tv For the Record With Greta MSNBC June 12, 2017 3:00pm-4:01pm PDT
in fact, that's how i'm going to be starting off all of my show meetings from now on, word to the wise, back in the control room, if you want to catch me, you can always find me on twitter, katy tur on nbc. chuck will be back in the chair tomorrow with more daily. greta, do you like that idea starting off with a flattery fest? >> yes. but i was going to talk about the "new york times" article about you. the senator leahy is with me and said he liked it. >> thank you. a top democratic senator is accusing sessions of running away from him. that senator joins us live in just minutes. we begin with the white house getting blitz from all sides. federal judges once again telling president trump he has it all wrong ruling against the president's controversial travel ban. then, there is this, for the
first time in the trump presidency, a democratic congressman circling articles of impeachment accusing president trump of obstruction of justice. check your clock. it is ticking. will president trump before 2:30 p.m. tomorrow invoke executive privilege thereby blocking attorney general sessions about telling the intel committee about conversations he may have had with the president about russia and former director comey and more. >> from the perspective of president trump what role did attorney general jeff sessions play in the firing of james comey? >> i'm not going to discuss private conversations between the president and the attorney general. >> to that end, when jeff sessions testifies tomorrow, do you believe he should invoke executive privilege on conversations between him and the president as it relates to james comey? >> it depends on the scope of the questions and to get into a hypothetical at this point would be premature. >> in any way, did jeff sessions
folks at the doj ask for the white house's permission in essence for him to testify publicly tomorrow? >> i don't know the answer to that question. i know congress generally speaking sets the -- whether a hearing is open or closed, based on the sensitivity of the subject. >> is the president okay with him testifying in this open setting tomorrow? >> i think he's going to testify and we're aware of it and go from there. >> late today, the democratic sources say the attorney general initially wanted tomorrow's hearing to be in private, held behind closed doors but that was quote a non-starter. with me, ken delaney and national security reporter. >> there are a lot of questions that prompted lawmakers to want to question jeff sessions. one looms above all others, this april 20 sean may flower hotel
event. and james comey set the table when he alluded to it in his testimony. let's take a listen to that. >> he was very close to and inevitably going to recuse himself for a variety of reasons. we also were aware of facts i couldn't discuss in an open setting that would make his continued engagement in a russian investigation problematic. >> comey didn't make that explicit there but later went behind closed doors of the intelligence committee and made clear he was talking about classified and saying there may have been an encounter with sergey kislyak at this hotel event. and he has denied that. i'm interested to see will he flatly deny it or say he can't recall? what will he say about that? the reason that's important because he already had to
correct his sworn testimony during his confirmation hearing when he said he hasn't met with the russians in his capacity with the trump campaign and emerged he did meet twice with sergey kislyak. that's for tomorrow. >> thank you. another big question for the president he is not answering, does he have tapes with former director fbi comey or not? why not tell us instead of this weird cat and mouse game with the public? the secret service says it does not have any recordings made in the trump white house. could someone else, even the president or someone at his direction have made tapes? sean spicer dodging that question today. >> does president trump have audio recordings of his conversation with director james comey? >> the president said in the rose garden he will have an announcement shortly. >> do you have a timeline? >> when he is ready to make. i if the president does have
evidence the fbi director lied under oath, what is he waiting for? >> he made it clear he would get back and his position on the conversation. >> so what is he waiting nor? what's the delay? >> he's not waiting for anything. when he's ready to discuss it he will. >> the white house ducking the issue whether he will testify before congress or not. remember, in the rose garden the president said he would 100% testify. over the weekend democratic senator chuck schumer jumped on the president's promise and invited him. >> he said he would be willing to testify under oath. can you say when he would be willing to do that? would that be before congress is in recess? >> i think he was specifically asked whether or not he would talk to director muller. he made it very clear what his position was. >> he is not saying he would go before congress. >> i don't know. i have not had a further discussion with that. >> to nbc chief correspond, hallie jackson.
