tv Morning Joe MSNBC October 13, 2016 3:00am-6:01am PDT
be in new hampshire. and former president bill clinton will make two stops in iowa. >> okay. busy day. that does it for us on this >> if i lose, i will consider it the biggest waste of time, money and energy i've ever done in my life. >> good morning. it is thursday, october 13th. welcome to "morning joe." >> dramatic shot. >> look at that shot of capitol hill. the sun has yet to come up in washington, but we're already talking. with us on set, msnbc contributor mike barnicle. political writer for "the new york times," nick is with us and mark halperin and willie, joe and me. a lot to get to. >> a lot to talk about today.
>> donald trump and his campaign are fighting back against a number of stories that came out late yesterday accusing trump of unwanted and inappropriate touching. "the new york times" released an article yesterday that features allegation of two women, rachel crooks tells the paper she was a 22-year-old receptionist working for a real estate group in trump tower in new york when she met trump one morning in 2005. they shook hands and trump kissed her on the cheek before kissing her on the mouth. and in the case of jessica leeds she met trump white sitting in first class on the flight. he put her hand up her skirt. both women say they support hillary clinton. and leeds says she hopes her story makes a difference in the election. nbc news has not confirmed the
allegations. the trump campaign told nbc news the article was fiction and it trivialized sexual assault. trump's lawyer went even further sending a letter to the executive editor of the paper demanding a retraction and apology calling the report reckless, defamatory and trump's senior communication adviser said in a statement "this entire article is fiction and for "the new york times" to launch a completely false character assassination against mr. trump on a topic like this is dangerous to reach back decades in an attempt to smear mr. trump, trivialize sex assault and set a new low the media is willing to go to determine this election. it is absurd to think that one of the most recognizable business leaders on the planet with a strong record of empowering women in his companies would do the things alleged in this story.
and for this to only become public decades later in the final month of a campaign for president should say it all." >> what do you think? >> i think that the story speaks for themselves at this point. nbc news hasn't gotten its own sourcing on it. i don't want to say anything yet. i don't know. i do think that this is going to get so ugly if we thought it was ugly now. >> that's what josh green has written about. donald trump believes, you know, that he's going to spend the next couple weeks doing this. why don't we talk about what josh green is reporting. >> donald trump believes that inviting three women who claim they were assaulted by former president bill clinton to last sunday's debate let his
democratic opponent shaken. >> the campaign believes will make hillary clinton toxic and weaken voter turnout for her among young women. according to a senior trump adviser, the campaign will soon bring forward new accusers. women are coming to us who have been groped or sexually abused by bill clinton. the campaign is debating on whether to feature latest accusers at campaign rallies according to green. the republican nominee's decision to close out his campaign by attacking what he alleges to be bill clinton's history of sexual violence and his wife's role after the fact suggests the next few weeks could be among the ugliest in modern presidential history. trump strategist claim new accusers have come forward after seeing the recent media coverage. the plan to increase the focus on sexual misconduct is being spearheaded by trump campaign ceo steven bannon. deputy campaign manager david bossi and trump's son-in-law
jared kutcher. bill clinton has never been charged with alleged crimes by the women trump featured. he did pay a settlement to paula jones with no admission of wrongdoing with prospect of alleged clinton victims coming forward, a trump adviser said we're going to go buck wild. >> he was disbarred by the u.s. supreme court and arkansas supreme court for lying under oath in a lawsuit. >> i was asking mika do you think they have any credibility? >> i don't think it's about me believing. i think -- >> let me ask you a different question. would you remember something that happened like the alleged actions that are charged to have
occurred if it happened to you 35 years ago? >> yes, i would. i spent a lot of time in washington. i've had experiences like that with very powerful people in washington. some of them that -- >> some people ironically, mika has had experiences with people right now who are going out and being self-righteous with leaders of news organizations being very self-righteous. she has had misconduct -- come on. i just -- >> i will say that, first of all, there are people in these families they talked to at the time. we spoke with them for the story. you can read in the story the steps that were taken to verify the accounts. i will say there are now a great number of these accounts and accusations over many years from different people. we are seeing a pattern to all
of them. it's the forceable kissing. it's moving into the room and making a sudden move. we see it again and again in the facts patterns. >> he admitted himself to howard stern. >> also on the tape with billy bush. it fits to what he said to billy bush. i kiss them. >> what is the impact of that? does that make him unqualified to be president of the united states? >> that's for the voters to decide not for me. i think it raises a real question about his character that people are going to evaluate. if they want to bring up allegations against bill clinton, i don't think that's unfair or out of bounds but he's not running for president ultimately. hillary clinton is. >> i think this also as nick touched on is culmination of six days on that bus where he described almost this using star power and allowed to do things to grab women and walk up and kiss them which is what a lot of these women are describing.
we didn't get into first-person account. donald trump suggesting he give a tour to this writer and pushing her against a wall and kissing her. she goes on in some detail. it's a very disturbing account of what happened. i just think if we're going to believe the bill clinton accusers, doesn't the same rule apply to the donald trump accusers? if you're going to give paula jones athe benefit of the doubt -- >> i called bill clinton accusers, accusers. i'm not making a judgment on that at all. these are accusers. i will just say that for the young women that were very young at the time this happened, i had experiences like that in washington. i was page on capitol hill. my parents prepared me for men like this. there are many of them in washington in the media and in politics.
and it's the girls who come in from town who don't really know -- that's the traumatic experience for them. they don't know how to handle it. i believe these things could have happened. i do. >> because they happen to you through the years. >> i've seen a lot of men like this and know them today. >> there are two things quite vivid in all of these stories. one is what you just referenced. no woman forgets this. the other aspect to me that's interesting is the bill clinton accusers and accusations made against him, if there were the power of social media that exist today existing in 1992, never would have been of the united states. >> i don't know about that. i remember in real time because i was there, women who came forward with these type of accusations and, mark halperin, you'll remember this very well. women who came forward with accusations like this and i have
no reason to doubt any of these accusations whatsoever. i'm talking about i remember in the '90s in real time bill clinton -- it's hard to believe they did this. but bill clinton and hillary clinton's political apparatus dismissing these ladies as sluts and nuts. hillary clinton was in charge of the sluts and nuts operation. she headed it up to destroy women that came forward with these type of accusations. james carville saying after a sexual harassment claim that was settled saying i guess if you drag a dollar bill through a trailer park, no telling what will come up. i guess that's what is so surprising to me when we have people selected with the people campaign being so shocked by what's going on here, i think we're all deeply disturbed by
what's going on here, but i would only say to hillary clinton you had me at nuclear winter. you should probably just leave this to the press. and just, please, we were all there in the 1990s. our memories are not that short. leave it to the media and stop being self-righteous about something that you know all too much about. mark halperin, the josh green report suggest that we're going to had a he said/she said on both sides over the next three weeks. is this any way to run a campaign? is this any way to run a country? >> people say this is the most negative campaign we've ever seen. we're now in the most negative campaign i've ever seen. donald trump is behind, right? he's behind. his campaign would acknowledge he's behind. and they recognize their options are limited in terms of how they can come back.
it is extraordinary that in the midst of an attempt to come back, they turn increasingly to going after bill clinton's past at a time when donald trump's past is now going to be scrutinized more than it ever has. extraordinary things about what's happening now. difficulty of the press and any allegation on any topic that comes up in the last month is a challenge for the press to handle. i thought the "times" handled this responsibility. i don't think there's any chance donald trump will sue despite the threat and the issue now going forward is how are all of these claims -- including the allegations and the implications of the wikileaks documents, how is this all going to be handled? i can tell you this. they won't talk about housing or health care or foreign policy. this is going to crowd out everything for the foreseeable future. donald trump is behind in this race. i was with him yesterday in florida. he was good to be on message but he won't be on message for a
long while on dealing with these allegations. >> his answer to anderson cooper at the debate when he asked him, so does this mean when you deny, does it mean you never forcibly kissed a woman and he said "i have not." to a woman as you read these stories, each said they were watching the debate and heard him say that and thought it was the time to come forward and tell their stories. this may just be the beginning. one night where we got five women and then there's another story in "the daily news." >> some of these things happened 30 years ago. they're all falling days before the election. >> that's why -- >> is that a coincidence? >> it may have happened anyway. this is obviously a drop. i do think his declaration at that debate he had not done it opened the floodgates. >> willie, i totally disagree. i don't think you can call it a
drop. the "times" makes clear as you just suggested that a lot of women coming forward are coming forward in reaction to what they said to anderson cooper. i'm always skeptical when stuff comes you have as all reporters should be and voters. >> i think it's good to be skeptical when you have stories that are 30 years old that come out days before an election. i think, mark, that's a good instinct on your part. >> we should be skeptical and question the timing. >> not skeptical of the stories. i'm not skeptical at all of the stories. skeptical of the timing that all of this has dropped over the past five days. days out from an election because doesn't it seem that a more appropriate time to drop these stories might have been after the first republican debate when the front and center issue was how badly donald trump treats women. meghan kelly's first question is how horrifically donald trump treats women. if this happened to me 30 years
ago, i would say this would be a really good time for me to come forward. right? >> i think all of the republican campaigns would ask themselves why this stuff didn't surface earlier because it may have stopped donald trump before now? >> what do you think the answer to that is? why do you think it came out days before the election? >> it came out days before the election because of what he said because of the billy bush tape, "access hollywood" tape and what he said to anderson cooper. we need to remain skeptical about the wikileaks process and content and pursue and skeptical about how this happened. i just think saying that it is somehow coordinated -- maybe it is -- no evidence of that. if you look at how "the new york times" said their account transpired and the "people" magazine reporter said, it has to do with women feeling aggrieved and concerned and
seeing what he said to anderson cooper and reacting to that. >> what about what he said to meghan kelly. >> it was about things he said. >> treating women badly. this is a recurring theme in media coverage for a year and a half that donald trump is a massonagist. you look at the story that they write about dump. they say that. it seems to me -- i don't think there's anything special about what he said to anderson cooper versus what everyone is accusing him of over the last year and a half that it dropped days before the campaign in october. >> there have been a string of stories about this for months. there have been talks from
beauty contestants and any number of stories over the last four or five months. i do think that mark is right that the comments of that first debate were about insults to women and what was different now is him coming out denying what he said on that tape to billy bush that speaks to the experience that people had that the exact thing he described doing to billy bush is what we are seeing in some of those stories. it's that thing making it happen. >> i want to -- by the way -- >> how were you in the 1990s with bill clinton? did you write columns condemning bill clinton's behavior? >> i did. more his draft dodging. yeah. i did -- >> what were you going to say? >> i want to be -- i'm having difficulty understanding the source of your skepticism. skepticism is healthy. >> skepticism about what? not these women's stories.
