tv MSNBC Live MSNBC January 14, 2017 12:00pm-1:01pm PST
very good afternoon. i'm richard lui lye at msnbc headquarters in new york city. good day to you. we start with stunning words from longtime congressman john lewis of georgia. nbc's chuck todd asking the civil rights icon about trump's presidency. listen to what was said here. >> i don't see this president-elect as a legitimate president. i think the russians have participated in helping this man
get elected. and they helped destroyed the candidacy of hillary clinton. i don't plan to attend the inauguration. it will be the first one that i miss since i've been in congress. you cannot be at home with something that you feel is wrong. the president-elect fired back against lewis' comments about his legitimacy on twitter today. and the democratic party of georgia also weighing in. kelly o'donnell is outside trump tower for us. get us up to date about the back and forth here. >> reporter: well, this has been a very volatile back and forth because john lewis is revered in the democratic party, he's got a persona that goes beyond politics because of his contributions to civil rights. he's also a sitting member of congress for 30 years. and to say that a president who
is going to be sworn in next week is not legitimate is a very serious charge. and you heard in his comments his basis for that, looking to the russian hacking as being an influence that interfered with the election. donald trump, who has been very sensitive to any suggestion that he has not been duly elected, did fire back, and he did so in a personal way as we have seen him use his twitter feed for before, saying that john lewis should focus on his district and described that district, which is the 5th district in georgia, as being crime ridden and a horrible place, very stark comments from the president-elect that do not fully represent what's happening in that district. and also saying that all talk, no action. and of course with john lewis he has been a person who has over the decades and especially during the civil rights era was a person of action. so that's what makes this so emotional. the president-elect can certainly comment on the fact that he feels strongly that his
election was fry and fair and even president obama has said this was a fair election and there'no oial reason to suggest the russian interference changed the vote tally on the day, but did it influence during the election season, and that's what john lewis is talking about. so we have seen the political response. democrats using this back and forth to try to raise funds. the democratic party of georgia notably standing up for the dean of its congressional district. and then you have a republican senator like ben sasse of nebraska who tweeted in support of john lewis, saying that he is a person of action, others calling hall of fame hero. so it's been the kind of politics we've seen so much in this election season, hyperbole takes over, e motions take over, and there are really jit mat issues in this conversation about did russia interfere, is donald trump getting the support that a new president should get from congress, all of these things are a very big part of this. and john lewis is such a well-known figure it got a lot
of attention. >> kelly o'donnell, thank you so much. elected officials on both sides of the aisle responding to congress lewis' comments. here's republican senator roy blunt after meeting with the president-elect in trump tower. >> john lewis is a great man. he's a friend of mine. he has to make his own decisions. but the idea of constantly looking for ways to delegitimize the results of the election no matter how unhappy you are about it, isn't the best example to set. >> joining me is a political pollster and professor at nyu and iona college. and also a spokesperson for jeff sessions and fellow at the harvard institute of politics. good day to both of you. what does this back and forth tell us as we look forward to the inauguration happening in just a wee -- what does it say about where we ar at when we
look at such important and prominent individuals such as congressman lewis and then you have a president-elect, the two of them going at each other right now? >> it's very troubling. i mean, you think about congressman lewis, he's the conscience of the congress and people on both sides of the aisle have the deep respect for him not only because of the work he's done in congress but the week he's obviously done throughout his lifetime and his commitment. for him for the first time ever to say he's not going to be going to an inauguration, that he does not see the president-elect as a legitimately elected to office i think is a stunning turn of events, and i think it is going to have a ripple effect and certainly donald trump for a while was a little quiet but has come back on twitter and i think we'll hear a lot of back and forth on it. it doesn't speak well were what we'll see during this quote/unquote honeymoon period that i don't think will be much of a honeymoon period when donald trump takes office. >> haven't seen a honeymoon at least. just as the e-mail server dogged
hillary clinton for the last couple of years, will this question about legitimacy, about russia, and the reports that have come out and the information that is alleged to have been out there so far, will that be that same issue that will dog donald trump in this first year, first two years? >> i certainly hope not. i'm incredibly disappointed with representative lewis. he's a hero to so many americans, and to come out and say that and not realize that this is about the peaceful transfer of power, it's about our american system, it's not about one man who i'm sure he didn't vote for, and that's okay. but to not say that about inauguration and about a president-elect was incredibly disappointing and i hope that americans do come together and acknowledge that this is our president. i understand that there are concerns about russia's actions, rightly so. but there is no evidence and everyone seems to agree on this, no evidence that the election itself was tampered with.
