tv All In With Chris Hayes MSNBC November 1, 2016 5:00pm-6:01pm PDT
the world sky high and trump saying that hillary will cause world war iii in syria. when they go low, we go high. not quite. but sadly it's come with this week to go up two candidates yelling bombs away knowing we all have to live in a country that looks so much better before this started. and that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. tonight on "all in" -- >> he has shown us who he is. let us on tuesday show him who we are. >> one week to go. >> we must win on november 8th. we must win. >> polls tighten as early voting continues. >> i already voted here in jamesville for our nominee. >> tonight what we know about where this race stands with seven days to go. plus, the fallout from the trump tax bombshell with michael
moore. then -- >> so important that you watch. >> why a federal judge just ruled the rnc must explain their ballot security plans. >> when i say watch, you know what i'm talking about, right? >> and a united states senator's plot to stop hillary caught on tape. >> if hillary clinton becomes president, i'm going to do everything i can do to make sure that four years from now we've still got an opening on the supreme court. >> when "all in" starts right now. good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. exactly one week till election day, it's an all-out blitz on the campaign trail. today alone president obama, vice president biden, bernie sanders and hillary clinton and tim kaine all barnstorming battleground states while the republican ticket donald trump and mike pence held events in pennsylvania and wisconsin. trump wrapping up his last event
of the day just moments ago. seven days out it's clear the race has tightened significantly. it's the first time trump has led this poll since may. clinton's margin in the real clear politics stands at 2.2% down from a peak of 1.7% a few weeks ago right after the emergence of the tape on which trump bragged about kissing and groping women without their consent and after a dozen women came forward with stories of trump doing exactly those things. it's not clear if the tightening in the polls stems from james comey's widely condemned disclosure of new e-mails to a top clinton aide or suggests that republican leaning voters coming home to the party once trump's sexual boasts faded from the headlines.early voting unde clues at who is getting to the polls this year.
in florida the latino turnout appears to be way up over 2012 race. but among african-americans, the numbers are nowhere near where they were four years ago. the battle for control of the senate, political forecasters still give democrats a real edge. they've got a 59% chance of winning the seats, 68% according to fivethirtyeight. those odds have declined since comey's odds last friday. republicans sensing an opening just launched a pretty misleading new ad targeting democratic senate candidates.
>> it's time to start asking why are democrat senate candidates still standing with hillary clinton. they already know about the smashed e-mail servers, sketchy meetings, shady political donations, special immunity deals, now hillary clinton is under fbi investigation again. >> to be clear, clinton is not really currently under fbi investigation. in fact, here's the thing.
we still don't know if the newly discovered e-mails have anything at all to do with her or her private server. comey's decision to inform congress about the e-mails before having to turn in their significance or looked at them has drawn criticism from democrats and republicans alike. even senator chuck grassley, the
republican chairman of the senate judiciary committee wrote comey a letter expressing concerns and demanding he release more information by this upcoming friday. we'll see if that's even possible. pete williams now reports that despite earlier optimism the review would move quickly the process isn't moving very fast. amid a spate of leaks to the press raising further questions about the integrity and impartiality of the fbi, new concerns that cnbc reported yesterday, that comey kept the fbi from publicly blaming russia for hacks of democrats because he didn't want the bureau to appear partisan so close to the election. the clinton campaign is trying to stay on offense.
