tv NBC News Special 2016 Vice Presidential Debate MSNBC October 4, 2016 10:00pm-11:31pm PDT
oying runny nose. better take something. dayquil liquid gels doesn't treat a runny nose. it doesn't? alka-seltzer plus cold and cough liquid gels fight your worst cold symptoms including your runny nose. oh, what a relief it is! and here we are the 9:00 p.m. hour on the east coast officially within the window of starting time. we're told again we have about three minutes of pad time at the top of the hour here. members of the press pool will be entering from both sides of the stage. elaine is right now in the holding period where the networks have started their coverage. she will turn the camera in front of her and welcome the national audience to this debate. both candidates will come out from both sides and shake hands. >> i think it has now become traditional spin tactics that you try to downplay the debating
skill of your candidate. say like oh, my guy has never done this before and the other guy, he's really, really good. you haven't seen them gaming expectations between the two of them. and we just heard about carol pence being on the debate time in high school and very confident in this. we haven't seen those games and i think the expectations are very high. >> someone pointed out kaine has been down, no scheduled events for what, five days? these are both preparers, both students and serious guys? >> right, and the washington lawyer you know is out there playing the opposite number to him. playing pence to him. so he will be very prepared. i do think the question is what will be the advantage of each candidate. i think it's to go after hillary clinton not to go of the trump. he will score, on the other
hand, i think that kaine is not comfortable going after hillary clinton -- trump, so i think he's going to play defense. i expect the offense is going to come from pence tonight and surprise everybody. >> i have a mechanical question about the news media in the filing room and the spin room there, because often what's written there at the event gets to be the first draft of reaction and how these are remembered. is everyone able to see the same within reason split-screen directed coverage that we're able to see in our staudio and folks at home. >> no, i have the advantage of where i'm seeing. i can see the split and i can see the single. i think it might be an option play for everybody. i think the split screen really hurt trump last week and plays an unusual role. and the look of the opponents
have been almost as powerful as the presentation of the speaker. >> i think we called it facial discipline last week. it will be on display again sunday night. >> one of tim kaine's signature thing and you saw one of the smiley face signs with the cocked eyebrow. he has it when he's making a point and when he's listening to something. >> i don't know if mike pence has a tick or a tell like that. >> it' you'r the one talking and when you're the one reacting and sometimes verbal discipline as well. you can see the projector has opened. we'll go down to the room. >> good evening. from long wood university in farmville, virginia and welcome to the first and only vice presidential debate of 2016, i'm
anchor at cbsn and sponsor for cbs news, it's an honor to mo moderate this debate between tim kaine and mike pence, both proud fathers of sons serving in the u.s. marines. there will be 90-minute debate. each segment will lead with a question to both candidates that will have two minutes to answer and then ask a followup question, by coin toss it has been determined that senator kaine will be first for the first question. the audience has greed to only expre
express their enthusiasm at the end of the debate and right now as we introduce senator tim kaine and governor mike pence. [ cheers and applause ] >> gentlemen, welcome. it true is a privilege to be with both of yoof you tight. i would like to start with presidential leadership. 28 years ago tomorrow night lloyd benson said the vice presidential debate was not about the kwaufqualifications a the vice presidency but how if the vice president should have to take over, what about your
qualities and temperment to step into that role. >> elaine, thank you, it is so great to be back at farm vivilf >> 65 years ago barbara johns, walked out of her high school, she made history by protesting school segsegregation, that led the decision that moved us down toward the path of equality. i am so proud to be running with another strong history making woman hillary clinton to be president of the united states i'm proud of her economy that works for all, not those just at the top. being safe in the world not only in the military, but also to battle terrorism and complialim
change. hillary asked me what her test was to be her running mate. she said it is not the signing of a bill or the passing of the bill. it's whether we can make the classroom better for school kids or teachers and she said to me you have been a missionary, a civil rights lawyer, a lieutenant governor and now a u.s. senator i think you will help me figure out this nation so we can always keep in mind that the success we make is the difference in people's lives and that's what i bring to the ticket. but my primary role is to be hillary clinton's right-hand person and strong supporter as she puts together the most historic administration as possible. we trust hillary clinton, my wife and i, and we trust her
with the most important thing in our life, we have a son deployed right now. we trust hillary clinton as commander in chief but the thought of donald trump as commander in chief scares us to death. >> governor pence. >> first of all, thank you elaine and for the university. it is deeply humbling to be here. it's an honor to be here with you as well. i also want to say thanks to everyone who is looking in tonight. who understands what an enormously important time this is in the life of our nation. for the last seven and a half years we've seen america's place in the world weakened. an economy sfietifled by more ts and health care reform that's come to be known for obamacare,
so i also want to thank donald trump. i grew you have with a corn field in my backyard. my grandfather immigrated to this country about my son's age. my mom and dad build everything that matters in a small town in southern irndiana, they raised family, and i dreamt of somehow representing my hometown in washington d.c. but never imagined i would be governor of the state the state, let alone, here, so to answer your question i would hope that if the responsibility ever fell to me in this role that i would meet it with the way that i'm going to meet the responsibility should i be elected the vice president of
