tv The Rachel Maddow Show MSNBC July 29, 2017 3:00am-4:00am PDT
but also donald trump and donald trump's campaign, and there was a real possibility in one of these cases that he could end or certainly people around him maybe even president trump could end up having to answer questions for the lawyers for the protesters' lawyers. it's not like a harmless thing. >> not wise. thank you so much. curtis lee, jonathan swan, jessica chambers. ken vogel, ali velshey. super pabl. that's hardball for now. thanks for being with us. all new with chris hayes is right now. tonight on "all in." obama care is alive, and the white house is in chaos. >> get over here. >> just hours after president trump's greatest failure to date, his chief of staff, is out. >> reince is a superstar. >> and replaced with a jonathan. >> john kelly, one of our real stars. >> tonight a new low for the trump presidency afternoon last
night's victory for the resistance. where the white house goes from here. >> they should have approved health care last night, but you can't have everything. >> and how murkowski, collins, and john mccain may have saved health care. >> this is clearly a disappointing moment. >> "all in" starts right now. good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. reince priebus is out. anthony scaramucci is ascended, and the trump administration is reeling. after one of the most dramatic votes in recent senate history, brought an edge at least for now to the gop's seven-year effort to repeal obama care. we'll revisit that historic moment shortly, but, firts, today's big news. >> he is replacing his chief of staff, reince priebus with homeland security secretary secretary john kelly. >> reince is a good man. john kelly will do a fantastic
job. general kelly has been a star, done an incredible job thus far, respected by everybody. a great, great american. reince priebus, a good man. thank you very much. >> john kelly leaves his post as homeland security secretary where he oversaw the trump administration's draconian crackdown on immigration. it will now occupy the most powerful staff position in the white house. there's no replace am as of yet for that homeland security post. the president first announced the news on twitter where he offered kind words from priebus. i would like to thank reince priebus for his service and dedication to his country. we accomplish a lot together, and i am proud of him. a source close to priebus tells nbc news he resigned last night, making his tenure 190 days. the shortest for any non-interim chief of staff in the white house. a move coming months after a report that the president was considering firing priebus, and less than 48 hours after the new white house communications director anthony scaramucci directed the fbi to investigate
priebus for leaking a scaramucci financial disclosure forum that was, in fact, a publicly available forum. scaramucci, of course, went on that profanity-laced tyrade against priebus in an interview published yesterday in the new yorker, describing priebus as a paranoid schizophrenic. the "wall street journal" reports that the president was dismissive of mr. priebus for not returning fire. given the choice between the two men, president trump chose scaramucci. tonight reince wants everyone to know there's no hard feelings. >> this isn't a situation where there's a bunch of ill will feelings. this is, i think, good for the president. i think it's smart for him to pick general kelly. i'm always going to be a trump fan. i'm on team trump. he has the best political instincts. hang on a second. he knows, i think, intuitively when things need to change. i've seen it now for a year and a half on this wild ride with
the president that i would love being a part of. he intuitively determined that it was time to do something differently, and i think he is right. >> staff writer at "the atlantic." owe lia, you wrote earlier that basically everyone inside and outside the white house had come to dislike reince priebus. why is that? >> well, i wouldn't say everyone, but there are certainly people within the white house who have not liked him who have disliked him for a long time, who just like republican national committee figures more broadly, who are anti-establishment types. i think partly it's that with donald trump he is never going to look inward to blame himself for anything that goes wrong, and he is likely to point the finger at somebody else and that somebody else happened to be reince priebus. we just had this huge event last night with health care, which was an embarrassment, i think, for this administration, and yet another failure legislatively, and i think probably that was the last straw when it comes to
reince priebus. i think the timeline is mixed up. everyone is sort of reporting different things about what exactly this became the plan, but it seems pretty clear that it was -- there was a lot of build-up. from the very beginning in this administration, people were fighting with reince priebus. remember early on there were a lot of reports about steve bannon and reince priebus not getting along and not being able to work together, and they actually came out on the record in new york magazine to talk to me and pretend like they were best friends, and they told me that they -- >> i'm glad you said pretend because i was going to interject that if you didn't. >> they told me when i got them at the beginning of the interview they told me they had just finished giving each other back massages and that they would fall asleep texting each other. they did this whole performative two-man show to me and other reports reporters. i believe they also did this with the washington post. the massage thing was pretty special, i felt. there has been a lot of conflict with reince priebus.
