tv MSNBC Live With Velshi and Ruhle MSNBC July 11, 2017 8:00am-9:00am PDT
it's a frame grab from a video posted by the government controlled syrian central military. these are syrian forces taking position during fighting between government forces and isis. the u.n. special envoy has a cease fire in parts of the country says is generally holding. this is coming from the syrian central military via the ap. i'll post that big picture on my facebook and twitter and snap chat pages and a lot of response to yesterday's photo of the one from california. responding to all of it after the show and hope to see you there. thanks for tuning in this hour. i'll see you back in washington, d.c. tomorrow. for now, more news with ali velshi and stepanie ruhle. >> we were just talking about pilates and scooping out our bellies and that works better for stephanie -- >> we were talking about chair heighth and i think this is how -- >> that's generally how it goes. >> have a great rest of your
day. she wants to be out of here as fast as possible. >> snapchat me, i'm out of here. you're probably waiting for this. let's get started. >> a military transport plane crashed in rural mississippi. it slammed into a soybean field and burst into flames immediately. all 16 people aboard are believed to have died. >> they found debris on both sides of the highway which suggests the aircraft could have exploded prior to the crash. >> have you ever worked for the russian government? do you have connections to the russian government? >> no -- >> this is the woman at the center of a storm over a meeting with donald trump's son in june of 2016. >> they had the impression it appears that they were going to be told some information that you had about the dnc. >> translator: it's quite possible that maybe they were looking for such information. they wanted it so badly. >> donald trump jr. who moments ago responded on twitter again,
with this, media and dems are extremely invested in the russia story. if this nonsense meeting it all they have after a year, i understand the desperation. >> everybody lied. on the disclosure forms, everybody lied in the trump administration about this meeting. >> if there is a conspiracy to obtain foreign assistance, that's a crime. >> there was no other connection, no phone calls or no further meetings, this is a massive nothing burger. >> it is not standard political practice to seek information from a foreign government. >> we don't know all the details. i know it's serious and i said a long time ago it's serious and this is a serious situation and one that is a long way from over. >> we're now beyond obstruction of justice in terms of what's being investigated. this is moving into perjury, false statements and even into potentially treason. >> lots to talk about here,
including the conversation with sebastian go rca. >> qutsz new york times reporting before around arranging the meeting don jr. was informed in an e-mail it was part of a russian government effort to aid his father's candidacy. now he is firing back, saying media and dems are extremely invested in the russia story. if this nonsense meeting is all they have after a year, i understand the desperation. extraordinary since he changed his story a few times in 24 hours. >> we just want the story, tell us what happened. >> tell us what it is. we have a team of correspondents and analysts here to break it down for us. let's go to keir simmons in moscow. you saw a bit of it earlier, he got to interview the russian lawyer at the heart of that meeting exclusively. take a look at this. >> what was the purpose of that
meeting? >> translator: i never knew who else would be attending the meeting. all i knew was that mr. donald trump jr. was willing to meet with me. i could recognize the young gentleman who was only present in the meeting for probably the first seven to ten minutes. then he stood up and left the room. it was mr. jared kushner and he never came back by the way. and the other individual who was at the same meeting was always looking at his phone. he was reading something. he never took any active part in the conversation. that was mr. manafort. >> they had the impression it appears that they were going to be told some information that you had about the dnc. how did they get that impression? >> translator: it's quite possible that maybe they were looking for such information. they wanted it so badly. >> have you ever worked for the russian government? do you have connections to the russian government?
