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tv   The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell  MSNBC  August 1, 2017 10:00pm-11:00pm PDT

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those words became public? that person had said all of that? how long -- how long would it take for that person to be fired? how long would it take for the president obama for wearing a tan jacket and for not wearing a tie and said he was completely disrespecting the oval office by not wearing a tie. but their current guy, current occupant calls the white house a dump. a beautiful, beautiful historic museum that bebelongs to the american people, a dump. >> joy, something you might have missed last night because it was another news work, eric trump was on another news network. i leave it to you to guess which show. he was on the highest-rated show, sean hannity show, and people love donald trump. and he is right, come on. people do love him. there are people who love him. a lot of people love him. but i looked at the cable news ratings last night and more
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people love joy reed because joy reed had, i don't know, maybe double the audience that eric trump had talk together people. joy reed, highest rated hour on cable news last night because people love joy reed. >> oh, thank you so much. thank you, lawrence. sorry, sean. thanks, lawrence. >> thank one joy. >> have a great show. >> thank you. >> bye. >> the debt ceiling is back. today come back. so republicans will once again bring the economy of the united states and the world to the edge of collapse and maybe this time over the edge. in a situation like that, so nice to have a coherent president to understand the worldwide stakes involved in the u.s. debt ceiling. but we don't. we have someone who needs the kids at his side to try
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desperately to keep him coherent. but jared kushner and ivanka trump, even though they in the white house everyday, cannot make him a coherent president. >> the president was not involved in the statement and did not issue the statement. it came from donald trump jr. >> the president weighed in as any father would based on the limited information that he had. >> america is the oldest constitutional republic in the world. it is not family business. >> they say that president trump personally drafted that initial statement from his eldest son. >> when you get caught in a lie, about one thing, it makes it hard to say, just let the other stuff go. >> every time there is one of those episodes it creates difficulty for mueller and his team to interview. >> i see what is happening in the rest of the world and i have deep concern about our inability to focus on real problems and
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real problem solving. >> very soon president trump will sign legislation to strengthen and codify the united states sanctions against russia. >> action by the congress to put the sanctions in place and the way they did, and neither the president nor i are very happy about that. >> jared kushner and ivanka trump had absolutely no interest in politics, no interest in ever working in government and then ivanka's father ran for president. suddenly jared kushner who knew absolutely nothing about any kind of political campaign, never mind the most complex of all president recall campaign , was right there in the thick of the presidential campaign. why was he there?recall campaign , was right there in the thick of the presidential campaign. why was he there? if he wanted to help his father-in-law's campaign, why didn't he help him find someone to hire who actually knew something about presidential campaigns. why do it yourself when you can
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afford to hire an expert who can do it better than you can? donald trump never had anyone in his family piloting his airplanes and helicopters. he hired professionals for that. and then, after coming in second in the vote count but first in electoral, donald trump found himself in transition. jared kushner and ivanka decided to give up their comfortable life in manhattan, uproot their children and move to washington to work in the white house. no doubt as surprised as the rest of us at the outcome of the electoral college, neither one of them had ever given any thought of ever going to work in a government building of any kind. why would jared kushner do that? why would ivanka trump move the kids to washington? take an office in the white house? my first guess about why they were doing that might be true. but it's not the whole story.
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the whole story is something i did not suspect. i did not suspect jared would seize the white house. my first guess is that the kids were worried about the old man. kids were watching especially over recent years in decline in donald trump's executive function. neurologists will tell that you it happens to most people his age. usually in ways that are barely per septemberible. forgetting the keyes. forgetting names. sometimes ways that are glaring. what neurologists call executive function includes basic mental processes like attention control, cognitive inhibition. decline of cognitive function is the process that leads to you take the car keys away from dad.
