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tv   MSNBC Live With Hallie Jackson  MSNBC  January 26, 2017 7:00am-8:01am PST

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leave the white house. he's making his way here to deliver a speech at noon. the president will probably point to his action-packed first week, even as he reunites the debate over torture saying he wants to fight fire with fire. and sanctuary city showdown. president trump moves to strip away their federal funds, most of them at least. we're going to talk to one of the mayors fighting back. we are covering it all here from philadelphia with kasie hunt in philly, kristen welker at the white house, hans nichols at the pentagon. we were just listening to that press conference. you were in there and there were some interesting moments, right? walk us through them. >> hallie, that's right. this of course has been a little bit of an uncomfortable retreat so far with congressional leaders here wanting to talk about their big priorities, repealing the health care law, reforming and rewriting the u.s. tax code. those are the things they want to be talking about. donald trump of course has had other plans. he instead has signed a slew of
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executive orders, some of which have put him at odds with congressional leaders here. he also has been talking about voter fraud in the election, which is another subject that republicans in congress would like to move past. i asked leader mcconnell and speak aer ryan about the discrepancy at the beginning of the press conference. >> we're going to be hearing from the president today. we've been working on a daily basis to map out and plan an agenda, to repeal, replace and repair a broken health care system, to clear out the regulatory underbrush so we can get economic growth going so we a are on the same page. administration. >> as the press conference wore on and the conversation turned to these specific issues, some discrepancies cropped up. one, the border wall and exactly who is going to pay for it. they say they are going to pass
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a bill to pay for the wall, it will cost between $12 and $15 billion but they wouldn't say whether that was going to add for the deficit, the deficit a top priority for speaker ryan and mitch mcconnell. the other issue, torture. congress voted pretty overwhelmingly to restrict how we interrogate people and paul ryan was very straight forward in simply saying we do not torture, that's the law and it should not be chged. hallie. >> and, kasie, tha seemed to be very quickly a moment that stood out to me because you heard paul ryan emphatically say we believe in torture not being legal. is there any concern from the folks you are talking to at this retreat that president trump may try to change that policy surrounding torture, even though the president has said he'll litten to generlit -- listen to general mattis and others? >> the law the congress passed
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restricts the intelligence community to the techniques included in the army field manual. if this executive order goes around that law by essentially saying, okay, fine, we're going to edit the army field manual, that's a potential problem. a lot of these republicans went through a very difficult, very emotional debate. a lot of them have read speaker ryan, speaker mcconnell both get high level briefings not available to others. there was a torture report that says pretty clearly that these techniques did not work, that they had the opposite effect, they damaged -- potentially created false information for intelligence communities. this is going to be a major sticking point in the president in consultation with mattis and pompeo go forward with this. >> i want to go to kristen welker standing by at the white house before president trump leaves and heads here to philadelphia in the next 15 to 20 minutes, this is a key
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meeting between the new president and republican lawmakers, you've been told this is kind of a big moment for the president. >> it is. he's trying to strengthen his relationship with gop lawmakers as kasie and you are just talking about, there are some areas of difference between them so he really wants this to be a moment of strengthening those relationships and it comes amid all these thorny topics, including the fact that he continues to insist there was widespread voter fraud, something that has been largely debunked. it's undermining the seriousness of your agenda and of your electoral victory and we're learning today that some of those who are close to him are actually registered in two states, including his daughter, tiffany trump, in pennsylvania and new york, she went to school in philadelphia. senior adviser kellyanne conway disputing nbc's reporting about this earlier today.