>> that's what i was going to ask you. >> i'm skeptical about the timing of this dropping talk about an october surprise when, again, as you said, there have been a thousand triggering events that would have made sense. if i had been sexually harassed by this man, the megyn kelly story would have given me an opportunity. there have been a thousand of these reports already. i'm asking why all of a sudden this stuff is blowing up in october. perhaps it's all innocent. perhaps there is no opo drop. perhaps it's not coordinated. i'm saying i only agree -- i only agree with mark halperin that we need to remain skeptical. i have found over my 25 years in public life that being skeptical usually pays off in the end.
we will find out the truth about why these stories dropped, when they dropped, if anybody had anything to do with the timing of it outside of "the new york times." we'll find that out in years to come. i'm just saying skepticism is a good thing. this campaign though is really sinking to an extraordinarily low level and we're now going to be having women put in front of the camera by both sides now an given the state of this country and state of our politics, it's really, really sad. >> any chance that we can vote tomorrow and end this thing? >> i wish we could have voted six months ago. we have some polls actually coming out in pennsylvania and some poles coming out in missouri. it's kind of uncomfortable when you say you're going to unendorse donald trump and then
you have to ununendorse him. you wonder if it's a scene out of "veep" where the staff says you have to unendorse again. >> revelations out of the new wikileaks hack and also joining us this morning, former governor bill weld is here on set. >> glad we have billy. >> plus hallie jackson joins us with her latest reporting and how the trump campaign is responding to today. david brody reacts to mike pence's lukewarm reception and fred hiatt. we'll be right back. you're watching "morning joe."
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2016 election, about 500,000 votes have already been cast this election cycle. many of them if key swing states and there's new statewide polling out this morning. in pennsylvania, clinton leads by nine points in a four-way poll. it's the same margin in the head to head with clinton over the 50% mark leading 51-42. bloomberg politics poll included interviews in the four key philadelphia suburb counties that have played a role historically in determining who carries the state. in this poll, clinton leads trump 59% to 31%. a 28-point advantage. that is 18 points higher than barack obama's margin in the same area in 2012. and in missouri, donald trump leads hillary clinton by five points in the latest monmouth university poll 46-41 but nearly inside the margin of error. a month ago they were in a dead heat. >> we were trying to figure out
the accusations and debate and impact it would have, looks like a push. pennsylvania poll numbers about the same and trump doing better in missouri this month than he was last month. >> in our poll good news for trump before the latest round of accusations on both sides is he did better in the poll after our debate than before. people greatly troubled by the "access hollywood" video. they long thought it was their best shot to get to 270. they don't think that anymore in part because what you are poll found. if he's going to come out of philadelphia itself with a huge disadvantage -- >> 600,000 votes down. >> and then you go to these four counties where mitt romney roughly held his own, he's being slaughtered in those counties. he's talked about child care. he did yesterday in florida. i was covering him in lakeland. he talked about child care a little bit. nothing he's done on issues has allowed him to close the gap in those four counties and the
combination of his big deficit in those four counties makes pennsylvania right now unwinnable for him. it's interesting in our poll, pat toomey is neck and neck. he's within the margin of error. you see again donald trump's weakness with certain constituency. >> if he comes up short, it's going to be because of women and the latest stories. they are a heat seeking missile to both demographic groups. some conservative republicans saying i can't vote for a man that has these charges against him. i'm bringing up bill clinton because i think the press was extraordinarily hypocritical on clinton versus what's going on now during the '90s and now.
but you know who is not hypocritical? these women. these republican women will say i didn't like it. i didn't like it when bill clinton did it. i don't like it when donald trump did it. i didn't vote for bill clinton and i'm not going to vote for donald trump. it's going to be devastating if this continues throughout election day. >> if those women thought perhaps the talk on "access hollywood" tape was locker room talk, you have stories that came out last night. this is now the second poll in as many days that have shown complete blowouts. is this a story about pennsylvania? are you seeing that trend in the suburbs that decide the general election in places like ohio and florida as well? >> there hasn't been a lot of polling in those places. safe to say that in columbus suburbs and charlotte suburbs, donald trump is having similar
difficulties. maybe not the same. pennsylvania is a state they haven't given up on because they can't. even if they win all of the romney states and add iowa and ohio and florida and nevada, they are still short. so they need to find one more state. you're seeing right now you've got mike pence and eivanka trump scheduled to go back into pennsylvania. they are going to have to do better with women. a lot of people at the rally had signs that said women for trump. donald trump talked about the fact he doesn't understand why he's behind with women in the polls because everywhere he goes women say they're for him. he's got a math problem with women and the latest stories are not going to help. if they start to try to have a battle over his past versus bill clinton's past, they're rolling the dice on whether to equalize things because right now he's too far behind with women to find victory. >> he's also -- some news, nbc news has learned overnight that donald trump is moving out of virginia. it's a state that republicans
just -- virginia used to be a bedrock republican state. barack obama obviously has won it twice. it's really a state that donald trump needed to win. any republican needs to win if they're going to get to 270. it looks like the trump campaign is pulling out of there now. that certainly makes the math a lot worse because you've got to take pennsylvania off the map now. you've got to take virginia off the map now. and, boy, that path to 270 -- again, he can still get there, but it gets a lot tougher without virginia. >> you start with basic demographic advantage in electoral college and add virginia and north carolina and pennsylvania. >> virginia, north carolina, and florida. three states that no republican should ever lose. they just shouldn't. >> if you can't win them, you can't win the presidency. it's amazing to watch virginia go from a red state to a purple state to leaning blue state. it's a fascinating shift.
>> i'm talking to a fairly significant republican operative yesterday. he mentions that georgia is in play. georgia. that's unheard of. >> how about utah? >> utah as well. >> reporting in "the new york times" that clinton campaign thinks they can put resources into georgia and get it. it's been since 1992 when bill clinton won georgia was the first time it went for a democratic president. >> there has been talk for some time of democrats winning georgia. there was talk four years ago and maybe even eight years ago. this tells you what the republicans challenge is on the national level on winning presidential elections. we talk about that wall, that great blue wall in the electoral college. it's just one of the great ironies that republicans are at the high water mark really of power. probably since 1928 in the house and the senate, with
governorships, with state legislatures. the republican party has never been more popular in almost all of our lifetimes than they are right now but they cannot win the presidency. >> with donald trump. >> with donald trump. with mitt romney. >> connects back to problems with no voters. >> with mitt romney. with john mccain. republicans have lost the popular vote in five out of the last six presidential elections. it looks like it will be six out of the last seven. and yet they dominate all other levels of government. >> going forward, republicans at the presidential level, are they not looking at a certain demographic death? >> absolutely not. it all comes down to who they nominate. it all comes down to who they nominate. >> even democrats would say if they nominated john kasich and marco rubio as their ticket,
they would lose the case. >> even when i was suggesting every day that marco rubio was not ready to be president of the united states, i was saying at the same time that marco rubio or jeb bush would win this general election going away. either one of them would have won florida. all things being equal. would have won florida. would have won new mexico. would have won arizona. would have won nevada. would have won colorado. the map with jeb bush or marco rubio running against hillary clinton suddenly would have become extraordinarily daunting and so you look at what republicans said in 2013 about needing to expand their electorate and look at them now and -- my lord. >> it's been boiled down to a very hardcore group of supporters. >> post-mortem in 2017 --
>> john kasich and roomarco rub were not close to beating donald trump. >> it's not like marco rubio is a moderate. he's more conservative in some ways than -- certainly he's far more conservative as is george bush and john kasich than donald trump. it's not about ideology. >> donald trump suggests republican leaders may have a secret sinister deal. we'll be right back. >> what is it? do you get money for being part of this deal? >> women for trump. i don't get these polls. every place i go i see hundreds of women's for trump and then i see a poll. he's not doing well with women. i don't know. i don't get it. you work at ge? yeah, i do. you guys are working on some pretty big stuff over there, right? like a new language for crazy-big, world-changing machines.
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>> you are looking at the upcoming shot of -- >> looks like a vampire movie. >> beautiful shot of washington, d.c. as the sun is yet to come up this morning. it's that time of year where it's dark all the time. i love it. >> isn't that funny? >> i love it. >> growing up i loved daylight savings time. i wanted to -- i always loved going really far north where it
was light at 10:30 at night. you get this show and you have to wake up at 4:00, thank god. you know when it starts getting dark at the 5:00 in the afternoon, everybody starts slowing down around 7:30. kids are, like, i'm tired. it feels like 9:00. why don't we go to bed? >> june is so rough. >> in june i hear them screaming outside at 9:30. >> i want atlantic time daylight savings time the whole year. >> back to the news. house speaker paul ryan is seeing erosion in support as donald trump exerted new pressure on the top republican in congress. after stating he was still endorsing but no longer defending trump, some are questioning whether ryan should continue to lead. >> whatever. just whatever. >> a conservative congressman who backed ryan for speaker last year tweeted given the stakes of
this election, if paul ryan isn't for trump, then i'm not for paul ryan. >> he's still endorsing trump. he's saying i'm endorsing him. i won't campaign for him. he's endorsing him. let's get it straight. he's endorsing him. >> he's for him for president. >> he's not going to campaign for him. there are a lot of democrats who loathe hillary clinton and can't believe they're going to have to vote for her. you know what they're going to do? they're going to vote for her. they're not going to do anything else. they're not going to admit to their friends they're voting for hillary clinton. it's not such a strange phenomenon what paul ryan is doing this year. >> why have the endorsement? i don't get the endorsement part of it. >> because he's speaker. >> internal politics? >> yeah. he's speaker. if he doesn't endorse, if he withdraws the endorsement, he leaves a lot of members high and dry. >> what does he do -- >> that's the politics of it.
>> by the way, do you think paul ryan wants to endorse donald trump? >> no. >> no. >> what does he do as speaker? hillary clinton is president. what does he do as speaker to these members who are threatening him now? what does he do when he comes back? >> nothing. they've got nowhere else to go but paul ryan. paul ryan is going to be speaker after this is over. the bigger question is will paul ryan if hillary clinton is elected as it looks like she will get elected, will paul ryan and hillary clinton be willing to be courageous and actually work together. >> yes, they will. >> and draft legislation that will help america. these people yelling now, they're going to be yelling at him later when he decides to put together an education reform bill or a tax reform bill or infrastructure bill that everybody on the far right and everybody on the far left is going to hate. i think they'll work together. >> that's a very good point. >> the second she gets out of the gate there's an obvious chance there.
combine tax reform and infrastructure spending and each side gets something they want. good for the country. i can see that being the first move for her. >> a great piece by bob costa we'll have on in the next hour to talk about. >> i want to say at 6:40 and 50 seconds after. you always have -- what's the date? october 13th. i'm going to -- everything is so negative. i've got to tell you. i'm actually regardless of who gets elected president as far as the legislation being passed, i'm far more optimistic than we will have a lot of deals made, get a lot of things done. a lot more things done than we have over the past eight years. i think whether it's hillary clinton or, yes, donald trump, we will get more things done over the next eight years, and i'm actually looking forward to washington and congress starting to work the way it was supposed to work. >> why do you say that because congress views those two differently than barack obama?
