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tv   MSNBC Live  MSNBC  October 29, 2017 1:00pm-2:00pm PDT

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hesitate to oppose him when i think that he is misguided. and from capitol hill to tinselto tinseltown, is sexual harassment just part of corporate culture in america? >> when i was growing up, i never heard about it, never knew anything about it. >> it has made me pay more attention to what's been going on around me more. >> this hour we're also going to go beyond the divide. the opioid crisis from addiction to recovery. we're going to talk to a survivor and tell their story. >> i have lost friends to it. and sadly, as it seems to get bigger and bigger of a problem, i don't really think -- honestly, i don't think kids really care. all right, we start with the big story of the day. it is the one word dominating all conversations in washington this very sunday -- indictment. yes. by this time tomorrow, we could know who, if anyone, from the trump campaign or the white house may face arrests in the russia probe led by bob mueller. and tomorrow is likely just the beginning, everybody.
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>> it could be manafort. it could be flynn. many people have been pointing out that you generally go after the small fish first. >> right. >> those are not small fish. >> yeah. >> we're talking about the national security adviser for the president and we're talking about the president's campaign manager. >> yeah. >> if those are the small fish, then the big fish has got to be pretty big. >> not small fish at all. the president has been on a tweetstorm, of course, today, again, calling the probe a witch hunt and suggesting democrats and hillary clinton should be the very focus. but former u.s. attorney preet bharara, who was fired by the trump administration, warns that trump may want to watch his words and his reaction. here's what he's keeping an eye on. >> whether or not donald trump has some reaction and talks in a way that could be used against him in the future, because bob mueller would do that. and the second thing i would look at is to see if the president of the united states is sending some kind of message to the potential defendant or other witnesses, and that's in two categories. one, is he sending a message of
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indimsion in some way through himself or his cohorts, suggesting that people should not be talking and people should keep their mouths shut? and the second thing is whether or not he sends a message of reassurance. >> all right, with me now, renato marriotti, a former federal prosecutor, and malcolm nantz, author of "the plot to hack america: how putin's cyber spies and wikileaks tried to steal the 2016 election." ned price is an msnbc contributor and former special assistant to president obama. he also worked at the cia and the national security council. and nbc's mike viqueira is at the white house for us. thank you all for joining me on this sunday afternoon. before i get into this, i want you all to weigh in, ned, malcolm and renato. do you think this is an inner circle or an outer circle indictment here? ned, i'm going to start with you. >> it's just how big the fish are. and presumably, they're going to have some relationship to the president, some people within his circle. the names like paul manafort and
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michael flynn have certainly been floated. there have been reports that mueller's team will indict them at some point. but i think as you heard from the congressman earlier in the segment, there is a chance that there is a smaller fish to start, someone like an accountant, someone like the son of michael flynn, his chief of staff at intel group, michael flynn jr., who could be a target in this. and as we know, bob mueller will want to work his way up, but he'll also want to use these coercive pressure tactics to try to either flip that target, or if it is a more ancillary figure, to have that target flip the person he is close with. so if it's michael flynn's son, that would lead him to michael flynn, for example. >> malcolm? >> yeah, i agree with that assessment to a certain extent. however, you know, it could be any number of lesser people as well. i mean, it could be any person who lied to the fbi in this investigation and is still remaining intransigent, and mueller may have just reached
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his limit with someone obfuscating. michael flynn jr. is a good person, but what if it's the person that was already told, which is paul manafort who was told he was likely going to be indicted, then had an fbi early raid on his house? all the indicators are pointing to him. look, someone's getting arrested in this thing, but i'll tell you who's not getting arrested tomorrow, hillary clinton. >> renato, your take, after that, of course. >> wow. yeah, well i always love malcolm's commentary. what i would say, what i would say, first of all, is one thing that's very interesting to me is there had been reporting that manafort and flynn's attorneys have not been informed that there's an indictment incoming, so that tells me one of two things. either as was previously suggested, we're looking at a figure like flynn's son or an accountant or someone that could be used to flip-flop manafort or
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flynn, or it could be somebody else entirely, whether it's michael cohen, the president's former attorney, or some other figu figure, kushner, whoever's been investigated, we don't know. there's not enough information to know. if i was a betting man and there was money on the line, i'd bet on paul manafort. >> to sum that up for everybody out there, we don't know. mike, i'm going to turn to you. there seems to be some silence from the white house, not from president trump, of course, who's been on quite a twitterstorm today, and we'll get to that in a second, but no official statements from the white house so far. what are you learning? >> well, there is one statement, and this was in response to questions from reporters in the wake of yet another tweetstorm from president trump. i think it was something like four tweets in the course of 24 minutes, about noontime here in washington. you went over it in the open there, yasmin. never seen such republican anger and unity about the clinton-made fake dossier, the witch hunt for evil politics, a phrase that he
