tv Up With David Gura MSNBC September 21, 2019 5:00am-7:00am PDT
saudi arabia. the treasury department sanctioning iran's central bank as that country's president makes his way to new york. and many of the candidates vying for the democratic nomination are in iowa for a steak fry in des moines being called the caucus cochella. that's joe kennedy iii prepared to announce he's running for senate in massachusetts. the announcement scheduled to start in about an hour's time. jamil smith is a senior writer at rolling san antonio atone. and a senior analyst for cnbc and with us this morning, from boston, ambassador nicholas burns. former undersecretary of state for political affairs. currently a professor at the harvard kennedy school. let's start with those new details emerging overnight about that whistle blower complaint. the chairman of the house
intelligence committee acknowledged the existence in a statement and since then reporters and lawmakers have been trying to ascertain what it entails. the acting director of national intelligence has withheld the complaint from congress at the recommendation of the justice department. on wednesday, the colleagues at the "washington post" for were the first to report the communications president trump and a foreign leader. in days since, several news outlets including the post and "new york times" reported that leader is the president of ukraine. there are new details from the "wall street journal." that newspaper reporting president trump repeatedly pressured his ukrainian counter part to investigate joe biden's son. the president urged him about eight times to work with rudy giuliani on a probe that can hamper mr. trump's potential 2020 opponent. they have not confirmed the wall street journal's reporting. this is what president trump had to say about all of this on
friday afternoon. >> it's a partisan whistle blower. they shouldn't even have information. i had conversations with many leaders that always appropriate. i just tell you -- >> president trump set to meet with the ukrainian president in person next week at the opening of the u.n. general assembly while joe biden also responding to the allegations calling them not credible and saying this. >> not one single credible has given any credibility to his assertion. not one. i have no comment. >> the president, his allies in the media are seizing on this story to attack the democratic frontrunner over what are unfounded plans. the incident is setting up to be another show down between congress and the administration.
we'll talk about that in a moment. what happened over the last 24 hours. they haven't slept all week. get us up to speed on what is happening. >> yeah. i'm feeling guilty because i've been here in new york and they've been working very hard in washington. so we've gone from the initial report that there was a complaint that involved a foreign leader to now being pretty definitively reported in several places, including ours that this was, indeed, ukraine. it involved the president's conversation, initial conversation, get to know you call with the new president of ukraine at the end of july and during that conversation, the wall stre"wall street journal'st eight times the president urged the new ukrainian president to pursue two paths of
investigation, you know, that then have to take a leap say those could potentially hurt joe biden and help the president. that would be the subject of a further complaint and that's what congress is trying to get to the bottom of whether that, in fact, is improper conversation for the president of the united states to be having with a foreign leader. >> let me turn to professor burns. you're working as a foreign policy advisor to vice president joe biden. i want to get your reaction to the reporting and what the president had to say about this yesterday. there's nothing abnormal about him having a conversation like this with a world leader >>well, if this story is true, and that, you know, more information has to come forward to verify. if it's a true, it's a clear abuse of power by president trump. i can't remember any similar episode by any prior american president in our memory who
would act like this. who would goad and, if you will, extort a foreign leader, pressure a foreign leader to go after one of the president's political opponent, in this case vice president biden. on completely trumped up charges, by the way, by the trump administration. by the president himself. personally. again, yesterday, it is a real problem for our national security because ukraine is fighting for its life. it's trying to fend off aggressive initiatives by president putin. it needs this military assistance from the united states. we all know that the administration held up this assistance for a long time throughout the summer so as a national security part of this. there's also, clearly, an ethical behavior by the president, if the story is true. >> they're bringing up the idea there could have been a quid pro quo here in all the reporting we've seen. that has not been reported yet. it's something certainly that you and others and lawmakers are
watching as this unfolds. the fact this military aid, $400 billion was released subsequent to the conversation taking place. >> a simpler explanation may be allegedly it occurred on july 25th. that's right after the mueller hearings. >> hours after it. >> exactly. let's be real about this. you know, the president may have been feeling himself a little bit. he may have been feeling himself that the mueller hearings are over. nothing is happening. there are no consequences coming forth. no one is holding me accountable. i'm going to pretty much do what i feel like doing. and no one has ever held him truly accountable for interfering in the election the last time. i'm going to do it again. and he said before in an interview with george stephanopoulos he was willing to accept foreign interference. he's going to do it again. he's going to seek it out this time. and so, yes, it's a gross abuse of presidential power, perhaps, outside of his human rights
abuses. the grossest we've seen yet. but i think what we need to do here is make sure that we have, you know, we have the house democrats have, you know, all the power to hold him accountable. we need to see them act. >> another principle in this story is rudy giuliani. former u.s. torn. the president's personal attorney, as well. he went on cnn on wednesday to talk about the story. let's take a little bit of a listen to what he had to say during a 30 minute interview. >> did you ask the you ukraine to investigate joe biden? >> no. the allegations there was sfwer feerns in the election of 2016 by the ukrainians for the benefit of hillary clinton for which -- >> you never asked anything about hunter biden? you never asked anything about joe biden? >> the only thing i asked about joe biden to get to the bottom of how it was that dismissed the case against -- >> so you did ask ukraine to
look into joe biden. >> of course i did. >> you said you didn't. >> >> i want to get your reaction. he was actively trying to get ukraine to investigate joe biden's son hunter. he said independently. >> the conventional wisdom that rudy giuliani has been front running stories for the president where he blurts something out. it's interesting in the broader context. i ran into a democratic senator yesterday on the train and he happened to be on the senate intelligence committee and one of the concerns he has there's such a lack of contemporaneous note taking going on inside the white house. ta they're not sure where it goes. trying to find hard physical evidence that would lead to a conclusion is one of the challenges they face in the senate and the house. >> and to this notion of rudy
being freelance diplomat. he maintained he was doing it of his own malicious. who was paying his bills, that's a huge question. what is different. what we haven't seen before. this is high up there, isn't it? >> well, it is. to have the president's personal lawyer taking trips to meet with y ukrainian government officials make demands of them. who knows what was said. when giuliani said he took the trip to meet the ukrainian in madrid earlier this summer with the knowledge of the state department and he reported to the state department, it's wrong to involve the state department in such a crass political affair. there's so many allegations around it. it's wrong to ask career foreign service officers who are nonpartisan, whose obligation is the constitution, not the president, their oath is to the constitution, wrong to involve them. so i've been saying the last couple of days the state department needs to stay clear of this.