any updates whether there are tapes between president comey and whether or not the president will testify? >> reporter: let me take that in two parts. first, nbc news has confirmed some of the "wall street journal" reporting you have there, which is the u.s. secret service saying they themselves, that particular branch, does not have recordings or transcripts of tapes. that doesn't mean they still don't exist in some other way or fashion. i'll leave it up to others to speculate. there has been the point everybody these days with their phones has a recording device, if you will, in their hands, in their pockets at arms length. no update there. sean spicer seemed to indicate there may be an answer upcoming soon without specifying it. the second part the president testifying under oath. sean spicer said he was asked about director muller. he was not.
the president said 100% under no conditions he would testify under oath some democrats have been calling for. there's no guidance or if ultimately that is what we will see given legal experts say it is unlikely they would counsel a client to do such a thing. we look hd to tomorrow, greta, some of those questions may end up being answered at least relating to the attorney general and some of the questions we still have surrounding the firing of james comey. >> we're all focusing whether or not there are taped conversations between former director comey and the president. i would want to expand it out and say are there any taped conversations of the person who came into the oval office next and did the president say, flint is a great guy and i want to make sure this is a complete investigation and comey didn't take the bait and he's still going forward. >> reporter: the question whether the president is
generally recording people in the oval office one going back weeks ever since the discussion or tweet about the quote unquote tapes happened back in mid-may has been one we have been trying to get out of the white house. is the president recording anybody in there? what kind of devices might there be. how can people be confident their discussion mays be private with the president and consistently we have seen no answers other than to elude to the fact the president will speak about it when he is ready. might he be ready in two weeks from now, when he is promising a press conference and will take questions from reporters. we will see. i will tell you three weeks ago the president in two weeks promised a press conference and that one never materialized and a lot of folks are hoping the next one might. >> in what would be a monumental twist in the russia probe will the president stun the nation and turn it upside down and fire
robert mueller. think it could never happen? one of the president's lawyers not ruling it out. >> the president of the united states as we all know, a unitary executive, the president will seek the advice of his counsel and inside the government and outside. i won't speculate what he will and won't do. >> with me, chief investigator for political, i don't know if he's jumping on that fairly or not or in the know or not. the president is his own man and makes his own decisions. if the president did something like that it would be highly unusual not to mention hugely controversial. >> absolutely, greta, it would be hugely controversial and create another self-inflicted wound. let's not firing of james comey was because of the russian investigation. that didn't stop the russia
investigation. in fact if anything added fuel with the appointment of this special counsel. no reason to believe firing muller would do anything other than tone down this investigation, in fact he is regarded as an institution deferential to institutions of power. you might end up with someone who is a little bit more aggressive towards the presidency and institution of the presidency if you replace him. >> except one of the problems that has arisen is the fact that muller and comey are close. they're friends. this is a small town. prosecutors know prosecutors. one of the things the president may say rightfully or wrongfully he wants someone not close to someone in direct odds accusing him of something which would not be so unheard of you wouldn't want someone to be investigating you if he's close to your accuser. >> certainly. while the president can
indirectly exert pressure to affect the firing of the special counsel, you can't do it directly. it would have to be the attorney general. the president could ask the attorney general and in this cases the actliing attorney general, rod rosenstein because the attorney general has recused himself, but special counsel rules say it would have to be for cause. you could just imagine the type of debate that would ensue if rosenstein fired comey -- sorry, fired mueller and if that cause was valid or not. >> if muller and comey ever socialized together or pald around together, i have no reason to think they have or not, this is a very small town, that might be cause enough. farther down the road. ken, thank you for joining us. >> thank you, greta. >> with me, senator patrick leahy from the great state of vermont demanding republicans
postpone a hearing with the appropriations committee until the attorney general sessions testifies. good evening, senator. >> good evening. >> attorney general sessions was supposed to be a witness before the appropriations committee tomorrow. what happened. >> he said twice he would be there. both times he went back. he was not there. it would be very unusual for the attorney general not to come and testify about his budget. i think he's very concerned about coming before us. i wish he would. he will go before the intelligence committee. if he thinks he's going to get tough questions in the appropriations committee he will get equally tough ones in the intelligence committee. >> his job as the attorney general is to come when summoned by the appropriations because your job is oversight over his budget, right? >> and we know they're not spending some of their budget. for example, he fired all the u.s. attorneys. 96 of them. none of that money is being spent.
