tv MSNBC Live With Steve Kornacki MSNBC January 13, 2017 1:00pm-2:01pm PST
towards delivering relief to more than americans who are struggling under this law. >> just in the last few minutes, the house of representatives taking a crucial step forward in the republican plan to repeal obamacare. republican leadership saying a plan to replace it will be ready to go by the end of the month, but as time is running out. even some rank and file republicans are worried it's all talk. also on the agenda, scathing report out of chicago on the police department there. the department of justice concluding the chicago police department has violated civil rights for years. >> there is reasonable cause to believe that the chicago police department engages in a pattern or practice of use of excessive force in violation of the fourth amendment to the constitution. >> attorney general loretta lynch delivering the results of a year long investigation, the massive reforms that the department of justice is suggesting just ahead. and rounding out our agenda,
donald trump against the media. another early morning tweet storm today from the president-elect, decrying fake news and what is turning into one of the early conflicts of his presidency. >> go ahead. go ahead. >> since you are attacking our news organization -- >> your organization is terrible. >> that's a question. >> i am not going to give you a question. you are fake news. >> trump and the media, it'll be a big story these next four years. what are we in store for when the trump presidency begins? all that, much more ahead this hour, but we do begin with our top story again, the breaking news out of washington just in the last few minutes, the house of representatives voting to pass a budget procedural plan this will clear the way to repeal major parts of the affordable care act. obamacare. and also in the last few minutes passing on the house floor, that waiver which is going to allow president-elect trump's pick for
secretary of defense, james mattis to serve in office. there of course is a long-standing restriction in place preventing someone whose been in uniform recently from being confirmed as secretary of defense. usually there is a seven year waiting period with mathty it'll only be three years, but that waiver now going through the house, but, the headline, the obamacare vote, repeal plans moving forward in the house. important to note though today that the legislation that just passed does not put anything into effect immediately. it is rather the second step in what is going to be a long process, if republicans are going to ultimately repeal obamacare. trump as of late has been to repeal and replace obamacare at at the same time, the problem with that idea, republicans have yet to put forward a plan that the majority of the republicans in congress can agree on to replace obamacare.
some republicans now expressing frustrations before this vote today. others trying to rally their colleagues to forge ahead on the vote for repeal. one congressman using floor time by invoking goats. >> a little over six years ago i lived in a pretty decent house, and one day i heard a knock on the dpoorp before i knew it, my colleagues had let a goat loose in my house. now for six years that goat has been messing in and destroying my house. i want to renovate my house, but before i can, i have to get the goat out of the house before it does more damage. voting gets this goat out of my house. >> all right. joining us how from capitol hill, casey hunt, she's been following all of this. you have a colorful metaphor there, casey, but take us from this standpoint, donald trump has said he wants to repeal obamacare and he wants, at the same time it's repealed, to have
a new plan in place. is that on the horizon? could that actually happen here? >> reporter: it is possible, steve, to a certain extent anything is possible in that regard. but it is extremely unlikely if you are familiar with how things tend to work or not work, kind of grind along here on capitol hill. the challenge is not just getting republicans on the same page, if they want to replace this, they have to compromise with democrats in the senate. that is really the challenge. and that's why what happened today is so significant. this is going to allow them to take apart with only republican votes. and the next step and i talked to vice president elect pence about this earlier this week, and he said, echoing the president-elect, we're going to move two pieces of legislation along parallel tracks. one is the repeal in the budget resolution. the other is whatever they're going to come up with to replace this law. and ideally they want to vote on both at the same time. but that second piece is just so
much harder. i'm trying to come up with a goat-related anl jis to help explain it, i'm drawing a little bit of a blank, but essentially, trying to move that through, they're going to have to collect votes from probably red state democrats and right now the democrats are saying we're not going to rescue that. we're not going to try to help you put it back together and we're going to let you feel what it's like to own problems in the health care system. which is of course what democrats have been feeling far long time. i also think there's going to be a significant administrative part to this. relying on tom price, the hhs secretary nominee, not just for his suggested plan and potentially using what he had outlined a very conservative health care plan to write some of the legislation up here, but also to dig into the regulations. there's a ton that the secretary of hhs can do to affect how people receive their health care