>> well, because hillary clinton actually -- when she was in the united states senate, i was always surprised at people like trent lott would come up to me and when i would ask sneeringly, he would say she's great. she works harder than everybody else. ask hillary details of the bill. works hard in committee. always shows up. makes everybody around her smarter. it's the famous joe klein line when he asked general petraeus in the middle of the surge, who knows the most about what you're having to do in iraq. petraeus goes you mean other than hillary clinton? and what? it's not even close. everybody expected hillary clinton to go in in 2000 and be what barack obama was and marco rubio were. and ted cruz. she boats who immediately got in
and started running for president. hillary clinton did just the opposite. kept her head down. she stayed away from press conferences. she worked. it's like donald trump said when he kocomplimented her. she just keeps working and going at it. and she gained the respect, such respect from people who worked for her on the hill. on the other side, donald trump, donald trump -- both mitch mcconnell and donald trump believe that donald trump is going to turn legislation over to them and they feel confident that they're going to get a lot of things done. >> a number of republican senators and republican members of congress who are going to see the inside of the white house for the first time if hillary clinton is president. >> there is that. up next, the must read opinion pages. >> george w. bush and barack obama both had little use for the legislative branch. >> a brand new endorsement from
"the washington post." we're joined by the paper's editorial page editor straight ahead. >> pat buchanan wrote the big article today. i'm not bragging. maybe a little bit. he said it was the single greatest debate performance in the history of presidential politics. wouldn't you think that paul ryan would call and say good going? in front of just about the largest audience for a second night debate in the history of the country. so, you know, you would think they would say great going, don. let's go. let's beat this cook. she's a crook. we have to stop her. no, he doesn't do that. a whole deal going on there. there's a whole deal going on. we'll figure it out. i always figure things out. but there's a whole sinister deal going on. afoot and light-hearted i take to the open road.
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"the washington post" makes their presidential endorsement. you'll be shocked at who they picked. plus rudy giuliani apologizes for something he said while stumping for trump. >> is he doing okay? i'm worried about rudy. >> he accused hillary of lying about something and then turned out he was lying about it and apologized. i don't know. i think it was purposeful. you don't do that. we'll be right back. or when it's convenient. it's using state-of-the-art simulators to better prepare for any situation. it's giving offshore teams onshore support. and it's empowering anyone to stop a job if something doesn't seem right. at bp, safety is never being satisfied. and always working to be better.
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joining us now for must read editor al page, fred hiatt. >> i'm shocked by the endorsement. you have such a great relationship with donald trump. >> endorsing hillary clinton for president. and here you go. >> we don't let personal relationships get in the way of our journalism. >> you are a ref. call it like you see it. >> in the bloom and ugliness of this political season, one encouraging truth is often overlooked. there is a well qualified, well prepared candidate on the ballot. hillary clinton has the potential to be an excellent president of the united states, and we endorse her without hesitation. no, we are not making this endorsement simply because ms. clinton's chief opponent is dreadful. if we believed she was the lesser of two evils, we might urge you to vote for her anyway that's how strongly we feel about mr. trump. we would also tell you that was
our judgment. fortunately, it is not. ms. clinton is resilient, purposeful and smart. we believe anyone that votes for her will be able to look back four years from now with pride in that decision. >> that is actually surprising endorsement coming from the paper that along with abc had a poll that showed 55% of americans thought hillary clinton should have been indicted. as colin powell says, she always -- i will paraphrase -- always messes things up with her arrogance. goes in and as made a series of missteps through the years. are you not concerned at all? even endorsing her? should you not provide a caveat to your readers that you're concerned about her poor judgment in the past and hope that gaining ultimate power doesn't create ultimate problems? >> yes, we do provide a caveat. not exactly the one you say.
i think there's no question that she's unpopular. we know that. second most -- >> i'm talking about her judgment. >> i think on her judgment, most -- there's a concern that she has a tendency to circle the wagons and not be as forthcoming when there's a crisis. but our judgment looking at her service in public office is that she's a much better person in government than she is a politician. as she herself as said. if you look at what she did in the senate and how she behaved in the senate as you were saying a few minutes ago and same at the state department. you talk to professionals at the state department and you talk to her counterparts in other countries and she was serious. she did not circle the wagon. listens to advice from professionals inside the state department just like she was willing to reach across the aisle and those are the traits
it seemed to us especially in this climate where somebody could actually get something done as president. >> so in the state department, for example, you say she didn't circle the wagons or have that issue she has politically. what were some of the, i guess, conversations or accomplishments or decisions made that sort of led you down that road to believe this to be true in terms of her ability to make decisions as president. >> partly it's talking to assistant secretaries and ambassadors and professionals who said unlike a lot of secretaries of state who come in with their political circles, she listened to advice. she was going into a meeting with the chinese. our talking points would be on her list. in terms of accomplishments, you know, it's hard when foreign policy is run from the white house. i think she did succeed in making women's rights human rights a central part of policy rather than just a slogan.
and i think maybe even more important is if you look at her foreign policy advice to the president, she was mostly right. and sometimes he listened to her and sometimes like in syria he didn't. and we think the country, the world, would have been better off if he had listened to her in those circumstances. >> you just mentioned that you thought going forward that there's some light at the end of the tunnel that she might be able to get some things done. what would lead you to believe that? >> i think, you know, we've seen this election where you've had two candidates take off, bernie sanders calling for a revolution and donald trump whose premise we have to blow the whole thing up. it's all corrupt. nothing works. and even in this difficult year has resisted that. she's somebody who really
whether she wants to say it or not, she believes in inkrecremel change. she tried to do health care reform as first lady. it failed. she came back and did children's health insurance and got something done. i think our editorial board believes you're never going to get change just from one party or the other. this is a divided country. for things to stick, you need democrats and republicans of good will trying to work together and she gets how that works. like you said, she'll have republicans into the white house. she'll talk to people. she will look for places i think where you can move it five yards, eight yards, and even if it's not a revolution. >> all right. >> thank you very much. >> thank you for coming by. >> thanks for having me. >> a good look at what a trump/ryan relationship might look like in washington but how would the house speaker work with hillary clinton if he keeps the gavel and she wins the white house?
robert costa goes back to 1998 when the former first lady campaigned hard against the aspiring congressman. plus, why the next few weeks could be among the ugliest in modern presidential history. americans are buying more and more of everything online. and so many businesses rely on the united states postal service to get it there. because when you ship with us, your business becomes our business. that's why we make more ecommerce deliveries to homes than anyone else in the country. the united states postal service. priority: you i'm going to the bank, to discuss a mortgage. ugh, see, you need a loan, you put on a suit, you go crawling to the bank. this is how i dress to get a mortgage. i just go to lendingtree. i calculate how much home i can afford. i get multiple offers to compare side by side.
i have tremendous respect for women and women have respect for me. i will tell you -- >> have you done those things? >> no, i have not. >> was that the moment that now has more and more women coming out accusing donald trump of unwanted contact? welcome back to "morning joe." it's thursday, october 13th. with us we have "the new york times" nick confessore, writer for the fix, phillip bump, bloomberg's josh green, a-- >> a lot of people. i'll start with josh green and ask a question a lot of people want to know. have you called your mother, josh? >> i e-mailed her last night. >> she knows you're on the show? >> she knows i'm on the show. she appreciates your concern. >> i'm more concerned about you.
so you actually even before the news broke last night in "the new york times," you talked about how we were going to be facing the ugliest few weeks in presidential political history with the story that the trump campaign was going to go -- what was the word? buck wild. >> buck wild on bill clinton accusations and hillary clinton accusations. >> i think the trump campaign knew a lot of these groping accusations were coming. we know that trump doesn't like to be on the defensive. always likes to hit back hard. what my story reports is that trump has come to believe that his debate strategy was a success. that rolling out these old clinton accusers from the '90s was a success. helped consolidate republican voters. helped republican elected official from bailing on him. they'll double down on that strategy. they toell me there will be mor clinton accusers coming forward.
>> let's go to "the new york times" story, mika, from last night. >> donald trump and his campaign are fighting back against a number of stories that came out late yesterday accusing trump of it unwanted and inappropriate touching. "the new york times" released an article yesterday that features the allegations of two women, rachel crooks tells the paper she was a 22-year-old receptionist working for a real estate group in trump tower in new york when she met trump one morning in 2005. she says they shook hands and then trump kissed her on the cheeks before kissing her directly on the mouth. in the case of jessica leeds, she told the "times" she met trump 35 years ago while sitting in a first class seat on a flight. she accuses him of touching her after the dinner trays were cleared. and that she got upset when he put his hand up her skirt. both women say they support hillary clinton. and leeds says she hopes her story makes a difference in the election.
nbc news has not confirmed these allegations. the trump campaign told nbc news the article was fiction and it trivialized sexual assault. trump's lawyer went even further sending a letter to executive editor of the paper demanding a retraction and apology calling the report reckless. and trump's senior adviser said in a statement this entire article is fiction. for "the new york times" to launch a completely false, coordinated character assassination against mr. trump on a topic like this is dangerous. to reach back decades in an attempt to smear mr. trump, trivialize the sexual assault and it sets a new low for where the media is willing to go in its efforts to determine this election. it is absurd to think that one of the most recognizable business leaders on the planet with a strong record of empowering women in his companies would do the things alleged in this story. and for this to only become
public decades later in the final month of a campaign for president should say it all. >> mark halperin, what's the impact not only of these "times" stories but also of what josh green is saying about what the trump campaign will do over the next two weeks? >> i think it's up for grabs. i don't know that either side at this point wants to back down. i also know that the trump campaign is behind looking for a way back. donald trump is going to have to speak to these things. these are not accusations that can be pushed aside with a statement by a spokesperson. he's going to have to be more specific. the trump campaign was critical, and i think rightly so, of secretary clinton for saying in the past all women's stories should be believed and allowed to speak out if they've had bad experiences with men and then they said why doesn't she say
that about her husband's accusers? trump campaign is going to have to take these more seriously. i understand why they're upset it's happening last month of the campaign. everybody should be on guard in the press and in the public for things that happen at the last minute. he's going to have to take these much more seriously than letting people speak on his behalf. >> what exactly is the trump campaign going to do? do you have any specifics? >> i was told that since trump began issuing these accusations and rolling out the clinton accusers, a lot of people are coming out of the woodwork claiming that they were assaulted in the trump campaign's word by bill clinton. campaign told me they're in the process of vetting these women and that trump himself wants to start bringing them to rallies and calling them up on stage. the same way he's called up on stage -- we've seen in past rallies -- the mothers of people whose children were killed by illegal immigrants. so the phrase as we mentioned earlier that trump's deputy campaign manager said to me is
they were going to go buck wild with these accusations of clinton enabling sexual violence and that seems to be their closing strategy for the campaign. >> we mentioned the two women in "the new york times" piece which is what set this off. a piece from "people" magazine, firsthand account from a writer there. a woman reported an incident being groped at mar-a-largo. i would ask this morning. how many women does it take before you believe it? is it ten people? is it 20? is it 50? when do you start believing these women. i would ask kasie hunt as well because you're covering the clinton campaign. how hillary clinton is dealing with this. kellyanne conway tweeted around the debate the other night every survivor of sexual assault deserves to be heard, believed and supported. presumably that includes the women that came out yesterday. what does the clinton campaign do with these new reports?
