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tv   Morning Joe  MSNBC  December 2, 2016 3:00am-6:01am PST

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december. "morning joe" is going to have those numbers as soon as they cross at 8:30. residents in san bernardino, california, will mark the one-year anniversary that does it for us on this friday. have a great weekend, everyone. "morning joe" of course starts right now. ♪ >> think of it. we won in a landslide. that was a landslide. remember, you cannot get to 270. the dishonest press. there is no road. folks, how many times did we
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hear this? there is no path to 270. there is none. texas is in play. do you remember that one? now, as a republican i'm supposed to win texas. as a republican, i am supposed to win georgia. as a republican, i'm supposed to win the great state of utah. i love utah. love those states. remember when they said donald trump is going to lose to some guy i never even heard of. who is that guy? he is going to lose to this guy. there's no way that donald trump can break the blue wall, right? we didn't break it, we shattered that sucker. we shattered it. >> okay. good morning. it's friday. >> how about that? >> this has been a very robust week. >> intense.
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>> it has been an intense, robust week. you know what's not robust after all this time, sam stein's beard. >> he's here. how are you? >> not alone in his washington studio. >> i sat down and he ignored me. i wanted him to look at my swee tweets and he's not interested. >> you don't think what mika is saying is worthy of taking notes? >> great to be back. >> he still can't lift the hammer. >> with us on set, managing editor of bloomberg politics -- >> what was that? kellyanne said because somebody reported something that -- >> just stop. >> they were yelling. did you see that? what are they yelling at each other for? >> kasie hunt was there and saw it all. whoa. >> willie, tell us what
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happened. you went to the harvard. >> there was an event -- >> you got a t-shirt. >> i did. kennedy school of government had an event last night where the main players in the two campaigns clinton and trump campaigns sat across from each other. it started off as sort of an academic -- >> rigorous metrics. >> and then it turned into a steel cage match as the raw feelings came to the surface. they were screaming at each other. if that's what it takes to win, i'm glad we didn't win, et cetera, et cetera. kellyanne didn't like that. a big fight. we'll show that later. >> you went to harvard. why can't your people -- >> it's not my harvard anymore, joe. it's all different. >> you didn't leave harvard,
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harvard left you. >> when i was there it was gentle. gentlemanly. womanly. >> in washington -- >> the guy is a genius. >> he said when kissinger got the nobel peace prize that one act effectively killed political satire forever. you can't top it. >> in washington, we have david ignatius. thank you, david. >> fight fiercely. >> one sad fact of history. today is the last episode of "with all due respect." tonight is the night. >> tonight is the night?
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we know what you're doing. >> i love it. >> "tonight is the night" excellent run but 6:00 p.m. and 5:00 a.m. seems to be a bit much. >> you have big things coming. >> all i can say is david copperfield, watch out. >> we have a lot going on. donald trump was in cincinnati, ohio, last night. the first leg of what the transition is calling a thank you tour. here it is. >> i kept hearing you must win ohio. you cannot win the presidency without ohio. so we started really we were about even at the beginning. then we had a couple troughs. with ohio it got better and better. history called and the people of
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this great state answered. you're going to be very happy. we're going to say right now, what are we going to do? we're going to make america great again. you watch. we spend too much time focusing on what divides us. now is the time to embrace the one thing that truly unites us. you know what that is? america. america. we'll compete in the world. we want to compete in the world, but we're going to compete in the world where it's a two-way road not a one-way road. the advantages are going to come back to our country. there is no global anthem, no global currency, no certificate of global citizenship. we pledge allegiance to one flag and that flag is the american flag. from now on, it's going to be
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america first. okay. america first. we're going to put ourselves first. we're going to seek a truly inclusive society where we support each other, love each other, and look out for each other, and that means that people coming into our country have to be people that have the potential to love us, not to hate us. we condemn bigotry and prejudice in all of its forms. we denounce all of the hatred, and we forcefully reject the language of exclusion and separation. we're going to come together. we have no choice. it's better. >> you know, mark halperin, i always talk about how presidents aren't all created equally. some are better at things than others. barack obama on a big stage with a teleprompter delivering prepared remarks is just as good
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as anybody ever. george w. bush was awful in certain things. east room press conferences but get him in an office one-on-one and he wassed as good as anybod. this is his strong suit. he absolutely loves it. and last night was an audience that was just custom built for him. >> he feeds off of it. we need three copies. one for the smithsonian, one for the time capsule and this is what the next four years are going to be like. >> this is just the beginning. >> never a speech like that during the transition in my career. >> that's what i was wondering when i looked at it last night. who does this? donald does. >> donald does. he breaks the rules.
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again, this is what he's most comfortable at. most people that campaign don't love campaigning the way he loved campaigning. teddy white asked richard nixon one time, when you reach out shaking people's hands, do you ever want to -- nixon finished his sentence, kick them in the chin. teddy white goes, yeah. trump loves this. >> got him elected. >> got him elected. we all mocked him. said you can't win by holding big rallies. apparently this is his strategy. >> i saw a guy last night as i watched that who missed this for the last 3 1/2 weeks. he did this for a year and a half. he fed off it. it gave him energy and life. he was back as though it were a campaign event. chants were back. they said "lock her up." playing greatest hits last night. he was in the state of indiana for this carrier deal, which is interesting on many levels. tax breaks, sure.
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more jobs leaving still than staying for carrier. but it is a delivery of a promise with the help of governor mike pence in his home state of indiana on something he gave to the people during the campaign and delivering on one here now as president-elect. >> at the rally trump made the surprise announcement of his pick for secretary of defense though the pick itself not much a surprise. >> are we doing a good job with our cabinet and our people? [ applause ] i don't want to tell you this because i want to save the suspense for next week. so i will not tell you that one of our great, great generals -- don't let it outside, right? we are going to appoint "mad dog" mattis as our secretary of
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defense. [ applause ] but we're not announcing it until monday so don't tell anybody. "mad dog." he's great. he's our best. they said he's the closest thing to general george patton that we have, and it's about time. it's about time. >> all right. so david ignatius, let's break it down. we'll get back to the patton description in a minute because i don't think that's quite app for those that know general mattis. i didn't know much about this guy before his name came up in the selection process. it seems that the washington foreign policy establishment certainly hold him in the highest of regard and feel a little more comfortable this morning because donald trump seems to be listening to him more than anybody else. >> i think for all of the relish with which trump used the phrase
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"mad dog" talking about mattis, he is a reassuring figure both for washington and foreign policy people and also for people around the world. general mattis is somebody that's known overseas. he believes in partnerships and allian alliances. this is good news. it's good news for nato. general mattis worked closely with nato on weaponization transformation and other programs. he's very well known to the military and pentagon establishment. the current chairman of the joint chiefs served under him in iraq. the current cno of navy served with him. the head of centcom served with him. this is very much a known figure. the one question that people have is whether this distinguished general, fighting general, he is that, has the management skills to take on what arguably is the toughest
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management job in america which is running the pentagon. it's tough for anybody to do that but in some ways especially tough for former uniformed general officer. >> let's talk about the patton description. there's that famous scene where bradley says to patton the difference between you and me, george, is i do this because i have to do it. you do it because you love it. patton says i do love it. that's not mattis at all, is it? general mattis is one who has seen war, is wary of it at best. >> mattis is a warrior intellectual i would say. he's not a blood and guts guy. he is a person who likes a fight when he's in it and wants to win it. he was tough on the way to baghdad in 2003. he fired one of his subordinate commanders for being insufficiently aggressive in that campaign. he was furious at the white house for not letting him push
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ahead in fallujah in the initial phase of the battle of fallujah in 2004. he is a fighting general. he's also an extremely well read man. he's supposed to have a library of 7,000 books. in my conversations with him over the years, they've been reflective. if you were to describe his foreign policy views, you would say he's a realist. not a guy that wants to go out and start fights. >> willie geist, not only are they 7,000 books but they're leather bound. rich mahogany wood in the library. >> i have 8,000 books. >> maybe you can be sec def next. >> so sam, he hasn't been out of active service long enough. do you think this pick has any chance of being stopped? >> let's explain why the waiver
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is there. we don't tend to appoint a military personnel as head of the department of defense. the country has been committed to civilian rule for a while. i think the last one was marshall in the '50s. the waiver is needed for him to get in place and gillibrand says i like the guy and respect his history but i'm uncomfortable with this. i have a sense she's going to be in the minority here. in part because in addition to his sterling records and resumes here, there's a discomfort among democrats over whether donald trump's foreign policy will be and that mattis represents a buffer. we should go back to "the new york times" interview trump gave where he talked in one conversation with general mattis, he got talked out of waterboarding. that's a massive philosophical principle. >> he talked about it over and over and over again and then sat down and talked to a professional who had been through this and who said no. >> it's not just a professional,
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it's someone he admires. i think trump can be moved by people that he respects and admires. we're seeing it a little bit with his phone calls with obama and i think mattis will serve that function. if you're a democrat and look at this, what are the other options? >> if you're concerned about general flynn as a four-star and flynn a three-star and flynn has the greatest respect for mattis and will defer to mattis and you're comforted by mattis being in the cabinet there to counterbalance. >> and bob gates walking in the door. >> talking to general flynn. you want to assure me, get bob gates in there. that's great. >> that was a guy trump was critical of during the campaign and on this show. >> look and see what trump has been doing. nikki haley bashes him. she's u.n. secretary. mitt romney bashes him. he's a finalist for secretary of state. bob gates bashes him. he's talking to bob gates.
