tv MSNBC Live With Katy Tur MSNBC August 16, 2017 11:00am-12:00pm PDT
live. katie turr picking things up from here. >> 11 a.m. out west, 2:00 p.m. in the east. a public service for heather heyer has just concluded. she was killed when a man rammed his car into a crowd of protestors in charlottesville, north carolina. our country is in -- >> i think there is blame on both sides. you look at both sides, i think there is blame on both sides. >> there are not two sides in this. they are hideous, hateful menmys of america and freedom, and
people exercising their free speech. >> this is an ideology. and this is a country that wants a expect who should say this is not okay. >> there is no moral e k equivalency between the kkk and anyone else. >> president trump was forced to disband his two advisory councils of ceos after executives started fleeing in droves. today mike pence stood by the president's word that's stunned his staff and reignited anger. but no one else from the administration has spoken out or stepped down, including chief of staff, john kelly, whose body
language in that press conference yesterday spoke volumes. who has spoken out at least on paper, republican leaders who repudiated the president in words if not by name, mitch mcconnell whose wife stood next to the president yesterday issued this statement earlier. there are no good neo-nazis. george herbert walker bush and george walker bush said they must always reject bigotry, anti-semitism, and hatred in all forms. heather heyer's mother said it will not extinguish the cause that her daughter tied for. >> part of what struck a cord is we know that what she did is achievable. we don't value to guy or
sacrifice our lives. they tried to kill my child to shut her up. but you just magnified her. >> i'm joining my kelly o'donnell where we expect to see the president. robert costa a political reporter with the washington post, an nbc political analyst. stephanie, the ceo in chief, self professed, has had to disband his two ceo county tici. >> you have to love him disbanding them. you know your boyfriend is on your way to your house to dump you and you said we're over. we're over. these councils barely met.
like president trump's agenda, it's not getting any traction. a lot of them joined with the thought of greater good, that never happened. the pressure that they're under, none of them are saying the president is any sort of nazi sympathizer. they say i don't need to be in politics. what's happening in the white house, i don't want it. jamie dimon wants to run his company, not get calls every day of what hi thinks about the kkk. you saw when guys came to the white house and president trump would say tell them the story of when i got a hole in one. he loves those meetings. he loves saying i'm an investor with you. >> he loves being in their company because it elevates themselves. >> he was never as high as them.
now he has the keys to the castle. >> he sold himself as a person that could hire the best people. make sure the country was running smoothly because he had the right friends. is this sort of thing, the ceos leaving him behind, going to hurt his reputation? >> it may animate some of his base. they think she anticorporate, what i'm really paying attention to is is this a break beyond the picks of the white nationalism. when it comes to tax reform, infrastructure, will they truly be weary, or just walking in from the prelim pressure. >> kelly, how is the white house
feeling right now? >> reporter: today, katie, there has within so little communication. we have seen the president has taken that move to disband the county tills with his tweet, and i stepped away from the camera so that we can have our camera in position, i'm told the president is now in his limousine set to take trump tower. on the roof stops, we have law enforcement with long lend class to sir veil the path that the president will take. i have heard some protestors intermittently. they repositioned, i believe the motorcade is beginning to roll now. if you will bear with us, we'll see the president departing here. the first time he is leaving trump tower after his own individual to his own torte n eight months.
so the. -- >> happy about being home, part of the reason he would have felt so comfortable yesterday? secondaryly is there anyone in the white house who tried to get him not to free lance yesterday in that press conference? >> i can't imagine that anyone in the white house wanted him to do that. i don't know if it was the location that made him feel comfortab comfortable. in the past few months, the white house has done really really worked to keep him away from the free style conferences. he had not had these press conferences since february. i think what happened yesterday
is a good indication of why they were so a preppprehensive in pu the president out there. >> we heard republicans really say they don't want to stand by the president a number of times in the past, is this any different? >> we started out after that press conference and into this morning feeling like this was a red line that would cause people to react differently. you have the house speaker coming out and tweeting in opposition, but as the time has worn on you have seen a very careful line between those willing to criticize hiv, and those saying they will be unequivocal in their con den namt. so i think you're seeing that same mixed messaging. >> i thought it was.