so donald trump is the legitimate president. he will be the president. and so we need to come together and recognize that the same way that the democrats were asking republicans to recognize that if hillary got elected. >> so yet more information to come. you're right, both side for the most part are saying we do not question the outcome, we question how the process was challenged, right. both of you have commented on this. i want to move to a topic that is related to russia because it's not only the question of the repts and that twpage addendum that allegedly was given and added to the report coming from the fbi. there's also the issue of china. i want to move to that because the president-elect, at least in recent statements, saying that he would not commit to the one china policy. he said this in an interview. you may have read it in "the wall street journal." it's a translation here of china's response that i also want to share with you. in part their response says this -- the one-china principle,
which is the political foundation of a china/u.s. relations is not negotiable. in order to avoid disruption to to the sound and steady development of the china/u.s. relations and bilateral cooperation in key areas we ask key parties to be sensitive to the question. when donald trump says he's questioning the one china policy, fairly consistent on russia and now on china. what do you think he's doing? >> donald trump is a disrupt or the and he is doing that in the case of china as you see with the one china policy and his statements in regard to that. he is also part of a small but i would argue growing group within the republican but not only republican circles who are challenging this idea of the one china policy. donald trump sees china as an economic threat to the united states, and he has made that perfectly clear. and his relationship,
quote/unquote with russia, while it will certainly morph and change, speaks to that as well. so i think what donald trump is doing here is he is putting china on notice. and i have to say i am somewhat everyone thet toik the argument he is making that china has not done well vis-ais t united states' economicly andhey're going to have to do better or he is going to start questioning what they see as fundamental to their relationship with the united states. i don't know how he's going succeed in this because it's going to take a lot more than just him talking about it. he'll have to bring in foreign policy and economic expert who is agree with him. but i think he is part of a growing contingent who we've been hearing in economics for a long time and i think we'll hear more of it. >> a democratic pollster joins us. fred, as you've been listening to the conversation here, the china, russia parallels in terms of the way donald trump has dealt with what traditionally have been two countries that the united states has been very
careful with its words, very calculated in terms of the way they address the issues that are important to these respective countries in the china situation, a one china policy, when he is saying he does not necessarily support that, is he not talking to china? is he not talking to those who look at foreign policy? is he really talking to that base that got him elected, those in the manufacturing spots across the country that certainly grabbed onto his anti-china statements, his statements about i will bring jobs back home? is that really where he's going? >> well, i mean, it's hard to say right now, richard, but, look, i think the is a difference between an economic foreign policy and national security foreign policy. i do think, look, president-elect trump obviously was elected with his coalition partly on bringing jobs back to america, but, you know, there's another part of the presidency
which you can't really campaign on. that's commander in chief. i think that's going to be one of the areas where people may have concerns about him and were sort of his shoot from the hip style on twitter, you know, could not only be at issue with countries around the world but also with reassuring americans. >> sara, reassuring americans and reassuring i remember leaders are two different things. when donald trump, the president-elect, is looking at the way to manage messaging, is he taking what may have worked before but does not work when you're sitting in the white house, the it's okay to question dominant theories but do that behind closed doors and work through that there, don't do it on twitter? >> well, we'll see, but here's what we do know. china has been a rising adversary now in the post cold war era for decades, and not much has been done to curtail that. and so for the foreign policy we've seen over the last decade
has led to frankly human rights catastrophes around the world at this point and rising national security threats as well. so i'm not surprised that the trump administration wants to try something massively different, because the way we do things, quote/unquote, hasn't been working. so we'll try something different here and i think that so far at least with the trump administration has been doing looks like it actually has been working. good. china's paying attention. that's right, china. you think that things aren't negotiable. everything is ne goebable. when you look at disputes in the south china sea and trade routes and trade policy, they'll have to come to the table and actually talk to someone who is unpredictable and who is not simply going to follow the playbook that has allowed china to become so aggressive in this last decade. >> too early to see if it is working because it will come out in policy and trade certainly as we go forward many the coming four years. fred, to u, when we look at russia and china, the messaging at's coming out from donald trump, is that going to resonate across the country?