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having personally watched donald trump become increasingly incoherent over the last several years my first assumption was the kids were going to washington because they knew dad was utterly incoherent much of the time and forgetful and inattentive and so in the white house, someone he trusts would have to whisper in his ear what he said yesterday or what he should say or remind him why he is having this meeting and to always be available it translate the president's incoherence to people in the white house and cabinet. in effect the president's translator. that's the job i thought jared would have. an intimate job. a trusted family member makes sense for the job. it had to be jared instead of eric or don jr because some think jared is smarter than his sons. given what we know about jared kushner, that may be one of donald trump's many misjudgments.
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as far as we know, jared and eric never set up a channel direct to moscow that trump transition team could use at the russian embassy in washington. that was jared's idea. no one ever made a stupider suggestion than that. that jared's idea. it was donald trump jr.'s idea to invite manafort to an important meeting. russia clinton private and confidential. the no, times knew about that meeting three weeks ago. last night it was reported that president trump personally dictated the words of donald trump jr.'s first public statement about the meeting he gave to the "new york times"
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when the times asked him about it. when the news of that meeting was first reported the president's lawyer said that president had nothing to do with donald trump jr.'s statement even though the "new york times" reported that the president was consulted in the drafting of donald trump's statement. today the white house press secretary said the president weighed in. >> he certainly didn't dictate but he, like i said, he weighed in, offered suggestion like any father would do. >> okay. let's for the moment, put aside whether the president weighed in or dictated every word of the statement and considered this demonstration of the president's failure of neurological executive function when he was speaking in an interview with the wall street journal last week. this is last week. the president said to the wall street journal there is no one on the campaign who saw anyone from russia.
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we have nothing to do with russia. 12 dayes before that, the president told did-before the president told the wall street journal there is nobody on the campaign, that saw anybody from russia. 12 dayes before that the president said this. about his son's meeting during the campaign in trump tower with russians. >> ifully a practical standpoint, most people would have taken that meeting. >> the same mind it was out there publicly defending donald trump jr.'s meeting with russians, 12 days later says, there's nobody on the campaign that saw anybody from russia. does the president have any memory at all? of what he said 12 days earlier about the same meeting. the president's constant intoe incoherence that it now passes without comment. anybody publicly incoherent would considered a crisis,
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profoundly serious crisis right in the strike zone of the 25th amendment enacted to remove presidents who were unable to discharge the powers and duties of the office. that amendment was written in anticipation of mental illness, mental disability as well as other disabilities. that was written for presidentes who sound like donald trump. is now listen to every word that president said when the wall street journal asked him last week whether he will try to fire special prosecutor robert mueller. sessions recused himself but is bob mueller's job safe? there is speculation. president trump, no. we will see. i mean, i have no comment yet because it is too early. but we'll see. we're going to see. so when asked if bob mueller's job is safe the president's first word is no. meaning, no, his job is not safe.
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we will fire him. then we will see, what that means is maybe. he goes on to say it is too early but we will see. we're going to see. we will see means i don't know right now. it's possible. that is a stunning answer about the future of a special prosecutor. it's possible he will be fired. what if donald trump doesn't even understand the words he's using and what they mean whenever everybody else uses them. what does we'll see, we will see, mean to donald trump. the most remarkable thing about that incoherent answer is that right in the middle of it, the president says, i have no comment. then he says, we'll see. we're going to see. not real eyesing that that is a comment.
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the incoherent president gives a very important comment while saying he has no comment and it is largely ignorable by the news media because they have gren accustom to having an incoherent president. a president for whom words mean nothing. a white house where words mean nothing. and so when the white house today claims that the president weighed in on donald trump jr.'s first public statement about his meeting with russians during the campaign, the only thing the white house spokesperson will say is that he weighed in. a phrase that has no specificity. no meaning. did he weigh in on every word? did weighing in mean he dictated some of the sentences and not all of the sentences? this morning, matt lauer asked republican senator lindsey graham about the possibility that the president dictated the words of donald trump jr.'s first statement about that meeting with russians.