robbie mook calling on the fbi to give donald trump the same treatment it gave to hillary clinton. >> all that we're asking, so that reporting can be fair, is that the information get released. release whatever information they have, and then if you're in the business of releasing information about investigations on presidential candidates, release everything you have on donald trump. release the information on his connections to the russians. maybe there are investigations now into his taxes. >> trump's taxes may not have been legal. reports of the maneuver trump used conferred enormous tax benefits on him losing vast amounts of other people's money by exploiting a loophole. today clinton sought to remind voters of trump's treatment of women. she appeared with alicia machado who trump shamed over two decades ago. even instructing his twitter
followers to check out her nonexistent sex tape. >> he made fun of me, and i didn't know how to respond. he told me that i looked ugly. he said to me, miss piggy, miss housekeeping, miss eating machi machine. soon it became a joke. alicia machado was the fat miss universe. it was really painful for me. >> president obama hit the campaign trail today in ohio where he took a hammer to trump's populist sales pitch. >> if you are out there every day working hard, punching a clock, the notion that this guy is your champion when his entire life he did not have time for anybody who wasn't rich or a
celebrity, who wouldn't let you into one of his hotels unless you were cleaning the room, wouldn't let you on one of his golf courses unless you were mowing the fairway, come on. this guy is going to be your champion? >> i'm joined now by congressman elijah cummings, the ranking member on the house oversight and government reform. congressman, it's been a remarkable few days since the comey announcement. we still basically don't know anything about what it was. there was a fairly strong consensus has emerged that it was probably the wrong judgment by director comey. are you worried about the integrity of the fbi right now as we have this sort of cascade of leaks emanating from the bureau unnamed sources pointing this way and that and we're collecting an election under these circumstances? >> i am worried about the integrity of the fbi. mr. comey, when he came -- director comey when he became
before our committee, he made it clear back in july that he did not want to and would not subject hillary clinton to a double standard, and that's exactly what is happening here. as a lawyer, i can tell you the integrity of the fbi is very important. the american people basically want fairness, but here it appears clear that there is a double standard. on the one hand, chris, we have been informed through this very vague letter about the investigative steps being taken by the fbi with regard to hillary clinton but on the other hand when it comes to donald trump and his advisers and the russian government and their efforts to undermine our election system and our situation here in the united states, we don't get a word. and a number of us in congress have asked for months about information with regard to mr. trump, his advisers and the
russian government, any kind of coordination or cooperation going on between them. and we have got not a mumbling word, not one syllable. >> i want to play for you something that donald trump said tonight in wisconsin. he's having a rally in wisconsin. he appeared there with senate candidate ron johnson, your colleague in the senate, not in the house and scott walker republican. he threatened a constitutional crisis if hillary clinton were elected. take a listen. >> if she were to be elected, it would create an unprecedented constitutional crisis and the work of government would grind to an unbelievably unglorious halt. >> you know, this strikes me as essentially a promise from the republican party that i think is sort of aimed at, you know, suppressing enthusiasm among democratic voters, people believing that it will be a
disaster and a nightmare because we will make it so if you elect hillary clinton. >> and that is not our way of the government in the united states of america. we're better than that. when you put out those kinds of statements, i think they're counterproductive, they're not patriotic and they go against every single thing our democracy stands for. and keep in mind, those kinds of words i think play right into the hands of mr. putin. no doubt about it. and so i think that the whole idea of telling people, like some of the senators have said, that they would not go along with appointing a supreme court justice for four years, those kinds of statements and then the whole announcements by trump talking about he doesn't believe in the elections and that they're going to be rigged unless he wins, all of those things is like a hijacking of our democracy. and i for one will not stand for it. i don't think the american
people will stand for it. >> congressman elijah cummings. appreciate your time. joining me now senior spokesman for the obama campaign 2008. now here as a consultant. also middle reliever for the cubs, got left off the roster. you know democrats, you know liberals, they get panicking. let's start with the map. you got this situation where this is sort of a quadrennial tradition in which the republicans said they would campaign in blue states, there was a huge rally in pennsylvania. it didn't work out for him. you got something similar this time around. is this a head fake or is there real softness in a state like michigan that hillary clinton herself is going to on friday? >> listen, the president visited wisconsin in 2012, bill clinton was in pennsylvania the day before the election in 2012. it's smart for democrats to really solidify their base and get to 270. i don't see that as really any
worry about michigan. what i do think is needed is rallying some enthusiasm, especially among african-american voters. that's what this trip is about. democrats are bed-wetters and not unlike cub fans and i can speak as both a democrat and a cub fan. we tend to worry. but the thing here is we have to go back and look at the fundamentals of this race. the fundamentals of this race really are exactly the same. the map is exactly the same. we start out with 242 electoral votes if we win every state that we've won for the last six elections. that gets us past 270. the math in these swing states is very much in our favor and moving more and more so. finally our organizing advantage is tremendous over donald trump. so we know based on the work and investment that we put in the data and our field and our organizing efforts, we know the
