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tv   MSNBC Live With Velshi and Ruhle  MSNBC  October 31, 2017 8:00am-9:00am PDT

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and music and food. the photographer here for the ap. would love to hear your thoughts on facebook, twitter, snapchat. send me your costumes for the day. interesting if you're going to dress up as a basket of puppies. >> why aren't you dressed up? >> you know, later. that comes later. >> i dressed up as ali. he looks a lot like me, right? in a body suit. >> ridiculous. >> don't you have news to do? >> i love halloween, but i love the news. guess what. we've got a lot of it. good morning, everyone. i'm stephanie rhule. >> i am ali velshi. we're dressed as ourselves. it is tuesday, october 31st. it's halloween. let's get started. >> i never heard of papadopoulos. he was the coffee boy. he had nothing to do with the campaign. and all of this is completely beyond the scope of his
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responsibilities. >> from what i recall, george was a low level volunteer who might have attended a meeting of the foreign policy advisory team. the one meeting that took place. >> george papadopoulos, the violation of the law was -- >> the collusion and cooperation. >> on the issue of the volunteer quick, who else were volunteers? don jr., eric, ivanka. >> plea deal now details the clearest evidence yet of links between the trump campaign and russian officials. >> that is a huge break in the russia investigation even if we don't know how high the problems go. >> the papadopoulos information has the one keyword that should frighten everybody in the white house. that keyword is guilty. >> were you in e-mail chains with papadopoulos? >> probably a few, yeah. >> were you in e-mail chains with him about russia? >> it may have come up from time to time. >> all they were indicted long before they ever met donald trump or had any association with the campaign. >> there is no conversation
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regarding firing robert mueller. >> i have zero concern that mr. mueller is in jeopardy of losing his job. there was some effort to do it without a good reason, there's be holy hell to pay. >> new bombshells from facebook and twitser on russia's attempt to influence voters. >> 126 million people received russian-backed content. on its website during the 2016 election. >> also new today, twitter says it found nearly 37,000 accounts that were linked to russian entities. >> facebook, twitter, and google. all three are testifying in hearings on capitol hill. >> robert e. lee was an honorable man. he was a man that gave up his country to fight for his state. but the lack of the ability to compromise led to the civil war. >> george papadopoulos, we may or may not have e-mailed about
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russia. guess what mr. lewandowski, if papadopoulos was wearing a wire, you'll be reminded by mueller. and papadopoulos, a quote, liar and coffee boy. this of course after one of trump's foreign policy advisers pleads guilty to lying to the fbi. sean hannity said last night he's a kid, 29 years old. 29. four years older than la david johnson who lost his life in n niger. father of two. he had a third on the way. guess what. 29 years old, not a kid. old enough to know don't lie to the fbi. wn "washington post" reports the president was fuming over the news. trump went on the defense tweeting about how few people knew the low level volunteer named george. he writes he was a liar . >> tried to minimize papadopoulos even further calling him a coffee boy.
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but here's what the president said about this young adviser loser liar coffee boy in march of 2016. unprompted. >> george papadopoulos, he's an oil and energy consultant. excellent guy. >> can i say one thing? an energy consultant. he had on his linkedin page, model u.n. that was on his list of credentials. i was student council president in high school. so watch out white house, there's my credentials. >> let's talktalk papadopoulos. let's take a look at some of the highlights. after learning that he would be joining the trump campaign as an adviser, you just heard president trump statalking abou that. in march of 2016, papadopoulos was in contact with an overseas
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professor. someone he, quote, understood to have substantial ties to russian government officials. the communications began around march 14th of 2016. the professor only becoming interested in papadopoulos because of his status with the campaign. on march 24th of 2016, papadopoulos e-mailed an unnamed campaign supervisor and several members of the foreign policy team of which he was one to inform them that he had met with the professor and a female russian national described as putin's niece. though authorities determined that the woman is not, in fact, the president's niece. okay. so a week after that, march 31st, 2016. papadopoulos sat in on a meeting with the future president, with jeff sessions. here's the president. the head of the table. on april 25th, 2016, this is the coffee boy. the low level volunteer. he e-mailed a senior policy adviser for the campaign telling them, quote, the russian government has an open
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invitation by mr. trump to meet him when he is ready. the next day the professor tells papadopoulos of thousands of e-mails that the russians had dirt on hillary clinton in the form of thousands of e-mails. the day after that, april 27th, 2016, papadopoulos again e-mailed a senior policy adviser on the trump team about going to russia. have some interesting messages coming in from moscow about a trip when the time is right. same day. he e-mailed a high ranking campaign official to discuss russia's interest in hosting mr. trump. have been receiving calls over the last month about putin wanting to host him and the team when the time is right. on may 21st, 2016, papadopoulos e-mailed another high official who we now know is paul manafort according to two sources. the e-mail reads russia has been eeg tore meet mr. trump for quite some time and have been reaching out to me to discuss.