giuliani needs to stop asking the state department to help him. and, you know, the transcript of this phone call and every national security counsel staffer prepares transcripts of presidential phone calls. it ought to be turned over to the congress if the administration doesn't want to make it public. turn it over to the congressional committees and let them see what the president said. if the president asked eight times in one short phone call for the president of ukraine to try to examine or investigate vice president biden, that's wrong. and that's an abuse of power. and the vice president doesn't deserve it because, as you know, the "new york times" and "washington post" looked at the wild accusations by president trump and giuliani and they say, the press says there's nothing there. >> i think we need to be careful. not to make this a joe biden story. i think joe biden needs to be careful not to make this a joe biden story. the commentary about it. he needs to make sure that he addresses the president's wrong doing and not necessarily focus
on him and maybe what his son is alleged to have done. >> where do we go from here? the conflict between the white house, intelligence community, and congress, as well. nancy pelosi highlighting the fact that by the law, lawmakers have to be notified when a complaint like this is brought to the inspector general. the inspector general testifying this week behind closed doors. we expect thursday this week joe mcguire will be on capitol hill, as well. we're talking about transcripts. we don't know if they're there. what will happen this week on capitol hill? >> the first thing is, as you refer yet another contest between house democrats and the white house. it's interesting that there will be testimony before the house and senate this week. but that's the instant question. will the white house allow the release of the original whistle blower complaint, which they haven't yet. the subject of it and the rough
contents of it are now pretty well known, including to the house committees that want it. they want to see the actual thing. will people be either compelled to testify in person or will a transcript of this phone call be provided? i mean, i agree with nick burns there is a transcript. there always is. it's a question of how good it is and where it is and whether they let it out. >> all right. >> obviously a huge story with many angles to sort through. what can congress do about this? a lawmaker will join us in a little bit. peter welch who sits on the house intelligence committee. to another big story. an announcement from the pentagon overnight that the defense department is deploying more troops to the middle east as tensions escalade ahead of the u.n. general assembly next week. ahead of the u.n. general assembly next week i am royalty of racing, raise your steins to the king of speed.
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the u.s. is sending what the pentagon said is a moderate number of troops to saudi arabia after oil facilities were attacked. the announcement comes hours after president trump announced another round of sanctions on iran's central bank. another step that the united states's maximum pressure campaign against the country. the president praised himself for showing restraint. something he said shows great strength. take a listen. >> the easiest thing i can do, i can do it while you're here, say go ahead, fellas. go do it.
and that would be a very bad day for iran. that's the easiest thing i can do. and for all of those that say, oh, they should do it. it shows weakness. actually, in my opinion, it shows strength because the easiest thing i can do, okay, go ahead. knock out 15 different major things in iran. i can do that and we're all set to go. it's all set to go. but i'm not looking to do that, if i can. >> nicholas burns with us. let me start with you and have you assess the reaction to this. there was talk of the u.s. retaliating with military and what we see here is the same kind of bluster we've seen after incidents in the past. more sanctions. some of the administration has done and time again. your reaction to what we've seen. >> david, my reaction is i don't think president trump is
standing up to the iran challenge. it's a real crisis now with the iranians acting with impunity. that was a capital strike against the heart of the saudi oil industry last saturday. the iranians have been threatening shipment in the gulf. they shot down u.s. drones and the administration has to be careful. we don't want a wider war, but sanctions sanctions and sending a few hundred troops to saudi arabia is not going to be seen by our adversaries in the region, by the iranians, as tough minded or effective. and there are all sorts of other options here. whether it's cyber attacks or covert operations or the united states striking at iranian revolutionary guard core outside the territory of iran because they're in the gulf. we have to stand up to the challenge. you said look at the rhetoric the administration. the president said we were locked and loaded. the response it doesn't measure up and we look -- it looks like iran now is the controlling power in that part of the world
going all the way back to the 1973 war in the middle east. the united states has always kept the gulf open. we don't appear to be doing that now. that's not in our national interest. >> and your sense of the message here to the iranians, and you have president of iran coming here. you'll be covering the general assembly this coming week. how do they process what is happening here. perhaps the u.s. is goaded into doing something and it did nothing. >> yeah. and the iranian prime minister is tweeting to that effect this morning. they feel like they kind of put one over on the president here. but trump is operating on two tracks with iran. on one side, he wants to meet toughness with toughness. you can tell in his remarks there that he is sensitive to the appearance he's not being tough and he wants to project what he's doing actually is tough. and at the same time, he wants to negotiate. he was hoping to be able to sit
down with rouhani this week and do what he thinks he does best, which is get in a room with somebody, look them in the eye, and try to figure out if he can make a deal. that has never worked with the iranians. only multilateral diplomacy and a combination of pressure campaign and economic and political has ever worked with them. so i think the question now would be how -- it will be interesting how they circle one another this week. but the sanctions imposed this week are not going to do much more. >> we'll play a bit more sound here. the president talking about the state of iran in light of the sanctions. let's take a listen to what he had to say. >> these are the highest sanctions ever imposed on a country. we've never done it to this level. it's too bad what is happening with iran. it's going to hell. doing poorly. they're practically broke. they have been the number one, as you know, well, number one
country worldwide of terror. between sponsoring it and doing it themselves. we can't have it. >> later in the statement he reiterates with the president said. a lot of sanctions imposed here. you saw the tweet a moment ago. poking at the defense officials and the president. what effect are they having? is the country going to hell, as you heard the president say? >> it's struggle economically. there's no doubt that iran is having a tougher time than it had in the past. now they're finding ways to skirt them with respect to selling oil through intermediaries to other large countries but their revenues are down. the bigger question, though, and i would disagree with ambassador burns, to a certain extent. the united states is becoming increasingly independent. from a foreign policy perspective, the middle east has less significance in that regard than it used to.
the united states produces 12 million barrels of oil a day. the oil market had a sharp response initially after the saudi attacks. and there's no doubt we should, you know, help protecting our allies. with respect to the larger economic picture, which i tend to focus on. it had a smaller impact than the arab oil embargo in 1973 or '74. there's a certain aspect that might, i would think, stay in the u.s.' hand. having said that, promoting regional stability is important. >> we'll leave it there. ambassador nicholas burns, thank you very much for the time. coming up, addressing what they're calling a crisis. millions of protesters demanding action on climate change as world leaders make their way new york for the u.n. general assembly. their way new york for the u.n. general assembly volunteerism.
