tv The 11th Hour With Brian Williams MSNBC July 18, 2017 8:00pm-9:00pm PDT
we might have had another one in there but essential the close would have been close to 48-4. that's a pretty impressive vote by any standard. >> 48 votes out of a 10348% pretty impressive. i guess it would be pretty impressive to someone who won the presidency with 46% of the vote came in second to hillary clinton who won an impressive 48% of the vote. 48% is tonight's last word. the 11th hour with brian williams starts now. tonight what we're learning about a second meeting between trump and putin at the g20. and now the questions, what was said and why weren't we told? and the problem with both answers. the plus a shockingly blunt assessment from the president on the defeat of the republican
health care plan. he says he is not going to own it. but what about health care for millions of americans with anxiety over cost coverage and the future? and the author of the number one book in the country is here with us tonight. it's about the man time magazine called the great manipulator steve bannon. "the 11th hour" begins now. on this tuesday night good evening once again from nbc news headquarters here in new york. day 180 of the still young trump administration brought disastrous headlines for the white house. the day began with the focus on health care specifically this klosle defeat for the president for mitch mcconnell on the republicans after an almost decade-long campaign after all to repeal and replace obamacare pep they will do neither now. the president more on this later, says he and they will refuse to own this failure. the focus of the day then
quickly shifted back to russia. that's because we learned this evening that there was a second meeting between trump and putin at that g20 conference, after their formal bilateral meeting, this one the start of which we were able to see. this was later after the dinner that night this dinner for the leaders and their spouses, why is this important? well for a number of reasons. for starters we weren't told about the second meekt meeting and we will likely never know what was said. the participants were donald trump, vladimir putin and putin's interpreter. no one else from the american team according to reports. it's important because putin interfered in our presidential election. it's important because we are in the midst of a counterinterrelation owe intelligence investigation being led by the frrm director of the fbi into trump and his people. it's important because the president attends the events to do the people's business having sworn an oath to preserve,
protect and defend the constitution of the united states. that's why it's a problem that no one apparently planned to tell us about this meeting and again there is no record of it. part of the proof being cited by several sources at any time tonight, the meeting was unplanned on trump's part. each leader was able to bring one interpreter to the dinner. according to the "washington post" the americans brought a japanese interpreter so you're president could communicate with shinzo abe of japan. putin brought a an interpreter who speaks english. trshlly an american president would always bring their own interpreter to such a meeting and would never rely on an interpreter working for the other side. "the new york times" noted this about the dinner. foreign leaders who witnessed it later commented operatively on the odd itty of an american president flaunting such a close rap potter with his russian counterpart pch remember all the
other leaders were at this dinner. the other breaking story of the day on this white house and on the topic of russia, we now know there were eight people in the room at donald trump jr.'s june 2016 meeting with multiple russians at trump tower. we know who the eighth person was. the new face which we have circled here in red, ike kavaldze, a russian businessman with ties to a russian billionaire who caught previously the attention of the feds when he pushed foreign money through us banks. that's him lower right. let's bring in the starting panel talk about all in "new york times" reporter ken vogel. anita couple ar white house correspondent and we welcome to the broadcast alexander former ambassador to russia and the bush 43 dprgs, a 30-year career member of the foreign sfts, having served every president
from reagan to obama. welcome to you all. ken, i'd like to begin with you, what will we not know about this one-hour meeting? what are the list of possible things we can't know? >> well we won't know anything. we won't know what was discussed unless president trump willingly divulges that information which he has thus far been unwilling to. let's not forget he gave an a long interview after the two meetings with putin. and he discussed in some depth the first one saying that he had asked twice whether putin was responsible for -- russia was responsible for the meddling in the u.s. election. putin denied it both times. naes settled we can move on from that. but in this case we won't know that. because there was no record of it. there was no u.s. interpreter there. and trump thus far has been unwilling to discuss it other than saying that it's fake news and it is quote, sick which he said in a tweet in evening,
despite the fact that we have now acknowledgement from the white house that it in fact did occur. >> and ambassador, your successor in the moscow posting mr. mcfall said when putin and trump are together trump is by definition playing defense. put isn't a 17-year veteran as leader of a nation before that a trained expert intelligence operative. we often ask the question in the broadcast kind of rhetorically what could go wrong? but as you hear of a one-hour long pull aside meeting with one side's interpreter you tell us what could go wrong. >> well first of all it's not that surprising the meeting took place given the fascination with putin and his seemingly unwillingness to criticize him for anything but mike! fall is absolutely right in a meeting like this with putin the experienced kgb veteran, 17 years in power, you need