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has used about the mueller investigation on countless occasions in tweets and otherwise. and he says the russia talk and everything that's happened over the last 24 to 48 hours, he implies is an effort to divert from the big tax cut or tax reform bill happening on capitol hill right now. and it was interesting what preet bharara said, looking for the reaction from president trump or anyone else in the administration might be feeling the heat. i think that's why, if i might speculate just a little bit, ty cobb, the special counsel here who deals with these matters involving the grand jury and the mueller investigation, representing the white house and the staff here, put out a statement that said his tweets, president trump's tweets today "are not, as some have asked, a reaction to anything involving the special counsel with whom the white house continues to cooperate." so, a very sort of anodyne and standoffish statement from the lawyer here at the white house, even as a reasonable person might objectively look at president trump's tweets today
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and say that's exactly what's getting under his skin. >> exactly, and i'll go with that line of questioning, ned. you can't help but scratch your head and say really, this isn't about what's going on tomorrow afternoon? do you buy what cobb said about that and saying the president's tweets had nothing to do with the possible indictment tomorrow? >> i don't buy that at all. i think his final tweet today ended with an exhortation in all caps, "do something" and the question was left unanswered, who exactly should do something? is it congress? is it the public? my concern, yasmin, in all of this, is that the president himself will try to do something, whether that's firing mueller, whether that is continuing to exert pressure tactics on law enforcement professionals who were involved in this. we know when it comes to this phony uranium 1 scandal, for example, that the president himself weighed in, and he declared that an informant should -- a gag order so an informant should be lifted so that that person's testimony can be made public. that's highly unusual and highly inappropriate for a policymaker, let alone the senior
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policymaker, the president of the united states, to weigh in on an investigative matter like this, and i think the president, if left to his own devices, will try to weigh in on this investigation into the president and his staff. >> well, let's take this one step further, renato, because ty cobb could be also saying on thursday before news of tomorrow's indictment was confirmed, he said this. take a listen and then i want you to weigh in. >> sure. >> i think he would be sad for them, as a friend and a former colleague, if the process results in punishment or indictments, but to the extent that that happens, that's beyond his control, and obviously, he's not trying to influence that in any way. but the president has no concerns in terms of any impact, as to what happens to them, on his campaign or on the white house. >> so renato, does he take this one step further, besides just weighing in?
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could he let pardons fly here if it were to be friends that were indicted, people that helped the campaign? >> yeah, i wouldn't be surprised by that at all. i mean, ty cobb is saying what a careful lawyer would try to say in this situation. and often, i will say, as a lawyer who was a prosecutor for a long time and now represents people at times who are investigated, you know, you -- if that person keeps their mouth shut, you as the lawyer can be the one talking carefully. but unfortunately, for mr. cobb, his client is opening his mouth, and i think his tweetstorm today was completely inappropriate, saying that people should do something in all caps. who is he speaking to, firearm owners? they should go after hillary clinton? is he talking about local law enforcement? is he telling federal law enforcement to go after her? i mean, what is he talking about? i think this is a man who went out of his way to pressure the fbi director to let things go as to general flynn, so the idea
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that he's indifferent to what happens to mr. flynn is hard to believe. >> i don't think i've heard so many off-camera sounds from a panel before as i've heard from this very panel on this conversation. i'm going to end with a big one. take us inside the head of a former kgb officer, that being putin. what's his reaction to all this that's going on right now come monday? >> oh, my god, vladimir putin is laughing at us. no matter what happens, he wins, all right? even if we start taking countermeasures against him, he's won. you know, i have a former cia director mention to me that if this thing is borne out, the trump/russia scandal, it will be the greatest intelligence operation in the history of mankind. >> wow. >> a nation will have gotten control of another nation that had atomic bombs. it's going to be interesting. someone's going to jail, but it will be fun. >> whoa, okay, fun. that's the first time i'm hearing that, but i'll end it on
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that, always giving us the big statements to end on. renato marriotti, malcolm nantz, ed price and mike viqueira, thank you for joining me. what can we do to stop the biggest opioid crisis in the country? we go behind the scenes with an opioid addict. and in the wake of the weinstein scandal, more women are saying me, too. next, the fight for safety and respect for america's workplace culture. how do we say that this fall, our guests can earn a free night when they book at and stay with us just two times? fall time. badda book.
