said it again in my acceptance speech last thursday, i want to be the president for all americans. i want to lift up and give
everybody a chance to pursue their dreams. and that means people who are supporting him. when i went to west virginia, i knew that i was not going to win west virginia, i can tell you that. and i was in a meeting with a group of folks, including a coal miner who was incredibly emotional in talking to me and outside there was a big trump protest going on, and one of the people at the protest, for goodness sakes, was blankenship who was just convicted of reckless indifference toward the well being of his coal miners, causing deaths. so clearly the lines are pretty stark. aye got a plan for rural
communities, it's one of the reasons as i said in my remarks that i support jim clyburn's 102030 proposal which would help all kinds of communities in america. jim and i have talked about this. so we have to reject and stand up against the appeals to the kind of bigotry and the use of bluster and bullying that we see coming from trump's campaign. but let's not forget the real economic challenges that too many americans of all backgrounds are facing today. so that's how i think about it. and that's how i'm going to try in this campaign to respond to and rebuke all of the horrible things he says on a pretty regular basis, but not about me, i could care less about that. but when he goes after individuals, when he accuses a
distinguished federal judge of mexican heritage of not being fair, when he insults a gold star family of a muslim-american who served in the military, you know the list i will stand up and call him out on that. but i will also keep reaching out to americans of all races and ethnicities and wrr they live to tell them that i am not going to forget about them after this election. i'm going to work my heart out to help every single person have a better job with a rising income and make sure their kids get a good education and everything else that i think they're owed here in america. [ applause ] >> and i think we have another question from our panel. >> madam secretary, we encourage you to do this more often with reporters across the country. [ applause ]
especially those that travel the country with you everywhere you go. a majority of voters consistently say, frankly, they don't like you. and they don't trust you. and they say the same thing about donald trump. either you or mr. trump will be elected president, how would you lead a nation where a majority of americans mistrust you? and what extra responsibility might you have to show that you're up to the task? >> well, let me start by saying, every time i have done a job, people have counted on me and trusted me. and at the convention last week, we highlighted the fights of my life. starting as a lawyer for the children's defense fund, taking on the problem of juveniles in adult jails in south carolina. segregated academies, so called in alabama, fighting for kids with disabilities to get an education, and all the way
through the work i did as senator after 9/11 and representing all of you as secretary of state. so there is, and i take this seriously, don't, don't, you know, don't doubt that, i take it seriously. i know it doesn't make me feel good when people say those things, and i recognize that i have work to do. but when i started running for the senate in new york, a lot of the same things were said i won, i worked hard for the people of new york and i was reelected with 67% of the vote after i demonstrated that i would be on their side, i would fight for the people i represent ed i rana hard campaign against barack obama as everybody remembers. it got a little contentious from time to time and to my surprise, he asks me to be secretary of state because he trusted me. then i served adds secretary of state, and when i left, i had a 66% approval rating. sop ask yourselves we're of 7%
of people in new york wrong? were 66% of american public wrong or maybe just, just maybe, when i'm actually running for a job, there is a real benefit to those on the other side in trying to stir up as much concern as possible. so i take it seriously and i'm going to work my heart out. in this campaign and as president. to produce results for people. to get the economy to work for everybody, not just those at the top. to do as much as i can to help people who as i said earlier may not even vote for me. because i think country is at a cross roads election. president obama said it extremely well, both in what his speech discussed in the convention, what his press conference has since pointed out. this is a cross roads election. there is so much at stake.