somebody there to ensure that what goes down is reported. and if there is any consequences to the discussion that we know how to react. the president was in there kind of naked. but again it's not that surprising. it's -- it was a social dinner. but i think what's striking for me is how much he basically dissed our closest allies he was supposed to have din we are shinz an abe one of our closest allies all of the other g20 leader were around and creeped out by the conspicuous side conversation between the two lasered. >> it's the anger the reason we know the story came about because of a robust press corps and a leaks. ambassador a very basic question here does the fact that this meeting happened at all mean that the president was played, that putin knew that no one could bring any seconds to this meeting, that he would have virtually unfettered access with
his own team's interpreter to the american president? >> that's hard to say. it may have been the president's initiative to seek out putin at the so-called social dinner. so we don't know what if anything was given away. and in fact it's important to note that despite everybody's suspicions about the president he so far hasn't given away the store and key issues like ukraine. he has appointed a diplomatic in ukraine to try to get the russians out of ukraine. the russians seem enraged about the diplomatic compounds and the administration unwillingness to give them back. so putin may not have felt he got a lot out of the meetings except for the most important thing for him, respect ability, the sense he is back, he is accepted people need to deal with putin. you can't isolate russia despite the effort of the u.s. and
allies to sanction russia after the naked aggression against ukraine. >> at long last the patient anita, and ken mentioned on social media we have two tweets to choose from helm let's see fake news story of a secret dinner with putin is sick. all g20 leaders and spouses were invited by the chancellor of germany, press knew. no one is alleging the dinner is secret. the fake news is becoming more and more dishonest even a dinner arranged for top 20 leader is made citizen sister. >> no the dinner was cover. everybody knew what was going on. . it was for leaders and spouses. so, again, kind of off the point here anita. >> right, definitely. the dinner these are typical dinners dinners for leaders and spouses. i think it's even typical they get you up and talk to other leaders and spouses. what's not typical is an
hour-long conversation with someone who is all -- is the foekd of all this scrutiny here in the united states. the reports show that president trump got up out of his seat to go over to president putin who was sitting next to his which have melania trump the first lady. and just sat there and talked to them. it's really -- there are so many questions as you mentioned but really a lot of in comes down to, again it's a publicity problem for them. they didn't mention it. had they mentioned it earlier it probably wouldn't have been as big of a deal. during the obama administration they often mentioned when president obama talked to president putin just on the sidelines in a casual way because they knew we were interested in that. it's always of interest. they waited to talk about it, didn't acknowledge it. actually it came out earlier and i was one of the people as many other reporters at the white house were asking about it. they didn't acknowledge it until 7:00 p.m. then came out with a
lengthy statement before the tweets that basically explained the situation and then called the entire episode absurd, that why is this a big deal at all. >> anita all i was going to say it's a publicity problem nonetheless it's a state craft problem. >> right, i mean they just -- what keeps happening to them it is they didn't have a good day as you mentioned with health care. but what keeps happening is a good day or bad day, you know the end of the day and something comes out and they are sort of unable to deal with dsh deeshl with it hours later they deal with it. they are upset about this. this is -- they're outraged really that this -- they're calling -- they're saying this isn't even a second meeting. and so it -- there is policy behind it. there is a problem with the meeting and us not knowing what's in the meeting. but there is also a media problem, a publicity problem for them. >> ten minutes is a dinner conversation. an hour is a separate meeting by most people's standards. ken we have a new expression in
the language. which would make a great movie title, rolling disclosure. and here is what i mean. we now know speaking of the room where it happened there were eight people, at least thus far at the trump tower meeting. this is to anita earlier point a publicity problem so far. but the hill and mr. mueller can't be in love with rolling disclosure themselves. >> well, we see mueller in some ways reacting to the disclosure in realtime as we're finding out about it. and it's not -- let's be clear. it's not that the trump folks are revealing this information in drips and drabs. it's forced they are forced to acknowledge it or sometimes not acknowledge it when the press reveals it that's what you have in the situation today. where we have an eighth person identified, a representative of the agalarov family. it's worth pointing out the guy who brokered the meeting in the first place was also a representative of the agalarov
family, goldstone. the new name the guy who we've discovered today was in the meeting was a representative of the family in the u.s. doing business and real estate deals. it's notable that the family -- agalarov family, very powerful in russia, sent the representative because it's suggests that the other people there who were not necessarily representative of the family or didn't have any allegiance to the family that that the agalarovs didn't trust them. the plot thickens we have potentially rival factions. certainly different factions within russia that have a presence at the meeting that we learn more about that we don't still to this point know precisely what was said in this meeting or what the information that was sort of being dangled in front of the trump folks to a secure this meeting, the potentially damaging information on hillary clinton was. but we expect we're going to tint reporting on that expect more on that expect more of the rolling discussions.