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manafort forwarded that to someone saying let's discuss. we need someone to communicate that dt is not doing this trip. it should be someone low level in the campaign so as not to send any signal. from mid-june to mid-august, papadopoulos pursued this off the record meeting between representatives of the trump's campaign and putin's office. and that's just now -- that's now after the famous june 9th meeting in trump tower between the russians, trump's son-in-law, paul manafort at that, jared kushner, donald trump jr., and some russians. on august 15th of 2016, the campaign supervisor in communication with papadopoulos said i would encourage you along with another foreign policy adviser to the campaign to make the trip if it is feasible. on january 27th of this year, papadopoulos was interviewed by the fbi lying about the timing of the communications on this. he was arrested in july of 2017. he pled guilty on october 5th,
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2017. his plea agreement says the government will inform the sentencing judge of papadopoulos' cooperation. and of course we just learned about all of this yesterday. >> you know, this timeline is important because john kelly four star general chief of staff to the president said last night on fox news papadopoulos' actions, you know, happened earlier. they didn't. these actions that are in question happened after he joined the campaign. when he was on staff. joining us now, former attorney for the office of the director of national intelligence. and former assistant fbi director. what do you believe the next step is for this investigation? yesterday sarah huckabee sanders said we're in the winddown mode. i say, i don't think so. >> yeah. i think we're really in the early stages of this. the next stage is with tropt re to mr. papadopoulos have probably largely played out by now. and that is the fbi and bob
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muller's team going back to him getting detailed information about anyone he had conversations with, what their responses were. his opportunity to have further conversations that might be recorded. to firm up those prior conversations. to see if anyone would suggest to him that he misremember or that he obstruct or that he lie to the special counsel's team. and to see if there's other potential corruption there. >> ron, let me ask you something. given that they started interviewing him in january, he was arrested in july, and he pled guilty in october. you think there was any chance he was wearing a wire? >> i think there's a real good chance he was wearing a wire beginning about the time he decided to take a guilty plea. quite clearly they've had additional conversations with him. they've had the cooperation agreement in place. he knows his future sentence depends on the value of that cooperation and the integrity of
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it. he has every bit of motivation to engage in further conversations as directed by mueller's team and record those conversations. >> what does this mean for the white house? the plea deal? we know we're hearing the talking points. he was a coffee boy. he was low level. he was a volunteer. but all of that was irrelevant if this guy was wearing a wire or if there is evidence of him communicating to the staff and ties to russia. >> obviously they've got a lot of talking points out. but what i think the papadopoulos plea does, it fills in a lot of those gaps in that timeline. if you think back to the campaign in the spring and summer, members from the trump campaign, the candidate himself, donald trump was saying a lot of really friendly things about russia in the summer of 2016. he said -- made comments about
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wanting the e-mails from hillary clinton to be revealed. so this is interesting as it's revealed through the plea. what it shows is that during those times that those public statements were being made which were so curious to people with an intelligence community background that he would be making those statements, the campaign knew that russian government officials and individuals affiliated with russia were trying to do outreach to the campaign and were successful at it. there was a back and forth of communication between these individuals in russia and papadopoulos. and he was communicating that back to or senior members. they encouraged him to continue the conversation. of how extensive the communication and potential cooperation was.
