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tv   All In With Chris Hayes  MSNBC  July 15, 2019 5:00pm-6:00pm PDT

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predecessor, franklin roosevelt's idea of being pa president was simply being franklin roosevelt. unfortunately for us and our country's history, donald trump's idea of being president is being donald trump. and that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in" right now with joy reid sitting in for chris hayes. tonight on "all in" -- >> so the first note that i want to tell children across this country is that no matter what the president says, this country belongs to you. >> four freshmen congresswomen respond to racist attacks from the president. >> it is time for us to stop allowing this president to make a mockery out of our constitution. tonight, the political firestorm over donald trump's racist politics and policy. >> does it concern you that many people saw that tweet as racist and that white nationalist
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groups are finding common cause with you on that point? >> it doesn't concern me because many people agree with me. and how democratic leadership is responding to the president's attacks. >> weak minds and leaders challenge loyalty to our country in order to avoid challenging and debating the policy. then -- >> we all know that aoc and this crowd are a bunch of communists. >> tim alberta on his new book "american carnage" on how donald trump took over the republican party. and exclusive reporting from nbc news on the 70 current and former border protection employees now under investigation when "all in" starts now. good evening from washington, d.c. i'm joy reid in for chris hayes. well, for the last three years
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there's been this agonized national debate, is donald trump a racist? does he realize that the thing he just said is exciting racists and white nationalists? does the thing he said this time finally prove he's a racist? but you know who has not been having this big debate? donald trump. after decades of clear evidence of racism, trump clearly knows exactly what he's saying and to whom, and as president he has consistently backed up his racist talk with policy. he's putting real racist policy on the table designed to excite racially anxious white americans and to terrify people who aren't white. so, yes, donald trump is really racist, fini. this weekend trump added to the ledger targeting four black and brown democratic congresswomen, representatives alexandria ocasio-cortez, ilhan omar, ayanna presley and rashida tlaib, to punish them for criticizing his hideous immigration policies, including
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locking central american men, women and children in crowded cages where they are told to drink water from the toilet. trump pulled the ultimate barbecue becky telling them they don't belong here. trump in a tweet storm told these four american congresswomen to go back to the countries from where they came from. all are born in america. one in the bronx, michigan, chicago, and one naturalized from somalia as a teenager. trump was asked if it bothered him white nationalists were high-fiving what he said. >> does it concern you that many people saw that tweet as racist and that white nationalist groups are finding common cause with you on that point? >> it doesn't concern me because many people agree with me, and all i'm saying they want to leave, they can leave. >> right. i mean, why would it bother him? his people loved it. now, to be clear, this was the man who called america a loser and trashed everything about this country while he was running for president.
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everything. but now if you don't like donald trump's version of america, self-deport. well, today the four women got their chance to respond, and they made it clear they will not be intimidated by donald trump. and they will keep on fighting for the country that they love. >> every single statement that we make is from a place of extreme love for every single person in this country. now, when people say if you say a negative thing about the policies in this country, you hate this country, to me it sort of speaks to the hypocrisy and alex and i were talking about this. when this president ran and until today, he talked about everything that was wrong in this country and how he was going to make it great. and so for him to condemn us and to say we are un-american for wanting to work hard to make this country be the country we all deserve to live in?