voters we need to reach, the ones that voted early, the ones that we need to turn out on election day. the structure that democrats have in place should give us great confidence just like the cubs starting staff did. >> well, right, to extend the metaphor, right, bad stuff can happen. so if that's the sort of structural advantage, right -- >> right. >> for instance, one of the things we've seen is we have seen lower levels of african-american turnout in early voting in states of north carolina and florida. much of that can be ascribed to early voting was cut back in predominantly black areas shockingly by the republican government. this is the first time the democratic party is trying to preserve the coalition without the first black president. >> that's absolutely true. i do think there's some cause for concern around african-american turnout in enthusiasm, we're seeing that in the numbers. but at the same time especially in early vote numbers democrats have pumped up their
registration numbers and turning out hispanic voters in rates. if you look at florida as of saturday or the equivalent saturday four years ago, we've got 660,000 democratic votes. we have 1.4 million democratic votes already in the bank, right? same thing in nevada where turnout is up, in colorado where democratic turnout outpaces republican turnout in the early vote by 30,000 votes already. so yeah, we do need to look at african-american voters and ensure that we're able to drive out our base for the next seven days, but we've also identified other groups that are moving forward and actually producing votes. >> hari sevugan who will be very happy after he checks his phone after this. the flow of outrageous behavior doesn't seem to have lasting impact on his polling. michael moore joins me to talk about that. niece. i don't use super poligrip for hold,
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amid all the talk of tightening polls, this race has been remarkably consistent even if not particularly steady even if the news has been otherwise. every time the republican nominee has done or said something seemingly beyond the pale from attacking a judge over his family's heritage to mocking a former miss universe's weight even getting caught on tape bragging about sexual assault and having 12 women come forward and accuse him of sexual assault. every time donald trump has done or said something that would have ended any other candidate's chance chances. michael moore in trumpland is playing in select theaters and available on itunes. you've got this line about him being a molotov cocktail. and i think it jives with things i've heard from trump voters and even folks who are not hard core trump voters. people acknowledge his flaws.
there's a certain hard core that have a personality cult, but a lot of them are like yeah, he says dumb stuff. you said he's like a molotov cocktail. then donald trump tweeted at you, i agree, michael. i am your voice. vote to drain the swamp. >> yeah. well, you know, there's one thing about him. he has no filters. and the fact that he would acknowledge what i'm trying to point out to people, that he is intending to blow up the system. >> right. you're right. >> he tweets me, he's a self-acknowledged anarchist who plans to go in there and just blow things up. so i think this is something that we need to be very concerned about. the other part of this, though, too, is all those things you listed about every time something bad happens to him, he dips for a second, but then he just gets stronger. i can't remember the name of that science fiction film from the '50s, but the creature any
time any negative energy comes at it it makes him stronger. >> although he returns to this kind of base of support. it's not like he gets -- >> well, that's true. and what happened with comey, you know, he had hasn't really picked up any new votes from that, she hasn't really lost any. i think the real danger of what the finn director did is that her -- and i hear this now -- i've been out in the states in the last few days. her support, a small percentage of it has weakened in the sense that they're still going to vote for her -- >> the enthusiasm. it's the bummer. >> okay, yes, i'm still voting for her. >> it strikes me as awesome for folks who lived through the '90s. a sort of reminder of the sort of like star chamber spanish inquisition kind of treatment of bill clinton. >> right. >> and this idea in the back of your head even if you're a partisan democrat or liberal or
supporting him, oh, my god, this will be the next four -- >> even people who support her or vote for her will be, i can't believe she did -- like what? what did she do? what did she have to do with anthony weiner? she has nothing to do with him. why are we talking about this? why does he have anything to do with this? but i just think that, you know, i watched on "morning joe" this morning, they played this "the way we were" theme song under all these democrats who three months ago were praising comey and you're the greatest thing since sliced bread. if i could take you home and marry you, i would, comey, i love you. and then it's like, oh, oh. >> but that is part of the fundamental dynamic here and something you talk about in trumpland and something that you have an interesting perspective on because i think you -- i think you find the polarization, the partisan polarization in the country unnerving and upsetting
even if you have very strong political views, right? i don't think you think of yourself as some centrist, but the degree to which partisan corners is upsetting. >> no, i think it's okay. i have strong feelings about the thing i believe in. >> right. >> and those who don't believe in what i believe in and feel strongly, but we've lost our way in the sense that we can just have the great debate and then get on with it. the republican candidate has said if he loses the debate, if he loses the vote, he's essentially called for and inciting riots, which i think is still against the law. this was a law set up mainly against unions and black people and, you know, lefties. but the fbi director should be paying him a visit asking him what are you actually intending on november 9th should you lose? what are you telling the people? >> right. but we also don't want -- >> no, i don't want him arrested or anything. >> a candidate to be hemmed in by the fbi director. >> but if he's planning for
riots, we need to plan for them ourselves. >> i don't think he's planning on riots. i think what has happened is a consistent undermining of the notion of the integrity of the process. that's been the common theme. if i'm losing, then it's rigged, right? >> yeah. yes. well, listen, i think -- listen, here's -- my big concern right now, and especially with this abc poll out today where he's ahead by a point. just walking in here liberals on the streets of new york, mike, mike, what are we going to do? i said, man, come on, buck up a little bit here. you know, yes, treat it -- i've been saying this for months, trump can win. i've been one of the few on the left that's been saying this. now everybody gets it. >> right. >> nobody is sitting back watching us going the heck with all this. >> complacency. >> we're done with that. now let's get excited about the fact that we live in a very liberal country. you go down any of the issues, the majority of our fellow americans agree with us.