from the numbers you've been watching as a pollster, are these two topics that are really at the top of the issues that donald trump supporters are hanging onto? >> well, i think right now the dominant issue in the country is the economy and jobs. look, i think when you're president of the united states, which he will be in less than a week, things you say or i guess things now you fwetweet carriese day. i think in terms of china and russia, what is interesting, you know, about the trump presidency is diplomacy by twitter. look, i have three daughters. sometimes we text. sometimes we have misunderstandings in texts. i just can't understand on something that as important as foreign policy where worlds and tone count that this is a way to run a country. >> all right. thank you so much, fred yang, jeanne, sarah, appreciate all
three of you. >> have a great one, richard. >> there's an estimated 2,000 people taking to the streets in the nation's capital today to protest their concerns over trump's policy on issues like criminal justice reform, lgbtq and women's rights and obamacare. the march is organized by reverend al sharpton's national action network and 16 other civil rights groups that are aimed at protecting the dream of dr. martin luther king jr. and preserving the legacy of president barack obama. nbc's hans nicholls was at the rally today and has the latest from the mall. hans. >> reporter: richard, the march is over, the protest is over, but the activists hope their message will continue to be heard throughout the trump presidency. one of the many theme ts here, we won't be trumped, we won't be moved, and something that came up quite often was police brutality. we had parents of those slain, eric garner, tray son martin, parent were there, mothers talking about it, and the reverend al sharpton made the point that police brutality and
everything that's going on there needs to be changed. >> we are not here because we didn't have something else to do! we're here because we fought hard to make sure that this administration heard our cry and we are not going away now! criminal justice and police reform must go forward! >> reporter: perhaps a dozen speakers and one thing that was also brought up throughout was the need to continue protest along with sort of consolidating the gains of the obama administration. that's on the affordable care act. what they're doing in terms of income inequality and this term of gains and locking in the gains from the economic growth we see over the last eight years. a great deal of concern that will be rolled back. that is the charge of this protest. going forward, they want to make sure that they continue to protest what they think, and you heard a lot of this, is an
illegitimate presidency. richard? thank you for that. hands nicholls in washington, d.c. speaking of d.c., today's march is just one of the demonstrations planned as donald trump pri pairs to take office. next we'll talk to democratic congresswoman kathleen rice. she's leading a rally to fight republican plans to repeal obamacare. plus, following the revelations about russian hacking, a former fbi double agent talks with us on just how extensive russia's intelligence gathering operations are. bounty is more absorbent, so the roll can last 50% longer than the leading ordinary brand. so you get more "life" per roll. bounty, the quicker picker upper
>> president-elect donald trump deannouncing reports that russians had information that could be used to blackmail him. trump calling the reports fake news. for the first time he did, though, acknowledge russian hacking during the election campaign. the kremlin denies that ever -- that it ever spied on trump or that it interfered in the u.s. election. russian dissenters and businessmen have accused the kremlin of black hail and harassment in the past which has raised questions about their practices. joining me a former fbi double agent and author of "how to catch a russian spy." thanks for being here. let's start specifically with these unverified reports of the russian government officials here that they have information that potentially could be used to blackmail donald trump. is that fake news or do you believe that's certainly within the realm of possibilities here? >> i think it's important to explain to the public the
difference between journalism and intelligence. in intelligence there's two silos, there's collections and analysis. when it comes to collections, look, you take down whatever information you get. you could be at a cocktail party and someone could mention almost anything and that gets written down and passed on. so and in journalism you'll seek to verify the authenticity of the actual data contained in there. it's very possible that reports say it's a former mi6 case agent who would have been running sources and in his profession in his prior life he would have been doing what i was, which is to sit down with sources, report back on what they were saying to them. now, we don't know if those things are true. but to your second question as to the realm of possibility, does russia have things that are embarrassing to trump or look, what they collect on american leaders, of course, absolutely within the realm of possibility. one catch yacht, though, in my experience i found that blackmail is often when it comes to espionage is not a tool that