you can look at my record of public service, you can meet people and families who were benefitted by the children's health insurance program. you can meet people who were benefitted bids reforming the foster care and adoption system. you can meet first responders and survivors from 9/11 who were benefitted because i went to bat for them. you can meet national guards members unless they were deployed before i worked with republicans to fix that. you can go down a long list and we'd be happy to provide it to you. of what i have done because i believe in public service. and i am proud that i've had the great, great opportunity to work on behalf of giving more people a better life ever since i was right out of law school. so i'm just going to get up every day and make my case. and i think they'll be an opportunity for a lot of people to actually hear it. [ applause ]
>> madam secretary, editor and chief of the undefeated at espn. what is the most meaningful conversation you've had with an african american friend? >> oh my gosh. well, could i tell you that i am blessed to have a crew of great friends. and i had two chiefs of staff who were my african american women friends, maggie williams and sheryl mills. i have been blessed to have people by my side in politics who's one of the leaders of my campaign. i've had a great group of young people who i have been really motivated by and frankly learned from. so i, i really have had a
lifetime of friendship going back to my college years with one of my best friends was an african american student. so, i can't compress into one conversation, they've supported me, they've chastised me, they've raised issues with me, they've tried to expand my musical tastes. so, we've had -- we've had a lot of, we've had a lot of great, great times because of our friendships. so i can't really pick one conversation out of, you know, 50 years of conversations. and i don't want to embarrass my friends, peggy lewis is here, she just became the dean of communications at trinity washington, and i want to congratulate her, donna brazile
is here, she's our acting chair of the dnc. [ applause ] so i, i guess i'll leave it at that. i think i'm going to -- i'm going to respect the cone of friendship silence, but please know i've got a lot of great friends who have given me so much more. >> madam secretary, such little time, and there's lots of question and they're signaling us to -- but i would be remissed, we're in a roomful of latino journalists -- [ applause ] -- and i have to ask you, and give you an opportunity to respond and set the record clear. does the democratic party, does your campaign take latino voters seriously or are you taking them for granted that they were automatically vote democrat? >> well, i take them seriously because i've had the great privilege of working for many
years with latino leaders, activists, business men and women, you know, just as i responded to the question, my first experience working on behalf of latinos was well actually even before i was a legal services lawyer, through my church, i baby sat latino kids on saturdays while their parents and older siblings went to the fields outside of my home in chicago which used to be hard to believe now, miles of farmland. it was my first real lesson in how much more we all have in common. there i was, 11 or 12 years old, baby sitting these little kids, and at the end of the day, the old ramshackle bus stopped at the end of the road and the parents and the older brothers
and sisters got out and these little kids just broke loose and started running down that road with their arms outstretched calling for their mothers and their fathers and getting swept up and very tired arms. and then when i was a little bit older, my church arranged exchanges with latino churches, we would go into the city of chicago, sit in church baseme s basements, talk about our lives. and again it reinforced what to me was so much of a common sense of, you know, what we wanted in our lives even though their lives and mine were very different. and as a legal services lawyer, as the chair of the legal services corporation, we expanded legal services in into places against a lot of political opposition. so i feel very fortunate that i've had the chance to work with
and learn from so many latino across america. when i ran for the senate, i worked closely with our elected representatives, both at the city, state, and national level. i was honored that they rallied around to support me and were part of the great victory that we had in the primary in new york. so now no, i don't take any voter for granted. and i particularly don't take any voter who is placing their trust and confidence in me for granted. because i am going to get up, as i said, every single day and work my heart out. to get the results that i have told you we're going to achieve together. and i know it's hard. i've been around as you all know very well. i'm not new to this. it doesn't happen by hoping it happens or wishing it happens, it happens by doing everything you probably can, and i am
blessed to have such close working relationships and friendships with latino leaders tonight at my house. we will be having a big event with latino business leaders coming from around america. and so, i'm going to do what i've always done, you see, i think at the core of political leadership is relationship. you've got to build relationships with individuals and communities. i know that doesn't happen by just asking for it, it shaps because you work hard to achieve it. so i'm going to do everything i can to make sure that any latino voter who votes for me knows that i'm going to be doing my best to deliver on everything that i've said. and i will tell you as we go along what the challenges are because i may need to ask your help. i may need you to put pressure on elected officials. i may need you to flood the internet or flood the old
fashioned, you know, mailbox of elected representatives. so they know people are watching. but that's how we're going to get it done. and i'm actually pretty confident and optimistic about that. so i hope that people will take this election seriously because i sure take you seriously and together i think we can create the kind of future that every one of our kids and grandkids deserves. thank you all very much. >> secretary clinton we are out of time -- >> that is secretary of state of hillary clinton -- before the national association of black journalists, you sere her talking to kristin welker right there, national association of hispanic journalists. the first time rel we have seen her in 244 day answer a series of questions from the press. and you heard one of the people pointing out she would do it more often. she has not had a press conference and it's something that donald trump and his appearances often hits her on, but we have a lot to cover.