the united states that's to be a lifetime of experience, a lifetime of growing up in a small town where i've served in the congress of the united states, where i've led a great state that works in the great state of indiana, i would hope and frankly i would pray to be able to meet that moment of that lifetime of experience. >> senator kaine, on the campaign trail you praised secretary clinton's character including her commitment to public service yet 60% of voert voters don't think she's trustworthy. is it because they have concerns about her e-mail? >> do they have a passion in their life that showed up before they were in public life and have they held on to that passion throughout their life regardless of whether they were in office or not succeeding or faing? hillary clinton has that passion from a time as kid in a
methodist youth group in the subesu suburbs of chicago, senator -- secretary of state it's always been about putting others nifir and that's a sharp contrast from donald trump. he always puts himself first, he built his career in the words of one of his campaign staffers, off the little guys and started with mexicans, who he has called rapist and criminals and pursued the outrageous lies that president obama wasn't born in the united states. it is so -- to think where an african-american could not be the ptresident of the united
states. >> you have said that donald trump is thoughtful, compassionate, 60% feel he is not -- why do so many americans think he is too erratic. >> you would really know more ant an insult-driven campaign. during the tenure of hillary clinton's state we see the middle east literally spinning out of control, watching hour-by-hour and today syria is the failure of weak foreign policy that hillary clinton helped lead this administration and create. the newly em boldened russia. >> you guys loved -- >> with the approach. >> >> gentlemen, we're going to
get to russia in just a moment but i do want to get back to the question at hand. >> these guys have praised vladimir putin. >> we do have that coming up but in the meantime the question is about your running mate, why the disconnect? >> where we've weakened the place of america in the world, the campaign of hillary clinton and tim kaine has been an avalanche of insults. donald trump has built a business through hard times and good times. he's brought an extraordinary business acumen. >> and paid few taxes and lost a billion dollars a year. >> but why the disconnect with your running mates? >> there's a reason why people question the trustworthiness of hillary clinton and that's because they're paying attention. the reality is when she was secretary of sate, senator, come
on, she had a clinton foundation accepting contributions from foreign countries. >> >> isn't -- isn't this a discussion. >> the clinton foundation accepted contributions from foreign donors while she was secretary of state. she had a private server. >> now i get to -- >> senator, please you have an opportunity to respond. >> governor pence doesn't think the world is going to say it's everybody's fault. >> do you? >> when hillary clinton became secretary of state do you know that osama bin lauden was alive. >> yes. >> do you know that iran was racing toward a nuclear weapon? under her leadership she was
some part of the national public safety team that went after bin lauden and wiped him off the face of the earth. worked with tough negotiations to eliminate. >> eliminate? >> yes, and right now we have 15,000. >> and iraq has been othver runy isis because hillary clinton failed to negotiate. hillary clinton failed to renegotiate a status of forcers agreement. >> that is incorrect. >> gentlemen, i would like to move on to the economy. >> and over run areas. >> president bush said we would leave in 2011 and they wouldn't
give us protection for our troops, and guess what is a nation where they don't want our troops to stay -- >> many people in the country are wondering about the economy. according to a responsible federal budget neither of your economic plans will reduce the $19 trillion gross national debt. in fact both would contribute to it. are you concerned that growing debt could add to the disaster of the country, governor pence? >> i think of this past administration which hillary clinton was a part we've almost doubled the national debt is atrocious. i'm very proud i come from a state that works, state of indiana has balanced budgets,
made investments in education and infrastructure around still have a balance of $2 billion in the bank. and he tried to raise taxes by about $4 billion but i think he's a very sffitting running me for hillary clinton. because in the wake where american families are struggling in the economy under the weight of obamacare and the war on coal and the stifling avalanche, hillary clinton and tim kaine want more of the same. they are add indicating a trillion dollars in tax increase, i get that. you tried to raise them here and were unsuccessful. more of the same on coal and more on obamacare and even
former bill clinton calls obamacare. -- donald trump and i have a plan to get this economy moving again just the way it worked in the 1980s, just the way it, w d worked in the 1960s, small businesses and family farms ending the war on coal, it is hurting jobs and economy, and repealing obamacare lock stock and barrel. and all the bills that barack obama has signed that are stifling and put it on top of trade deals that will get america working first and when you get the economy growing, elaine, that's when you can deal with the national debt. when we get back to 3 and a half
to 4% growth, we will meet our nation's needs at home and abroad and will have the ability to bring down the national debt. >> senator kaine. >> there's a choice, do you want your hired president in hillary clinton or do you want a you're fired president in donald trump? h i think that's not such a hard choice. hillary and i have a choice on the table that's a you're hired. first thing we do is invest and manufacture infrastructure and research in clean energy of tomorrow. second thing invest in our work force from pre-k education, to great teachers to debt free college and tuition free for families that make less than $125,000 a year. by paying women equal pay for equal work. fourth starting small busies --
business, fifth, we have a tax plan to target individuals and small businesses. the trump plan is a you're fired plan. there's two key elements to it. first donald trump said wages are too high and both donald trump and mike pence think we ought to eliminate the federal minimum wage. mike pence voeted against it, ad he has been a one-man bull work for minimum increase in indiana. and the other is for tax breaks for people that make more than a million dollars. that's exactly what we did ten years ago and put the country into the deepest recession since the 1930s.