>> translator: no. >> okay, well that was keir simmons conversation, there was inconsistencies there for well because she met donald trump jr. for seven to ten, he said 20 to 30. nothing is particularly clear. let's bring in kristen welker and kasie hunt. why is this e-mail important? >> reporter: it's significant because it's the first time that we're learning that according to the "new york times," someone within the trump campaign in this instance, his eldest son, donald trump jr. was alerted to the fact that the russian government had designs to try to impact the election and effectively did so with this meeting in which it characterized through this attorney, according to the "new york times" that it had damaging information about hillary clinton. the new york times reporting that trump jr. was informed in an e-mail that the material was part of a russian government
effort to aid his father's candidacy. now donald trump jr. is vigorously pushing back in a series of e-mails and states. his attorney writing in my view this is much ado about nothing. don jr. had no knowledge as to what specific information if any would be discussed. he did nothing wrong. and then this from the spokes person for president trump as person attorney, the president was not aware of and did not attend the meeting. >> the key takeaways from the perspective of the white house, look, yes, don jr. took this meeting with the promise of damaging information about hillary clinton but he didn't actually take or receive any information from the meeting and there was no follow-up. but this is still creating a major problem as it relates to the russia probe, in part because don jr.'s story continued to shift. initially he said he was taking the meeting to learn about russian adoptions. then a day after the story posted, he acknowledged that he
was given this information or promised information that would be hurtful to hillary clinton. again, we should stress he says once the meeting got under way, there was no information to be gleaned or obtained. still it has lawmakers on capitol hill pressing for more information, demanding that he come and testify. >> the issue -- >> had they gotten information, then would it be a different story? we have to remember it was not just don jr. in the meeting. jared kushner who at the time had an official role in the campaign and at this time has security clearance and an official role in the white house and paul manafort, obviously not with the administration at this point, knows his way around politics. so we need kasie hunt to weigh in. give us feedback. what are we hearing from others on the hill? just yesterday there was a republican lawmaker from florida, i would take a meeting like that. i'm not sure if he's remembering a meeting like that from a foreign government, that could pose a very big problem, not your run of the mill research.
>> reporter: yeah, that's not what i'm hearing so far from the senators i talked to outside the senate armed services committee. we've been speaking to senators who sit on that committee including john mccain, lindsey graham and senator tim kaine, a democrat from virginia. a varied response but universal sense of concern about what exactly what was going on here. some questions raised by both graham and mccain and very serious charge leveled by tim kaine. take a look what he had to say. >> if there's an e-mail it's a different case if there's nothing. i heard the nbc interview of the lady in question and her side of the story is that they reached out to her, not the other way around. clearly, donald trump jr.'s explanation of the meeting has evolved. if there's an e-mail between some russian figure and the trump campaign saying the russian government wants to help this lady can help you, then
that's something i would definitely want to know. now, apparently nothing transpired. there was no exchange of information between the russian lawyer and the campaign. but if there's an e-mail from a russian suggesting that the russian government wants to help, that would be very problematic. >> we're now beyond obstruction of justice in terms of what's being investigated. this is moving into perjury, false statements and potentially treason. >> i've said many times in the past, there's another shoe that will drop and there will be other shoes that will drop. >> reporter: so john mccain not exactly ready to write all of this off at this point -- >> mark warner has made -- >> reporter: the accusation that this is potentially treason. >> mark warner has said there's nor to come on this thing. we've seen donald trump jr. tweeting out the e-mail in question that everybody has been
talking about. and i want to point out an important line in the e-mail. it's from -- hard to say who it is from. i think it's from the person who triped to set up the meeting -- >> i'm going to go first. in the subject line where it says russia clinton private and confidential. let's start from the get-go, from saturday when donald trump jr. was asked about this and led with, it has to do with russians and the orphan situation there. that's what's interesting to me. if that's what donald trump jr., the first way he described this meeting, amazing when you look at the e-mail in the very subject line it's clinton russia -- >> he put out a statement that said donald trump jr. just tweeted this, it's sad that the left today would rather see america suffer and fail than to see it succeed with real donald trump at the helm, #make america
great again. >> i don't think it's one or the other. >> this is remarkable distraction. this is not true. most people would not take a meeting. if you would google this lawyer -- it's unbelievable that donald trump jr. with jared kushner and paul manafort would take some random meeting without knowing what it's about. if these e-mails are what they are, it's very clear he thought he was taking a meeting by somebody who represented the crown prosecutor in russia with information about hillary clinton. so this isn't good either way you cut it. >> with regard to putting america first, we would absolutely love to talk about president trump and the republican agenda. if there's a new health care bill coming out, we would love to sit town and see it and meet and have people from the white house talk us through it. >> this is serious business. >> we love to talk infrastructure, the president gave a much admired speech in poland at the end of last week. when you think about what the president talked about when he
references the g-20, there's a lot of confusion whether or not he and vladimir putin discussed sanctions because what he says and what president trump says and rex tillerson says are not the same thing. >> president trump and sergei lavrov say sanctions were discussed. two translators and tillerson says sanctions were discussed and others say sanctions weren't discussed. let's go back to kristen welker who is looking at the e-mail that weefl gotten hold of. what do you see? >> reporter: a couple of things that stand out. i know you have been reading some of the contents of this on air. apologies if i repeat -- >> it's all good. >> reporter: let's start with the initial e-mail. this according to what was just sent out from donald trump jr. was written by rob gold stone, that is the publicist who helped to set up this meeting. here's what he says, the crown prosecutor of russia met with
his father this morning and in their meeting offered to provide the trump campaign with official documents and information that would incriminate hillary and her dealings with russia and very useful to your father. this is high level and sensitive information but is part of russia and its government support for mr. trump helped along. that is critical. this is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of russia and its government support for mr. trump, helped along by ar is and emmon. what do you think is the best way to handle this information? >> he stresses again this is ultrasensitive. the response from donald trump jr. dated june 3rd, the same day that the first e-mail was sent, thanks, rob. and he says, seems we have some time and if it's what you say, i love it.