i want to talk to howard fineman whose global editorial director and malcolm nance, national security expert at msnbc analyst, and i thought, howard, that kristin asked the question a lot of people have been asking recently is why on sunday, after her statements about what was said i did fbi director comey did she -- given four pinoccios by the washington post why she repeated them essentially on a sunday talk show. i wonder what you thought of her explanation in this press conference overall. >> well, i thought you saw several stages of hillary clinton there. you saw the all the different types of hillary clinton. the first one an answer to kristin's very appropriate question, was the maddeningly hair splitting overly legalistic and fundamentally wrong hillary clinton that has led to her having the poll numbers that she has on trust and likability. the fact is, there were a lot
of -- there was a lot of classified material going back and forth. and to pin it on the exact two or three e-mails that she's splitting hairs about is really to miss the point, but when the clintons get backed into a corner, that's what they do. they split hairs, they're overly legalistic, they use their yale law school education to try to evade the fundamental plain truth. that's the first hillary clinton. the second hillary clinton was the one who says look, you may not like me as a result, but i am effective. you know, i'm not glamorous. you know, i was glamorous as a potato peeler, but i sure can peel the potato and doyle that as president. the third hillary clinton was, i've got friends, i know the business, people who know me like me, i have close allies in the black community and the latino community and you can look back and see them. and then the last hillary clinton, and to me the most effective one, is the personable
church-going, method hillary clinton as a little girl observing what she observed, i think quite sensitively about the latino, the children of the migrant workers around chicago. so you've got the full krang range of hillary clinton there. what's maddening about her, what puts people off, but yes also what's appealing or at least useful about her. the keyword that she used was results. she's saying you don't have the to love me or trust me. as a matter of fact there's polls that show that trust is not necessarily a measure of electability believe it or not. if you think she can get things done, that'll be her sales message all the way through. >> and she did obviously when she dressed that, she talked about the fact that she thinks that the economy, you know, ultimately it's the economy that people are going to go for, and that question was asked about why donald trump supporters support them. and i have to tell you that, malcolm, in this fast-moving news world that we live in, this presidential campaign, what
struck me today and she addressed this whole idea of national security, is that on one hand we have a new nbc news wall street journal poll that will asks who is better prepared to handle national security, terrorism, homeland security, and it's virtually a dead heat. it's like 44 to 43%. at the same time, in the opinion pages of the new york times, you have a former cia director who served for 33 years in the cia under president's from both parties, and he essentially says that donald trump is a dupe of vladimir putin, how do you reconcile those and what do you think as you watch her standing there and this whole issue? i think there are two key issues for people. it's economy and it's fear related to terrorism and homeland security. >> well, let me touch on that, the truthfulness issue for a real quick second here because, i know hillary clinton is trying to split hairs because it's a question of her having to deal with what we call a special security office matter.
where she did not lie to the since her husband was caught in a perjury trap, you know, when president clinton was in office. she is seriously trying to avoid that, especially dealing with security matters. so that's why she splits hairs. coming back to the issue of, you know, the deputy cia director endorsing her and declaring donald trump quite possibly an unwitting agent of russia, well, you know, that is not an unserious charge. if you've been watching msnbc for the last two weeks, i have been hammering that point home. he may be actually, you know, what we call long arm handled by a foreign intelligence agency and his immediate fears, but because of his affiliation with vladimir putin and of course -- >> you think vladimir putin's been playing him? >> yes, i really do.