simply by virtue of holding that position. and i think they're going to rely a lot on him as well. there is a very, very tough road ahead here, steve, to replace this law. it's much rockier than the road to repeal. >> okay. well the new phase here, republicans quickly entering into, they've been arguing for repeal for the last six years, now they're going to have to address that second. >> reporter: herd of goats, steve. >> you've got the goats in, casey hunt there on capitol hill with all the latest. casey, thank you for that. of course the other story playing out on capitol hill all week in anticipation of donald trump swearing in a week of confirmation hearings for president-elect trump's cabinet choices. hearings for his picks for attorney general, for cia director, for other top posts going off relatively without incident in most cases. trump and his team optimistic so far that his picks are headed towards confirmation, but, there are some potential speed bumps, and maybe worse for the incoming administration. a lot of it has to do with
trump, his pick for secretary of state, and this moment. >> if someone is conducting cyber attacks against the united states and we pass a law that authorizes the president to sanction them or actually imposes these sanctions is mandatory, would you advice the president sign it? >> given the executive stool one thing, requiring the executive to use it without any other considerations, i would have concerns. >> and what's troubling about your answer is the implication that somehow, if there is some country that we're trying to improve relations with or have significant economic ties with, the president, you may advise the president not to impose sanctions on that country in individuals on that country out of concern it could damage our rest of our relationship with them on a cyber attack. >> that's marco rubio, republican marco rubio with rex tillerson, donald trump's pick for secretary of state at tillerson's confirmation hearings this week, and if there is one problem, one big question
marks that's emerged for this the incoming administration, it's is marco rubio going to cause trouble for rex tillerson's nomination for secretary of state? you see the subject of russia coming up there. rubio focussing on that with his questioning. this is the vulnerability with tillerson. concerns from hawkish republicans like marco rubio, that may be donald trump doesn't take putin, doesn't take russia seriously enough, and also that rex tillerson with his business ties as the ceo of exxonmobil, all of those ties he has to russia, all of those ties to putin, will he take russia seriously enough? will he have an aggressive enough posture. rubio raising those concerns. well marco rubio actually vote for rex tillerson as secretary of state. and here's why that matters. check out how this committee looks. this is the foreign relations committee. they've going to vote on whether to recommend this nomination. look at the balance. there's 11 republicans, there's ten democrats, if, and this is a big if, if all ten democrats
vote now and if marco rubio also votes no, there are more no voits than yes, sir notes. you have a negative recommendation come out of committee, you can still take it to the senate floor, but if marco rubio twor vote no, if you were to get a negative recommendation out of this committee on tillerson. look at what the rest of the senate looks like. look at the potential domino effect, the republicans have the majority, they do not have a lot of votes to spare. there are other senators, like blooub are hawkish on russia, hawkish on putinen. worried about the posture. lindsey graham made a noncommittal statement. there are others. if rubio goes, does mccain go, does graham do? do the other republican hawk goes? does tillerson have under 50 votes. the flipside of course, are there democrats who might then bail out the republican nominee, donald trump's nominee. think of joe manchin, heidi
highcamp, joe donnelly from indiana. what do they all have in common? they are democrats from red states who are up for reelection in 2018. they are going to have to face the voters in less than two years, in states that went for donald trump by big margins. would they think twice about torpedoing donald trump's pick for secretary of state? so right now, we will see more hearings next week. some cabinet picks have not had the hearings start yet, right now the biggest single question mark when it comes to the trump administration, will rex tillerson get through as secretary of state? joining me now to talk more about this, and the transition as it moves into it's final week, former republican senator from texas, kay bailey hutcheson. thank you for joining us. we're talking in my m cases about your former colleagues. obviously you know how the senate works. you know how confirmation battles work. i'm curious what you make of the rex tillerson confirmation, looking at marco rubio, looking at the questions this week.
