tv All In With Chris Hayes MSNBC September 14, 2016 12:00am-1:01am PDT
>> the president lets it fly in philly, dressing down donald trump. >> he won't let you on his golf course. he wasn't going to let you buy any of his condos. now suddenly this guy's going to be your champion? >> tonight barack obama's impassioned rallying cry, and why he was touting the single-biggest election headline of the week. >> republicans don't like to hear good news right now. >> plus "the washington post" on the latest explosive reporting on the foundation. did they flip the deplorable script. >> hillary clinton wasn't talking about that bad man. >> and new questions about donald trump's health to be answered by dr. oz? >> i'm not going to ask you a question she doesn't want to have answered. >> "all in" starts right now. good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. keeping an eye on donald trump who is giving a speech on maternity leave, of all things,
which if you're surprised, this campaign continues to surprise every day. we start tonight with some breaking news. hillary clinton's campaign announcing she'll return to the campaign trail on thursday after taking three days off to recover from her well publicized bout with pneumonia. police have arrested a man accused of hitting several anti-trump protesters during a donald trump rally last night. they also issued a warrant for a different man who is accused of punching what local news reports identified as a 69-year-old woman outside the rally. she told a reporter she was there protesting trump as well and appears in the photo to be wearing an oxygen mask. after a whirlwind few days focused on hillary clinton's health and donald trump's deplorables today brought the single-most important piece of election news this week, possibly the entire campaign and for once that had nothing to do with either candidate. u.s. census bureau announcing that real median household income increased 5.2% up to $56,516.
it's the first increase in household income since 2007 before the great recession, the fastest growth on record since the census bureau started keeping track almost -- more than 40 years ago. these aren't just numbers. they make a real dins. the average household earned nearly $2800 more last year than it did the year before. and if you can distill the trump's campaign's message down to a single idea -- america is a disaster, everything is terrible, hillary clinton will only make it worse and you must vote for trump because, and i'm quoting, i alone can fix it. >> and think of this, median household income has fallen by more than $4,000. $4,000. we have people standing in this room who made more money in real wages years ago than they're making today. they didn't work as hard.
they were a hell of a lot younger. it should be the other way around. and we lost our jobs, we lost our companies, and we're not going to let it happen anymore. we're going to get our jobs back. we're going to bring our companies back. >> today's news, and more specifically and importantly, the reality reflects undercuts trump's doom and gloom message. while clinton wasn't on the campaign trail today to point that out, she happened to have the perfect surrogate out there making the case the economy is thriving. the time had come for him to pass her the baton. >> republicans don't like to hear good news right now, but it's important just to understand is a big deal. more americans are working. more have health insurance. incomes are rising. poverty is falling. and gas is $2 a gallon. i didn't even -- thank you for
reminding me. thanks, obama. >> crucially the economic gains we're seeing aren't just going to people at the top of the economic spectrum which has been the case for most of the recovery. it was the lowest earning americans on the left who are seeing the biggest growth in percentage terms in their real household income. in a speech today, the president didn't just make a case for clinton and continued democratic party policies, he also mocked trump for casting himself as a champion of the working class. >> let's talk about mr. trump. he's not really a plans guy, a fact guy. he calls himself a business guy. but america's got a lot of businessmen and women who succeeded without hiding their tax returns or leaving a trail of lawsuits or workers who
didn't get paid. people feeling like they got cheated. i mean, look, you know, i keep on reading this analysis that, well, you know, trump's got support from like working folks. really? like this is the guy you want to be championing working people? this guy who spent 70 years on this earth showing no concern for working people. this guy's suddenly going to be your champion? i mean, he spent most of his life trying to stay as far away from working people as he could. and now this guy's going to be the champion of working people? i mean, he wasn't going to let you on his golf course. he wasn't going to let you buy in his condo.