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>> this is the short memory you're talking about that politicians need to have. >> bill clinton said the best trait you can have as a president is a very short memory. donald trump showing at least this week that for some political rivals he has a very short memory. >> who doesn't have a short memory? >> this is fresh for a lot of people. the 2016 presidential campaign turned into a shouting match as top strategist from both the clinton and trump campaigns debated over how president-elect trump pulled off his victory on election day part of a two-day forum at harvard university sponsored in the wake of every presidential election since 1972. operatives from nearly all primary and general election campaigns and many journalists who covered them attended. one of the most raw and emotional exchanges was between hillary clinton campaign director of communication and kellyanne conway on whether the trump campaign encouraged
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racism. >> if providing a platform for white supremacist makes me a great technician, i'm happy to have laws. give me a minute. i'm more proud of hillary clinton's all right speech because she had the courage to stand up. i would rather lose than win the way you guys did. my proudest moment of her is her standing up and saying with courage and clarity in steve bannon's own words and donald trump's own words, the platform they gave to white supremacists and white nationalists and it's an important moment in our country. >> do you think wherei ran a can where white supremacists had a part of the platform. >> i can certainly understand
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the rawness there. and you want everyone to come together. obviously the wounds are still fresh especially for the clinton team. >> let's bring in msnbc political reporter kasie hunt who was at the event and started texting me right after because it was more spicy than expected. what more can you report on this? >> what you guys were talking about that rawness was so obvious from the very point that everyone showed up in this pretty small conference room. the trump team was swaggering. the attitude was they were high fiving. they wanted everybody to recognize we won. you know, i think that was missing from a lot of the coverage coming up to the election obviously. so i think they were demanding that. the clinton people came in there trying to defend hillary clinton's honor and still very clearly grappling with the consequences of this. still very much kind of in campaign mode. these things are usually polite
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and often the winning team sets the tone. by the time that exchange happened, it was deep into a three-hour conversation about this campaign. i'm not sure anyone necessarily expected it to actually erupt in shouting. you could just tell the body language of these people. kellyanne conway and at the top of their profession staring at each other across this table. by the time it actually erupted, i don't know that many people were surprised because you could just feel how intense it was. now kellyanne conway pushed back by saying hillary clinton lost because she had no economic message. >> do you think you could have had a decent message for the white working class voters. you think this woman who has nothing in common with anybody, we flipped over 200 counties that president obama won and donald trump just won, you think
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that's because of what you just said or because people aren't ready for a woman president? how about it's hillary clinton? she doesn't connect with people. they have nothing in common with her. how about you had no economic message. i can tell your angry but #he's your president. will he accept the election results. will you? will you ever accept the election results? will you tell your protesters he's their president too? >> i understand the edge on both sides. i understand the resentment on both sides. call somebody a racist. their back is going to be up. kellyanne brought up the most important point. this was about hillary clinton. hillary clinton failed to deliver a message that could drive people to the polls --
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>> i think people really hurting voted to donald trump. people who would have voted for bernie sanders, voted for donald trump. so that accusation, i'm sorry, about having white supremacists -- >> this wasn't a massive trump landslide in the greatest vote. so much of this was just the failure of hillary clinton to do exactly what they were saying she didn't do and she could never connect. >> these harvard sessions often the losing campaign is asked to come in and admit their mistakes and blame their candidate.
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you can't expect people three weeks after their election saying our candidate was horrible. kellyanne kept trying to get them to say it. i think that was part of what produced the tension. >> when you win, you're gracious. >> she wasn't. that was really -- >> kids -- when i ran for congress, i had mattingly people smearing me nonstop saying things about me and my family and horrible things about my loved ones. you know what i did the next morning? i said i didn't deserve to win. the other candidate was smarter and she was more intelligent and would have made a better congress person. i was just lucky. i called her up and told her that. i didn't deserve to win this. i would have lost it two years ago. i appointed her --
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>> this is the campaign manager. >> my mom yelled at me for doing it. i appointed her to an important panel. that's what was missing. >> i think obama did invite mccain into the white house or met with him during the transition or something like that -- hillary clinton didn't step foot in wisconsin in the general election. that's a strategic mistake. on the flip side, while you're right that voters weren't racist, it's fair to say that a lot of what was coming out from the trump apparatus were dog whistles. >> hold on. don't say the word dog whistle. they were ugly, racist issues that were on the forefront. there were stupid comments. >> the muslim ban, racist.
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>> blurted out and not a dog whistle and stop saying dog whistles. are these people that voted? dogs? stop. they're americans who probably would have voted for bernie sanders. >> you guys aren't taking enough credit for the type of negative campaign you ran. they were very effective. trump was very effective and hillary clinton made very bad strategic missteps. >> no message for two years. >> a close loss in three states that will ultimately decide the presidency. >> it's hard to sit there and blame wisconsin on a racist message when your candidate never visited wisconsin. and it ended up being the state that finished your presidential chances. >> her strategic mistakes we'll be writing about for years. it was obviously so painful for clinton's people to admit that
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they lost this thing. you can just feel that sense of deep regret. my fear is that if trump goes around spiking the football victory dance greatest hits, it's just going to deepen the sense of polarization and that would not be good for the country. >> that is fair. >> would it not be incredible for donald trump to get in the car, drive up to see the clintons -- the clintons have been through more trash than anybody else has been through. >> that would be a classy thing to do. no question. >> maybe bring a cobbler with them. a casserole. >> i think the trump side does not understand the importance of a really unifying message. i'm hoping the inaugural address does something big to bring americans together. i still think they think that's sort of like, you know, not
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important for some reason. it is. there are people who were scared. there are people who are angry. there are people who -- and then, you know, that moment or maybe before there is a need, i think, to bring everyone together. there's one person who could do it. he could do it really, really well and really beautifully. >> always a winner. it's incumbent on the winner and incumbent on donald trump. >> kellyanne, stop rubbing people's faces in it. it doesn't help to just -- that's not polite. >> january 9th, 2009, on the eve before inauguration, president-elect barack obama attended dinners promoting bipartisanship. one of the people he honored was john mccain. >> still ahead, the wide reaction to donald trump's deal with carrier to keep jobs in the country. sam says it's more about stage craft and salesmanship than policy. sam is upset about it.
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he'll explain. >> if donald trump sent a man to the moon, sam stein would have said it was done in a burbank parking lot. >> you're watching "morning joe." >> he can't lift the hammer.
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>> i was watching the nightly news. i won't say which one because i don't want to give them credit. i don't like them much i'll be honest. they had a gentleman, worker, great guy, handsome guy. he was on. he said something to the effect, no, we're not leaving because donald trump promised us that we're not leaving. i never thought i made that promise. now, winot with carrier. i made it for everyone else.
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i didn't make it for carrier. what's he saying? they played my statement. i said carrier will never leave but that was -- now because of him. whoever that guy is. is he in the room by chance? that's your son. stand up. you did a good job. united technologies is one of the top 50 companies in the united states. they make many other things other than air conditioners. believe me. >> believe me. believe me they have big military contracts. >> yesterday celebrating the deal to keep about 1,000 jobs at a carrier plant in the u.s. >> a lot of people don't like this. "wall street journal" says he's bullying corporations and everything. i'm going to get to you in a second. a lot of people don't like this. "wall street journal" says he's bullying. this reminds me a lot as far as
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just symbolic move is when -- a symbolic move can have great impact. reagan fired the air traffic controllers in '81, '82 and actually after the soviet union fell, there actually was documentation that soviet leaders said this guy is not like all of the other presidents. this guy means business. we need to be ready. >> and it's not symbolic i would say to 1,100 people whose jobs stay. there are 1,300 people leaving whose jobs are going to mexico. it's not a perfect solution. it's the delivery. some people are afraid to say it. a delivery on a promise he made. he said a lot of other things in that speech about dropping the corporate tax rate, slashing regulations and the tariff side of it. >> there was stories out about other companies who are now rethinking about what to do
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about their outsourcing plans. it is having a symbolic effect. >> you talk about the role that indiana has played as far as economic messages for barack obama first and now president-elect trump because both visited the state very early after the white house victories. you remember barack obama going there in 2009 pitching a stimulus plan at a town where unemployment was close to 20% and trump went to indianapolis yesterday for the carrier deal to save jobs. >> what was interesting to me is when you talk to people in indiana about what the stimulus did, funny thing is very few people actually know they were helped out by the stimulus. i went through the ledger of grants and loans and i would ask them, what did you do with the 50,000 or 100,000 that you got? that wasn't through the stimulus. that was through this company or
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that. i think it points to that you can go and help companies whether it's through negotiations deals with carrier, passing legislation, but if you don't sell it on the back end, you don't reap the political benefits from it. i think what trump is very good at and what obama was not and has not been so great at is taking credit and selling the stuff that he does. those people in carrier will forever remember that donald trump went to their factory and saved about half of the jobs. you could quibble with details. they will remember this. i don't think people who got stimulus money have or will remember that they got that stimulus. >> one of the things -- one of our frustrations with the obama white house early on is we talked regularly to people that ran the white house, helped run the white house. and they kept saying we don't do theater. we don't -- >> that's a quote. >> we're too good for that. we don't do theater. we're too good for that.
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fdr knew from the day he got sworn into office, david ignatius, that actually that's a big part of being president of the united states. >> being able to have an impact. >> having an impact when you tell people we have nothing to fear but fear itself and delivering it like a shakespearean actor. elkhart, indiana, 19% unemployment in 2009. 3.2% unemployment today. >> donald trump gets the theater part. no question about that. there is a tradition that we haven't seen much of over the last couple presidents of what was called job owning with the economy where presidents would lean hard on corporations if they were thinking of raising steel prices, presidents would get the steel companies to back
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down. that direct government intervention is a slippery slope. under president nixon it went all of the way to wage and price controls. that degree of government intervention to force companies to do what the president thought was best. so it's not surprising that this morning you have expressions of concern on editorial pages, "wall street journal," "the washington post" also about this kind of intervention. he's delivering a campaign promise. that's striking. it will deter other companies from moving. you go down this road where presidents tell companies what to do, that gets dangerous. >> i agree since we're all reading "the wall street journal." >> in your reporting, the $7 million tax breaks you saved these jobs but cost the state of indiana $7 million. >> honestly, $7 million for the number of job saves seems like a good deal. the problem is with the principle that david is talking about which is the government going to come in and say this
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corporation is a problem if they leave and go to mexico so we have to help out there. but there's all these other corporations including right now in indiana that are doing outsourcing. i will say this. if you are trying to be ideological consistent about this, liberals should be more receptive to this but conservatives who blasted obama time and again for picking winners and losers held up as an example of crony capitalism, this should be a problem. >> the trump carrier shakedown is a lead editorial in "the wall street journal" and finishes up by saying trump's carrier shakedown is a short-term political victory that will hurt workers and the economy in the long run. >> governors and other countries do this nonstop. >> up next, paul ryan wants you to know that he never called donald trump a racist. only that something he said was racist. the speaker sizes up working with the new administration
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>> you called donald trump a racist. >> no, i didn't. i said his comment was.