♪ble that his words were very different from the words we saw him speak from a tell prompt ter. take a look. i thought we had that ready, stephanie? >> i spoke to people in the white house that were gob smacked. they were there to talk infrastructure. lowering the time it takes to get permits, and he went road. he did not want to give that correction or warmer statement on monday. yesterday you got the real trump yet again. >> we condemn in the strongest possible terms this egregious display of hatred, bigotry, and
violence on many sides. racism is seven, and those that cause violence in their name are criminals and thugs. including the kkk, and other hate groups that are repugnant to everything that we hold deer as republicans. >> you had a group that was banned and a group that was very ent. >> i mean, how many times have we watched tape like this. there is a time when there was photos that show thatpocket. and i think the pictures of general kelly off to the side, with his head down, tell you everything you need to know about how the people around him feel about this. >> this argument that jared
ivanka want to be a moderating voice for them but they're on vacation? balog balogna. >> every time the president does something that is something he is criticized for, there is no evidence, just good pr spin for the first daughter and the even your daughter to the president. there was an article luking about the rhetorical ricochet. and they said to name the bad con frfrontation to hit noting t nazi are criminals and thugs. and then d down seems
perfectly donald trump. he is naturally including to dance with the ones two brought him. we're also hearing that gary cohen was reportedly disgusted and appalled by trump's comments. if there are advisors that totally disagree, why are we not seeing resignations? >> i think it is important to know that he is still at the white house. still part of this administration. i'm told hi is one of them, a form former democrat. the question is an important one. the basic truth about president trump. you understand he comes out of this culture in the late 1960s,
early 1970s. this white working class grievance really a response to the urban america. he channels that decades later. so even if he doesn't have a great connection to the right that both sides are at fault that we saw decades ago in new york city. >> what are you hearing from inside the white house about how upset people are about this. >> it does team like people are expressing display. i don't think that we have seen anything that shows that people would be taking option to leave maybe just privately saying they have iffing with them been erin is standing with the president every seas and was asked about these comments from the
president yesterday. and i stand with the president. >> what did you make of john kelly's body language yesterday? >> well, i mean certainly he looked very concerned and down. i'm sure that those pictures will follow him, and he was supposed to be order to the white house. sop to see him looking dejected. >> defny raul, kacie hunt, and thank you very much for joining me. >> thanks, katie. >> as the follow up continues, it is important not to forget heather heyer killed in saturday's violence. this morning, family, friends,
and strangers gathered not just to mourn her death, because to continue her cause for activism. >> it could have been a storm in a teapot. i could have said let's have a small private fooun really. anyone that knew her knows she had to go big and large. that's my child, she is just that bay. always has been and will wont to be. always he she was care en and compassional wind wants dro.
i would rather have my child, but if i have to give her up, we're going to make it count. >> make it count, moving and powerful worlds from heather heyer's mother. next, what is defining the republican party right now, is it the party of lincoln and reagan. and the president's words at trump tower could inspire more rallies like we saw in virginia. a neo-nazi gave this prediction to us. >> what do you think this means for the next althou-right prote. >> i think it will be tough to top, but we'll try. >> tough to top? someone died. we should move. our home team will help you every step of the way. still not enough? it's smaller than i'd like. we'll help you finance your dream home. it's perfect.
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i do not agree with and i this it is inappropriate how he is attacking the judge. >> i respectfully ask you, with all due respect, step aside. step down. i can't endorse donald trump for president. >> the timing made little sense to me. >> i was really disappointed and displayed by the president's tweet. >> i'm not surprised but i'm
disappointed. >> republicans on capitol hill were disturbed when candidate trump criticized a mexican american judge. they pulled their support when the access hollywood tape was released. they questioned the timing when he fired fbi director james comey. then those republicans moved on. they turned back to their agenda and now republicans are denouncing president trump again. >> i think the president was wrong yesterday. there was one side and one side only. and we have to condemn anti-semitism, white sue -- white supremacy. standing up to defy hate and
bigotry. the president of the united states should say so. congressman charlie dent also said potus most stop the moral equivalency. and marco rubio, you cannot allow white sue prpremacists toe only part of the pain. will republicans do anything this time that they have not done before? joining me now, elise jordan, and msnbc political analyst. also liz mahr. online communications director and republican strategist. we're hearing from top republicans in the house and senate on this as well. we have paul ryan tweeting that we must be clear white supremacy is repulsive. there can be no moral ambiguity.