and now suddenly this guy's going to be your champion? >> here with me now michelle goldberg, a columnist for slate and a reporter for "the new york times." we've got donald trump making a speech tonight on policy. there's been a real policy turn from donald trump which has been interesting. he was quoted by saying it's just bureaucrats putting together paper. it doesn't matter. how kellyanne conway saying she's proud of how policy focused the campaign is. ultimately this question is due to how much of the fundamentals matter. if you're looking for fundamentals, this saz important as fundamentals news gets. >> this is very good news to working families. it does undercut trump. but the gains in these are not wildly -- are somewhat narrow. rural parts of the country, which are trump parts are not feeling it. things are not as good as they were at the peak of the 1990s. the question is who is feeling
which part of it? who is feeling the good news and the bad news and how do they vote? >> nobody changes their vote on the basis of these census figures, right? >> no, no. >> so if your own situation feels very precarious, you know, and u have a lot of anxiety, maybe it could ease your anxie a little bit but people are basing these things about their situation and their neighbor's situation. so the kind of unofficial slogan of a lot of this campaign has been nothing matters, right? and people say that every time trump says something that doesn't disqualify him people say nothing matters. this is the test. will this puncture trump's message of kind of america in freefall? or does truly no empirical fact kind of puncture the bubble that he and his are living in? and i think he's trying to extend into as many swing voters as possible. i guess that's what matters.
>> the question here, right, so you have the president coming out being -- first of all, you've also got hillary clinton sort of on the bench because of the pneumonia diagnosis, then you've got -- i think the president was pretty happy to be out on this day when the news came out. it was suffused through his entire bearing. someone yelled $2 gas. it reminded me of the fact that i was going back through dumb little campaign micro controversies, someone reminded me in 2008 when gas was high that you should check that your tires are fully inflated because it actually reduces gas mileage. there was a point when john mccain was handing out tire gauges. gas was $4 a gallon then. this message about who is in and who is out ultimately looks like the defining fundamental structural part of this campaign. we've got polling out of maine, which is not doing very well, saying that the race is tight. we've got virginia and colorado, states that should have been
swing states that look like runaways for hillary clinton. >> there are right-leaning swing states that are in doubt for trump and left-leaning swing states that are for hillary clinton. and as everyone says, the sense of security the next paycheck, the last, is the future going to be better than the past? the real big sensations on what people based a vote on and it's not the gdp or the average household income. >> not just the next paycheck, because trump voters are actually doing pretty well and doing well relative to voters relative to sanders voters, but when in public opinion surveys their kids aren't doing well, their communities are in disrepair. that kind of doesn't change because the fundamentals are improving. >> i want to play this bit of sound because they're talking about child care tonight, maternity leave. there's the sound of trump talking about how he views men and women's roles in caring for
a baby. i wanted to get michelle and your response. >> you're going to be a new father again in the near future. >> i am. i am. >> do you actually change diapers? >> no, i don't do that. >> not one, right? >> no. i don't do it. it's not my thing. i'm a good father, but that's not my thing. >> it's nobody's thing. yeah, but it's no one's thing. >> yeah, but some women -- well, it's up to the women. there's a lot of women out there that demand that the husband act like the wife and, you know, there's a lot of husbands that listen to that. >> you hire one person to be the diaper changer? >> no, melania is going to be fantastic. she's going to be a fantastic mother. and by the way, if i had a different type of wife, i probably wouldn't have a baby. because that's just not my thing. i'm really like a great father, but certain things you do and certain things you don't and it's just not for me. >> i think we've seen the fact
that it's interesting, this is not family leave, this is specifically maternity leave. >> the problem with the economy right now is that it's actually set up for families who are kind of arranged their duties the way that trump does. >> division of labor. >> and we look at that and it seems like so incredibly retro, right? it's almost kind of kitsch, what a chauvinist he is. even if it's trump, fine. trump has incredibly retrograde ideas about women in his personal life. to me, he's incredibly retrograde about working women in his public life. none of us will remember how disgusting he found it when somebody was pumping breastmilk during a deposition. this is someone who is hostile to women when he has to work with them, working mothers. >> take a look as donald trump continues to lay out his policy agenda in this area. take a listen.
>> this solution will receive strong bipartisan support. do you agree with it? do you think? when you go to the other side, they'll be ok? i'm hearing they will be. we'll get them to be okay, right? and we'll be completely self-financing. i think you will. you'll have bipartisan support. by recapturing fraud and improper payments in the unemployment insurance program, we can provide six weeks of paid maternity leave to any mother with a newborn child whose employer does not provide the benefit. >> joining me now, betsy stevenson, former member of president obama's council. we were lucky to get the soundbite, live, when we went to it. that's the tweet-length version of this policy. you know, my first thought when i woke up this morning and saw they were rolling this out, we have bipartisan contenders on maternity leave. what's your thoughts?