he's talked about increasing the cost of our bureau of prisons by going after people involved with marijuana, of all things. we have a lot of questions we want to ask him. >> do you want to ask him any questions about russia? >> that would be the first off question about russia because he didn't tell us the truth twice when he was under oath. >> mistake or not tell you the truth? >> it wasn't truthful. he can call it whenever he wanted. he had to come back and say on those two occasions he did not tell the truth. now we found things to indicate he had a third meeting. let's find out under oath what it was, not what somebody thinks it was, let's find out under oath. he's one of the few people that might appear under oath. nobody nobody in god's green earth thinks donald trump will ever come up under oath. attorney general sessions will. >> do you think, by the way get
back to this whole thing of the president, do you think there are tapes of the president's conversations with fbi director comey or is he playing cat and mouse dangling that in front of us? >> if there are tapes i would almost guarantee you it will corroborate what james comey said. whether you agree with mr. comey on one issue or another, he tells the truth. if he took contemporaneous notes then that's what was heard. >> let me go back to this whole thing with attorney general sessions. you served with him here in the u.s. senate. there's a big difference between being mistaken and forgetting some meeting and intentionally lying. how do you decide which is which? >> if i was a member of a presidential campaign and had major meetings with the russians, i think i would remember. jeff session is smart enough to remember. >> if he just met him in a holding room with 15 or 20 people, would you expect him to
remember that? >> i certainly would especially if he was there for the campaign. let's have him come here before the committee and explain. he gave us one answer before. he came back afterwards and said, look, that wasn't an accurate answer. i will recuse myself. when did he recuse himself? after he asked to have director comey fired for investigating the trump administration's ties with the russians. it becomes wheels within wheels. >> do you think he's deliberately dodging you or a scheduling problem and he thinks you should be satisfied with his deputy? >> there's no scheduling problem. we asked him to come. he agreed two other times. we asked him to come tomorrow morning. he's not testifying before intelligence until the afternoon. he could easily come. >> so he's dodging you? >> well, he certainly isn't coming even though he said three times he would, he's not going to be there. >> senator, thank you for
joining us. nice to see you. >> still ahead i talk to a former independent counsel. i want to know what would happen if the president did try to fire the special counsel. and the perjury trap is part of this. and a new lawsuit filed against the president and a court of appeals court told him unanimously he is wrong about something coming up. all that and the one thing the entire trump cabinet can agree on. stay with us. you totaled your brand new car. nobody's hurt, but there will still be pain. it comes when your insurance company says they'll only pay three-quarters of what it takes to replace it. what are you supposed to do? drive three-quarters of a car? now if you had liberty mutual new car replacement™, you'd get your whole car back. i guess they don't want you driving around on three wheels. smart.
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>> never has there been a president, with few exception, in the case of fdr, he had a major depression to handle, who's passed more legislation and done more things than we've done between the executive orders and job killing regulations terminated. >> it got a tad bit weird, the president going around the table and each or his cabinet leader take his or her turn to butter up the boss, the president. >> on behalf of the entire senior staff surrounding mr. president we thank you for the opportunity and blessing you've given us to serve the american people and your agenda. >> what an incredible honor it is to lead the department of health & human servicess at this time. >> mr. president, thank you for the honor of being able to serve. >> i apologize for being late to work. about four months i got bogged down in that swamp. >> but while all that looks rosy today in that room, tomorrow may
look very different when cabinet member attorney general jeff session is on the hot seat before the senate intel committee unless the president asserts executive privilege, sessions will testify on russia tomorrow. and brad sherman drafted articles of impeachment on donald trump and plans to raise it on the house floor. >> joining us, howard, it looks like everything was rosy in that cabinet room. >> i can't speak for mike but i want to say what an honor and perspective limit is to be here with you. >> you're doing such a superb -- >> you guys are great guests. >> it was absurd. >> it looked like to me something out of north korea or the soviet bureau. get that the president feels he isn't being treated fairly. a couple things.