the trump plan would cost 3.5 million jobs. why would donald trump do this? because his tax plan helps him and if he would give his tax returns like he said he would we would see how his economic plan is really a trump first plan. >> the new york times released part of mr. trump's 1995 tax return and reported he could have avoided paying federal income taxes for years and said that -- donald trump said that he brilliantly used the laws to avoid the tax. does that seem fair to you? >> i've seen a lot of pre-done lines. what you all just heard out there is more taxes $2 trillion is more spending, more deficits,
more debt, more government and if you think that's all working then you look at the other side of the table. the truth of the matter is the policies of this administration, which hillary clinton and senator kaine want to continue have run this economy into the ditch. we're in the -- >> creating 50 million new jobs? >> there are more people living in poverty. >> and the median income improved drastically between 2014 and 2015. >> honestly senator you can roll out the numbers and the sunny h side. people in scranton no different or in fort wayne. the answer is not more taxes. >> but not to giveaway tax relief to the folks at the top. i am interested whether he will defend his running mate's not releases taxes. >> the question is whether it seems fair to you that mr. trump
said he brilliantly used the law to pay as little tax as legally possible. >> the this is probably the difference between hillary clinton and senator kaine and god bless you for it, career public servants, donald trump is a career businessman, those tax returns that came out publicly this week showed he faced some pretty tough times, but he used what's called net operating loss. we have a tax code, senator, that is designed to encourage sbr enter preneuroship. he used the tax in a brilliant
way. >> how do you know that? you haven't seen his tax returns? >> because he's created a -- business. >> he has created tens of thousands of jobs and paid taxes. the only issue is that hillary clinton is going to raise taxes. >> donald trump started this in 2014 and said if i run, i will absolutely release my taxes. he has broken his promise and he stood on the stage last week and when hillary said you haven't been paying your taxes he said that's smart. so it's smart not to pay for the veterans, it's smart not to pay for the with teachers. >> senator, do you take deductions? >> i do. >> governor pence had to show his tax returns to show he was
qualified to be vice president. donald trump hmust give the public his tax returns to show he is qualified to be president. >> donald trump has filed over 100 pages of financial disclosure which is what the law requires, senator he is going to release his tax returns when the audit is over. >> -- when he was under audit. if you can't meet if nixon standards. >> gentleman, the people at home cannot understand either of you when you speak over each other. >> in 18 years when the social security trust funds run out of money, estimating your benefits could be cut by as much as
$7,500 a year, what would your administration do to prevent this cut? >> first we're going to protect the social security, it happened at a time when you would work your whole life, your whole life raising your kids being a little league coach and being a sunday school teacher and retire, and we have to keep it so vent and we will keep it solvent and like adjusting the tax cap upward to do that. here is what hillary clinton and i will not do, i want to make this plain, we will never ever engage in a risky scheme to privatize are social security. donald trump says social security is a ponzi scheme. even after president bush
stopped pushing for it governor pence kept pushing for it. we're going to stand up against efforts to privatize it and going forward focussing primarily on the payroll tax cap. >> i'll give you an opportunity to respond. >> thanks, elaine. there they go again. all we have said that we are going to meet our obligations to our seniors. >> go read the book. >> that's what this campaign is really about, senator and this is the old scare tactic that they roll out and scare the s n senio seniors, there was a question you asked a little bit earlier that i have to go back to. look you're running with hillary clinton who wants to raise taxes by $2 trillion and you say you're going to keep zps. donald trump and i are going to
cut taxes so we can meet the obligations of social security & medicare. if we stay on the path that your party has us on we're going to be in a mountain range of debt and we're going to face hard choices -- >> gentlemen, i want to move on now. >> he asked the question about debt and the debt explosion on the trump plan is much different than the hillary clinton side. >> to law enforcement and race relation. law enforcement and race lel relations, after the dallas shootings, the police chief said we're asking cops to do too much. every societal failure, and ask the cops to solve it i. not enough funding, let's give it to the cops. do we ask too much of the police officers in this country and how do you address the chief's concern? >> i think that's a fair concern. i think we do put a lot of
pressure on the shoulders of the police. when i came in we had a very high homicide rate. we reduced our homicide rate nearly in half then when i was governor we worked really hard and did something we really wanted to do, we cracked the top ten safest states because we worked together. here is what i learned as a mayor and a governor the way you make communities safer and police safer is you build bonds between the community and the police force, bonds of understanding, then when they feel kofcomfortable and when th gap narrows it's safer for the kmun communities and for the police. there are some other models that don't work, an overly aggressive
more militarized police. it polar rises the police and the community. here is what we will, focus on community policing and hillary clinton has rolled out a mental health reform package that she worked with on law enforcement professional fs and stop the sko scorge of gun violence. we learned through virginia tech that through that painful situation that gaps in the background check could have been prevented. >> one of those killed was a guy, a holocaust survivor, he
survived the holocaust and the soviet union taking over and he was a professor at virginia tech and couldn't survive that. we will work on background checks and that will make us safer. >> my uncle was a career cop on the downtown beat in chicago. he was my hero growing up. when we would go up, my three brothers and i would marvel at my uncle when he would come out side arm at his side. police officers are the best of us, men, women, white, african-american, latino, hispanic, they put their lives on the line every day and at the risk of agreeing with you community policing is a great idea. it's worked in a hoosier state.
and we fully support that. donald trump and i are going to make sure that law enforcement has the tools to be able to restore law and order to the communities and cities of this nation, it's probably why the 330,000 members of the fraternal order of the police endorsed donald trump because they see his commitment to them and his commitment to law and order but they also hear the badmouthing that comes from the people that seize upon tragedy in the wake of police shootings as a reason to use a broad brush to accuse law enforcement of implicit bias or institutional racism and that really has got to stop. i mean when an african-american police officer in charlotte named brantley vincent an all-star player who went to liberty university in the state
followed his dad into law enforcement joined the force in charlotte in 2014 was involved in a police action shooting that claimed the life of keith lamonte scott. it was a tragedy, we mourn with those who morning, we grieve with those whorieve and saddened at the loss of life, but hillary clinton refer todre that as implicit bias. when she was asked a week ago, her only answer was that there's implicit bias in everyone in the united states i just think what we ought to do is stop seizing on these moments of tragedy, we have to assure the public that we'll have a full an complete transparent investigation when there's a loss of life, but senator, please, enough of this seeking every opportunity to
demean law enforcement broadly by making the accusation of implicit bias. >> people shouldn't be afraid to bring up implicit bias. >> i'm not afraid to bring this up. >> we would agree this is a heartbreaking example. the guy that was skilled in a local worker in a school, and killed for no apparent reason. when folks investigated it. philando castile, they found he had been stopped 30 or 40 times before that incident. and african and americans and latinos get sentenced at
different rates, but those who say we should not be able to bring up and talk about bias in the system. >> when african-american police officers involved in a police action shooting involving an african-american why would hillary clinton accuse that african-american police officer of implicit bias. >> i can't believe you are making the suggestions -- >> i did not make that statement! your friend who is african-american recently spoke on the senate floor and said he was stopped seven times by law enforcement in one year. >> a u.s. senator. >> he said i have felt the ang g anger and frustration and sadness that you're being targeted for nothing more than your race what you would you say to senator scott?