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>> it sounds like the president himself was trying to cover up the truth about that meeting. >> if that's true, then that was a bad decision bit president, which will make us more questions. when you get caught in a lie about one thing, it makes it hard to just say, let the other stuff go. >> joining us now, peter baker. also, eli stoeg els. and paul butler. peter, do you first. you've been to the interviews, rambling incoherent interviews conducted with the president. what is it like in that room when he begins a sentence, cuts himself off, changes the subject, adds a new subject that isn't clear at all. wanders off. then maybe never answers where
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the whole question began? >> well, he does free throat in these interviews. he wanders from subject to subject a little bit. it is very much through consciousness. it is very different than other presidents. no question. other presidents tend to stick to talking points. tend to stick to previously scripted answers they've given again and again and again and the struggle for an interviewer is to try to get them off that kind of game with president trump the other way around. he tends to go where his mind takes them and where he is thinking about. and what you want to do is sort of really force him to focus on one topic for a little bit and try to get a precise answer, get a sustained answer. but the trick is, often are these other thoughts, new directions he goes, are interested in their own mind and you want to explore them too. it is after more interesting and engaging kind of interview than some of the ones we have. >> peter, the white house reaction today which is that,
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you know, the president just weighed in, whatever that means, on donald trump jr.'s first statement in response to your newspaper's investigation of that meeting. and then donald trump jr. had to issue two more statements each day the "new york times" advanced the story. >> yeah. no question that first statement was an complete description of this event. saying the meeting was primarily about adoption policy and what it does not say is that it had been advertised a as an opportunity to get incriminating information about hillary clinton provided by the russian government. that's a very different understanding of that meeting. so the first statement was certainly not complete. certainly misleading. we reported very shortly afterwards that president himself signed off on this statement. and then jay, one of his lawyers, went on television, went on this network and other networks to say, no, that's not true. that's an incorrect statement. the president had no involvement in it. that is obviously not true according to the white house
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itself. the white house itself today said he was using the words weigh in or dictate or whatever else. the white house confirmed what was reported way back in july that he was involved in the statement contrary to his own lawyer. >> and paul butler, there are multiple sources about the president dictating every word of the statement and so when investigators see something like that do they then try to find those sources who are unnamed in the woo post and try to get their accounts of this? >> they don't just try to find them, they subpoena them. >> how do they do that with unnamed sources in the washington post? >> mueller has a team of some of the best prosecute poerps with all due respect to the washington post, if the post can find these guys, certainly investigators with subpoena power can find them and they will want to. now if the post is correct, we
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have direct evidence that trump not only participated in a cover-up, he did so trying to throw off the investigators. we have evidence of a corrupt intent to impede an investigation. lawrence, that's obstruction of justice. >> eli, there's another behavioral indicator in this story. that is, this is the way trump tells story. taking a few different positions on weighed in or had nothing to do with it, but when you're under oath, and testifying under oath, you can get tripped up by perjury wires on things that don't seem particularly central to what the investigation is about. donald trump jr.'s first statement to "the new york times" is not central to this investigation. but if someone does not tell the truth under oath, in questioning about that, someone can end up with a perjury charge on this peripheral matter.
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>> right. and this so far is just a constant story about arrogance. can you kind of understand why maybe they were overconfident inside trump tower during the transition and continue to be inside the white house. they won the election. donald trump's pension for contradicting himself almost constantly, adhering to the life-long policy as part of the deal with truthful hyperbole, they were all available to the whole country and they voted for him anyway. can you understand where this hubris comes from after november 8. as lindsey graham said, they want to get out of one box and they put themselves in an even tighter box because they are so eager, so short-sided and sort of trying to win every point and not letting anything go. not thinking they need to consult with their lawyers, just sort of immediately rationally reacting on twitter. that is a tendency that continues to exacerbate the legal trouble it seems for this
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president and perhaps for campaign folks as well. >> and peter baker, working for one of the two newspapers, you with the new york times and washington post, that keep delivering these blockbuster revelations about the trump white house, almost entirely from unnamed sources within the white trump white house or within the world, i would like to get a sense from you of what your guess is about the special prosecutors ability to find the sources that have been speaking, without their names in "the washington post" and in the new york times. and i'm not talking about you going anywhere near those sources but just the extent to which you sense they are available to talk and willing and or eager to talk. >> well, as just said, prosecutors and subpoena power have an awful lot levers to work to get people to testify.