especially late in the summer. >> if it's what you say i love it. >> in other words, if it's what you say, research on hillary clinton represented to be from the russian crown prosecutors -- not as donald trump jr. has said in the other statement, that as she has said as they've said the woman would be in new york not a government official. that's nonsense to suggest he didn't think this was tied to the russian government is absolute nonsense and refuted by the e-mail which donald trump jr. posted as real. he once again krcontradicted himself. >> can we put in political comparison. when al gore was running against george w. bush, and received a briefing document that george bush would have had before the debate, the gore campaign immediately contacted the fbi. >> that wasn't anything provided by a foreign government. >> to make the argument this is run of the mill research,
research receiving something of value from a foreign government that is a far different situation. and when donald trump jr. is saying if you it is what you say it is and if you look earlier in the e-mail when rob gold stone is saying you expressed you were interested in this, that begs the question, donald trump jr. said i didn't know what it was, they asked to come see me. it's confusing or misleading. >> i think here's the key point. legal experts will have to break down what the legal implications may or may not be of these actions, this is the first time we have someone within the president's inner circle, couldn't be closer to the president, his eldest son, effectively saying that he was alerted about what the russian government was up to, what the u.s. intelligence agencies have now determined was a direct and intentional move to interfere in the 2016 race. so this is certainly significant. it's significant that he decided
to release these e-mails. the questions become why did it take so long for this meeting and the contents of it to be divulged and of course, as lawmakers on capitol hill have said, they want to talk to every single person in the meeting. so donald trump jr., jared kushner, who didn't initially divulge the meeting but ultimately did disclose it when pressed about it and of course paulmana diagno paulmanafort as well. if all of this is being made public, what is it that special counsel robert mueller knows that hasn't yet been made public? this is a big, big development. >> i want to point out that in donald trump's statement he writes the woman as she said publicly was not a government official. >> yet in the e-mail it is represented by rob goldstone as someone who has information from the russian crown prosecutor. >> let's make it clear. yes, she was not an official -- she was not a government official, but it doesn't mean that she doesn't have close ties to the government or potentially
an operative. >> pitched to him as information that came from the russian government. >> i want to share one thing. this happened early july or early june in 2016, june 9th. on july 24th of 2016, don jr. in a tweet, on the clinton campaign's claims that the russians were helping trump, he said, quote, it's disgusting. it's so phony. donald trump jr. on july 24th, when responding it's disgusting so phony -- >> a month and week after -- >> kristen, thanks very much for your reporting on this, kasie hunt will continue to talk to people on capitol hill and getting a great deal of reaction, including some from senator lindsey graham of south carolina. let's listen to what he's had to say about this. >> okay, so any time you're in a campaign and you get offered from a foreign government to help your campaign, the answer is no. i don't know what mr. trump jr.'s version of the facts are.
definitely he has to testify. that e-mail is disturbing. but what is equally odd that the person they met with knew absolutely nothing. so i don't know why they would pick somebody for him to meet with who didn't have information about the clinton campaign, but on its face, this is very problematic. we cannot allow foreign governments to reach out to anybody's campaign and say we'd like to help you. that is a nonstarter. donald trump jr. is new to politics and jared kushner is new to politics but this is going to require a lot of questions to be asked and answered. >> do you think the white house is being truthful about the version of events that happened in their meetings that occurred between the associates and the russians? >> it's very frustrating for every couple of weeks to find out about a new meeting. i'm sure they met with a lot of people during the campaign. i'm sure the clinton campaign met with -- >> this way, senator paul.