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>> i'm not sure there's a great deal of daylight between those two definitions. he definitely called you ineffective and disloyal. have you patched it up. >> yeah, we have. we're fine. we're not looking back. we're looking forward. like i said, we speak about every day. it's not about looking back in the past. that's behind us. we're way beyond that. >> did you believe he could be nominated? really? >> yeah, no, i didn't see this one coming. he knows that. donald trump is a very -- he was a very unconventional candidate. he's going to be an unconventional president. what i like about it in my almost daily conversations is he's just a get things done kind of guy. >> paul ryan on "60 minutes." did you see this news yesterday? nobel prize secretary regrets obama peace prize decision. who could have ever seen that coming? >> who says that? >> you give it to him before he becomes president or he's there for three days. >> that's undermining to the
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president. >> we're going to give him the peace prize. >> to his great credit, president obama also thought it was ridiculous at the time. >> i actually tweeted back to him, i said, if it makes you feel any better, he actually had his own private kill list that he bragged about to "the new york times" that he would select people to kill. >> julie pace, hi. paul ryan, go. >> i think for paul ryan there's perhaps an opening in this trump presidency. trump is someone who likes wins. he likes victories. he's not necessarily a policy ideologue. paul ryan is. if this relationship unfolds in a way where ryan can work with mike pence and cabinet secretaries and make progress on these agenda items he's been promoting for the last several years, that's good for paul ryan. the downside for paul ryan is if
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donald trump doesn't want to take his policy ideas and sign the legislation. there are a lot of people in the republican party who are fans of paul ryan who believe he's the future of this party who are really worried about how he comes out of this four years at least of the trump presidency. >> okay. well that makes sense. it did seem very -- i have to say, because i gave him a lot of trouble in the campaign, he actually played it just right for himself, didn't he, in some ways navigating this relationship with trump. >> in fact, they are right now getting along very well. >> two of his closest friends and political friends, mike pence and reince priebus will be amongst the five most powerful people in the white house. that's good comfort level for him knowing if he has communication with the you preside -- new president he doesn't like, he can call reince priebus or
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mike pence to work it out. >> when he chose reince, it's not like he didn't know he was close to paul ryan. >> donald trump is seeing the field. >> okay. still ahead, back in 2011, dylan ratigan sounded the alarm. >> money party, everybody. >> we're going to do this again? he sounded the alarm and we heard it hear literally. >> i've been coming on tv for three years doing this. the fact of the matter is that there's a refusal on both the democratic and republican side of the aisle to acknowledge the mathematical problem which is the united states of america is being extracted. it's being extracted through banking. it's being extracted through trade and it's being extracted through taxation and there's not a single politician that has stepped forward. >> i missed that. >> you boil that crack down to a
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little rock. intense. dylan is right. he predicted the driving issues in 2016. he said it was a money party and we're back in a moment. we'll have tranquilizer guns for everyone.
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>> you know what all of the kids are asking? they're playing stick ball. you go to brooklyn and where is chris christie? what's happened? >> what up, chris christie? >> you never hear anything about chris christie anymore. >> all asking one question. >> new jersey's governor, where is he? i'll tell you where he is right
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now. i can't you where he is right now. that would not be good. >> he's making the case to be the next chairman of the republican national committee. according to politico, christie told members of president-elect trump's transition team he's interested in the position. but politico says several members of trump's team have been encouraging the president-elect to consider other candidates, which itself is creating division amongst that team. at the center of this reported battle are current rnc chairman and incoming chief of staff reince priebus, who is a connection to the gop's establishment, and trump's chief strategist steve bannon and top donor rebecca mercer who have pushed the president-elect more toward his populous base. politico says vice president-elect mike pence's political team is getting into the mix. julie pace is still with us.
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>> this is getting kind of sloppy. >> i have probably heard about 20 names floated for the rnc job since the election. it's actually the job i have heard the most speculation about. part of this is because reince priebus is protective of the rnc. he wants to make sure the person that takes over the party apparatus is someone who he trusts. he really feels like he's built a big operation there. a fund-raising operation that can sustain the party going forward. he's got a really personal interest. when it comes to chris christie, you just feel like christie is showing up in trump tower saying i'll do anything at this point. what's open? what's available? if he gets passed over for this, maybe he should take some time away from putting himself out there for these jobs for a little while. >> what about sean spicer? he was so good. >> he's inside the white house, right? >> a lot of decisions still being worked out. >> they did a great job.
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>> really did. what about sam stein for rnc chair? >> i will not serve in that position? >> why not? >> i don't think i'm suited for it to be honest with you. i haven't really thought about it much. i probably shouldn't do it. >> first time since founding of the republic we've had two straight two term presidents and won election because they started running for reelection the day after they won and rnc is key to that project. >> especially given their success. >> david ignatius, what is it about the political culture that we live in that it seems to be the most vicious than it's been since 1800 or since precivil war times when they would cane people on the house floor but pretty vicious by 21st century standards and yet first time since the founding of our republic that we had three presidents that were reelected. >> we have a yearning for government to work but things that drive the wedge deeper and
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deeper, very partisan media outlets is part of that story. i just was thinking as we talk about the rnc job, one thing that we used to ask a month ago was what's the future of the gop? is this party going to split wide open? we're seeing now that the future is that it will be fused, the mainstream establishment and the populist new gop will be fused under donald trump. that's what his cabinet is telling us. i think that's fascinating. this party is going to come together in a different shape, rnc chairman will be in a sense the figure but what an amazing achievement he's made just politically. >> at first it seemed like he blew up the party. the party now seems like it has some sort of focused future as david ignatius was saying. the question is what about the democratic party, which we'll talk about later. >> on the republican side there's been this battle, this push and pull between the
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conservative wing of the party and the populist wing of the party. you actually are seeing these two fused together for the first time. >> julie pace, thank you so much. "the washington post" eugene robinson and former pennsylvania governor ed rendell join the conversation. we'll be right back with more "morning joe." ♪is it manwich night? ♪ put some manwich on the table... and give boring weeknight meals,
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>> i've spoken to democrats and i said we can't go on with this gridlock. it's gone on for so many years. they can't get together. we're going to get together. i believe they want to get together. you know why? because it's time. the people are angry. they're angry. they're going to get together. we're going to make joint decisions. we are. the nice part, our victory was so great, we have the house. we have the senate. and we have the presidency. p put on some of the greatest business people in the world. one of the networks said he put on a billionaire at commerce. that's because this guy knows how to make money, folks. he knows how to make money.
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i like to put on a guy that failed all his life, but we don't want that, do we? no. i put on a killer. i've been honest. i said i am going to be putting on the greatest killers you've ever seen. >> he's not going to pick a loser. >> welcome back to "morning joe." it's friday, december 2nd. >> do you think he's enjoying doing that? >> yes. that's what he does. >> he missed it. >> that is his thing. >> still with us as you can see managing editor of bloomberg politics, mark halperin, sam stein, kasie hunt, david ignatius and joining the conversation former chairman of the democratic national committee and former governor of pennsylvania ed rendell and from "the washington post," eugene robinson. >> let's go to ed rendell.
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you know about making deals. you hear donald trump talking about we're going to bring the other side together. are you skeptical? do you think it can happen? >> i think it can happen on a certain number of things where there's not an ideological divide. so for for example, when we've talked about infrastructure, i think both sides want to see some real progress on infrastructure. i think the question is how to pay for it. i think we can work that out. that's an important challenge. tax reform, mr. mnuchin sounded like he wanted to do individual tax reform and corporate tax reform. i think everyone is in favor of that. the question is what happens to the money you saved? does it go to reduce the debt? does it go to stimulate the economy? does it go to other programs? so there are areas i think where democrats will be willing to work with the new president if he does what he says he's going to do. >> gene robinson, what do you think? this is a guy that knows chuck
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schumer. contributed money to him. contributed a lot of money to democrats. more comfort socially around chuck schumer than paul ryan. is there any reason for americans to hope that this congress and president get it right in areas they have not? >> ed rendell mentioned infrastructure. we all talk about infrastructure. everyone agrees that we need a big infrastructure push. so my question is how do you get the republicans in the house to go along with that? how do you get them to spend the money? >> you run them over is what trump's going to do. he'll run them over if he has to. >> then, you know -- >> he'll pick up the phone and call them. >> i think most democrats -- i've talked to a lot of democrats that say infrastructure, bring it on. we're all in favor of it. so maybe he does it that way.
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just counts on public support. go out and have a bunch of rallies or something. >> this is the number one goal of the administration. let's talk about the very raw feelings that still exist given the election because that also can get in the way of progress. we've got this post-mortem session of the 2016 presidential campaign that turned into a shouting match at harvard as top strategists from both the clinton and trump campaigns debated over how president-elect trump pulled off his victory on election day. the session was a thing they do all the time every time. part of a two-day forum that harvard sponsored in the wake of every presidential election since 1972. operatives from nearly all of the primary and general election campaigns along with many of the journalists who covered them attended. one of the most raw and emotional exchanges between hillary clinton's campaign director of communications general palmieri and trump
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campaign manager kellyanne conway over whether trump encouraged racism in his campaign. >> if providing a platform for white supremacists makes me a brilliant tactition, i'm glad to have laws. i'm more proud of hillary clinton's all-right speech because she had the courage to stand up. one of my proudest moments of her is her standing up and saying with courage and clarity and in steve bannon's own words and donald trump's own words the platform that they gave to white supremacists and it's a very, very important moment in our history of our country. >> do you think i ran a campaign where white supremacists had a platform? >> it did. >> do you think you could have had a decent message for the white working class voters? do you think this woman who has
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nothing in common with anybody -- >> that's not why you won but -- >> flipped over 200 counties that president obama won and donald trump just won. you think that's because of what you just said or because people aren't ready for a woman president? really? how about it's hillary clinton. she doesn't connect with people. how about they have nothing in common with her. how about you had no economic message. >> i can tell you're angry but wow. hashtag he's your president. how about that. will he accept the election results? will he accept? will you? will you ever accept the election results? will you tell your protesters he's their president too? >> that's just not the way to do it. >> on both sides. >> if you're not going to handle yourself this early, and i certainly understand, just don't do it. the country doesn't need it. certainly the kids watching that don't need it.
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it's really unfortunate. win with grace. just don't go. and if you're on the other side, accept defeat with grace or just don't go. >> kasey what happened? this did get to a point where it was cringe worthy on both sides. both making good points but kind of lost in the ugliness of it. >> this is completely out of character with how these forums have gone in the past. the tone, people who have participated in them before, say it's usually really set by winners. in 2012 when mitt romney lost to barack obama, david axelrod and one of romney's top strategists met during one of the breaks and he invited her to come speak at the institute of politics. that's usually how these things play out. i think this one, the clinton campaign had such visceral emotion and the trump campaign really felt to somewhat understandably that they have not been given the credit for what they managed to pull off.