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it's complete hypocrisy. >> weak minds and leaders challenge loyalty to our country in order to avoid challenging and debating the policy. this president does not know how to make the argument that mariners americans do not deserve health care. he does not know how to defend his policies, so what he does is attack us personally. and that is what this is all about. he can't look a child in the face and he can't look all americans in the face and justify why this country is throwing them in cages. >> what the congresswoman was referring to, of course, was put on display on friday when trump sent mike pence and three republican congressmen to do some pr for the internment camps, but what america saw instead was visual proof of what democratic congressmembers have
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told the country the trump administration is doing in our name. nearly 400 men caged with no cots in a space so crowded they could not even lie down on the concrete. they were hungry, dirty and said they'd been there for 40 days or longer with not even a chance to take a shower. the guards wore face masks. a reporter described the stench as horrendous. and today trump took it a step lower, moving to prevent most central american migrants from even claiming asylum in this country. the move coming after he promised for the second time large-scale immigration raids to begin this past weekend. now, like most promises, the reality fell far short of the hype, with fewer raids than promised, but the message got through loud and clear to his base that he is scaring and hurting the right people. it's the same message that he sends when he locks children and adults in cages and questioned the birthplace of the nation's first black president and
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attacks democratic women of color, not just for what they believe but for who they are. >> despite the occupant of the white house's attempts to marginalize us and to silence us, please know that we are more than four people. we ran on a mandate to advocate and represent those ignored, left out and left behind. our squad is big. our squad includes any person committed to building a more equitable and just world. and that is the work that we want to get back to. and given the size of this squad and this great nation, we cannot, we will not be silenced. >> joining me now is an msnbc political analyst author of "the true american" and travelled the country exploring the roots and manifestations of xenophobic racism. thank you very much for being
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here. let's talk about this. it's so typical for us to talk about donald trump is he a racist, is he not? yeah, he is. we know that's the case. the question is not about him at this point, it's about the people who this impacts and who this works so strongly with. what do you know, you know, being around the country and talking with people about them? >> we are so in a date to day dumpster fire alert mode with this president that i think we sometimes forget the longer term shift this country is in the middle of, which is a shift of identity of a kind that, frankly, very few superpowers in history have ever gone through. we're seeing the racial identity of this country shift, the coming eventually of a white minority, people of color majority, we are seeing gender relations thrown up in ways that i think are fantastic but are
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discombobulateding for discombobulating for a lot of people. and donald trump has clearly decided that his movement and the republican party he leads is going to be the movement of resentment against the future. it is going to be a movement of people who don't want to live in the future. it is going to be a movement of people who want to cling to whatever white power can be clung to with a senate that allows a majority of people to rule and with a supreme court that reps their interests. it's going to be an america that allows men to cling to whatever opportunities they have to be locker room boys, as he talked about. and there is no attempt -- this is a break even from republicans of a few years ago, who at least were interested, if not so effectual, at winning some hispanic votes, reaching out to the black community, thinking about how they could win women. this is a movement. i think it's a very bad long-term strategy. i think it's a better short-term strategy than a lot of us
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realize. this, the movement to preserve and speak to the resentful and preserve the last vestiges of their power for as long as possible as essentially become the purpose of this sad man who doesn't seem to love himself much and seems to need to belittle people to feel the barest vestiges of anything to be proud of. >> well, you know, this is interesting when you talk about that. republicans going all the way back to nixon, telling people resentful of the future they don't want the next black family moving into the neighborhood. they're resentful of the idea that their kids have to go to school, either be bussed out or kids be bussed in, that's not a new thing. donald trump has just taken, you know, the sheet off of it. he says it very clearly. but what you just talked about, i do think about w.b. dubois because he's somebody who is not willing to give white americans anything. i'm not giving you tax cuts. those go to the rich. i'm not giving you help with
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your farms. you may lose your farms because i'm doing tariffs. to hell with you. i take away maybe things the government could give you, but i'm giving you this white privilege. i'm giving you this power. i'm saying you are the only americans. that's all he's got to give them at this point. >> it's so correct and it's such a remarkable thing because as you say, there was at least in the past some gestures of offerings of -- to regular people. here the entire offering is chauvinism. the entire offering is men can continue to be locker room boys and white people can continue to receive more than they deserve. and other people will continue to be locked out of opportunities. and what i actually appreciate about donald trump is that he has eliminated subtext in american life. it is all text now. this -- this is explicit, right? this is the thing i have heard a handful of times in my life, go back to your country.