do you think tillerson has something to worry about here in terms of being confirmed? >> well certainly watched the hearings. and i was particularly concerned about marco's line of questioning seeming to badger rex tillerson into saying that putin is a war criminal. you know, i think a senator can make that allegation, but i don't think it would be right for our country for the secretary of state to say, oh yes, certainly i would call a name like that. that's not a good beginning. i think rex tillerson was great in his hearing because he was very measured. and i think it shows that he does have a diplomatic side and a judgment factor that's going to be very important for his job going forward. >> i'm curious, do you think there was a subtext here in the questioning from marco rubio, and maybe in terms of the comments from john mccain or from lindsey graham this week, where they have concerns about
donald trump, donald trump and russia, donald trump and vladimir putin, and they have before them a nominee rex tillerson who has business ties to russia just by virtue of the oil business he's been in for all of his life. that did they see an opportunity to use this nomination to make a bigger statement about their concerns about donald trump and russia? >> i think that's a fair statement. however, i do believe that rex tillerson was very imfattic that he is clear-eyed about putin. as is donald trump. -- george bush said he was going to try to have at least a dialogue capability with putin and i think that's what rex tillerson and the president-elect are also saying. i don't think they want to start out by calling my name of a head of a country that is an adversary. it's a country that we are going to have to deal with in a very firm way.
and i think going now into that, in a measured way is the right approach. i thought general mattis was also very clear in his hearing. i think rex and general mattis are going to be a great team to put america's best foot forward in a very judicious, but firm way. >> the critics of donald trump, and that includes from within the republican party, they say hey, look at the public record here. donald trump's comments about russia, comments about vladimir putin. you will be hard-pressed to find critical comments by donald trump when it comes to russia. he'll talk about how strong vladimir putin is. how much respect and support he has from the russian people. you wasn't hear condemnation from donald trump. do you subscribe to the argument that donald trump is not tough enough on vladimir putin in public? >> i don't. i think that both the leader of
china and russia are going to be people with whom america is going to have to have a relationship and in which they can go forward in every way possible that will be productive, but on the other hand, not allowing them to do things to america like any kind of cyber attack on our election system or going into. china sea where there's no right for china to be. i think these are things that rex tillerson has laid out are groing to be areas where we're going to be very firm for america's position. we're not going to make statements that are going to blow things up in a way that would not be productive going forward. there will be a time to blow up, but let's try to make sure that we're not in a bad position which we have to take that very strong stand. >> and i just to want ask you about the other, the breaking
news right now the out of capitol hill, the house moving forward, it's a complicated process here, but moving forward with the repeal of obamacare. you were there in 2010 when obamacare passed. you voted against it then. there seems to be disgreept about what exactly to do here. let me ask you from this standpoint, donald trump sags hey, i want to repeal this thing and at the same time, i want to put a replacement plan into effect right away. other republicans say, that's not realistic, that can't happen. where do you come down? >> i think what's very important here is that people not think that you can just vote to repeal it, because a lot of people are on it right now. they've just signed up for the next year. and they need to be totally assured that they are going to have what they have signed up for this year. as the congress works forward, it took about three or four years to get obamacare in place. i voted against it. every republican voted against it. it's going to take several years
to undo it, but i think what they're all saying is we're going to start now undoing it. because it has hurt our health care system. we want to keep the parts that are an improvement, and there are some, but the prescriptive nature of it, in my opinion, is what has killed obamacare and made the insurance companies back out of covering people. and i think if they can start addressing those issues, and allow the companies to give a health care for their employees that the employees want, give them choices a ennot make them take things they don't need or want, and let them choose plan but allow the companies to get back in the system with the insurance companies and give people a system they feel that they can rely on where the premiums are not going to go up 100% or 200% every year. and that's what i think the
republicans are saying and they're in lock step. it is going to take a couple of years, people need to know that, but we are not going to have a broken health care system like obamacare has given us. >> all right. former republican senator kay bailey hutcheson, thanks for the time. >> thank you very much. going to take a quick break here. coming up, civil rights icon john lewis weighing in on donald trump's election with some very provocative comments. this is an exclusive interview with chuck todd just from a few minutes ago. >> you have forged relationships with many presidents. do you plan on trying to forge a relationship with donald trump? >> no, i believe in forgiveness. i believe in trying to work with people. it's going to be hard. >> we'll play exact wla congressman lewis had to say and he will explain why he is skipping the trump inauguration. that's coming up. plus more fallout after the
bomb shell announcement the department of justice inspector general is now looking into the fbi's handling of the clinton e-mail investigation. while many on the left and right welcomed the move. is there any proof as some have claimed that comey's actions actually affected the outcome of the election. we have a bunch of numbers. we're going to go through all of them. that is too, stay with us. no sir, no sir, some nincompoop stole all my wool sweaters, smart tv and gaming system. luckily, the geico insurance agency recently helped baa baa with renters insurance. everything stolen was replaced. and the hooligan who lives down the lane was caught selling the stolen goods online. visit geico.com and see how easy it is to switch and save on renters insurance. by simply enjoying it. boost® simply complete. it's intelligent nutrition made with only 9 ingredients, plus 25 vitamins and minerals and 10 grams of protein. and look where life can take you!