>> i respect senator scott and he's a close friends. we need to reform criminal justice. i worked when i was in congress on the second chance act. we have got to do a better job recognizing and correcting the errors in the system that do reflect on institutional bias and contributory negligenrimina donald trump and i are saying is not have the reflex of assuming the worst of men and women in law enforcement. we truly believe that -- it is not a place. >> so what would you say to senator scott? >> law enforcement truly are people that put they're lives on the line every single day. but what i would suggest to you is we need to assert a stronger leadership to support law
enforcement. you just heard senator kaine reject stop and frisk, i would sub suggest that the families that live in our inner cities -- >> haelaine, if i can jump in. look, criminal justice is about respecting the law and being respected by the law so there is a fund mental respect issue here and i just want to talk about the tone from the top. donald trump has called medication ramexicans rapist, criminals and slobs, and he attacked an indiana born federal judge and said he was unqualified to hear a federal lawsuit because his parents were ameri mexican, he went after john mccain saying that he wasn't a hero because he was a pow.
>> and rejected that president obama was not a u.s. citizen. you can't have somebody at the top who demeans every group that he talks about and again, i cannot believe that governor pence will drive the insult driven campaign that donald trump has run. >> immigration, your running mates have both said undocumented immigrants who have committed violent crimes should be deported. what would you tell the millions of undocumented immigrants who have not committed violent crimes? >> governor pence. >> donald trump has laid out a plan. once and for all, we have been talking it to death for 20 years. we have been talking about open borders, amnesty, all the things that are driving wages down fl this country, senator and also too often with criminal aliens in the country it's bringing
heartbreak, but donald trump has a plan that he laid out in arizona, that will deal systemically with illegal immigration beginning with border security and internal enforcement. probably why the first time in history their union actually endorsed donald trump as the next president of the united states because they know they need help to enforce the laws of this country and donald trump has laid out a prior to remove criminal illegal aliens and people who have over stayed their visas and once we have accomplished that it will strengthen our economy and country and then we will deal with those that remain, but i have to tell you i was listening to the avalanche of insults coming out of senator kaine moments ago -- >> these were. >> hold on, it is my time. >> it is.
>> i forgive you. >> he said ours is an insult driven campaign? >> did you just hear that? if donald trump said all the things you said he said and the way he said you said them he still wouldn't have a fraction of the insults that the hillary clinton level when she said that half of our supporters are a basket of deplorables that they were irredeemable and she went one of the another ism on millions of americaamericans, w believe we can end illegal immigration once and for all, so senator, this insult-driven campaign, that's small potatoes compared to hillary clinton calling half of donald trump's supporters a basket of deplorabl deplorables. >> you know the very next say
she said you know what i shouldn't have said that. >> gentlemen, please. >> that's right, now we're even. look for donald trump apologizing for saying mccain he wasn't a hero, for calling women disgusting, did donald trump apologize for taking after a twitter war and making fun of her weight? did he apologize for saying that half of african-americans are living in h eshlell, you will l in vain for donald trump every apologizing for these. donald trump believes in deportation nation. you have to pick your choice, hillary and i want a bipartisan choice keeping families together that's the top goal. second that will help focus
efforts on those who are violent, third more border control and fourth provide a path to citizenship, pay taxes work and that's our proposal. donald trump proposes to deport 16 million people 11 million who are here without documents and both want to get rid of birthright citizenship, they want to eliminate that that's another 4.5 million people. they want to go house to house, school to school, business to business and kick out 16 million people and i cannot believe -- >> that's nonsense. >> i cannot believe. >> that's nonsense. >> i cannot believe that he would support his running mate's claim. >> we have something called immigration and customs
enforcement. >> so you like -- >> senator, that's nonsense. when you just heard is they have an plan for open borders, they call it comprehensive reform on capitol hill. it's amnesty and one of the last things he mentioned was border security. that's how washington always plays it. we'll do this, and we'll do that and eventually -- >> donald trump said a nation without borders is not a nation. he is committed to restoring the borders -- >> will so how would millions of these undocumented immigrants be removed? >> i think it begins with border security not ends with border security. but not only build a wall underground and in the air.
but he said the focus has to be on illegal immigrants. we just had a conversation about the violence that's on our cities the reality is that there's heartbreak and tragedy that has struck our families because of people that came into this country illegally are now involved in illegal activity, and we don't have the resources or the will to deport them systemically, donald trump says we're going to move them out. people who have over stayed their visas we're going to enforce the law in this country and have more personnel in order to do that and donald trump has made it clear once we have done all of those things that we're going to reform the immigration system that we have where people can come into this country and that's the order that you should do it border security, and senator i'll work with you when you go back to the senate i
promise you, work to reform the immigration system. >> i look forward to working in whatever capacities that we serve? but he's trying to fuzz up, he looked the audience in the eye and said we're building a wall and said "they will all be gone" they will all be gone and this is one of those that you can just go to the tape on it and see what donald trump said. and to add to it and to add to it and to add to it. we are a nation of immigrants. mike pence and my family descended from immigrants, maybe some not so graeat things have been said about the irish, but when donald trump says mexicans are rapist, criminals and -- when he said a judge was unqualified to hear a case
because his parents are mexican, i can't imagine how you can defend that. >> do you think the world today is a safer or more dangerous place than it was eight years a ago, has the terrorist threat increased or decreased? >> the it habs decreased because osama bin lauden is now dead. there are other parts of the world that are challenging, let me tell you this, to beat terrorism, there's only one candidate who can do it and it's hillary clinton. remember she was the senator from new york from 9/11 she was there when they were still searching for victims and survivo survivors, that seared on her.