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here's what she told matt lauer on the "today" show. take a listen, hallie. >> i talked last night with tiffany trump and she said it is flatly false she is registered with two states and i recall talking to tiffany all through the fall what she was trying to reregister in new york so she could vote for her father, it was very byzantine and took a long time. >> what about steven bannon? >> i don't know. doesn't it make the point that -- >> no, it proves the point that you can be registered in two states and not vote illegally in two states and sway an election. >> we did our own fact check about this, hallie. if you look at the actual documents they n fact sho thatiffany trump registered in two states. she's still registered where she went to college and her voter
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status is listed at active and public records in new york show she is also registered in that late. bottom line, president trump is expected to discuss this issue with gop lawmakers today, the broader issue of voter fraud. he wants to explain to them why he has some real concerns, why he wants to move forward with this investigation. you and i have been doing a lot of reporting about this. he could, in fact, put that investigation into motion as early as today, although the specifics of how it would be carried out, who would conduct it still remain unclear at this point, hallie. >> very quickly, i got to touch on this issue with the president of mexico, donald trump tweeting this morning that perhaps they will cancel the meeting given that mexico is reiterating that they're not going to pay for that border wall. >> the mexican president saying he is absolutely not going to pay for that border wall and
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expressing his disappointment in wake of -- it has been a one-sided deal. if mexico is unwilling to pay for the badly needed wall, then it would be better to cancel the upcoming meeting. so a real shot across the bow. we know that the mexican president now reconsidering as well. it would be significant if the trip were to get cancelled. >> it would be his second meeting with a foreign leader after the one with theresa may tomorrow. kristen walker, thank you very much. we've been talking about this issue of torture, about waterboarding. i want you to listen to what republican leadership said about this in the last 45 minutes or so. >> i believe virtually all of my
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members are comfortable with the state of the law as it is now. >> and torture's not legal. it's not legal. and we agree with it not being legal. >> hans nichols is at the pentagon. walk me through what your sources tell me what your new -- >> mattis thinks not only is torture illegal but that it doesn't work. there's something to consider about trump's comments. they're symbolically important but theoretically they're not going to have much weight. allies thinks the president of the united states returning to torture. in terms of what kind of high-value detainees, what kind of suspected terrorists you're capturing, here at the pentagon there's very little of that. almost every day we get a briefing here whether or not they've taken out 80 guys in
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libya, 100 people in northern syria, strikes by drones or b-52s, b-2s. the first questions we ever had here is were there any high value targets, hvts. they don't giveven get to the stage. they have a term form them, they're squirters. they fled and they try to find them afterwards. on the practical level, what trump is saying is really theory and doesn't have much of an effect the way the pentagon or cia under new leadership is going to prosecute these wars and try to keep america safe. hallie? >> we're joined here on set with corey gardner. i'm sorry for the rain here that just started. >> it's a beautiful city -- it's
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a great day. >> i agree. i want to pick up where hans left off on the subject of torture and interrogation. president trump says waterboarding works. what do you call it? >> it's not legal. that's clear in the law and there's no move afoot to change that. >> what if there were a movement afoot? >> i don't think secretary mattis or pompeo even know about it. >> though they both agree it was illegal. >> yes. >> on the border wall, there's a real question mark about how you pay for it. he says mexico will pay. mexico says guess what, that's not happening. are you comfortable him taking the risk and putting the expense
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on the taxpayers for this possible $8 billion expense? >> congress will indeed be footing the bill going forward. i haven't seen the details on the white house on it, haven't seen the details. if it happens it, would be something that would go through the appropriations process. >> and you support that? >> i think we have to recognize democrat a republican plans overs past several years,he comprehensive plan put forward in the senate all focus on border security. so whoever's plan it has been over the past several years has a component of border security. that's what the american people want, that's what both sides of the aisle have said they want. it's not just an issue of immigration, it's an issue of national security. it's something i believe we can come together to work on. >> existing plans don't call for
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a $20 billion physical structure across the southern border. >> i do think security is important -- >> so it sounds like you're saying yes, that security outweighs -- >> am i saying security outweighs -- i think national security is extremely important. that's why the american people have been demanding border security because of national security. i think we can have a conversation of what that's going to be and what the cost would be. i'm not speaking for the white house. you'll have to ask them for specifics. both plans put forward in the house and senate by democrats and republicans have an element of barriers on the southern border. we need to look at our east/west coast and northern border. >> do you think mexico will ultimately pay for this? >> that's a discussion the
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president is having with the president of mexico. if it moves forward, it would be something that we would be asked to come up with a plan for. >> i am asking your opinion, though. >> that's what i mean. i think we would have to come up with that plan. until somebody says here's the deal -- i can ask my neighbor for a lazy river they would be able to share. i don't know that they'd be willing to pay for it. >> the president could sign some sort of executive action or memo or order that directs some kind of investigation into what he has falsely claimed is widespread voter fraud. you have said this morning that you haven't actually seen any evidence of widespread voter fraud. do you support an investigation into something that does not exist? >> i haven't seen any evidence of the widespread nature of the fraud that he talks about. i hope he lays out the evidence. >> do you think that evidence exists? >> i don't know. i vietnam sehaven't seen it. when i talked to the second of colorado, there have been a
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handful of incidents. i told a story about a candidate trying to run for the senate, the petitions had forged signatures on there and they're being prosecuted right now. this kind of activity does happen. is it at the level they say it happens at? where there's fraud, it has to be rooted out and eliminated. >> nobody is disputing that there are handfuls of cases of voter fraud. the president is talking to 3 million to 5 million different votes. do you support an investigation into this? >> you bet i do. let's lay out the evidence. if it's there, there should be some investigation. if not the, the american people will know. i this we should lay out the facts, lay out the evidence and show the american people what's happening. one. most important things we have in this country is the integrity of our electoral process.