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>> hey, ron. obviously law enforcement and muller's team are triangulating at this point. because everyone could have a deal. we know papadopoulos will do well if he fesses up everything he knows. despite a blustery comment, the bottom line is paul manafort and richard gates have got to be thinking carefully about their level of cooperation with the investigation. >> sure. these are very serious charges, you know, for somebody certainly at paul manafort's age. these are charges that could potentially imprison him for the rest of his life. so he has to be looking at what are my real prospects of prevailing? you know, the documents, this is by and large a document case. going to be very telling. what did he fail to declare. did he do with those hidden assets. you know, if i'm a blue collar voter for donald trump reading this indictment, i'm angry.
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because of the amount of money that passed through these guy's hands. untaxed. >> you could say that for the last ten months. that forgotten american vote who are wanted the swamp drain who believed they were his guy, who railed against goldman sachs and wall street while on the campaign trail. welcome to the age of hypocrisy. so president trump's base, do you really think they're going to be outraged by paul manafort and 75 million bucks? they haven't blinked yet. >> it wouldn't be the first time people get outraged by one thing or another without reading the essential facts. as a friend said to me and we used to have this conversation in the fbi. if you want get angry, read the indictment. >> no kidding. >> there's enough to be angry. >> it's an indictment everyone can understand too. what do you think gates and manafort's next move should be?
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>> manafort's house was searched. he obviously had a lot of notice that he was going to be charged. so his opportunity to cooperate, i think he had a big opportunity to do that. mr. gates, it was a little bit surprising that he appeared before the judge yesterday without a retained attorney. and so that looks, perhaps, like he did not quite understand the seriousness that he was coming at him. but what i would say, also, with respect to sort of anybody in trump's orbit is anyone who was interviewed by these federal frv investigators. they ought not lie nap goes throughout the papadopoulos plea as well as information that gates and manafort have provided to the government in the past where they were not truthful. and so there are so many people who are in this orbit who are
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going to be interviewed. all of them are going to determine whether or not they're going to be truthful in that they're going to prosecute for false statements. >> ali velshi, put russia aside. you had nine detailed pages of a paul manafort money trail. during the campaign, i went to see one of president trump's largest wall street backers. he said donald trump when it comes to business is a sloppy guy. there's a lot of business he's not going to want revealed. whether you're talking about paul manafort or you continue, where was a lot of that money funneled through? i mentioned it earlier. in 2014 he bought a stake in that bank. zblit could be a weird coincidence. >> but we can call papadopoulos a coffee boy all day long. but if you have 75 million bucks being laundered and your
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commerce secretary sits on that board, robert mueller is going to have more questions. it doesn't matter if the white house wants to deflect and distract. robert mueller isn't getting distracted. >> ron, kerry, thanks very much to both of you. we're going to stay on this story because there's a lot to dig through. stick around, everyone. john kelly defending confederate general robert e. lee. how come? >> and coming up next, we're getting reactions to his thoughts on the civil war like these. >> tell you that robert e. lee was an honorable man. the lack of an ability to compromise led to the civil war. and men and women of faith on both sides made their stand where their conscience helped them make their stand. greatest . selfies, cat videos and winking emojis. speaking of tech wonders, with the geico app you can get roadside assistance, digital id cards... or even file a claim. do that.. yeah, yeah that should work.