>> that -- you are saying is par for the course. a bunch of things are going on here. to olivia's point, look, actually firing your chief of staff after humiliating legislative defeats i have ever seen, which was last night's senate vote. that's not unwarranted. you si that trump has a it group of mini-trumps. in comes scaramucci who just seems to take that past any possible imaging. >> i mean, he -- the reason that i think that he probably has a bright future in trump land, at least for the foreseeable future is because he has figured out how to channel donald trump. he flatters him. he slavishly loyal to him.
he is also like him. when trump says he surrounds himself with the best people, he means people like himself. reince priebus was never like donald trump. i mean, he was added to this white house and given a prominent perch largely as a concession to the republican establishment and to the republican congress in an attempt to use him to kind of push through legislation and bridge the two worlds. the trump world and the rest of washington republicans. you know, you're right. reince priebus of the one or one of the people who told donald trump that he should go for health care first, and spend all of his political capital and all of his time coming into the white house on health care and it didn't work. he wasn't necessarily wrong to fire reince. my question, though, looking forward is this new chief of staff somebody who, by the way, doesn't know a lot of republicans in congress, doesn't know a lot of the republican establishment? is he going to make things better? is he going to somehow advance the republican legislative agenda that trump wants to
advance? i don't know. it's not at all clear to me this is going to fix that problem. >> well, the question of what he wants to advance itself is a little odd, right? olivia, you have a situation now to mckay's point. sean spicer and reince priebus were both connections to the institutional rnc. the sort of actual institutional republican party, an organization to which he has a very strained, complicated, strange, alien relationship. basically conquered that entity. he is the most important republican in the country, and yet, the party itself and its agenda is a bit at arm's length. one question is does this signal -- i saw john harwood, my colleague reporting that one ally saying that he is going to turn against essentially ryanism. there's a big question about is this president going to take a new tact domestically and wedge. he went down the line with gop agenda. does that change having gotten rid of reince and sean spicer? >> possibly. certainly they had fewer links, fewer solid relationships to
establishment republicans now. donald trump, we have to remember, he doesn't have an ideology. his ideology is donald trump, and so i think he is very much influenced by the people who he surrounds himself with. you know, it's interesting. obviously people who are sharing a lot of anthony scaramucci's older tweets on friday and over the weekend after he was hired, this is someone who is also all over the political map. it's going to be interesting to see, you know, how kelly and how scaramucci and how anyone else brings in and influences what they choose to focus on policy-wise because, you know, so far it has been pretty much the status quo in terms of things that republicans are interested in in it what they believe establish-wise, but going forward, if none of them are around, i think, you know, it's whoever -- there's a saying about trump that the last person to talk to him is the one who wields the most influence, and i think that will probably turn out to be true in this instance. >> there's also this -- just a spectacle of this humiliation, which has become a theme. it was a theme from the very first debate. this is something that i think
the president has -- he has a genuine talent for attempting to humiliate people. genuine talent for bringing out the worst of people. those are things that he is sort of indisputable excellent at doing. to have priebus sort of publically this way. the details in the "wall street journal" that he -- we know from the reporting, he likes watching his aides fight each other. gets a kick out of that. it's amusing to him. he likes to cultivate that atmosphere. he looks back -- that was the final straw. does that ring true to you? >> oh, absolutely. so many people who have worked for trump, served trump have told me that trump gleefully and deliberately fosters an atmosphere that one person described to me as the hunger games. he wants his aides to bludgeon each other to death to prove their supremacy and to win trump's affection. he enjoys that.