first of all, having everybody go around the room like that did look a little soviet, at least to me. in terms of actual legislation, they haven't passed any and he's ordered, reince priebus as chief of staff to basically shape up or ship out, which would indicate to me he isn't really pleased with the actual amount of progress they've actually made. >> there is a report from political that reince priebus has until july fourth to clean things up. they have denied it and spicer has denied it. is there anything reince priebus could do? >> it's not at all clear. we have heard stories reince priebus is about to get dumped. i'm not sure what to make about this one. trump's problems are not being driven not by reince priebus but by his own tweeting and the self-inflicting wounds he has caused himself leading to the
russia investigation, taking off in new avenue, focused at this point on questions about obstruction and some of what former fbi director comey had to say. you could argue had it not been for donald trump's own tweets and public statements he wouldn't be in this situation. >> congressman brad sherman circulating an article of impeachment for obstruction. where is that going? >> that's not going anywhere right now. my sense of this, given how many different investigations there are, there are several hill investigation and extremely thorough bob mueller at work as special counsel, i think you're talking a year maybe. maybe more, before those kinds of questions get really really serious. there will be political efforts by the democrats to do it right now. i think they are at risk of making the same mistake the republicans made, focusing all their attention on trying to
impeach and convict bill clinton back in the day. it may grow. i think there's a division in the democratic party between the so-called pragmatists and the revived and reenergized liberal/progressive bernie sanders wing. they will push for impeachment. i think they're making a mistake, too. they need proposals and substance. not that yet. it will take a long time. >> meanwhile, back at the ranch, president trump under siege in his own country, protests today. that's the underlying problem is that the -- he has meddled in our election and we have to do something about it and there will be a vote hopefully next week on the issue whether there will be sanctions or not. >> the next 24 hours are very key in this. sessions' testimony, how he holds up, he will be facing a lot of questions about what comey testified and the interaction that he had with sessions, remember, when he leaves the room, he says to
sessions, don't leave me in the room with that man again, that man being the president. what does sessions have to say about that? more importantly, why was he involved in the decision to fire comyn the first place if if a, she was recused from anything to do with russia and trump says he was firing because of russia. then questions about this third meeting. did it take place in the mayflower hotel april of 2016. he will be under oath tomorrow. we have to see whether he answers under oath the questions the same way the justice department has said up to date which is to deny that. >> if the next 24 hours is so important with the attorney general'sdom, the president probably could block it. he could block conversations he's had with the attorney general under executive privilege. that would be fatal. >> would look like he's stone walling. >> while i would say serious
impeachment talk is a long way off and depends on the results of these investigations, jeff sessions, a lot of people think, is in serious trouble. there are a lot of people talking about the possibility of perjury, was he fully candid when he spoke to the senate last time around. >> how do you know it? >> you have other people contradicting what other people said. james comey doesn't tend to hint at things unless they are there. he also -- >> he also threw democratic general loretta lynch under the bus. >> i think he thinks part of his job is to throw people under the bus that deserve to be thrown under the bus and may be true of jeff sessions, too. >> i think he laid it out with lynch pretty well. he talked about how he believed she forced him to tone down how he described the hillary
clinton -- >> she didn't dispute it. i don't think she disputed it either. >> and something closer, senior advisor -- this is all unfolding the next 24 hours unbelievable. michael howard, thank you. what are the big questions we want answered tomorrow when the attorney general testifies before the senate investigative committee. first, would president trump ever fire robert mueller? if so, what would happen if he did? >> firing special prosecutors tends not to work, as we all learned from watergate. it's over. i've found a permanent escape from monotony. together, we are perfectly balanced. our senses awake. our hearts racing as one. i know this is sudden, but they say...if you love something set it free. see you around, giulia
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attorney he fired says that is a case. >> i think there is evidence for a case. no one knows right now if there is a provable case of obstruction. what i see as third party out of government there's no basis to say there's no obstruction. >> but then ken starr, yes, that ken starr, former independent counsel investigated the clinton administration in 1990s, he disagrees with him. >> even if the president said what the director said he said, does that in fact constitute either obstruction of justify or another crime. i don't think it's close at this stage. we shall see. there is a requirement of corrupt intent. i don't think at this stage we're anywhere near a crime nonetheless we have to investigate it. >> robert ray is a former federal prosecutor. he succeeded ken starr as independent council issuing the final reports on the clinton whitewater investigation. nice to see you, sir. >> good to see you, greta.