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we just went through a long, divisive election. talks of russian hacks and activities to try to influential the outcome of the election, this is all part of something that we take very seriously. that's making sure that every ballot is sacred, that the access a voter has to that ballot is sacred and we do a job of upholding the integrity. if there's problem, let's fix it. i know what i know and i know what i've been told by the folks back home in colorado. >> the lightning round before i let you go. my congressional colleagues said yesterday felt a little uncomfortable because of all these questions about president trump. do you agree with the characterization of the tone here? >> i think there's a lot of excitement now. when i go home and talk to people about what they see, they're excited about getting our economy moving again.
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wednesday morning, he talked about bringing this nation together, talked about the forgot i don't know men and women of the country. and it's important to keem them in mind and create more opportunities for this country. >> coming up next, much more ahead, including the firestorm set off by the president over torture. i'm going to ask a senior cia analyst about what works and what doesn't. any minute we're go to see the president leaving the south lawn to head to philly. we'll bring it to you live when it happens. wth presents itself? american express open cards can help you take on a new job, or fill a big order or expand your office and take on whatever comes next.
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senior fellow george washington university's center for cyber and homeland security. it is mouthful but thank you very much for being here. >> thanks for having me. >> you know this from your work on the ground at ground level. president trump says waterboarding is not torture. senator mccain says it is. >> this is not just the national security but the intelligence folks and other places in the intelligence community, speaker
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ryan and mitch mcconnell have said torture is illegal. so the question is what is torture? we kind of defined it as the using physical pressure to get information. it's ineffective to take out an entire terrorist network. the idea that torture is never useful, if someone is hitting you with a lead pipe to give you your atm number, you probably will give that up. but when you're talking about a larger segment of knowledge, rapport building is much more useful in the long run. >> can you talk about the way at that the united states government fights terror now? it seems as though when you talk about some of these enhanced interrogation techniques, when you talk about torture, that is different from the way that you go after, as hans nichols was
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saying, high-value targets. do you see a shift in president trump does try to reinstate the torture mechanisms, do you see a shift in how we fight on the ground? >> intelligencesuilt up over various months and years. you don't sort ofomb random building and hope you hit a high-value target. >> cross your fingers. >> there's a lot of building in iraq and syria right now. what you kind of want to do is build up relationships not only with liaison partners. you also have our own unique clandestine opportunities which is signals intelligence. this is not a fight can you do by yourself. by introducing things that are not concomenant with what our allies want to do, britain,
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france and other western democracies and start using mechanisms they believe are not useful, you undermine the entire intelligence network that the united states has really built up over the last years. >> you're very plugged into the intelligence community obviously. can you talk a little bit about how some of. l -- of the lower level and lis, how the people doing the nitty-gritty work feel about president trump and the intelligence community? >> i talked to various people. it was a bit of a spectrum. some people shrug their shoulders and say this is the president, this is the way he talks. do we take him seriously? two, folks who go up there and say how can he go up there and
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talk to the media in front of a wall of stars representing those killed in the cia. it seemed really inappropriate. the point is some people say look, this is who he is, what are you going to do to people who feel very, very offended by what happened. >> thank you very much for that perspective and joining us here. we appreciate it. any minute we're expecting to see president trump depart the white house. i think we might have a live shot of air force i on the tarmac. this is the first time he's on this plane. we're going to bring it to you when it happens. also arriving in philly, theresa may, the british prime minister speaking with republicans today and then visiting the white house tomorrow. the big question, of course, will she stand up to trump on