investigation just days before the election. an october surprise that the clinton team believes cost them the election. brian fallon, who had been clinton's campaign spokesman this morning blaming comey's last minute action for the result. >> brian, do you still think that james comey had a significant affect on hillary clinton's loss? >> i do. and a number of us that worked on the campaign were in touch yesterday in light of this news and all of us were appreciative of the fact that there's finally going to be an authoritative statement for the historical record about inappropriateness of what happened here. we wish the action had been taken in july and if it had, if there was a probe launched about james comey's press conference in july, maybe it would have stopped him from sending that letter and history might have had a different course. >> donald trump now hitting back at team clinton's response to the new investigation, tweeting, what are hillary clinton's people complaining about with respect to the fbi?
based on the information they had, she should never have been allowed to run. guilty as hell. they were very nice to her. she lost because she campaigned in the wrong states, no enthusiasm. for more now, i want to bring in ed rendell, former pennsylvania governor, former chair of the dnc and matt slap, i'm curious, you look at this investigation, we see the clinton folks are happy, they think it's overdo. what do you hope comes out kpf. >> what i hope comes out of the investigation is rules and regulations that are make it clear that we cannot engage in this type of dhukt close to an election no press conferences. certainly none within 60 days before an election. when i was a prosecutor, we never would have done anything like this within 60 days before an election. and i hope some very hard and fast rules, recommendations, come out of this that changes the future.
did this -- comey's announcement, the october surprise, cost hillary clinton the election? i think that's impossible to say. did it have an effect? it sure did, steve. the day prior to comey's october surprise, hillary clinton was ahead in the philadelphia suburbs by 22 points. she wound up on election day winning 11 points. had she won by the original 22, she would have countered by over 50,000 votes. >> we have more numbers too. we're going to look more into that section and i think you're right, it sproebl impublic to ever say for sure what one thing did or didn't swing an election? but matt, let me ask you from a procedural standpoint i guess looking back at that drama in the last few day us of the campaign. 11 days out, james comey comes out and says hey look, we have these anthony weiner e-mails, we're taking a new look. the whole political world kind of goes crazy. you had donald trump saying look that the, the investigation is back open, this is a huge deal
then a couple days after, coe my basically saying, okay, that's it. it's over. we found nothing here. looking back at it, maybe he should have never said anything in the first place. >> i can understand why people say that because it is unusual to have such a lightning bolt come from the sky that affects the race, but you know, i think it's amazing. you know, hillary clinton broke the law. if anyone else had done what she did on the custody of her e-mails and handling classified information which we know on multiple occasions she did not handle correctly. anyone else, people in the military and government, they've had the book thrown at them. she did not. she got off for whatever reason, i could make all kinds of charges, but in the end, what do you expect the fbi director to do when he finds a whole new cache of e-mails, he finds in an
investigation because her husband is some kind of online creep, you know, you also can't make those facts up and the fbi director had this thrown in his lap. and he really had no other choice but to investigate. the whole thing is -- hillary clinton has no one to blame but herself for the way she handled the e-mails. we all know there are protocols and everyone's got to follow the law, even the secretary of state. >> we talk about this question of whether the coe my thing affected the election. something else you've heard from clinton folks, democrats, the belief that the russian involvement swung the election. now we have this, john lewis, congressman from georgia, long time democratic member from congress, he said just a few hours ago to chuck todd, he does not believe donald trump is a legitimate president. listen to this. >> you have forged relationships with many presidents. do you plan on trying to forge a relationship with donald trump?