mitch mcconnell releasing a similar statement, but they are not naming president trump, why are they not calling him out by name? >> i think at this stage in the game you're seeing a lot of republicans that are hesitating to call president trump by name and that is a shame. we have to all out who is the ins insta i instigator. it is taking this horrible president enand elevating white supremacy. i'm curious what the national women and chairman of the republican national committee think of this behavior on the part of the president and if it is going to be tolerated as a party and as of now, you know, i have not seen much of a robust respon response. >> and the head of the rnc did go further says that republicans
do not want support from white supre supremacists or neo-nazis. we have seen republicans up and down the party go out and call out the president by name and say they don't agree with his policies or his ideas or rhetoric, et cetera. and nothing has changed up until this point, why not? >> i think you have to distinguish the rnc from the rest of the party. the rnc answers to the president. the chairman is in that job because the president put her in that job. this is someone who knows exactly where the president has been on these things. what we heard, if anything, recently was him coming out and going back to his home turf and what is comfortable with him. so i don't think she can possibly be surprised by this
and i don't think she has much of a choice where she pegged herself in. with regard to the rest of the party, i would like to see more people calling him out by name, but fundamentally, i think the republican party reached a juncture now where they need to focus on progressing their agenda in congress. he has an r after his name, but he is not what republican party stands for and i think they have to work on progressing their agenda. whatever, he is on his own. that's how it needs to be from here on out. >> is this the party of lincoln? >> i think in some places it is, but in other places, this is an extremely fractured party and there are some people that have evolved themselves in it, and those people really probably have a hatred for him, and they
caused their great, great, great grandparents to suffer a great deal. i think those people are not on the same package as the race of us, i think those are the people that donald trump always had a certain appeal to. they are not the people who traditionally supported the republican party. >> not all of donald trump's supporters support white supremacy or naziism. a lot of them were very frustrated with the status quo, the economy, and the jobs and they wanted a revolutionary change, are people like that who voted for him for economic reasons now flinching at this and do republicans have an obligation to represent them? >> i'm going to speak for myself and where i'm sitting right now.
i grew up in a small town in mississippi, and the kkk was so looked down upon, it was a very tiny presence, any time anyone in town was rumored to be a member of the kkk everyone condemned them and that is why this week is so personally upsetting for me because he is taking the ideas that are the antithesis of what america is all about and trying to normalize and give a flat form to something that the country is go done with. i think they should be outraged that they are trying to lump them in with the very worst. breaking news, another statement from another ceo reacting to the president's words. jamie dimon issued a statement about the disbanding of the
president's strategic and policy forum and the protests that broke out in charlotteville. and will not matter if we do not address the divisions in our country if is a leaders role in business or government to bring people together, not tear them apart. >> next, what it takes to change, a conversation with a former white supremacist who has a powerful mess an. it is never too late to stop the hate.
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would you be here today without donald trump? >> i haveen emboldened for 25 years. to be proud that you're white, group together, and support white issues. >> that was a white nationalist reacting to the president's comments yesterday. the president's insistence that both sides shared the blame for the violence on saturday. among them, former kkk leader david duke who said thank you, president trump for your honesty and courage to tell the truth
about charlottesville. the southern poverty law center estimates there are 918 hate groups. joining me now is arno who is a former white supremacists. why are you seeing so many more now and why are they clouder than they have been in quite some time? >> i think it is very emboldening for them to see a policy that reflecting things they have been saying for a long time. they exist on fear, they cultivate on fear, that is their bread and butter. when we have an administration also dealing in fear, we're all speaking the same language.