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go long™. ♪ let's get a quick check of some of the morning head lolinee are following now. in chicago, a 12-year-old girl is among six people hurt in a shooting. it happened last night. it happened as people who were mourning another victim of gun violence were at a memorial. two were taken to local hospitals in serious condition. >> over on wall street, by the way, stocks at record highs. remember yesterday we told you the dow finally topped the 20,000 mark for the first time? this is the big board still above 20. and just minutes from now, president trump will take his first flight on air force i. he's going to talk to republican
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lawmakers at their annual retreat. this is part of a push to make sure he has enough support for his agenda over on capitol hill. >> u.k. prime minister theresa may also heading here to philly. she's talking with congressional republicans at that retreat. by the way, she's going to be the first serving head of government or state from outside the u.s. to do so. so this is kind of a big deal. she's going to head to d.c. after this, where she will sit down with president trump tomorrow. my colleague is following this from not london but new york this morning. good to see you. walk us through what's going to happen over the next couple of days. >> she's going to speak in philly to republican leaders, as you mentioned. i'm told that speech will last 20, maybe 30 minutes and then she'll fly to d.c.
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this is a big deal for the trump administration. it's an opportunity for him to look statesman like, like a world leader. it's a huge deal for the british because they know if they can get the u.s. on side on trade, that gives them leverage in negotiations with the europeans and already the british prime minister is pretty clearly setting out an idea of a relationship like reagan-thatcher. that was such a strong alliance. she's talking about trump and her leading the world again. so she clearly understands the importance of this visit. so trade is going to be a huge topic. also potentially is torture. >> we have a very clear position on torture, we do not get involved with that and that will continue to be our position. >> how do you see this coming into play tomorrow? >> it's one of a number of
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issues that are going to have british diplomats biting their finger nails throughout the whole trip. torture is crucial because the british are against torture, the local system in britain is against torture. there was a very big problems with the british over the use of torture and waterboarder. it damages the relationship between the u.s. and british because if the u.s. are connected with that kind of interrogation, that can end up in court and secrets that are american secrets that have been shared with the british can end up being revealed in a british court. it is an extremely difficult position for the prime minister. she has no choice but to go in there and say, mr. president, we don't agree with torture, we won't work with you if that's what you want to do. and at the same time she's
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trying to build an alliance. that's the difficult tightrope she has to walk. >> we'll see how she walks it today and tomorrow. keir simmons, thank you. coming up, what are sanctuary cities and what can president trump do to strip funding them? mayors in those cities are digging in their heels against this administration. we'll talk to ed murray about it next. "how to win at business." step one: point decisively with the arm of your glasses. abracadabra. the stage is yours. step two: choose la quinta.
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the darkest day in immigration history in america since the interment of t americans. >> the stroke of the pen does not change the people of new york city or the values. >> those are mayors of some of the largest sainctuary cities
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saying they're not going to change their policies when it comes to sanctuary cities, even after president trump signed an order preventing funding from sanctuary cities that don't prosecute offenders. we saw you talk about being a dark time in immigration history. how do you plan to fight this? >> have i not talked to the president. we're talking about people who work at jobs most americans won't work at, who pay taxes, we're talking about children in our schools who spent their whole lives here. we believe that the constitution, the tenth amendment and the spending clause states clearly that, first of all, to be undocumented by itself is not a crime. the federal government cannot coerce us through funding to do something that is not legal. we believe the president is acting outside the rule of law.