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and so accepted that i think it's going to take a lot to dig us out of that hole now. >> welcome back, everybody. i promised you i would not stop reporting on sexual harassment and the harvey weinstein scandal, and now it's gone way beyond harvey weinstein. this week, congresswoman jackie speier launched a campaign to illustrate what she says is a hostile culture of sexual harassment on capitol hill. nbc news political analyst mark halperin, off the air now after cnn and the "washington post" reported allegations of sexual harassment when he was at abc news a decade ago. halperin posting an apology on twitter friday night saying "i bear responsibility for my outrageous conduct" while denying some of the allegations. celebrity chef john besh left his own company this week after 25 women said they experienced sexual harassment while working for his restaurant group. in a statement, besh apologized to those who "found my behavior as unacceptable as i do," and the list goes on and on. joining me are clair atkinson,
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editor at nbc news digital, karen desoto, nbc legal analyst and former prosecutor, and maya ragu, director of workplace equality at the national women's law center. welcome to all of you and thank you for joining me on this sunday afternoon. clair, i'm going to start with you talking about hollywood and media in general. what are we seeing in terms of women speaking out right now? >> unbelievable number coming forward. anna bell surer, who was an actress in "the sopranos," very well known actress, admitted in "the new yorker" a couple days ago that she had been raped by harvey weinstein. she tells a very heartbreaking story. just to add, harvey's lawyers maintain there was no nonconsensual relationships. but her story is very detailed, very heartbreaking. she describes how she was called by the reporter initially and declined to speak to him and said nothing had happened, then changed her story and said, yes, actually, something really terrible did happen to me. she gave the details, as did daryl hannah. >> unbelievable, each story more
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heartbreaking than the last. you think it stopped, it's over, then it keeps going on and on and more and more women are coming out, which is actually a good thing. i will say, that more and more women are coming out. karen, i'm going to go to you on this. going to capitol hill, congressman jackie speier saying it's also a toxic place there with regards to sexual harassment. how can we expect policy changes here with regard to sexual harassment in the workplace, when it's happening in the very place that we need change to come from? how can we trust the process? >> oh, well -- well, you can't trust the process. and i can tell you being an attorney who has filed a lot of sexual harassment cases that it's getting worse. it's not getting better. in fact, the last couple of complaints that i filed actually were so graphic that i had to put warning labels on them. so, part of this is, yes, it's part of the culture, whether it's d.c., hollywood, or corporate america. we have a public safety issue, i think, for women. men are not getting in trouble. it's confidentiality agreements, not warning any of the other
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women, whetherd.c. d.c. is known as a good old boys network. hollywood, the casting couch is not a term we just recently learned about. so, the policy has to stop with, obviously, a fiduciary duty, a duty to start protecting women and not gagging them from speaking out. and i think that part of the cosby effect is that women are realizing they don't have to be alone, they don't have to be fearful, and women are standing up behind them, which is a very new concept for women as far as not gathering together. my grandmother used to say men, one lies, the other one swears to it. so, women i think are finally speaking out and standing by and becoming stronger and empowering each other. >> grandmothers are always very wise, aren't they? >> yes, they are. >> maya, bringing you into the conversation here. i brought up the statement that some of the public figures were putting out there who had been accused of sexual harassment in the workplace, george h.w. bush also, former president, being accused of touching people inappropriately, putting out a statement saying it was a joke and it was intended to be