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i think the clinton team came in there essentially to try to defend hillary clinton's honor. the message i took away is that they think she lost largely because of sexism, racism and james comey. i didn't hear a lot of introspection from them about that economic message that kellyanne was talking about but at the same time the tone is so raw and so reflective of how this campaign went. i'm not sure that we got the usual kind of pulling back the lens here's the history of it. we got another episode of this campaign. >> ed rendell, did pennsylvania flip because after voting for barack obama two times suddenly they woke up in 2016 and said we're racists and bigots or, you know, is it just the fact that 200 counties that went for barack obama eight years ago went for donald trump now and that either had something to do
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with donald trump or it had something to do with hillary clinton but they voted for obama eight years ago. it doesn't seem like it has anything to do with racism. >> no, absolutely not. it didn't. we didn't lose in pennsylvania because of racism. actually, more important point was were pennsylvanians ready to vote for a woman president or this woman president? interestingly, hillary clinton lost by 50,000 votes. the three democratic row officer candidates, attorney general, state treasurer won by an average of 250 which means a lot of democrats walked into the polls, didn't vote for either of the two women, did vote for the men. voted for the men in fairly big numbers. >> governor, how many times has a woman won statewide in pennsylvania? >> for a major office, only once. we have had no women governor,
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no woman senator, and we have no women congressmen. >> kasie, you were in the room for the full three hours. was there any discussion or any administration from the clinton side of maybe we made a mistake not going to wisconsin, for example, or that their polling was wrong on election eve? did they talk at all about tactical and strategical errors they may have made? >> kind of blew through it. if we could go back again, maybe we would have gone to wisconsin. they pointed out rightly that margins were very narrow in these places and that any one prescription that everyone has been offering put bernie sanders on the ticket and talked about economics, any one of those things might have made the difference here. i will say to what the governor was just saying, there was a very interesting and extended discussion about this idea that so many people said the american people are ready for a woman but just not this woman. and mandy said, look, i understand that's what people
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think but when i look at numbers for women candidates, the hurdle is are they strong enough? do numbers show that? are they ready to be commander in chief? when you look at hillary clinton's number on those things, she reads like a man. if her name wasn't on the top of the sheet, you might think it was a male candidate. she said i've also elected six women to the senate. i don't know when we're going to see another candidate who shares those attributes that hillary clinton has built over a lifetime of service. i think there's some sexism in a broad sense but there's data that backs up this idea that there were real challenges for clinton because she was a woman. >> except for the fact, eugene robinson, she had a lower honest and trustworthy number than donald trump. that had absolutely nothing to do with the fact that she was a woman. it had to do with the fact she couldn't get is it straight on servers and the clinton foundation and every single day
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of her campaign she was hammered by another side and those numbers just collapsed. >> she was in that sense fighting out of a hole the entire campaign. and just didn't quite get over the top. i mean, we do, i know it doesn't count but she did get about 2.5 million more votes than donald trump got so it's not that she did so terrible, it's just that she didn't win and she didn't win in the rust belt. that's more of an economic issue, i think, than anything else. and was there a clear and coherent hopeful economic message from the democratic party? i think you have to honestly say that there was not. there was -- i would argue that there wasn't a terribly coherent message from donald trump but it was a hopeful economic message and it clearly connected with enough people in enough of the right places that he won. the whole event at harvard
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sounded like a really, really bad morning on "morning joe." it's all the people who always come on "morning joe." >> that's bad night at harvard. >> there are no bad mornings. >> kasie, you have seen both. >> we can all go have coffee after the show. >> sam stein says there's never bad day at "morning joe." last time you were on here, i will say, you said congratulations. this is the worst episode of "morning joe" in the nine-year history. >> you guys stepped it up since then. >> it was very bad. did your mother tell you to say that? >> no. i can make my own thoughts. >> you can? really? can you lift a hammer? >> can i ask you a question about this panel? i think it's an important media question. one of the things they said -- clinton people said is because there was such an assumption she would win that the media scrutinized her and focused on her in a way that they never
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focused on trump. i wonder if you feel like that's true? >> that's one of the stupidest things i ever heard in my life. not from you. that naanalysis, i've been challenging a media school to actually study and do what they do in every other campaign and let's see how many articles about donald trump were positive? how many articles about donald trump were negative and compare those numbers with hillary clinton. they will be historically negative against donald trump. "the new york times" did admirable work from the very beginning. it was so one-sided as far as -- of course, the media will say there was more bad things right about donald trump. it was overwhelmingly negative. the media climate was so negative that mark halperin was actually called a lap dog by a columnist in "the washington post" because he simply said donald trump had a chance to get
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elected. >> is that a dog whistle? >> no. >> it's an actual insult. >> if you want to see how badly served the american people were by the media over 2016, just look at how the media responded the last two weeks to the few people that said trump had a chance to win. they were called lap dogs. they were called unrealistic. >> part of the inside team. >> who is the guy -- there's this abc correspondent on sunday that used to work for bush. if you ever suggested -- the dowd guy. if you ever suggested that donald trump had a chance to win, he would fire off ten nasty messages and it was that way around the entire climate. >> another abc correspondent who has given to the clinton foundation who never receives any -- it's interesting the bias. think of all of the correspondents and anchors who have gone to visit the obamas at
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marth martha's vineyard and friendships that developed. i'm just saying people need to keep it real. >> if you talk to editor of "the new york times" or "the washington post," they will tell you that donald trump is the worst creature that ever walked on the face of the earth and coverage has to be overwhelmingly negative but if they want to know why they woke up the morning after the election and had no idea about what was happening, it's because they were disconnected from america. i said it on the show when i went out to a wedding in scranton, pennsylvania. i didn't have to go to scranton, pennsylvania, to know donald trump had great chance of winning. i had to go to the target. i had to go into a target for a reason. i walked into target. and five minutes after being in the target, i looked around and i called mika, and i said i
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think donald trump is going to win. i went to jacksonville, florida. listen, i know the state of florida. i know how conservative it is. i walked through the airport. i got in my rental car. i drove 30 miles to see my mom. i saw trump yard signs all over the place. i saw people wearing shirts. i saw bumper stickers. i called mika. i said it's all antidotal but everything i'm seeing when i get outside of new york city tells me donald trump is going to win. i say that on the show and mark halperin says that and suddenly we must be lap dogs for donald trump. i called him a racist about 20 times during the campaign. >> i'll give you that. i think -- >> thank you for giving me that. >> sammy. >> i agree with that. >> he lifted the hammer. >> i think it's an important discussion. the pushback -- i'm not saying i
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agree with this -- is that if you have an expectation that she's going to win, you have to sort of try to find some critical coverage of her in a proportion to the expectation that she will win. what the clinton defenders look at is the front page of "the new york times" the day that comey letter came out. three main stories on top of the page about the new investigation. and then they look at the exoneration letter the next week and it was not much -- it was like a column. they look at that and say the proportionality of the coverage based on seriousness of the issue is maybe off. >> we can do a lot of retrospectives on the campaign coverage which was as always imperfect. the question for the republic is what happens when people write big good investigative stories about donald trump. "the washington post" did many. "the new york times" did many. they seem to have no impact on his supporters. >> that's worrisome. >> that's the question. if you do investigative
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journalism and it doesn't impact what people think of the person who is the subject -- >> do you know why? it's all white noise. if you call donald trump a fascist or a nazi or let's just take examples of what happened this week, right? so donald trump puts out a tweet. he talks about criminalizing flag burning. let's take that part of it. their hair is on fire. my god. this is the worst thing ever. he's a nazi. he's a fascist. and then you walk out of the studio and someone goes you know that barbara boxer and hillary clinton in 2006 co-sponsored the bill to criminalize flag burning. i'm not saying it's the same thing. he went beyond that by saying it stripped citizenship which is unconstitutional for 60 years but never context provided. it's donald trump is a nazi. if you hear that every day and you're in scranton, pennsylvania, or if you're in pensacola, florida, you're going
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to go -- >> but trump has run a very effective year-long campaign demonizing the media. i think that has helped. >> but, david ignatius, if the media told americans that donald trump had a 1% chance of winning the republican nomination and then they told americans that he only had a 15% ceiling, and then even late into november they were saying he only had a 20% ceiling. and even after he started winning primaries they were saying marco rubio was going to still win the nomination. this is all historical record. marco rubio was out of the race and "the new york times" upshot was still saying it marco rubio was going to win the republican nomination. i'm not even saying that to be funny. if you get it wrong as consistently as the media has
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gotten it wrong, then at some point americans just turn off the media. they stop listening to us. >> joe, i think there's no question that what was perceived as the elite media's bias against trump by a lot of his supporters deepened their support for him. i think that we'll look at this just as clinton supporters will look at what happened and will assess how we cover politics. all of that introspection doesn't go to the heart of the matter which is can president trump take this divided country and pull it together? watching him on his victory tour, there are moments you think he really wants to be liked by everybody. not just by the people he voted for. if that's true, then he's a smart politician. he'll figure out ways to speak to the country as a whole. >> i tell you the first thing i would do, i would bring my team in, and i would say you won.
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in the words of vince, don't rub noses in it. >> remember how horrified everyone was when obama said i won but this is worst in some ways that we're seeing with the teams. david ignatius, thank you very much. everyone else, stay with us. >> appreciate it. >> still ahead on "morning joe" -- >> i'm here today for one main reason. to say thank you to ohio. we didn't have much help at the top levels. you know that, right? but i will say this. i will say this. it was very nice. your governor john kasich called me after the election and was very nice. >> was very nice. he was very nice. >> democratic congressman tim
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ryan also of ohio is next about the way forward for his party. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. my business was built with passion... but i keep it growing by making every dollar count. that's why i have the spark cash card from capital one. with it, i earn unlimited 2% cash back on all of my purchasing. and that unlimited 2% cash back from spark means thousands of dollars each year going back into my business... which adds fuel to my bottom line. what's in your wallet? ...another anti-wrinkle cream in no hurry to make anything happen. neutrogena® rapid wrinkle repair works... ...in one week. with the... fastest retinol formula. ...to visibly reduce wrinkles. neutrogena®. ♪
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generosity is its oyou can handle being a mom for half an hour. i'm in all the way. is that understood? i don't know what she's up to, but it's not good. can't the world be my noodles and butter? get your mind out of the gutter. mornings are for coffee and contemplation. that was a really profound observation.
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you got a mean case of the detox blues. don't start a war you know you're going to lose. finally you can now find all of netflix in the same place as all your other entertainment. on xfinity x1. >> who is the future of the democratic party? >> i haven't thought about that. >> is it nancy pelosi? >> yeah, to some extent, this is our leader. this is who our caucus chose and we're going to support them. >> rolls right off the tongue, doesn't it? smooth. >> he's being honest. i like him. >> well, good, because we have him here. >> good. >> tim ryan from ohio is here. tim, name somebody not in their
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'70s that's the future of the democratic party? >> tim ryan. >> good answer. >> know your value. >> you're a great person to ask this question. we were having a discussion about what exactly happened at the seminar in harvard yesterday, a lot of screaming and yelling going on. for those of us that were more dignified at the university of alabama were shocked by the outburst, that said, while everyone is looking for excuses, do you think it hurts the democratic party to have people running around saying we lost the house. we lost the senate. we lost the governorships. we lost the white house because there are a bunch of racists in pennsylvania that voted ed for republicans? >> i have a brother-in-law that's a university of alabama fan and dignified is not something i would associate -- >> that just happened. he went there. it's on. >> okay.