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i want to read from a handful of signs. climate emergency. there's no planet b. save the environment or we'll die before retirement. good one. all that happened because of 16-year-old greta thunberg. she's been speaking out about it. >> this is an emergency. our house is on fire. we are doing this to wake the leaders up. we're doing this to get them to act. >> protester expected to continue next week in 150 countries and today is international coastal clean up day with millions of volunteers participating in beach clean ups around the world. jake levine was an aid to president obama and joins us in new york. i want to get your reaction what we saw yesterday. there have been protests in the months and years past, but it felt like something different in terms of the magnitude and the age of those participating. >> absolutely incredible.
i think we saw more than 4 million protesters worldwide. over 150 countries, seven continents. and, look, this is all because of one young woman greta thunberg. i think we need to listen to what she's saying. she says i don't want your pa-- praise. i want you to listen to the science. she's got some serious guts. she goes into the eu and congress and says you're not doing good enough. try harder. it's inspiring. >> you were down at one of the protests here in new york. what did you see? what were people saying about what motivated them to come out? >> i think, really, the words that i would use are more urgency. i think that, you know, you saw the kinds of passion that really sparked the creation of things like the epa. you know, when things happened in my hometown of cleveland, ohio. it catches on fire and people
speak up and say, hey, we've had enough. and we need to have government action and the government actually responds. now, unfortunately, you have so many vested interests that are feeding this that, fortunately, the government does not respond. so we need people to actually respond i think a little bit more proportionately. and i think right now we're seeing hundreds of thousands of people on the streets and millions. we need even more. >> ed, to jake's point there about how it translated into action. we have this moment coming up monday of this week. there's going to be a gathering of world leaders. what is the test going to be, if this message that rang out through the streets around the world resonated with those in new york. >> i think one thing we'll be looking at who attends that summit tomorrow and surrounding the u.n. and my expectations is president trump will not. the trump administration has
both said they recognize the threat of climate change and done, frankly, little to say they are following through on that threat. many different parts of the government that were seized was this question. a few years ago have been starved of resources and in some cases people have, you know, foreign service officers and others have had retaliation taken upon them. >> jake, the question to you. what are you looking for? >> i mean, action. real action on the policy. >> exclusive of the u.s. or inclusive of the u.s.? >> both. but, you know, the contrast between the protests all around the world and what was happening in the u.s. yesterday when president trump and his administration revoked california's waiver under the clean air ability to implement more stringent fuel economy standards. for example, it's just striking.
and california sued in its 60th lawsuit to defend on these types of issues. as a follow up to this type of agitation in the streets, what we need to be seeing is real policy action primarily in the united states. i would say who has the ability to lead internationally but all around the world. >> so, you know, we need the action but we also need these protesters to be unrelating. they need to take a page out of the playbook, if you will. if you go back to the vietnam era and you go back to the era where the epa was created. the kids who were on campus in the 1960s and engaging in antivietnam war protests were unrelenting and the change for pressure so was great that ultimately it brought an end to the war. if these kids want to control their future, they can't stop. they can't have a day off and walk away. it has to be something that is persistent, consistent, and have
to go to the voting booths and polls, as well, and make their voices known. there we go. >> again, i speak these words more urgency. you look at what the trump administration is doing. we saw denying actively in their policy the fact that, you know, we have climate refugees, you know, and the fact this problem is only going get worse and the trump has an active interest. politically, in making sure that people believe this is not happening. >> and nice reporting by my colleagues. thank you very much for being with us. >> and the award-winning writer jonathan safran foer has a new book about climate change. he'll join us on sunday. a story just breaking on nbcnews.com that joe biden
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raise your steins to the king of speed. >> the most important sentences ever written in the english language that all men were created equal. we didn't apply that fully then. we haven't applied it fully now. but that journey toward a more perfect union is the story of the country. perfect union is the story of the country. well, this is "up." we're learning this morning of serious concerns within senator cory booker's presidential campaign that there may not be much more for him to be in the race. nbc news obtained a memo that don't see a path forward unless they raise nearly $2 million in the next ten days. cory booker is one of ten
democratic presidential hopefuls fielding issues about the lgbtq community in iowa last night. a topic that mostly went ignored at the democratic debates thus far. the candidates were united but lead to tense moments for former vice president joe biden as he was asked to defend his record and is exchange with the cedar rapids gazette exchange. >> you voted for don't ask don't tell. in 1996 you voted for the defense of marriage act. you voted to repeal both of those but also praised vice president mike pence as a decent guy. >> you're a lovely person. >> that columnist later described you're a lovely person as contindescending.
we'll hear from cory booker at the steak fry. >> yeah. you need money to run for president. and he actually did have pretty good moment at the last debate a reterritorial moment a lot of people were waiting for. he's arguably the best on the stump. you know, he's got fire, he's got a great delivery. he's rhetorically strong but hasn't caught fire and that means he hasn't been able to bring in as much money as certainly as he hoped but a lot of people expected and i don't know whether he'll drop out or not but he's definitely staring down another fundraising deadline and he's going to have nose numbers will have to look better than it appears that look now before more money comes in. >> i think with respect to senator booker, he didn't have
as clear a compelling set of arguments as elizabeth warren or as much recognition as joe biden or a pete buttigieg. he's somewhere in the nether land that, you know, i think most candidates are finding themselves as we move toward four or five viable names. >> i want to ask you about the exchange with the cedar rapids newspaper. what you saw >>well, i think to the point on senator booker, i think senator booker is one of the only candidates that hasn't really presented a compelling reason why he's doing this. i think he is a good -- >> it's love, optimism, and what? >> he definitely has the message of radical love in this moment. but i think it doesn't really speak as oppositional to donald trump as maybe he thinks it does. it doesn't necessarily speak as a reason to put him in office. i think as much as he tries
really, really, really hard to, you know, impress the american public, you know, with his skills and his political acumen, i think that the senator just is not presenting the american public with a reason to put him in office. to the point of -- >> so you've why joe biden should step aside in the campaign. >> yes. >> i imagine this would be at the top of the piece. >>well, i think it would be an addendum to my essay on why mr. biden needs to leave the race. i think there's no such thing as benevolent sexism. and what you have there, in addition to his comment on the stage, liz describe what he said after wards. apparently dryly called her a real sweet heart. and this is just this kind of p
behavior we don't need to see from a standard bearer for the democratic party. especially in a year when the nominee is running against a known misogynist who pressed forward with misogynist policies and we have women in the race who have strong campaigns going forward. strong policies going forward that are just better choices. >> to this point, about 30 seconds left. there was so much talk about letting trump be trump. i don't know if there's a parallel to let biden be biden. you have to acknowledge his behavior is as a result of this. do you see it as part of what we continuing? >> i mean, biden will be held to a different standard than trump is held. trump regularly on stage refers to women as darling. right. that's not what you're supposed to do in 2019 but he does it and is not penalized for it. not by his own supporters and
not more generally. we comment on it but it basically that is no effect. that will not be true, is not true for joe biden or any other democratic candidate. president trump's favorite punching bag is a guy who can't punch back. o can't punch back at fidelity, we believe your money should always be working harder. that's why your cash automatically goes into a money market fund when you open a new account. and fidelity's rate is higher than e*trade's, td ameritrade's, even 9 times more than schwab's. plus only fidelity has zero account fees and zero minimums for retail brokerage and retirement accounts. just another reminder of the value you'll only find at fidelity. open an account today.