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this is the thing i heard at a fourth of july picnic in boston some years ago, go back to your country. but now the president is saying it. now this is go back to your countryism, the national ideology as expressed by the white house. i want to say when it was said to me some years ago in boston "go back to your country," a man who was angry about who could see the fireworks and who couldn't. right after he said that, a white man, a tall white man -- another white man standing not far away stepped forward. he hadn't seen this second man. he stepped forward -- >> right. >> and he looked like what you might imagine a trump voter looks like. tattoos everywhere. bandana -- american flag bandana. big beefy guy. and he steps forward and looks at the guy who had said to us "go back to your country." he looked at him and said stop it, these are my people, too. that phrase i think has a lot of
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redemptive power. that's the phrase that those four women were acting on in the previous tape. these are my people, too. >> yep. >> that is the countertradition that we must find in this moment. >> yeah. and, unfortunately, won't find it in the white house. anan thank you very much. house speaker nancy pelosi meanwhile has had something of a fraught relationship with the same democratic women who trump attacked this weekend. in a tweet yesterday, in response to trump's comments, pelosi said the following. "i reject trump's xenophobic comments meant to divide our nation. rather than attack members of congress, he should work with us for humane immigration policy that reflects the american values. stop the raids. #familiesbelongtogether." i'm joined by a columnist at "the new york times" and jayson johnson, the politics editor at the root. jason, i'm going to start with you at the table. i think of the wages of whiteness conversation. trump doesn't have anything to offer his base. there is nothing economic on the
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table for them. he is offering them this thing that is more powerful. i think about the democrats now, they seem to have an offer as well, which is we are going to somehow find the past when we could do policy and go back to an era when we had normal politics. >> right. >> is that a stronger -- i mean, she said let's do policy on immigration. is that a stronger argument than what trump is doing? >> no, no, it's not a stronger policy. it's like you can't give me -- i want real coke, not diet coke. i want the real thing. there are people who hunger for racism. there are white people in this country who have wanted it all along. i have to say this, joy, there are people in our industry that have wanted this sort of validation from the president. and part of the failure of the democrats is a failure of message, it's a failure of our discussion of these issues. look, at the end of the day, this discussion you said this brilliantly at the beginning. it's not about donald trump being a racist, right? i mean, like, everybody today who has finally moved from racially tinged. >> racially charged. >> racially sauted. to finally saying, hey, welcome to the party, right?
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you finally figured it out, right? but the issue isn't just that he is racist in what he said, we failed to discuss and integrate that no how we look at his policy. the democrats don't do that. the census, it's racist. i.c.e. raid, it's racist. all of his immigration policy, it's racist. we have to attach these words to policies. as long as the democrats can pretend we can turn back the clock to 1998, we'll continue to fail. that's the danger of this. >> michelle, it is interesting to me, on the one hand people were saying, well, trump brought the democrats together. got speaker pelosi to defend these four women. but it did strike me that at the end of her defense of them, she goes then into a plea to do immigration policy, whose immigration policy is to lock up brown people in cages and not feed them. so it's a weird turn to say that the answer then is to somehow compel him to, you know, to jason's point, do something other than racist immigration policy. what is the moderation between racist immigration policy and
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what she wants to do? >> well, i think that, you know, you see this split in the democratic caucus because -- between those who want to really take on this president directly, make his unfitness, his corruption, his disloyalty to this country, make that kind of the centerpiece of democratic politics right now and put him on trial every day in the house of representatives. then you have nancy pelosi and other people in democratic house leadership who believe that they need to be the, quote, unquote, adults in the room. that they need to be the face of normality in this country. so they've been passing all of these message bills, some of which are perfectly good pieces of legislation, and then they seem surprised that these bills that have no chance of ever becoming law don't kind of dominate the agenda or don't change the conversation. and i think that because nancy pelosi has tried so hard to tamp down the anger of the democratic caucus and the democratic base that should be directed at donald trump, instead it's been directed internally.
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and so you have these outbreaks of really, really counterproductive fighting and sniping within the kaubs. caucus. and it's true. i think that donald trump has brought them together for now, but it was this dissension and this discord that he's been exploiting in in the first place by going on this racist rampage. >> right. and, i mean, jason, you had some democratic officials circulating a poll that white, you know, white working class people don't like alexandria ocasio-cortez. well, yeah, no kidding, right? and i'm not sure whether that means it should worry us that they realize that there are more trumpists than we think. that in their mind they're saying, wait a minute, we're worried that there is a broader electoral f electorate for those racist policies so we need to somehow appease those in advance. >> a lot of them still subscribe to it. many democrats, not all, they don't hate donald trump as much as they love white supremacy because it still been finefits .