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welcome back to "velshi & rhule." this morning white house chief of staff john kelly is again facing criticism for some controversial remarks. this time it's for comments he made about the civil war and confederate general robert e. lee. that came during an interview on fox news last night where he was asked about the recent decision by a virginia church to remove plaques that honored both george washington and robert e. lee. >> history is history. certain things in history that were not so good and other things that were very, very good. i think we make a mistake in
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society and certainly as individuals when we take what is today accepted as right and wrong and go back 100, 200, 300 years or more. it shows you what -- how much of a lack of appreciation of history is. robert e. lee was an honorable man. he was a man that gave up his country to fight for his state which 150 years ago was more important to country. it was always loyalty to state first in those days. now it's different today. but the lack of an ability to compromise led to the civil war. and men and women of good faith on both sides helped them make their stand. >> history is history. but for fact's sake, let's tell the truth. first of all, historic fact number one. the civil war was fought over
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slavery. 11 southern states left the union back in 1860 and 1861 in order to protect the institution of slavery following the election of president abraham lincoln. lincoln was an avowed opponent of the expansion of slavery that said he would not interfere with it where it already existed. from history.net, the burning issue that led to the disruption of the union was the debate over the future of slavery nap dispute led to secession. and secession brought about a war. the first state to secede, south carolina on december 20th, 1860, approved of an ordinance of secession and offered an invitation to form a confederacy of slave holding states. robert e. lee served in the u.s. army and became superintendent at west point in april of 1861 he was offered command of all federal forces but lee declined. resigned from the army and accepted a general's commission
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in the newly formed confederate army. >> all right. general kelly's comments touched off strong responses on social media. berniece king tweeted, it's irresponsible and dangerous especially when white supremacists feel emboldened to make fighting to maintain slavery sound courageous. all right. joining us live is rowland martin of tv one's "news one." john kelly said not to appreciate this shows a lack of appreciation for history. you have tweeted out this morning calling kelly's comments insanely stupid. tell me how you really feel about this. >> yeah. i'm not going to allow four stars to allow stuck on stupid to simply go on. here's a man who's utterly clueless. for him to say, well, we could have compromised. really? we did compromise. it was a thing called united states constitution. you know what that said? if you're a black, you're 3/5 of a human. what he should do is go read
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goldstone's book "dark bargain" the details with the south to get the constitution passed. you want to talk compromise? how about the hayes/tilden compromise that ended the 12 years of reconstruction and ushered in jim crow, removed the federal troops from the last three remaining southern capitals. we could talk about compromise the fact we had a civil rights act and didn't get one until 1957 which was weak. how about compromise? we had three reconstruction amendments. 13th, 14th, 15th. you know what? america didn't care about those constitutional amendments because of that 1877 compromise which led to the civil rights act of '64. and the voter right act of '65. and so i need john kelly to actually go back and read a history book that my 12-year-old nieces are reading right now because clearly he fell asleep in history. >> i don't know if he fell
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asleep in history, but my son in sixth grade is reading the same lesson. what about the claim that 150 years ago state wrs more important than country and that he gave up his country to fight for the state of virginia. robert e. lee, i'm talking about. >> well, guess what then. then i want to see general kelly defend anybody in isis. they're giving up country for their ideology. it's the same exact thing. see, this is how we normalize white supremacy. then to say, well, we don't have an appreciation of history. i love this whole deal about how, you know, he was an honorable man. really? there were abolitionists during that particular period who did not believe in slavery. don't call the men of their time. but maybe general kelly also didn't read this which was from norris, one of the slaves he had with where he said when we ran away he asked why we run away. we said because we're free. he order us to be beaten given
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50 lashes. when one of his overseers wouldn't do it, he called a county constable to give us the lashes. it was lee who said lay it on well. which he did not fail to heed. not satisfied with simply lacerating our naked flesh, general lee then ordered the overseer to thoroughly wash our backs with brine which was done. you call that honorable? you call that decent? >> what about kelly saying is it fair to judge what happened in that time by the norms and morals and understandings that we have today? >> i'm not judging it by the norms and the morals of today. i'm judging it and the norms of morals of abolitionist who is were also white. individuals who did not believe in slavery. individuals who did not miscon true and pimp and degrade the bible. there were men and women who were white and american and did not believe in slavery. i'm not going to somehow excuse this by saying, well, you know, they were imperfect human beings. it's not going to happen.