first we got to take out the leaders on the battlefield. she will get the head of isis, second we have the disrupt financing, third disrupt ability to recruit on the internet in their safe havens, but fourth also have to work with allies and surge intelligence. that's the hillary clinton plan. she has the experience to do it. donald trump can't start a twitter war with miss universe without shooting himself in the foot. donald trump doesn't have a plan. he said i have a secret plan, then he said i know more than all the generals about isil and then he said i'm going to call the generals to help me figure out a plan, but he trash talks the military, the military is a disaster, john mccain is no hero, the generals all need to be fired and i know more than
them. hec he wants to tear up nato. and will only work with they play big league. he has a mt. rushmore for vladimir putin, saddam hussein and -- >> give me a break. >> he said japan should get nuclear weapons, and care-- don trump said "go ahead, folks, enjoy yourselves." i would love to hear governor pence tell me what is so comical or enjoyable about nuclear war. >> did you work on that one a long time? because that has as a lot of creative things in it. >> is there i would like to see
if you can answer it. >> after being the architect of the foreign policy of this administration, america is less safe today than it was the day that barack obama became president of the united states. it's absolutely inarguable. it's been a combination of factors, but mostly a lack of leadership. i was in washington d.c. on 9/11 i saw the clouds rise. >> i was in virginia. >> i know you were. we all lived through that day as a nation. it was heartbreaking. >> uh-huh. >> and i want to give this president credit for bringing osama bin lauden to justice, but the truth is osama bin lauden led al qaeda, our fight is with isis and it would have allowed some american combat troops to remain in iraq and secure the
hard fought gain the american soldier had won by 2009, isis was literally abled to be conjured up out of the desert that the american soldier won in operation iraqi freedom. my heartbreaks for the corporal who fell in falluja in 2005. he fought hard through some of the most difficult days in operation iraqi freedom and he fought hard and that nation was secured in 2009 but because hillary clinton & barack pobama failed to provide sufficient troops in there we are back at war. the president just ordered more troops on the ground. we are back at war and scott's mom would always come to see me and i would always give her a hug and tell her we're never
going to forget her son. they were squanderred in iraq because it created a vacuum in which isis was able to grow. in reference to the iranian deal that hillary clinton initiated a $150 billion? >> we stopped -- >> you didn't stop. >> yes, we did. >> once the period of time that the treaty comes off. >> immigrants from parts of the world that export terrorism, but that does not address many of the resent terrorist attacks in the united states such as the orlando nightclub massacre and the recent bombings, in h new york and new jersey, thoese wer home grown, what types of tools would you use to prevent those
types of attacks. >> it's a great question, elaine, but it really does begin with our reform and putting the safety of the american people first. donald trump has called for extre extreme vetting so we don't bring people who are hostile to the american way of life but also donald trump are committed to suspending the syrian refugee program and programs from areas of the world that have been compromised by terrorism. hillary clinton & timaine want to increase this -- >> i'm talking about home grown terror. >> yeah. >> but let's make sure we're putting the safety and security of the american people first. >> or instead of you violating the constitution by blocking people based on their national origin rather than whether they are dangerous.
>> that's not at all. >> that's what the seventh circuit. hillary and i want to do enforcement based on are people dangerous, this guy says mexicans are bad and respect to refugees we want to keep them out if their dangerous. >> mike pence put a program in place to keep them out in they're from syria, and yesterday with three republican judges struck down -- >> those judgments said to your point because there wasn't any evidence yet that isis had infiltrated the united states. well, germany just arrested three syrian refugees. >> but they told you there's a right way and a wrong way to do it. >> if you're going to be critical with me that's fine. after the attack in pairs which
is called paris's 9/11, i have no higher decision than to keep my people safe and we're going to put the safety and security of the american people first. >> be clear, hillary and i will work on immigration and we don't do it based on discriminating against you because of the country you come from or the religion, that is completely and anti-thet anti-thetical. >> but they said we can't be for sure where they're coming from the fbi and the homeland security said we can't know where they're coming from. >> by trashing all syrians and
all -- >> let's ask about an intelligence surge, what would that look like and how would that identify terrorists with no operational connection to a terrorist organization? >> it's two things, elaine, first dramatically expanding our intention capacitities by hiring great poerofessionals, but we he some of the best intel and cyber people working in the united states, but also striking great partnerships in the private sector to regulate with constitutional principals to gather more intelligence but also means creating stronger alliances so you gather your intention and share between your allies and that's how you figure out who may be trying to recruit. alliance ps are critical.
that's why donald trump's claim that nato is obsolete. >> that's not his plan. >> well, he said that nato is obsolete. who are you going to share intention with? hillary clinton built the regime around the world that stopped the iranian nuclear weapons plan. >> i would like to turn to the tragedy in syria -- >> can i speak to this first? >> 30 seconds. >> we have got to bring together the best resources of this country that cyber warfare is the new warfare that we face in the country and i look forward if i'm privileged to be in this role to work with this.
>> we will work together in whatever roles we inhabit. >> it's important to remember that hillary clinton had a private server in her home that had classified information. >> all right governor 30 seconds is up. >> e-mails from the president of the united states of america were on there. her private server was subject to being hacked by foreign powers. >> you have now had a minute. 250,000 -- >> not one reasonable prosecutor would take any additional step. you don't get to decide the rights and wrongs of that. we have a justice system that does that. >> all right. we are moving on now 250,000 people handled 150,000 of them -- >> governor. >> that is absolutely false. >> gentlemen, please. >> the fbi did an investigation.