senator paul -- do you have half a second. >> we've been hearing those comments from kasie who went over to senator paul. >> don jr. is new to politics, there was a thirds person in the room part of the trump campaign. >> paul manafort in the middle. >> would you say paul manafort is new to politics? >> no, he's been in politics about 40 years or something like that. let's just remind everybody what has happened here. in the midst of trying to clear up confusion on meeting, while we were on air, donald trump jr. released a series of e-mails, two of which contain the transcript of the e-mails -- series of tweets, two of which contain e-mails we've been discussing from rob goldstone to donald trump jr. about this meeting in which rob goldstone says, they are information -- they have information that comes from the russian state prosecutor, meaning russian government stuff.
then donald trump jr. puts out a release or a statement that says, the woman as she had said publicly was not a government official and as we have said she had no information to provide and wanted to talk about adoption policy and -- >> no, she was not a government official, but it did certainly seem she has ties. the statements don jr. has made over the last few days, i didn't know what the meeting was about. i didn't know who she was -- >> these e-mails contradict that. >> they directly contradict it. he did not know what information she would ultimately have, but based on the e-mails rin s writn the subject line, information about hillary clinton, don jr. without a doubt knew why they were sitting down. he didn't know what he was going to get out of her. but the intent was let me get that information and this is to lindsey graham's point wildly different than your run of the mill opposition research seeing
it is coming from a foreign government. >> that part about the russian crown prosecutor's office was abundant a clear in the e-mail sent to done sald trump jr., we're going to figure out know that a little bit more of the truth is out, whether collusion is actually at play. stay with us, we're coming right back. are created equal, that they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. ♪ when a fire destroyedwith us everything in our living room. we replaced it all without touching our savings. yeah, our insurance won't do that. no. you can leave worry behind when liberty stands with you™. liberty mutual insurance.
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on donald trump jr. and the e-mails, the meeting last june along with jared kushner and paul manafort with a lawyer from russia who keir simmons sat down with later. i want to bring in our national security reporter in d.c., ken, what do you make of the e-mails -- i read the new york times said don jr. put the e-mails out to scoop the times because they were about to release them. >> this may be the most extraordinary development yet in the whole trump/russia saga. as you know for months, donald trump and associates have been denying that there was any coordination with the russian government that they were aware of attempts by the russian government to help the trump campaign. here in black and white and i want to read this to you from rob goldstone who set up the meeting, to done sald trump jr. on june 3rd, 2016, the crown prosecutor of russia met with his father aris, an oligarch in
russia and offered to provide the trump information with official documents and information that would incriminate hillary and dealings with russia and be very useful to your father. this is very high level and sensitive information but is part of russia and its government support for mr. trump helped by aris and amman. >> the trump campaign being told the russian government wanted to help their effort. there are other references to alerting mr. trump through his personal assistant but i wanted to go to you first don jr., instead of calling the fbi and alerting authorities to this, took the meeting as we know now. >> and the response which is important. that e-mail you just read from was june 3rd at 10:37 in the morning. at 10:53 the same morning, less than 20 minutes later don jr. responds to rob goldstone and among other things says if it's what you say, i love it.