he thinks -- he does believe that it brings out the best outcome because he thinks that the best person will eventually win, but, i mean, i also think we have to just take stock of the fact that donald trump, the day that the major republican legislative initiative was on the verge of either passing or imploding, donald trump was gleefully egging on a public knife fight between two of his top aides. that's how he spent that day. >> well, that's -- >> it's just that he is trying to figure out who is the best and will come out on top. it's also that donald trump is easily bored, and he -- >> that is a great -- that is a great point and a genuine revelation about how this country is functioning right now. i'm serious. >> you're welcome. >> he is easily bored, and he likes to preside over chaos. he is entertained by it. when people stop entertaining him, i think with their fights and he moves on to the next one, and i think that we can sort of assess a lot of what's going on
in this white house with all of the so-called palace intrigue. it is so true that it was -- it was -- i have never seen anything like it. the entirety of the health care process, which was essentially pulled off like a heist, where mitch mcconnell is going to try to sort of sneak into the bank and crack the vault and get the health care out before anyone could catch them, and while they were doing that as opposed to publicly presenting the plan or saying affirmatively why they were good. the president who had no obvious interest in nor understanding of what was happening at a policy level, was both picking a fight with his dem who he clearly wants to fire so he can -- and perhaps himself. in the case of egging on a knife
fight, a profane knife fight between two aides. this is what he was doing in the most monumental day of the fate of the domestic policy agenda of the party of which he is the head. >> he stuck in the white house right now walking around in unfamiliar surroundings. he is somebody who likes familiar surroundings, who likes to feel at home. he went home a lot during the campaign. he would fly home on hours just to sleep in his own bed. he is in this strange place in a strange city that is not his own to which he is not native. he probably misses new york. i'm speculating, but that seems likely, and i think, you know, he is just looking for ways to keep himself occupied. it's not going to be through policy. certainly. he didn't -- people reported that he did not know the difference between medicare and medicaid. certainly he is looking for other outlets for kind of how antsy he must be, and he can't -- he cannot act the same -- exactly the same way he did on the campaign. i'm sure he has a lot more
people telling him now that he has to act presidential, and even though he does still say crazy things on twitter, he will attack morning show hosts, say, for plastic surgery or other things. i think he still -- he is not quite at the level of campaign donald trump in that respect, does and i think it's probably making him look for other areas where he can be entertained. >> there's also the fact that we have never -- we have not had, thankfully, any major crisis that this white house had to negotiate, about the one always has to think about what that happens, when that hapsz. thank you both for your time tonight. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> i'm joined now by contributing editor for "the atlantic." with me also former republican congressman david jolly. norm, as someone who has been writing about the structural nature of the republican party as an entity in american politics for several decades now, and about how unique it is and the sort of nature in which we've gone off the rails, do you think there's a connection between the kind of chaos and
dysfunction we've seen legislatively from a standpoint that culminated last night and what we've seen from trump and the white house. >> over, sure, there is. while a lot of this preceded trump, in many ways provided the ground work for trump to emerge, this attack on government and on everybody in government that's been going on at least since newt gingrich came to washington, i think there's little doubt that the dysfunction in congress, the fact that you have a republican party that is not really focussing solving problems and trying to manage its way through with a large group of radicals and no moderates to speak of anymore. this is all connected. you know, i keep coming back to the term. resurrected now. government by the least competent among us. the more congress is unable to do anything, both ryan and mcconnell failing at passing things on to trump and what they had hoped was simply that they would have a president who would
just sign anything put in front of him. if they can't put things in front of him, they're going to be under attack, and trump is going to go after them as well. >> the most remarkable thing, and the most revelatory came down to the moment in which a bunch of republican senators said the bill before us is a disaster and a fraud. i'm quoting directly. we're going to vote for it as long as you promise the bill we're voting for doesn't become law. i thought to myself. you know what that is, they miss barack obama because what they all miss -- they all miss voting for stuff that the president can sign, could veto. they miss essentially playing legislator as opposed to actually being one, and this is them attempting to role play their way back in time. that's not how it works anymore, and you saw last night they're not ready to actually legislate. >> last night was a humiliating
moment for -- that was equally bizarre. the president then went to twitter and said, yes, please, i drae. pass something that you actually don't want to be ep acted into law. we woke up this morning a deeply divided party. understand, for seven years, republicans have promised this. this is a deeply divided party. members of congress are going to hear it from their conservative base. to norm's point and yours as well, chris, we have been divided in different variations now for easily a decade. at one point it was tea party versus establishment. now it's trump world versus tea party, and there is no place for center right if you want to call them establishment or not. there is no place for center right republicans anymore in this current party. frankly, what we saw last night was the inability of this president, a republican president, to lead the party and lead the nation on one of the most critical issues we face and one he had promised to reform on day one. >> i want to press on the nature of that failure because the nature of the failure to me is all interconnected. the only reason the way that
donald trump can win a republican primary was if enough voters didn't care about policy mastery. i would watch debates where he would be up there with governors. these are governors who my own politics and world view are quite different than. say scott walker, for instance. you would watch them. there would be parts where there is a debate on planned parenthood defunding, and every one of those governors could tell you with tremendous granular detail the in's and out's of how they went about, say, defunding planned parenthood. donald trump could not do that. the voters chose someone who didn't have that, and so it all seems to me to kind of come back around. last night was the product of the choices that are being made by a base that don't really seem to care in some deep sense about governing. do you agree, norm? >> absolutely, i agree. i think what you had was a republican party and it goes back certainly in this case to when obama became president, using for midterm victories in 2010 and 2014 a set of themes that it's all corrupt. it's all awful.