>> you know, i believe in forgiveness, i believe in trying to work with people. it's going to be hard. it's going to be very difficult. i don't see this president-elect as a legitimate president. >> you do not consider him a legitimate president? why is that? >> i think the russians participated in helping this man get elected. and they helped destroy the candidacy for hillary clinton. i don't plan to attend inauguration. it'll be the first one that i miss. since i've been in the congress. you cannot be at whole with something that you feel that is wrong. >> well ed rendell, i have to ask you this, if you think back to a few days before the election when everybody certainly in the clinton campaign thought they were going to win the election and donald
trump was saying, you'll have to see after the election if i acknowledge he's the winner. hillary clinton had this to say, she put up on twitter, donald trump refused to say he respect the results of this election. that's a direct threat to the democracy. that was a major theme in the closing days of campaign, the importance of respecting the results, and now you have john lewis coming out saying that donald trump is not a legitimate president. is that a responsible thing to say? >> well, i think john lewis is an american hero, but i think he's wrong because there's one fact missing. do i believe the russians trying to help donald trump become president? absolutely. do i believe james comey's eras help donald trump become president? absolutely. do i believe that donald trump had anything to do with either of those events? there's not a sin tell la of evidence, until there is, for example, to say that the trump campaign was working with the russians, and that doesn't
exist. until something like that exists, donald trump is a legitimate united states president. he won under the rules, there were outside forces that helped him, but outside forces that -- up to now, we have no evidence had any control over. i think john is -- i understand the depth of his emotions. we both cared very deeply about hillary clinton, but i don't think it's fair to say that donald trump is not a legitimate president. absent, some connection between the trump campaign and either of those events. >> all right. ed rendell and matt, we are out of time unfortunately thank you both for joining us. squeeze a quick break in here. still ahead, widespread constitutional abuses napz how the justice department is describing what is going on with the chicago police department for years, they say. >> the department of justice has concluded that there is reasonable cause to believe that the chicago police department engages in a pattern or practice of use of excessive force in violation of the fourth
all right. time now far quick check of the headlines. house voted in the pags hour to approve a budget resolution that sets the stage for the repeal of major portions of the affordable care act. obamacare. the resolution allowing lawmakers to use a process called reconciliation basically what that means. you only need 51 votes in the senate. it can't be filibustered, makes it easier for republicans to do. federal and local officials meanwhile in the nation's capitol saying there is no credible threat to donald trump's ft. shl inauguration. nearly 30,000 police and military personnel will be on hand to protect the event. hundreds of thousands are expected to gather in washington for events surrounding the transfer of power. federal prosecutors announcing an indictment today against three former executives of air bag maker takata accusing them
of covering defects that the company uses. faulty air bag inflaters are blamed for at least 16 deaths worldwide. the largest auto recall in u.s. history. agreeing to pay $1 billion in fines. drivers from oklahoma all the way up through southern illinois dealing with icy roads and highways this afternoon. a winter storm bringing freezing rain to the region causing accidents, grounding flights, even closing a number of schools. and now, to the city of chicago. that is where officials are now promising reforms. this after the justice department released a scathing report on the city's police force. the report finding that the president had violated the constitutional rights of residents for years. >> the department of justice has concluded that there is reasonable cause to believe that the chicago police department engages in a pattern or practice of use of excessive force in violation of the fourth amendment to the constitution.