>> i do think we're moving in the right direction. this is a republan candidate standing up and saying we're going to need to provide some form of paid family leave. unfortunately, i think he's proposing the policy that maybe we should have been talking about 30 or 40 years ago. but today we actually in many families if not most families have both men and women who are active care-takers so providing a policy for paid maternity leave without any plan for fathers to take an active role and to be able to take time off to do that is really absurd in 2016. he won't get bipartisan support on that. >> i want to stop you there. because there's a distinction. hillary clinton has a paid leave portion to her website, also child care, but the way this is talked about in hillary clinton's campaign and the democratic policy is paid family leave and one of the things i read that i thought was interesting was there's evidence if you make it just maternity leave you end up hurting women
in the workplace because employers think to themselves oh, man, i'm going to have to deal with this problem of them taking leave whereas paid family leave does a better job of sort of leveling the playing field in that respect? >> that's absolutely true. one of the great things about being the last developed country to implement any kind of paid maternity, paternity, family leave is we've learned a lot from other countries. when you only offer maternity leave, two things happen. one employers become more skeptical and more likely to discriminate against women because they think that they're going to disappear for maternity leave and they don't have that fear for men. but the second thing is that families make that decision that women are more likely to take time off because they're the ones whose time off is funded, then that perpetuates inequality within the household which makes it harder for women to play an equal role in the workforce. that problem reinforces itself over the next 18 years.
>> do you think -- can you imagine a universe in which there is actual -- i mean, i joked today that now that we have some bipartisan buy-in for the general principle, even if hillary clinton wins, obviously, republicans will help her get this policy done. i was sort of tongue in cheek. but do you think that's a plausible scenario? >> the country has moved very sharply and very quickly towards the vast majority of people supporting a plan for paid family leave. and i think it is the smart thing and the right thing for republicans to get on board. i do think we're going to need to come up with a truly bipartisan way to get the legislation done. but i do not think that trump has proposed anything that's close to bipartisan. we haven't even talked about his absurd plan to pay for it. but i do think that we're going to move to where there's going to have to be bipartisan support because both republican and democratic voters want paid family leave. >> all right. thanks for your time.
i should note that president- president? donald trump mentioned in his speech that hillary clinton does not have a policy on this. she very much does. it's right there. this is on early childhood education where she talked about paid leave and there's also child care all of which are themes tonight. those have been laid out by hillary clinton i think back in june 2015, if i'm not mistaken. still to come, some professional republicans are starting to think donald trump just might win this thing and they're panicking. they're freaking out. details ahead. plus breaking news, the new york attorney general opens an inquiry into the trump foundation. this after explosive new reporting on trump's charitable giving. i'll talk to the reporter that's been tracking this in just two minutes.
we've been concerned that the trump foundation may have been engaged in impropriety from that point of view. we've had correspondence with them and didn't make a big deal out of it or hold a press conference but we've been looking into the trump foundation and making sure it complies with the laws that govern charities in new york. >> we should note the attorney general and trump are at odds politically. the new york attorney general is already suing him over trump university. "washington post" reporter david farenthold's pursuit of trump's charitable giving, something president obama referenced today. >> one candidate's family foundation has saved countless lives around the world. the other candidate's foundation took money other people gave to his charity and then bought a six-foot-tall painting of himself. i mean, he had the taste not to go for the ten-foot version.
>> now, that anecdote comes from "the washington post" investigation of david farenthold that began with a simple question, what are the charities that donald trump has given money to? farenthold has been stonewalled. so his investigation included calling charity after charity after charity trying to find a donald trump donation. the post has called 326 charities with connections to trump asked if they received a gift of the nominee's own money. in 2008 that search turned up one gift. in 2009, worth less than 10,000. the police athletic league children's charity in new york. yesterday a big break in the case when mike pence went on national television and said this. >> anyone who knows about donald trump and his career knows that this is a man who has given away tens of millions to charitable causes throughout the course of his business life. >> as of now, there's still no proof of tense of millions of charitable giving personally by donald trump.