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providing information about other people who then are brought under oath and then challenged with the information they've already been gotten and so forth. i don't think it is that hard for prosecutors to find people to testify against things like this. i think the harder thing for the prosecutor is to figure out what is going on with the russians. remember, there isn't a particular scandal, this isn't a particular thing we have seen in the past. this involves intelligence, another culture, another language, another government. what their intent was. what their modus was, and i think that's more complicated than people who are americans putting people under the campaign and that's what they do quite often. >> which brings us to a new report tonight, joining mueller's team. the deputy assistant where he oversaw the fraud unit and
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managed the targeting of foreign bribery. paul butler, your reaction it that addition to the team? >> it doesn't mat who president's lawyer is, if he doesn't listen to them. so we had his current lawyer good in on msnbc and other news sources saying that the president had nothing to do with don jr's memo or recollections of the meeting. we now know that is false which means either that president trump was lying to his lawyer or his lawyer was lying to the american people which is a violation of the code of ethics among other things. >> as robert mueller continues to staff up, he is defended by both parties in the congress. and democrats and republicans. some saying it the president makes a move on the justice department, that could be the turning point that could point to a shorter term than four
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years. >> yeah. lindsay graham last week said explicitly if the president decides to go after mueller that could be the beginning of the end of his presidency and you've seen really over past week more republicans taking more strident positions. criticizing this president more directly. it is not just lindsey graham and ben sass any more there are other people coming out. jeff flake being one of them. but a number of people standing up and saying this bothers me too and going back to the mueller hiring a white-collar crime attorney, this investigation just getting started. probably going into 2018 and maybe past 2018, but that will drive president trump up the wall. what did he say about a week or two ago? you can focus on russia, but that's it. when he hears there is somebody who is an expert in white collar crimes added to this legal team,
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i would just say i'm going to set my alarm for about pretty early tomorrow morning and check twitter for what the president has to say. because this is something that seems like almost inevitably will set him off. >> that's a big test for the new white house chief of staff if something happens on twitter tomorrow morning. peter baker and professor paul butler, eli, thank you all for joining us. coming up, what is president trump doing with the new russia sanctions bill? it has been passed and he is sitting there not signing it. meanwhile, vladimir putin is expelling united states staffers from the american embassy in moscow. and later, what republicans have learned about president trump on legislating, his failure on the health care bill. what does that mean on the debt ceiling which absolutely must pass and what does it mean on the republican dream of tax cuts?
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one word, not one word, about russia expelling 755 staffers from the american embassy in moscow. and now russia has begun preparations to move some 100,000 troops to its border with nato countries and one of the biggest steps taken so far in vladimir putin's recent military buildup, russian military exercise has been planned for months and is not seen as a response to the u.s. sanctions bill necessarily. today at the state department secretary of state rex tillerson said this about the united states and russia. >> the relationship as you know in russia is under considerable stress. by action by congress to put the sanctions in place and the way they did. neither the president nor i are happy about that. we were clear that we didn't think it was going to be helpful to our efforts. but that's the decision they made. they made it very overwhelming way. i think the president accepts that. >> also today "the washington
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post" reports that under the rework organization of the state department tillerson is considering eliminating from the state department's mission promoting and supporting democracy around the world. joining us now, david ignatious. he is also an msnbc and nbc news political analyst. also, senior counsel and former secretary of defense responsible for policy on russia, msnc analyst. the delay in signing the sanctions bill, not one word from the president about 755 americans from the moscow embassy. and what rex tillerson said today about how disappointed he and the president were about the russia sanctions bill? >> lawrence, like everything, this is peculiar to have this enormous expulsion order and no white house response.