as a matter of fact, this operation is an old school kgb operation. this is called political warfare. and in this variation of political warfare, we're not buying a trade union, not buying a printing press and buying votes, they are doing watergate 2.0. they break into the facility, they steal information and using a cutout like wikileaks. they selectively release that information. it's taken the cia and, you know, certainly director brennan, about a week last week he said a foreign entity was playing around with the fundamental machinery of the american democracy, the electorate. it's very hard for them to come out and say these things and for mike to come out and actually say that. you're saying essentially what the entirety of the intelligence community senior leadership are starting to see on the basis of the entire historical record of how the fsb/kgb director that is vladimir putin runs operations. >> and it's obviously concerns
like that, statements about the khans, i could go on an on howard that has brought this big divide. now we have a nine-point gap in our latest poll. there's another poll that shows a 15-point gap in the favor of hillary clinton. but we're also, you know, again this very short world we live in, he tweeted sort of going back on wt he said about the plane that he thought he saw that landed with $400 million, he put out a statement responding to that op-ed piece we are talking about, really going after hillary clinton. which seems so much more focussed than we've seen -- it wasn't necessarily the defense of himself, it was more politically going after hillary clinton. do you believe, and it's early, it's august, do you believe donald trump can make a turn? >> well, he's going to have to. i mean, at this the point -- >> but can he? >> if i knew the answer to that question, i would tell you for sure, but i don't. i've spoken with donald trump, i
know him some, i know the people around him, when i'm told by the people around him is that he's basically impossible to manage. he's going to say and do what he wants in response to mostly what he sees on television, maybe occasionally if he glances at the op-ed page of the new york times and he's going to get on his smart phone and reply. now, in the last couple days, i've seen examples of him sticking to the script of trying to turn it to hillary clinton, of not immediately responding, and so forth, so i think some of his long-time friends, and here i'm talking about people like rudy giuliani and tom baric who is an investor who has known trump for 30 or 40 years and kwhost head of his finance team, basically i think dragging him into trying to behave like a kmat normal candidate. for the last week, essentially he's been depicted swhat convincingly if you believe the polls as a dangerous if not
trader. and you wonder that he's behind by 9 to 15 points. i mean, but what i do know is that a month is a year in three months is practically a lifetime in american politics. in the democrats, whatever the numbers are now, the democrats have to keep the pedal to the metal and i think the clinton people understand this fully. what donald trump will do in the next few days, who knows? my guess is he'll behave himself by the likes of the managers for a few days until he runs off the rails again. i would never bet on donald trump sticking to any script, any time. >> howard fineman, malcolm nance, gentlemen, thank you and thanks for sitting with us as we watched hillary clinton today. and i need to turn now to breaking news out of chicago. the police department and an oversight released shocking and disturbing videos of an officer involved shooting last week. an autopsy showed that
18-year-old paul o'neal was fatally shot in the back. now this death has been ruled a homicide. tammie lighten her is in chicago with more, tammie, walk us through this video that was released of what happened on july 28th. >> chris, it was just released in the last hour, nine clips, what you see is what happened before the shooting, what happened during the shooting, and what happened after. let's go ahead and watch this first clip. >> we got him, we got him. [ gunshots ] >> you've seen the officer id the suspect. they get out and that's when they start shooting. we have this from a different angle. take a look at that one. >> okay.
[ gunshots ] >> what happens from there is the car that speeds off, tobacco hits another car. that's when the suspect bailed out and starts to run. we have that in there. >> officers then give chase ask the suspects to get them. going over fences and eventually you hear gunfire most people shot. now we have one last clip you can see the suspect is taken into custody. he is on the ground and you can actually hear the police officers call him an explicit, police officers appear to kick him once he was on the ground.
you can see his head is then pushed into the ground. all of these videos were just released a short while ago, chris. and the family and the attorney got a chance to watch these videos. the attorney did speak afterwards and let's go ahead and listen to what he had to say. >> we just watched the family watch the execution of their loving son. it is one of the most horrific things that i have seen, aside from being in a movie. these police officers -- these police officers decided to play judge, jury, and executioner. the family was so distraught and understandably so that they have left. >> so, paul o'neal is the 18-year-old kid who was shot and killed. it was his mother and his sister who watched these videos for the first time today. we're told that they were shown six clips of what happened.