that became very apparent again today when trump's campaign manager was asked about it. >> do you stand by the tense of millions number? >> donald trump has been incredibly general russ over the course of his life. >> with his own money. >> with his own money and his foundation's money, which is his own money. >> no the foundation's money is other people's money. >> okay. but he's been incredibly generous. >> donald trump has not given his own money to his own foundation since 2008. nbc universal made a $500,000 donation to the trump foundation in 2012. joining me now "washington post" political reporter david farenthold. all right, let's start with -- forget the foundation for a second. the beginning of this was a simple question, donald trump's a billionaire, a rich guy. rich people tend to give money to charity whether they're generous or not, just a thing that rich people do. what charities has he given to? and you've been stonewalled and been reverse engineering it by just calling charities and you
got basically bupkis so far. >> he said i give millions, where did it go? and they don't give us an answer. so then we started looking. let's try to prove donald trump right. we started looking at charities that he seemed close to. people he'd given trump foundation money to, has gone to their galas, praised them on twitter. i've called those groups. that's how we started. >> you're 1 for 326 on that, am i right about that? >> yes. >> can you show us the notepad. you've been tracking this on this weirdly iconic notepad. that's the no, never. then there's the foundation that people are surprised to learn is other people's money and also right now is in a little bit of hot water over pam bondy and maybe some of the other stuff you reported. let's talk about the painting first. you talked about this a bit, but how did foundation money from
other people end up in a painting of donald trump? >> well, in 2007, donald trump goes to a party at mar-a-lago, his club in florida. and the entertainment for the night -- this was a charity gala, a gala put on by a charity. the entertainment for the night is a speed painter. he paints one painting every five minutes. a frenetic show. in the end he flips the painting over, you find out who he's been painting. boom, it's donald trump. then they auction off the painting. nobody but melania trump bids. $10,000. nobody else is challenging her for this painting. the auctioneer said, hey, you should really bid $20,000. you're melania trump. she gets the six-foot-tall painting of donald trump. later when the time comes to pay, donald trump pays using the trump foundation's money. so he used money meant for charity in 2007, almost all of the money in that foundation was from other people. anyway, once it goes in, it's supposed to be used for charity. he uses it to buy a painting for
himself, which is against the law. you can't use your charity's money to buy items for yourself. >> now, in terms of clearing all this up, right, this is someone whose financial dealings are complicated. are there documents you could see that would just sort of make all this crystal clear just to clear up this sort of weird inquiry you've now found yourself in? >> yeah. tax returns. donald trump's tax returns presumably would list whatever his charitable donations have been. there are other ways we can do it, too. the trump foundation wants to put out a list. the tax returns would tell us more, but that would tell us something. there's a lot of ways to clear this up. we haven't gotten any of them yet. this is someone who -- say these were $10 billion. you found so far a $10,000 donation out of his own pocket over the last several years. they could just tell you who he's given money to, right? >> they could. and we've asked a number of times including a couple of times in the last few days and we haven't heard it. >> david farenthold.
this shouldn't even be close. if you want higher wages, better benefits, a fair tax code, a bigger voice for workers, stronger regulations on wall street, then you should be voting for hillary clinton. look, i just came from overseas. talk to the other leaders around the world. they don't even understand how this is close.
>> those world leaders the president talked to are not alone in their confusion over the state of the u.s. presidential race. the polls have tightened considerably. hillary clinton's lead now 2.4 points down from a peak of 7.9 points on average after the democratic convention. it has many clinton supporters agonizing that she's leading by a normal margin over a historically abnormal candidate running an abnormal campaign. according to a new nbc news survey monkey poll clinton holds a four-point lead over donald trump but that's barely larger than pesident obama's margin over mitt romney in 2012. clinton's flaws as a candidate play a role, polls show that trump is a different candidate than mitt romney. the fundamentals of this race are largely the same. stu rothenberg points out in "the washington post" there just aren't that many swing voters out there. if you look at actual presidential election results you may be surprised to see how little swing there is when all the votes are counted.
the american electorate demographics increasingly are destiny. show someone's race, gender and class and there's a good chance i can tell you who they're voting for. that helps explain why according to a recent poll the race is statistically tied in arizona and georgia. two normally safe red states where populations have gotten younger and more diverse than 2012. they still favor hillary clinton who is tied or ahead in every single one of the key battleground states. now, it would take something very big to turn that dynamic around. the trump campaign seems to think it's found that think in clinton's basket of deplorables comment.
mike pence landed himself in a bit of hot water for refusing to use the word "deplorable" infamously employed by hillary clinton to describe david duke, former kkk leader and white supremacist seen here at what appears to be a cross burning. pence stipulated that he and trump have denounced duke. a running mate who refers to hillary clinton is not in the name calling process. >> the whole idea that they were trying to make pence, you know, call me names basically and he didn't bite on that was a real positive thing for all of us.