climate change, paying women the same. >> plus six out of seven presidential elections with a democratic plurality majority. >> and two of those elections our felly americans voted for a guy whose middle name was hussein. >> who was a good segue who said something today that echoed something you've been saying about how men feel about the first women president. i'll share that if you stick around. >> yes. from food alone. let's do more. add one a day women's gummies. complete with key nutrients we may need... ...plus it supports bone health with calcium and vitamin d. one a day vitacraves gummies. you know what, guys? there's a lot of tree branches and dry brush over here. we should probably move the bonfire over there. [smokey whistling a tune] i'm guessing smokey liked that idea.
is voting to kind of look inside yourself, if you're having problems with this stuff, how much of it is that we're just not used to it? so you know, like, when i a guy's ambitious and out in the public arena and working hard, that's okay. but when a woman suddenly, why is she doing that? i'm just being honest. i want you to think about it. because she is so much better qualified than the other guy. >> president obama in columbus, ohio, asking men to think about whether they are being sexist when it comes to scrutinizing hillary clinton. still with michael moore. i thought that was an amazing moment for the president, sort of saying to men out there, ask yourself if you're having some reaction to hillary clinton what that's about. >> yes, what is that about? well, i'll tell you what it's about. it's the muscle memory of 10,000 years that's in our dna when
we've run the show forever. and now in the most powerful country on earth, next tuesday possibly, hopefully, a woman is going to lead the most powerful country on the earth. in other words, the 10,000-year reign is over. and come on, give some of these guys a little bit of empathy here. it's a bit of an adjustment to have it be one way for 10,000 years -- >> although that's a -- look, i know this is sort of a slightly comedic conceit on your part, but that's an oversimplification. >> no, i don't think so. when you say oversimplification with men, you're being redundant, let's be honest with men of our own gender here. guys have got about a week to wrap their heads around the fact that hillary clinton is going to be president of the united states and this is going to be good for us. guys, seriously, guys, if you're watching, this is really good. let women run the show. it will be a lot less stress on us. they live three years longer than us. >> i feel like this is the sort
of mars/venus shtick, where to me it's more about the fact that we're all independent-thinking citizens. >> yes. >> and we should be making judgments about who we think are the best -- >> we should, but we're still guys. there's no way around that. even though all of us guys have a little bit of estrogen in all of us. >> but this feels like -- i guess my point is there's a certain amount of male privilege, right? >> yeah. certain amount? like yeah. >> huge amount. >> yeah. >> and you can feel the palpable crisis of masculine authority happening in this election. >> yes. and they're going to have to get over it. they will get over it. i am old enough to remember signs that said "whites only" and "colored only." i grew up in a time when the n-word was used as often as you would say the word kleenex. that's the era i grew up as a child. those people had to change.
the future came in. everything moved forward. these men are not going to be able to stay this way. they'll get on board the train and thaey'll realize that actually having women who have a say in what's going on, makes the planet, makes your life actually better. >> the movie is michael moore in trumpland. >> as we close, cubs fan, chris hayes, has a 200-inch screen over there. >> yr you blowing up my spot, michael moore? >> he has like a -- look at this. look at this. >> we have no express written consent. >> thank you, thank you, thank you for snitching. michael moore. coming up -- >> vote for hillary. >> -- a judge just ruled the rnc must explain their ballot security plan. 3
kids, childcare they can trust and afford, equal pay for women, and jobs they can really live on. people ask me what will
be different if i'm president? well kids and families have been the passion of my life and they will be the heart of my presidency. i'm hillary clinton and i approve this message.