>> ambassador no one is piling piling on but the trump administration did name a able and capable man to represent our country in moscow. john huntsman, the problem was they misspelled his name snt announcement kind of stepping on the announcement when news media pointed out the misspelling. i chiefly want to get your reaction to his appointment to your old job. >> well full disclosure i work at the atlantic counsel now where he is the chairman of the board. i have some limited experience with him and he is great a great statesman. he has shone that as ambassador to china earlier to singapore. he has had ha series of executive branch governments of course was governor of utah. sew has great experience and kind of a broad vision of our diplomacy. he is not a he shall rayen expert he know that is, doesn't know the language. but i think his china experience will prepare him for the challenges of dealing with the russians and dealing with shady
characters like this guy kavaldze who we discovered was in the meeting with donald trump jr. >> shady characters we've got a lot of. and anita while you're not one of them please talk about the status of the trump agenda and a reminder this is made in america week. >> it is made in america week. and somehow no one seems to be talking about it. the publishcy they've gotten on made in america is actually not been great because as as you've seen people have been talking about how. >> the trump pro. >> ivanka products and trump products are many of them not made in america. they've been getting questions about that. but they've been doing events every day like they do on the weeks, the theme weeks and they have been doing them but i haven't heard a lot of publishcy about them except for the trump organization products. and it's interesting because they say they can't talk about that. here they are promoting that. but they say any can't speak to the president's businesses.
>> with great thanks to all three of our guests in our initial panel and great congratulations to our friend ken for his new gig at the "new york times," token vogel to anita, ambassador alexander, thank you so much we'll go into the first break here and when we come back reaction to this. and the president saying he won't own obamacare's failure. we'll hear about all of it, a live interview with democratic senator amy klobuchar standing by to talk to us when "the 11th hour" continues. just like the people who own them, every business is different. but every one of those businesses will need legal help as they age and grow. whether it be help starting your business, vendor contracts or employment agreements. legalzoom's network of attorneys can help you every step of the way so you can focus on what you do. we'll handle the legal stuff that comes up along the way. legalzoom. legal help is here.