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then i was listening to fox and friends this morning saying do we negate the declaration of independence? maybe we can because he said the life and pursuit of happiness which wasn't the case if you were slaves. we have too many people in this country who are white who do not know history who want to somehow glorify these confederate leaders. and i'm telling you right now, they ain't my founding fathers and they're not my leaders. we need to have real history, not a his-story, but a history. and i will say that john kelly, shame on you. and also, you owe congresswoman wilson an apology for lying. don't you talk about honor and sacred and how we treat women when you lied to the american people and you're not man enough to admit it. >> roland martin. >> you don't have to be a man to tell the truth. there are plenty of women who know how to tell the truth. >> absolutely. >> the civil war was about slavery. and i mentioned it earlier last
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night, john kelly lied about paul manafort's relationship with president trump. he lied about george papadopoulos -- how do i say it? papadopoulos when he did what. so you can be a four star general. doesn't mean you tell the truth all the time. >> and quick, laura ingraham, you need to read a history book too. you don't know what the hell you doing. >> thanks, roland. >> go astros. in light of the ongoing fight against confederate monuments in this country, we want to introduce you to something that means a lot to ali and i. monumental americans. those who may be deserving of a statue. today it's horace albright who helped make national parks what they are today. >> albright was born in california in 1890. he worked for the department of the interior in washington when the national parks service was formed in 1916. in 1929, he became the second-ever director of the park service.
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>> he was a superintendent of yellowstone and yosemite park and is responsible for opening national parks to regular people. in 1980, he was awarded the presidential medal of freedom. albright died in 1987 when he was 97 years old. >> if you've got a monumental american, tweet us. stay with us. you're watching "velshi & rhule" on msnbc. america's beverage companies have come together to bring you more ways to help reduce calories from sugar. with more great tasting beverages with less sugar or no sugar at all, smaller portion sizes, clear calorie labels, and signs reminding everyone to think balance before choosing their beverages. we know you care about reducing the sugar in your family's diet, and we're working to support your efforts. more beverage choices. smaller portions.
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the answer company. thomson reuters. you're back with "velshi & rhule." money laundering with b it's a concept we've all heard of. it was a plot point of '80s and '90s movies. it features heavy in the indictments of gates and manafort. how does money laundering work? let's go through it. first money is made illegally. it's dirty money. it could be drug sales, human trafficking, bribes, any ill-gotten gains. dirty money has to be laundered to become clean money. next comes placement. the money is transferred into some sort of legitimate business. sometimes a dummy corporation is set up like what the government alleges manafort and gates did. or it could be an existing business. but one where legitimate records are not maintained. imagine a cash-only business where it would be hard for authorities to trace how much
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business is being done and how much money the business is actually making. that business will typically inflate its costs, falsify its records, or claim to have sold more than it actually had to account for all this dirty money that is suddenly flowing into it. think walter white and his car wash locations in "breaking bad." in manafort's case it would be sifted through other shell corporations. something called layer b. it's another tactor to throw authorities off of a money trail. in many countries these shell companies can be set up with very little personal information. allowing many dummy corporations to operate on paper without actually existing in the real world. cyprus is a popular place for these dummy corporations. so is the caymen islands. but the u.s. is actually a very popular shell company location. in states like nevada, wyoming, delaware famous for being an easy way to incorporate a business. so much so that delaware has more corporate entities than
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people according to "the new york times." now, after this layering part is done, it's time for integration. got to be able to use that money. finish cleaning the dirty money. money launderers buy property such as properties in london or a new york apartment or stock investments. things not likely to lose value. that's sort of the concept behind money laundering. you're not supposed to have or don't want the government to know you have so you do something with it. >> joining us now, an attorney who sits on the advisory board of the journal of tax practice and procedure. brian, when you read this it seems like a complicated web. >> it is complicated. and it looks big but there are really two main things in the indictment. everything else builds on top of that. and the money laundering is really an add-on on top of that.