. go down to certain areas and watch and study and make sure other people don't come in and vote five times. so important that you watch other communities because we don't want this election stolen from us. >> take a look at philadelphia, what's been going on. take a look at chicago, take a look at st. louis. >> it's perfectly legal for presidential campaigns and political parties to send observers to the polls on election day to help, say, track which supporters have already voted, make sure election law is being followed and offer general assistance to voter. what is generally not legal is
to send people to polls in order to intimidate people in order to suppress the vote among a particular group, which is precisely what the republican party was doing in new jersey in 1981 when it employed off-duty law enforcement officers to polling places in minority districts wearing arm bands called national balt security task force and in some cases, firearms. democrats sued and as part of a so-called consent decree still in place to this day, the rnc agreed to refrain from tactics that could be used to intimidate voters. but donald trump and his allies have been flirting with those types of tactics. telling supporters to monitor polls in largely black locationsp you can sign up to be an election observer and, quote, help me stop hillary from rigging this election. they plan to videotape voters
and conduct fake exit polls. the group even allowed poll watchers to print out official looking badges although after questions from the huffington post, stone took down that function. why he plans to conduct the fake exit poll. >> the clintons fear this program because they would like to, you know, get away with the perfect crime. rigging the machines would be the perfect crime. and therefore, this really threatens them because it is the only tangible proof we may have of the hijack. >> there is, of course, no basis for that accusation whatsoever. democrats have now filed federal lawsuits against trump, stone and state parties over intimidating parties in four states. they're seeking, among other things, to block volunteer gop poll watchers from harassing or photographing people and prevent aggressive question of voters waiting to cast their ballot. in a separate case a judge ordering the republican national
committee to detail any agreements it has with donald trump's campaign to engage in ballot security efforts. after they indicated they were working with the rnc to monitor poll violations in direct conflict with that same decree. >> the trump campaign and the republican national committee are working very, very closely with state governments and secretaries the of state all over the country to ensure ballot integrity. >> let's start with this. you've got -- people can go to polling places to watch, right, campaigns, lawyers, different people can go there, a public place. what were the kinds of activities that were being engaged in that led to that consent decree that tipped something over from being an observer to essentially engaging in voter intimidation? >> in 1982 or in 1981, the election, what they were doing
was they put law enforcement at these polling places, and they targeted black and latino polling places in new jersey and so just by force of those officers being there with badges and, you know, calling this program ballot security program when in fact, you know, their ballot security is what we would call intimidation. and they targeted voters of color. >> right. >> and then fast forward 2004 one of the things, the advancement project, my organization, we actually intervened in that case because the rnc and the state parties, including the state party in ohio, had started conspiring again to do another ballot security program. and what happens is because that court order is still in place the gop has to go to new jersey and get approval of that court before they engage in any kind of ballot security program.
they hadn't done it in 2004 and i'm sure they haven't done it this time. >> they have to go before a federal judge and say, hey, look, this is our plan, does this violate the consent decree? >> because they want to make sure they're not targeting voters of color again. >> this is a little tape that came from florida, an early voting site, these are trump supporters outside sort of engaging in hectoring, i guess you would call it. take a look. >> how many syrian refugees are you taking into your home? i want to of you hypocrites. you want somebody else to pay for it. you're hypocrites. >> because they're standing by the signs we know they're the legally prescribed distance from the polling place. that's first amendment protected. we're talking about people that are inside that cordon, inside polling places, right? >> right, right. so most states do have laws
about how close to the polling place you can get, like a hundred foot rule in many states, 100 feet from the front door. they have to stand outside of that. of course, the first amendment does protect them. but if their actions do get to the level of intimidating people or threatening people, that is where they have violated the law. the other thing is that we have to be careful about people who are inside the polling place, right? so poll watchers, and in many states there are rules by which they have to sign up to be poll watchers. and then they can't be inside intimidating voters either. >> you can't have people sort of just walking up to voters and saying, hey, are you registered? you can't do that, right? just to be clear. >> no, we cannot have havoc and chaos in the polling place. and so those are the kinds of things that we'll be looking out for on election day as part of the election protection coalition because while we're protecting voters they are so-called protecting the ballot.