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i can tell you the republicans are not going to own it. we'll let obamacare fail and the democrats are come to us and they're going to say how do we fix it or come wup a new plan. >> a defeat for the president and a rare kind of thumping defeat for republican leader mitch mcconnell who is still pushing ahead with a repeal only effort next week. the problem is that doesn't have the votes. three republican senators have already come out in opposition. you may note something about all three of them. susan collins be shelley moore capito. lease say murkzy. skbr the senator amy klobuchar a member of the judiciary committee. senator i've noticed that female senators in the republican party have been what passes for profiles in courage in that chamber yet were not invited
anywhere near the process of getting the bill up for vote or failure. >> well it's interesting this started with just 13 men, not only were democrats not invited but really the american people weren't invited into the room. and now after many iterations of this bill two that didn't give enough support we are now back where they started with a repeal. and you already have senators all women shelly capito susan collins and lisa joining us and saying it makes no sense. it boots over 20 million people off of health care. and while i know the president is having them over to the white house, the entire republican caucus tomorrow for lunch, i don't think a tuna fish sandwich is going the change of minds of the three strong women. so we are where we began. and now the key is- i think chuck schumer said it pointedly today. open the door. let us in. i have said from the beginning
that the affordable care act was a beginning and not an end from the day it passed. and we need to do more to strengthen exchanges and bring down pharmaceutical prices for the american people. >> talk about the president's choice of language and his tone. and let's talk about a family and a in a port of your state i love up in the iron range, a working class family that has to make a choice between groceries between medical care or medicine for a child. and then they hear who is not going to own health care in washington. >> yeah, i really don't think they want to hear anymore finger pointing. the president had supporters in our state. a lot of them supported him because they thought he is going to approach this differently. but instead when you hear the finger pointing that's what they don't want to hear. they want to see us actually do something on pharmaceutical prices. and i have the bill with senator grassley to stop big pharma
companies from paying off generics. i've got a bill with john mccain to bring less expensive drugs from canada. we should unleash the power of 41 million seniors and have negotiation under medicare part d. something the president said he supported. you add that to the idea of stronger exchanges which helps a lot of people in rural america who depend on those exchanges. and you do that through many so of the ideas we have there. tim cain he is insurance. the cost sharing bill, those bills in the past have had republican support either in state legislatures like my own or from senators like susan collins on reinsurance. there are some things that we can do. but they have to make sure they open the door and let us in. >> let's turn the page to russia and as our friends at pbs my question is brought to you by the numbers, 78, 2 and 11. we know there were eight people
in the meeting at trump tower. there were two meeting was putin 11 days ago that we didn't know about. what this of list worries you? >> well all of it really. i mean the first -- the meeting -- the ever expanding clown carve the donald trump jr. meeting where it seems more and more russians were there. that's obviously something bob mueller is looking at and the senate judiciary committee has invited him to testify. and we'd like him to come before us as well as paul manafort and hear what happened. secondly, you have the fact that the president right going into that meeting, the g20 was already waveling on the fact that russia had hacked into our election by saying maybe it was other countries. then he left the meeting. one calling for a joint cyberunit with russia, which nearly every republican dismissed as a bad idea. then secondly his administration has been lobbying against the russian sanctions bill in the house of representatives.
so yes you wonder what happened at that dinner given what happened before it and what happened after it. >> senator amy klobuchar democrat of the state of minnesota thank you for joining us live tonight. >> it's great to be on thank you, brian. up next after the break two reporters on the remarkable comments from donald trump today and what in means for the would you say, the republican party, the future of what we were just talking about health care that's we we come right back. the opportunity of the year is back: the mercedes-benz summer event. get to your dealer today for incredible once-a-season offers, and start firing up those grilles. lease the gle350 for $579 a month at your local mercedes-benz dealer. mercedes-benz. the best or nothing.
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i'm not going to own it. irk tell you the republicans are not employing to own it. we'll let obamacare fail and then the democrats are coming to us and they're going to say how do we fix it? or how do we come wup a new plan. >> we repeated that to pennsylvania reason process it's striking to watch one politicking expert in the moments after that said on live television those were the most single remarks given by a president in his lifetime. president trump today at the white house let's talk about all of it robert costa back with us. national political reporter for are the "washington post" and moderator of. >> vivian salama. what about the president's tone and language and his relationship with this issue, robert? >> brian, the president is the standard bearer forea party that has rallied against the