>> they put out a new statement last night when "the new york times" came out with these saying that these reports are disturbing and that this further pushes the narrative that they've been talking about that donald trump is unfit to be president of the united states. i think you're going to see them handle this the same way that they've approached ever since this tape broke, which is they've usually had something to say that was pretty direct and immediate and then they've taken a step back and said, you know what? we'll let donald trump's words and actions play out. we don't necessarily need to get ourselves involved in this. i think that's how you saw her approach this on the debate stage. when she was asked that question, she had a very specific careful sober tone when she talked about it. then she broadened her answer to talk about how she feels how donald trump has insulted other groups of people, immigrants, muslims among them. you saw her steer away from it a little bit. i think you're going to see that
kind of same reaction going forward. you know, i think one thing that i've started to notice at clinton rallies and other democratic rallies have been interrupted, there is a call out from info wars to wear shirts that show bill clinton's face and rape underneath. these interruptions are more frequent and the goal there is to make sure had a she never comes across as rattled by any of it. that's the challenge for the clinton campaign if in fact this strategy josh green is talking about is how the trump campaign approaches the next month that, you know, they need to make sure she's not rattled by it. >> so talk about, if you could, this strategy we're hearing about on the trump side to drive down the vote to impact voter turnout. how does that exactly work and what have you heard? >> if you take a look at what voters are saying in the polls about enthusiasm, typically what
i'm seeing is trump supporters saying they're a little more enthusiastic about their candidate than clinton supporters. a smaller bucket of people. more loyal to their candidate whereas clinton's problem is a lot of her voters are folks like millennials, loosely tied to the process, where she needs them to show up in order for the math to work out in her favor. so donald trump being really far behind, he may be gambling at this point that it's unlikely he's going to move any more folks in the middle. by adopting this strategy he's not making outreach to new groups and people. the people are with me are going to ride or die with me. i have to make sure that the math works out on election day that they are the last men standing. so the goal is to drag clinton down as much as possible so that if you are somebody who is loosely attached to the process, they both seem horrible. i'm going to stay home. >> phillip, all of this we've been showing polls from the
philadelphia suburbs for the past two days. doesn't look good for donald trump. he's accusations, you take accusations and say where is this going to have the biggest impact among voters? obviously suburbanites and women. women in suburbia. you see it not only philly suburbs, but i can't believe you won't see it also i-4 corridor, columbus, ohio, a lot of these swing areas. this is a devastating message for the last two weeks of a campaign to be getting out there? >> it's hard to see how this isn't deadly. you just showed the poll from the philly suburbs showing that donald trump gets 24% of women in the philadelphia suburbs. that's hard to believe. particularly white women. white college educated women voted for mitt romney. they've been a solid republican voting block for quite some
time. white women in particular have. white women are turned off by donald trump. a group he needs to win. he's made gains with white men without college degrees but falling badly behind with this group. donald trump has been here and not figured out how to increase his lead. clinton has been here. trying to drag her down. there's no way for him to get back up. >> again, we always remind our viewers bill clinton elected president of the united states with 43% of the vote. that's his goal. >> josh green, i have a question for you. i saw the statement from jason miller where he says that these allegations from 30 years ago are being dredged up. then i read your story about their strategy for responding, which appears to be to dredge up old allegations against bill clinton. isn't the thing they're complaining about also the strategy they're embarking on? >> there are a lot of interesting facets to this strategy. part of the problem is that these are 30-year allegations
for the most part. they are against bill clinton not so much hillary clinton although the trump people call her sort of the lead enabler, charge that she intimidated victims. but really what's going on here -- they were quite open about this in my interviews. they're trying to depress the votes of millennial women. they think that the position of clinton's tweet about how every victim of sexual assault deserves to be heard coupled with what they charged with clinton's behavior back in the '80s and '90s hiring private investigators to intimidate victims and that sort of thing is untenable in that once they bring this information to young women voters, they won't be willing to vote for hillary clinton anymore. >> we have some breaking news here. willie and i have been disgusted over the past week as nobel prizes have been handed out. a lot of work in nuclear physics has been stolen. they've stolen everything, right, willie? >> again.
>> so just about every nobel prize we've been screwed. we should have won. willie breaking news this morning. there's actually one nobel prize that we will gladly -- this year, gladly hand over. >> this is breaking news. nobel prize in literature awarded to bob dylan. bob dylan. longer than a long shot. he was a novelty on the list. no way he was going to win. here is he winning for having created new poetic expressions within the american song tradition. bob dylan has a nobel prize. >> absolutely extraordinary. a remarkable career that obviously started out as a folk singer and would emulate willie godfry. he went electric in 1965. he told his crowds if they were going to boo, to boo in key.
just extraordinary lifetime of work whether you talk about highway 61 revisited on one of my favorites blood on the tracks. amazing thing about bob dylan. you go on spotify and you have all of these options. you go back and listen to something like "don't think twice it's all right." acoustic guitar and bob dylan and his voice. it's as powerful as -- i never was a beatles fan. i was a stones fan. i never was a huge bob dylan fan. but it's extraordinary how his life and his music and his words hold up all these years later. >> this feels like a lifetime achievement award and well deserved one. >> all right. josh green, kristen, thank you. everyone else stay with us if you can. still ahead, is donald trump's campaign thinking about abandoning virginia? we'll get hallie jackson's latest reporting on that and
later, libertarian vice presidential candidate bill weld joins us. we're sure he studied the map of syria. we're positive. you're watching "morning joe." >> that's a relief we're talking to him. hey listen, when you tell our friends about your job, maybe let's play up the digital part. but it's a manufacturing job.
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>> it's what i grew up. i'm basically your standard redneck. i was the first person who ever went to college in my family. i had a grandfather, as i told you, who was a saint. he and my grandmother fought the only time. the only thing they agreed on was education and civil rights. he had a sixth grade education. she had a correspondence degree in nursing. they knew they were all the same. so i deserve no credit for what i tried to do. i just raised that way. but i know how they feel. i'm telling you, the older you get, the worst it is. if you look in the mirror every day and think you can't do anything to change the future.
>> bill clinton says he meant no harm when he used the word redneck to describe donald trump's supporters on tuesday. >> was he getting hammered for saying that? >> apparently. >> who was upset about that? >> some conservative outlets and republicans trying to make hay out of it. >> i'm from the redneck rivera. proudly. i proudly say i'm from the redneck rivera. we joke around about it. certainly the way he brought it up was a source of pride. a source of pride of where i'm from. you almost say it defiantly. >> he says he takes pride in the firm and he's not ashamed of it. joining us from cincinnati, ohio, nbc news correspondent hallie jackson. hallie, donald trump and his campaign are fighting back against the latest accusation against trump of unwanted and inappropriate touching. what are they saying this morning? >> touching and kissing without consent. strong denials coming from the
trump campaign on multiple fronts. in "the new york times," the campaign is demanding a retraction pointing to timing of publication of this article just weeks before election day and calling it politically motivated. for the palm beach post article for the piece that came out in "people" magazine, a writer saying she was kissed without consent and pushed her up against a wall, the campaign saying those allegations are simply fabricated and made up without merit. trump's lawyers now threatening more action with senior aide telling nbc news there's potential for "big lawsuits" coming up with the campaign ready to fight back against this. all of it, of course, for days after trump has said that 2005 vulgar audio was locker room talk. words and not actions. that's disputed now by these women coming forward. for the trump campaign, it is something that is taking a lot of attention and a lot of time as they start to shift their
strategy politically. let's talk about what's happening on the political front. nbc news has learned that the campaign is all but pulling out of virginia. this is what sources are telling our team. they are instead going to divert everything to pennsylvania, north carolina, florida and ohio. that is going to be the four-state push over the next four weeks. it's a significant move. it's not particularly surprising when you look at where the polling has been in virginia. but still, this is clearly a campaign in crisis trailing in nearly every major poll and nearly every battleground poll with this final 26 days until election day. >> nbc's hallie jackson, thank you very much. joining us now from south bend, indiana, political reporter for "the washington post" and msnbc political analyst robert costa. in your latest piece, you write about how hillary clinton and paul ryan and how that relationship could shape washington writing in part this. it was october 1998. hillary clinton's midterm
campaign swing for democratic candidates brought the first lady on a saturday afternoon to a middle school gymnasium in janesville, wisconsin. a 28-year-old conservative upstart from the town was running for congress and clinton was trying to stop him. clinton's efforts failed of course. paul d. ryan went on to win. clinton and ryan didn't know each other then and they barely have a personal rapport now. nonetheless, their relationship could become washington most important in determining whether the federal government functions over the next four years. should clinton win the presidency and ryan retain his majority as polls show is probable although not certain for both. and what did you find about the answer to that question? >> the relationship is the talk of washington especially as donald trump struggles in the polls. there's a sense on capitol hill that this relationship could be the key to whether washington works next year. could something actually be done
in this highly partisan atmosphere, charged atmosphere we've seen over the last few years. they don't have much of a personal rapport, clinton and ryan but there are some connections. you do have clinton that graduated from wellsy so did ryan's wife, janna. both sides right now are navigating. where would this go? >> knowing them both or having met both of them, this is a great opportunity to say -- we've been so hard on paul ryan. i totally think they would work well together just knowing their personalities. i think it would be very effective. >> i always said of people when they ask what was hillary clinton like first time i met her because when i ran in '94 i ran against hillary clinton. i ran against hillary care and this other stuff. first time i met her, she's a midwest methodist. i know that's hard to believe
with everything that's been written about her and said about her. when i meet her -- i'm just saying personally, i said this all the time. there is -- i don't know. i just connect with her. it's a no nonsense -- i'm sure she's really hard to work for. i'm sure she's this and sure she's that, the dozen times i've met her throughout the years, ex-tritremely comfortable. there's a solid realness no nonsense, no b.s. sort of take on her that drove me so crazy about her husband that it was sort of -- there's just -- i don't know. same thing with paul ryan. i've known paul since he was 23. these two, if they work together, should be able to work together pretty well. >> time and time again, clinton in the governing context has
been knowledgeable and hard working and she also kind of cares about blocking and tackling of lawmaking and policy and touching members of congress and working with them in a way we saw in the last few years the current president lost his taste for it. >> we haven't had it in 20 years. didn't have it with george w. bush. didn't have it with barack obama and people like bill clinton understood, nixon understood, lbj understood. >> it's something that donald trump of course is totally foreign to him. something he's never done before. the point that's interesting to raise is bill clinton and hillary clinton are very, very difficult politicians. very different personally. also very different politicians and reactions they get from folks is very different as well. it's interesting that over the course of these past 20 to 30 years that hillary clinton has become defined by her husband's type of politics, which i don't think is how most people have experienced her.