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it's on. >> okay. >> go ahead. >> i have to live with this. i know exactly what you're talking about. >> may i only say i hope that we face penn state at the national championship. we'll talk about it then. >> wow, joe scarborough, you just hurt my feelings, but i'm over it. >> wow. >> to answer the -- >> you can tell he works for jim, can't you? go ahead, mr. chairman. >> to answer the substantive question here, no, you can't do that. we had a ton of people in ohio who voted for barack obama two different times. and then voted for donald trump. i don't think those people are racists. were there elements of white supremacists? of course. we heard what david duke said but the vast majority of the people voted their pocketbook and we need to do a better job of talking to those working class people about the issues that i feel as a democrat we can
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better address the challenges they have every day. >> can you explain to somebody that works in manhattan in sort of the national media complex -- >> bubble. >> can you explain to them why someone would vote for barack obama in 2008 and 2012 and then vote for donald trump in 2016? >> wages. pensions. benefits. the economic anxiety. i'm one that thinks that going back to probably the 2006 election, maybe even before that, that all of these elections have been who can better help me economically other than '04 when we were just on the heels of the war. so i think these have all been economic elections and whether it was obama against john mccain or president obama against mitt romney, it became the 47% who is looking out for you but then in
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those off year elections in '10 and '14 and '16, economics and democrats lost, which is why i ran against leader pelosi is to make that point. >> i'm going to toss this over to ed rendell. those same voters might they have voted for bernie sanders realistically? >> well, i think it's possible but it's hard to say. the tax issue would have played in a very negative way in places like ohio if you would have looked at senator sanders' entire agenda. you have to pay for that stuff. i think that would have been the real challenge with senator sanders. >> sanders against trump. >> but sanders really resonated with a lot of people and i have a lot of respect for bernie sanders. >> ed rendell, jump in. good to have you on the show. >> congressman, i admire what you did and it took a lot of courage, and i think you are one of our young leaders going forward. who would you favor for our chairman? what should our dnc chairman,
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who should that be or more important, what should that chairman reflect? what values? >> well, i think we need to see all of the candidates but again someone who can push this economic message to working class people and not just white working class. black, brown, gay, straight, working class people who try to make ends meet and just not speak to things like the minimum wage governor which we're all for an increase but speak to those middle class people whose wages have been stagnant for 20 or 30 years. whoever is the next dnc chair has to speak to those. we have to figure out a way to vertically integrate the dnc with the democratic senate committee and the democratic house committee and the state parties so that we're not all moving in different directions. we're all growing in the same direction. we have to figure out a way to vertically integrate all of these different parts of our system. that's going to be really important to have somebody that can be able to do that.
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it needs to be someone -- it's got to be a full-time job. i do not think we can have somebody that has two different jobs. i'm one that believes it needs to be a full-time job for somebody. i'll give you an example of what we have to figure out. there are 180,000 millennials in the average congressional district. they don't want tv. the model of we're going to buy tv ads and speak to millennials is not a good model and so we have to play offense. i think we have to have more of a civic engagement where we're engaged in these communities and don't pop in, spend 5 million bucks and then leave. and that needs to be a part of building this broader coalition. this broader new movement of a new democratic party. >> congressman, it's willie geist. good to see you. you took a run at nancy pelosi. came up a little short but you did pick up 63 votes. going forward now, do you feel like the democratic party has heard and will carry forward at least part of your message
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because to a lot of people nancy pelosi who has been a very effective leader is from san francisco. she looks like the democratic party perhaps that couldn't defeat donald trump. do you think her view of the world now remains the view of the democratic party or do you think you've made inroads in getting your message out? >> from our caucus meeting yesterday, almost all of the reforms that were part of my reform proposal are starting to be accepted which tells me the leadership is starting to hear. it was pushed very hard by some very courageous people and joe knows this. it's not easy to come out in a caucus race against the leader of the caucus but people like kathleen rice are pushing hard for these reforms. they're getting a response for them. i think it's really cool to watch. the initial internal politics is moving in the direction of reform. i hope that the kind of outward messaging marketing piece of
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having more of an accent on the economics starts to take hold. time will tell. we'll find out. if we don't, we won't be successful at all. >> congressman tim ryan, a lot of people are talking about tim ryan. they like him. >> and the casual look today. >> like that. kind of rumpled. worked all night. >> casual friday. through the night. >> thank you. >> great to have you on the show. come back. ed rendell, thanks to you as well. coming up next on "morning joe" -- >> you've been more gracious than i would be especially you now met with governor mitt romney twice. how was that? >> it was good. we got along very well. he was very, very nice. very nice in terms of his remarks afterwards. and i think it was very good. we have some terrific people and terrific people to come. >> donald trump says his meetings with mitt romney went great but as joe was first to report, the ceo of exxon mobile is now being considered for
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secretary of state as well. we're back with more on that after this. for adults with advanced non-small cell lung cancer previously treated with platinum-based chemotherapy, including those with an abnormal alk
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♪ >> great question. i mean -- >> does vanderbilt play anybody this weekend? >> we're waiting to see what bowl we're going to. maybe independence. maybe birmingham. >> the bowl on a friday night. >> off the records when those two teams get together. >> 37 degrees outside. those were great. >> cold rain. >> where was astro blue bonnet bowl played? memphis? it was always cold and rainy. players would come out, why are we here? >> 3,500 people in the stands. >> families look bewildered. >> championship game this week. alabama and florida. >> florida does not have much of an offense to begin with and best defense in the country. could be a shutout. 28-6 game. >> have alabama games become
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boring for you? >> yes, they have. >> you know it's bad when you lose to ole miss 24-3 at halftime and i'm yawning and joey calls me up, we're going to win. we've seen the movie before. they'll wear them down. you notice the fourth quarter they're always running the ball downhill. they hand the ball to fill in the blank. and it's like they are running downhill. >> no other team can score against them which helps. you have an nfl defense. >> when is the last time the team scored against alabama? >> could alabama beat the cleveland browns. >> you guys just wasted an entire block. >> up next, eugene robinson -- >> i'm not done yet. you know i went to florida too, did you know that? >> do you feel torn at all? >> i don't. >> are we going to talk about dartmouth football? >> we're terrible this year. the hockey team is great.
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>> dartmouth won a couple games. >> keep your eye on number 22. he's a star. >> mika is into dartmouth hockey. i don't know why. she really is. it's very funny. can we tell them what that picture is about? >> no. >> up next -- >> i want to tell people what the picture is about. >> it's awful. it was so sad. >> horrifying. >> all right. eugene robinson says that donald trump will helm the government. he'll explain straight ahead.
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he wears his army hat, he gets awalks aroundliments. with his army shirt looking all nice. and then people just say, "thank you for serving our country" and i'm like, that's my dad. male vo: no one deserves a warmer welcome home. that's why we're hiring 10,000 members of the military community by the end of 2017. i'm very proud of him. male vo: comcast. >> i was just so disappointed to
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see the president-elect nominate congressman price to serve as secretary of health and human services. between this nomination of an avowed medicare opponent and republicans here in washington threatening to privatize medicare, it's clear that washington republicans are plotting a war on seniors. >> is it really? >> incoming senate minority leader chuck schumer slamming congressman tom price as donald trump's pick to lead the department of health and human services. this morning political reports that republicans are planning to vote to repeal obamacare next year. >> they can't allow people to lose coverage, can they? >> i don't think so. i would think they wouldn't want to do that. the actual repeal may not take effect for as long as three years giving them time to come up with a plan. they haven't yet, have they? >> they have to. look who is here. this is amazing. >> former white house adviser.
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university of pennsylvania. great to have you here. >> obviously there has to be a replace component. just make it better. >> so what are some suggestions? >> suggestions? the first thing is, i think paul ryan's plan is not the place to start. >> why not? >> even his own economists analyzing his plan suggest that 4 million people will lose coverage. he's going to cost shift a lot of money to pay for health care to the states who already don't have care. i think you can block grant but you have to make sure that states have enough money so they don't get poor and people in the exchanges, you have to give them another vehicle, an insurance pool at the national level if you want to buy insurance. there has to be some organized way for them to buy insurance. and i don't think they have a plan yet that works because they
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don't like mandate and you need a mandate if you're going to get people coverage in this country. >> when you talk to conservative health care policy analysts, are they forthright with you saying we don't think universal coverage is something the federal government should unive is something government should aspire to? >> no, most health care policy experts who thiare conservative think we can't have a system that doesn't work with some way of getting people insurance and getting everyone in the system. otherwise, you just have cost shifting. business will be hit hard if people lose insurance because they still go to the hospital. right? and those costs get transferred to the people who are paying. one of the secrets is obamacare has been good for business. it's capped health care inflation and their premiums much lower. >> no business leader i have met think that's true, not one. >> they won't say it in public, but that's absolutely true. low health care inflation, their premiums have been stable under the last five years than under
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president bush. >> what do you say to the big insurance companies who watched it play out and said we have to pull out. we can't afford it the way it's set up? where they right to do that? was it a business move or was it amoural, as some people have said? >> no, each one of them has a different reason. united never was in this game. did not like this game. aetna told you, mike wrote that, if you don't approve our merger, we're going to pull out of the exchanges. it was a kind of blackmail arrangement. and we have to remember, the republicans took away some of the protections for the insurers entering a new market, and that made it much harder for them. this wasn't natural. this happened because of particular laws in washington, when marco rubio pulled out the risk corridor. >> you didn't think it was a rational business decision. too many old sick people, not enough young healthy people. >> there was some rational
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decision making, but it didn't happen in a vacuum. it happened with changes to the law they weren't expecting. one of the things we look at, are republicans going to have a big giveaway to insurers when they stop the exchanges. that would be quite hypocritical. >> we shall see. >> gene robinson, you write in "the washington post," trump wilhelm a government by and for america. donald trump's administration is shaping up to be a administration of, by, and for corporate america. steven mnuchin, a former goldman sachs executive and hedge fund tycoon, whose name i will learn to pronounce, his nominee for commerce secretary is wilber ros. he does not have an m and n in the beginning of his name, and he is the pick to serve as deputy, and todd ricketts is choice for education secretary,
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betsy devos. when he holds the hearings, we should pay less attention to what he says and tweets and more to what he does. so far, this is not a team of rivals but trickle down economics isn't what voters voted for, but it looks like what they'll get. and add to this the fact that yesterday we broke the news that the trump team is now looking at the ceo of exxonmobil as possible secretary of state material. >> well, what more says, you know, man of the people than the ceo of exxonmobil? just look at the cabinet and the way it's shaping up, and the sort of core beliefs of the cabinet members. and i'm not seeing a lot of populism there. now, donald trump is donald trump. he is, you know, i don't think for a minute that he intends to be led by the nose by anything
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like a cabinet or anything like that, but i do think this obviously reflects a mindset, and to a certain extent, reflects his intentions. so we'll see. obvious la, what happens. let's get him in office first, but this is not, you know, this isn't a working-class cabinet. >> you know, it reminds me of what i read about eisenhower when he was setting up his cabinet. he had a saying, he didn't want anybody working for him who could afford to work for him. he brought in a lot of corporate leaders. i didn't actually know them. he heard about their reputations, heard they were good business people and brought them in. it looks like that's the direction trump is doing except he knows the people. unlike ike, who didn't trust people he knew to work for him, trump is going in the opposite direction. >> gene is right, it's not populist, not working class. policy matters more than anything else.