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mike pence, vice president said in georgia that president will sign the bill. so i'm sure the signing is coming. i know the white house is trying to put together a signing statement that sometimes accompanies signing of bills. presidents in general don't like to have their authority challenged on foreign policy matters p. that is true with president obama and has been true for years. they are working on the signing statement. the idea that russia would do this with no trump reaction reinforces the ambivalence, putting it charitableably, that he has towards putin. it seems like the two of them were going to move down the road together. that period is clearly over. >> and evelyn fergus, here is a president who insulted leaders around the world and never considered expelling any american from any american embassy, from australia to germany.
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and here he is absolutely silent on this. as former -- >> defense. >> sorry, defense. that the white house would drop from the promotion and support the democracy from around the world. >> as former defense department and former senate staffer i view that with a lot of concern. because you know, we've never dropped democracy from our mission even when the united states as most isolationist. we said we will stand as the city on the hill. example for the world. so we're not going to intervene or try to tell people how to run their lives. what we want to still be an example of them of how to be prosperous. i think taking this out of the equation is a mistake. the administration could have said, we won't force demock roocy on people. that's one thing. but to say, to actually eliminate democratic, that's
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what makes us different as americans. we're not just about prosperity. we're about values. democracy. how do we get to prosperity. we do it through democracy. every man and woman, one vote, et cetera. >> and david, what i find so striking about this is that a mission statement of the state department is kind of like a party platform. no one ever reads it or thinks about it. it never crossed my mind before until someone in the trump state department has come along and said, oh, i have an idea. let's take out the idea we want to support and promote democracy around the world. >> i worry that this administration is trying to dismantle the liberal international order as it was called. the structure of this has been under challenge from the administration since inauguration day. the g20 sum sit an example.
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leaving the u.s. isolated and separate.sit an example. we live in a world of united states values, institutions we shaped after 1945. a world that i think has thrived in that era of the liberal international order. trump and steve bannon and others regard it as essentially the enemy and want to take it apart. i think the democracy promotion and devaluing human rights is an issue. all part of this campaign and i think makes us weaker by the month. the standing united states and world's eyes has plummeted since january. the numbers are striking. and in the end that means that our strength, our security as a country is diminished by the lack of support from our traditional friends and allies.
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>> david ignatious and evelyn vargas. thank you. >> thank you. >> coming up, debt ceiling and other potential disasters are looming. we, the people, are tired of being surprised with extra monthly fees. we want hd. and every box and dvr. all included. because we don't like surprises. yeah. like changing up the celebrity at the end to someone more handsome. and talented. really. and british. switch from cable to directv. get an all included package for $25 a month. and for a limited time, get a $100 reward card. call 1-800-directv.
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are you afraid of president trump? >> no. i'm a senator who was duly elected by the people of maine. i'm very honored to have that position. and i'm going to do what i think is right and sometimes that means i'm going to be agreeing with the president and sometimes it means that i'm not. >> senator collins was the strongest republican opponent to
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the trump mcconnell health care bill in the senate. and today republicans and democrats announced a plan to try to work together on the next step in health care legislation. the next step in health education and labor committee will begin holding hearings in september. quote, on the actions congress should take to stabilize and strengthen the individual health insurance market. joining us now, senator murphy from connecticut. a member of that committee. senator, thank you for joining us tonight. this is a routine announcement in the past in the senate that this committee that has jurisdiction over this subject will have hearings on this subject. but in the senate you've been working, and this is a break through. >> yeah, it is a break through. i guess it's better late than never but the problem is we're up against the clock. insurers are making decisions this fall about the rates that they will offer on the exchanges. whether or not they will continue to participate and what
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we're talking about in these bipartisan negotiations is essentially taking the keys to the american health care system away from the president of the united states. because we're pretty convinced that he is going to use it to drive the health care system into the ground. so we have a really short window here. and try to rescue the health care system from donald trump, trying to sabotage this system in order to make sure that millions of people who get health care today through these aca exchanges continue to get them. so we don't have a lot of time here. would have been a lot better had we started talking to each either. and no one included us in these discussions a couple months ago. >> the president took to twitter to complain bitterly about filibuster rules in the senate after the defeat of the health care bill. apparently not comprehending that that had absolutely nothing to do with the way the health care bill went down. let's listen to mitch mcconnell correcting the president on that.