>> gentlemen. senator. senator kaine, governor pence. please. i want to turn now to syria. 250,000 people 100,000 of them children are under siege in aleppo syria, bunker buster boms and incendiary weapons are being dropped on them, does the u.s. have a responsibility to protect civil vaians and prevent mass casualties on this scale, governor pence? >> the united states of america needs to begin to exercise strong leadership to protect the 100,000 children in aleppo. hillary clinton's agenda was the russian reset. russian se sreset. after that they took over cir
mmi cirmia. the greatest nation on earth just withdraws from talks about a ceasefire while vladimir puttin' pu-- puttinin puts a sy in. it begins by rebuilding our military and the russians and the chinese have been making enormous investments in the military. we have the smallest navy since 1916, the lowest number of troops since the end of the second world war around donald trump will project our american strength in the world. but about syria, i truly do believe that what america ought to do right now is immediately establish safe zones so that families and vulnerable -- families with children can move out of those areas work with our
arab partners realtime to make that happen and second, i have to tell you that the provocations by russia need to be met with american strength and to make that happen. the provocations by russia need to be met by american strength. and if russia continues to be involved, i should say in this barbaric attack on civilians in aleppo, the united states should be prepared to use military force to strike the assad regime, to stop them from this humanitarian crisis that is taking place in aleppo. there is a broad range of things we ought to do as well. we ought to deploy a missile defense shield to pollard and the czech republic. we've just got to have american strength on the world stage. when donald trump becomes president in the united states, the russians and the other countries in the world will know
they're dealing with a strong american president. >> hillary clinton and i also believe that consistent with the u.n. security council resolution that was passed in 2014 would be a very good idea. and hillary has a way to stand up to russia again and again in a way that donald trump cannot. the trump campaign management team had to be fired a month or so again because of those shadowy connections with those forces. he said vladimir putin is better than obama. he run his economy into the ground. harms lgbt folks, if you don't know the difference between dictatorship and leadership,
then you have to go back to a fifth grade civics class. i tell you what offends me. >> that offends me. >> donald trump is avoiding paying taxes. "the new york times" story suggests that he probably didn't pay taxes for about 18 years starting in 1995. those years included the years of 9/11. so get this, on 9/11, hillary clinton and donald trump's hometown was attacked by the worst terrorist attack in the history of the united states. young men and women, young men and women signed up to serve in the military to fight terrorism. hillary clinton went to washington to get funds to rebuild her city and protect first responders but donald trump was fighting a very different fight. it was a fight to avoid paying taxes so that he would not support the fight against terror. he would not support troops. he would not -- this is important, elaine. when a guy running for president will not support the troops, not
support veterans, not support teachers that is really important. and i said about aleppo we do agree the notion is we have to create a humanitarian zone in northern syria, it's very important. >> governor pence, you have mentioned a no-fly zone. where would you set it up, specifically how would you keep it safe? >> well, first and foremost, donald trump supports our troops and veterans. donald trump has -- do you not take deductions? how does that work? >> it is about our troops. how can you -- >> i understand why you want to change the subject, and let me be very clear on this russian thing, the larger question -- >> gentlemen, we're going to have time to get to russia. >> there is an old proverb that says the russian bear never dies, it just hibernates.
the weak policy of barack obama and hillary clinton has awakened the aggressiveness with russia, where they moved into the crimea, and georgia, and all we do is fold our arms and say we're not having talks any more. to answer the question, we just need american strength. we need to marshal the resources of our allies in the region, and in the immediate we need to act and act now to get people out of harm's way. >> and exactly how would the safe zones remain safe? >> the safe zones have to be as the senator said, there is a framework that is already recognized by the international community. the united states needs to be prepared to work with our allies in the region to create a route for safe passage and then protect people in those areas including in the no-fly zone. this is very tough stuff, i served on the foreign affairs
committee for a decade and traveled in that region. i saw what the american soldier wanted, the freedom, and to see the weak and feckless administration that hillary clinton was involved in with barack obama. >> he doesn't want to acknowledge that we stopped the iranian nuclear weapons program. he doesn't want to acknowledge that hillary was part of the team that got osama bin laden. he doesn't want to acknowledge, said it's a good ting, not a bad thing, that it's a good thing not a bad thing that we're down from 175,000 troops. what will really make the middle east disastrous, donald trump's suggestion that they should get more weapons. ronald reagan said something in the '90s, he said the problem the nuclear proliferation is that some fool or maniac could
trigger a disaster. and i think that is what runningmate is doing -- >> that was pretty low. >> ronald reagan also said a nuclear war should never be fought because it could never be won. and the united states of america needs to make investments in modernizing our nuclear force -- >> tn you think as donald trump's claim -- >> let me go back to this iran thing. he keeps saying that hillary clinton started the deal with the iranians, prevented iran from getting a nuclear weapon. they got -- >> the israeli, the joint chiefs of staffs is saying right now. >> that is not what israel thinks. >> you wouldn't necessarily know that. i know you boycotted prime
minister netanyahu's speech. you boycotted the speech. the point is what this so-called iran deal did was essentially guarantee -- when i was in congress i fought hard on a bipartisan basis with republican and democrat members to move forward the toughest sanctions. literally in the history of the united states. >> and then hillary used it. >> we were bringing them to heel. but the goal was always we would only lift the sanctions if iran permanently renounced -- elaine let me finish the sentence. they have not re announnounced nuclear ambitions, and when the deal runs out there is no limitation on their weapons -- >> just quickly -- >> six times tonight i have said to governor pence i can't imagine how you can defend your runningmate's position on one issue to the next, in all cases he refused --
>> don't put wor in my mouth. >> and yet he is asking everybody to vote for somebody he cannot defend. i think that should be underlined. >> i'm very, very happy to defend donald trump. if he wants to take them one at the same time. >> more nations should get nuclear weapons. >> he never said that. >> gentlemen, russia, russian president invaded ukraine and provided military support to the assad regime. what steps would your administration take to stop these actions? >> you have to be tough with russia, let's start with not praising donald trump as a great leader. donald trump and mike pence said he is a great leader. >> no, we haven't. >> and he has business dealings with russia that he refuses to disclose. hillary clinton went toe to toe