it can't get any worse than this. trump comes along and says what the hell have you got to lose? we'll blow things up. you had a lot of voters that said go ahead and do that. you had a group of people in congress who were not prepared to make a pivot with policy ideas that they had along with a president, unlike any we've ever had, who has zero knowledge of policy and no interest in developing any knowledge. >> quickly, david. there's some talk that the president is now going to pivot against the gop congress and essentially run against them. do you think that's likely? >> your conservative base is going to blame ryan. the purge you're seeing in the white house of priebus and spicer, the other establishment republicans, this president's only path forward is to go back to what he knows, which is to surround himself by those who believe in trump as the person, not as trump as the leader of the party. >> norm, david, thank you both for joining me. we'll have much more on today's white house shake-up. capping off a disastrous
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>> let obama care implode and then do it. i was right. >> president trump spoke today in long island. that was just hours after senate republicans failed to pass even the skinny repeal, as they called it, of obama care. the president's speech today, four members of law enforcement, centered on depictions of terrifying violence, as he often falls back on. the president also praised his homeland security secretary john kelly who just hours later he announced as his new chief of staff. joik me now republican congressman lee zeldon, first district of new york, who
traveled with the president today. i believe that's -- you were in territory that's ajoining your district today. you had a sort of hometown crowd today. the president once referred to the white house as a smoothly running machine. would you say that's the case? >>. >> well, hopefully by putting an experienced general, it can become one. i would say right now they're in a transition where hopefully identifying strengths and weaknesses of those that were there and possibly additional changes, they could get to the point where therl smooth running machines. i don't know if they're there at this moment. >> it seems from people around the president that he blames paul ryan and reince priebus, and i think probably blames people like you and other folks in congress for the failure of health care. it's not his fault. he always says they, which i think is interesting. they've been trying to do it for seven years. he hasn't been doing it. do you think it is reince priebus's and paul ryan's and your fault? >> well, i mean, i spoke to the president about this today, and he tweeted as well about, you
know, where he puts the blame of three republicans and 48 democrats in his opinion, and, you know, i had a conversation days ago with a senator, and i asked, do you have three or more moderate senators in your conference who just won't vote for any repeal no matter what it looks like, and that senator said yes. i wasn't terribly surprised by what happened earlier this morning. i was told yesterday that it was going to go a little bit different. senator mccain then changed his vote after that. >> so you thought -- wait a minute. that's interesting. you were told yesterday they had the votes? >> i was under the impression that they had the votes. i didn't think it was going to be much more than a tie-breaking vote by the vice president. >> of course. >> but i wasn't expecting it to go down by one.
whether you are a conservative republican senator like mike lee, ted cruz, rand paul or a moderate senator like cassidy, shelly moore capito, dean heller, they were trying to move the process along, but, you know, this obviously wasn't what i think the large majority of congressional wanted to see get done as the final product. it wasn't the final product. >> right. >> the president talking in front of police officers talking about how police officers treat suspects who, of course, have not been convicted of a crime and are presumed innocent under the constitution. here's what he had to say. >> when you see these thugs being thrown in the back of a paddy wagon, you just see them thrown in, roughed, i said please don't be too nice. like when you guys put somebody
in the car, and you are protecting their head, you know, the way you put your hand over -- like don't hit their head, and they've just killed somebody. don't hit their head. i said you can take the hand away. okay? >> do you support the president's call for police brutality? >> no. i wouldn't say that -- the president is coming to an area where we have people who -- i have my own constituents. the high profile murder of four by ms-13 that brought a.j. sessions here a few months ago. two of them were my constituents. two were in congressman king's district. they were murdered by machetes. the nature of what we are going through right now is tearing apart families. it's -- >> those crimes are indisputably horrible. anyone who sees them will think they are. is it okay even in context to that to instruct police officers to engage in illegal criminal activity, which is assault or police brutality? >> right.