>> duke also took to twitter to expand on his media criticism. quote, fight for the black and mexican interests and you are never deplorable but dare defend the heritage of white people you are so, so, so deplorable. the specter of david duke followed pence all the way to capitol hill today where he attended meetings with republican lawmakers including utah senator mike lee, close ally to ted cruz, who privately urged pence to call duke's racism deplorable, according to lee's spokesperson. later pence faced questions from the press while standing in front of house gop leadership and pretty open about his reasons to avoid using that specific word. >> for all the world, i have no idea why this man keeps coming up. my colleagues know that i believe that civility is essential in a vibrant democracy, but i'm also not going to validate the language that hillary clinton used to describe the american people. look, millions of americans know and frankly you all know hillary
clinton wasn't talking about that bad man. she was talking about people all across this country. >> among the gop lawmakers sharing that podium with pence was louisiana congressman steve scalise who almost lost his post as third ranking house republican when it was revealed he had given a speech to white supremacists in 2002. he was quoted as saying he was like david duke without the baggage. joining me now sam seder. i found this sort of deplorable statement, i like the fact that pence says i won't use that word because it validates what she said, which is, of course, the point. >> yeah. well, that's not the only word in the english language that you can use to describe an avowed racist, right? he could say reprehensible, despicable. look, it's very hard to buy mike pence's argument that he thinks name calling is so destructive
to the democratic process in this country based upon whose ticket he's on. honestly, like a child could figure this out. but certainly david duke is getting the message, and certainly if you go into like the sewer, the swampy pit, you'll see that when they have to distance themselves from a david duke or whatnot -- >> right. >> -- those people rationalize they need to do this because they're getting pressure but we know the real deal. when you refuse so adamantly refuse to attack the individual in that way, you're sending a message. and frankly, look, this is not too dissimilar from what we've seen from paul ryan. all right? paul ryan -- >> vis-a-vis donald trump. >> he will critique the comments, then say i'm not going to be a pundit, then tells hillary clinton she should be ashamed of herself. he has not ever not once said anything directly about donald trump or his character.
he said -- things he said sr. prototype racist, but he's not drawing that connection. and there's a reason why he does that. that's because donald trump's voters are paul ryan's voters and there's a reason why mike pence won't say that about david duke because david duke's people are mike pence voters. >> there's two things happening here. one level you're seeing real partisan sorting happening. the polls show it. clinton's and trump's numbers are going up to normal levels with their party. republicans and democrats. at the same time you've activated this sort of ugly core of we don't know how big they are but white supremacists, neo-nazis, et cetera. now everyone's in the same boat. they always were, right? but all of the distancing from trump has essentially gone away. and so the question of like how this ends up affecting the republican party as a brand becomes pretty interesting. because it used to be, oh, there's trump and then there's
the okay republicans. increasingly those distinctions are getting collapsed. >> they should. >> your argument from the beginning. >> yes. not like he appeared miraculously from the sky and became the nominee. he was elected the republican nominee. his ring has been kissed for years. john boehner said on this network, it's not my job to tell members of my caucus not to push a bill that barack obama is not an american. the republican party has sown these seeds. mike pence should be thanking hurricane hrg for pursuing a tactic of not lumping these people together. talking about giving paul ryan an off ramp. they haven't taken it. it's time to draw the connection here. >> that is a sort of interesting question, as we head into these last 56 days.
sam seder, thanks so much. republicans hoping to lose the white house this november are now worried their candidate might actually win, to sam's point. but first thing one, thing two right after this break. looking sharp, len. who's the lucky lady? i'm going to the bank, to discuss a mortgage. ugh, see, you need a loan, you put on a suit, you go crawling to the bank. this is how i dress to get a mortgage. i just go to lendingtree. i calculate how much home i can afford. i get multiple offers
thing 1 tonight as hillary clinton prepares to return to the campaign trail on thursday after being diagnosed with pneumonia last week, her campaign is vowing to release more of the candidate's medical r0rds. she released a doctor's letter last year citing her specific health history which was noticeable difference from her opponent's astonishingly excellent bill of health written by this man dr. harold bornsteen who said he worked on it for minutes while a limo driver waited outside. he's prepared to release more details including information from a recent physical.