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good-natured. mark halperin of nbc, who is on leave right now, denying some of the allegations. we're seeing apologies as well. first, i want you to weigh in on do you buy the apology? do you think they actually mean it, or are they only saying it because they're supposed to? and, b, why is there always a caveat attached? why not i'm sorry, it's wrong, period, end of sentence, moving on? >> well, i think you've hit the nail on the head, and the problem is, it's a culture issue, right? it's attitudes and behavior that are going to take a long time to change and fix. nothing is going to change until people stop thinking about this or these revelations as a pr problem or a crisis management situation. so that's why, you know, i hope that their apologies are sincere, but it's hard to tell how much of it is sincerity and how much of it is crisis management. in order for real change to take place, we're going to have to take -- it's long term. it's going to take time and it's
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going to take money and it's going to take real leadership from the top levels of these corporations and workplaces to say we're going to hold the most powerful men who are harassers accountable for their behavior, and then we also expect men to step up and call out that behavior when they see it and be good allies so it's not just on all of these women who have been coming forward to make known the scope of this problem. >> but karen, can we take it one step further and say we're going to hold these men accountable that are in these positions of power that are doing it not just when it's being reported on, but when one person comes to us and says it's happening, we're going to hold that person accountable, not because there's an expose in some major newspaper and suddenly we have to hold people accountable because we have to, and the country's looking at us. >> employment procedures were changed to protect men, meaning that binding arbitration in employee handbooks are meant to keep women quiet and confidential. and as long as money in the corporate structure, money and
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power equal success, not ethics, not principles, this is going to continue. this has been going on for many, many years. i know i've filed many of these actions. so, you're right, there has to be -- it would be nice to say that men would step up, but unfortunately, when women step up, even in a civil context, they're still black-listed in hollywood, their jobs are changed in the corporate structure, right? they're the ones, even if they are getting great civil penalties, they're still not allowed to speak out, and therefore, not allowed to protect other women who are coming up behind them. >> and to be completely honest, this is not a male-bashing segment. >> of course. >> because there are people who will tweet at me and say there are men who have spoken out against this, and it's important to note that and there are also men who are subjects of sexual harassment in the workplace as women are as well, so important to acknowledge that. >> then help change the policy. get rid of the binding arboreration. >> yasmin, one last point. i found out and was horrified by the fact that guys in congress don't even have to pay out of
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their own pocket if there are settlements. it comes out of the u.s. treasury fund. >> wow. that is huge. >> and with corporate, it comes out of the insurance company, so maybe they should have more skin in the game. >> right, there's no accountability and no incentive to change. >> clair atkinson, karen desoto and maya ragu, thank you for joining me. >> thank you. president trump back in the global spotlight ahead of his trip to asia. could tomorrow's indictment hurt his agenda? that's next. whoooo.