works well. i think that you'll find if you look at the case history people unfortunately do this voluntarily. so it's certainly plausible. unverifiable competely but it's there. >> when you would gather information as you were out gathering this data and then forwarding it to those that you had to toward it to, did you at all earmark what you thought might be more truthful and less truthful? how would you weight that when you were reporting? >> that's a great question. it's important to understand a little bit so my role asou said, as a double agent, i was working both for the russians and the fbi, although in actuality i was really working for the fbi. so what that means simply is russians believed i was their spy. as such, i was sitting down with them and passing them information which they were then in turn forwarding on to moscow. the control of that information was very much directed and overseen by the fbi. however, the part that wasn't directed or controlled by the fbi was whether my russian case
officer, my spy handler, believed me, because clearly the way that he wrote that was going to include an assessment, you know, saying this source is truthful. >> did you weight it? >> important distinction. absolutely. we want wanted to get to the point where we would eventually do disinformation. one more step back. listening to the opening clip of trump kwloen -- and i'm lucky in i can share a classified story with the world -- but it's the professionalism of the rank and file fbi agents that i served with who -- look, i put my life in their hands and i'm able to talk, they're not because in many cases these agents still work undercover. >> got to go but i have to ask you this. >> go ahead. >> the delay of the information, the fbi saying they had this data about this information about trump for mos and they were deciding what to do with it because they couldn't verify it, now coming forward with evident lay two-page addendum. how does that compare to that which the fbi came forward, comey specifically, on the
e-mail server? how do you put those two together? how do you weight them? >> great question. very quickly, two very different silos. the criminal investigative side of the fbi is completely different from the counterintelligence side of the fbi. it's a very important distinction. clearly the comey letter had an impact on the election. the claims that are out there i would imagine that there is a task force. they're going to be looking into this. someone's got to either say they're truthful or not truthful and eliminate them. nonetheless, they warrant some level of review. >> that comparison will be made. thank you so much, former double agent for the fbi. thanks for your time. up next, the powerful winter storm you're seeing in certain parts of the country bringing dangerous icy wther to the midwest so, bad the nfl even changing its plans for the playoffs.
the country. it's now being blamed for three deaths so far. the dangerous road conditions also leading to this major pileup that you see here in kansas. at least 20 cars involved. no one was seriously injured. nbc's morgan radford is live in wichita, kansas. morgan, how does it look there right now? lots of ice i imagine. >> reporter: exactly, richard. after that 20-car pileup, people are being asked to be extremely cautious on these roads right here. to give you a sense of things we're expecting to see up to half an inch of ice overnight into tomorrow. but this ice, when it gets to about half an inch, that's what causes the power lines to weigh up to about 280 pound causing them to snap and so people are without power. i want to show you behind me, you can see the kansas national guard. they've also asked for 200 troops now to be on standby. they'll be available patrolling key roads and into the night to help those first responders.
that's as people are being asked to be cautious especially on the roads. >> morgan radford, thank you i wanto get more perspective on what we're watching in the coming days with nbc meteorologist bonnie schneider. bonnie? >> well, richard, you can see where morgan's standing that the bulk of the moisture hasn't quite worked its way into wichita but it's coming straight from the panhandle of texas. we have reports of thunder along with freezing rain. the temperature sl 36 degrees. it will go down later on. we're seeing the numbers kind of teering around the freezing mark across the region. they'll go down as well as we continue through the afternoon. with cold air to the north and more moist air to the south, it does create a recipe and some circumstances for an ice storm. when that you have warm air overriding the colder air and the precipitation falls through it, eventually by the time it reaches the ground, it's cold enough to freeze. so it'll freeze on any surface whether it's your car or the ground itself. this is where we're looking at the biggest ice impact, western
kansas and into oklahoma. we could see half an inch of ice accumulate. and keep in mind that when we're talking about that much ice, it's not just a little bit that will tilt a branch but it will actually potentially cause numerous power outages. so, richard, something to watch through tonight and into early tomorrow. >> ice on trees not good. msnbc meteorologist bonnie schneider, thank you. the house of representatives begins the process of repealing obamacare this week. next, one of the few republicans, though, that decided to vote no on this first step to repeal.