affordable care act for nearly a decade now. but he didn't really -- if you talk to him and other senators, they knew that the base was not stewing as much for the repeal and replace as they have in past years. they wanted to get rid of the president obama signature law. but the appetite, the enthusiasm to really move this forward among conservatives and moderates just wasn't there. and they came face-to-face with that reality this week. >> rob, the language was striking in part because the expression, don't own it, is a term of art in politics usually kf confined to meetings usually not spoken in front of the customers. >> it's a vexing problem for republicans looking ahead to 2018. they know the base in some parts wants to have obamacare repealed but this law as we all know has taken root in many states. some of the fiercest defenders for the affordable care act have
been republican governors who want to ensure the medicaid funding promised under the law will keep coming to their states. and so they knew the democrats were going to seize on the issue in 2018 and run against republicans for disrupting the health care system thp you see the president trying to shrug off blame and and that's the sentiment. >> i already heard a trump surrogate tonight say call let's call it what it is a mitch mcconnell failure he's been lying to members of the congress. surrogates don't talk that way by accident. vivian i know you know the following but we want to take a moment before we talk and remind you and our audience that in light of today's kind of dark wording from the white house some presidents have used the white house and their job to cheer on the american people to
exhort the american people to be the best selves that's why this was such a contrast we'll watch this. >> we believe in social security. we believe in work for the unemployed. we believe in saving homes. cross our hearts and hope to die. we believe in all these things. >> we'll just let obamacare fail. we're not going to own it. >> we choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy but because they are hard. >> i'm not going to own it. >> ultimately the buck stops with me. as president i have a solemn responsibility to protect our nation and our people. >> i can tell you the republicans are not going to own it. >> so there you have it. and vivian, what by now is the president looking for, a win still or survival on this issue? >> he definitely wants a win. but president trump on the
health care issue has definitely opted for survival. and remember, this is one of several issues that president trump has repeatedly said that he inherited a mess. and so in is basically his way of expressing that. and you know sort of present terms in terms of how- what is happening today versus the previous administration and kind of how we led up to this moment. now the white house has two options. and president trump has two options. he could develop a concrete strategy to really repeal and replace and the white house seems adamant about the fact this is still a possibility they don't want to close the door to it or he can deflect and blame the democrats and some republicans as he did today. the latter strategy can only last so long voters are going to demand concrete changes and results. if the president wants to start claiming wins in this particular area, an area that's been so key to the republican agenda and the
republican party in general he is going to have to deliver on those issues. now one of the things that is really interesting to see is just on the president's attitude toward this whole issue in the last couple of days. remember he was in france last week and then he went to the u.s. women's open at a time where the health care vote was on the brink. a lot of people were saying why wasn't the president in washington to really rally behind the party and try to get those votes and get people on his side instead of being at the golf tournament up in snuj? it lends to the question of whether he was that dedicated to the issue to begin with or whether he wants to push it aside because he realizes that it's -- there is no getting around it and he just wants to move on to something like tax cuts or any of the other things he keeps on promiseding voters. it's interesting to see where he stands right now. and he keeps on saying maybe we'll win maybe we won't. and he expresses disappointment. but as far as actually taking responsibility and blame, we
haven't seen that yet not on health care for sure. >> what does it say about the nose counters. >> they're -- the white house lobbyists on the hill while the president is having din we are seven republicans last night minutes after the meal i believe the two fatal defectens came across the wire and the bill was dead. >> it's so revealing of the disconnect throughout the entire process. you're right, brian on monday night they're having rib eye in the blue room, veteran republicans senators sitting with the president. senator danes from montana was there said the president was talking more about bastille day and the trip to paris than getting into the nitty-gritty of the health care snoerkss because there was assumption in the room and elsewhere that leader mcconnell would get it done but there were all the swirling forces beyond the nose counting, brian, beyond the details of the bill about the expansion of medicaid being liked by both
republicans and democrats, the law's popularity all the forces rather than the inside game ended up mattering more. >> and vivian i know you're in the prediction business. but what's the win going to be for this team? >> well the president really has been emphasizing his counterterrorism strategy, defeating isis, going forward with you know his operations in syria and whatnot. that seems to be something he has put a lot of focus in at the moment. obviously coming back from par it's raft week where there was a key discussion. he is trying to deflect on the issues. but domestic policy is taking a hit they need to to have something to deliver to the voterers saying we're fighting for you the american people until they tlifr something big like health care, tax reform it's an uphill battle. >> brian real quick i don't like to predict but based on my reporting trade. in an administration where legislation is secular on theic
and almost impossible to pats my sources tell me the president will focus on trade maybe have a trade war as a sorts to make sure the states went for him in 2016 with michigan, pennsylvania, ohio stick with him. >> we will watch your by lines. great thanks another break for us. and when we come back our political panel weighs in on all of it.