so that disabuses everyone of this idea that he did not know a what might be coming -- may not have known the specific content but he did no it was information gleaned by the russian government in support of donald trump's presidency that he wanted to hand over to donald trump jr., number one. and number two, that there was no surprise about who this -- where this was coming from, that it was official government information. this is stuff that donald trump jr. that's contradicted in the last few days. >> you're absolutely right. it's stunning and to be clear, you know, as this lawyer describes the meeting, that's really not what transpired. she -- according to her account and don ald jr.'s account, there wasn't substantial incriminating information and she really wanted to talk about these sanctions relating to this adoption issue. but what it shows is that donald trump jr. and people around him
were willing to take this meeting, willing to engage on this issue and put on notice by their associates that the russian government wanted to try to help them. at one point, rob goldstone refers to this woman as a russian government lawyer. she says she has no official ties to the russian government but clearly lobbying on a cause that's near and dear to the russian government's heart, lifting sanctions and having to do with human rights violators in russia. this is incredible development, guys. >> before sally yates was fired, one of the risks she said the white house was in was that russians would be in a position to blackmail mike flynn. the fact that don jr. took this meeting and jared kushner was in the room and paul manafortd, not that they gained information, but if the russian government had that information that they knew these gentlemen took this meeting, these e-mails existed -- >> after saying that there was
no such meeting. >> after they repeated said this is false and untrue. knowing that information could that be blackmail worthy content that the russian government could use against the trump team? >> i mean, just as a matter of common sense it would seem it could be, right? i think people are going to be asking the question, given these facts, the e-mail we've seen, is this a crime? i've been doing some reporting on that and talking to lawyers both democrats and republicans who practice in this area and surprisingly they say it's not necessarily a crime. there's no statute that makes it a crime to ckol lewd with a foreign government if money didn't exchange. it's not espionage or turning oversee krets to russia. there is a crime of failing to report you're a foreign agent. that's not applicable here. this is one of the reasons tell me that the fbi is looking so hard at financial transactions,
if they were trying to cultivate the trump team and associates, were they also doing business deals? certainly this issue of collusion and this e-mail is going to be a factor legal experts tell me am bob mueller's investigation going forward. >> there's a specific infraction at the very least when it comes to jared kushner because this is the third time he has not disclosed a meeting with someone who purportedly represents or has information from the russian government. while donald jr. may not have committed crime and we don't know because it flows out at quite a rate. jared kushner continues to not disclose relationships that he has with russians -- >> but jared's attorney says he will speak openly when he's called by the committee. >> this issue of disclosure is certainly a live one here. there's a question about did mike flynn lie to the fbi. there's a question whether jared kushner was forthcoming on his security clearance forms about
these foreign contacts. it's not often people get prosecuted for failing to disclose those meetings but if there's a pattern and criminal intent, that's where you're facing legal jeopardy, folks. >> thanks for your reporting. we have a lot of paper to look through. meanwhile, kasie hunt has been getting reaction on capitol hill. let's listen to what ted cruz had to say about this. >> washington is obsessed right now. it is the democratic talking point du jour. when i go back to texas, nobody asks about russia. you know how many questions i got on russia? zero. outside people are focused on obamacare, they are focused on tax reform and want to see a simple flat tax and abolishing the irs and regulatory reform. they want to see the federal regulations killing jobs lifted so we can have more jobs and opportunity. so it's just worth keeping in
mind the absolute disconnect between the obsession of the washington media and where the american people are -- >> you're not concerned about possible collusion, the russians interfered with the election and that's the intelligence community -- >> you're being very persistent and i suppose that's your job. but let me point out the american people want the president to succeed. one of the saddest things to see is the president was traveling overseas to europe was meeting with our allies and adversaries seeing so many on the left publicly calling for him to fail. that's the president of the united states. when we're -- when the president is overseas, we should not be undermining the president. it's in all of our interest, whether democrat or republican, to have a strong president who stands with allies and defends american interests and stands up
to our enemies. all of the russia obsession, i don't know i've seen very much coverage about president trump's speech in foe land. it was the most important part of this trip abroad. it was a powerful speech that covered the full range of history of poland standing up to tyranny and o plegs, standing up to the nazis and soviet union and pope john paul, been on spot where he gave the speech, with million polls chanting we want god. in 1979 behind the iron curtain at a time when the soviet union was imposing age theism and oppression -- putin and rt uses did not like president trump highlighting the power of freedom and power of speaking the truth to tear down soviet
tyranny. if you wants to talk about russia, there's a good point to talk about. >> is russia an enemy of the united states? >> russia is a adverse rarery -- >> do i think trump is treating them that way? >> i think we've had eight years of barack obama showing nothing but appeasement towards russia -- >> president trump is not appeasing russia? >> if you look on substance, part of the irony of this media obsession with russia, is that the obama administration began with hillary clinton bringing a big red reset button to russia, saying they were going to reset the relationship with russia so she and obama were going to be friends with russians. that's how they began. if you look at what happened with russia, russia invades ukraine and the obama administration does nothing, utterly ineffect you'll. and john kerry saying he wants to provide putin with --