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there are two things that i think some people with a government mentality or washington mentality may not boo taking into account. a lot of these people are from the business world, not from the government world. and a lot of them haven't lived in washington, d.c. a lot of trump voters -- >> what's also interesting, his two economic picks, democrats. >> but they're people who never worked a day in government for the most part, and people who have a different mentality. >> could be really interesting. >> i tell you the reason it's bad. because people, i have to say, i have seen a lot of people suck in government. some of the people that suck the worst are ceos and go in there, this is the way. this is the way i worked and it's going to work here. no, it doesn't work that way. they will come and they will pick. they're like vultures. they will pick your eyeballs out of your face. and the bureaucrats will eat you alive bit by bit. >> without a doubt, there's a
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history of that, but this is what trump said he would do. when people asked what kind of people would you put in government, this is what heed. >> here's the thing, zeke, and throw it to gene, too. you can have all these people around you. you better have more than reince priebus who knows how washington works. this is a mistake the obamas made. the obamas come into d.c. d.c. and say, we're not going to make new friends. guess what? that was a huge problem. they need to get a lot of people who know how to work. >> one of the big differences between government and business is government is run by compromises and discussions and getting people onboard. business, you can have a top town decision. and people who don't know that government is more, i would say, like a university, you have to get people who have power, independent power, to agree with you. they trip up, as you point out, because they don't know -- >> they're not used to it. >> on the consensus board. >> really quick. >> people are constantly poking at you. constantly spitting at you.
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you even don't know the directions it's coming from. wait until -- whenever he picks at state, they're going to kill him. they're -- the cia is going to leak. that's what they're going to do, bit by bit. >> you hit me. ow. >> you have seen this before. a lot of people in washington don't have to do what you say. they don't have to just jump and do what you say. and if you are used to that, you're in for a rude awakening. >> i'm doing to do what alex says and go to break. thank you both. still ahead this morning, the art of the deal. inside, how donald trump got his wish to keep about 1,000 american jobs on american soil. but the debate rages over whether the cost was too high. plus, trump makes a not so surprise announcement. >> mad dog. >> the former general he's tapped to run the state department. google some of his famous statements. >> his quotes are just amazing. >> there could be snagged in the
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that airline credit card yout? have... it could be better. it's time to shake things up. with the capital one venture card, you get double miles on everything you buy, not just airline purchases. seriously, think of all the things you buy. great...is this why you asked me to coffee? well yeah... but also to catch-up. what's in your wallet? welcome back to "morning joe." it's friday, december 2nd. 8:00 on the east coast, 5:00 a.m. out west. with us on set, we have manager editor of bloomberg politics,
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mark halperin, who has done all of his christmas shopping. senior political editor and white house correspondent for the "huffington post," sam stein, and in washington, columnist and associate editor for "the washington post," david ignatius who does all his shopping online. >> and in the middle east. >> where the best deals are. >> we have a lot going on. donald trump was in cincinnati, ohio, last night. the first leg of what the transition is calling a thank you tour. here it is. >> i kept hearing, you must win ohio. you cannot win the presidency without ohio. so we started, really, we were about even at the beginning. then we had a couple troughs. but with ohio, there was no trough. it just kept getting better and better. in a true sense, history called and the people of this great state answered. you're going to be very happy. we're going to say right now what are we going to do? we're going to make america great again.
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you watch. we spend too much time focusing on what divides us. now is the time to embrace the one thing that truly unites us. you know what that is? america. america. we'll compete in the world. we want to compete in the world. but we're going to compete in the world where it's a two-way road, not a one-way road. the advantages are going to come back to our country. there is no global anthem. no global currency. no certificate of global citizenship. we pledge allegiance to one flag, and that flag is the american flag. from now on, it's going to be america first. okay. america first. we're going to put ourselves first. we're going to seek a truly
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inclusive society where we support each other, love each other, and look out for each other. and that means that people coming into our country have to be people that have the potential to love us, not to hate us. we condemn bigotry and prejudice in all of its forms. we denounce all of the hatred, and we forcefully reject the language of exclusion and separation. we're going to come together. we have no choice. we have to, and it's better. >> you know, mark, i always talk about how presidents aren't all creating equally. some are better at some things than others. barack obama on a big stage with a teleprompter, delivering prepared remarks is just as good as anybody ever. george w. bush was awful in certain things like east room press conferences but get him one-on-one and he was as good as anybody in the white house
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dealing with people. this is the next president's strong suit. this is what he's absolutely best at. >> loves it. >> he absolutely loves it. and last night was an audience that was just custom built for him. >> he feeds off it. i would say we need three copies of that, one for the smithsonian, one for a time capsule and one for everyone who ever wants to run for president again. he's doing what he likes. but do not like him, and that was a majority of the country, will look at that speech and say it was ungracious, egotistical, et cetera, but this is what the next four years are going to be like. >> this is just the beginning. >> there had never been a speech like that during a transition in my career. >> that's what i was wondering when i was looking last night. who does this? donald does. >> donald does this. he breaks the rules. but again, this is what he's most comfortable at. most people that campaign don't love campaigning the way he loved campaigning. teddy white asked richard nixon one time, when you're reaching
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out shaking people's hands, do you ever want to -- and nixon finished his sentence, kick them in the shin? there's nixon. and teddy white goes, ah, yeah? but trump loves this. >> got him elected. >> got him elected. we all mocked him, said you can't win by holding big rallies. apparently, this is a strategy. >> i saw a guy last night as i watched that who missed this for the last three and a half weeks. he did this for a year and a half. he fed off it. it gave him energy, it gave him life. now he was back as though it were a campaign event. all the chants were back. they were saying lock her up. they were playing the greatest hits last night. he was in the state of indiana. we'll talk more about this for the carrier deal, which is interesting on many levels. tax breaks, sure. more jobs leaving still than staying for carrier. but it is a delivery of a promise with the help of governor mike pence in his home state of indiana on something he gave to the people during the campaign and delivering on one
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here for president-elect. >> at the rally, trump made the surprise announcement of his pick for secretary of defense, though the pick itself not much a surprise. >> are we doing a good job with our cabinet and our people? i don't want to tell you this because i want to save the suspense for next week. so i will not tell you that one of our great, great generals, don't let it outside, right? we're going to appoint mad dog mattis as our secretary of defense. but we're not announcing it until monday, so don't tell anybody. mad dog. he's great. he's our best.
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they say he's the closest thing to general george patton that we have, and it's about time. it's about time. >> all right, so david ignatius, let's break it down. a couple questions. first of all, we'll get back to the patton description in a minute because i don't think it's apt from everybody who knows general mattis, but first of all, i didn't know much about this guy before his name came up. in this selection process, but it seems that the washington foreign policy establishment certainly hold him in the highest of regard, and feel a little more comfortable this morning because donald trump seems to be listening to him more than anybody else. >> i think for all the relish with which trump used the phrase mad dog talking about mattis, he is a reassuring figure, both for washington foreign policy people and also for people around the world. general mattis is somebody who is known overseas.
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he believes in partnerships and alliances. this is good news for gulf arab allies, the united states, they love general mattis. good news for nato. general mattis has worked closely with nato on weap weaponizati weaponization, transformation, known to the military, pentagon establishment. general dunford served under him in iraq. the current cno of the navy, admiral richardson, served with him, so this is very much a known figure. the one question that people have, joe, is whether this distinguished general fighting general, he is that, has the management skills to take on what arguably is the toughest management job in america, which is running the pentagon. tough for anybody to do that, but in some ways especially tough for a former uniformed general officer. >> so let's talk about the
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patton description. there's that famous scene where omar bradley says to patten, the difference is i do it because i have to do it. you do it because you love it. he says, i do love it. that's not mattis, though, at all, is it? general mattis is one who has seen war, is wary of it at best. >> mattis is a warrior intellectual, i would say. he's not a blood and guts guy. he is a person who likes a fight when he's in it and wants to win it. he was tough on the way to baghdad in 2003. he fired one of his subordinate commanders to being insufficiently aggressive in that campaign. he was furious at jerry bremmer and the white house for not letting him push ahead in fallujah in the initial face of the battle of fallujah. he's a fighting general. he's also an extremely well read man. he's supposed to have a library of 7,000 books.
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in my conversations with him over the years, they have been reflective. if you were to describe his foreign policy views, he's a realist. he's not a guy who wants to go out and start fights. >> willie geist, not only are they 7,000 books, they're leather bound. rich mahogny wood in the library. >> maybe you can be sec def next. kristen gillibrand already is saying she's not going to -- she's going to fight the waiver that he hasn't been out of active service long enough. do you think, though, this pick has any chance of being stopped? >> let's explain why the waiver is there. we don't tend to appoint a military person as head of the department of defense. the country has been permitted to civilian rule for a while and the last one was marshall in the
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'50s. the waiver is needed for him to get in place, and gillibrand says basically, i like the guy, i respect his history, but i'm uncomfortable with this. i have a sense that she's going to be in the minority here. in part because in addition to all of his sterling records and resumes here, there's a discomfort among democrats over what donald trump's foreign policy will be. mattis represents a buffer in many respects. i think we should go back to that "new york times" interview that trump gave where he talked about in one conversation with general mattis, he got talked out of water boarding. water boarding is sort of a massive philosophical principle. >> he talked about it over and over again, then he sat down and talked to a professional who had been through this. >> it's someone he admires. i think trump can be moved by people that he respects and admires. we're seeing it a little bit with his phone calls with obama. mattis will serve that function. if you're a democrat and you
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look at this, you say what are the other options? >> if you're concerned about general flynn as a four-star and flynn a three-star, and flynn has the greatest of respect for mattis and will defer to mattis. you're also comforted by general mattis being in the cabinet there to counterbalance any other voices that concern you. >> and bob gates is walking in the door. >> great that bob gates went in there, talking to general flynn. again, you want to assure me, get waub gates in there. >> that was a guy trump was critical of. >> just a tad bit. >> again, look and see what trump's been doing. nikki haley bashes him. she's u.n. secretary. mitt romney bashes him, he's a finalist for secretary of state. bob gates bashes him. he's talking to bob gates. >> this is the short memory you're talking about that politicians need to have. >> what bill clinton said, the best trait you can have as a president is a very short memory. donald trump showing at least this week that for some
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political rivals he has a very short memory. >> still ahead on "morning joe." >> democrats and republicans who have both said the movement of this plant is evidence of how damaging free trade is to the u.s. economy. well, so the question is, are you going to bemoan that fact and bemoan the fact that there are manufacturing jobs that are leaving indiana as a result of this decision by carrier? or are you going to actually do something about it? and president obama has pursued a strategy for actually doing something about it. by completing a trans-pacific partnership agreement that includes canada and mexico, that effectively does renegotiate nafta. >> has the obama administration missed the messaging on trade and jobs? donald trump goes to indianapolis to saver a win before he'sa even taken office. we'll talk about if he's being held by more hostages by companies to keep them in america. >> here's bill karins.