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further. with us tonight, heather mcgee back on the broadcast president of dem os action a progressive group. david jolly former republican congress from the sta it of florida. david because you were in the business i have to ask you what did you make of the president's tone and language, choice of words today. >> i think it's something that a lot of republicans might rally behind, this notion that the democrats own obamacare. there is something intuitive about it. but the reality is republicans control the ship of state right now. and eventually it will catch up with them if they fail to solve some of the structural kalk challenges of obamacare. brian the real issue tonight for republicans this is a party that is deeply divided. we have lived through in six years the tea party versus the establishment now trump and antitrump. this is a deeply divided party that controls all of washington. but is searching for a leader because it's not in the president and we haven't found
one on capitol hill either. >> heather you're not here to represent the entire democratic party. but i'll ask you for the the subset you know best in your policy area. and that is what's in this for the democrats if the republicans indeed quote don't want to own it. >> well i think what has happened here is that the republicans have really revealed the true stripes, including to their base. the fundamental fact is here that americans are struggling. we have the worst economic inequality and insecurity we have seen in over a century. and health care is the one concrete place where government has been actually able to make a demonstrable difference in people's lives over the past few years. and so the idea that republicans would sort of gleefully try to take away health care from tens of millions of people to give a huge tax break to the wealthiest has really i think allowed the democrats to say in is whose
side they're on. they're not on your side. we are going to fight to give your family health care and to protect what you won and you've gained. >> congressman, a subset of what heather was saying using the word gleefully. when people hear the washington speak of we're not going to own it. as i said earlier the families who have a choice between groceries and medical care or medicine for a child, in is going to cause deep anxiety when they hear people like us talk about repeal now, worry about replacement later. no, no, no we're talking about health care. >> sure but repeal now will never happen. understand when donald trump says let it wither on the vine, the great irony is that he is going to penlz the very constituency that supports him obamacare if it lives for many more years will include medicaid expansion. it will include coverage for high risk pools like those with preexisting conditions. the very people that are punished by let going wither on
the vine are those low-risk healthy families who have seen premiums going up. donald trump is trying to prove a point but the reality is it's going to come at the cost of the very constituency of center light republicans and that is the ignorance and the nonsense of this president's frankly tweet storm today but also his policy position. >> heather it falls on me to steer the ship of state or at least this broadcast into the russia question. and the russia matter. what worries you most that there are now eight known people at the meeting at trump tower or that 11 days ago our president apparently held two meetings, no record of the second, with the russian president? >> you know, honestly brian what worries me most not what the trump family and a bunch of connected russians did months ago or days ago. it's really about what the republican party has and has not done. we should have very low
expectations about donald trump and his family and russia at this moment. we're all just waiting for the shoe to fall to really show conclusively what many of us feel like the evidence is already out there. what is so worrisome is the relationship that the republican party now has to democracy. because they have had a choice from the beginning to put country over party. and they haven't. and i think that when you really connect the dots between the way that republicans have shone so much disrespect for our democracy in terms of willing knits to suppress the vote make it harder for working class people to go and vote, for young people to go and vote, it really shows that there is a disrespect for the democracy, that they really do love power more than they love the country and very idea of democracy. and i think it's really telling that right now we have got this sham commission that's going out
and looking for fraud, so-called voter fraud by noncitizens when we have a known -- known fact that noncitizens foreign powers have actually committed election fraud, hacking propaganda, and fake news possibly in inclusion with the president of the united states and his family. >> congressman do the impossible you have 30 seconds to tell me how and where hether is wrong. >> brian on the trump putin meeting today, the story is not the meeting. who cares if he met for two hours or three hours. it is a reflection of the fact that the american people don't trust their president right now. ronald reagan and goesh chof took a 44 meeting a private walk in geneva in 1985 without the press we didn't distrust president raeg reagan it wasn't the private meeting today it's not that it's private meeting between trump and putin it's that we don't trust the cht of the united states to handle something of aggravate concern to the american people and that is the trump/russia issue. >> our great thanks to the two
guests heather! gee david, woe like to invite you both back on another break for us tonight coming up about our next segment and go on amazon look up the number within best seller in the country, right now, we have the author of that book in our next segment. it's about steve bannon. that when we continue. there's nothing more important to me than my vacation. so when i need to book a hotel, i want someone who makes it easy. booking.com gets it. and with their price match, i know i'm getting the best price every time. visit booking.com.