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when you're running against donald trump, you're running against this administration, you can make an argument about his moral failures and you can make a policy argument. for 2020, give me a candidate who can do both. that's what we actually need right now. to the degree they want to do this circular firing squad, i personally don't care that the president is a racist, okay? i don't care that he hates brown people. we've always known that. what i care about is a party that seems to to not understand how that manifests itself in a immediate danger. i'll say this above and beyond policy, joy, we've had two members of congress get shot in the last ten years, a republican and democrat. this kind of violence, this kind of rhetoric from this president is not just about we can clean it up with policy. these women are in danger. we have a party that doesn't seem to realize that. >> is that the point? i don't know what the disconnect is. do the leadership in the democratic party -- do they genuinely view donald trump as just sort of a normal maybe a little utre republican and not a danger just to these women,
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because jason's right, when he spee speaks he calls upon a group of people who include very violent people. also to the constitution. do they not see the danger of him and just think these women are an irritant. >> no, i think they see the danger but they also see these women as an irritant. my sense is that their perception of the electorate is, you know, was very much shaped by many, many decades of democrats being constantly on the defensive and constantly having to run away from any association with radicalism. and so there are people like ocasio-cortez and other people on the left who look at the trump election and think that a base-first strategy, a strategy of being forthright about your values and -- >> right. >> -- saying things that didn't used to be permissible in the public discourse can also work for progressives. and i think fundamentally a lot of people in the democratic leadership don't believe that. >> yeah. >> they still think that the only way back from this nightmare is to get some portion
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of those -- i think it was 9 million people who voted for obama and then voted for donald trump. >> yeah. >> rather than the people who voted for obama and then stayed home. >> yeah. >> or the people who voted for jill stein who were, frankly, trump's margin of victory in a lot of the swing states. >> 7 million people didn't vote at all. michelle goldberg and jason johnson, thank you both. up next, donald trump's complete and total takeover of the republican party with his most vocal opponents eventually falling in line behind their racist leader. author tim alberta chronicles trump's rise in his new book. he joins me next.
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way back in 2015, well
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before donald trump was president or even the republican nominee, back when senator lindsey graham still had a spine and something of a conscience, this is how he described donald trump. >> race baiting, xenophobic religious bigot. he doesn't represent my party. >> fast forward four years and lindsey graham is up for re-election, and so there is no more conscience, just haydra, al day every day in the wake of trump's racist tirade against four congresswomen of color. lindsey graham reached back to 1950s criticism. >> we all know that aoc and this crowd are a bunch of communists. they hate israel. they hate our own country. they're calling the guards along our border, the border patrol agents, concentration camp guards. they accuse people who support israel of doing it for the benjamins.
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they're anti-semitic. they're anti-american. >> commies. perfect. lindsey graham running to the president's side once again. he must be an exceptional caddie. he is hardly alone in his complete swoubordination to dond trump. only a handful of congressional republicans have voiced opposition at all. joining me now for more on the republican embrace of donald trump is tim alberta, chief political correspondent at politico magazine and author of new book of "american carnage." tim alberta, thanks for being here. the piece of your book that everybody's been talking about this week is paul ryan and this sort of agonized subsequent explanation of his life in politics. this is the quote. "we've gotten so numb to it all, says ryan, not in government, the way we live our lives, we have a responsibility to try to rebuild. don't call a woman a horse face. don't cheat on your wife. don't cheat on anything. be a good person. set a good example." he was probably, paul ryan, the
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biggest capitulator to trump of all. he would hide when donald trump would say something bad. is he the kind of patient zero of what happened to republicans? are they just scared of trump? what is it? >> boy, look, it's a combination of things, obviously. and ryan i think obviously does carry the burden in terms of his legacy of being one of the chief enablers of donald trump, given that he was the most powerful man in the co-equal branch of government, the branch of government that is given primacy under the constitution, article i. paul ryan, you know, told me that and i could sort of see on his face and hear in his voice that this was almost his way of apologizing or justifying or maybe a little bit of both, you know, what had gone on the last couple of years, joy. i think it's really interesting. when paul ryan is talking about this idea that outside of government now we have a responsibility to try and rebuild, he's basically saying, you know, forget about government, we can't count on washington, d.c., we can't count on the president, we can't count on congress to try and solve these problems and try to calm