our investigation founded this pattern of practice is in no small part of the result of severely deficient training procedures and accountability systems. >> now the investigation began in late 2015 after the city released this dash cam video. shows a police officer shooting black teenager louisiana kwan mcdonald 16 times. that officer, jason van dyke is now facing murder charges. gabe gutierrez joins us now with reaction from chicago, gabe, what was notice to believe me at least in that clip we just played, you had loretta lynch and the city's mayor rahm emanuel standing right next to her as she unveiled this report. >> yeah, it's exactly right, steve. now the reaction to this report is range from vindication from. critics of the chicago police department who felt there were systemic problems within the department for decades. and criticism from the head of the police union who says this was a politically motivated rush job right before inauguration day. as he mentioned, one of the big
questions we had going into this morning is what would mayor rahm emanuel say? he stood next to her. and last year enacted reforms before the results of this d.o.j. report came out. let's listen to some what have he had to say this morning. >> i want to be clear, the chicago police department, the city of chicago is already on the road to reform and there are no u-turns on that road. it is my fefr rant hope that this report does not lead to another round of finger pointing or more ak ro moans you debate of us versus them. >> and mayor emanuel also pledged to work with the federal government through the court system to enact some more police reforms. steve, the question will be how the incoming donald trump administration will handle this. his nominee for attorney general, jeff sessions, previously said, and he is reluctant to get the federal courts involved to force reform
at local police departments. so that remains to be seen, steve. >> all right gabe gutierrez out there in chicago. gabe, thanks for that. turning back to politics, one week from today, donald trump due to be sworn in as president as the countdown continues. he is expressing confidence in his cabinet nominees. now seven of the president-elect's picks facing questions this week from senators in confirmation hearings. several of them moving to distance themselves from trump on some policy issues. most notably involving russia. trump tweeting this morning that the nominees are doing a great job in his view. said he wants them to be themselves and express their own thoughts. kristen welker joins us now from washington with more. kristen, this has been an unusual situation that has emerged where there's daylight that's becoming evident between these trump picks and between trump and the things he said during the campaign. and some senators saying, they're comforted by that. >> it's been really striking, steve, and you're absolutely right. a number of senators saying that
it has given them more confidence in president-elect trump's picks. over the issue of waterboarding as you point out, president-elect trump as a candidate talked about the fact that he would support waterboarding. that is something that james mattis for example has picked for secretary of defense has said that he wouldn't support. and then over this issue of russia, which has become such a hot button issue. just today, president-elect trump tweeting about it again, blaming the u.s. intelligence community for leaking information about the fact that intelligence officials essentially prepared a briefing which said that russia has incriminating evidence against president-elect trump. that's something that hasn't been corroborated, hasn't been verified, the president-elect calling that fake news. look at his latest tweet, steve, from today, dressing that. he says it urns out that the phony allegations against me were put together by my political opponents and failed spy afraid of being sued. totally make-up by sleaze bag
political operatives, fake news. russia says nothing exists. probably released by intelligence. even knowing there is no proof and never will be. my people will have a full report on hacking within 90 days. and what we saw during those confirmation hearings this week, steve, was a very different tone from his pick for secretary of defense, james mattis, as well as his pick for cia director, mike pompeo, who said they do have confidence in the u.s. intelligence community. mike pompeo going further to say he believes firmly that the u.s. intelligence community is accurate in the assessment that russia tried to meddle. the president-elect made a surprise appearance at trump tower today as he sometimes does and he was asked about the fact that there is daylight between him and the cabinet picks. listen to what he had to say. >> you want them to be themselves. and i told them, be yourselves and say what you want to say. don't worry about me. and i'm going to do the right
thing. whatever it is. i may be right, and they may be right, but i said be yourselves, wouldn't you say steve, let them do. picked have said do this, they. i want them all to be themselves. >> and again, steve, the fact that they are expressing some daylight from the president-elect, it seems if you talk to sources on capitol hill is increasing their chances of getting through this confirmation process. of course republicans already have the majority in the senate. so, it's unlikely any of them will falter, but i think it's certainly adding to the extent to which lawmakers are saying and expressing that they have confidence in these choices, steve. >> all right kristen welker in washington, thanks for that. >> thank you. susan rice, president obama's national security advisor, also the former ambassador to the united nations. she just sat down with andrea mitchell, talked about president-elect trump and russia. >> russia has been sanctioned now by this white house for trying to interfere with the
u.s. election. on the side of donald trump, against hillary clinton, expelling 35 diplomats, yet vladimir putin responded by not only not retaliating, but inviting american diplomatic children to moscow far christmas party. what's the deal there? i've never in all of these years seen alleged spies expelled and no retaliation from the other side. >> well, andrea, as you'll recall, it was much more than expelling 35 spies. it was also shutting some of their facilities here in the united states, sanctioning the russian military intelligence unit and other elements of the russian intelligence agencies. it will responsible for this and the individuals behind it. it was also putting out great detail the forensics behind the attacks and how they conducted them. and then has been said, there are things that the american people will not see. so we have taken significant steps. the fact that the russian government has chosen for the time being not to respond is
obviously their choice. but it doesn't deminnish the severity of their actions and the necessity of our response. >> do you think in any way that they are getting signals from donald trump, from his national security advisor that this would be reversed. that the trump administration would go easy on them? donald trump -- has actually said that being a friend of vladimir putin could be an asset. >> well, andrea are, i obviously have no firsthand basis for commenting on what may have been said between anybody on the trump team and the russian government. we have one government at a time. and it's vitally important that we respect that principle because when we engage with foreign entities, friends, butted aer have says even more so, it's necessary that we communicate with one voice. and i am hopeful that that principle has been respected. >> all right again, that's susan rice in a new interview with
andrea michl. hillary clinton still has not weighed in on the department of justice inspector general's newly announced review of how the fbi handled the clinton e-mail investigation, but just last month, this was clinton talking about what she sees as the impact of fbi director james comey's letter in the final days of the election. >> take it from nate silver whose pointed o ut that swing state voters made their decisions in the final days breaking against me because of the fbi letter from director comey. and nate silver believes, i happen to believe this, that that letter most likely made the difference in the outcome. >> did james comey cost hillary clinton the election? that's what she believes. we'll dissect it in our most important number of the day, next.