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i'm not thrilled with the fed but despite we have an incredible economy. >> jerome powell's job is safe? >> yeah. it's safe. he's got a job and, you know, i'm disappointed in him. >> this is "up." that was president trump in his latest interview expressing his displeasure with jerome powell, a man he picked. it's a classic bullying tactic to punch the guy who cannot punch back. the fed is not a political constitution. the fed chair's communications are skrut niced. he's declined over and over again to respond to president trump directly. on wednesday the president
tweeted. in the past he said powell and the fed don't have a clue. he said powell is like a golfer who can't putt. this was the one that shocked everybody, i think, it's fair to say. my only question is who is our bigger enemy? jay powell or chairman xi. >> this is a guy that goes to princeton, goes to georgetown, law school. becomes under secretary of the treasury. has a high profile job at the carlisle group. he's in a position where he cannot respond to the attacks. help us understand the dynamic. he's rebuffed these questions about his relationship to president trump and yet this has to be wearing on him. >> if i were jay powell, i would do the unthinkable and call the president and say, dude, your trade war is killing the global economy. i'm doing what i can to offset the damage that you're causing to global manufacturing to slowing down the u.s. to a rate maybe next year that will be
below trend. this is your problem. figure it out. i'm cutting rates. i have so many, you know, left in the arsenal. i'm 1.75 now. we don't want to go to zero. that's an emergency rate used for crises. it's not used for managing a soft landing in the economy. this is on you. he can't do that but that's really the message that should go to the president. >> he's punching somebody who can't punch back. what extend are we seeing something out of his play book. >> yeah, i mean, this is a sign of weakness. this is the president's understanding of masculinity at large. and, you know, this is his leadership. frankly, if i'm the democrats, every day repeating what was in that yahoo! story we saw about a week or two weeks ago, 300,000 jobs lost by this trade war. 300,000 jobs. and only amy klobuchar is the
only person that brought it up. every day they should be repeating that. up to a million are expected to be lost by the end of the year. >> and the average american may pay an extra $2,000 for goods on tariffs from china. >> it's really at a point where we have to judge the president from an economic standpoint as an enemy of the state. >> when you talk to investors, how much attention do they pay? as i talk to them, is jay powell's job in jeopardy? what will happen with the fed. it's been illustrated over and over again. is it another thing they're able to do now? >> well, no, you can't tune out the federal reserve. you can't. >> what about the president's messaging? >> to an extent. by statute the president cannot fire the chairman or chairwoman of the federal reserve except for cause. the president is also eroding the credibility of the federal reserve by constantly harping on
them and suggesting they're not doing the right thing. he has two nominees who may end up on the board who want to take rates to zero at a time they shouldn't be there. i think i think markets, while they're not focused on it yet, could be on it later. >> also to ron's point about what's statutorily allowed, that hat now stopped the president from going to his lawyers to figure out cause. >> it's part of the pattern. the president thinks i run the government, so i run the government, and he runs all of it. he's immensely frustrated as what he sees as the fed's refusal to do so, and the only, you know, whipping boy he's got is jay powell, so he's whipping away. >> whipping away. thank you all for joining me. make sure you tune back in tomorrow.
we'll see you tomorrow on "up." coming up, what do you know about the president's call with the ukraine that caused the whistleblower to file the complaint? the president weighing in on twitter. one lawmaker weighing in on it, peter welch is going tow weigh n it as well. that's coming up next. weigh i it as well that's coming up next. raise your steins to the king of speed. i'm off to college. i'm worried about my parents' retirement. don't worry. voya helps them to and through retirement... dealing with today's expenses ...while helping plan, invest and protect for the future. so they'll be okay? i think they'll be fine. voya. helping you to and through retirement. if you have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis, every day can begin with flakes. it's a reminder of your struggles with psoriasis. but what if your psoriasis symptoms
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. this is "up." i'm david gura. president trump tweeting about the whistleblower scandal. he's writing, quote, the fake news media and their partner, the democratic party, want to stay as far away as possible from the joe biden demand that the ukrainian government fire a prosecutor who was investigating his son. it was a complete and total disaster. the fake news knows this but doesn't want to report it. a distillation of rudy giuliani. complaints are supposed to be handed over to lawmakers, but acting dni joseph maguire has not given the authority to do that. lawmakers are up in arms. the house intelligence committee
has subpoenaed acting dni. reporters for the "washington post" which first broke the news continue to give us new details on what it alleges and how that document has been handled. the latest big developments come from "the wall street journal." the journal is reporting that during a phone call between president trump and his ukrainian counterpart, president trump urged him eight times to investigate joe biden's son hunter. a similar report has appeared in t the "washington post" and "new york times." here's what president had to say saturday afternoon. >> it's a partisan whistleblower. i've had conversations with many leaders, always appropriate. >> have you read it? >> no, i haven't.