yeah. you know, just finishing the thought to answer that question is while it is deeply emotional what's going on, it's very important for our law enforcement to be following their rules, the laws, because people are innocent until proven guilty. we have a process here in our country to insure that people right to counsel. what's interesting, though, is when dealing with ms-13, we have people who are, you know, illegal on many different thoughts, and that whole issue is highly charged, but it is the best practice of all of our law enforcement to be following the local rules and regulations and understanding people are innocent until proven guilty. >> this is what the suffolk county pd said. strict rules. violation of those rules are treated ek treatmently seriously. was it important for him to say that? >> no. i mean, i definitely have a different style than the president. >> was that appropriate? >> i wouldn't have said that -- >> to tell police officers to
engage in brutality? >> you know, i -- i don't -- i can't agree with that. >> was it appropriate for the police officer to applaud? >> i didn't know i was going to be here to referee this one sentence of the speech. i mean, they really got into a whole lot of really important issues. >> but congressman, you can understand -- you know who freddy gray is, right? >> sure. >> okay. his spine was snapped in the back of a police van, possibly because he was treated roughly. you can understand how if, say, his family members were to see this speech, the president of the united states,ic maing jokes about treating prisoners roughly and seeing police officers applaud, you can understand how that would really be hurtful to those people, right? >> sure. i would also say that there are a whole lot of people who watch this speech who live in my area who are very pleased that the president is taking the aggressive approach that he is on combatting ms-13 because they
lost their son as a result of an attack with a machete. >> the question is there -- >> everyone can -- >> the key point is there is a question between one and the other, right? i think what seems important as someone who is a lawmaker or someone who is a president and enforcing the law, is understanding that engaging in protecting people from ms-13 and prosecuting crimes, right, does not necessitate the police engaging in extra judicial violence. that seems like an important line to establish, and that one doesn't have anything to do with the other, because we're a nation of laws, and we pursue people like ms-13 lawfully. >> it's one of those particular questions where, you know, it's kind of impossible to be -- you can't play devil's advocate. again, law enforcement has to follow their local regulations. they have to follow their laws. people are innocent until proven guilty. i would say that there is an emotion that is felt when -- >> i respect that. >> yeah. when there is a killer who, you
know, just murdered someone with a machete that, you know, we're going either not in this country legally and that goes on, and we're worried about making sure that they don't bang their head, but one of the reasons why you set those standards is that you don't want anyone to take matters into their own hands, and then you have an issue that becomes more complicated. i mean, i get it. it's impossible to argue the other side of it, and if i was up there, i would have said it, but, you know, there was so much more to this speech, and also so much more to the back story of what we're going through here, and something police sent out their tweet afterwards, you know, to reiterate what their policy is, whereby i'm sure their people will get the message. >> i want to play these crimes, obviously, that have been committed there are horrifying. we should also be clear that violence that gangs like ms-13, which was started in the united states, exported back to el salvador from americaners pro prisons have wreaked unbelievable pain and suffering.
these are groups that have really left a long toll of violence. the president describing what it's like in the district add joining yours. to get your point about the broader themes of the speech. take a listen. >> since january 16, think of this. ms-13 gang members have brutally murdered 17 beautiful young lives in this area on long island alone. they beat them with clubs. they slashed them with machetes, and they stabbed them with knives. they have transformed peaceful parks and beautiful quiet neighborhoods into blood-stained killing fields. >> given how horrific these crimes are, and they really have been horrific, and it has been concentrated geographically, but do you think about the place you live and the place that you
represent, the add jojoining ar as blood-stained killing fields. is that the place you reside? >> when these incidents take place, they're at that moment absolutely. these are -- i love long island. this is our home. i wouldn't want to live anywhere else. especially this time of year. we have a lot of people who come visit us. the weather is beautiful. for those that are watching and want a good place to vacation. at that moment when you are outside of that bar and there was a small skirmish inside that results in someone taking a knife and basically ripping out -- i don't want to say it on the show, but what happened one of the other incidents that happened, you know, and it's not -- they don't use guns if many cases because they don't want too quick of a death, and they want other people watching what happens. you know, at that moment it's just happening too much, and
it's also human trafficking. it's drug trafficking. gang-rape. we talk about the murders, but we also don't talk about all the other stuff that's going on as well. >> i really appreciate you taking the time to matter. thank you for sticking around. >> thanks, chris. >> all right. next, the dramatic scenes from last night's vote. gasps on the floor. the staredown. all the reactions. we're going to break the whole ding thing down for you. you don't want to miss it next. i'm everything. i'm from all nations. i would look at forms now and wonder what do i mark? because i'm everything. and i marked other. discover the story only your dna can tell. order your kit now at ancestrydna.com. olay regenersit shatters livthe competitionype? big hype. big price. big deal.