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but will trump's agenda ratcheting up pressure on north korea and trade with china be overshadowed by an indictment tomorrow? with me, msnbc contributor and editor at large of "the atlantic," steve clemons, white house correspondent for "the mcclatchey," anita and paul singer, correspondent with "usa today." steve, talk to me about the timing of this visit. could this bode well for president trump, considering a possible indictment tomorrow that could be, could be the code word, a member of his inner circle? >> it depends on the donald trump we see. usually donald trump doesn't travel well. he's going to be 14 hours ahead timewise. he's not going to sleep right. he's going to be checking out those tweets and headlines on the mueller indictments that are going to come forward, and we'll see whether he keeps his head in the game on asia and focused on, you know, generating confidence in the american presence and approach in the region and its ability to deal with north korea, or is he going to be distracted and tweeting about what's unfolding here in washington, very, credit close
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to his franchise? you know, perhaps somebody who ran his campaign or perhaps somebody who was his national security adviser. so i think in that situation, we may see a very wobbly donald trump, and that may undo all of the goals in this 12-day trip to asia of trying to communicate that the united states is there, strong, and focused on our asia-pacific partners. >> and you know, let's talk about what's being said to president trump ahead of this trip to asia, considering this indictment. what are they trying to make sure that he stresses when he's abroad so that these leaders have confidence in him and what he says? >> right. well, i mean, he's going to five countries over 12 days, which is an extremely long trip for him, i mean, longer than he's had as president. so i mean, he does have to deal with north korea. he has to -- he also has a host of other issues. he's going to attending two summits, visiting five different countries and meeting with leaders in five places. all sorts of other leaders also at the summit. so i mean, the thing they want him to focus on, obviously, the number one top priority is north
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korea. he needs to have some confidence. he needs to watch what language he uses, and he also really needs to pressure china. what the white house is saying is that they want to go to china and have president xi there, you know, force him, push him to really act and force north korea to do something or to, you know, not do anything. what experts are telling me, though, is that there might be a missile test by north korea while president trump is traveling. >> wow. wow. that would be huge. >> and so, that's going to put him on the spot while he's in china or south korea, he's also visiting. so, it'd be huge. he'd have to decide there how to react. >> yeah, yeah, exactly. i can't even imagine if that were to happen what exactly the president would say at that very moment. paul, as we all know, bob corker's speaking out a lot about his sort of disdain for president trump and his ability to really be president, be presidential. and he certainly believes that the president undermines the capability of diplomacy abroad. let's take a listen to corker, and then i want you to weigh in.
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>> when our secretary of state is sitting down with the partner that matters most, china, trying to negotiate something that would resolve and keep us from going into military conflict with north korea, which brings in south korea, japan, china, and russia, and he's knee-capped by the president, it hurts our nation. >> so, paul, if, in enafact, yo have that, then you have an indictment come monday, i can't imagine the leaders abroad would be thinking, well, who's pulling the strings here. >> right. well, the one thing i will say is that the president is not leaving for asia until the end of the week, so if there is, in fact, an indictment on monday, we'll have a couple of days of news cycle for that to play itself out. as we know, the president is very interested in changing the subject from the trump/russia, as we call it, investigation. so in fact, having him 14 hours ahead in a different time zone where he's not live tweeting "fox & friends" or other programs might be beneficial.
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it also gives him an opportunity to talk about something else that is consequential other than the trump/russia investigation. there's some possibility that this is a good opportunity for the president to get away from the noise here in washington and focus on something important overseas. i should also mention that bob corker's having a hearing monday afternoon, 5:00, with secretary tillerson and secretary mattis to talk about authorization of military force, but i can't imagine that korea won't come up in that as well. >> yeah, steve, i do want to switch subjects a little bit here, just in talking specifically about the president's trip abroad. of course, north korea being top of mind. i read a fascinating article in "the new york times" this morning talking about how there could feasibly be an arms race in that region of the world, considering where we're headed with north korea. is the president's job to quell that need, that want, that desire for an arms race possibly? and what does he need to do? >> well, you know, the president, as soon as he came into office, withdrew the united