they couldn't get through all of them. they watched three clips, about 15 minutes of video, i'm told that his mother and sister broke down crying. they were actually supposed to come out and speak to us afterwards, and they were too upset to do that, chris. >> tammie lightener, thank you for that. i want to bring in the chief legal correspondent and ari, there's obviously what we see and what we don't see. what's your headline from what you see on that video? >> the big headline in terms of policing and with problematic here is the shooting directly into the jaguar. and we can play that part, it's in the very first video we showed. this is very vivid and to some effect disturbing video. what you see clearly if we can show it is that inside the squad car, you've got the jaguar, allegedly stolen, that's the felonious act. yet with the gun drawn, out of the car and you see it here, boom, there, repeated shots into the moving vehicle. forget the secondhand after the fact judgments that we see in
these cases which can be difficult and at times unfair to police. you should the polices own rules in chicago, you are not allowed to shoot into a moving vehicle like that unless you see some other threat, beyond the threat posed by the moving vehicle itself. and we know in this case, in addition to this brand new video, there was no weapon found inside the video. so the only legal question -- >> inside the car. >> correct. >> the only legal question would be did the officers to believe there was some threat beyond the moving car, even if they were wrong. and that can be a defense and we don't know all of that yet, but clearly the headline is, you have what we would call policing that violates their own rules in shooting into the car. after that you have the suspect giving chase, you have a difficult scenario of what is someone who is shown a willingness to pose danger to others. let's be clear. the alleged incident was a stolen car, on the run, leaving with cops, that does put other people in danger. you're not looking at a clean or a simple scenario of saying the
suspect was somehow completely unarmed and turning themselves in. this is a suspect fleeing. this is a suspect that police could be violating several felony laws. but i would say the headline is you have a violation of the policing rules that suggests potentially improper use of force. >> but what we have here is a charge of homicide and what we don't see on this video, and this is the part of the video that we're showing now, obviously the person with the body cam has not yet gone over into that backyard. >> right, and i would also say having reviewed like you have, this one is especially clear, it is daylight video, multiple angles with, we do not have the shooting and kills itself on video. and that's very important legally to the questions around whether this was justified use of force, how the victim died. it's in clear, it was in daylight. the other big thing here that is not relevant to anything about this incident or these officers, but the broader discussion we're having in the country about policing is, this is the very
first video released in chicago under the new policy that mayor emanuel and others put out after the controversy over laquan mcdonald, and there's now a murder case against the officer for that, jason van dyke. so what we are seeing if you look back and say as i usually do, we don't know everything based on one set of videos. we are now seeing a shift in how the chicago police department which has some of these problems more than other cities is dealing with this. for years, chris, we were told by top police officials, you can't release these have i owes. it ruins the investigation, et cetera. that has changed and changed largefully response to the very graphic video that came about laquan mcdonald and now within # 0 days, we are releasing the video. i want to be clear, there is not a conclusion as to potential wrong doing by the officers here, but there is at least the appearance of a policy violation and video that's going to add to the debate over whether this case was handled properly.
>> thank you. i want to bring in our law enforcement analyst jim cavanaugh, retired agent in charge. i'm going to play the the video one more time, jim, for people to see it and so question listen to it as well and then get your reaction on the other side. >> we got him, we got him. [ guilty verdicts ] [ gunshots ] >> what do you make of it? >> there's a lot of bad tactics, i've been in the same scenario with the exception othe person driving cart right at us and shot five people and was shooting at us, and i remembered getting out over a radio car and having to point my gun toward his car, but since it was fleeing away, i could not shoot. so until most of the shots in this are terrible, terrible or bad shoot, bad shooting, bad
shot. maybe the first shot arguably could be justified. it would still violate the chicago police department policy. which that policy has a lot of flaws as well because it would indicate you couldn't even shoot the truck in nice, france. that policy has flaws. maybe they could argue the first shot. since his partner was on the other side of the vehicle, he thought he was going to get run over. but as that jaguar pans, as it passed the police vehicle, and he shoots, he puts his partner in danger with the cross fire, he's shooting at just a stolen vehicle, the danger passed and he unloads on a fleeing vehicle. and when he unloads on the fleeing vehicle toward the stp, there's also another radio car behind that. so he's putting another officer in the cross fire. so that's a bad shoot. and that's where the superintendent, eddie johnson, i think made the determination after looking at this video, you know, there's no danger, you shouldn't have been shooting your gun in that instance. and of course, when they try to
climb the fence in the yard, you hear a series of five shots, at least five shots if you count them. and of course we know now that the darge was not armed. so there's five shots at an unarmed person. we know from reports that the fatal shots were -- >> unarmed person that even if he was guilty and we don't know that, his crime, quote/unquote crime, i'm saying, we don't know anything about it, but even if he did do what think suspected him of doing, it was to steal a car. do you shoot somebody w's stole an car? >> right, you don't shoot a car thief, fleeing on foot unarmed, in other words, even given that he was just flying on foot. why would the officer shoot a person fleeing on foot? regardless of the crime, if he's not armed or he's presenting no imminent danger to the officer or others. there'd be no justification to shoot a man fleeing on foot in the yard is what i'm saying. no justification to shoot the fleeing vehicle.