>> bob costa, i think also the lens through which she watched what happened in washington and engaged as first lady because of her own personal interest in so many issues has given her a great sense of what works and what doesn't work. >> i think that's exactly right. when you talk to friends of secretary clinton, they point to her experience in early '90s working on health care and lessons learned from that experience and time in the senate where she built relationships with republicans across the aisle and overlap here that could be important on policy. infrastructure has been a priority for speaker ryan. he's talked to some democrats behind the scenes about how that could look. that could be an area of compromise. so could poverty. ryan bought poverty to the fore for the gop. clinton also wants to target poverty. >> we learn more from our
failures and successes. hillary clinton's failure in 1993 on health care reform obviously taught her what the art of the possible was. she had, again, she saw it firsthand as a first lady and in arkansas as well got burned a couple of times. it's one of the things i was saying in 2008. i could not believe that the democratic party put barack obama in the white house instead of hillary clinton. someone who had been there, done that, and was ready to govern on day one. >> someone that knows how the relationships between white house and congress work and knows how to navigate that. i think it's funny. we've heard from the obama administration over the last eight years that we in the media overreact to the lack of relationship that if we had them over for coffee, everything would have been fine. those relationships matter. they just do. if you have a president who is willing to step out and invite those people in and have those conversations -- by the way,
it's happening every day. i was talking to cory booker a couple days ago. he talked just an example of going and meeting roger wicker, the republican from mississippi. couldn't be more different. belief systems couldn't be more different. they wanted to get something done on railroad infrastructure. things like that. so they built a relationship. they became friendly with each other. two people who never would have known each other and got legislation passed. it can be done. >> one of the great failings of the obama administration not understanding just how important those relationships are. i saw it time and time again that building a personal relationship with somebody on the other side of the aisle is absolutely necessary to get legislation moved. >> and there's an acknowledgement on both sides that those personal relationships matter but just a cup of cold water here. throughout my course of reporting on this, people kept bringing up two things. ryan could be burdened by the freedom caucus. dozens of members who don't want to see any kind of agreement should secretary clinton win the
white house and for secretary clint clinton, she'll have her own pressures. bernie sanders, elizabeth warren in senate not wanting a deal on entitlement reform. those are barriers that could maybe stop any kind of agreement from happening even if the relationships are better than they've been in the past. >> robert costa, thank you. great reporting from "the washington post." still ahead this morning -- >> willie and i voted you for nobel prize. >> appreciate that. >> first runner-up. >> if this was the "time" magazine cover before last month in politics, we can only imagine what's in store for this week's edition. we'll reveal the new cover coming up. but the specialists at ford like to show off their strengths: 13 name brands. all backed by our low price tire guarantee. yeah, we're strong when it comes to tires. right now during the big tire event, get a $140 rebate by mail on four select tires.
i spent many years as a nuclear missile launch officer. if the president gave the order we had to launch the missiles, that would be it. i prayed that call would never come. [ radio chatter ] self control may be all that keeps these missiles from firing. [ sirens blearing ] i would bomb the [ beep] out of them. i want to be unpredictable. i love war. the thought of donald trump with nuclear weapons scares me to death. it should scare everyone. i'm hillary clinton and i approve this message.
>> i saw him walk straight in the eye of the mexican president. he didn't blink. he didn't look like hillary clinton or one of those long answers. >> that might explain it. >> that might explain it. former new york city mayor and donald trump's surrogate, rudy giuliani, is facing criticism this morning after accusing
hillary clinton of lying about where she was on 9/11. >> during a paid speech for which they got $225,000, she told the very rich audience that she was speaking to that terrorism was not a threat to us. don't tell me if you said that that you remember september 11, 2001. i remember september 11th, 2001. i heard her say one day she was there that day. i was there that day. i don't remember seeing hillary clinton there. that was, like, when she said she had a run through gunfire. that turned out to be, what do we call it? a lie. >> that turned out to be a lie. just to be really clear and take his words, there's no evidence clinton ever claimed to be in new york on september 11th.
clinton, a senator at the time, was in washington that day. she was able to get to lower manhattan the next day where she stood in the rubble of ground zero right beside rudy giuliani. a few hours after making those comments giuliani issued an apology which seems really convenient. telling the associated press, "i made a mistake. i'm wrong. i apologizapologize." >> clearly exhausted. >> no. >> repetitive behavior in things he's said and done over the past month. >> kind of generous. >> by the way, he said two months ago after the dnc, two months ago, he called her enormously helpful surrounding 9/11. she was enormously helpful. during 9/11 with families afterward. this is the kind of stuff people hate about politics. she was there. she was helpful. you said that in the past. you criticize her on other stuff
but don't make stuff up. >> a series of unhinged performances. >> a biggei don't understand. we talked about this a couple weeks ago. giuliani has an important legacy for this city. an important legacy for what he did along with all of the city workers on september 11th. >> it's tarnished now. >> i just don't understand some of these statements. is he okay? i say that seriously? is the guy okay? >> well -- >> did he forget what he said a couple months ago? i don't understand. i don't understand how people say things like that. you know, the thing is if he said a couple months ago she was enormously helpful, did he forget it then? smart enough to know there's
videotape out there. that's why i'm wondering is it exhaustion? maybe we're being charitable. >> another moment in that same speech where he said she can take her socialized medicine and shove it up her and caught himself and went into this weird moment. i didn't say it. i didn't say it. careening down a strange path. >> i'm not sure it's an improvement for him. >> up next, another wikileaks snares john podesta. plus, evangelicals report that won donald trump more votes than any other republican presidential nominee before him but a new poll this morning shows him showing support among that demographic. david brodie from christian broadcasting network joins us to talk about that. "morning joe" is back in a moment. >> i hear then some people saying, well, i am a christian
and so i'm all about forgiveness because nobody is perfect. well, that is true. i'm certainly not perfect. nobody is perfect. and i, too, believe in forgiveness and redemption but that doesn't mean i'm going to elect the person president. you're not a cook, if you don't cook. you're not a firefighter, if you don't fight fires. or a coach, if you don't coach. and you can't be our leader, if you don't lead. our next president needs to take action on social security, or future generations could lose up to $10,000 a year. we're working hard, what about you? hey candidates, do your jobs. keep social security strong.
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wikileaks released another batch of e-mails allegedly taken from the personal account of clinton campaign chairman john podesta. >> how do you like your g-mail attacked for a week? >> podesta's alleged respond to a quote by republican senator mark kirk condemning the deal. he compared president obama to a prime minister who handed czechoslovakia to adolf hitler. also it includes an alleged e-mail from podesta to hillary clinton and a top aide urging
clinton to call prominent latino politicians to ask for support. the e-mail, which mentions former new mexico governor bill richardson and former energy secretary pena features the subject line, needy latinos and one easy call. meanwhile, a purported 2011 e-mail exchange features podesta and center for american progress fellow reportedly discussing religion. responded to comments on rupert murdoch raising kids as catholic. he allegedly replied i imagine they think it is the most socially acceptable politically conservative religion. their rich friends wouldn't understand if they became evangelicals. here is the response yesterday. >> i'm a catholic. i don't recognize that e-mail
that we saw. and this whole effort is led by the russians. the russians orchestrated this hack. we believe as noted by the statement of national intelligence they're behind timing and manner of the leaks and we're not going to do anymore to comment or aid their efforts. >> the new e-mails also show members of the clinton team viciously attacking catholics and evangelicals. did you see that? the press doesn't want to report that one. that could be election changing. it's just the latest evidence of the hatred that the clinton campaign has for every day faithful americans. >> house speaker paul ryan also weighed in. >> yes, he did. releasing a statement that reads in part this. "the clinton campaign's disdain for the catholic faith and christian evangelicals is staggering. if anything, these statements reveal the clinton campaign's
hostile attitude toward people of faith in general. >> how is the clinton campaign handling the steady stream of wikileaks revelations coming out every worrisome in so much as they have no idea what the next round is going to bring. i mean, we have seen, you know, every day, there's some new tidbit along the way, but i think it's important to remember that, you know, this isn't a case of a whistle blower. this isn't somebody who went and said, hey, there's corruption going on so i'm going to turn these documents over to the proper authorities. this was a hack. this data was stolen. i'm having fun, as a longtime political reporter, the kremlinology on display in these e-mails is fascinating. we're starting to figure out why philippe rines, the top aide who played donald trump, didn't get a job on the campaign. you mentioned the risotto. there's a lot of incredible texture here that really paints a picture of how this campaign is working. but i think you're going to see
them start to focus again and again on what jen palmieri was saying there about the russians. roger stone also acknowledging he has a quote/unquote back channel with wikileaks, that they're also going to focus on, i think. >> brian fallon, who, spokesperson for the clinton campaign, went a step further. he said this is a modern day watergate. somebody broke in, stole our things, andee asked the question, what did donald trump and when did he know it? their approach is they have been hacked by hugzs, a, but b, they would like to know if donald trump was involved. >> joining us, chief political kraunlts for cbn news, david prodi. first of all, your reaction to these e-mails, especially about catholics and evangelicals. >> well, i think paul ryan said it with his staggering. i think in evangelical world, it's like, yeah, tell me something i don't know. i think even evangelicals and
conservative catholics have known this for long time. at least that's the talk around the evangelical table about how democrats, especially liberal democrats, feel about them. so no surprise here. i think the question becomes how much does donald trump do with it. clearly, he's starting to trot it out. >> i wanted to ask you, david, donald trump's relationship with evangelicals, conservative catholics. other people of faith. it's always seemed curious to a lot of people that evangelicals have been supporters of donald trump. any evidence of that support fraying over the past week or so? >> little evidence of that. i know there's been a lot of talk and a lot of media headlines about what the christian post has said and a few other outlets as well. clearly, there is some work to do within the evangelical community, and donald trump would be wise to engage even more with the evangelical
community because of some of this. but the reality is, most evangelicals, even if they have to hold their nose a little tighter, will go to the polls for donald trump. i don't think there's any question -- >> can you explain why that is? that's why a lot of people say how could evangelicals vote for donald trump? what's the answer to that? >> i understand why people are thinking that. look, here's the deal, joe, and i wrote a column about this just a day or two ago. if you've got in evangelical world, if you have two immoral candidates. if you think donald trump is doing things that aren't morale upright and you have hillary clinton. now you're faced with this choice of immoral versus immoral, the tie breaker is the next 50 years of 5-4 supreme court decisions, and it's beyond that. they believe, and evangelical world, as you know, grace is sufficient. there's quite a bit of grace in evangelical world, so donald trump should be thanking his lucky stars if any block of voters is going to give him grace, it will be evangelicals
because they know all about that because the last time i checked, jesus came down to this world and gave grace to all of us if we accept it. >> david, it's nick confessore. yesterday, we saw jerry falwell jr. said that you don't have to share someone's values to vote for them. i wonder if that's an argument that will have a lot of water with evangelical voters. >> yeah, i mean, i think so. and i think once again, if you look at the kind of totality of all this, you know, donald trump talks about repealing the johnson amendment. donald trump talks about this idea of fighting how christians are under attack in the public square. you're not hearing any of that from hillary clinton. i think it comes down to this. look at it from a percentage standpoint. in evangelical world, and i keep saying evangelical world because this is kind of like the world view, the scuttlebutt, if you will. zero percent, they believe you're going to get from hillary clinton in the next four years. you're probably going to get 60% to 70%, 75% from donald trump.