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states from the trans-pacific partnership, which essentially was a gift to china and a signal to a lot of countries that have depended upon the united states and its presidents to be behind, to be with them in their dark days. and so, they doubt the united states. china writes a lot about the strategic contraction of the united states. so if you're japan or south korea, you know, you're looking at a situation, regardless of what you're pretending to be the case with the american military, but really, behind closed doors, they're saying we can't depend on the united states as much as we did, so we may have to do other things. and the philippines is trying to set up a bidding war between china and the united states on who will do more for the philippines. that's one of the reasons why he's going to see duterte, who is, you know, engaged in summary executions and ex-judicial killings. so in that situation, i think you've got donald trump, who's got to demonstrate seriousness, stability, resolve to be committed to these countries in a very balanced way. we haven't seen him do that kind of thing before, but that's what he needs to achieve. >> and words matter on this
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trip, what you say matters on this trip. and so far, we haven't necessarily gotten that. it's certainly something to keep our eyes and ears on. steve clemons, anita camara, paul singer, thank you for joining me. moments ago, several houston texans players took part in a pregame protest in response to comments made by team owner bob mcnair. they had an nfl meeting on the past anthem protests, and he made the comment "we can't have the inmates running the prison." mcnair has apologized twice. by listening to an thiaudiobook on audible.ame
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i went from being a cpa to a tax attorney because our clients needed more. call us, and let us put our 30 years of tax experience to work for you. welcome back, everybody. let's go beyond the scope. puerto rico's power authority has just pulled the plug on the controversial whitefish contract. this follows governor ricardo rossello's demand earlier today that the $300 million deal be scrapped. the ceo of the puerto rico power authority says this might set back power restoration efforts 10 to 12 weeks. hurricane maria devastated the island a month ago, but the road to recovery is winding. many questions still unanswered, including the death toll. get this, buzzfeed now reporting
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funeral home and crematorium directors are being permitted by the puerto rican government to burn the bodies of hurricane victims without including those people in the official death toll. the department of public safety said that over 900 cremations of "natural deaths" were authorized in just the last five weeks. unbelievable. in a surprising twist, the brother of jared kushner has written an op ed defending obamacare. joshua kushner, co-founder of oscar health insurance, penned a piece titled "the individual market will thrive in the long run." the piece reads in part that the administration's outreach and lip service to repealing the affordable care act do nothing to stench growing confusion among shoppers. and the winner of a high school golf tournament denied her trophy. why, you ask. because she is a girl. emily nash, a junior in massachusetts, lost her prize to a boy that was trailing her because of the tournament rules. according to the massachusetts
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athletic association, emily says the move was a surprise to her, although her coach was aware of the rule. all right, coming up, everybody, opioids in america. we go beyond the divide with a story of survival. next, one man's mission to help others fight addiction. you don't want to miss it. >> people are going to get drugs, regardless. so it's kind of a hard thing to do. maybe just offering more support, making rehab less of a luxury and more of something that we can actually get our hands on. this is a story about mail and packages.
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welcome back, everybody. let's go "beyond the divide." what can be done about the opioid crisis? to understand the scope, in 2016, more than 2 million americans had an addiction to prescription or illicit opioids. 64,000 americans died from overdoses alone. in fact, drug overdoses are now the leading cause of injury death in the united states,
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outnumbering both traffic crashes and gun-related deaths. the white house declared a public health emergency. a national emergency would have triggered a rapid release of funds to combat this problem. joining me today is a man who's seen both sides, really, an addict who got clean and started helping others. mike duggan, certified intervention professional and a founder of a massachusetts-based addiction recovery program. mike, it's good to talk to you and i appreciate you joining me and telling me your story. what happened? how did you get addicted to opioids? >> it's credential a loertainly but just to give you an idea, three-sport varsity athlete, playing hockey, broke my wrist senior year in high school, and the solution to the pain at the white house was prescription opioid pain medication, which certainly opened up a door to a long few years of serious drug abuse, you know, that devastated myself, my family, almost, you