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he holds us hostage every day with his weather forecast. >> we try to keep it short. >> hold something over your heads. cold morning. that has been established across the country in the wake of the storm system that produces the tornadoes. we're still getting footage out. this is from two days ago in the atlanta area. this was cobb county. look at this outside on the deck there. an ef-1 tornado. winds around 100 to 120-mile-per-hour winds and knocked down a bunch of trees. no one was injured by those. it's a cold start across the country. feeling like december, but this afternoon is no complaint. today is a nice day across the nation. rain in the pacific northwest. that's already moving in now, and in texas. as far as the fires go, still even after the rain, we have 16 large fires burning in the southern appalachians. about 1,000 fire personnel on all of the blazes. today and tomorrow, no problems. and then the rain comes in sunday into monday, and this is exactly what we need to put a big dent in the drought and also
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to knock out a lot of these fires. here's the rain forecast. 2 to 3 inches is the red and pink in here. and that's over a bunch of the fires. the purple color is an inch of rain. this will be welcome, and hopefully we can get containment on a lot more of the big blazes still burning. the rest of the forecast in the upcoming weekend. soaking rains in texas will move to the south. we may get severe weather on monday in louisiana, but as far as sunday goes, it looks like plain rain on i-10 from texas to louisiana, to arkansas and a little wet weather still in the northwest today and then on saturday. also this week, despite all the bad weather and tornadoes and fires, we also lit the christmas tree here at 30 rockefeller plaza. looking beautiful today. a cool, chilly morning. a lot of people ice skating. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. but there will still be pain. it comes when your insurance company says they'll only pay three-quarters of what it takes to replace it. what are you supposed to do? drive three-quarters of a car?
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i was watching the nightly news. i won't say which one.
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because i don't want to give them credit because i don't like them much, i'll be honest. and they had a gentleman worker, great guy. handsome guy. he was on. he said something to the effect, no, we're not leaving. because donald trump promised us that we're not leaving. and i never thought i made that promise. not with carrier. i made it for everybody else. i didn't make it really for carrier. and i said, what's he saying? and he was such a believer. then they played my statement. and i said, carrier will never leave, but that was a euphemism. i was talking about carrier like all other companies from here on in. now, because of him, whoever that guy was -- is he in the room, by any chance? that's your son. stand up. you did a good job. i don't know if you know, united technologies is one of the top 50 companies in the united states.
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they make many other things other than air conditioners, believe me. >> believe me. military contracts. they have big military contracts. >> in indianapolis, celebrating the deal to keep about 1,000 jobs at a carrier plant in the u.s. >> sam, a lot of people don't like this. the "wall street journal" says he's bullying corporations and everything. >> i was about to get to sam. >> i'll get to the hippie in a second. willie a lot of people don't like this. this reminds me a lot, as far as just symbolic move -- >> i think, yeah. >> a symbolic move can have a great impact. everybody says -- reagan fired the air traffic controllers. i think in '81, '82, and actually after the soviet union fell, there actually was documentation that the soviet leaders said uh-oh, this guy is not like all the other presidents. this guy means business. we need to be ready. >> yeah, and it's not symbolic,
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i would say, to the 1100 people whose jobs stay. there are still 1300 people who are leaving and their jobs are going to mexico, so it's not a perfect solution, but it is a delivery. some people are afraid to say it a delivery on a promise he made. he said a lot of other things in the speech about dropping the corporate tax rate, slashing regulations, import tariffs, things that will scare some people, particularly the tariff side of it. >> to joe's point, there are already stories about companies thinking about what to do with their outsourcing plans. >> you're talking about the role that indiana has played, actually. >> oh, yeah. fascinating. >> the economic message s for barack obama first and now president-elect trump because both visited the state very early after their white house victories. you remember barack obama going to elkhart in 2009, and he was pitching that massive stimulus plan to a town where unemployment was close to 20%. then trump went to indianapolis
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yesterday for the deal with carrier to save jobs. >> yeah, so it's a weird parallel that indiana ends up being this stop for both of these people, but what was interesting to me is when you talk to people in elkhart, indiana, about what the stimulus did, the funny thing is very few people know they were helped by the stimulus. i went through the ledger of grants and loans and called up recipients and ask them, what did you do with the $50,000, $100,000 you got? they would say, that wasn't through the stimulus. this was through this company or that. and i think what it points to is that you can go and you can help companies whether it's through negotiating deals with carrier, passing legislation, but if you don't sell it on the back end, you don't reap the political benefits from it. i think what trump is very good at and what obama was not and has not been so great at is taking credit and selling the stuff that he does. those people in carrier will forever remember that donald trump went to their factory and saved about half of the jobs.
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i mean, you could -- you can quibble with the details, but they will remember this. i don't think people who got the stimulus money have or will remember they got that. >> one of our frustrations with the obama white house early on is we talked regularly talked to people who ran the white house, helped run the white house. and they kept saying, we don't do theater. >> we don't do theater. that's a quote. >> we're too good for that. >> a quote, wow. >> we don't do theater. we're too good for that. well, fdr knew from the day he got sworn in to office, david ignati ignatius, that actually, that's a big part of being president of the united states. >> being able to have an impact. >> and having the impact when you tell people we have nothing to fear but fear itself. and delivering it like a shakespearean actor. and we showed the chart. elkhart, indiana, 19% unemployment back in 2009.
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3.2% unemployment today. >> well, donald trump gets the theater part. no question about that. there is a tradition that we haven't seen much of in the last couple presidents of what was called jawboning, with the economy, where presidents would lean hard on corporations if they were thinking of raising steel prices. presidents would jawbone the steel companies into backing down. the problem is that kind of direct government intervention is a slippery slope. under president nixon, it ended up going all the way to wage and price controls. that degree of government intervention, to force companies to do what the president thought was best. so it's not surprising that this morning you've got expressions of concern on editorial pages, the "wall street journal," "the washington post" also, about this kind of intervention. he's delivering a campaign promise. that's striking.
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it will defer other companies from moving, but you go down the road where presidents tell companies what to do, that gets dangerous. >> i agree. since we're all reading the "wall street journal." >> i think bernie sanders has a piece in "the washington post." >> in your reporter, the $7 million tax breaks, some say you saved all these but you cost the state of indiana $7 million. >> honestly, $7 million for the number of jobs saved seems like a fairly good deal. the problem is with the principle that david is talking about, which is is the government going to come in and say okay, this corporation is a problem if they leave and go to mexico, so we have to help out there, but there's all these other corporations, including right now in indiana that are doing outsourcing. i will say this, if you're trying to be idealogically consistent about this, liberals should be more receptive to this, but conservatives who blasted obama time and again for picking winners and losers like solyndra, which was held up as an example of crony capitalism,
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this is a problem. >> the trump carrier shakedown is the lead editorial in the "wall street journal." it finishes up by saying trump's carrier shakedown is a short-term political victory that will hurt workers and the economy in the long run. >> governors and other countries do this nonstop. >> right. >> yeah. coming up on "morning joe," oh, boy. the money party is back. >> remember when we had him on the first time and he talked about doing things in bed. pooping in bed. except he didn't say that. >> what's he going to do today? >> i'm worried. >> you know what dillylan ratig is doing? he's doing good. >> is he going to freak out when he comes on the set? >> i think he's mellowed out a little bit. >> is he growing pot in the dwreenhouse. >> it could go any direction. don't prejudge it. >> dylan ratigan joins the table. >> i love money party. >> he explains why bernie sanders and donald trump are a
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natural response to the 2008 bailouts. "morning joe" is back in just a moment. they are the natural borns enemy of the way things are. yes, ideas are scary, and messy and fragile. but under the proper care, they become something beautiful.
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you know what i call the american workers? the forgotten men and women of our nation, and those men and women came out to vote. nobody ever thought that was going to happen. they came out by the millions. >> a little something happened between thou and the last time we saw money party. breaking news on the economy, though. the november jobs report is just out, according to labor department, 178,000 jobs were added last month. the unemployment rate ticked down to 4.6% from 4.9% in october. analysts expected 175,000 jobs, and markets were bracing for a number around 200,000. joining us now, co-founder of -- how do you say that? >> heelical. >> we know him as money party, dylan ratigan. we showed tape of you. >> you did. nobody checked with me before you did that.
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that's like unauthorized. i didn't sign a waiver. >> are you still like that? >> like what? >> like that. you know what i mean. kind of a little bit off, you know? kind of crazy. >> you're asking me if i'm a little bit off? >> welcome back, by the way. >> well done. well done. willie, take it away. >> nice to see you. happy holidays. i like your scarf. i feel like we could go to the opera. >> it's my thing. >> very new york, very glamorous. >> we'll move on to more important things. >> where's joe? >> he's coming. doing reporting right now. >> first, great to have you back, man. with us. >> i feel like it's old time, mark's here. barnicle is not here. where is barnicle? >> he was here are week, but he likes to do a four-day week. >> he heard about my incoming and that was the end of that. obviously, the two political parties have done a great job of providing an amazing selection of candidates for the leadership of this country.