>> immediately democrats rose one after the other to speak out against the bill and the idea of jamming it through the senate overnight. after mcconnell first introduced the bill, just one republican senator would take to the floor for the gop. that was senator mike enze of wyoming, who intended to hold the floor at all cost. >> does the senator yield the question? >> disregarding -- >> i think this is under my time. >> if i could just respectfully
ask the chairman since we have only had this bill for an hour, we have a number of senators who want to speak, and i just would respectfully ask if there's any time that we will have between now and the vote to make any comments since we just have had the bill for a very short amount of time and we'll be voting on, and we'll obviously have millions of americans. >> well, i think the answer that i gave was perhaps your time might be better spent taking a look at the bill. vice president pence arrived. the first vote of the night began at 20 minutes after midnight. the last lever democrats could pull, which was a request to send the bill to committee for debate. now, that vote would certainly fail, and it did. but here's the thipg. even with all the votes counted, for that first vote, mcconnell kept that first vote open. talking the vice president pence on the floor. it was becoming clear he was stalling. nearby john mccain was talking to two senators who had criticized the bill. suz app collins and lisa murkowski. then pence was talking to
mccain. mcconnell did not have the votes, is and the vice president was trying to change that. he kept the vote open for over an hour. the clearest foreshadowing happened shortly after 1:00 a.m. when mccain walked over to a crowd of democrats. they were joking around and smiling. mccain even put his arm around dianne feinstein. collins voted no. mccain didn't answer when his name was called. he walked in seconds later and stood in front of mcconnell and asked for the clerk's attention. >> mr. peters. >> as buzz feed noted, you could look at this one moment like a renaissance painting, what each person was doing when that third republican vote was passed to kill the bill. something several democrats have told all in they did not know what would happen for sure until they witnessed it. bernie sanders nudging senator jeanne shaheen the vote was
coming. amy and bob casey on their feet waiting in anticipation. and then brown slapping the desk. elizabeth warren leaning to see what would happen, and then unable to resist cheering for mccain's vote. minority leader chuck schumer, look at that, trying to quiet his exuberant colleagues as the audible gasps and smaterrings of applause. majority leader mitch mcconnell, arms folded, staring at mccain, watching him walk up the floor knowing the bill was dead. as the crowds outside would find out seconds later. [ cheering ] >> after that vote leader mcconnell addressed the senate saying it's time to move on and acknowledging the defeat.
>> this is, know, clearly a disappointing moment. we worked hard, and everybody on this side can certainly attest to the fact that we work really hard to try to develop a consensus for a better way forward. yes, this is a disappointment. a disappointment, indeed. >> joining me now senator jeff murkly of oregon. senator, what was it like to be in that senate chamber last night? >> it was incredible amount of drama because what we understood was that it was essentially a tie, and the health care for 16 million people was going to depend upon one hand movement. john mccain's hand. was it thumbs up or thumbs down? >> so you had an indication while you were talking among your colleagues, you knew that susan collins and lisa murkowski were no's. you needed one more vote, and there was an indication that had been sent to you that you understood that mccain might be a no. do you know that walking into the senate chamber? >> we knew it was in question.
we knew that the arizona governor had talked to him. we knew he had given a speech who said this process is not the right process. he had voted to get on to the bill, and he had indicated some willingness to send it to a conference committee. it really was hanging in the balance. then on the floor the vice president comes out on the floor and instead of taking the seat, he goes to talk to john mccain. that's a good sign. then the vice president disappears. that's not such a good sign. then the vice president comes back and goes out with john mccain probably to hold a conference, maybe to talk to the president, and then we were really worried. it was right down to the last moment. >> so you're describing -- i was watching the same scene. i wasn't in the room. i was drawing basically the same inferences as you just described, meaning that you were watching this unfold in realtime, trying to draw clues from all this like everyone else was. >> yes. in the middle of it, john mccain came over to the democratic
side. four or five of us huddled around him, and he had a question about the third rule. that is, we were contesting or potentially contesting the last section of the eight-page bill saying it didn't seem to fit the rules. we told him we would set that aside. he asked some questions about whether we would be willing to proceed to the defense authorization act and facilitate that so that we didn't have a long drawn out mark-up of that act on the floor. we said we were happy to do that. that felt pretty positive, and he -- it sounded like he was about to go with us, but we still weren't 100% sure. >> how did you and the democratic colleagues feel last night when this was all over? >> tremendous relief. we have been engaged with grassroots america saying, hey, we have to work with you because you have the ability to say what is really going on in the ground to your republican senators. the expansion of medicaid is working really well. the exchange has empowered hundreds of thousands in your state to get health care. the health care bill of rights
makes a lot of sense, and that blowing all of this up really would be a terrible thing to do. we needed the citizens in every state to tell their senators that. we needed the health care stake holders to say that. we contacted governors in these states to have them convey that. still, what you saw was this solid determination to get something passed even if it hurt the people of america. it was a real battle, and a huge relief that we aren't going to blow up health care, and now we're just hoping that our republican colleagues will finally say, okay, enough with the politics. we know things need to be fixed. we will work with you. democrats have had a list of things that need to be improved. i'm sure that republicans have some. let's work together to make this system work better. >> is that an actual -- senator mccain is flying back for chemo and further treatment for brain cancer, which means his vote is not on the table for the rest of august. i think it's unlikely that mcconnell could move anything on
this particularly for the rest of the month. i guess the question is how confident are you that this is not -- that we've seen the end of this kind of unilateral push on this piece of legislation? >>. >> here's the challenge. the rjz were doing things to deliberately undermine the marketplace exchange. they were proceeding to sabotage, reinsurance, which enables a company to go into a market place and get insured of having a risk of having their disproportionate share of sick people. then there's the -- >> the open sign-up period. that hurt. and so forth. we needed them to get out of that mode and say quit sabotaging the exchange. this is a republican right wing think tank idea. a marketplace that essentially were private options, private
insurance companies and yet ironically that's the part that they're really trying to blow up n now. we can make things work better. >> senator jeff murkly of oregon. thanks for joining us. >> the unbelievable week in the trump sthags that started with the president making public attacks on jeff sessions as it's pending with a new chief of staff. where's gary?