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>> i'm from canada. i have a bank account in canada. every year i have to fill out a form saying this was the starting balance, ending balance. end of story. i'm done. >> very simple and very common. i represented hundreds of people who did not fill out their reports. foreign bank account reports. most of them don't get prosecuted. >> there's that and the idea one shouldn't forget if you're working for a foreign government, everybody knows that. if you're lobbying for foreign government. they got them on a couple of technicalities. not technicalities, but they're simple matters. but like you said, the charges all stem from there. >> from not reporting the accounts and making false statements in connection to the lobbying. then they say, well, if you earned money from the false statements in connection with the lobby and bringing it back to the united states and you did that to either conceal the illegal activity or to further it or engage in tax evasion, then that's a huge crime that has many, many years in prison attached to it. and also can give rise to
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forfifo forfeiture of your policy. >> that sounds ominous and it sounds general at the same time. what does that even mean? >> that is super general. it's super ominous, but super general too. anything you do to impair or impede the lawful function of the internal revenue service can be a crime. and prosecutors love conspiracy because it's a very broad charge. all you have to do is think about doing something wrong and then take one act and furtherance of it and that would be a conspiracy. >> so if you were these guys' lawyers, one of the things a lot of people point out to us is that they've got a paper trail for all of this. this is not dependent on witnesses, doesn't depend on something not testifying. knowing what you know about these guys, what is their best course of action here? >> i think i see the defense in the indictment. the defense is both of these things are gray areas. whether you have a foreign account that has to be reported in the united states, it can be simple if you own the account yourself. not so simple if it's owned by
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other corporations or other entities. same thing about lobbying in the united states and acting as an agent for somebody else. that could be a gray area. both of these folks are going to say we had professionals around us. we had lawyers. we had advisers. and we relied on them. if you relied on somebody else who told you it was okay, that could be a complete defense. >> because the law doesn't actually allow that to happen, though, right? in the end i can't say it's all on my accountant. >> you can. you can say it's all on your accountant if you really in good faith relied on the accountant and gave all the correct information. the accountant tells you it's okay -- >> so my accountant always sends me a thing when i'm filing my taxes. it's sort of a statement that says we prepared these based on information provided by you. >> that's what that's all about. if you give them false information, it's back on you. but if you gave them the right information and they made a mistake, they're the one who is are responsible. >> before we go, were you surprised at the level of detail? i mean, that was eight pages of a very detailed money trail.
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>> i was surprised at the level of the money trail itself. i would be nervous if i had a client that had all of those transactions. usually it's one or two. this was a lot. but that tells me he thought he might have been doing it okay. that's why i think he's relying on somebody. i think he's going to say i relied on somebody to tell me that was okay to do. >> we'll soon find out. brian, thank you. stick around everybody. >> shocking new numbers on russia's attempts to influence the 2016 election. facebook says nearly 1/3 of americans were exposed to russia funded content. twitter discovered nearly 37,000 fake accounts linked to russia. this coming just hours before facebook, twitter, and google appear before investigators on capitol hill today. >> and here is our political cartoon of the day. it shows two voice bubbles coming out of trump tower. one says, quote, clinton paid for opposition research on me. it is a very sad commentary on politics in this country. the other says, quote, sir the
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russians with dirt on hillary is here and julian assange has returned your call. >> you're watching "velshi & rhule" on msnbc. we'll be right back. non-insulin victoza® lowers a1c, and now reduces cardiovascular risk. victoza® lowers my a1c and blood sugar better than the leading branded pill. (avo) and for people with type 2 diabetes treating cardiovascular disease, victoza® is now approved to lower the risk of major cardiovascular events such as heart attack, stroke, or death. and while it isn't for weight loss, victoza® may help you lose some weight. (avo) victoza® is not for people with type 1 diabetes or diabetic ketoacidosis. do not take victoza® if you have a personal or family history of medullary thyroid cancer, multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2, or if you are allergic to victoza® or any of its ingredients. stop taking victoza® and get medical help right away if you get symptoms of a serious allergic reaction such as rash, swelling, difficulty breathing or swallowing.
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welcome back to "velshi & rhule." a live look at capitol hill as we learn how aggressively russia used social media to influence the 2016 election. today representatives of facebook, twitter, and google are preparing to testify at three congressional hearings that begin this afternoon and
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continue to tomorrow. according to prepared testimony obtained by nbc news, facebook will tell congress it now estimates 126 million americans -- that's a third of this country -- may have been exposed to russian-backed content during the election. one-third of our population. facebook revealed that additionally 29 million users received 89,000 posts from 120 russian-backed pages. but through likes, shares, and follows that number skyrockets to 126 million people. there's also alarming new data from twitter. it found nearly 37,000 automated accounts or bots linked to russia. those resulted in nearly 1.4 million tweets, seen 228 million times. google said it found more than 1,100 videos on youtube related to the russian effort. those videos were watched more than 300,000 times.