you do the math. the last time i checked, when you see 60% is greater than 0%, you go with that as the right answer. >> okay, we have sound from jerry falwell jr. yesterday talking, something related to this. take a look. >> if these things happened, would you still support him? would you still vote for him if these things happened? >> i can't answer a hypothetical. i can't answer a hypothetical question. you're saying if, if he murdered somebody, would i forgive him? >> these are allegations. these are women saying it with their names. so yes, i'm giving you a hypothetical because these women are coming forth and telling their story and he says it isn't true. i'm saying if what they say is true, does jerry falwell jr. vote for trump? >> i'm going to vote for donald trump because i believe he's the best qualified to be president of the united states. i'm not going to say anything to besmirch the character of any of these women. it's the heat of an election. it's four weeks away from election day.
and everybody is in a frenzy, so we have to keep that in mind. >> david brody? >> david brody, dot dot dot. here's the dot dot dot part of it. at someo point, there does becoe enough water in the boat where it will sink. that's with any politician, though donald trump has put a lot of water in the boat and it's not sinking. there's a reason for that. look, i think one of the things in donald trump's favor is he can play the mainstream media card because these revelations are not coming out in august or four months ago or five months ago. they're coming out three, four weeks before a general election day, and i think that plays well in his narrative of, hey, look, it's all against me. everybody is against me. i think that plays well with evangelicals. >> okay, david brody, thank you very much. >> thank you. >> up next, donald trump is
fighting hillary clinton. top republican leaders, and now multiple media reports of women accusing him of inappropriate touching. a closer look at the allegations. and trump's reported strategy moving forward. "morning joe" is back in a moment. look at all these purchases you made with your airline credit card. hold on...you only got double miles on stuff you bought from that airline? let me show you something better. the capital one venture card. with venture, you earn unlimited double miles on every purchase... not just...(dismissively) airline purchases. every purchase. everywhere. every day. no really! double miles on all of them! what's in your wallet?
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make sure it's ano make a intelligent one. ♪ the highly advanced audi a4, with available virtual cockpit. welcome back to "morning joe." it's 8:00 on the east coast. 5:00 a.m. out west, and back with us, veteran columnist and msnbc contributor mike barnicle. political writer for the "new york times," nick confessore, and in washington, managing editor of bloomberg politics, mark halperin.
let's get to it. >> a lot to talk about today. >> donald trump and his campaign are fighting back against a number of stories that came out late yesterday accusing trump of unwanted and inappropriate touching. the "new york times" released an article yesterday that features the allegations of two women, rachel crooks tells the paper she was a 22-year-old receptionist working for a real estate group in trump tower in new york when she met trump one morning in 2005. she says they shook hands and then trump kissed her on the cheeks before kissing her directly on the mouth. in the case of jessica leeds, she told the"times" she met trump 35 years ago while sitting in first class on a flight. she accuses him of touching her after the denner trays were cleared and she got upset when he put his hand up her skirt. both women say they support hillary clinton, and leeds says she hopes her story makes a difference in the election.
nbc news has not confirmed the allegations. the trump campaign told nbc news the article was fiction and it trivialized sexual assault. trump's lawyer went even further, sending a letter to the executive eder it of the paper demanding a retraction and apology, calling the report reckless, deflammatory, and jason miller, trump's senior communications adviser said, in part, quote, this entire article is fiction. for the "new york times" to launch a completely false, coordinated character assassination against mr. trump on a topic like this is dangerous. to reach back decades in an attempt to smear mr. trump trivializes sexual assault and sets a new low for where the media is willing to go in its efforts to determine this election. it is absurd to think that one of the most recognizable business leaders on the planet with a strong record of empowering women in his
companies would do the things alleged in this story. and for this to only become public decades later in the final month of a campaign for president should say it all. >> mika, what do you think? >> i think that it's -- the stori stories, i guess, speak for themselves at this point. nbc news hasn't done -- gotten its own sourcing on it. i don't want to say knnanything yet. i don't know. i do think that this is going to get so ugly if we thought it was ugly now. >> that's what josh green actually has written about donald trump believes, you know, that he's going to spend the next couple weeks doing this. why don't we talk about what josh green is reporting? >> okay. >> donald trump believes that his gambit to invite three women who claim they were assaulted by former president bill clinton to last sunday's debate has not only left his democratic
opponent shaken but has helped to unite republican voters. >> according to a report by bloomberg's joshua green, trump will double down on the strategy, which trump believes will make hillary clinton toxic and weaken voter turnout for her among young women. according to a senior trump adviser, the campaign will soon bring forward new accusers. women are coming to us who have been groped or sexually abused by bill clinton. they're trying to decide whether to feature these women at campaigns. the republican nominee's decision to close out his campaign by attacking what he alleges to be bill clinton's history of sexual violence suggest the next few weeks could be among the ugliest in presidential history. new accusers have come forward after seeing media coverage. the plan to increase the focus on sexual misconduct is spear headed by stephen bannon. deputy campaign manager david
ba bosse, and jared kushner. bill clinton has long denied past allegations of misconduct and has never been charged with crimes from the woman trump featured at the debate. he did pay an $850,000 settlement to paula jones with no admission of wrongdoing, with the prospect of additional clinton victims coming forward, a trump adviser said we're going to go buck wild. >> he also was disbarred by the united states supreme court, and i think the arkansas supreme court, for lying under oath during the sexual harassment lawsuit. what were you going to say, mike? >> i was going to ask mika if she believes the woman who came forward to the "times." do you think the memory has any credibility? >> i don't think it's ubme believing. i think -- you know -- >> let me ask you a different question. would you remember something that happened like the alleged
actions that are charged to have occurred if it happened to you 35 years ago? >> yes, i would, and actually, i spent a lot of time in washington and had experiences like that with very powerful people in washington. some of them that were -- >> some people actually ironically, people had experiences with some people who right now are going out and being very self-righteous and with leaders of news organizations that are going out being very self-righteous. and by journalistic gods who are being very self-righteous over what is going on. i mean, come on. >> i would say there are -- first of all, contemporaneous people in these accusers' families who they talked to about it at the time. and we spoke to them for the story, the "new york times" spoke to them. you can read the steps that were taken to verify the accounts. i will say there are now a great number of these accounts and accusations over many years from
different people. and we are seeing a pattern to all of them. it's the forcible kissing. it's moving into the room and then making a sudden move. you see it again and again. >> he described it in the statements. >> patterns. >> he's admitted it himself, to howard stern. >> exactly. also on a tape to billy bush. it fits what he said he did to billy bush. he said i just kiss them. >> what is the impact of that? does that make him unqualified to be president of the united states? >> for the voters to decide, not me. i think it raises a real question about his character. the people are going to evaluate. if they want to bring up allegations against bill clinton, i don't think that's unfair or out of bounds, but he's not running for president, ultimately. hillary clinton is. >> this also, as nick touched on, is the culmination of six days which started on that "access hollywood" bus where he described almost this. using his star power to grab women and to walk up to them and
kiss them, which is what a lot othese women are describing. we didn't get into the first-person account from the "people" magazine writer, natasha stoynoff, down at m mar-a-lago where she describes mei lanio going upstairs to chaj, and he closes the door behind her, and starts kissing her. she goes on and on in some detail. a very disturbing account of what happened. i think if we're going to believe the bill clinton accusers, doesn't the same rule apply to the donald trump acc e accus accusers? >> i called the bill clinton accusers accusers. and i don't -- you know, i'm not making a judgment on that at all. these are accusers. i will just say that for the young women that were very young at the time this happened, i mean, i had experiences like that in washington. i was a page on capitol hill. my parents prepared me for men like this. and there are many of them in
washington. in the media and in politics. and it's the girls who come in from town who don't really know, that's the traumatic experience for them, because they don't know how to handle it. and i believe these things could have happened. i do. >> because they happened to you. >> i have seen a lot of men like this. i know them today. >> there are two things that are quite vivid in all of these stories. one is what you just referenced. no woman, including you, forgets things like this. >> oh, no. >> the other aspect of it is really, at least to me, really interesting. the bill clinton accusers and the accusations made against him, if there were the power of social media that exists today, existing in 1992, he never would have been president of the united states. >> i don't know about that. i remember in real time, because i was there, women who came forward with these type of accusations, and mark halperin, you'll remember this very well.
>> and there are people who make it up. >> women who came forward with accusations like this, and i have no reason to doubt any of these accusations whatsoever. i'm talking about, i remember in the '90s in real time, bill clinton, it's hard to believe they did this. but bill clinton and hillary clinton's political apparatus dismissing these ladies as sluns and nuts. reporting that hillary clinton was in fact, quote, in charge of the sluts and nuts operation. she headed it up to destroy women woo came forward with these types of accusations. james carville saying after a sexual harassment claim where that was settled, saying, well, i guess if you derog a dollar bill through a trailer park, no telling what will come up. i guess that's what's so surprising to me, that when we have people connecting with the clinton campaign being so shocked by what's going on here,
i think we're all deeply dist b disturbed by what's going on here, but i would only say to hillary clinton, you had me at nuclear winter. you should probably just leave this to the press. and just please, we were all there in the 1990s. and our memories are not that short. leave it to the media, and stop being self-righteous about something that you know all too much about. but mark halperin, the josh green report suggests that we are now going to have a he said/she said on both sides over the last three weeks. is this any way to run a campaign? is this any way to run a country? >> i have been covering campaigns since '88. people say this is the most negative campaign we have ever seen. we're now in the most negative campaign i have ever seen. and donald trump's behind. right? he's behind. his campaign would acknowledge he's behind, and they recognize their options are limited in
terms of how they can come back. and it's extraordinary that in the midst of an attempt to come back, they're toning increasingly, as josh green reports, to going after bill clinton's past at a time when donald trump's past is now going to be scrutinized more than it ever has. a lot of extraordinary things about what's happening now, the difficulty of the press in any allegation on any topic that comes up in the last month is a challenge for the press to handle. i thought the "times" handled this very responsibly. i don't think there's any chance donald trump will sue despite the threat. the issue now going forward i think is how are all of these claims, including the allegations and the implications of the wikileaks documents, how is all this going to be handled? i i tell you, not going to talk a lot about housing or health care or foreign policy. this is going to crowd out everything for the foreseeable future and i'll say again, donald trump is behind in this race. i was with him yesterday in florida. he actually, i thought, was pretty good at trying to be on message.