the officer may be able to argue that his very first shot was trying to save the life of his partner, but after that, when the bullet goes into the hood of his cruiser, you know, he's basically putting his partner in a cross fire and danger as well. and when he shoots at the fleeing vehicle toward the stop sign. he's also putting the police car that eventually rammed and stopped the stolen vehicle, he's putting the officer who operates that vehicle in danger as the bullets are flying down the street. so i think the superintendent, chris, did the right thing. he stripped the officers of police powers. prompt investigation, he's going at a real aggressively. one thing you notice when chicago pd here. they have so many resources. such a tremendous force there. the second largest force in the nation. 13,000 officers. and look at all the officers who are able to put their very quickly. there's a helicopter up, i don't know if that's a police helicopter or news helicopter, but they're able to put a lot of people there. if the person with a stolen person gets away on foot, they
have so many officers in the area, they should be able to of a-end that person safely. spot him with the helicopter, get him on all of those officers and they should leverage that, leverage that strength they have. instead of, you know, using the trigger in that particular case. >> jim cavanaugh, thank you very much. i'm joined by senior fellow at the american center for progress and former president of the naacp. here we are again, ben, talking about a police shooting like this. and i just wonder what your thoughts are as you see this. >> you know, there are so many. first of all your heart goes out to the young man's family. and i just can't say that enough. at the same time, it's seeing these cases again and again that make us feel so many us feel like our young men are being hunted, that they have to fear both the bad guys and the cops. and, you know, at the same time, i think activists in chicago
have, you know, can take some pride in the fact that the cops are responding the way that they are. the superintendent is talking sense. that, you know, that this case is not being covered up the way that the mcdonald case was, and that quite frankly, from the mayor on down, people are acting as if they might lose their job if they don't ensure that we deal with this situation and we actually make it safer for all of our young men, all of our people, you know, even when they do something wrong. and this young man may have done something very wrong, may have stolen a car but didn't deserve to be shot, not shot in the back unarmed apparently running away. >> there are so many different layers to this and it's a very complex situation and you know, as i've gone to far too many of mass shootings and covered stories, you often hear from people. even people who are family members of those who have died,
they will say they know that the police have a tough job, they have to make split second decisions, that their hearts are pounding, that the pressure is intense, and frankly, most officers never fire their weapons. so, you know, you realize that's an incredibly intense situation. so i wonder, ben, how much of this is in your mind about money, how much of it is about training, how much of it is about inherent racism? where do you see what is happening on too many streets of america? and i'm not drawing a conclusion aebd what happened there in chicago, but this is obviously a big question, the president has been struggling with it, a lot of really smart people have been struggling with it, what do you see happen kpg. what needs to happen, ben? >> what needs to happen is a series of things. first of all we have a national crisis as far as a lack of national use of force and national use of force training.
every other western nation has national standards for when an officer should use a gun, verbally engage, use a taser seen forth. we don't. every other western nation has national standards for how often they get training and support. we don't. and so, what is most common is, you know, in our country is that an officer gets trained once at the economy and that's it for his formal training on use of force. whereas say in the uk and england, where officers typically don't carry guns, they're trained every six months. so we need national standards for use of force. we need use of force training. that said, the cities do better. that may not be the problem here. the next thing we have to focus on is quite frankly the mental health of officers. it's often seen as something that you shouldn't do, that may harm your career in law enforcement and they are doing tough jobs.