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>> so what are you going to do about it i guess is my question. are there plans to take the fight to the federal government through some sort of legal action? >> we will go to court. clearly the courts and the constitution clearly say there has to be some connection between the activity the government is asking us to do and the funding. you can't simply cut off transportation funding because of an immigration issue. i think it's pretty clear. we're going to fight this in court and we believe that we will win. >> you say the president cannot coerce you to do anything different, right? reuters, if you look at these estimates, says about $72 million goes to your city for federal funding and you are at risk of losing a lot of that. you can see some of these other big numbers for cities around the country. at any point, yor, have you reconsidered when you look at these numbers and the mey that goes to seattle, have you reconsidered being a sanctuary city? has that ever crossed your mind?
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>> it hasn't. it means we would betray the constitution of this country. this is a city that is not going to allow cities to be taken out of their schools and neighbors taken out of their homes. i believe we're being coerced the constitution says that the president is coercing us. >> a lot of these cities are run by democratic mayors. is this a political issue? what do you say to critics who say this is being politicized for some sort of gain in that field? >> it's a moral issue. we're at risk of losing funding. by the way, i should add that cities have suffered decades of federal cuts so the threat is not what it once could have been. but again, i think our argument is that we are on the side of the rule of law. you simply according to the courts cannot arrest somebody simply because they're undocumented and you can't take our money away when we are actually obeying what the courts
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have said. >> mayor ed murray, taking the fight to the trump administration. thank you very much for being here on this so. we appreciate it. >> when we come back, we're traveling about 90 miles north and west of where we are now, where the changing face of one small town is challenging its anti-immigration history. that's next when we come back live from philadelphia's independence mall, my hometown and eagles country. i had frequent heartburn,
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hazelton has an interesting history of when it comes to orders and how they're handling the incoming population. >> there is clearly division here. one wall, two viewpoints. you talked about the explosion in the hispanic population here in hazelton. 5% in 2000, 50% now. there has been a lot of white flight out to other rural areas out of the county. this county went to donald trump. barack obama carried it four years ago. here's debbie. she owns the restaurant. good morning. you voted for mr. trump. how big was the immigration issue for you when you went to
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vote? >> it was very important to me. years ago here we had a major influx and it was crazy. there was a lot of crime, there was a lot of -- just a lot of things that had to be corrected. and with our mayor at that time, lou barletta, who is now our congressman -- >> the act went through the supreme court system and they refused to take on the case. where do we stand now what's the atmosphere in hazelton now? is it like it was before? >> no, we're trying to work together and trying to create harmony. there's a lot of great people here. we didn't want to see people
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come here, we want to see people come here for the right reasons. come here, try to make our country great, try to make our city -- keep it great and work hard like the rest of us and take care of each other. don't look for things to be handed to you. >> i've noticed obviously you sell italian food here. you've also added a spanish line. tell me about that decision. >> we want to make everyone feel welcome. years ago a lot of our customers didn't speak english. so we do our menus now in english and spanish. when they walked in, we wanted to feel this is great. >> so the community is coming together. >> yes. >> we want to wrap it there as always. there is divide on this imgrag issue. the president is following through on his promises to build that southern border wall as well as that decision about the
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sanctuary cities looking to pull funding from them. we'll send it back to you. >> great stuff there on the ground in hazelton, pennsylvania, where you will be throughout the day. we're taking another live look at air force i, his first flight on the presidential 747. and when he gets here, plenty to talk about. so what should the first priority be? we're going to talk to our special guests, the woodhouse brothers coming up from the city of brotherly love. tiki barber running a barber shop? yes!!! surprising. yes!!! what's not surprising? how much money david saved by switching to geico. fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more. who's next?