>> so when they come out on both sides, what is that doing for the movement? >> i think it absorbs the responsibility by saying there is an opponent of theirs that is just as bad when in actuality it was a unite the right that initiated everything in charlottesville. while there are those that aggravated violence, across the board really the entire extent happened because of far right white supremacist agitating. >> and you heard them saying it is time more writes to rally around white issues. what are white issues? >> white issues, according to white supremacist ideology is a
cultivation of fear, the idea that white people are under attack, that they're being oppress oppressed, and it is that kind of paranoia that drives what they do. richard spencer makes no bones about that that what he does is identity politics for white people. it is a logical conclusion for that form of social things if is a reflection of what has been happening on the left. >> i found your article today fascinating talking about the sort of people that are trying to convert. talk to me about how that works. >> essentially what makes you right for recruitment into white supremacist or any kind of violent extremist, it is essential to show that it is identity for the so-called
state. and it is looking at people who are suffering. so primarily young, white men, who don't have things going for them. they don't have a great job, a girlfriend, they have other sorts of problems. it is way easier to blame other people than it is to look inward and say what can i be doing better. essentially rch geveryone getti involved in these hate groups are taking the easy way out. tragically taking all of the right steps to lead their miserable lives to a worse place. >> so we played sound from a white supremacist that was talking to vice news and he said more people will die. they're willing to spill their blood for this movement. how far are folks in this movement willing to go in
criminal? >> i think we need to take that kind of threat very seriously. at the same time 20 years ago when i was involved in hate groups we had the same rhetoric. i would say we had to kill and die for our race. in my case honestly, i just wanted to get drunk and get in street fights. it would be a mistake to minimize the threat that far right groups pose, but also realize this is all bluster and a way for them to bolster their egos. they want to see themselves as warriors. like they're the heros in a lord of the rings movie or something. in order to do that, they need a dire threat facing them and that's what rhetoric is all about, concocting this threat. making it sound like white people are under attack, and they are the ones that are supposed to come swooping in to
save everyone. >> and you said carrying a sw t swastika or a flag was a good way to get a good reaction out of everyone. thank you for coming and sharing your insight. next, we turn our debate to confederate statutes that are still standing in the south, does president trump realize why they cause so much pain? >> this week it is robert e lee. is it george washington next week? thomas jefferson the week after. you have to ask yourself where does it stop. it's a champagne and models potpourri
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take down statues overnight. the events in charlottesville continue the debate on what to do about kaconfederate monument. a growing number that have removed, are removing, or are considering removing confederate monuments. among them in memphis, they called for the removal of a statue of confederate president jefferson davis. several counter protestors were also there and police asked them to leave when things got heated. mariana. they say they're far from finished, what are the plans for coming back out this afternoon? >> they're antimonument
protestors want to gather in front of city hall today and they prepared a list of demands for the mayor. they want the mayor to take action. yesterday we were here as they were protesting this statute of jefferson davis. they are also for the remains of a monument of na thathan bedfor forrest to be removed. i spoke a mother about why it was port to bring her daughter here. i want you to listen to both perspectives. >> it felt like an opportunity to come out and point at something and point to the history of our town try and
about changing the stories. >> he just represents a period of our history. we have 200 years of american history, and it was just part of it. so it is just one of the educational tools that we have to team people about all of our american history. >> protestors said they will continue to put pressure on the mayor of memphis. the city here unanimously voted to remove these monuments, but there is a law in place that does not allow it and they're asking for the mayor to find a loopho loophole some way. >> thank you very much. joining us now to take a closer look at this is michael dyson, georgetown university sociology professor. and author of "tears we cannot
stop." thank you for joining us. talk about the robert e. lee statue in charlottesville they were protesting. and then he equates it to over statutes. >> stonewall jackson is coming down, you have to ask where it will top. >> is it fair to equate robert e. lee with george washington or thompson jefferson? >> at least he understood the negative consequences by those
people antedidn't get caught up into historical reverie. george washington, and the founding father, and thomas jefferson, on our declaration of independence, are radically dissimilar. robert e. lee hated it so much he wanted to divide from it and find another union. thomas jefferson and george washington, no matter how flaws, sought to protect the democracy that would flourish. to appeal to them, to talk about the ongoing need. so comparing stonewall jackson
and robert e lee. it is just a category mistake and symptomic of their disregard for this history that the president has disregarded. >> people will argue it is part of america's history, even if it is ugly. how do you espouse to people that removing them is the right thing to do. >> let's stipulate this. it is be part of your history and heritage of bigotry. the heritage of america, which is to transmit the virus of white supremacy that we see now. it doesn't mean that it is not something that is problematic. if we use these monuments as em
policem policewomemblems of our torturef we said this is a sorry man f manifestation of the hurt and pain we imbodposed on million o people. they wanted to respond to the perception that black people were taking over. the confederacy that supposed to be so important was long since forgotten except by a few until the rise of the civil rights movement led them to revive it. if we're going to get history right here, we have to be honest about it across the board. those saying let's just honor what we're doing here, let's acknowledge the plight and predicament of our past. let's reformulate the future. >> we should note that some of
them were erected earlier than that in the 1920s, but again, far after reconstruction. after. >> no question. right. >> thank you very much for joining us. >> thank you for having me. >> and next, the alt left. you heard the president use the term several times yesterday, but is it really a thing? thank you so much. thank you! so we're a go? yes! we got a yes! what does that mean for purchasing? purchase. let's do this. got it. book the flights! hai! si! si! ya! ya! ya! what does that mean for us? we can get stuff.