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joining us now is tony rahm. senior editor for policy and politics at recode. tony, we got to start with what matters to these social media sites like twitter and facebook. these are public companies. every time they report earnings, it is all about user growth. user growth is how they show wall street analysts, look how many eyeballs are on us. it's how they go to advertisers and try to pull advertising dollars saying look at our impact. now we see bot after bot and russian influence. could facebook and twitter see this and stopped it? or did they have their eye on the prize and that's user growth? >> i think it's a little bit of both now. these companies most certainly can't avoid the issue now that they're facing questions on capitol hill to the extent russian agents had their platforms. facebook will report its earnings on november 1st which is the day executives are set to testify. i think you raise an interesting point. the selling point from these
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social media companies is your ability to have impact and reach. and it's not just advertisers. it's users. >> sure. >> it's this notion you can put up content, your friends can see it and maybe reach folks you never met before. interestingly enough, when these appear on capitol hill today, the point they're going to make is this is just a drop in the bucket for them. it's just one small amount of content. so it wasn't that influential. >> stephanie's point is one we follow closely about the finances and the economics and the stock price. the other one is as you say, users. at some point there's got to be a tipping point where regular folks just say, i can't trust the material that's on twitter and facebook. let me tell you, some of the tweets we get we i like to think they're bots and we can't trust them. >> every day we get tweets from accounts with one user, no name, no face. and every quarter twitter likes to say guess how many new users we have. >> yeah. and fixing that problem just to
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hit this nail on the head, fixing that problem means that twitter has to wipe out accounts and it looks like it's lost accounts. it's difficult from the financial perspective and political perspective for a company like twitter to do this. what we get into is what the role of regulation is and how much responsibility we want to put on these platforms to service police officers of sorts about the content posted there. on one hand there's an effort to try to regulate this by focusing on ads, but the companies have rejected that. while there's some attempt to put the onus on companies to stamp this out, there are people that think facebook and twitter and others shouldn't be the ones policing speech because they don't always get it right. it's a difficult problem. and it's one with implications beyond balance sheets. >> so is it a regulatory thing where we decide they are media companies? they really don't want to be labeled as media companies. >> it doesn't matter what they want rb want, ali. >> but media companies like ours
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can be regulated successfully. >> there are levers of power there to go after for these companies and there's a conversation happening right now specifically around the issue of political ads. folks like senator mark warner who's the top who will interview these companies at the hearing tomorrow has put forward legislation that would require them to announce a public file of all political ads on their platform. it's similar to the rules in place for tv networks when they have broadcast ads. that legislation faces some on capitol hill. there are lots of folks fighting over it. it's going to come down to whether they have the political band width and wherewithal to push this across the line. >> of course the tech companies don't want it. no one wants to be regulated but we also know that no one self-regulates. so knowing what happened in the past irrelevant of who you're going to blame, you can make a difference going forward. and at this point, the reach of those social media outlets, just
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ask the ads sales department. are broader than the media. >> but they have a lot of lobbying money and power. that's influencing members of congress who say do i want to be the first guy to regulate the internet which is the way the tech companies are selling this. don't take that step to wreck the internet. >> millions and millions of dollars on the part of these companies. five, six years ago when i first started covering this beat, you didn't see them lo b bying the way they do now. but these are powerful forces on capitol hill. when you layer on top of that the fact that dealing with these issues on social networks, they're very complex. they're very steeped in jargon. they're not easy to do. >> okay. i get it. steeped in jargon. how many times are we going to hear samberg and zuckerberg use the word community. and then four star generals saying the biggest thing moving forward is cyber warfare. >> but it certainly comes down to the hill. it's not that there's a lack of ideas right now on capitol hill. it's not like there aren't folks
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like senator warner pushing for the kind of regulation you're talking about. every time we get to this inflection point, it all the matly doesn't cross the finish line whether it's folks antiregulatory in the republican party or elsewhere or lobbyintsy doesn't get to the finish line, whether it's that or lobbying on the part of tech companies. what you're seeing is a small group of members pushing this regulation. we only have one republican, senator john mccain, who is a powerful retch cpublican, but t don't have a base of support, and it's going to come down to if these members decide they need to prioritize. >> to stephanie's point about the community -- the community -- if you don't know this is hurting you, if you don't understand how this is hurting you on your facebook account or your twitter account or the way you consume news, is there much popular support behind the concept of twitter and facebook changing, or do most facebook and twitter users think it's something that serves