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week for president donald trump. started with the president relentlessly attacking his own attorney general, jeff sessions, calling sessions beleaguered, ask & asking why he wasn't looking into crooked hillary's crimes. it ended with the humiliating defeat in the wee hours on friday morning. republicans have promised their voters obama repeal -- obama care repeal for seven years, but the bill was derailed by thumbs down from senator john mccain of air. once ridiculed by the president for getting captured during vietnam. in between those sign posts, there was what you might call a series of unfortunate events, including the previously mentioned ban on military service by transgender people and the instantly infamous boy scouts jamboree speech that sounded more like a political rally and prompted the boy scouts themselves to issue an apology. of course, anthony scaramucci's profanity-laced interview with "the new yorker" in which the new communications director attacked then chief of staff reince priebus and chief strategist steve bannon. topping that off was the ouster
of priebus and the appointment of a new chief of staff. joining us now executive director for move on and matt -- matt, you're -- i would say you're not a never trumper. ure not really like on the trump train. you're sort of somewhere in between as a sort of republican guy. republican operative. if i were a republican operative, i would be feeling pretty low right now. what is your feeling? >> well, i certainly felt that way after last night. i mean, the sense of failure with the senate effort to do something on health care, keep the vehicles moving, was profound, and there's a lot of blame to go around honestly. seven years. not getting consensus behind one bill. letting this process become such a mess. the product itself became a mess. look, i think the question now is can trump have a successful final sick months of this calendar year. next year we have an election year. it's going to be very difficult to get much done. i think the likelihood of
passing tax reform probably increases with health care faelg. i think the need is there. you have the beg six up on capitol hill. we'll see where it goes from here, and i think more order and less reform. more order and less chaos out of the white house will go a long way. >> that's interesting, matt, anna, we have seen the death of a health care bill so many times. in fact, in editorial discussions, i was like, what do we call it? there are only so many times we can say the health care bill is dead. maybe it comes back in a few days. what is your thinking on one of the groups that mobilized strongly against it. what is your thoughts on this? >> thursday was unbelievable. let's be really clear what happened. a moral autrocity became a
political liability. on thursday night, the resistance movement, which had a massive uprising over the course of six months, not just this week, a massive resistance movement succeeded in killing a terrible idea that would have killed americans. we've killed it. it is a zombie. it has arisen before from the grave. if it arises again, we will kill it back into its grave. you are seeing people celebrating this week rightly because of the incredible victory that we have seen. no one is resting on their laurels. everybody is getting ready to fight as much as we need to to keep this terrible, destructive, cruel idea from ever seeing the light of day. there will not be the same level of moral svehemence to a tax
bill. is the idea okay? we have taken a bunch of ls. this one we are going to take and move on for he can actually that reason. >> i think they will move on. there will be a lot of finger pointing as to why health care did not pass the senate. there will be a lot of doubt and monday morning quarterbacking. the strategic decision to start with health care rather than starting with tax reform, which has been republican terrain. tax reform is an issue trump and his team understand better. there is broader unity and consensus on tax reform than there was on health care. the question is, moving forward now, particularly with the new chief of staff in place, can this white house start operate wg foc operateing with focus and discipline, everybody on the same team and working together? >> matt, i have some news for
you. in all honesty, i don't think that is going to happen. i think the way they have conducted themselves is apparent. maybe jack kelly is a miracle worker. the chaos is interesting. for folks on the hill, the chaos is maddening. i heard from so many folks that i report on who were working in the trenches whether it was democratic hill staffers or republican hill staffers. chaos for people fighting the bill was hard. they felt like there was a lot of distraction. the president's allies and opponents both find the chaos maddening in different ways. do you feel like the chaos has made it harder to actually mobilize an opposition to the president's agenda? >> that's a great question. a side note that chaos is a kind of authoritarian ruling strategy. all of us need to keep our eyes on the traditional politics around trying to defeat a health care policy bill and the craziness, which seems to be an
intentional strategy by this white house to keep people off balance. it has made it harder and all the more remarkable that the resistance movement just killed the top priority of this administration and of the gop. the thing that was supposed to be passed on day one was beat back by a movement of people that started mobilizing in december, that flooded town halls and showed up every time a senator or a member of congress would possibly show their face back home, they were confronted by saying, hell, no, you are not going to do this to us. they are not going to stop with health care. if tax reform comes up, that's a different issue but people are fired up to stop this entire toxic engine. >> i wouldn't undercount that. anna and matt, thanks for making time. joining me is my colleague, lawrence o'donnell, host of "the last word." >> i am stealing your introduction for this segment.