but he's not going to be on message for a good long while in dealing with these allegations. there the floodgates may have opened anyway, but his answer to anderson cooper when he asked him pointedly, does this mean when you deny this, does that mean you have never forcibly kissed a woman? he said, quote, i have not. to a woman as you read all these stories, each said they were watching the debate. they heard them say that and they felt this was the time to come forward and tell their stories. this may just be the beginning. this is one night where we got five women, and there's another story in the daily news. he talks -- >> some of these things happened thi 30 years ago, and they're all falling days before the election. is that a coincidence? >> that's why i say it may have happened anyway. this is an opo drop, but i think his declaration at that debate that he had not done it opened the floodigates. >> i totally disagree. >> really? >> i don't think you can call it
an opo drop. i think the "times" makes pretty clear as you suggested, a lot of the women coming forward are coming forward in reaction to what he said to anderson cooper. an opo drop suggests it's from the clinton campaign. i'm always skeptical. >> i think it's good to be skeptical when you have stories that are 30 years old that come out daysber an election. so i think, mark, that's actually a good instinct on your part. >> we should be skeptical and question -- >> not skeptical of the stories. i'm not skeptical at all of the stories. skeptical of the timing that all of this has dropped over the past five days. days out from an election. doesn't it seem that a more appropriate time to drop these stories might have been after the first republican debate when the front and center issue was how badly donald trump treats women? megyn kelly's first question in the first republican debate was how horrifically donald trump
treats women. now, if this had happened to me 30 years ago, i would say this would be a really good time for me to come forward. right? >> i think all the republican campaigns would ask themselves why this stuff didn't surface earlier, because it may have stopped donald trump before now. >> what do you think the answer to that is? >> hold on one second. >> let me ask mark this and then you can answer. what's that, why do you think it came out days before the election? >> it came out days before the election because of what he said, because of the billy bush tape, the "access hollywood" tape and what he said to anderson cooper. look, we need to remain skeptical about the wikileaks process and the content. and pursue that. we need to maintain skeptical about how this happened. again,ium not be critical. i think saying opo that it's coordinated, maybe it is, but there's no evidence of that. if you look alt how the "new york times" says their account transpired, what the "people" magazine reporter said, it has
nothing to do with coordination. it has to do with women feeling aggrieved and concerned. >> what about what he said to megyn kelly? again, i'm wondering, what was the trigger? >> the megyn kelly question was about things he said. >> also treating women badly. this is a recurring theme in media coverage for a year and a half that donald trump is a misogynist. by the way you look at every "huffington post" story they write about donald trump, at the bottom, they say he's a misogynist. it seems to me, i don't think there's anything special about what he said to anderson cooper versus what everybody has been accusing him over the past year and a half, that it dropped days before the campaign in october. >> two things. first of all, there have been a string of stories about this for months in multimedia outlets. there's a boston globe story, a "new york times" story, crossing the line was a big story, 5 million people read it online. his accounts of behavior with
women. talks of beauty contestants. any number of stories over the fast four or five months. i couldn't say when the first one was. i do think that mark is right that the comments at the first debate were about insults to women and what was different now was him coming out and specifically denying what he had said on that tape with billy bush, which clearly speaks to the experience some of these people had actually, that the exact thing he described doing to billy bush is what we're seeing in some of these stories. i think that's making it happen. >> let me -- i want to -- >> by the way, mike, how were you in the 1990s with bill clinton? did you write columns kunl deming his behavior? >> i did, more his draft dodging. i want to be -- i'm having difficulty understanding the source of your skepticism. skepicism is healthy.
>> skepticism about what? not the women's stories. i'm skeptical about the timing of all of this dropping, talk about an october surprise, when again, as you said, there have been a thousand triggering events that would have made sense if i had been sexually harassed by this man. the megyn kelly story would have given me an opportunity. like you said, there have been 1,000 of these reports already. i'm just asking why suddenly all of this stuff is blowing up in october. perhaps it's all innocent. perhaps there is no opo drop. perhaps it's not coordinated. i'm just saying, i think i'm only agreeing with mark halperin that we need to remain skeptical. and i have found over my 25 years in public life that being
skeptical usually pays off in the end. we will find out the truth about why these stories dropped, when they drop, if anybody had anything to do with the timing of it, outside of the "new york times." we will find that out in years to come. so i'm just saying, skepticism is a good thing. this campaign, though, is really sinking to an extraordinarily low level. and we're now going to be having women put in front of the camera by both sides now. and given the stay of this country and given the state of our politics, it's really, really sad. >> still ahead on "morning joe," napoleon, southeacaesar, and hi. bill weld put a point on the presidential race. he joins us live in a bit. >> but first, what the suburbs of philadelphia can tell us about the state of the race in
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that time is of the essence in the 2016 election, an nbc analysis finds that about 500,000 votes have already been cast this election cycle. >> oh, my gosh. >> many in key swing states. and there's new state-wide polling out this morning, in pennsylvania, clinton leads by nine points in a four-way poll. it's the same margin in the head-to-head with clinton over the 50% mark, leading 51% to 42%. the bloomberg politics poll also included interviews in the four keep philadelphia suburb counties that have played a role historically in determining who carries the state.
in this poll, clinton leads trump 59% to 31%. a 28-point advantage. that is 18 points higher than barack obama's margin in the same area in 2012. and in missouri, donald trump leads hillary clinton by five points in the latest monmouth university poll, 46% to 41%, but that's nearly inside the margin of error. a month ago, they were in a dead heat. >> very interesting. we were trying to figure out what the accusations and everything in the debate, what impact it was going to have. it looks like it's been a push. the pennsylvania poll numbers about the same, and actually, trump is doing better this month in missouri than last month. >> it ain't our poll, good news for trump before the latest round of accusations. he did better in the poll after the debate than before. people are troubled by the "access hollywood" video, and trump can get to 270 without pennsylvania, but they have long thought it was their best shot
to get to 270. they don't think that anymore, in part because of what our poll found. coming out of pennsylvania with a huge disadvantage, and esthesfour counties where mitt romney held his own. he's being slaughtered. he talked about child care, yesterday in florida, i was covering him in lakeland. he talked about child care a bit, but nothing he's done on issues has allowed him to close the gap in if four counties. the combination of the big deficit in the four counties, the deficit in philadelphia that any republican is going to have, makes pennsylvania unwinnable for him. pat toomey is neck and neck, even in the deficit, he's in the margin of error with katie mcginty. you see donald trump's weakness not necessarily burdening other republicans. >> if donald trump comes up short in the campaign, it's going to be because of women and suburbs. these latest stories that have
come out actually are like a heat seeking missile to both of those demographic groups. deadly in the suburbs. deadly among women. and women of all political stripes. even conservative republicans. some conservative republicans thinking, i just can't vote for a man who has all of these charges against him, and probably thinking, bringing up bill clinton because i think the press was extraordinarily hypocritical on clinton versus what is going on now, in the '90s and now, but you know who is not hypocritical? these women, who will say, these republican women who said i didn't like it when bill clinton did it. and i don't like it when donald trump did it. i didn't vote for bill clinton and i'm not going to vote for donald trump. it's going to be devastating for him if this continues throughout election day. >> and if those voters, those women did think perhaps the talk on the "access hollywood" bus was just, as donald trump said, locker room talk, now you have stories that show otherwise. i would ask you, mark halperin,
do you think these numbers out of the philadelphia suburbs because this is now the second poll in as many days that has shown complete blowouts. the nbc/"wall street journal" poll had it at a 16-point spread. is this a story about pennsylvania? are you seeing that trend in the suburbs in places like ohio and florida as well? >> there hasn't been a lot of polling but it's safe to say in the columbus suburbs and charlotte suburbs, donald trump is probably having similar difficulties, maybe not quite the same. pennsylvania is a state they have want given up on because they can't. even if they win all the romney states, even if they add iowa and ohio and florida and nevada, they're still short, so they need to find one more state. so you're seeing right now, you have mike pence and ivanka trump both schedules to go back into pennsylvania. they can't give up on it, but they're going to have, as you said all just said, they have to do better with women. yesterday, a lot of women at the rally had signed saying women
for trump. he doesn't understand why he's behind with women in the polls because everywhere he goes, women say they're for him. he has a math problem with women and these latest stories aren't going to help. if they start to try to have a battle over his past versus bill clinton's past, they roll the dice. he's too far behind with women to find victory. >> coming up on "morning joe," from republican governor to libertarian vice presidential candidate. bill weld joins us live next.