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i still think if this election had been held ten days earlier, prior to the timing of james comey's letter, hillary clinton would be the 45th president of the united states. >> all right. so this is the subtext to that news that the inspector general at the department of justice is going to be looking in, at least in part to james comey, to his investigation, his handling of the investigation into hillary clinton and her e-mails during the campaign. and of course, the question being raised here is did comey, did that last minute announcement 11 days before election day that he was reopening, essentially reopening the investigation, did that swing the election? hillary clinton says yes, so let's take a look at it with our most important number of the day today, which is 50. 50 as in, well check this out. this is something that the clinton people i think look at when they say hey, comey made the difference. this is the exit poll on election day. people who decided to vote in the last week of the election, 50, 50% of whom went with trump,
38 went with clinton. the late deciders broke trump's way. so that's really the logic here for the clinton folks. hey, the late coverage in this race was dominated by james comey. concurrent with that, donald trump was doing well. you see this in the swing states too. look at this. wisconsin, minnesota, utah, you go right down the list here. donald trump, gobbling up the late deciders in most states. that is really the basis for the clinton folks looking at this and saying hey, comey is the reason this happened. otherwise, that's not going to happen, but, there are other ways to look at this too. this may be a much more complicated picture. it can be harder than you think to pin down a single pause. here's a question also from the exit poll, how did you vote? look that the. in the final few days of the campaign, donald trump barely beating out hillary clinton. in the last week a bigger period
of time, a bigger margin, but how about that? go back further, before the james comey letter came out. if you decided in the month of october, remember, the comey letter didn't come out until october 28th. people deciding in the month of october, they also broke very decisively for donald trump. how about go back to september, they broke not o as decisively, but go for trump. people making up their mind basically before labor day to find a time period where hillary clinton beat donald trump. and it does raise a possibility here, a possibility that hey, people against donald trump, they decided against him early. and if they didn't reach that threshold necessarily of being against him early. they were a lot more inclined to go with him and against hillary clinton late. look at it it this way, hillary clinton we talked about it throughout the entire campaign. it was true of donald trump as well. historically high unfavorable numbers. the two least popular nominees we'd ever seen. running against each other. so hillary clinton went into election day with a 54%
unfavorable rating. of course donald trump was too, but it raises the question here, how many voters were always going to break against hillary clinton in the end? because they couldn't ultimately bring themselves to vote for her. yes, trump extremely unpopular, but clinton was too. look at this. this is the line graph. this is the head to head, donald trump versus hillary clinton map. basically for the entire year. look at this, 50% right here, hillary clinton, essentially for the entire campaign couldn't crack 50%. one day, basically late march, early april, cracked over 50%, right up to 50% by about a fraction of a point. the reese of the year, couldn't hit 50%. also, look what you see here, you see the yawning gaps that tighten, it keeps happening throughout the campaign, that was a trend we were seeing. donald trump would get hit with a scandal or bad news or a gaffe, whatever it was, and he'd fall far behind, but the poll ls always ended up coming back together in converging. maybe that's what was going to happen no matter what in the final days of the campaign.