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things down and bring this country together. we need to do that outside of government. a lot of people would say that's rich coming from a guy who made very little effort to rein this guy in while you were in government. so, again, i think it's almost his way of trying to rationalize his exit and saying, look, i'm sort of washing my hands of this place. paul ryan is not alone, to your point of l kbrindsey graham and others. at least paul ryan will in retirement say what's really on his mind. i don't know that we'll get that from any of these other folks. that's not meant to be an ad hominem attack, it's an observational reality. you had rick perry call donald trump a cancer on conservatism. that's something we conveniently forget. ted cruz, we all know the saga. these folks who have come to jesus and made their peace with donald trump. there's a reason for it. it's because they're terrified of him. they understand that this is trump's party. that his base is fully behind him. that as unpopular as he may be with the broader electorate, with moderates and independents,
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he has a chokehold on the republican base. if they're on the wrong side of them, they're going to lose their jobs. >> paul ryan, rich of him to say sitting on the board of fox, is that where he's going to change the country for the better? is it fair? what is it? is it that donald trump is speaking a sort of vehement kind of racist invective that they can see that the base likes? are they shocked by that and thinking, oh, my god, i better sub-orden myself to it or they're getting the judges and tax cuts they want and they don't care because they're benefitting? >> so i actually do think it's both, frankly. think of it this way. if you're a republican, you understand that for a stretch of time after george w. bush left office the party was in this wilderness phase and its identity was really being fought over on ideological grounds. you know, are you part of the outsider insurgency class or an insider establishment guys. are you a tea party conservative or a washington moderate? the playing field has completely
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changed, joy. the fault lines are completely different. it's essentially are you with trump or are you against trump? politics is self-preservation. we know that. you spend five minutes on capitol hill and you come to understand that very quickly. if you're a republican right now you look around and see what happened to mark sanford, to jeff flake, justin amash had to leave the party because he wasn't going to win a republican primary after being the only republican member in congress to advocate for impeachment hearings. >> right. >> these folks look around and not only want to protect their own hyde, but they can also rationalize it and say, look, i can handle trump. i can at least by not speaking out against him publicly, this was paul ryan's approach all along. if i don't speak out against him publicly, i can maintain my influence in private and put points on the boards for my constituents. that's how they rationalize it. >> tim alberta, fascinating book. "american carnage: on the front lines of the republican civil war and the rise of president
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trump." it is on sale tomorrow. so pick it up, everyone. thank you very much. and up next, the new investigation into 70 current and former members of customs and border patrol. what we know right after this. beep goes off ] now that you have new dr. scholl's massaging gel advanced insoles with softer, bouncier gel waves, you'll move over 10% more than before. dr. scholl's. born to move.
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70 current and former customs and border protection employees are under investigation tonight for participating in a secret facebook group where members of the group mocked the deaths of mikes and posted racist and sexist content. while the current head of the
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border patrol called the posts "completely inappropriate" when they were revealed, we learned just last week that not only was she aware of the group, she appears to have been an active member of it. here with me democratic congressman david price of north carolina. the congressman helped lead the effort to prevent the use of federal funding to keep migrants in mexico while they seek asylum. congressman, give us the status of the investigation into this group. is there anything congress, by the way, is going to do about it? >> well, the immediate responsibility is the office of professional responsibility in -- in cbp in the homeland security department. they do have an investigation under way. it's very alarming, the evidence of what was posted very recently, but this has been going on for a long time. making fun of the plight of migrants. going after their political cribs.
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i critics. i'm not sure what else. this is completely unacceptable as they now belated the knowledge. and i expect this will be taken up in the congress, but the first line of investigation is the office of professional responsibility. >> and is -- given all that we've seen, the facebook groups where people are mocking migrants, the scene that we saw when the vice president and three members of congress, including lindsey graham, went down and saw, you know, men packed into cages and the president's comments today mocking members of congress. is there any reason to believe that the money that was approved by congress to give to i.c.e., to cbp, is going to be used in any way properly? is there any reason that congress should have trusted the administration to do the right thing with that money? >> well, with a normal administration, one would not have to do too many legislative additions to the -- to the appropriation to make sure it's properly spent, but we don't trust this administration for very good reasons, for a lot of