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the third broadly line of work is the deconstruction of the administrative state. if you look at these cabinet appointees, they were selected for a reason. the deconstruction. the way the progressive left runs, if they can't get it passed, they will put it in a regulation in an agency that will all be deconstructed. >> the often discussed, rarely heard enigmatic white house strategist steve bannon laying out how he wants to dismantle, again that phrase, the government's administrative
state, still misunderstood by people. a new book details the relationship between bannon and president trump. there it is. it is called devil's bargain. it was released today and this is impressive. it is already number one best seller on amazon. the author, joshua green. after an exhausting initial day is with us during the shank of the evening. he is also the senior national correspondent for bloomberg business week. congratulations to you. how is this anything more? >> because trump won't allow himself to have puppet strings that somebody else will pull. and bannon is less svengali than idealogue. somebody with deep rich motivations that have funneled
themselves into motivations. >> you used the word idealogue. if the president isn't an idealogue, what in him wanted to hand over that part of, okay, you tell me how we should do this and what part of bannon wanted to hitch his wagon to donald trump? >> i don't think it was bannon telling trump what to do. i think bannon flattered trump. he recognized that trump has these populist impulses and said you're not a clown. you're not a punk line. i have this whole intellectual infrastructure. he used to tell trump that trump was part of this global uprising. it fed trump's ego. you can see that in the anecdotes in the book about how trump fed on bannon's input the same way a boxer feeds on the pep talk he gets from the corner man in the ring. that worked to brilliant effect in the campaign. it hand worked as well in the white house. but bannon is a guy who understands or understood how to connect with trump. >> there's a point in the book where you touch on donald
trump's ratings in the apprentice as measures with his popularity with certain ethnic groups. >> one of the fascinating discoveries that i had researching the book, if you flash back ten years when donald trump was an entertainer on the apprentice, he was more popular with black and hispanic voters than white voters. that made them darling of corporate america. toyota, home depot, mcdonald's. everybody wants a piece of him because they was multicultural person. i talked with the ceo that does ads for fortune 500 companies. she said trump was wonderful. he presented blacks and hispanics as sbreentrepreneurs, still on prime time television they were portrayed as gangsters
or entertainers or all the stereo times we remember. instead of running as a big ten open party candidate, he burned that all down. the birther, the far right of the republican party. >> what was steve bannon ever doing on the national security council? >> no idea. but bannon was at the outset of the administration, very influential. pretty much wrote his own ticket. i was told, trump never said, i want you on the security council. bannon just did it until he got shoved out. he has grand yoss ideas, not just about trade and immigration but about changing the whole global system of government and trying to reach back to almost a pre enlightenment time. driven by a very conservative conservative catholicism. i get into the roots of that in the book including the oddest
character. ban object has ant intellectual who practiced occult iism given everything we know about steve bannon and what he said about islam and radical jihad, it is enough to make your brain hurt. >> here's the book, number one in america. the author has been kind enough to stop by and talk to us. it is out today.
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it's been 19 days since the last on camera white house briefing. the last time the white house addressed the american people so we could see them was june 29th. today the fox news chief correspondent john roberts left in the middle of today's off camera briefing. >> john roberts is bored today. he is headed out. >> if it were on camera, he might not. >> roberts took to twitter to say he left the room to appear on live cable television. and this takes a little bank shot to point out, but think of it this way. if the briefing had been live on camera, he wouldn't have found it necessary to appear on cable television, because it's likely all the cable networks would have been covering the briefing
live. this current effort is to make the whole notion of an on camera briefing seem rare and less like the norm. the norm, of course, we have traditionally been allowed to see the daily briefing on camera. that's our broadcast for tonight. audio and video. thank you for being here with us. good night from msnbc headquarters in new york. the republican effort to kill obamacare, that effort appeared to die a hard and unexpectedly sudden death. this time during our show last night. well, today, the republicans came back, they tried two separate times to bring it back, to revive that effort. both of those efforts appear to have also failed today. that mea