i'll just tell you. everybody's read it. they laugh at it. >> the president's lawyer rudy giuliani also got the ukraine to investigate joe biden's son. they say it's a corruption allegation. his reaction from former vice president joe biden last night. >> not one single credible outlet can give assertion. not one single one. i have no comment except the president start to be present. >> be present. clintd watts is a former fbi agent now with the foreign policy research institute. also with us this morning kyle cheney, he covers congress for politico and he was one of the first to report on the existence of that complaint. kyle, let me start with you and
hel help us understand what the last 24 hours have yielded especially on capitol hill where you roam the hallways hour after hour after hour. what do they say about this? >> it's moving faster than congress is used to dealing with it the way it comes out drip, drip in press reports. you 're starting to see pro-impeachment lawmakers. they're starting to open their ey eyes, the grave consequences it could have for the presidency. >> kyle, just a moment. i want to get a sense from you what they've said about what they said, where they think of where this process is. >> the democrats all walked away from there, affirmed in their belief that this is a matter of
serious consequences. they said, look, if the president is going to deny these allegations, he can release the transcript of his phone call with ukrainian leaders because they've asked for that for a couple of weeks now. republicans are pretty guarded on this. some have come out, the allies of the president have come out and said there doesn't appear to be anything to this, but really the members of the intelligence committee are sort of keeping mum for now and saying let's see how this plays out. >> kyle, last question here. we know about this call because lawmakers have been investigating this. help us understand that, that subject of investigation, how this was being looked at or regarded by lawmakers before this news broke? >> well, they don't know the details of the whistleblower complaint per se, but they have seen rudy giuliani's very public comments about trying to get ukraine to investigate about joe biden and his son. so they started looking at this and bringing in a question of
whether a brief hold on military to ukraine was tied in as a leverage point. they've been looking at this for weeks now. and they know the call came a day after bob mueller's testimony on capitol hill. they're very well aware of the calendar on that. they wonder if that emboldens the president to have some outreach to the ukraine for potentially election-related information the day after. >> kyle, stay with us if you would. we'll go to the congressman in just a moment. you and kyle have complementary pieces about what this says about how the administration, how republicans on capitol hill approach scandals like this one. >> yeah. i mean if it seems eerily familiar to anyone, that's because it is. there's a pattern here. if rudy giuliani's interview on cnn seems familiar, it's because i watched that interview five times during the russian
investigation regarding bob mueller. it becomes denial, we did not do them, or even if the president did them, there's nothing wrong with them. the president does not say he did not ask anything to the president about joe biden. he's not deflecting. he's not denying that. but there's a deflection to the subplot. here is the biden's subplot. and rudy giuliani has been pushing reporters for month to pay attention to ukraine, to try and get attention for these allegations he has about joe biden and joe biden's son in the u crane. finally because of the whistleblower report he has them talking about biden and ukraine. and finally there will be the discredit part of this playbook like bob mueller's angry democrat or how many there were,
the partisan witch hunt. the president already calling this whistleblower whose identity he says he does not know a partisan whistleblower. >> you heard him say that to our colleague kristen welker in the oval office. there was a closed door hearing that lasted several hours. next week they're going to hear from the acting director joseph maguire. with us now, patrick welsh. let me start with how satisfied you with the inspector general this week and what you hope to hear when he sits before your committee on thursday. >> well, the inspector general was very, very solid. keep in mind he was appointed by president trump and he is a by-the-books straight shooter. he gave us no information about the content of the complaint,
but what he said is a whistleblower followed the legal procedure, filed a complaint to his office. under the law it's very simple and clear. the inspector general has two weeks to investigate that and if the inspector general determining it's urgent and a matter of environmental national security, he forwards to the director of national intel jerngs and then under the law the director of national intelligence has the responsibility to convey it to the committees. the dni did not do that. it appears that the justice department intervened. we've got a situation where the whistleblower statute has clearly been violated, and that in and of itself is extremely concerning, and i hope to my republican colleagues as well as the democrats on the committee. congressman, they talk about legal recourse if your committee doesn't get the information you
and chairman schiff want to get. what is the recourse? >> if the administration is violating the law or in this case the director of national intelligence not following his clear duty under the whistleblower, we can go to court, and chairman schiff has indicated that very definitely is an option. there would be an effort to get as immediate relief as we could in that the report be provided to the full intelligence committee. what's so important about this whistleblower statute, as long as the whistleblower follows the procedure, they're authorized to given what otherwise might be prohibited information for them to give to the intelligence committee and then we can evaluate it and decide what it is we have to do. but when you essentially close down the option for a person who has information that is of your
ge urgent and there's been a significant breach that threatens security, you open up the possibility of it going rogue, ala snowden. >> your chairman goes out and makes a press statement,ivstat a letter, there's going go nothing at the end. your reaction, the pattern as this gets under way. >> where's the complaint? the complaint has been issued, filed by the inspector general, and our committee should be seeing that. so none of us know what's in that complaint. so to suggest it's serious or trivial, none of us have the information. so we have to get the complaint. it's of enormous importance that the committee in congress stand up for the right of congress to do oversight. you know, we have a republican
president today, but some day we'll have a democratic president. we should all be standing up for the right of national oversight. that's critical to the protection of our constitutional order. >> last question, you're in a fact-finding capacity. i just want to get you to reflect on this last week, what you've been able to ascertain versus what reporters are able to ascertain about this, what it says about congress's ability to get information of grave significance. >> the bottom line, the press has been the leader in all of this. we had a meeting with the inspector general. he was very, very careful to tell us the procedure histoal h. he did not reveal any information under the complaint. that's because as of right now, he's not ought rise dodd that. the reports by the president to ukraine, essentially inviting ukraine interference in the
election, a la what russia did, that's coming to us from the reporters. >> peter welch, the congressmen from virginia. thank you very much. one of the principal investigators >> i'm going to turn to you. about the sanctity of a whistleblower, that congress would review it, it would be taken seriously, and your identity would be kept secure. >> it's remarkable this is happening, essentially since edward snowden has a back out this week. we have one here, and it's not working. it's not set up in such a way. most of these things are not set up to say, what if the president does it? this is probably the problem
that joseph maguire has right now. they go and look at the rule book and they say, is this an intelligence activity or not? is this person in my command or above or outside of it. and they try to figure out what the role is. they're having to report to that boss what's going on in iran because we have a huge international thing going on. this shows if we don't have norms, people that don't abide by those norms, if we can't act for all americans and we ultimately end up in this position all the time, this whistleblower, whoever it is, has followed the procedures exactly the way they're supposed to. we've, again, reached a breakdown. so you think back to the special council investigation. now we're at this one again. it's systematically our government has been challenged and no one weighs a thought on how to advise. >> the point was real about how
broken down things are. this shows relief and dysfunction of congress. >> those who are complicit with congress gets responsibility of oversight. what we have here is the kind of continuous example of the overreach of executive power. there's way in which the folks around donald trump and donald trump himself, they believe that -- you know, in something we describe as the imperial presidency, that he, in fact, has unchecked power. it seemed to be the statement that there are republicans in congress who hold the same view, at least when a republican is in office, and so part of what we're witnessing in this battle over this particular issue is the erosion of the people's house. and that doesn't bode well for our democracy. >> joe biden is involved in all of this, shannon. let's play a bit of tape of joe
biden addressing reporters about that whistleblower complaint. >> i have no comment except that the president start to be present. >> donald trump appears to be collaborating with foreign governments to attack america's democracy. clearly doesn't get the job of what it means to be president of the united states. >> this is extremely disturbing. >> really raises so many questions about what is happening, what they're trying to hide and why. >> it's file ftime for congress step up and begin serious impeachment proceedings against this man. >> you see the democrats stepping up and pushing past the on fuss skaggs and questioning the phone call with this foreign leader. let's go back to the first man, former vice president joe biden. this is a tricky situation for him to be in. there's this widely discredited investigation. it begins to be something that we and others are talking about.