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know, ruined my chances of finishing school and could have been certainly fatal for me as well. >> well, and it's interesting because yours, like so many others, started innocently, a prescription that just sort of led down, that spiraled out of control, and that's what seems to happen to so many young kids these days, as it happens with a sports injury or something like that, and then suddenly, your life is completely opposite of what it used to be. >> of course. i mean, four to five heroin users started on prescription opioid pain medication, you know. so when we talk about the failed policy with the war on drugs, i mean, the fact of the matter is the war is with the pharmaceutical companies in a lot of ways because this easy access to these prescription drugs with little to no education on addiction has created this crisis to begin with. you have, you know, so many individuals who started with an accident, having their wisdom teeth pulled, and they were given a solution that was originated for end-of-life treatment or to treat terminal
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pain, and it was given for a tooth ache, you know. >> wow. >> even as i'm sitting here watching certain commercials, i see a commercial from the pharmaceutical company. so when trump made his declaration this week, he talked about advertisement, and i think that's important. i think it's important to get a message in terms of prevention, to prevent more people from falling in the grips of addiction. but the fact of the matter is, there's only one other country that allows pharmaceutical companies to directly market to the consumers, you know, where you're sitting on your couch and they tell you what your problem is, where the solution is, and how to go about getting the solution. and that should never be allowed. >> did doctors warn you when you got your first prescription? >> during this time, this is around when they implemented pain as a fifth vital sign. there was little to no training for doctors on the subject of addiction. so they were being told by pharmaceutical companies that you cannot become addicted to these drugs. just keep increasing the dosage until the pain completely goes away. so there was a lot of
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mismarketing practices. all of these crises in terms of drugs, they all started with legal prescriptions. if you go all the way back to the german pharmaceutical company, bayer, and the introduction of heroin back in the late 1800s, and then cocaine and then amphetamines and methamphetamines to treat anxiety and depression, i mean, these are all drugs designed by the pharmaceutical companies, and they're the ones making all the laws, and they're the ones that are making it very challenging for us to combat these distributors who are pushing these pills in ways that are being, you know, obviously prescribed that are high risk to individuals and wiping out a whole generation. >> so mike in 30 seconds really or so, because we don't have a lot of time left and i wish i could talk to you longer, but how do you get clean from this? i love the name of your organizati organization, but how do you get clean from this? you're at the bottom -- you know, you've hit rock bottom. you've been addicted for years. what's your first step? what do you do? >> i think access to treatment
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is important. i think one of the biggest things in terms of where people are disappointed so far in the announcement of a national, you know, public health crisis, is the fact that there was no allocation of funding. i mean, you're talking about tens of billions of dollars that need to be going towards treatment and access to treatment, and it's not inpatient acute care where you criminally stabilize people and discharge them with no follow-up. it's a chronic illness that needs to be treated on a long-term basis, so we need to start funding long-term intensive case management services and after care, and ultimately, it's going to take a lot of money in order to combat this crisis right now. >> i think what's so terrible is this is affecting more and more people, but maybe by affecting more and more people, it's starting to become personal to so many out there, and now is when action will take place, we'll be able to sort of, you know, really put a dent in this thing. mike duggan, i appreciate your work and i thank you for joining me. >> no problem. thanks for having me. coming up, what history tells us in terms of indictments
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as we await tomorrow's indictment news, it's worth asking, what do political parties tell about the white house? during the nixan days, data shows on average gop administrations have 29 times more indictments, 64 times more convictions, and 24 times more prison sentences than democrats. let's talk all about this. joining me now, eleanor cliff, washington correspondent for "the daily beast," and maxwell, former director of progressive media for the clinton campaign and former communications director for california congressman dana rohrabacher. tara, i'm going to start with you. why are gop administrations more prone to arrests and convictions here? >> i don't know. i mean, i think that this comparing what one considers a scandal, what's criminal and which party is worse, i think
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that depends on what metric you're using. we could go back as far as tammany hall with democrats and corruption and boss tweed. we can talk about new york and new jersey and mcgreevey and new jersey and all of the democratic mayors in the republicans do hold the trophy on that. i don't know if it's a trophy people want. >> again, i think -- so what. that happens. politics is a bir at this business. republicans obviously, they have taken the heat for it, been convicted rightly so if thats what the case. i don't think this is a metric we should be measuring things on when there's corruption among politics all over the place, democrats are certainly not immune to that either. blog ovechkin in illinois, selling senate seats. >> you bring up these things and they're justified in bringing them up. eleanore, what happens? >> want to go to you on this.