>> where do you stand on this? >> not just because he was my former boss but ken starr is right and the other is wrong. >> why is that? >> he doesn't have to have a reason to fire the director. his hopes and intimations about what he would like to have happened, if that's accurately recorded by jim comey, that doesn't constitute obstruction of justice because there would be no way based upon that evidence to prove corrupt intent. all this circus is politically interesting but doesn't add up to a case you can bring before a jury beyond a reasonable doubt. it's a sideshow because a sitting president is not going to be charged. >> the president's chief accuser appears to be the former director of the fbi from last week's testimony.
the fact special counsel has a close working relationship with him and perhaps, only perhaps, a small town, prosecutors stick together in this town and defense lawyers stick together, if they have any sort of social relationship would that be a defense the president could consider dismissing robert mueller or not. it might be the basis for a manufactured one. i assume both gentleman even though they are close friends are not going have contact with regard to the substance or subject matter of the investigation. i think that's probably enough said in that regard. they've both been through this drill before many time, bob mueller knows how to act appropriately. there's no basis to believe that would ever be an issue. the political process and public consumption, you could make the argument because they're close
friends a personnel decision has to be made. you led the 350piece with the argument the president's lawyers haven't ruled out firing special counsel and the president has the authority. they haven't ruled it in either. i wouldn't say that doesn't occur but you never say never. >> there's a big difference between the political world and legal world as we look at these investigations? >> of course. that distinction is everything. although it may be somewhat difficult for everyone always to grasp the distinction, we're in a political process, first and foremost. it seems to me bob mueller's charge is to get through this investigation and get to the bottom of this as promptly and responsibly as he can and ideally within the period of the next 18 months. why? most importantly, that's in the public's interest and the country's interests and it also
is doing a disservice, it seems to me, the president to allow this to hang over his administration because it potentially does damage to the country in the interim. that's why it's important we get to answers with regard to collusion or not, to the question of whether or not michael flynn made false statements or not, whether cases should be brought or not and a report ultimately presumably to congress after brought by the deputy attorney general so congress can take the measure of what happened here. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> why is president trump being sued today? it has nothing to do with russia. a prominent republican senator with a warning for the president, what could take him down. his words, not mine. urke) at farmers, we've seen almost everything, so we know how to cover almost anything. even a coupe soup. [woman] so beautiful. [man] beautiful just like you. [woman] oh, why thank you.
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high profile u.s. attorney for manhattan preet bhara. >> here it is in 60 seconds. >> the attorney general set to testify tomorrow. >> should it be public or private? is sessions simply trying to avoid public scrutiny. >> i do think it matters you pull this guy out in front of the cameras and ask him what the heck is going on. >> the attorney general has asked this hearing be public. >> during the afternoon president trump holding his first meeting of his full cabinet.
>> thank you. >> thank you very much. >> does president trump have audio recordings of his conversations and meetings with the former fbi director, james comey? >> the president made clear in the rose garden last week he would have an announcement shortly. >> the other big story, a new lawsuit. >> maryland and washington, d.c. filing a lawsuit today over the president's businesses raking in foreign cash. >> foreign governments are spending money there in order to curry favor with the president. >> the president's interests do not violate the immoll youments clause. >> day four and ding ding ding, get ready for round two. this time, attorney general jeff sessions going before the senate intel committee on the russia probe. one line of questions we can expect about the infamous oval office meeting. fired fbi director james comey says the attorney general left him alone with president trump.