>> trying to water down a sanctions bill you voted for. >> didn't want an off ramp and the policies of the obama administration were constant weakness and appeasement. one of the best things recently announced was the trump administration's intention to go forward with placing anti-ballistic missile batteries in poland in the czech republic. those were scheduled to go in ten years ago. in 2009 in the opening weeks of the obama administration, barack obama and hillary clinton canceled the anti-ballistic missile batteries. why? because she wanted to appease putin and appease russia and russia didn't want the batteries to go in. i'm glad the trump administration is returning to a common sense defense of our allies against our adversaries and -- substance matters. policy matters. he think standing up using all of the tools we have to con
strainutin and russia's aggression is gd thing to do. i think one of the real problems with the obama -- hillary clinton foreign policy is that it facilitated russian aggression and i'm glad we're not doing that anymore. >> thank you. >> okay, that was ted cruz saying a lot of things about this russia situation except largely saying it's a nothing burger. >> what do find interesting, why isn't the media covering more about the great speech the prepared remarks that president trump gave -- >> we covered it quite a bit but what's interesting to me following g20 meeting the president himself when he's not giving prepared remarks written by steven miller and gary cohn and others, when he's taken to twitter, he's gone back and forth about the meeting he had with vladimir putin, whether whether or not they should have a cyber security joint partner
snp. sunday evening it was a no. whether or not they discussed sanctions was unclear. on monday when he could have talked about that agenda, the global message he had in that poland speech, he could have talked about that on twitter yesterday but he didn't. he went back to defending why he himself placed his daughter ivanka in his seat when he left the room in the g-20 meeting and what he didn't do was bring all of those allied nations together in response to what they are going to do with north korea. we haven't heard that much from president trump. so to the response to ted cruz, senator cruz, i'd love to talk about that. >> we did. just for their information, we did talk about poland. we find that kind of stuff interesting. we want to bring in jaf rery jacob vich, represented officials in the clinton white house. i don't know if you had a chance to look at e-mails, put out via twitter by donald trump jr.
himself. they directly contradict those statements he also put out on twitter himself in which he said this woman as she said publicly was not a government official. i guess that may be technically accurate but the e-mails show clearly this is russian government information gathered by the crown prosecutor of russia to help donald trump and his campaign. >> that's right, ali, what you have is definitive information showing that the russian government is involved and that trump jr. and kushner and manafort are going to a meeting where they are expecting to obtain information that was helpful in terms of dirt on hillary. >> what now what happens? we were talking to ken delaney, but again, we know jared kushner was involved in the campaign and now he is in government and had to fill out declarations of his
involvement with meetings with russians. he did not disclose yet another meeting. >> that's right. there's a series of meetings that weren't disclosed but still, i don't think you can bypass what donald trump jr. did, what you have are the conspiracy statutes and you have an attempt to obtain something of value from a foreign country, a foreign add sers vary. that i'm sure is a concern of mueller and his group are looking into this. >> what happens from here? >> what happens, mueller will continue as a -- individuals attends the meetings would be called up to testify most likely have to take the fifth amendment and not testify -- >> why? >> the investigation goes on. but now for the white house to come outs and say this is russia fake news would be very difficult. >> and -- hold on, why? they are going to continue to
want to say that. we just heard from ted cruz, when i go home to texas, people aren't asking about this, this is a washington media obsession. is this a media obsession or a serious little issue? >> i think people are still very much interested in what will happen with the mueller investigation and where it leads. and i think the republicans on capitol hill have to be interested in it because it could deter from any kind of support that trump would want from them in passing legislation. >> let me ask you about the fact that donald trump jr. has released these e-mails himself, apparently going to be in a "new york times" story later and they also published it. the fact he's putting them out there and put the statement out, a little contradict tri, i would assume now he's hired a lawyer it would be more consistent but that hasn't happened. when you plead the fifth after you've done this, how does that work? >> well, there would be an issue whether he's waived a fifth amendment because he's already spoken about the subject.
and it could end up being a battle in court about it. but it's going to be very hard for donald trump jr.'s lawyer to mitigate the damage or change the story because trump jr. is right out there in terms of what he was looking for and e-mails are out there, corroborated the story through three individuals. it's going to be very difficult for him to back away from the story. >> we're going to continue to follow this. thanks for your instant analysis for us. he has been joining us, an expert on white collar crime and worked with members of the white house -- >> probably one observation, we've heard so much -- i would say probably from people in the administration who call the "new york times," failing "new york times," i'm going to say this week, definitely not failing. >> no kidding. >> we're going to stay on top of the story. by the time we come back after break, there may be new news.