we want to make sure that people don't get threattened and intimidated in the process. >> thank you for being with me tonight. >> thank you. >> they'll hold the open supreme court seat hostage for four years if clinton wins. more on that ahead. thing 1, thing 2 starts right after this break. [ sighs ] [ rumbling ]
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thing 1 tonight, it's undeniable that a single social media platform is having an influence on this presidential election. consider one of hillary clinton's most memorable lines at the dnc, a line the president reiterated today. >> i think hillary made a pretty good point. a man you can bait with a tweet is not something you want to trust with nuclear weapons. >> twitter.com has driven stories this election. for instance, that time trump retweeted someone with a handle white genocide. leading to questions about just who makes up the trump
electorate. or when donald trump lashed out and disparaged alicia machado in the debate. and twitter has served as a public record after trump denied calling climate change a hoax in the first debate, fact checkers pointed to several times when trump in fact called global warming a hoax. but given the prominent role twitter has played in this election it's easy to forget how young the platform is. president obama his first tweet coming in may of 2016. six years in they're finally giving me my own account. what had become of @potus. no, i picked the wrong insurance company. with new car replacement™, we'll replace the full value of your car plus depreciation. liberty mutual insurance.
his @potus handle will remain with the white house and be available to the incoming president. he'll move over to potus 44. bonus perk, the new president gets to keep the 11.1 million followers already amassed on that account. but all the existing tweets will be moved on inauguration day giving the incoming potus a field to fill as he or she pleases. (ee-e-e-oh-mum-oh-weh) (hush my darling...) (don't fear my darling...) (the lion sleeps tonight.) (hush my darling...) man snoring (don't fear my darling...) (the lion sleeps tonight.) woman snoring take the roar out of snore. yet another innovation only at a sleep number store.
if someone asks you who are you voting for? you respond with the name of the person you're voting for. mitt romney, obama, trump, whatever, or maybe you say none of your business. but not if you're house speaker paul ryan. when donald trump attacked judge gonzalo curie el ryan said claiming a person can't do their job because of their race is sort of the textbook conversation af racist comment. after the "access hollywood" tape was released ryan told his caucus he would no longer defend him or campaign with him.
even then his endorsement of trump was slow in coming. but now ryan, says this person who he cannot bring himself to name, should be the most powerful person in the world. >> i stand where i stood all fall and all summer. in fact, i already voted here in jamesville for our nominee last week in early voting. we need the support our entire republican ticket. >> you voted for donald trump and you're encouraging republicans and democrats and independents, anybody who will listen, to vote for donald trump to stop what you're talking about, the clinton corruption? >> i am supporting our entire republican ticket. i have been all along. >> he cannot bring himself to say the name of the man that he thinks should control the nuclear arsenal. republicans have also for nearly a year now been promoting a made-up rule that they needed to wait until after the election to consider a supreme court nominee. now that they're worried that clinton will win, they are forming a complete new untenable position. that's after the break. i love that my shop is part of the morning ritual around here.
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some are already saying they won't appoint a ninth supreme court justice boasting of their refusal to compromise as if that's an accomplishment. how does that help you? >> not to look too hard for the republicans president obama was describing tonight boasting for government obstruction. take north carolina senator richard burr up for re-election right now, republican incumbent in north carolina, who said this at a campaign event on saturday. >> in a lame duck session that you guys would appoint a supreme court justice?