donald trump had a rough middle of the october, maybe it was going to tighten at the end of the campaign. i could go on far long time. they're screaming in my ear to get out. this is a lot more complicated than looking at comey and saying automatically, that's the factor. could have been, could be a lot more at work too though. and that is our most important number of the day today. it is 50. coming up, donald trump's escalating war of words with cnn and buzzfeed. he is not the only occupy of the oval office or soon to be occupant of the oval office to spar with the media. our media panel is going to join me as we head to the next break. let's check in with the cnbc market wrap. >> hey thanks so much. thanks so much, steve. stocks close mostly higher. boosted by strong quarterly earnings the dow sliding five points, with the s&p up by four and the nasdaq gaining 2 points to a brand new record. that's it from cnbc first in business worldwide. american express open cards can help you take on a new job,
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go ahead. >> president-elect, since you are attacking our news organization -- >> not you. your organization is terrible. we're not going to give you a question. i am not going to give you a question. you are fake news. as far as buzzfeed, which is a failing pile of garbage, writing it, i think they're going to suffer the consequences. they already are. bbc news, that's another beauty. i will tell you some of the media outlets i deal with, the fake news, you have a few sitting right in front of us. so they're very, very dishonest people. >> my friends at hardball putting that together. donald trump lashing out at members of the media during that big press conference on wednesday.
trump's critics say they are concerned about what they see as his efforts to relegitimize the press and control the message about his incoming administration. for more, i want to bring in claire atkinson, media reporter. claire, let me start with you. obviously he wants to -- at least in part here delegitimize, criticism from the press. that's what we see there. is he succeeding at that right now? >> well, i feel like the white house press conferences are going to be must-see tv once he takes office. that press conference was absolutely amazing and the fireworks were unexpected. i think fake news is a very strong term. it's very worrying term to throw around. but i feel like it's a term that fox news has had to live with for quite some time. and fox news's neil cavuto did a segment saying hey guys, now it's your turn and the shoes on the other foot and let's see how it feels. >> i see people raising this today, you think back a few
years when the obama administration was not including fox news and they went after fox news, a little taste of it here. this is dan pfeifer at the white house back in '09. we simply decided to stop abiding by the fiction that fox is a traditional news organization. and josh ernest back then saying we figured fox show so you think you can dance than broadcast an honest discussion about the reform. trump's tone and blunt enes is different here, but how different is what he's actually doing? >> what's different about what he's doing is that any news organization that prints something negative about him, he goes after them. he went after fox news in the primary, remember? he went after fox news on twitter, said he couldn't get a fair hearing out of them. this has no basis in the reality. or any news organization that when he's watching tv at night, he happens to see something negative, and he takes off on
twitter, there is no principle, no consistency, no basis for any of it. so, i reject the notion that there's a parallel here between how the obama administration proceeded in early days. >> the press is offering criticism and he is -- as you say, he is going back at them hard. is there anything inherently wrong with that or is there an argument to be made that hey look, he's got the platform, he's being criticized. he can respond however he wants and people can make of it what they want. >> there is something, i believe inherently wrong about calling cnn fake news for a story that is 100% bullet proof nap story about the meeting, the briefing last week has held up wonderfully. and for him to tell cnn, fake news, i mean, that's off the hook. i don't know there's a precedent
for it. >> asking that question, eric just did, is there a precedent for it. i could think of spirro agnew in terms of finding a parallel of combativeness with the press. and what he was tapping into back then maybe and what trump is tapping into now. what do you make of it? is there a resentment of the media that's out there that's right for a politician to tap into? >> i think he just punchings hard at everybody. whether it's competitors for the primary, or whether it's the media, whether it's business people. his moe tus op ran die is to fight back and punch ten times harder than he's being punched by the press. i happen to think that an adversarial relationship with the president or with whoever is in power is a good thing. and perhaps everybody's been kind of sat back for eight years, maybe having too cozy relationship with president obama and now they kind of waking up to a new day. and i think perhaps we're going
to see some great journalism come out of this period of time. >> all right. claire, eric, that is going to have to do it. thank you both for joining us. that brings us to the end of the hour. that's going to do it for us here in new york. tonight, do not miss lester holt's exclusive interview with president obama on air force one, the dateline nbc special barack obama the reality of hope. 10:00 p.m. eastern on nbc, mtp daily starts right now. >> if it's friday, doubts on the legitimacy of the presidential election hit a new level. tonight, a bomb shell declaration from congressman john lewis. >> i don't see this president-elect as a legitimate president. >> why this living civil rights icon and respected member of congress says the russians stole the election. plus, how russia has become a new test of republican allegiance to trump.