we've got all of our people on the store rix the president's son releasing the e-mails showing how the meeting arranged with a russian lawyer who has ties to the kremlin. those e-mails show donald trump, jr. show he knew they would incriminate hillary clinton. for 10 years, my tempur-pedic has adapted to my weight and shape, so i sleep deeply, and wake up ready to perform. right now, save up to $500 on select tempur-pedic mattress sets at our july 4th event. find your exclusive retailer at tempurpedic.com
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donald trump, jr. has just released a series of e-mails between himself and rob goldstone, purporting to talk about this meeting held on june 9th, 2016. because we're going to be talking a lot about this and you're probably going to be able to go on the internet and read e-mails yourself. they are there, i want to tell you about who's involved in the whole thing. first of all, who was at the -- this is rob goldstone, he has been e-mailing back and forth to set up the meeting. he is -- he was involved with the 2013 miss universe pageant in moscow. and in the e-mails he refers to two people, emin and aras. a russian pop star with ties to the kremlin. his father is a real estate developer who helped sponsor the 2013 miss universe pageant in moscow. >> which at the time president trump owned. >> and signed a political deal to build trump tower in moscow.
this is the connection, these two men, they were represented by the music promoting rob goldstone who then e-mailed donald trump, jr. and said the following the crown prosecutor of russia met with his father this morning and they are in the meeting to pry official documents and information to incriminate hillary and her dealings with russia and very useful to your father. this is high level and sensitive information but is part of russia and its government support for mr. trump helped along by aris and emin. would you be able to speak to emin about it directly. i can send this directly to your father but it's ultrasensitive, wanted to send it to you first. >> this is extraordinary. we're going to break this down with senator tom carper, a democrat from the state of delaware, works on the senate finance committee as well and
former naval officer who served three tours of duty during vietnam. you're just observing this information as we are. what's your initial take? >> i was a naval flight officer for 23 years all in, p3 aircraft, our job was to track soviet submarines and around vietnam as well. we didn't trust the soviets then and frankly don't trust the russians today. good news coming through all of this, bob mueller is our special counsel. bob mueller, former head of the fbi, i've known for years, putting together a team that will drill down on every piece of evidence including stuff you're reporting today. ultimately our goal is to get to the truth. people know the truth, we won't make a mistake. mueller and the team he's putting together will find out the truth. >> what's the only danger that stands in your way? we've heard rumbles, they seem to have come to nothing, that the president may have the power to and is considering replacing robert mueller.
obviously that just wouldn't go over very well if you tried that. >> the president decided to pull the plug on robert mueller, terrific individual, great lead every and citizen, if he tried to do to him what he did to jim comey, i think there would be huge outcry. wouldn't just be democrats or independents, in the senate, it would be republicans as well. that would be one bridge too far. >> ted cruz makes the argument when he goes home to the state of texas, his constituents don't care about this at all. they care about good government, tax reform, deregulation, health care. what's your response to that? >> they certainly care about health care, i hope they gave him an earful. to figure out democrats and republicans work together on health care and figure out what's wrong with the affordable care act and fix it and what's good about it, preserve and if things need to be dropped, they ought to be dropped. i was talking to john mccain yesterday, if they have an idea, introduce it as a bill. let's go regular order and have
hearings and people who like the idea and don't like the idea and one hearing or weeks of hearings like for the affordable care act. in committee, on the floor and let's go regular -- that's what we ought to do. people in delaware, what they want and i expect people in texas together, figure this out and work together to get it done. stop carping at one another and get it done. >> he says the people of texas don't seem to care about this russia issue, only the media that cares. >> well, i use ed to live in texas, stationed in corpus christi and my guess is that a lot of the people in texas do care about this and a lot of people in the country can think it is a bad thing. they did it in order to throw the election to donald trump and didn't want to see hillary clinton elected as president. my guess is there is people in texas, god knows a lot of people in delaware that care.