worry about moving too fast. among them congressman charlie dent, with us now from his home state of pennsylvania. you're saying they're going too fast. you voted no originally for the act, correct? >> correct. i voted against obamacare. there were numerous problems with the law that need to be corrected. it's important for republicans to first identify a replacement plan prior to repealing the law. i think that's absolutely essential. there are certain policy considerations we must be aware of. first, there are individuals who have -- who are being subsidized currently. we want to make sure whatever we changes we make would not disrupt their coverages. also the second issuehat between repeal and replacement we want to make sure that the insurance markets are able to adjust because the individual
market is collapsing as we speak without doing anything, but if we repeal the health care law without a credible replacement package, then i do become concerned about the acceleration of the collapse of those insurance markets. there's also a political consideration here, too, richard, that we have to think about, that there are going to be those on the left who will not help us replace this law and those on the hard right who will consider any obamacare replacement as obamacare light. >> the pragmatism that you're expressing, how are your fellow republicans reacting to that? >> candidly, most-my republican colleagues, many of them agree with me. >> not voting as much as you have here, representative. >> that's true, but many of them are thinking very hard about this. i think this will only get more difficult because let's assume we get this repeal through the house and the senate, as we know, the replacement package will likely require a 60-vote
threshold in the senate. i am not ware of which eight senate democrats will help us replace obamacare. that's something we have to think about. again, we also have a challenge in the house where some on the hard right and certainly those on the left will not vote for the replacement because they'll consider that replacement -- they'll denounce it as obamacare right, at least on the hard right and the left just won't help. >> some of the polling on how folks across think about obamacare right now, right now it's saying 48% of people according to quinnipiac in their recent poll iing said president-elect trump should support efforts to repeal the affordable care act. 18% saying full repeal. 31% saying no repeal. you can see what's dominant right now are parts. so for you, what do you think is efficacious here? what are the parts that need to be changed quickly? and i know we don't have all day to talk about it and we could talk about it all day.
what's one of those? >> well, first, look, at the end of the day we'll have to repeal part of this law, replace part of this law, overhaul, reform part of this law, and maintain certain aspects. so some of the pay-fors, the medical device tax, for example, is extremely problem mat nick the part of the country where i live. we have to determine a way to create an individual health insurance market that functions properly. that is not happening. and that's one aspect that we are going to have to tackle in this obamacare discussion. >> what percentage will you keep? >> oh, i don't know. certainly there's agreement that -- >> i understand. >> dependent coverage for those under 26. certainly those with pre-existing conditions should be able to maintain their coverages. we want to make sure those people are protected. those are i think two basic things. we'll have an interesting conversation about the medicaid expansion, about how to adjust medicaid. some of the states like mine have already expanded medicaid under the health care law.
and i suspect we'll have to maintain that in some form or fashion. could be different than it is now, but the expansion has occurred and i think it will be hard to put that jeannie back in the bottle. >> representative dent from pennsylvania, thank you for stopping by. >> thank you, richard. >> you betcha. > on the other side reaction to this first move by congress to repl obamacare. but from the other side, representative kathleen rice, a democrat, joins us after this. what are you doing? getting your quarter back. fountains don't earn interest, david. you know i work at ally.
i was being romantic. you know what i find romantic? a robust annual percentage yield that's what i find romantic. this is literally throwing your money away. i think it's over there. that way? yeah, a little further up. what year was that quarter? what year is that one? '98 that's the one. you got it! nothing stops us from doing right by our customers. ally. do it right. let's get out of that water.
tomorrow democrats start to lead rallies across the country to fight republican efforts to repeal obamacare. kathleen rice will be holding a rally in long island. thanks for being here. >> thanks for having me. >> we were jt speaking with charlie dent and he was one that did not vote for the repeal. he voted no. how many others on the other side of the aisle do you believe will come along with you in terms of a pragmatic approach forward, yeah, let's fix some things, leave other things but not repeal right now? >> i think charlie has quite a
few colleagues that feel the same way he did. john did not vote for it either. they understand when you say repeal and replace, which is what the president-elect talked about during the campaign, it sound like a great campaign slogan. and even a campaign promise. but when it comes time to governing it's very difficult to do. this is a very complicated law that has to be done in a thoughtful way if you want to fix it. now, i am one of those people, i was not in washington when it passed, i support health care for all. we tear greatest nation in the world and people should be able to go to the doctor. >> the criticism before you heard, the way it was introduced to congress last time came out of a committee with nancy pelosi and then you got this big, large document and you had to vote for it and then figure out what you didn't like. this is what americans are saying across the country of that process and the outcome of it. i would share some from the quinnipiac poll and discussing it with charlie dent.