>> if this story goes on or they try to go down the impeachment path, there's this continuing subplot of the president and rudy giuliani alleged that joe biden did something nefarious in the ukraine. it just muddies the water, and even if people don't believe that, it still can create the sort of subconscious perception that while he was vice president there was something shady about his past. it gets into the subconscious narrative that can taint a narrative going forward. that's the risk the democrats have in bringing this up over and over and over again because there will be the alternate echo chamber going on talking about biden and yukraine. i think it's similar to the
russia investigation. a crazed doj and partisan leaders. and that has its own effect on the american psyche. >> kyle cheney, last question, with politico. i wonder if you and your colleagues were listening to npr yesterday in which the house speaker nancy pelosi addressed this story and the allegations that talked about impeachment. we heard about those trying to get the nomination of president. how much is this testing the resolve of the house speaker? >> we heard her say they should revisit the statutes on whether a president can be indicted. she is still avoiding the subject of whether impeachment is warranted. it's like, let's see where it
goes. it's gone in the last few days. >> kyle cheney with politico. thank you very much. next we head to iowa where the caucus coachella is set to kick off. a primary clash in the making. how another kennedy is testing the political waters, out with his first campaign moments before his first campaign announcement. oments before his first campaign announcement i am royalty of racing, raise your steins to the king of speed. driven each day to pursue bioplife-changing cures...ers.
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back to "up." i'm david gura. moments from now joe kennedy will officially announce he'll be running. you see him walking to a place in east boston where he's going to make the announcement. he's a member of one of the most historical political families. he's been laying a foundation for a run. that set up a poll. it puts him at 35% to 26% for senator ed markey. joining us now, kimberly. kimberly, let me ask you, why is joche kennedy doing this? he's young, 38 years old. markey is 73 years old, got to congress a few years back. why does he see this as his moment to enter the race? >> i think because he can is the best answer. look. there are a bunch of ambitious
politicians out of massachusetts, and there are few opportunities for them to move up. this is an election year for the senate. you have someone like markey who is well liked. kennedy doesn't have qualms with markey, doesn't mention him in his campaign video, but this is a race he can run, and if he wants to be a senator, ed markey, his biggest problem is he has a significant amount of massachusetts voters who either don't know him or don't have an opinion of him, and you have someone who is a kennedy who has that name recognition and you have polls like that. i think he saw this as a shot, and he's taking it. >> let's dip in and listen to what the congressman is having to say in east boston. [ cheers and applause ] >> it is so -- yes, buddy.
it is extremely meaningful to me to be able to do this and announce this here where in 1848 a few steps from where this building is today my father's family first arrived here in this country. patrick kennedy came fleeing oppression, starvation, and he arrived here with literally nothing. he married a woman named bridget murphy. she ended up getting a store just down the road here over on border street. patrick passed away young from cholera. and from sheer force of will and with the help of a community, she kept that family together.
her son owned a local saloon, became a ward boss, and served in the state senate. his son, my great grandfather, was born a few blocks from here on meridian street. his son served this neighborhood in congress and then went on to serve as president of the united states. [ clapping ] >> i want to turn to you. it only took a minute before he referenced the former president of the united states. the kennedy name still has a lot of resonance. we saw a few moments ago of ed markey alongside alexander cass y
-- >> i think we're in an interchange. kimberly will note the political culture of this space better than i do. there are two other people in this race. there's steve pemberton who's in this race, shann lease reirden who's in this race. there's something going on behind the scenes and the diversity in the democratic party. so there's a sense where alexander ocasio-cortez has made it clear she supports markey. kennedy's making a move here, but there's something underneath this election or this campaign that actually speaks to the fissures within the party. the dccc isn't acting well here. there's some stuff we need to get to. i'm particularlien intere-- intd
in the story. >> the president has teed up the reporter. kimberly atkins, respond to what he just said about the deeper fissures. >> i think the professor is right. we have seen in massachusetts. i noma is a place where voters are happy to, a, vote out an incumbent that they like, and we saw that in the race with ayanna pressley beating out mike capuano, and we're seeing a state especially in and around boston within route 128 where the population is changing and there are a lot of people of more color and more immigrants. i think that's why we'll hear from joe kennedy. he picked boston for a reason. he talked about his family emigrating there and leading a political dynasty and says other people coming to this country should have that same opportunity. his campaign video was released
in part in spanish. he's really playing up the fact that he wants to put immigration as an issue front and center. and i'm told he will tout his support for disenfranchised communities throughout his campaign. ed markey is standing on the other side of aoc and talking about climate change. >> how closely are you watching seth moulton and ayanna pressley as well? are they likely to make endorsements? >> i'm told by both camps they're staying out of this one. they're important because they're the last two people to oust people in massachusetts. >> you see jochen d i declaring his candidacy for president in massachusetts. the 2020 hopefuls are smartening their pitches. it's the famous iowa steak fry where 17 candidates will flip steaks and rally and make
speeches to the faithful. vaughn hillyard is there. talk about the scandal surrounding the president and the ukraine. i imagine that's going to come up. what are you expecting to hear from daenlts in polk county today? >> reporter: anybody who has been to coachella would take issue comparing this to coachella. someone just yelled this is better than coachella. for iowa, this is their coachella. there's one campaign official who explained to me, the way he put it, this is the beginning of the fourth quarter. we're 135 days away from the iowa caucus. to give you an idea, 17 of the presidential candidates will be here in des moines. i want to set you up.