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them well? >> i think it's both right now, and even in the context of russia we see these places label fake news, to try to address a lot of the fact there is garbage on their feeds. twitter in particular has had no choice but to do this because of abuse problems on that platform and they're things they can no longer choose to avoid or for whatever reason it wasn't tackling those previously. but there's certainly an effort on the part of these companies to deal with these things, and it typically does come down to the question of registration. facebook and twitter disclose information about those ads, including who those ads targeted specifically because there was congress threatening this hearing and planning to drag them to capitol hill to ask them about their practices. >> tony robb is a senior editor from policy and politics. >> can i ask you a question? >> yeah. >> two weeks ago was the first opportunity we had in ages to
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hear from cheryl sandberg when she sat down with axios. 200 people backed her on that. what did she talk about with alan? her high school reunion. >> we have given these companies a pass. we're fascinated by them, we're always fascinated by tech companies. if media companies were behaving this way, they would be in big trouble. that's why i was asking tony, we in society have to be met by the garbage we get on social media, the lies, the falsehoods. that's the problem. >> i'm just saying when they have a chance to have a serious conversation in america, those conversations didn't happen. >> they're not going to draw that light on themselves. i would love it the day mark zuckerberg or cheryl sandburg gets up there. >> we find that out now before they testify before congress. all right, happening now on capitol hill, fema administrator
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brock long testifying before a senate hearing on the federal response to recent hurricanes harvey and maria. >> right now donald trump is holding meetings on taxes at the white house. we expect to hear more any moment. you're watching "velshi & ruhle" live on msnbc. and the mohawk valley, which marks the start of our nation's first 50-mile unmanned flight corridor. and allows us to attract the world's top drone talent. all across new york state, we're building the new new york. to grow your business with us in new york state, visit esd.ny.gov.
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welcome back. >> it says stephanie. >> i'm stephanie ruhle dressed as ali velshi. >> welcome back to "velshi & ruhle." the fema chief defends their hurricane response. roughly 70% of puerto rico remains without power after hurricane maria. not long ago brock long talked about the challenges fema is facing this year. >> i've been here for 71 days. for 17 of these days we've been dealing with maria, harvey.
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before harvey hit, fema was reacting to disasters across the nation in many states you folks represent, and now in addition to those major disaster declarations, we were also responding to fire management assistance grants due to fires taking place. while there are many improvements to be made to ensure that the whole community response and that the asset management system continues to grow in a positive way, i do recognize there are many challenges ahead, particularly when it comes to california, texas, florida as well as the virgin islands and puerto rico. cleaning roads, fixing roads, getting rid of debris is also a major mission. there is 3.5 cubic yards of debris in puerto rico alone. communication and cell service is something else. i believe we're up to about 85%, for example, on puerto rico. retail industry is back up to about 90%.
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the water systems are back up to about 80%. so progress is being made but we have a long way to go. >> a long way to go and we need to stay committed to it. >> and we've got our people continuing to cover puerto rico to get you the full story. fbi looking into that whitefish contract. >> today a halloween. >> my favorite holiday. guess who else likes it? first lady melania trump at the white house. she hosted some trick-or-treaters and posted this picture after. #v #velshi &ruhle. what about that blacked out person? we can't tell if that's the dark shadow. maybe that's the deep state. >> thanks for watching this hour of "velshi & ruhle." i'm stephanie ruhle dressed up as ali velshi. >> no, he isn't.
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>> check us out on social media. check out our show. we would love hearing from you unless you're a bot. >> we don't want to hear from you unless you're a bot. regulators, today is your day. google, facebook, twitter. right now we hand things over to andrea mitchell for "andrea mitchell reports." aftershocks. president trump reportedly privately fuming after the mueller indictments shake the white house. >> they were indicted long before i ever met donald trump or had any association with the campaign. >> but publicly they are in denial about any close ties with their former campaign officials. >> can you talk about what president trump's role with the campaign

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