>> my sense was the attorney general knew he shouldn't be leaving which is why he was lingering. >> after you were left alone with the president you mentioned it was inappropriate and should never happen again to the attorney general. apparently he did not reply and you write that he did not reply. what did he do, if anything? did he just look at you? was there a pause for a moment? what happened. >> i don't remember real clearly. i have a recollection of him just kind of looking at me. there's a danger i'm projecting onto him, this may be a faulty memory and his body language gave me the sense of, what am i going to do? >> with me here, correspondent for the "washington post." how important is this testimony tomorrow for the white house. >> it's very important to get the narrative back to where they want it. there were a lot of lapses in judgment former director comey described last week.
it will be very interesting to hear what jeff sessions, who does not have the sort of excuse he didn't know what the mores and standards of washington are, how he describe these events. >> erin, if i were on that senate intel panel tomorrow i would ask him specific conversations about what he said with the president to help me put the pieces together. >> if the president acertified executive privilege the attorney general could not answer. that hasn't been asserted. at least not tonight. that question is fair game tomorrow to be asked of the attorney general. >> i would love to hear how jeff sessions portrays that oval office meeting when he was asked to leave and what his recollection was what james comey said later, don't leave me alone with the president again. that clip you played of asking him those questions, that was
the one moment of weakness comey showed, i might not be projecting, i don't exactly have a perfect recollection. the white house, i'm sure sensed some weakness to have jeff sessions pounce there. >> you have to look for the facts and corroboration in law and in politics people oftentimes take sides and people have reached upons already on mueller -- reached opinions on mueller whether he got it right or not and nobody going there who likes mueller. he did say something controversial about the former attorney general lynch a democrat. he said she basically strong-armed him about the investigation that had to do with the clintons and had something to say about her but will only do it behind closed doors. he's getting in hot water with some democrats as well. >> at this point, the democrats would like this see it stay on the track it was on. i really don't think he will be
having much pushback from the democrats. >> tomorrow, you expect him to answer every question posed to him? >> certainly not. we haven't seen that from anyone just yet. i'm sure we will hear something like we heard from comey he can't answer it in an open session. >> why not do the appropriations with senator leahy and said he could do that and now passing it off to rosenstein when he has a meeting in the afternoon. >> in part because he knows those questions will be focused a lot on the investigation an investigation he ostensibly recused himself from. >> he will get the same from the budget intel. >> we saw people testify last week and it's not getting enough attention. i think it was smart for sessions to send in someone who will get different questions especially on the budget. >> i will see it and be there tomorrow to watch it in person.
coming up, suing president trump, why two top law enforcement officials think the president's business dealings violate the constitution. and another calling the president his own worst enemy. ♪ here's to breaking more glass ceilings. in golf and everywhere else. ♪ the kpmg women's pga championship. but when we brought our daughter home, that was it. now i have nicoderm cq. the nicoderm cq patch with unique extended release technology helps prevent your urge to smoke all day. it's the best thing that ever happened to me. every great why needs a great how.
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president trump soon to be served with a lawsuit. attorney generals from maryland and d.c. claiming he violated corruption clauss. >> adding new legal firepower to challenge president trump's worldwide business holdings, maryland and the district of columbia says he's violating it. >> the president understands the value of walls and one he can't
dig underneath. >> the two attorneys general says mr. trump markets his properties as president and space in trump tower and staying at the washington hotel to seek his favor, too much of a conflict they say when he makes decisions about foreign policy and say he never put his holdings in a blind trust. but the constitution only blocks a president from personal dealings. easily the richest in modern time, the lawsuit faces long odds. it hasn't come up before. even if it doesn't succeed, it could force the president to turn over revealing financial records. >> request number one will be his tax returns to see if there's any basis behind these allegations that are made, that could be very significant.