>> he had that physical late last week because he believes that it's important for the public to know what his basic health condition is. and he has said that the doctor is preparing his report and that it will be made available this week. >> and was it with dr. bornstein? >> that i don't know. i was not present for his physical. >> you may not know whether he performed trump's physical but we do know who he has enlisted to analyze his medical records on daytime television and that's thing 2 in 60 seconds.
this last week i took a physical. i'll be releasing, when the numbers come in, hopefully they're going to be good. i think they're going to be good. i feel great. when the numbers come in, i'll be releasing very, very specific numbers. >> that was donald trump vowing to get specific with new medical details. now, we're learning exactly where he'll be revealing those details. the dr. oz show, popular
syndicated talk show in which the star dr. mehmet oz discusses all kinds of revolutionary breakthroughs such as weight loss aids which oz has had to admit before congress does not pass medical muster. half of the information he gave on his program was baseless or wrong. but oz knows what his audience wants. the subject of cancer, quote, is our angelina jolie. we could sell that show every day. he'll be revealing his medical records this thursday. as to what might be revealed, it may not be much. >> it's really his decision. his personal records. i'll ask him pointed questions about his health. >> what if there's embarrassing things? >> i bet you he won't release them. >> it's still his decision? >> the metaphor for me is this a doctor's office, the studio. i won't ask him questions he doesn't want to have answered.
buzzfeed has covered trump on the campaign trail is out with a new piece that details the rash of behind the scenes handwringing among professional republicans as they confront an unnerving new possibility. what if their nominee actually wins the white house? i love this quote. you've got people that are talking donors who are going to give money to trump who think he might inaugurate the end of human life on the planet. not an overstatement. if he wins they won't love it but they won't be facing apocalypse. i mean actual nuclear warfare. what is the mind-set of these folks? >> this extends beyond donors. it's political class operative strategists. >> professional republicans. >> everyone in the gop political class. basically all about self-interest at this point. they believe that they don't have the responsibility themselves to stop trump. they thought up until recently that hillary would have it in the bag, it would be easy that trump would be defeated and they wouldn't have to go out on a
limb and publicly oppose trump because it would hurt their business and hurt their reputations in conservative circles. they're looking at the landscape, getting a little more nervous about the state of the race, they think that trump could win. but the once i talk to are still not quite ready to go on the record for the most part. >> as you can tell, i guess one question is why won't -- i mean, this is really profiles in cowardice. they're giving you these quotes off the record. no accountability to that. >> and i pressed all of them to go on the record and i asked them why and no one had a good answer. some said, look, it won't make a difference if i go on the record, what am i going to say? which is just letting themselves off the hook. at the end of the day he's people are looking out for themselves and they're putting -- what i think is so interesting is they're putting the onus entirely on the democrats. i have a couple of quotes from people saying hillary, this shouldn't be that hard. this should be just an easy election, why can't you stop him? which is kind of funny given that trump just steamrolled republicans at the primary.
>> basically hectoring hillary clinton fr not doing a better job. we also get -- what's up with this buzzfeed story about colin powell today? i'm so confused by this story. buzzfeed has obtained e-mails of colin powell basically calling trump a racist, a threat to the nation, all of these things. there were e-mails to someone, emily miller who used to work for him but buzzfeed has them? >> my colleague obtained them. but this is another example of the same thing. although colin powell has publicly criticized trump, although not in those terms, but this is one of the big problems with how our partisan system is not well suited to handle somebody like trump because -- >> they're on the team. >> people have to play for the team. >> i have said this for a while, that the republican party can absolutely survive and thrive under hillary clinton and it will be destroyed by a donald trump win. >> yes. and that's absolutely believed by everyone i talk to. >> we'll be joined by two professional republicans to discuss exactly that next. xwxexe
everything they thought would happen, everything they invested in bombed out. >> joining me now ben howe, an upcoming film about trump called "the sociopath." republican strategist and still with me at the table is mckay coppins. so my belief is if hillary clinton wins election day the gop will snap back to fighting shape basically the next day and will go into full oppose hillary clinton mode, oppose, oppose, oppose, and be fine and be more or less the kind of the same party we've seen. if donald trump wins, the gop as we know it is over. >> yeah. i think it's the difference of being pushed out into the wilderness and being stranded on mars. you've got two situations, one where we could have our agenda isn't getting pushed for the next four years but we got a shot at getting it pushed in the next eight, ten, 12 years. whereas is trump wins my feeling is based on everything he said,