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the reasons you cite. so we in the house passed a version of that appropriation which was much more constrained, much more -- much better defined, exactly what the money was to be used for and a lot of standards in that bill as to the treatment that migrants were going to receive. unfortunately, mitch mcconnell stiff-armed that version of the bill, but it -- it remains our responsibly, i think, now that the money has been appropriated. and goodness knows the money's needed, but it needs to be spent in the right way. now it's our responsibility to do very vigilant oversight, much, much more than we're used to. just to watch them like hawks and make sure this money is not -- is not badly spent. >> and how do you do that? how do you do that? is there a potential of, you know, impeaching officials at i.c.e.? is there something that congress can do right now? >> well, i was just part of a congressional group that went down to brownsville and mcallen on saturday. that's one thing we do, is to
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insist on being admitted to these facilities and go in there and talk to the migrants themselves, look for ourselves as to what's going on, and there needs to be repeated vigilance of that sort, and, of course, we have a committee structure here where we can hold oversight hearings and call in the responsible officials and call in other groups. >> right. >> there are lots of people concerned about this situation, lawyers, others in ngos and so forth who are there trying to help and who have -- who have important things to say about what they've observed. >> right. >> so i just think even if we had been able to get those safeguards in the appropriations bill, i just think this is a time to really, really be on our toes in terms of oversight. >> congressman david price, thank you very much. really appreciate your time tonight. thank you. >> thank you. all right. ahead, jeffrey epstein's first day in court where prosecutors say that they found, get this, piles of cash and a fake passport in his safe. incredible details from today's hearing after this. ♪
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jeffrey epstein made an appearance in a federal district courthouse today in manhattan, where prosecutors urged a judge to deny bail to the accused sex trafficker. and one of the things that we learned from the hearing today is that when fbi agents raided jeffrey epstein's manhattan mansion, they found a safe with piles of cash, diamonds and an expired passport issued from a foreign country listing saudi arabia as epstein's place of residence. the passport appeared to have jeffrey epstein's picture but was revengistered to a fake nam. two women who accused jeffrey epstein of sexual abuse testified in court asking the judge to deny him bail. one of whom alleges epstein assaulted her when she was just 14 years old told the judge "he's a scary person to have walking the streets." the judge said he would not rule on whether epstein should be granted bail until thursday. joining me now is casey frank,
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senior editor of investigations at the "miami herald." you were in court today. can you give us a little of the other color that went on? >> i was not in court today, our reporter julie brown was in court today, but it was very interesting. remember that these accusers never had the chance to face mr. epstein in court. well, today they did. and i think the judge surprised the courtroom when he said if there are any accusers here, i'd like to give them the opportunity to say something, and these two young women, annie farmer and courtney wild, stepped forward and had their say. they didn't go into great detail about the nature of the alleged crimes, but they did say, as you noted, that he's a dangerous man and they would be very uncomfortable if he were allowed to go free on bail. they stood just three or four feet away from mr. epstein when they were doing the talking, and at one point as -- as courtney
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wild spoke mr. epstein was noticed shaking his head in the negative. >> yeah. let me play just a little bit of the very famed attorney, very renowned attorney who represents three of epstein's accusers. he talked about -- about that testimony and how courageous it was. take a listen. >> the most powerful testimony was not from any of the lawyers in there, it was from these two brave women who were prepared to step forward and talk, and they told the story about how as young teenagers they were abused by mr. epstein. and asked the court not to release him pending trial. >> we also now know that jeffrey epstein wired $350,000 to two people who are potential witnesses against him at a previous trial. did that come up much in court today and could that maybe be the reason that he is deemed too much of a flight risk to allow
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out, in addition to the horror of his alleged crimes? >> well, it certainly did come up in court today, and the attorney for mr. epstein said just because he wired $350,000 to friends of his -- or one was a friend. one was a former employee. two or three days after the "miami herald" did its reporting on -- on his case doesn't mean that there is anything wrong with that. perhaps he just sends money like that because he's a very wealthy man. it seemed like the judge was skeptical of that suggestion and -- and, yes, that -- that did come up and could come up again on thursday when the judge -- >> yeah. >> -- makes his ruling. >> yeah, probably the most outrageous part of it, epstein arguing that epstein has been crime-free since he was out of jail. telling the judge it's not like he's an out of control rapist. that ought to be a powerful
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argument on his behalf. casey frank, thank you very much. really appreciate your time. >> thank you. you're welcome. still ahead, the fight for the future of the democratic party. that's next. t. award winning design. award winning engine. the volvo xc90. the most awarded luxury suv of the century.