with russia, went toe to toe with russia as secretary of state to do the new start agreement. she has experience doing it. she went toe to toe with russia and launched protests when they went into georgia. and we've done the same, but more by putting punishing sanctions on russia that we need to continue. donald trump, on the other hand, didn't know that russia had invaded the crimea. he was on a tv show, hed i guarantee you this, russia is not going into the ukraine. he had to be reminded that they had gone into the ukraine years before. she got them engaged in a meaningful way to cap iran's nuclear weapons program, and yet she stood up on the syrian invasion, you have to have the ability to do that and hillary does. and on the other hand, you have number in donald trump who
praises vladimir putin all the time. america should really wonder about a president trump who had a campaign manager with ties to putin, pro-putin elements in the ukraine who had to be fired for that reason. they should wonder when vladimir putin is sitting down with donald trump, is it going to be america's bottom line or vladimir putin's bottom line that will be worried about with dealings. i know he is laughing at this -- >> what does this have to do with russia. >> every president since richard nixon has done it. >> he has not said it. >> governor -- >> well, thanks. just trying to keep up with the insult-driven campaign on the other side of this table. >> i'm just saying facts about your runningmate, and i know you
can't defend him. >> i am happy to defend him, don't put words in my mouth, most of what you said is completely retaliatifalse, and american people know it. look, this is the alternative universe of washington, d.c. versus reality. hillary clinton said her number one priority was a reset with russia. that reset resulted in the invasion of the ukraine. after they had infiltrated with what were called little green men, russian soldiers addressed up as dissidents. and then they invaded the ukraine. donald trump knows it happened. he is basically saying it is not going to happen again. what you have with the rise of russia that increased its influence with iran, that now because of this deal is on a pathway in the future to obtain a nuclear -- the leading state
sponsor of terror in the world in iran now has a closer working relationship with russia because of hillary clinton and barack obama's foreign policy. and $150 billion and sanctions all being lifted. and then of course syria, it really is extraordinary. syria is imploding. you just asked a very thoughtful question about aleppo, isis is headquartered in raqqah, they have overrun vast areas that at great sacrifice the american soldier won in operation iraqi freedom. senator kaine still sits here, loyal soldier i get all that is still saying that the foreign policy of hillary clinton and barack obama somehow made the world more secure. it really is astonishing. >> we have wiped out the leader of al qaeda. >> we delivered $400 million in cash as a ransom payment for americans held by the radical
mullahs in tehran. >> the other day, he said putin says he has no respect for hillary clinton or barack obama. why do you think he will respect donald trump? >> strength. >> donald trump's son says -- that the trump organization -- >> please, senator, i'll give you a chance to respond. >> says we're going to rebuild or military. this whole putin thing, look, america is stronger than russia. our economy is 16 times larger than the russian economy. america's political system is superior to the crony corrupt capitalistic system in russia in every way. when donald trump and i observe that as i said in syria and iran and ukraine that the small and bullying leader of russia has been stronger on the world stage
than this administration, that is stating painful tafacts. that is not an endorsement of putin, that is an indictment of the rescueless and feckless leadership of barack obama and hillary clinton. >> i just think -- >> said he is a strong -- he has been stronger on the world stage. >> thouno, he said leader. i'll just say this governor. if you mistake leadership for dictatorship and you can't tell the difference, the country that is running the economy -- if you can't tell the difference you should not be commander in chief. and donald trump's sons say they have all of those business dealings with russia, they could be disclosed with tax returns, they just need to do it. americans need to learn if
donald trump is watching out for his bottom line or their bottom line. >> senator, what happened with the russian reset? >> vladimir putin is a dictator, he is not a leader, anybody who thinks otherwise doesn't know russian history or vladimir putin. hillary clinton knows exactly who this guy is. john mccain said i look at his eyes and see kgb. so how do you deal with him? you have to deal with russia in a lot of different ways. there are areas where we could cooperate. it was hillary clinton who worked on the restart treaty. it was hillary clinton who worked with russia to get them engaged in a community of nations to stop the iranian nuclear weapons program without firing a shot. she is not going around praising vladimir putin as a great guy, but she knows how to sit down at a table and negotiate tough deals. this is a very challenging part of the world and we ought to
have a commander in chief who has prepared and done it rather than someone who goes around praising vladimir putin as a great leader. >> all right, i would like to ask about north korea, iran and the threat of nuclear weapons. north korea recently conducted its fifth and most powerful nuclear tests. what specific steps would you take to stop north korea from developing a nuclear armed missile capable of reaching the united states? governor pence? >> well, first we need to make a commitment to rebuild our military including modernizing our nuclear forces. and we also need an effective american diplomacy that will marshal the resources of nations in the asia-pacific rim to put pressure on north korea, on kim jong-un, to abandon his nuclear ambitions. it has to remain the policy of the united states to
denuclearize north korea. when donald trump is president we're not going to have the kind of posture in the world that has russia invading crimea and ukraine, that has them building in the north china sea. it has them flouting power. we're going to have to go back to the days of peace through strength. i have to tell you that all of this tax about tax returns and i get it. you want to keep bringing it up. it must be the will of some focus group. but hillary clinton and her husband set up a private foundation called the clinton foundation. while she was secretary of state, the clinton foundation accepted tens of millionsf dollars from foreign governments and foreign donors. now y'all need to know about this, this is basic stuff. foreign donors cannot participate in the american
process nor can they make contributions. but the clintons figured out a way for the foreign governments to donate millions of dollars. then we found out more than half of her private meetings when she was secretary of state was given to the clinton foundation. when you talk about all of these baseless rumors of russia and the rest, hillary clinton you asked the trustworthy question at the beginning, it's because they're looking at the pay to play politics that she operated while she was secretary of state. and they're saying enough is enough. >> senator kaine. >> i want to talk about the foundation then north korea. so on the foundation, i am glad to talk about the foundation. the clinton foundation is one of the highest rated charities in the world. it provides aids drugs to about 11.5 million people. and helps americans deal with
opioid overdoses, and gets higher rankings as charities than the american red cross does. hillary clinton as secretary of state took no action to benefit. they concluded everything that hillary clinton did as secretary of state was completely in the interest of the united states. so the foundation does good work, and hillary clinton as secretary of state worked to help the united states. the trump organization is an octapus organization whose conflict of interest could only be learned if donald trump would release his tax returns. he refused to do it. his son said the organization has a lot of business dealings in russia. and remember, the trump organization is not a nonprofit. it's putting money into the donald tmp foundation and into his children's pockets.