this is the polk county steak fry that start 40d years ago. hartman started it when he retired in 2014. polk county took it over. that's what leads us here today. the candidates, you can see, quite now there's quite a bit of empty green space, but you're going see this park area get filled with cars. beyond the horizon line, the candidates are going to be addressing their rally crowds. they're going to be coming in here. to be clear, they're not frying their steak. they're grilling their steak. you see the activists, organizers across iowa come in here. you see pete buttigieg standing here. this is sort of a very celebratory event. and as you said, the interesting part of it this year is there are very, very serious issues taking place in washington, d.c. we'll be catching the candidates throughout the morning, david, having serious conversations while all of this happens behind
us. >> shannon, have you been to this before? >> i have not. i'm so jealous. i'm based at the white house. i'm watching vaughn right now and i'm like i need to get out to iowa for two weeks because i was just reminded this week by a very good democratic strategist. throw out the national polls. stop looking at those. everything will change. what we see nationally, like vaughn is probably seeing out there, this sort of energy and environment. someone talked about beto o'rourke has good ground game. we've seen surprises before. john kerry in 2003, 2004. he was not on the radar, and then he wins iowa and it's all over from that on in p. we need to pay more attention to vaughn. >> vaughn hillyard, thank you very much. tickets, $35.
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announced more u.s. troops are headed to the middle east. that announcement comes as the u.s. continues to weigh its next steps following the attacks on saudi arabia's oil facilities last week. that includes newly aannounced sanctions on iran. president trump said he hopes to avoid military conflict with that country. help us understand what the pentagon is doing here. this is sort of a two-pronged attack by the united states. there's a financial component to it. now this announcement from the defense department that we're going the see, i see reported here, 500, 600 troops brought to the middle east. >> reporter: that's right, david, and obviously the financial arm of it has been
going on for quite some time now as the united states says they have imt posed some of the harshest sanctions any country has put on iran. it has. made them buckle. it's made them dig in even deeper and become more defiant, more bilge rent. iran said they're not going to return to the negotiating table until all of those sanctions are removed. and now with the deploemt of these troops, it's 500 or 600 troops. let's be very clear. they're not going to be battle troops who can invade iran. nonetheless it sparked fury in iran. he was surrounded by drones that iran alleges they have -- that they have downed as well as iranian-made missiles. and he made some very, very fiery comments. he said that whoever wants their
country to be a battleground, then so be it, let the games begin, a clear reference to saudi arabia and the uae. he vowed not to let the battle get dragged into iran. he said that they're willing to punish their enemy and they won't until they do so. >> shannon pettypiece, catch us up to date on what the president is thinking. what is the path forward? what's being considered as you look at a white house that does not have a national security adviser and -- it does have a new national security adviser that a new defense secretary, we should note, acting director of national intelligence. you have knows pieces in play. it shoes, what can you do, without getting interarmed
military conflict, which this administration wants to avoid for many reasons. of course, the president ran on a campaign to get us out of wars. he would like not to get us into another one. he's been very milk about that. it's always turned into rogue leaders getting sanctions. sanction, sanction, savings. there's not much more they can do. >> it's been tightened to capacity. >> they threw another one on iran. they say, what's the impact on this one? what can you do next? send a few troops over, make some noise, shake things up in tehran a little bit, but the risk here is with each step, you run closer to a risk of miscalculation where all of a sudden this turns from a face-off into an actual conflict, and that's the risk here. >> when this initially happened,
there was speculation that this oil complex was going to be out of commission for months. your sense of the import of that event itself and how that is shaping the calculations of being in the white house. >> yeah. what's fascinating, what is our objective with iran? what else has changed? looking from the obama administration to now, we've lost a lot of allies or alienated them. at the same point as shannon pointed out, we're dealing with saudi arabia at the same time. why have we always been in the region? that's part of the oil. we're an oil exporter. the next layer is we're redeploying troops back, which is one of the impetus for a group called al qaeda 20, 30 years ago. if you're trying to avoid war
and you don't have allies, it becomes a place where iran has great strength. they can push us and nudge us and try to force us into a war. and then you see the president saying to saudi arabia, we've got your backs, saudi arabia, we're lock and loaded. we're playing in dangerous waters with national security advisers, someone new in charge. what's the check, the balance, the goal? i don't know. >> the carousel goes around. >> help us understand the iranache objectives. zarif using his favorite b-team hashtag saying those sanctions show desperation. preventing the bank from providing food and medicine for our people. and the b team, the return to negotiation. what does zarif want as he comes to new york today? >> i think iran's new policy now
is not to show restraint. they had shown a fair degree of lulls. that didn't yield results. now they're being more aggressive in their approach and they're thinking that might bring the u.s. and other parties to loosen some of the sanctions because they're threatening an ought-out w all-out war in the middle east. it has spread across the region. in many ways they've boxed saudi arabia on three fronts. iran has proxies to the north in syria and iraq. iran itself lies to the east. and, of course, they have the houthi rebels in the south. they're using that as leverage to say, listen, come and talk to us and don't let things get out of hand. when we come back, the latest fallout surrounding the
president's phone call reportedly with the temperature. and why they're calling it the ultimate impeachable act. the ultimate impeachable act raise your steins to the king of speed. red lobster's endless shrimp is back for just $15.99. get all the shrimp you want, any way you want 'em. like new sriracha-honey shrimp, savory grilled teriyaki shrimp, classic shrimp scampi and more! red lobster's endless shrimp is $15.99. hurry in.
has teamed up with george conway once again. they call the reported details of the complaint the ultimate impeachability act. congressional procrastination has probably emboldened trump and it emboldens future presidents that might be of his sorry ilk. matt, react to what you read there in the pages of the "washington post" when you sat down to breakfast and looked at that in the paper. indeed, you saw statements from the house speaker and the house intelligence committee to this effect, that this is a bridge beyond, i guess you could say. >> i somewhat agree with neil and george. you look at the time line. it happened after the appearance on the hill on july 24th. president trump called the
ukrainian president to investigate bind eight times. it's emboldened by the fact he welcomed foreign interference once before and he got away with it and that told him to do it again. there's something else they write as well. trump's actions here are actually more serious than any of those exposed in the mueller report, and i would add one thing on top of that. the response needs to be more urgent. it largely was conduct that occurred in the past. it's occurring in realtime. we're in the middle of trump's re-election campaign. we have a little over 14 months to go before the election. if trump gets away with this and trieses to use his power. what do you think he's going to do the next 14 months? is he going to stop? back down? of course not. he's only going to ramp up.