>> well, my answer to you into be it isn't going to happen. period. and if hillary clinton becomes president, i'm going to do everything i can do to make sure that four years from now we still got an opening on the supreme court. >> burr is not alone in this. senator ted cruz said there is certainly long historical precedent for a supreme court with fewer justices. that's a debate we're going to have. and prior to that john mccain said that republicans would be united against any hillary clinton nominee before suggesting that hearings would be had. just how remarkable this is. justice antonin scalia died with 140 days left in the sitting term. it would take the president's staff of not granting the sitting president's nominee judge merrick garland a hearing because republicans had invented
a new rule saying that in the final year of the president's term they could refuse to give a hearing to the president's nominee because the american people had to weigh in. >> the american people should be afforded the opportunity to weigh in. >> we think that the american people need a chance to weigh in on this issue. >> let's let the american people decide. >> put off till after the election. >> this should be a decision for the people, george. let the election decide it. >> okay. very clear. let the election decide. now as we approach the election, the possibility they will lose this election looms, some republicans are now changing their story and saying that even after they declared the election a referendum in the supreme court vacancy, they may ignore the result if it doesn't go their way and proceed to take a sledgehammer to constitutional traditions. joining me now sabrina, let me start with you. i've been having this debate for months now. the republicans will block a hillary clinton nominee if in
fact she wins. and people said, you're crazy. they're going to have to come around. you've been doing some reporting on this. what are you hearing? >> well, i think there is a split that's emerging and in part because you have a faction of republicans who are creating this new litmus test that if you're a true conservative you're going to block any nominee the potential clinton presidency puts up. i talked to marco rubio about this topic. he said he won't predispose, is the word he uses, any nominee proposed by clinton to that kind of test, implying that they might get at least a hearing. then you have jeff blake who has actually said we should just confirm merrick garland in the lame duck because clinton will probably appoint a more liberal just. where do they want to go after this election and how do they want to resolve what we call trumpism if in fact hillary clinton wins and this is how they created trumpism by putting up promises they were never going to be able to keep. if you say we won't fulfill a
supreme court vacancy for four years that's not a tenable position and that's what will cause the grassroots uprising that caused people to select donald trump. >> what do you think of that theory? >> obstructionism is almost inevitable. this is the new dividing line in the republican civil war. this is the litmus test for anybody in 2020. i try to imagine how american politics would be different if republicans would say we won't overturn row versus wade and democrats would say we won't overturn heller. but there's a reason why republicans are rallying around one of the most repellent human beings in the united states. one of the arguments i hear over and over again, we have to save the supreme court. this has become the red line. if hillary clinton limps into that office, you can expect this ugly campaign to be followed by years of obstructionism. the weaker she is, the more emboldened they will be to hold the line on this issue. >> i hear the same thing.
there's two things i would say. one is it's remarkable that they've sort of bootstrapped this. >> yes. >> they've said we cannot -- we absolutely cannot confirm merrick garland who has been praised by hatch, is widely respected as a centrist jurist, et cetera. we have to keep the seat open. that becomes the reason to vote for what you just described, in your words, one of the most repellent human beings ever to run for office, is the supreme court. and now you have the escape hatch essentially being drilled into the back, which is -- >> yeah. >> sabrina, think about what burr is saying. i want people to be clear about this. they are suggesting essentially a dieoff on the supreme court. i want the be very clear. to say that we will keep that seat open is to say we hope the actuarial charts catch up with some of the democratic appointees and they die so things can even up. that's what's implicit in that promise. >> and chris, the last time you
had a vacancy that was as prolonged as they're suggesting was actually for over two year, about two years and three months, that was in 1844. you have ted cruz saying there's a historical precedent for having less than nine justices. for 150 years the composition of the supreme court has been to have nine members on the bench. it is important to note that senate republican leadership is not voicing support for this plan. in fact, chuck grassley who chairs the senate judiciary committee he tried to take it down a notch and say, look, i've said that the next president will be the one to appoint a nominee and i'm sticking to that commitment that i made, otherwise i would be going back on my word. and that's notable. the pressure will be overwhelming. donald trump and steve bannon, they're creating this grievance movement. this will be their hot button. ted cruz needs to make himself relevant again. he needs an issue to set himself up. this will be his issue. the pressure will be overwhelming particularly because conservatives and republicans have convinced
themselves -- think how many things they have embraced, think how many things they've rationalized by telling themselves it's the court, it's the court. it won't go away after the election. >> ex post facto psychologically, you've done all these things to get yourself to support this person. you can't just give it up. >> right. >> to charlie's point, i agree there's a split among the leadership and this may never come to pass because donald trump could be elected president and the senate will -- if it's a republican-controlled senate, probably confirmed as nominee. but this split i think is indicative of this sort of deeper thing which is just that the pressure of trumpism if trump doesn't win will move into that body very quickly. >> absolutely. that's why you see this jockeying, as charlie mentioned, where ted cruz wants to find an issue where he can elevate himself again. curry favor among those he may have lost while wavering on the endorsement of donald trump.
but this is going further than ideology. this is eshl isle denying a democratically elected president, if it is hillary clinton, of fulfilling the obligations as president and they did that to obama, too, who was re-elected in 2012. and there were more than 300 days when they passed the away for him to fill that vacancy. >> the rachel maddow show starts right now. >> thanks, my friend. >> you bet. >> thanks to those at home for joining us this hour. happy tuesday, happy november. happy all souls day. happy week till you know. bladenboro, north carolina, 2,000 people live there in southern rural north carolina, it's due south of fayetteville. every year in bladenboro, they host something called the bladenboro beast fest. i don't actually know why it's called the beast fest, but i do know that they hav