how uncontrollable he is and he's a bit of sociopath, i think that we'll push ourselves so far out of the american mainstream that we won't be able to win future elections and that hurts conservatism. it really upsets people when i say it that way. people on the right. so the most conservative thing is to vote for hillary clinton? yeah, it is. and that's because there's more than a four-year cycle when it comes to advancing your agenda. you can't just look at the next four years. what do you think about this thesis? >> maybe we're defining the terms wrong. if donald trump wins, he will have redefined the republican party. so it's a little unfair to say the conservatives couldn't win again. he'll have made an entire new, you know, coalition of voters if he wins. that being said, you look at the senate candidates for the republicans running far ahead of him. if he won, there would then almost be a republican party made up of these winning senate
candidates that won in this cycle. >> yeah. >> then donald trump who defines a new coalition. so we're sort of in a no man's land of basically having three parties at that point. >> this is the thing i keep thinking of. if you want to know what the future of a donald trump presidency looks like, take away all of his personality trait that ben i guess is making a movie about and just look at the house. that's a microcosm of what republican governance looks like. and the fact is it's been a disaster. peace, mike drop, i'll go and smoke cigarettes and drink red wine. paul ryan had to be basically dragged into doing it because there isn't the necessary deep consensus of what the party stands for even in the house forgetting donald trump. >> wroi a whole book about this. pretrump there was incredibly angry and divisive debate in the republican party about what the national coalition should be, what they stand for. that was never resolved and the power vacuum that was created was filled by donald trump.
going forward if donald trump wins, look, if trump loses we go through another cycle of those debates and maybe somebody does emerge with a vision that coalesces. if trump wins that debate's over, right? the party is basically over. it's fractured so permanently that it could become a regional party, there could be different coalitions, but it won't be this debate is going to be complete obsolete. >> but let's not forget that the gop is not going to stand up to donald trump. >> right. >> if donald trump does the wrong things, if he embraces the farthest left agenda you can imagine, they're all going to pretend it is the new conservative reverse. that's how they operate. >> someone the other day was joking on twitter, i think it might have been after the maternity leave, this sort of maternity leave started to roll out and there was grumbling among conservatives. is this a long con? can we get him to convince conservatives to like everything?
like climate change is real, like organic food? can donald trump just lead anyone to any belief? >> i like organic food. >> this is the thing i keep coming back to and it's like i just don't have -- what i really try to imagine it. when i just say donald trump's inaugurated president, what's the first hundred days agenda? hillary clinton i've got a pretty good sense. i think immigration would probably go near the top partly because of the way certain promises have been made in a sense that have been teed up, something on climate, you'd have probably a new supreme court justice nominee. i do not know what the first hundred days for donald trump would look like. >> the first hundred days would be basically him on twitter campaigning how democrats aren't doing what they need to do and trying to get mike pence to do his job for him. >> agenda wise, i guess my feeling is the two things i identify the clearest or three things are trade deals,
renegotiate nafta, build the wall, ban muslims. but is paul ryan going to shepherd that through a house? >> that wilderness argument he made in his book might actually be the first hundred days where the different factions within the republican party need to fight it out for that donald trump, you know, legacy, what will that presidency be about. and i don't think we know the answer to that. because i don't think it was resolved in this cycle. so who knows? >> that's also mckay saying there's no constitutional crisis in first hundred days. >> no impeachment trial. >> or impeachment trial. he's got people with the knives out for him on day one. ben, you talk about no one standing up to him. but no one standing up to him, but there's lot os people that would be happy to sink the knife in from the back. >> sure. they talk anonymously right now. they'll keep doing it. >> exactly. thanks for joining us. that's "all in" for this evening. the rachel maddow show starts
>> thanks for joining us at this hour. hillary clinton's presidential campaign just in the last few minutes, they've confirmed that secretary clinton is going to be back on the campaign trail as of thursday. they've now formally announced it will be thursday night in greensboro, north carolina. the campaign says they're accepting rsvps for this event with secretary clinton in greensboro. so now we officially know how much time hillary clinton has had to take off the campaign trail because of this illness that cost her so much trouble at the 9/11 memorial on sunday. her downtime started after that on sunday night. it's going to include monday, tuesday and wednesday. but now we're told by the campaign officially she will be back out there as of thursday. so that's brand-new news as of tonight. also tonight the libertarian party has just announced they're going to have their presidential candidate on the ballot in all 50 states.