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>> well, i mean, it is pretty obvious that our problem on health care is not the democrats. we didn't have 50 republicans. they are not the votes in the senate as i've said repeatedly to the president and to all of you. to change the rules of the senate. it would require 50 or 51 republicans to agree to do that. vote are simply not there. >> that sounds like majority leader who is ready to move on, senator. >> yeah. he is not going to get 50 votes on health care reform. why? because the bill they continue to put forward is wildly unpopular amongst the american public. frankly, a miracle that they got 49 votes on a bill that enjoys 15% approval out there in america that uninsures 20 million people and drives up rates by 20%. again, if they are willing to work with ounce a bill that maybe gives republicans a little
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bit on flexibility and gives us and the american public something on long-term security and stability on the marketplaces, we could get 70 votes for it. but yes, he is right to correct donald trump. the problem is not the filibuster. the problem is that you spent six to seven years driving the affordable care act, calling for replacement and republicans didn't bother to spend any of that time actually coming up with any good ideas on how to replace it. >> senator, i want your reaction as member of foreign relations committee where the sanctions billow ridge nats. the president's delay in signing the russia sanctions bill and not a word from the president about 755 americans being expelled from the moscow embassy. >> yeah, it is par for the course. this president has taken a really odd series of positions on u.s. russia relations. i guess this stands in that pattern of behavior. i take him at his word that he
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will sign this piece of legislation. he is right that it is complicated. but we are in the position today that we are in because donald trump sent a myriad of signals to the russians that they have free reign around the world to grow interflewens, interfere in other people's elections, to try to spread their influence into places that we had checked them before. so i think that his silence on the expulsion of hundreds of american diplomats is yet another signal to putin that he can continue to spread his wings in his periphery without any push back. of course the irony is that putin is expelling people that help russians in the united states. so it'll hurt the russian people, not the united states government. >> coming up, president trump proves he doesn't know the difference between tax reforms
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and tax cuts. there is a big difference. now mitch mcconnell is worried his dream of tax cuts will sink into donald trump's incoherence. that's next. whoooo.
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he calls a big giant tax cut. senator mcconnell says he expects to do that tax cut with republican votes only. 45 senators sent a letter to mitch mcconnell today saying they would oppose any tax bill that would increase the deficit or cut taxes on the richest 1% of taxpayers. the biggest political weakness and the republican tax plan is the incoherence of donald trump. donald trump, first of all, didn't know what to call it. last week in his interview with wall street journal, president trump said you know, it's tax reform but a dig tax cut but simplification and tax reform but a big tax cut. tax reform is when you simplify the tax code by eliminating deductions when you eliminate deductions taxes go up on those using reforms but because of the new generated revenue knot
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treasury can you use that revenue to cut tax rates so that most taxpayers are better off or paying the same. i may lose my deduction but because my income tax rate goes down i may pay the same or less in the end. when the dust clears the treasury is supposed to be left with the same amount of revenue. that's what tax reform is. a tax cut is when you don't eliminate any deductions and you just cut taxes. and the treasury just loses money. and that is what the republicans have always done thaents what they're planning to do this time. and because mitch mcconnell knows that democrats will refuse to cut taxes on the top 1% of income earnings, he knows he's going to have to do this with only republican votes. because like all republican tax cuts, mitch mcconnell will make sure that most of that money goes to the very, very rich. and in his interview with the wall street journal donald trump
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made life all the more difficult for mitch mcconnell once again. the president said, you know, i was with bob craft the other night and he came to have dinner with me. he is a friend of mine. as he left, he said, donald, don't worry about the rich people. tax the rich people. you got to take care of the people in the country. it was a very interesting statement. i feel the same way. so there's the republican president agreeing with democrat chuck schumer without realizing it and disagreeing with republican mitch mcconnell without realizing it which is the kind of thing the president did on health care for a year. when the president would say he was going to take care of everyone's health care, not realizing that's the most liberal position possible and the president cheers on a bill that would take health care coverage way from 32 million people. if the president keeps this up, he just might lead the republicans to failure. on something they've never failed to do before. cut taxes. including a really, really big tax cut for bob craft and all
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the rest of donald trump's very rich friends. up next, why the debt ceiling is going to be the next very serious piece of business in congress and why this time donald trump's incoherence really could do unimaginable damage to the united states and the world. l. l. showing off my arms? that's cool. being comfortable without a shirt? that's cool. getting the body you want without surgery, needles, or downtime? that's coolsculpting. coolsculpting is the only fda-cleared non-invasive treatment that targets and freezes away stubborn fat cells. visit today and register for a chance to win a free treatment. he's happy.t's with him? your family's finally eating vegetables thanks to our birds eye voila skillet meals. and they only take 15 minutes to make.