48% of the people in this quinnipiac poll that came out this week saying when you look at the numbers, 47% say they want to repeal parts, 18% say full repeal, 31% saying no repeal. then we go into specifically some places, some spots in the country. i want to go to iowa. we have another poll. 59% mostly say it's a failure. are you open as charlie dent is to looking at fixing certain parts, keeping others, and getting rid of certain others? >> absolutely. i think that if charlie were sitting right next to me we would both agree we want to keep the fact that you can be up to 26 years old and stay on your parents' plan, that you cannot be penalized for a pre-existing condition, that you take away lifetime caps. those are all the good things that republicans and democrats alike agree on. where we disagree is how do you pay for that? and how do you kp t good, take out the bad, which is pa what the republicans want to do, but they don't have anything to
replace it with yet. you're going to be part of dozens of rallies happening over the rest of the week here. what is it that you hope, then, to do in these rallies, more awareness, more information that folks may not know about? >> the goal of these rallies that we're having all over the country is primarily to give americans the ability to take center stage and talk about their own personal stories. this is not time for kathleen rice to get up and say why this repeal is not what i want. i want regular people who have been affected by the ac nashgs positive ways to talk about how devastating it would be if it was just to be ripped out from under them. so it's their opportunity to speak to their elected officials on both side of the aisle and implore them to get down to work, put aside partisan bickering, and come up with a solution. >> these are bipartisan rallies. >> there's no question that there are going to be republicans and independents and democrats alike at our rally because we are talking about this issue as americans, not as
republicans or democrats, not through a political lens but through an american lens and through a human lens. that's what we hope to convey tomorrow. >> thank you so much. >> thank you. donald trump's inauguration friday will have one less star performance as of today. broadway icon singer jennifer holliday announcing today she is canceling her appearance. her decision coming less than 24 hours after she faced some backlash from the lgbt community from initially accepting the invitation. in an open letter, she apologized far quote lapse of judgment, writing she was sorry r causing souch dismaand hearreak to my fans. country singer toby keith and 3 doors down are still slated to perform on friday. joining me now is juliana smoot, co-chair of president obama's inaugural committees in 2009 and 2013. gargantuan parties and events as they are, julianne, when you see this latest headline and think about all the moving parts here,
how difficult is it to have to replace a last-minute cancellation like this amongst all of the other moving parts i was just mentioning? >> well you know what, it is a stressful time. thank you for having me on the show, by the way. it's exciting to be part of this talking about such an exciting time. you know what, there are so many moving parts like you said that this is just one piece of it that's been announced. i'm sure they'll be able to fix this little snafu and have more entertainment. so i feel for the folks working on this because it's a short turnaround time. it's a two-month period of time where you build this entity and then take it all down. two mos. >> you had to raise money and then put together one of biggest parties in the country that's ever thrown here. when we look at president-elect donald trump and his inaugural committee, we are hearing they raised some $90 million in private doe neighs. i think that beats the numbers that you were able to put together. barack obama's two inaugural
committees they collected about $55 million and $43 million in '0 lt and '13 respectively. what do you do with all this money? and what do you think they'll do with $90 million? >> well, i mean, it does take a lot. think about the inaugural for president obama, the first one nine years ago, eight years ago now, it costs money. you know, you've got to pay for the additional security. you do have huge number of folks coming in to the district. it takes so much work with logistics. you work with the d.c. government, the police, the secret service, congress, and, you know, you put on the parade and, you know, the balls. i think president-elect trump is also doing a concert similar toll what we did with president obama did on the lincoln memorial. you know, that takes funding and just an enormous amount of ho gistics. >> so we are hearing, reporting, watching already some of the warm-ups to protests leading up to inauguration day. that's going to be part of the
places that money will be spent. and i think we have to really go back to maybe bush after the iraq war, back to richard nixon to really look at some of the protests that were of the number at least that we expect this time around. how do you plan for that? >> well, you know what, we work with such wonderful folks that have done this. you know, president obama's team coming in, we were sort of new to inaugurals, president-elect trump's team will be new to inaugurals. you have seasoned experienced folks working on this to make sure d.c. stays secure. i just can't say how wonderful the d.c. government was, the capitol hill police, homeland security. they know what they're doing. >> did you talk to trump's inauguration committee? did they reach out to you or you reach out to them? >> no, i have not talked to them but i'm feeling for them right now. it's a stressful time for sure. >> virtual simpatico, a virtual empathy for what they're going through. >> totally. >> juliana smootd, thank you so