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as we mentioned earlier, all eyes this joonafternoon were on four young democratic freshmen who many see as the future of the party, and as women, women of color of multiple religions physically embodied the physical opposition to trumpism. the four women held a press conference firing back at president trump after he launched a racist attack, telling them to go back to their countries despite the fact of them being american. we're witnessing this ugly fight of what the future of america is going to look like, but when you look at the state of the 2020 race among democrats, it's the man in many ways who represents the democratic party's past who is leading in the polls, particularly in the polls regarding who could do best in the battle to replace donald trump. the latest nbc news/"wall street journal" poll shows joe biden beating the president by the
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largest margin, by 9 percentage points, 51% to 42%. the former vice president sat down with mika brzezinski earlier today for a 6:00 a.m. interview airing tomorrow on "morning joe." t he talked about how he thinks the congresswomen nicknamed the squad fit into congress. >> aoc is brilliant and the other three women we are talking about are really smart. they are the exception to the rule. that's the majority of people who got elected. we need that kind of energy, but that's not the majority of the democrats who got elected last time. >> we will talk about that past versus future, democratic party divide, right after the break. (vo) the insurance institute for highway safety
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weak minds and leaders challenge loyalty to our country in order to avoid challenging and debating the policy. this president does not know how to make the argument that americans do not deserve health care. he does not know how to defend his policies. so what he does is attack us personally. >> despite everything that we have seen from this president, there remains a large contingent of the party that seems to believe they can work with trump and republicans on policy issues. the challenge here is that part
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of the party is looking backwards and another part said that era is actually over. let's talk about this with our guests. amy and allison. from she the people. as well as christine quinn who is, sorry, president and ceo of nonprofit -- sorry. i'm grabbing it. i'm sorry, we have a bit of a prompter freeze situation. i had to get your titles right. >> no worries. >> you did the she the people for them and it was powerful and it was sort of a future look and all of these women of color listening to the voters. in your view, the women that you talked to through the she the people network, do they want a party that will look backwards to a past when things had more comity or a future that had significant change? >> women are color are looking to the future and we want a
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different kind of leadership out of the democratic party. what has been interesting about the press conference today and what has revealed this last week is that this squad which is more than four votes has captured the hearts and the souls for the majority of democrats. the candidates embrace this broad-based agenda around all the issues that we heard alexandria ocasio-cortez and the other congress women articulate that are pushing legislation and those are most inspiring and the things that women are color, the millions of them that represent a fourth of the vote in the swing states they are looking for. >> let me play a little bit of joe biden's interview. he is pushing on this idea that he would try to bring republicans over if he became
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president. here he is talking to mika. >> i campaigned in 24 states for 69 people. i campaigned for virtually every member who beat a republican to win back the house. they have come to me over 20 of them and saying please, please keep us moving forward. i didn't run saying i would never talk to a republican. >> christine, there is the joe biden -- he's saying that is moving forward. he sees a future in which there is a republican party they can do deals with even if it's the same party. is that a realistic view? >> there was a time in american politics when that was the reality and you could get things done. look at senator ted kennedy, the lion of the senate. he was able to get things done in a bipartisan way with republicans. those times are far gone. i don't see them coming back in the near future.
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when a democrat is president, the republicans are going to dig their heels in even more and not give in on anything. what's living in the past of once was and it may never come back. i don't think that's a good thing, but it's not coming back any time soon. >> what about this thing going on between democratic leadership and the four women called the squad? each of them represents more people than the whole state of wyoming and vermont and the district of columbia and all of alaska and all of north dakota and south dakota. they represent 2.8 million people combined. what is the idea of circulating a poll that shows alexandria ocasio-cortez is not popular. do you think that's an effective way to move the party? >> i have been very disappointed
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in nancy pelosi and earlier in the last few days trying to minimize and vilify the voice of the squad, the women of color who has been in office 6.5 months and have brought so much energy and focus. they do represent where the democratic party is going. that's the base really wants a clear set of policies that run cowner and in particular, the crisis on the border. naps is undermining the best thing the democrats have got. when trump agreed, it was clear that democratic party leadership had to stop and change course. it's the squad which actually includes a lot more than the four. that's the country's top progressive leaders and i was on
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stage with ilhan omar and deb holland and in that conversation, that was a standing ovation. everyone was on their feet. these are the people that have captured the heart and the minds and the souls of those who will go out and register voters and knock on doors. that's the spirit of the party and what we need to win the white house in 2020. >> also there are moderate democrats in lots of the parts of the country. one of the seats that are red states. which would you do to lose those seats, but they want to harness the energy of the new and younger voters of color. >> the democratic party has been diverse in ideology in the district where is a lot of people beat republicans are more conservative. what we need to be as a democratic party is progressive. is forward looking. and is supportive of each other.
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i just don't understand why singling out these four women and others as bad or to this or to that is anybody's benefit. >> i hate to wrap, but we are done. thank you very much for joining us. appreciate it and that's it for this evening. we will be back in the anchor chair tomorrow night and find me on "a.m. joy" this weekend. rachel maddow starts now. >> you are the greatest, joy. thank you very much, my friend. happy monday and thank you for joining us. it has been a remarkable day. it has been a remarkable weekend in the news, but today everything that was remarkable got worse and darker and more complex. also more revelatory. it has been an incredible news cycle that hopefully we are coming to the end of and about to start something new. if we take the broad view and want to know where this current news cycle


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