no clinton family member draws any salary. in addition, donald trump has a foundation. the foundation was just fine for illegally contributing donations to a florida foundation. they tried to hide it by disguises it as somebody else and the person they donated to was somebody whose office was charged with investigating trump university. this is the difference between a foundation that does good work and a secretary of state who acted in accordance with the american interests, and somebody who is conflicted in doing work around the world and won't share with the american public what he is doing and what those conflicts are. >> governor, i would give you 30 second s to sunnrespond, becau know you want to. but i remind you this is about north korea. >> thank you, they give every
cent o-- less than ten cents on the dollar, the charitable foundation has gone to causes. it has been a platform for the clintons to travel around the world to have staff. but honestly senator, we would know a lot more about it if hillary clinton would just turn over the 33,000 e-mails that she refused to turn over. we would have a much better you are of what the clinton foundation is doing. >> senator kaine if you had intelligence that north korea was about to launch a nuclear missile capable of hitting the united states, would you take pre-emptive action? >> look, the president would have to take action to defend the united states, the president would have to do that. now call what action you have to determine what your intelligence was, how certain you were of that intelligence with you would
have to take action. i am on the foreign relations committee and we just sent up a package on north korea, interestingly enough, elaine, the u.n. followed and did the same package, often china will use their veto in the security council to veto the package, they're starting to get worried about north korea. they actually supported the package, even though many of the sanctions are against chinese financial institutions. so we're working together with china and we need to. china is another one of those relationships where it is competitive and also challenging and in times like north korea we have to be able to cooperate. hillary understands that well. she went once to china, and stood up and said women's rights are human rights. they didn't want her to say that but she did. she has also worked on a lot of important diplomatic deals with china, and that is what it is going to take. the thing i would worry about is
that donald trump owes about $650 million to banks including the bank of china. i'm not sure he could stand up so tough to the people who have loaned him money. >> i would like to turn to our segment on the social issues. you have both been open about the role that faith has played in your lives. can you talk about a time where you struggled to balance your personal strength and public policy. >> yeah, that is an easy one for me, elaine. i am really fortunate, i grew up for a wonderful irish catholic house, my mom and dad are sitting here. i was educated in kansas city, my 43rd union is in ten days. i worked with missionaries, and they were the heroes of my life. i try to practice my religion in a very devout way and try to follow the teachings of my own
church in my person life. but i don't believe we raise any religion over another and we allow i'm to worship as they please, that the doctrines of any one religion should be mandated for everyone. to me the hardest struggle in my faith life was the catholic church is against the death penalty and so am i. but i was governor of a state. and the state law said there was a death penalty for crimes if the jury determined them to be heinous. and so i had to grapple with that. when i was running for governor i was acted pretty strongly because of my position on the death penalty. but i looked at the voters in virginia and said look, this is my lreligion, i'm not going to change my position because of my religion, but i will uphold the law. it was difficult to allow executions to go forward but in circumstances where i didn't feel like there was a case for
clemency, i told voters i would uphold the law. it was a tough struggle. it's important for those of us who have deep faith lives don't feel like we can just substitute the views for everybody else in society regardless of their views. >> governor pence. >> it's a wonderful question, and my christian faith is at the very heart of who i am. i was also raised in a wonderful family of faith. it was church on sunday morning and grace before dinner. but my christian became real for me when i made a personal decision for christ when i was a freshman in college. i've tried to live that out, however imperfectly every day of my life since. with my wife at my side we followed a calling in public service where we tried to keep faith with values that we cherish. and with rega to when i
struggle, i appreciate and i have a great deal of respect for senator kaine's sincere faith, i truly do. but to me i would tell you that for me the suspeanctity of life proceeds out of the belief the ancient principle where god says before you were formed in the womb, i knew you. the state of indiana has seen that we expand alternatives in health care counseling for women, non-abortion alternatives. we're well on our way in indiana becoming the most pro-adoption state thin the country. what i can't understand is hillary clinton, with kaine at
her side, to support the partial-birth abortion. i know you hold pro life views personally, but the very idea that a child who is almost born in the world could still have their life taken from them, is just anathema to me. and i can't think of a party -- i know you supported taxpayer funding of abortion, but hillary clinton wants to repeal the longstanding provision in the law where we said we would not use taxpayer funding to fund abortions. it all for me begins with cherishing the dignity, the worth, the value of every human life. >> elaine, this is a fundamental question. a fundamental question. hillary and i are both people out of religious backgrounds.
her methodist religion was the background of her faith. we believe you should live your faith but it's not the public role to mandate it. let's talk with it. we support roe versus wade, we support the constitutional right of women to consult their own conscience, their own supportive partner, their own minister. but then make their own decision about pregnancy. we trust women to do that. we don't think that women should be punished, as donald trump said, for women having an abortion. governor pence wants to repeal roe versus wade. we had young people in the audience, before roe versus
wade, the state could do just that, punish women if they made a decision to terminate a pregnancy. i think you should live your moral values, but the very last thing the government should do is have laws that would punish women who make reproductive choices. and that is the fundamental difference between a clinton-kaine ticket that wants to punish. >> it really is not. donald trump and i would never support legislation that would punish women th-- holiday the decision -- made the decision -- >> then why did he say that? >> from the pumice of the heart the mouth speaks. when donald trump says women should be punished, or mexicans are rapists and criminal, or
john mccain is not a hero -- >> senator, you whipped out the mexican thing again. >> can you defend it? >> look, there are criminals coming in the country -- >> you want to use a big tar brush against mexico. >> and he said many of them are good people. you keep leaving it out of your quote, if you want me to go there i'll go there. a choice on life, i could not be more proud to be standing with donald trump who is standing for the right to life. it's a principle, and i'm very gentle about the this. because i really do respect you. i appreciated the fact that you supported the hyde amendment that bans the use of public funding for abortion, but that is not hillary clinton's view. we can create a culture of life. nd