much. >> jennifer holliday did say she's not going to be there to perform. she will als b joy reid's gues tomorw on "a.m. joy" at 10:00 a.m. eastern. jennifer holliday discussing her decision to drop out of donald trump's inauguration concert. next, the lessons learned from the alleged russian interference in the u.s. election. what other countries are doing to prevent it from happening to them. befi was active.gia, i was energetic. then the chronic, widespread pain drained my energy. my doctor said moving more helps ease fibromyalgia pain. he also prescribed lyrica. fibromyalgia is thought to be the result of overactive nerves. lyrica is believed to calm these nerves. for some, lyrica can significantly
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after witnessing the role that russia allegedly played in hacking the presidential election in the united states, europeanns are taking no chances on their upcoming elections this year. for instance, reuters reporting that cyber security centers are being erected ahead of presidential elections in germany and france. they're designed to track fake news and social media targets. experts say it may be too late. sean henry, president and chief
security officer of crouch strike services. thanks for being here, sean. are these capacity that is they're setting up better than what we've got? >> the u.s. has had centers like this going back to the middle of the 2000s. 2007 we started the national cyber joint task force, an agency led by the fbi, but with representation from nsa, cia, department of defense. all of the agencies bringing all their capabilities together to focus on adversarial threats. >> where does this fake news and cyber warfare space? where do they fit together? we've talked about it in the physical world for centuries where people have used false flags and those sorts of things. it's the same thing here. the information is being used to create chaos, to get people to focus on other areas away from the facts so that the adversaries can target with
their information kpabs the networks they need to target. >> so there was a report that came out from part of your team here talking about this idea that these capability from russia in this report have been around for a long time. trying to change the way not only the way humans make decisions, but the way the computers make decisions as well. i think what you big brains call reflexive control theory or something like that. >> you know, the russians have some of the greatest capabilities out of any nation state. they're constantly changing their techniques or tackics. on the defensive side we have to understand what they're doing so we can intercept and disrupt their attack capabilities. >> have they been able to do what i just mentioned? have they been able to affect the way we've made decisions both humans and computers because of their disinformation capabilities? >> so we still have a situation where humans are engaged with computers. we're taking big data.
we're it synthesizing it and culling out the pertinent information. they're not going to be able to completely disrupt that capability as long as you've got human beings in the mix there's an opportunity to disrupt them. >> you may have heard rudy giuliani who is handling the sieshz of cyber security, cyber warfare, and i read from one of the responses of the expert including herself, and this is what the quote was. one expert telling cnbc his website is so basic it barely even qualifies as security. the website as of today is offline. is juliany, when you look at this criticism of the juliany website, the right person to be leading cyber security if his n website is that basic. >> i don't know about what his cyber capabilities are in terms of technical expertise. what i will say is that what we
need in this space is leadership. there are a lot of plans in place for a long time. they've not been fully executed. they need to be brought to bear, and you need someone in a leadership role. there are a lot of really smart people who can help and have been for many years focussing on these threats. we need somebody in that position who can do that that to me is the most important characteristics is the leadership. whether he is the right person or not we'll see as this goes forward. we've got plans that are on the shelf. we need to brush them off and execute them. >> what do you give guiliaiulia? one to ten, in terms of ten being good, one not so good? >> i'll let you know in about a year and a half when we see what contributions have been made. >> sean will be running for office as well. >> that's it for this hour. the top of the hour, by the way, president-elect trump uses twitter to blast a civil rights icon calling him all talk no action. plus, andrew mitchell's interview with vice president
>> good saturday afternoon. i'm richard luis at headquarters in new york city. thanks for being with us on this day. let's go right to our lead story. president-elect donald trump criticizing congressman john lewis after the long-time public servant and civil rights icon questioned trump's legitimacy as president-elect. >> i don't see the president-elect as a legitimate president. i think the russians participated in helping this man get elected, and they helped destroy the candidacy of hillary clinton. i don't plan to attend the inauguration. it will be the first one i miss since i have been in the congress.