>> they sat down with nancy pelosi yesterday for an interview and asked her about the possibility of sitting for the president. >> our founders could never suspect that a president would be so abusive of the constitution of the united states, that the separation of powers would be irrelevant to him than he would co, any president would continue to withhold facts from the congress, which part of the constitutional right of inquiry. >> so, shannon delineated early on. >> the strategy. >> what she did not say is part of that playbook includes the fecklessness of democrats, the fact that we're not moving, that the democrats are not moving.
there's a wonderful line. when the laws are no longer executed by the corruption of the public, the state is lost. here we have a man who thinks he's unbound by the state of law. nancy pelosi is so concerned about maintaining the majority, her speakership, that she and the cob, the democratic party, they're not in some ways exercising their constitutional responsibility. they're absolutely right. we're at a crisis, but we've been there for a while. they need to step up. >> i'll go to you, shannon, on this point, someone foresaw or wanted to see a separation of powers. >> republicans see the democrats in "the boy who cried impeachment." there's a number of things
democrats have brought up that the president should be impeached for. here's another one. democrats can't beat us in the election, the only thing they have is to impeach us. that's the only thing. it muddies the water and confuses people. until this point when was impeachment of the president ever discussed? back in the 1990s with bill clinton is the only memory. so there's constant talk of impeachment this and impeachment that which plays into fatiguing which i think for the republicans they hope plays in their favor. >> we can leave it there. when we come back, a woman took the stand against supreme court justice brett kavanaugh. another allegation comes to light in a new book. vanaugh. another allegation comes to light in a new book. -guys, i want you to meet someone.
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supreme court nominee brett kavanaugh defending the accusations. now a new book revisits that day, that episode as well as other accusations against now justice brett kavanaugh. they came to a striking conclusion at the end. ultimately we combined our notebooks with common sense and came to believe an utterly human narrative that they were mistreated by brett kavanaugh as a teenager. that kavanaugh over the next 35 years became a better person. we come to this unsatisfying conclusion based on the facts as we found them. they join me here in new york. let me turn to you first, robin on that. i think a lot of people look at this book and learn what they learned about it. it is such an informative book about the cultural book. tell us about that paragraph, what you wanted to get from this investigation. >> i think we felt these events
flew by in a way that was hard to make sense of them. so we wanted to come back and look at the contact characters in more detail. we found it complicated. sort of the messy middle which is that, you know, there is were these extremes painted about the people at the time and actually we do found there is corroborating evidence for these allegations from high school but we also get a fuller picture of who this person is as a justice and as -- what he was like as a person growing up. >> you get that and kate, i want to ask you about the principles of the story, when you look at christine blasi ford. speak to their awareness and the political implications of what they were doing. this was a process that consumed them as soon as it began and they weren't aware of what was taking place. >> interestingly enough, christine ford she grew up in washington and sort of inseed
the beltway and her parents and brothers still live in the area and are still very money part of that culture. she is not. she moved to the west coast for graduate school and never came back. she got teaching positions so although she's an incredible intellectual and very aware of social and political issues i think she had no idea how partisan and how kind of toxic really the dialog is in washington these days and how even somebody that's coming forward with information that they think is relative regardless of politics and affiliations can be sucked into that vortex. i think she was shocked and dismayed by what happened when she brought the information forward and she tried to keep it private until the very last minute when the narrative was coming out of her control and it was either come forward and speak or not at all. debra ramirez not part of that
world at all. that was one reason why the alleged experience with brett kavanaugh, her freshman year would be indecent exposure with souza painful for her because she was already feeling like a fish out of water. but she is living in boulder, colorado, definitely not of this world and someone flew an airplane with a danner casting dispersions on her credibility and saying kavanaugh was the believable one. so even yesterday there's this rush to talk about everybody's perspecti perspective. their respective corners and political affiliations as opposed to the facts. >> let me ask you what this says about where we are and over this last year and you both write that you recognize the fact that people have their views of this, of the justice himself and how this all played out. what does that tell you? going into that project with that vantage, where we are cultur culturally.
>> i think this experience of a year ago and even now with our book coming out you see this is such a polarized moment in our country. as well as there is a heightened sensitivity of sexual misconduct because of the me too movement and people are seeing what they want to see in this story. when we go to our book maybe they open their minds a little bit more and evaluate this in a fact based way and go a little deeper. >> can i have one quick one? i mean, what's interesting is one reaction that we've seen coming out is idea that we should take a look at the fbi investigation that was so short and limited in scope which we have a lot more detail on in the book and the idea of whether or not you're for or against justice kavanaugh being on the court and having been concerned this sort of inquiry into this past behavior, sort of the process of doing that research and trying to get to truth was count truncated and unsatisfying to all. that seems to be a message that
we she would some light on as well. >> thank you very much for joining us this morning. coming up next hour, joy reid recounting all the impeachable offenses against donald trump and why she says it doesn't get worse than this. sat doesn't get worse than this. raise your steins to the king of speed. liberty mutual customizes your car insurance, hmm. exactly. so you only pay for what you need. nice. but, uh... what's up with your... partner? not again. limu that's your reflection. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty ♪
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30,000 e-mails that are missing. i think you will probably be rewarded mightily by our press. >> if russia, if china offers you information, should they accept it or call the fbi? >> i think maybe you do both. i think you might want to listen. there's nothing wrong with listening. if somebody called from a country, norway, we have information on your opponent, oh, i think i'd want to hear it. >> did you discuss joe biden with his family? >> it doesn't matter what i discuss. welcome to a.m. joy. we are now getting closer to understanding the credible and urgent matter that compelled a senior level member of the intelligence community to become a whistle blower and sound the alarm about donald trump. through the wall street journal we know now that the president in a july phone call