>> thank you for joining us. the senator is joining us to talk about -- we were going to talk about other things, but this news developed very quickly. we're going to be talking to john harwood from cnbc, who has been following this story closely, and the timeline of the russian developments, which will do after the break. >> you're watching "velshi and ruhle." stick around. big day. ♪ nausea, and sweaty eyelids. ♪ and in certain cases chronic flatulence. ♪ no. ♪ sooooo gassy girl. ♪ so gassy. if you're boyz ii men, you make anything sound good. it's what you do. if you want to save fifteen percent or more on car insurance, you switch to geico. it's what you do. next! ♪ next! if you could book a flight, then add a hotel, or car, or activity in one place and save, where would you go? ♪
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chain that we have not verified it that shows how his meeting with the russian lawyer was put together, no comment from the white house about the new release of this e-mail. joining us now, cnbc editor at large john harwood, writing expense live abo extensively about the trump family history. >> this is all right out in front of us. donald trump since 1987, when he wrote the art of the deal, talked about doing business in russia, and they have done business in russia, including the miss universe pageant. he wanted help from the russians in the campaign as the e-mails make clear. russians provided help to president trump and now despite what senator cruz told you a few minutes ago, he has been helping russia, how? because a big goal of the russians is to weaken the western alliance, weaken nato, president trump has been grudging in his support for nato, article 5. took it out of the speech
earlier. he did reiterate it at the g-20 the other day and now we see why he wants to help russia and it is because in the e-mails it explicitly outlined in the e-mails that rob goldstone sent describing natalia veselnitskaya as a russian government attorney, and the effort as part of russia and its government support for mr. trump. the president was eager for that support. he got it. he is not eager to punish russia now, that's why he is -- said he wants to move on and work constructively with russia. and in effect, has allowed vladimir putin to cast doubt on the idea that he was, in fact, interfering with the united states election, which he was. >> i want you to repeat yourself one more time. ali and have not been able to see all the e-mails. you're saying in the e-mail it says, quote, russian government attorney with sensitive info, quote, part of russia, and its government support for mr.
trump. it says that specifically in the e-mail exchange between rob goldstone and donald trump jr., is that correct? >> yes, that's the language that rob goldstone used, which makes it difficult to understand how in any way this is exculpatory for donald trump jr. or the trump white house. this is confirming ever that -- every question raised about potential collusion and refuting all of the denials from the white house about the idea that, well, there was no collusion with russia, he went into this meeting blind, didn't know who it was, this puts it in black and white, he released them to get out ahead of a new york times story that laid it out, now it is all out there, and certainly bob mueller is going to take this into account, certainly the congressional committee is going to take this into account, don't know what the white house is going to say about it, but they're in a bad spot right now. >> john, the other issue, of course, is that this denial
about not knowing who this was, or that it was really russians, or that, you know, nobody had any idea. that -- donald trump jr. probably can't get away with that, but jared kushner can and paul manafort, who has been in the campaign business for 40 years certainly can't get into the idea that in june of 2016 random people were showing up and he was taking meetings with them. >> precisely. this lays it out that donald trump jr. knew that he was getting information sourced to russia and its government. that's how rob goldstone described it. it is inconceivable that he did not make jared kushner and paul manafort aware. that's why they came to the meeting. it is also very difficult to believe he didn't tell his father about this information. >> and also, directly refute ing this, i want to share again, it said in that e-mail, as part of the russian government's effort to help trump, and then on july 24th, 2016, on television, donald trump jr. when asked
about the clinton campaign's claims that the russians were helping trump, he said, it is disgusting, it is so phony. so for donald trump jr., in july of last year, to say it is disgusting and it is so phony, there is no other way to describe this, that is a lie, given what he clearly knew in this e-mail exchange that he has sent out in june. >> much more to be done about this, much more to be read, john harwood and our team are going to be scouring this information and seeing what other fallout comes out of it. thanks for watching this hour of msnbc live with us. i'm ali velshi. >> i'm stephanie ruhle. i'll be watching tv for the next hour. do you know why? because andrea mitchell is in the house. time for "andrea mitchell reports". >> great to see you. thank you very much. right now, on "andrea mitchell reports," red alert. donald trump jr. releasing what he's says are the e-mails from an associate, a family business associate, saying the kremlin was offering, quote, incriminating information about hillary clinton's dealings with
russia that would be useful to his father. trump jr. responding, if it is what you say, i love it, especially later in the summer. all this last year during the campaign. keir simmons tracked down the russian lawyer who is tasked to bring that information to trump tower. >> they had the impression, it appears, they were going to be told some information that you had about the dnc. how did they get that impression? >> translator: it is quite possible that maybe they were looking for such information. they wanted it so badly. >> connecting the dots. as the president's older son calls it a nonsense meeting, top democrats are pouncing even before the e-mail is dropped. >> there is a lot more in the public domain, but, of course, the evolving accounts from don jr. don't inspire a lot of confidence. >> we're now beyond obstruction of justice in terms of what is being investigated. this is moving into perjury, false em