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>> so much has happened. >> nothing to worry about there with the political party. >> we want to talk about the incredible work you have been doing for the last four years. i want to ask you because i thought about you as we went through this campaign with donald trump and his rise and then his election. >> and bernie. bernie's surprise. he had the same energy, a different flavor. >> four years later, a completely logical reaction to all the stuff you were talking about in 2007, 2008, and 2009. >> not just me but anybody who looked at how the bailouts were dealt with. the first time i sat on this desk with you in september of 2008 in the middle of the financial crisis. we talked about the need to be honest about reforming the way our government relates to corporations, specifically, and whether it's the drug companies or the banks or the defense companies, and the idea that rules are for sale. at least the perception that rules are for sale, and obviously, i'm not the only one who had that perception. that's a widespread perception,
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i believe rightfully so, and the reason why bernie did as well as he did and ultimately the reason trump won. >> were you surprised that donald trump won? >> i would never sit here. first, it would be the height of arrogance for me to show up and say i saw this coming. >> you saw something in the air? >> it was clear that anti-establishment energy was continuing to build and it at some point it would happen. that it turned out to be donald trump was shocking, quite honestly, but that something happened is incredible. if there's one thing made clear to me in the whole process, it's that we must, we must, must, must ultimately do something to create more access for more presidential candidates to be able to run. we can't relinquish the authority to select our candidates for the presidency of the united states to these two political parties. that to me is sort of the main takeaway from this election,
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regardless of what happens. there are hundreds of americans, thousands of americans who are incredibly qualified, who are -- we all know ten people who are incredibly qualified who could never run for president because they don't work inside of this political system. >> what did you think of bernie sanders as a candidate and would he have had a shot? >> i think he destroyed donald trump. again, i believe that donald trump voters, i believe half of the donald trump voters were people who were voting against the establishment. and donald trump was the only choice they had to do that. and so if you gave them another choice or two choices that were anti-establishment, i believe bernie sanders simply is vastly more appealing and credible in many ways. thought that i agree -- see, here's the thing. oh, donald trump believes this or that. nobody cares what these people believe. it was -- i mean, i shouldn't say nobody cares, but the referendum is much more on the idea that the establishment political system, the clinton
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establishment, all these things, it was done. and unfortunately, it was done by donald trump which i would hope that we could do better than that, but again, that's why honestly, just to really tie a ribbon on this, i'm so happy about peter ackerman, because he's running this lawsuit against the uber partisan committee on presidential debates, which is preventing -- they're a partisan organization preventing access. i'm happy to be here, but if there's somebody you ought to have on the set, january 5th, he's going in front of the court to argue against the federal election commission to say, listen, not that any one of us should be president, but we can do a better job of creating presidential candidates. this is america. we have the best universities in the world, some of the best scientists in the world, some of the best leadership in the world, and we're getting donald trump versus hillary clinton as our two best presidential candidates. the whole world is saying you have have 300 million people and the best you can do is these two
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people. it's embarrassing and it's happening because we created a partisan system that is restricting to the candidates. if you don't produce the candidates, you gaecan't get a president. >> is that it? >> that's it. he's back. >> i thought we were talking about greenhouses. >> right now. >> dylan has channeled that energy we saw every day on his show. the energy you saw there, and he's using it to do good in the world. talk about the containers. explain what they are. nice profile in "the new york times." >> that was nice. >> very cool. i was like, look at money party. >> what's the container. >> the company is called helical. think of it as a kit, as the best solar system, the best hydroponic growing system, the best communication system and the best water processing systems in the world of which i invented none, so we went out and sourced best water system, best hydroponic system, best solar system, best communication system and hired oil workers
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from louisiana and repurposed them or redirected them to integrate best solar, best water, all those categories, best water, best solar, best communications, best power, best food. put it all together in a standardized plug and play kit that can go anywhere in the world. and that upon arrival anywhere, whether it's an inner city in america, whether it's a rural environment in america, whether it's the middle east, whether it's a housing development in louisiana, whether it's a native american indian reservation in canada, talking to them. flint, michigan, it's perfect. i hear just to back up a little bit, all of us love the idea of getting the benefit of all of this technology. right? the same way we like the benefit of having iphones and ipads, but we don't know how to build iphones and ipads. we love the idea of living in a solar powered world, but i'm not going to sit here and go through catalogs. mark is not going to figure out how many kilowatts and how many
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gallons. so the idea behind this is to crate create a camp that's sourcing best in class, getting those things, putting them together and prewiring them in such a way that it can actually function as a kit and benefit mark or benefit willie or your children and their school or benefit communities in harlem or communities in the bronx or wherever it may be. and so that's what the business has been for the past few years and it's been a learning experience. i know more about killowatts thn i ever thought i would know. >> i think that's cool. money party has done something actually green. >> dillon rylan ratigan, thank much. you look great, healthy and happy. >> again, i like the scarf. looking good. >> still ahead, former senator scott brown finds an unlikely ally in his bid to be the nest sexitary of veterans affair. >> if scott brown is the nominee for veterans affairs, i have no doubt that he would put his heart and soul into trying to help veterans.
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i would put my heart and soul into trying to help him do that. you bet i would support him for that. >> that's elizabeth warren, who by the way, texted me, because i said that sort of critical -- i love her, i was critical this week. she said she was trying to fight back a bill where lobbyists outnumber members of congress three to one when she made the comments i was critical of. so i think we need to have her on to talk about that. i'm going to talk to her today. >> another person reportedly being considered for the v.a. job, sarah palin. plus more on donald trump tapping retired general james mattis as defense secretary. colonel jack jacobs gives us his take ahead on "morning joe."
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donald trump is considering sarah palin to be his secretary of veterans affairs. yeah. palin said she's great at
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helping veterans, and john mccain was like, wrong. >> that's a good point. it is a good point. joining us now, msnbc military analyst and retired army colonel and medal of honor recipient jack jacobs. sarah palin heading the v.a., go. >> no. and it's not going to happen either. it's curious about where that came from in the first place. >> really? >> have to find the thread and work it all back and see if it didn't come from sarah palin herself. >> i would think that would be demoralizing. >> i don't think anyone's taking it seriously. >> let's focus on general mattis. >> yes. >> because that is real. what's your gut on his leadership style, what we know about him, and sort of the thinking behind this choice? >> he's -- you know, we use the term unique all the time. we over use it. and as a matter of fact, we misuse it. we talk about people who are very unique, things. you're either unique or you're not unique. general mattis is unique.
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i have never run across anybody quite like him. and there have been few people in history in the military uniform who are like him. he's very well read. extremely focused. and that may be part of the problem. i mean, he's so focused on war fighting. he's a war fighter, as a general officer, spnt as much time as he could with troops, in fox holes with them. we all do. we love troops. it's good to be with them. they're very funny and caring for the united states all the time. he has never been at a job where he's had to deal with a large, cumbersome inertia ridden bureaucracy. that's the defense department. the pentagon is the biggest office building in the world, and it's crammed full of people. he doesn't have that experience. he's going -- i think he's going to do what he wants to do, which is to talk about strategy, spend time with the troops, try to
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convince the boss of the right way to use the military instrument of power. on the good side -- >> and build it up or bring it into the future? >> well, i mean, that's going to happen whether he says it or not because the congress is bringing it into the future because they're spending a lot of money on technology. no, he has a very clear-eyed view of what role national security plays among the pan apleaa of tools the nation has at its disposal. he's not the kind of guy who says what we need to do -- i know there are a lot of quotes. let's blow them all up, but when confronted with the option of blow everything up or do nothing at all, he's got a very clear-eyed view of what to do and how it fits into the use of the economic instrument and the diplomatic instrument. however, having said all that, he doesn't know it's going to be difficult for him to get behind a desk. he doesn't want to do that.
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which means that the -- his deputy secretary of defense better be somebody who knows that building, has a great deal of experience. don't forget, the deputy secretary of defense is the xo. he runs the day to day operation of that enormous building and that whole department. my guess is that jim mattis doesn't -- he can do it, i guess, but he doesn't want to do it. so the number two guy better be that guy. >> also, the secretary of state job, mark, now is sort of interesting. you would want to have -- i'm not sure you would want a general. >> no, and a number of people close to donald trump familiar with how he thinks about this who say maybe with flynn and mattis, another general is not a great idea. but i'm curious how you think flynn and mattis will get along. >> i'm glad you brought that up. i don't think they're necessarily going to get along very well for a number of reasons. the first is that flynn is probably not the right guy to be national security adviser in the first place.
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he is an operator, an intelligence operator. if you want to know what putin had for breakfast this morning, flynn is the guy to ask. to be the honest broker, to take all of the input, all the requirements for national security, fashion it into some kind of guidance, which then can be executed by the united states, flynn's not the right guy. i think what's going to happen now is mattis and flynn are going to be like this. >> colonel jack jacobs thank you so much. >> still ahead, more from donald trump. back on the trail. >> thank you so much for being with us. o is for out of this world. l is for loving the seasonal cuisine. a is for access to everything, including the aisle. r is for reclining in tailor-made bedding. and i... must be dreaming. s... so long, jet lag.
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liberty mutual insurance who is a woman entrepreneur here? who are the women? a lot of them. hate to tell you, men. generally speaking, they're better than you are. now, if i said it the other way around, i would be in big trouble. >> oh, my god. he's back. he's back. donald trump -- the president-elect rallying. >> president-elect to you. >> going to be interesting to see how much live coverage he gets as president for his remarks. >> oh, it's all going to be a big show. >> for the first six months, everything he does in public will be covered live on every channel. food, a&e. >> network executives are getting killed right now.
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>> there's that. >> certain one that won't be named went to a seminar yesterday and got absolutely skewered. >> what? >> for playing the speeches in full. i wonder, does that change now that he's president of the united states? do they -- >> fascinating to watch, but i think we'll see a lot of live coverage. >> you have -- he's going to be the president of the united states. >> going to be a massive show. >> press conferences the president does with foreign leaders. >> i priredict he won't pardon e turkeys. he'll kill them with his hands. >> they'll cover that in full. >> what did you take away from the week? >> it's funny you mentioned turkeys. my takeaway from the week has to do with thanksgiving leftovers and how long you can go about eating them. i discovered there is no -- >> art buchwald is now on the program. >> i had about eight meals in a row that involved leftover thanksgiving turkey. you can do different things with it. you can make soup.
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>> what's going on with him? >> you can make turkey enchiladas. >> never mind, actually. um --. >> i tried to make it -- >> kasie, what did you learn this week? >> um -- how to keep a straight face on a set with sam stein. honestly, i learned a ton from the harvard forum yesterday. >> that was incredible. >> the bitterness. >> the bitterness of it, the way both sides view how this election was won and lost. and quite frankly, what our conversations are going to sound like for the next four years. >> oh, i hope not. >> i just don't think that the bitterness is going away. in addition to the personal animosity, the culture clash that underscored this entire election was on display, and i just don't see that getting any better, especially if the president elect is making speeches, the speech he made last night was in such sharp contrast to the gracious
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concession he gave on election night. i wonder which donald trump are we going to see every day. >> i learned donald trump is extraordinarily caught up in the question of who his secretary of state should be and there's a lot of toing and froing around him, and i think in his own mind about how to resolve this. >> you think what? >> toing and froing about how to resolve this. >> it's wide open, and he is in absolutely no rush. but there's no doubt he would love to go back to rudy giuliani, but he's been told by too many people that doesn't work and he may not be confirmed. he had a great dinner with mitt romney. but the blowback from choosing romney would be pretty tremendous from his own people. even last night at the rally, there were signs that said no romney. >> he's not going to announce secretary of state monday when he announced mattis? >> i don't think so. >> who leaves? no romney, no rudy, no petraeus because of the general question. >> it's not no.
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he's looked at rudy, looked at mitt. >> rudy has looked at himself. >> corker. >> he's looked at corker and now he's looking at the ceo of exxonmobil, and he's got -- i mean, the process is going to go on at least long enough for him to get the ceo of exxonmobil in to talk to him. and people are asking what's going on. well, there are a lot of imperfect selections here. again, he would love to have rudy. he knows he has confirmation problems with rudy. other big problems with rudy. mitt romney makes the most sense. says he's straight out of central casting, but that causes too much consternation among his key supporters. general petraeus, he loved general petraeus, was blown away with general petraeus, but he can't name yet another general there. and he understands that, too. >> this could drift back to corker. >> this could actually drift back. now he has -- >> great math. >> now the ceo of exxonmobil
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coming in. he's going to talk to him. the guy's been running the company for 20 years. but you are right. this could drift back to bob corker. as sort of, you know, a choice -- who's going to be angry if he picks bob corker? >> nobody. >> absolutely nobody. >> might be well served. >> he's safe, and corker would make a lot of sense. >> chuck schumer wouldn't object. >> even schumer. pass it through. and actually, you're right, bob corker might be the compromise candidate that makes the most sense. >> what a week it's been. we have great bookings forthex week. that does it for us this morning. have a wonderful weekend. >> can we say who's coming? >> no. >> it's huge. >> but it's going to be huge. ali velshi picks up the coverage. >> thank you. i'm ali velshi in for stephanie ruhle this morning. the never ending campaign. donald trump reliving his victory. >> we did have a lot of fun fighng

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