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counterprotestors who were also in charlottesville last weekend. >> the alt left, they came charming at the as you say the alt-right. do they have any semblance of guilt? let me ask you this, what about the fact they came charging with clubs in their hands, swinging clubs? do they have any problem? i think they do. >> the anti-defamation league tells "the new york times" there's no such thing as the alt left and that the term was probably made up to create a false equivalent lessons with the alt-right. joining me now and reverend tracey black man, executive minister of justice and witness ministries at the unite church of christ. she was in charlottesville during last weekend's violence. let's start with you. what do you think of the president coming out and using the term alt left to say there were many sides or both sides that were responsible for the
violence? >> thank you for having me, katy. i feel that that is a ridiculous term, and i reject it out right. the term alt-right was created by richard spencer to legit miez the hate groups and the promise you will gags of hate that he was helping to direct. and to compare peaceful protestors, who came out with a message of love, it's ironic that on friday night a part of the certificate monday that i delivered was to remind us that we were not just there to stand for ourselves, but we were there because love is the solution for everyone. so to make a false comparison like that i thought was unfortunate. >> and reverend, you were trapped inside of a church on friday night? >> we were. we had a worship service. it was always scheduled to be just a worship service. there was no protest component
to it. we wanted to prepare ourselves spiritually because we were going into saturday morning with the sole purpose of creating an alternative maem to the hatred we knew would be there because we had seen the flyers inviting people to come. they said things like race war. they said things like white people are taking the country back. and so clerjy were invited to come and to be a prayerful presence there, and we chose to begin with a worship service. wonderful, wonderful organizers in charlottesville put it together. it was a standing-room only crowd. and i want to take this moment to say that even on my plane this morning i received a text from tracey whisper way, who was one of the organizers in charlottesville asking for me to pray for tyler mcgill. tyler mcgill is an employee of uva who went out on friday night
to try to help some students that were surrounded by this mob of white supremacists. in trying to help them, they hit him in the neck with a tiki torch, damaging his carotid artery. he's now had a stroke and he's in ucu. so i ask the question if this was a blame on both sides, why aren't there injuries on both sides? today was the funeral of heather heyer. why aren't there injuries on both sides? if there was violence on both sides? it's just a lie, and it shames me to have to say that the president of the united states is lying. >> done take, what do you make of the president trying to compare groups like yours to groups on the far right? >> see, his rhetoric is nothing new, and it has emboldened so
much invitation reol that has happened over the last several years in response to black folks taking action in the streets and other folks taking action in the streets. to literally fight for our lives. and i think that what we're seeing here, right, is that he continues to reject, denouncing this hate, the white supremist violence that has happened. we've seen this happen in response to charleston and so i think this is nothing new. but what i do want to offer is that if anything, his rhetoric, particularly the rhetoric that came out of his press conference yesterday, that when he goes off the record, like when he goes off script, people should be paying close attention, because these are the true feelings of how donald trump views race and racism and white supremacy in this country. right. and one of the other things that he does instead of putting on --
when he knows that he feels challenged from the left, he tends to fight. fight, fight, fight, fight, fight. and pushes the blame on groups like on ours and other folks as well instead of really taking control around the rhetoric that he's been using and putting people like bannon and miller and other folks into office who are really driving a lot of these key decisions around white supremacist hate violence. when we know that these folks are also associated, have been associated with white supremist groups. so i think here is bottom line, right, which is that we need to be able to see the right right now to be very clear about who donald trump is and the times of people that he's putting into his administration. by far they have been elm bold eng this type of violence and i can expect that moving forward we need to continue to keep the pressure up to hold them accountable to this violence
that they have been moving across the country. >> done tai berry and reverend phrasey black man, thank you very much for joining us. and that wraps things up for me this hour. ali velshi picks them up right now. >> you covered the trump campaign so you're probably the closest person who could believe the stuff going on. >> we saw a number of people holding kkk signs at trump alriz. we saw people wearing confederate flags at trump's alriz. we saw people saying that president obama was a muslim at trump's alriz. we saw people -- most of the time it was a u femism saying i want to see things going back to the 1950s. what do you mean? well, that's when things were better for us. or when obama was president this