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that's why at comcast we're continuing to make4/7. our services more reliable than ever. like technology that can update itself. an advanced fiber-network infrustructure. new, more reliable equipment for your home. and a new culture built around customer service. it all adds up to our most reliable network ever. one that keeps you connected to what matters most. msnbc a tax cut is when you don't eliminate any deductions
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don't eliminate any deductions and you just cut taxes. and the treasury just loses money. default. >> this is a chaos presidency. we might see how chaotic, because you can make a long list of things that could go wrong here. and quite frankly, you know, donald trump's ability to influence congress i think is diminishing by the day. but in this particular case you do need the 60 votes to get that raised. i'm not sure they have a formula to do that. >> no. and you have so many republicans in both bodies who have been opposed to raising the debt ceiling in the past. it had to be done with democratic votes. what do the democrats do this time? do they say it's up to you.
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you guys do it on your own and force the republicans to either fail to raise the debt ceiling or break in re vows about everything they've ever said about it? >> yeah we're in the weird situation the republicans have few ogss and democrats have a lot. what will the republican dos what would democrats insisted the cost sharing payments in obamacare be included to get legislative approval as part of the debt ceiling package. is it a possibility that a trump white house would veto this particular legislation? you know, in a lot of ways donald trump needs to get his mojo back and maybe doing something like shutting down the federal government would get him back to his -- his receive space. i don't know what's going to happen but this is the undercovered story with all of the train wrecks we've seen with health care in one could be the big one. >> and we -- what we've seen in the past is some junior members of the congress and sometimes more than junior members who simply don't understand the debt
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ceiling they think the united states can default on debt and everything is okay. we have -- we have a president who doesn't understand the debt ceiling. that's the first time that's ever happened. he is the guy who has played games with debt his entire life. he believes debt is a game that could be the most dangerous element to the whole thing. >> well and as you pointed out we're about to see what the price tag we'll pay for the president's incoherence and ignorance on policy but also recklessness. the debt ceiling had you is an easy issue for smu for politician foss demagogue. s in a tempting issue for the president. you know again shine the spotlight what's coming down the track. >> september 29th. we will work late that night. charlie sykes thanks for joining us. really appreciate it. >> thank you. tonight's last word is next. i came across this house with water dripping from the ceiling. you never know when something like this will happen. so let the geico insurance agency help you
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according to white house sources kelly let the mooch go because etted more structure, less of game of thrones. that's not fair. >> wow. >> that's not fair errors comparison. with game of thrown you have to wait a week for a new bee heading. >> steven colbert gets the last word. >> the tonight no denial in fact the white house says the president was doing what was doing what any faert would do. also special robert mueller expands the team of investigators reportedly hiring
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an expert in foreign bribery. one of the top political strategists in modern american politics weighs in upon a white house in crisis. strategists in modern american politics weighs in on a white house in crisis. he was with us on election night. now he's back to review just where we've been. james carville with us tonight as "the 11th hour" begins now. on a tuesday night, good evening once again from nbc news headquarters here in new york. day 194 of the trump administration. and this day came with an important reminder. important to remember the investigation of robert mueller. it continued today. he will be back at work tomorrow morning. tonight reuters reports exclusively that mueller added another lawyer to the expanding team. the 16th attorney so far. his name is greg dr


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