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ronald reagan is the standard bearer when it comes to the republican party. he was the best president, wanting to compare their presidency to reagan. he's second in line to nixon in numbers of criminal convictions and arrests. according to the daily kos they had 26 indictments and 16 convictions. your reaction to that? >> well, we did have the scandal over selling arms overseas and aiding the contras illegally. and that got the president caught up and a number of people in his administration as well. you know, during the transition when power shifted from president obama to president trump, one of the pieces of advice that president obama gave to mr. trump was listen to the lawyers. and by that he meant that you really had to scrub people, vet people before you nominated them so that you're not surprised later. and i think what's different
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about this administration is the volume of the scandals, not only at the very top having to do with russia collusion, but also affecting cabinet members. we've had one major resignation with tom price. and i think in trump's case, it really is a matter of somebody coming from the business world where the ethical standards are more fast and loose and you don't pay a price, or you can settle a lawsuit. and the government is very different. and i think mr. trump is coming up against now armies of lawyers that he never would have had to confront in the private sector. >> going off of sort of the advice that president obama gave there, you think back to the flynn advice. >> right. >> that was heard, that obama gave to trump in that you should be wary of flynn and look what happened a month into the trump administration. >> i think it's not taking the ethics lawyers seriously. you saw the chief ethics lawyer resign in protest because this
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administration was not heeding his advice. i don't think it's necessarily that democrats are better at following ethics rules than republicans. >> right. i do agree -- >> it's funny. our producers write questions, we come up with some of them. are democrats better at vetting administration picks? i want to ask that because it's not about that. >> with this particular administration, there are a lot of people that came from the business world that had assets and business dealings that weren't properly vetted before they were confirmed. i think that is going to be one of the under covered stories in this administration. i think there's going to be more scandals coming up that don't have to do with -- >> let's go with that. trump saying he wants to clean up the swamp. is that going to cause more issues than good, he's bringing people in that know how to operate in the private sector than the public sector? >> even that is questionable with the people trump brought
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in. there is a skeletal department that were at historic vacancy levels because he can't find qualified people who want to work for this administration and we can understand why. that is why so many people are concerned about general kelly and mattis and those guys leaving. scaramucci made a comment, i think, he thought it was an insult saying there were people inside the white house trying to protect america from the president. he thought that was an insult. that is relieving to some of us because of the way the president is operating. it is clear the people he surrounded himself with, outside of cabinet agencies and elsewhere, we're not getting the same level of talent we had in other administrations because people are concerned about getting caught up in this trump administration quagmire only nine months in. >> eleanore, do you think more is to come here? >> i think a bigger problem -- i think more is to come, yes. but it's the nature of partisan government today. but i think a bigger problem
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throughout the government is the dee moralization of people who are working at all levels of the government who feel like they're not valued and they're not trusted and they're not cut in on decision making. there is a real hostility to the government that exists in washington. people who are not partisan, they're not political appointees. and the lack of leadership throughout is -- i think it's really a disservice, not only to people who work there but on all the programs they are working on to serve the american people. >> just so i don't have people tweeting at me, i want everybody to know we have not forgotten what happened to president bill clinton. we all understand what happened with the bill clinton administration. >> there were political scandals under obama. just because there weren't -- >> now we're starting something else. we have to go. i'm getting yelled at. thank you. we'll be right back, everybody. t a safe driving bonus check
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welcome back, everybody. let's go beyond with a tweet from jessica chastain. she shares a list from one of harvey weinstein's accusers naming 82 different women having come forward. 82 different women. while weinstein denies accusations of nonconsensual sex, chastain says there are more to come, and there are. as we've seen this last week, it's not just in the film industry. it is across all industries. yours and mine. we spoke at the top of the show about the workplace culture that contributes to sexual harassment and assault. and the silence that follows. all of this has to stop. not just the physical, but the tangible, but the judgments and the locker room talk. as women we should be allowed to think about being the best we can be at our job as men do. the next time you find yourself judging someone privately or publicly for the way they look or he engage in, quote, locker room talk, don't do it. next time someone in your circle comes to you with a grievance or wanting to share their heartache, believe them.
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go to real yasmin v. that's it for us. i'm yasmin. see you again. news continues with my colleague a minute. >> thank you. i'm amin hadeen. we will soon learn the identity 0er targets of the first charges filed in special counsel bob mueller's investigation and what it will mean for the white house. the republican strategy right now for dealing with questions of collusion with russia, what else? blame hillary. are they just muddying the waters or is there something there? we're going to break it all down. and losing the base numbers just out from a new nbc poll. has the president's numbers down, but it's where he's losing support that might be most troubling to the commander in chief. and to republicans heading into 2018. more on that ahead this hour. but we begin with what's shaping up as a monday to remember, an indictment in the mueller investigation set to be unsealed in washington tomorrow


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