>> with me, nbc's justice core respondent, pete williams. the trump administration says this is a >> that they have standing because their sovereign states who feel strongly about this issue, that may not carry the day. they also say foreign businesses aren't -- or diplomats dignitaries are not doing business with their taxpayer own or supported institutions like the dc convention center and instead going to the trump hotel. the government would argue, i think as it has in a previous case similar to this one that that's speculative. the question is here is can they get past that hurdle at least to
get to the point of discovery, that seems to be one of the goals here. >> now let me take you to the ninth circuit. there was a ruling there. what did the court say in that case. >> so this is the second appeals court ruling on the travel restrictions the president signed that restricts travel from six predominantly muslim countries. the fourth circuit said it's unconstitutional because its religious discrimination, the ninth circuit ruling on the case that called out of hawaii. it's illegal that the president violated federal immigration law. he didn't meet the test of the law to show why this restriction didn't be in the national interest, he violated a law saying you can't single out people without a good reason. it's a narrower ruling, perhaps the appeals court thought it would appeal more to the supreme court which now has to -- the government has asked for the supreme court to take this appeal and in the meantime to let the government start enforcing the ban while the
tweet. any party leaders wanted him to go cold turkey. but not many are going this far about talking. >> you may be the first president in history to go down because you can't stop talking about an investigation that if you just were quiet would clear you. your own worst enemy. >> press secretary says, stop talking, you're heading into a giant perjury trap. and it's not just the president, his son keeps talking, too. >> when he tells you to do something, guess what, there's no ambiguity in it, there's no hey, i'm hoping. you and i are friends, i hope this happens but you've got to do your job. as a politician to go back and write a memo, he felt so threatened, but he didn't do
anything. >> back from karen and erin. this problem that the republican party is having over his tweets and talk and everything else, there's nothing they can do, right? >> absolutely not. we've never had a situation where we've been able to sort of have a running real time commentary with the president and that's what we're looking at. whether this becomes part of a public record at some point, it's out there. it lives. it will always live. >> you know, it's almost though as he has teflon. he said some things, accusing of wiretapping him, which is -- which in my opinion opinion is e egregious, but nothing really sort of sticks with him. nothing has hurt him, so far. >> several times he has indicated that he doesn't know how nato works instead of his tweets and they are still there and he hasn't deleted those. i will point out that they've
been ineffective spokesman for this white house. he goes on tweets on his own and has shown that he is talking closely with the white house when there's suppose to be some degree of separation between the president's son because of the business and white house. if donald trump, jr. is tweeting about the white house, talking about the white house in some other internal strategy, that shows you there's little too close of line there. >> it is sticking to him. the way he communicates is one of the reasons such as approval ratings are stuck in the high 30s, the lowest we've seen for a president. his tweets are one of the reasons. his agenda are getting nowhere. if he was using it to message about policy, he might be in a different situation now. >> they did infrastructure, this week it's going to be energy. and they're almost coming off as laughable weeks because the president is not getting on board and pushing out his own message in the way that he could. >> can i defend it, i know it's incorrect to do so.
but my heart bleeds for children of famous people politicians. they go out and defend their parents. it's like, you know, i cut slack for the children. i know he's not a child. >> i don't disagree with that. i'm saying, i'm not for a aid, not for a lawyer, not for anything else. >> he's choosing to be on tv. >> i understand totally. it's a part of my -- i have a soft spot for children dealing with special problems. >> can i add, he's said sort of outrageous things about international relations. >> i'm not defending what he said. i said i feel sorry for him. >> he compared dealing with terrorist to parenting his five children. that's a little bit over the top. i know it's a joke. he's saying things that are kind of crazy. >> i know. any way, i'm just saying i have a soft spot and soft spot -- any way, thank you very much for joining us. make sure you tune in tomorrow night. 6:00 p.m. eastern and tomorrow afternoon, i'm going to be inside the room when attorney
general jeff sessions testifies before the senate intelligence committee. i like to go and have a closer look at it. follow me on twitter. we'll see you tomorrow night at 6:00 p.m. eastern, ha"hardball" with chris matthews starting right now. trump with defense. let's play hardball. good evening, i'm chris mattis donald trump has been thrown on defense. he got lawyered up. after last week's testimony, he's throwing personal insults and attacks calling the former fbi a coward. he tweeted this weekend i believe the leaks will be far more prevalent than anyone thought possible, totally illegal, very cowardly. this morning his daughter echoed her father's attack on the comey's testimony and what she called the viciousness of the criticism of h