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we started off, we had no isis. and now, 7 1/2 years later, they're in, they think, 32 countries. and she's going to get rid of them? i can tell you this. they are hoping and they are praying. they are hoping and praying that hillary clinton becomes president of the united states. because they'll take over not only that part of the world. they'll take over this country, they'll take over this part of the world. believe me. >> joining us now, the libertarian vice presidential nominee, former republican governor bill weld of massachusetts. good to have you onboard this morning. >> good to be here. >> okay. what's the strategy to come in second to make donald trump third? which is part of your plan. >> well, gary and i have been letting people know that there is another alternative out there
to former two-term republican governors who are demonstrably fiscally conservative, which should appeal to republican voters, and we think a lot of republicans will not be able to pull the lever for donald trump. it's not just the sex allegations recently. it's that he's campaigning straight out against everything the republican party has stood for. >> like what? >> for free trade. he wants to have a closed economy and pretend there's no world out there. traditionally, as recently as nafta when i worked with bill clinton and newt gingrich to get that passed, the republican part as is where clinton needed the votes to put that through. both the major party candidates have really turned their back on free trade. >> trump calls nafta the worst piece of trade legislation. >> trump thinks every car is made in one country and sold in another country. he doesn't realize there's stages of manufacturing, and maybe mexico does a little low wage stuff so low wage jobs deto
mexico, but that allows the car companies to sell more cars in korea and japan against those manufacturers and hire more engineers and marketing people, which are high-wage jobs. we have such an edge in productivity per worker that we always get the high-wage jobs out of free trade. the solution is not to disregard the geographic areas and industries where we lose the low-wage jobs. >> that's the next question, what do you say to the millions and millions of workers who feel like they have lost their jobs, they have lost their communities, they have lost their way of life because of trade deals and globalization? >> right, where we have a national problem like that or, you know, young black men with no jobs, i say we go in there, we have worker retraining, worker resettlement programs. we make efforts to have more partnerships between manufacturing companies or hi - high-tech kaeks. >> they were talking about doing that in 1992 in the new hampshire primaries. why do we still talk about that
and with little hope of it having an impact? how do you do what nobody else has been able to successfully do over the last 20 years? >> it may not be everybody's dish of tea, but i'm a big public/private partnership guy, and i read about efforts in a apalas vegasa right now to bring in environmental engineering industries, internet companies that are necessary in a new economy, the new economy, and people are doing that themselves, self-help, to make up for the coal and steel jobs that are being lost. that's very good, and i think the government can assist that and re-enforce that. >> so governor, late yesterday, governor johnson, your running mate, issued this statement. donald trump cannot win this election. it's time for republicans and all americans to face that reality. and it's time to reject the notion that he's the only option other than hillary clinton. americans deserve better. women deserve better. so that reality that governor johnson is talking about, with regard to donald trump, does that reality not also apply to
the libertarian ticket? you cannot win. >> i think if the country focused on the third way, which we represent, kind of like the tony blair of britain or bill clinton of 1996, we're fiscally conservative and socially liberal. that's a majority of the country. be that as it may, whether you think that's impossible putt or long putt, we're going to keep trying, but we want to make the point that mr. trump cannot win, and there's a lot of republicans out there that when they realize they can't vote for donald trump, we want to make the small point that they do have somewhere else to go. it could even help the republicans in the down ballot races because then those people wouldn't stay home. they could vote for us and vote for republicans down ballot. >> governor, as someone as fluent as you are in foreign policy, i heard you talk at length on different shows about china, mexico, what ought to be done in syria, were you dismaced about your running partner's inability to answer basic questions? what's it like to sit next to him when he struggled to answer
those questions. >> i think gary is very solid on policy. he was a very solid governor. certainly, he was eloquent on the perils of syria before the aleppo moment. pop quizzes, snap quizzes on television, not his torforte. >> hooshouldn't he know what alo is? >> he knew what it was. he just didn't copy on the context. he thought it was an acronym. i heard him talk about syria in some detail before that gaffe. >> you're comfortable with his grasp of foreign policy? >> let's put it this way. he's a western governor. he hasn't had occasion to travel as much as, say, i have in the last dozen years both on business and as members of organizations of heads of state. i had probably more foreign exposure in the last ten years than i had previously just because of how i have been spending my time. gary's time has been more in the west. >> why not you on the top of the ticket? >> because my friend gary johnson called me said and said would you like to be on this
ticket? he was already my friend. we liked each other a lot. >> but don't you say to a friend, yeah, i'll be your running mate, but i'm going to be on the top of the ticket, because that would be a more effective ticket. >> not when he's already run once before. >> you were fairly close to hillary clinton, you have known her for a long time. if she does become president of the united states, give me the scenario where she can govern under the current polarized conditions. >> part of what i have been saying is the current polarized conditions in washington aren't accept. i think she might go to the hill, do outreach, and say listen, we're not getting anything done with having both parties having no thought but to kill each other. they're also hyperpartisan. all they worry about is getting re-elected. what would be the silver bullet for what is wrong with washington is term limits. i was national chair of the term
limits with howie rich when i was in congress. if congress won't act on that, the states have the power to force the amendment. i think that would be a worthy cause after the election. >> take care of term limits. take care of gerrymandering, and you have taken care of a lot of at least what ails the house. >> yeah, we wouldn't have to work for a living if we knocked off those two. >> that would be pretty good. >> governor bill weld, thank you so much. great to have you on the show. >> why start working, exactly? >> still ahead, donald trump has repeatedly said hillary clinton should be in jail. his campaign manager says don't take him literally. we're back in a moment with that. how can good paying jobs disappear? it's what the national debt could do to our economy. if we don't solve our debt problem 19 trillion and growing money for programs like education will shrink. in just 8 years, interest on the debt will be our third largest federal program.
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deleted the e-mails. she has to go to jail. and her law firm, which is a very big and powerful law firm, which is the one that said, well, they'll determine what they're giving, those representatives within that law firm that did that have to go to jail. >> he's talking about going around the democratic process. i mean, talking about jailing your political opponent is something that -- >> no, he's not. he's talking about the result. no, he's not. you're taking it literally. you're stuck on this one thing. >> he's saying she has to go to jail. he's not talking about she has to stand and be judged. he's saying she has to go to jail. >> and -- in other words, what are you saying? you're saying he had to stop and say here's how you get to jail, here's the process. it's complealy ridiculous. >> he's talking about a
predetermined end result here. >> no, he's talking about what a lot of americans want to know why the heck this woman wasn't punished at all. bl. >> all right. >> nancy gibbs writes in this month's "time"s magazine, issues in election year are aunl like the fat book s that we're glad o own but don't read. keep it here on "morning joe." f. i'm beowulf boritt and i'm a broadway set designer. when i started designing a bronx tale: the musical, i came up... ...with this idea of four towers that were fire escapes... ...essentially. i'll build a little model in photoshop and add these... ...details in with a pen. i could never do that with a mac. i feel like my job is... ...to put out there just enough detail to spur the audiences... ...imagination to fill in all the blanks. this windows pc is amazing, having all of my tools... ...right at my finger tips is incredible.
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>> this was the august 22nd issue of "time" magazine entitled meltdown, which "time" said the since the convention, donald trump had done, quote, almost nothing right by traditional standards. the writer of that cover story revisits that notion in the magazine's new issue. now, it's a quote, total meltdown, and the piece's co-author, washington correspondent for "time" magazine, alex altman, joins us, along with nancy gibbs. also at the table, author and columnist for the new york daily news and msnbc contributor, mike lupica. >> nancy, what was the editorial decision to do this? >> this has been true all year, where we say it can't get worse, can't get lower, nothing can fall apart, and then it gets worse. but this week, where he himself is talking about a scorched earth to the mattresses kind of campaign, it really is like
nothing we have seen. the meltdown is not only him. it's his party. it's the open warfare. three weeks in front of an election. it is impossible to get your head around in historical terms quite apart from in real time. >> alex, any evidence he had no choice but to basically go to the map here? >> well, i think certainly he feels he's pinned into a box, that he is certainly on a trajectory to lose, and i think what he's looking to do in a way is lay some, we call it exculpatory groundwork, to say that the election was rigged. my party abandoned me. and to nurture his base at the expense ovtrying to build his coalition. >> mike, what's the long-term play? >> you put those two covers together, and it looks like he's the wicked witch of the west, and he's shrinking and melting at the same time. to me, it's extremely symbolic. this has turned into political porn. i mean, for the last three weeks
of this campaign, it's going to be bill clinton's accusers against donald trump's accusers. and it's going to be like this conga line of accusations. and when you look at the wikileaks stuff, it's like his running mate isn't pence anymore. it's julian assange. >> let me ask you this. do people at the end just tune it all out? if it's just one accusation after another accusation after another accusation? >> no, i don't think they do. i do think that there's a general level of noise that you're unable to differentiate anymore what's important, what's not important. and the trick for mr. trump, as i see it going forward, how does he say that his accusers are not credible and the accusers of bill clinton are credible? that's a pretty tough tightrope to walk. >> that is a tough tightrope, and i completely agree with you. i think it's also a tough
tightrope, willie, for hillary to walk, saying that because donald trump has been accused of doing this, he's unfit to serve as president of the united states, as she said after the tape came out, when she campaigned pretty hard for another guy who was accused of doing the same thing or worse. >> yeah, it's an ugly stew. let's be honest. it just is. >> you think? >> look at it. here, we have a picture, artist rendering of the stew right here. >> it goes way, way back, but particularly just this week. nancy, starting with friday, the "access hollywood" tapes, the debate question set up where anderson cooper said did you do anyway of the things you talked about? and he said, no, i did not. that encouraged many women who came out last night, they were motivated by him saying that at the debate. >> this issue also has 53 pages of arguments and analysis about the policy issues that whoever
wins is going to have to deal with. it's from taxes and debt to the opioid epidemic and paying for college. and what i think is especially discouraging to voters is the fact that everything that is happening in front of us makes it harder almost by the minute for us to move forward. in any productive way. >> nancy, do you find with these covers, which are dramatic and terrific, are they selling? are they moving the needle? because joe and mika were saying this all the time, are people still paying attention? do you find that they're engaged? >> this is what's fascinating. people are more engaged, and we have seen this by every metric, more interested in this election than any in 20 years. they're watching debates in higher numbers. paying attention in higher numbers and overwhelmingly, they're disappointed by it. they can't take their eyes off it, it is kind of a car wreck, but it also is making them deeply unhappy and discouraged at the same time. >> alex, can you predict the next cover?
>> i shudder to think things go lower, how we'll render it artistically. >> what do you expect from your reporting over the next two weeks. >> they should be prepared for things to get even uglier. i think that the trump campaign has decided that, again, their best way to win is probably to drive down turnout. to count on their base, and basically to goose them by trotting out a parade of accusers of bill clinton. they signaled last night in an article in businessweek that they have more ready to go. i don't think this is going to turn into a high-minded debate on policy issues over the next couple weeks. i think it's going to be a barrage of character attacks coming from trump towards clinton, and clinton trying to float above the fray. >> so mike, we started this campaign with the two most unpopular nominees in american political history.
and it looks because of the way the campaign is going to end that nobody is going to get out of here alive. be it donald trump or hillary clinton, who is elected at the end, they're going to start with rick scott approval ratings. he started at governor on the day he was sworn in with like 34%, 35% approval rating, and it's hard to recover. >> the next cover will be like an orange spot on your tie. what's interesting to me is what nancy said, people are more engaged and interested in this campaign than any other in history, but part of the plan for trump now is to drive down voter turnout. doesn't it seem like those two things are counterintuitive? >> it does. >> alex and nancy, thank you very much. we'll look for the new issue of "time" magazine. a follow up to the august issue. >> very excited to read, and i'm serious, about the policy. you go through the policies, whether it's child care, health care. looking forward to reading that. >> mike lupica, thank you as well. we're back in a moment with more
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if i lose i will consider it the biggest waste of time, energy, and money i have ever done in my entire life. true. >> oh, my gosh. >> you know, mika, there aren't a lot of things that the presidency of grover cleveland will be remembered for, but one of them was, of course, the second time he came back, not the first.
because he's not that old, but the second time grover cleveland was in the white house, one mike barnicle was born. >> that's true. >> a smiling beautiful baby boy. >> you didn't come through on the pickup truck, i'm going to say, but i'm coming through on the birthday present. is wan't that beautiful? ♪ happy birthday to you ♪ happy birthday to legendary ♪ happy birthday dear legendary ♪ >> can i say something? >> yes, mike, go ahead. >> i'm happy to be here. i never thought i would make it this long. >> we love you. >> i greet each dawn with delight. >> here it comes. >> no, seriously, because i'm grateful for my wife and i'm grateful for my friendship. >> you better be. she's amazing. >> i'm grateful to be here. >> let me bring you -- let me bring you closer to death.
there you go. >> we're grateful every day that you're here. and we're just delighted that you're a part of the family. >> that does it for us for now. stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now. >> happy birthday, mike. good morning, mika. good morning to you. i'm stephanie ruhle. we have breaking news this morning. an avalanche of accusations. multiple women coming forward to multiple news outlets alleging that donald trump inappropriately touched them. >> it was a real shock when all of a sudden his hands were all over me. >> at least four women stepped forward overnight, plus even more pageant contestants allege inappropriate behavior. one of them speaks exclusively to nbc news. >> and it was at that time where he turned to me and embraced me and gave me a kiss on the lips. i remember being shocked. >> firing back, donald trump denies all of them.