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we are keeping an eye now on the departure of president trump from washington, d.c., joint base andrews specifically, up here to philadelphia where in about an hour he's meeting with congressional republicans at their annual retreat, just a flew blocks down from where we are. in the past hour we've heard from republican leaders there, specifically speaker paul ryan saying his party is on the same
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page with the president. >> with respect to the core agenda that we have laid out for our members that we are planning and coordinating in the house and the senate, we have done this in conjunction with the administration. we ran on these issues all of 2016. there's no surprise here. the president agrees with this agenda. >> so picking up where paul ryan left off, we're bringing in dallas woodhouse, the executive director of the north carolina republican party and brad woodhouse, president of americans united for change and former obama senior strategist. yes, two woodhouses, a house divided you could say. two brothers. dallas, you heard paul ryan talking about how they are on the same page. at the same time you have republicans putting the president in a tough spot when they talk about torture and widespread allegations of voter
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fraud. how do president trump and hais team come -- >> we've seen voter fraud in north carolina, it's that widespread -- >> he's talking about millions of people. >> we had two local elections that were thrown out for vote buying in fraud. this is something that needs to be looked at. let's find some confidence in the system and find a way forward in a bipartisan way to increase security. i don't know any public for torture. >> president trump does. >> mr. trump is laying out a strong case to distance himself from the blame america crowd. we should do what it takes to
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protect our interest and we shouldn't be blamed for. >> torture, which our country has been against for years, which leaders in the republican party are against but trump wants to bring back. and then this issue of voter fraud. it goes to this made-up, trumped up issue of voter fraud. it goes to the heart of democracy. first of all, donald trump is a baby. he wants to explain away the fact that he lost the popular vote but it's more insidious than that -- >> are you trying to say there's no voter fraud in america? there's fraud in churches, in tv stations in -- come on, it's laughable! of course there's fraud! >> there's no fraud anywhere in america that affected the outcome of the 2016 presidential election or any other national
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election. >> hallie, that's a standard we're not going to accept in north carolina. we want to get rid of voter fraud period because it may not affect the result now. >> dallas, let me get in here. your efforts in north carolina on voter frustrate were nothing more than a documented attempt to suppress the votes of african-americans and young people. >> that's a lie. >> you wrote a letter to the state -- to t county boards of elections telling them to suppress the votes of african-americans and young people -- >> i did not at all. we got investigations going on. >> dallas, brad, give me a second here, i want to talk -- >> hallie, it's your show. >> no, i get it, brothers. i want to talk about this he headline from politico. brad, when it comes to democrats, they're launching a scorched-earth strategy against donald trump. isn't this what democrats
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criticized republicans for doing against policemanresident obama? >> if that's the standard, of course we're going to have a strategy of opposing him at every single turn and we should. this is someone the majority of americans did not want to be president, it was someone who was helped to become president by vladimir putin and russian interference in this election, and to allow him to proceed without a fight would be a dereliction of duty to those democrats who believe in democratic ideals and progressive policies. >> hallie, if they take that attude to try to block everything that trump does, a popular agenda, those ten u.s. senators and deeply red states that are up in 2018 will have a hard time. >> the woodhouse brothers,
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dallas and brad, thank you all for being here on our feisty panel. i'll let you guys take that offline to family dinner on sunday night. we're still awaiting word that president trump has left. he's running a little bit late. we're monitoring that as we wait for him to get here to philly. stick around. or fill a big order or expand your office and take on whatever comes next. find out how american express cards and services can help prepare you for growth at i own my own company. i had some severe fatigue, some funny rashes.
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turned the thermostat down in the white house and asked all americans to do the same. that's it, throwback thursday. you can find me any time on facebook, instagram, snap, all of the above. hi, tamron. >> hi, hallie. amid a backlash against president trump's reported stance on torture, the president is getting ready to leave for philadelphia. sources say the president could green light a, quote, major investigation into his false claims of voter fraud as soon as today. despite opposition, again, from within his own party. plus outrage erupts over president trump's actions. trump's threat to pull billions from so-called sanctuary city
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has several leaders considering defying the president's orders. and this morning chelsea manning speaking out. she's now criticizing former president barack obama, calling him, quote, weak. i'll talk live with manning's attorney about this op-ed written by her client. good morning. i'm tamron hall coming to you live. air force i ready to take off with president trump, headed to philadelphia where he will address congressional republicans at his annual retreat. his address comes amid what politico calls deep divisions between the president and his own party on several major issues, leaving them reportedly scrambling to respond after some of his recent announcement. among them discussing his position on torture. during his first sit-down interview as president, here's what he said last


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