and many are traumatized and they respond badly that we have to get more help for officers on the job, but we should also frankly be doing tests on the front end to mak sure that we weed out people whose personalities are predisposed to using violence. i was in a small town once where an officer had killed, you know, a young black men who was not armed, and an old teacher came over to me and she said, i don't know what you see in your town, i taught all of these boys, and when i go down to the police department, i don't see the bullies from my schoolyard, i see the kids who were bullied. and so, you know, that -- and that anecdote, frankly to guard the township here that you have people who frankly, we let on to our force who are there because now they want to be the one in charge. they want to be the one with the gun. they want to be the authority that nobody else can contest. and you've got to wonder when you look at this officer who is shootsing at a fleeing car, and
then, you know, his colleague apparently shoots somebody in the back running away from them like what their issue was. we have to dig into all of this, but the simple thing we can do. get national standards for use of force, use of force training, but you can use personality tests to weed out bad candidates and make sure the officers on the force get the help they need to deal with the trauma of being a cop in a tough city. >> one small part of a very important large conversation. always good to talk to you, thanks. >> thank you. coming up, the latest nbc news/wall street journal poll that has hillary clinton leading donald trump by nine points. president obama never had that lead against mitt romney in 2012. is this a sign that trump campaign is in serious trouble or is he mounting a comeback? that's next. ♪ i'm going to make this as simple as possible for you. you can go ahead and stick with that complicated credit card
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polls is whether it's single or double digits. the latest national polls have her between 9 and 15 points ahead of donald trump. in battleground states it's between 6 points in florida and 16 in new hampshire. there are two ways to read these polls. this ought to be the the heart of the post convention bounce when analysts preach caution. on the other hand, trump had a tough week of his own make iing. moments ago, clinton addressed the one issue that's dogged her entire political life, trust. >> i take this seriously. don't doubt that. i take it seriously. it did you want make me feel good when people say those things. i recognize i have work to do. >> larry is director of the uva center for politics. is this a snapshot in time too early in the campaign to really tell us anything or is this a big hole that donald trump has to really dig himself out of? >> it's more the latter.
it's a big hole that trump has to dig himself out of. i'm not saying the lead is going to be maintained at this level, chris. this is the peak of clinton's bounce and the reaction to trump's controversies. but i would say the polling average is 6.7% clinton lead. i think it's probably about 5 or 6 points, once you have the receiving that will take place. >> do we have any historical precedent for what we're seeing here. we were talking earlier that president obama didn't come to this kind of lead until october. >> but remember the polling averages will go up and down with different events and different circumstances. ly tell you one historical norm that ought to be paying attention to, no candidate who has clearly won the convention bounce story has lost the election. >> really?
>> there's simply no question. we haven't had enough good polling for that many election cycles, but the ones that we have when a candidate wins the bounce war, which is what hillary clinton has done, that candidate has gone on to win. sometimes it tightens, but it doesn't matter. if you get 270 electoral votes or 538 you're still president for four years. >> a lot of fascinating parts to this poll. donald trump is polling 1% with african-americans. in spite of comments that a lot of national security folks have raised questions about, it's 43 to 42%. he's within a point of hillary clinton on issues of homeland security and it is terrorism. and then there's this. he is down now 1 point with men, which is a big rebound for her.
what do you attribute that to? >> again, hillary clinton's convention bounce and all of trump's controversies, particularly the fight that he ended up picking with the gold star family. really monumentally dumb. but it's not going to last. hillary clinton will lose men. donald trump will lose women. but i'll predict to you flatly right now hillary clinton is going to carry women by a lot more than donald trump is going to carry men. that makes a big difference in the end because women, after all, are 53% of the electorate. >> university of virginia's larry sabado, good to see you. the excite mement is buildi until the opening ceremony of the olympics in rio. you're watching msnbc live, stay with us.
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the 2016 rio olympics with the opening ceremony a few hours away. an estimated 1 billion people expected to tune in. you can watch it live on nbc tonight. watch the games on all the networks of nbc including right here on msnbc. thank you for watching this hour of msnbc live. i'm chris jansing. right now, more news with one of those 1 billion who will be watching tonight with great enthusiasm. >> i hear you gloating. you know i'm an olympics superfan. i have olympic fever and she's leaving to get on the plane roigt now. but i'm going to be tuning in. >> as soon as you're done, you're going to go pack for me. >> i love packing. good afternoon. we're going to begin this hour with breaking news. new video has just been released showing that deadly shooting of an unarmed teen by chicago police officers that took place last week. an autopsy showed the 18-year-old was shot in the
back. our team is following the breaking developments of this story. i want to go first to tammy leitner live in chicago. we first have to warn viewers. the video is graphic so walk us through exactly what happened on july 28th. >> we just got this video an hour ago. they released nine clips. these clips are from the dash cams of the police cruisers and the body cameras. it really shows you what happened in the moments leading up to the shooting, during the shooting and after the shooting. this first clip is when police identified the suspect paul o'neill in a stolen car. he drives by them, nearly hits them and one of the officers gets out and starts shooting. let's watch that clip. >> so the next clip of