the entire idea of tonight at 10:00 p.m. was the worst week yet in the trump presidency. you just did it in 72 second. >> here is my -- so you worked in the senate and have been sort of in the room at various times. have you seen something like what happened last night? >> never. i have seen votes like that decided. never with this kind of suspense. one of the reasons for the suspense frankly has been the inconsistency of john mccain. it is kind of inconceivable that someone gets off the bed from brain surgery and that you would then fly across the country to
take health care away from tens of millions of people. that becomes conceptually hard to imagine off the bat. i listened to his speech when he came back and i said right away this speech indicates he is going to vote against anything that mitch mcconnell proposes. he casted the procedural vote. in the old days of the senate, they didn't have votes on motions to proceed. you automatically proceeded to the debate. mccain was using the old tradition. wait until you votes on a substantive piece of legislation and both times that came up, he voted no. i was not one of those democrats on the democratic side of the floor where you heard them gasp. they wouldn't have been so surprised if mccain had been consistent over the last few years of matching his rhetoric to his votes. his rhetoric was completely
clear. ible mitch mcconnell knew all week he didn't have mccain. >> i have to say as someone that follows you on twitter you were right about this. there were a few people that heard that speech and said, wait a second, this is him giving the signal. here is my other question about how the president relates to congress, which i think is fascinating. you have people saying that, okay, now, the president is going to go after the gop congress. >> does he think there is a third party in the congress that he can work with? >> i don't think that's implausible that he does that. you can tell he is angry at them. i think he thinks i had this thing going that was mine. i let myself get dragged into this thing that they had. i don't care about it. why did i allow myself to be tarnished? >> nothing is implausible in the trump white house and remains eve morn in the zone. they are bringing in a white house chief of staff who knows
absolutely nothing about politics. the white house xhechief of stas job is politics. whatever you think of reince priebus he knows more about politics than general kelly. he is going to work with the most incompetent people he has been near. he comes from a world of competence. all the people under him know what they are doing. all the people above him know what they are doing. they are professions within the military. he is leaving all that behind to a world of chaos. he has a measurement for failure. he has a measurement for failure on his first day. that is exactly how many hours does it take him to yank scaramucci's credentials off of his neck and ban him from that building. if he can't do that, he has a white house out of control, totally out of control on day one. he is a failure on day one, because his job is control of
the white house. >> the issue, we all chuckle when matt said about getting on the same page. the issue is the president doesn't want it on the same page. organizations take on the attributes of their leaders in many respects. this white house is a manifestation of the man at the top. >> no white house has had a president saying, go out and publicly attack the chief of staff or sean spicer. they have never had this madness. all of the madness begins with trump, all of it. everything is his fault in that sense. the bringing in of scaramucci is a crime against the government payroll. the american taxpayer is going to pay for this guy's madness. this guy that belongs in a straight jacket has these white house credentials around his neck. he is unemployable in county government on long island, in any city hall anywhere.
>> is very successful. >> there is exactly one government office that would employ this raving lunatic and that's donald trump's white house. >> he has the job. lawrence o'donnell, thanks for being on. that does it for "all in." you can catch us every weeknight at 8:00 right here on msnbc. good morning, everyone. i'm dara brown. it's 7:00 a.m. at msnbc world headquarters. it is day 191 of the trump administration. here is a look at what's happening. a new day dawns on the white house with a new chief of staff to start on monday. reince priebus out. homeland security secretary, john kelly, in. could it be the change that brings new stability to the chaotic west wing. north korea's ballistic missile, they fear it has major range to hit cities not just on the